Showing Posts For Flim.4608:
stealth attacks (which sic em wont completely disable – dont be dramatic)
Sic em will apply revealed. Revealed completely disables stealth.
I’m not saying it’s going to be up permanently and rendering thieves unable to use stealth forever. (Although 10s duration, 40s CD means it only takes 2 rangers for 50% uptime.) I’m saying that it completely disables the entire class mechanic for its duration.
but rangers could throw that argument right back at you, have you seen what pets do when a thief stealths? kitten all. (except howl… which is useful for getting out of SR)
This isn’t a valid comparison except in 1v1, and 1v1 balance is utterly irrelevant (and impossible to achieve) IMO.
Pets do nothing to the thief for the 3-4s duration of his stealth, sure. But they’re still perfectly able to function against any other target during that time. Versus the revealed debuff, which completely disables stealth against all opponents.
- Red pet is attacking a blue guardian. Blue thief attacks the pet (not that he ever would, but for comparative purposes) and stealths… doesn’t matter. Stealth doesn’t affect the pet or red ranger.
- Blue thief is attacking a red guardian. Red pet attacks the thief with Sic ’Em… thief is screwed against the red pet, red guardian, red ranger, and any other nearby red enemies.
Looking for additional information:
- Is this only happening on Foefire?
- Is it only in solo queue?
- Which region? (NA/EU)
Speaking for myself and our whole guild group of 5-6 on voice chat last night (8pm-12am Eastern)…
- Foefire only
- Team queue tPvP and hotjoin sPvP (Didn’t try solo queue tPvP)
- NA
Just to reiterate: this wasn’t “slight annoyance” lag of 1-2 seconds.
We’re talking game-breaking, completely unplayable lag. People being locked up for 10, 20, 30+ seconds. Abilities not firing, not firing, not firing… then all blowing at once. Watching allies, opponents and pets running directly into walls or disappearing off into the sunset. Standing completely alone on a point without a single enemy in visual range, then finding yourself instantly dead 20 seconds later when the lag spike ended.
Further info:
- It wasn’t hitting everybody equally in any given match. 2 or 3 team members might be completely locked up (20s lag spike, then 3-4s of mobility, then another 20s+ lag spike, rinse repeat) while 2 or 3 people might be getting only minimal lag spikes.(“Minimal”, in this case, being intermittent 2-4s spikes probably every 8-15s.)
- People were lagging out to the point of getting disconnected. Each member of our guild group was DC’d at least once on Foefire last night, some of us several times. Only on Foefire.
- Different people were affected to different degrees at different times. It wasn’t the case that the same people were consistently getting the bad “lockup” lag; it varied from match to match. (And it sometimes improved after a DC and reconnection to the same match.)
- Opposing teams noted the same match problems in tPvP map chat.
That covers everything I can think of…
Edit: And thanks for taking note and responding!!
(edited by Flim.4608)
The enemy just starts wandering off, making it impossible to scoot over to the “side” (not a clue where “front” ends and “side” begins) for a Backstab and extra damage from the trait.
Visualize looking down on a character from above. Draw 2 perpendicular lines through him, so he’s quartered — with a front quarter, back quarter, and two side-quarters.
Anything in the back or sides counts as a backstab and gets associated trait benefits. It’s only the 90 degree arc at the front of their character that doesn’t count. So as long as you’re not looking directly at their face, you’re good.
Also, the D/P “infinite stealth” thing is a little overplayed — at least by people who don’t understand it. It’s not something you can easily pull off right in the middle of a fight, partly because you must de-target first to pull it off, partly because you’re still very much susceptible to AE/cone damage and CC while stealthed. Ideally it requires some space — shadowstepping away is really the best immediate exit strategy — meaning it’s better as an escape or preparation tactic.
So for your regular, in-combat backstabs, just work on your positioning and learn to predict target movement, now that you know where on the body you need to land a hit. The 50% stealth speed trait or access to swiftness can definitely help with maneuvering.
In short, the ability to completely disable an entire class mechanic is pretty ridiculous.
What’s the point of making small balance tweaks here and there, if you’re then going to make a sweeping change that removes a fundamental class function?
Also, IMO, anyone defending sweeping changes like this to any class based on 1v1 ability needs a swift punch to the nuts.
If you want 1v1, go play Mortal Kombat. What’s the point of playing “team” PvP or large-scale “world vs. world” in a “massively multiplayer” game… if you’re then going to balance for 1v1 and solo play?
Only lagging on Foefire for us too. tPvP and sPvP.
Not just slight lag, people are getting 10-20 seconds or more at a time or flat-out DC. Heard the same from the other team in matches too.
Stealth is definitely a problem for point capping, particularly in uncoordinated sPvP teams.
This is compounded by:
- our lack of area denial (i.e. no gtAE damage [except caltrops], turrets, knockbacks, etc.);
- our lack of stability in dealing with KBs and CC off the point;
- our own squishiness in the face of enemy area denial.
It’s possible to spec for catching and bursting roamers off the point in sPvP, but honestly that achieves very little in the scheme of the match score.
[Little more detail for the OP; this is old news to thieves]
As far as basic combat issues go…
Thieves have lowest HP tier and only medium armor, so we’re pretty squishy by default. (I think only ele’s are worse off in that respect: low + light.) To compensate, thief defense is meant to be achieved by some combination of:
- glass cannon (i.e. kill them before they kill you)
- stealth
- evasion (dodge, shadowsteps, etc.)
Those methods are pretty effective in wide-open WvW against singles where you can pick your battles. They’re much less effective in highly-concentrated, group-centric, cap-based sPvP.
- true glass cannon is generally not viable because
— you’re rarely (or not reliably) going up against a single person;
— people also know where you’re going to attack (on the cap point);
— good players can see stealth patterns to predict when that burst is coming and negate it.
- stealth is 100% effective only against immediate single-target DD.
— AEs and cones will still destroy you;
— conditions will continue to eat you;
— heat-seeking pets/turrets will reacquire target the moment your stealth ends, regardless of whether you’ve confounded their owner.
- evasion requires good resource management and timing, and even then can leave you vulnerable to gtAEs, pets and conditions.
Why are other classes often more effective?
Ostensibly (in people’s minds, at least), thieves were kings of single-target burst. In truth there are several classes that can currently achieve similar or significant burst (certainly against us!) and often with more survivability and/or AE capability.
Thieves are predominantly melee and predominantly single-target. SB offers some AE (without much burst), sword offers some cone. But by and large the majority of our damage requires a single target at melee range, while other classes can offer hefty DPS as AE/cone, and/or at range. gtAE and turrets are problematic for melee; target stealth/invis and myriad pets are problematic for maintaining/reacquiring single-target focus.
In short, “passive” and fire-and-forget damage — gtAEs, pets, lingering conditions — are our bane, IMO. Ironically, I’d say we fare best against other builds that are single-target and lack pets, because it’s there that our single-target burst/stealth/interrupt/evasion timing really counts.
Note: I’m not trying to make excuses, call for buffs/nerfs, or complain about “how hard it is” for thieves. Just pointing out some of the sPvP combat factors that combine to trip people up in sPvP. It’s definintely possible to spec to counter certain aspects of the survivability drawbacks, with heavy condi removal or heavy mobility, but it’s not easy to balance everything reasonably in an easy-to-play spec while maintaining substantial DPS. Also, I’m definitely not a pro so take everything with a grain of salt. :P
shadow return from infiltrator’s strike: 1 condition
shadow return from shadowstep: 3 conditions
signet of agility: 1 condition per nearby ally (up to 5)
trait into it: 1 condition per 3 secs of stealth
Bowl of Saffron-scented Poultry Soup: 1 condition per healing skillThat’s more than enough.
You cannot rely on utility-based condition removal in tPvP right now. The CDs are far too long; you need to be monitoring and stripping conditions on a near-constant basis.
Sword SR is really not a reliable strip since there’s also a whole lot of area denial going on. Regardless of how fast you spam it, it’s not going to help if it’s just porting you right back into the AE mess you’re trying to cure.
Cure-on-stealth is arguably the most reliable way to go, with Hide In Shadows for emergencies when dots really stack up. Shadowstep is a nice backup but honestly more useful right now for getting the hell out when you’re stunned/rooted in a bunch of AEs — not for porting back into them for the cure.
WvW’s an entirely different animal. As a thief, you should pretty much always have the option of simply getting the hell out of dodge if things get too hairy, which negates the need for frequent condition stripping anyway.
Or make the AoE select the real players in priority.
This part I disagree with.
Uncap, possibly. But there are times when I want to clear at least some of those low-HP pets asap, and dropping a bunch of AEs is the most effective/least dangerous way of doing so. Having to individually target and kill a bunch of mesmer pets to cripple a shatter build before it destroys me would be nightmarish.
(*Disclaimer: playing a thief, so AE damage to players is rarely my overall objective. More often I just want to clear the clusterf___ of pets, so I can actually see and track individual targets and reduce the amount of passive damage I’ll be taking in the process.)
On the down side: shame it only supports Lion and later.
On the plus side: at least this means I can’t install it at work, otherwise I could see exactly ZERO productivity in my future. :P
Im reporting this to my local BBB and also sending an email to The state of washington attorney generals office
a) Overreacting
b) Reporting to the BBB is about the emptiest threat in existence. It achieves nothing. Literally, nothing.
c) Fixed. (Allegedly.)
Im just wondering if we buy the DDU again from another character and get the skill on our main? Anyone knows???
Unlikely.
The skill only seems to appear for characters you created after your account was flagged with the DDU. So any characters you already have are pretty much SOL until this is fixed.
And yes, same problem here. Getting more annoying the closer I get to 80.
No lol. They are available when I pick them again but I have to fill in the blanks every time I rejoin the mists.
Sounds like the same issue I’m seeing. When I enter sPvP, the trait points are still assigned to the various trees as before, but several Major traits are usually deselected (i.e. blanked out completely).
For me, it tends to happen primarily on Mug and Thrill Of The Crime (thief). I often get half way through a match before I realize I’m missing 2 or 3 traits.
Even tho i must say stealth seams OP in pvp…Possibility to just press invis and walk away from any attacker is anoying ^^
Stealth only lasts 3 seconds, so “just walking away” doesn’t really get you very far. It is possible to chain stealths if you don’t attack, but you need to have the appropriate abilities equipped and not on CD. It’s no more OP than the elementalist’s Mist Form invulnerability.
5 – 10 seconds of stealth
Disagree strongly.
3 seconds of stealth is more than enough to fit well with the pace of GW2’s combat. It makes it useful if used carefully, without being an OP get-out-of-jail-free card that could be abused by even the worst players.
It’s not meant to be a tool for endless assassination ambushes, where you take your target down to 25% before they even know you’re there. It’s meant to be a deception and distraction technique, and it works very well as that in its current form.
My primary complaint with the camera is its positioning during the Downed state.
While Downed, camera rotation appears to be centered on your left buttock … meaning that the slightest bump in terrain beside/underneath your character sends the camera into either dizzying vertical spins or ridiculous closeups of your groin. (It’s particularly annoying if you have downed abilities that rely on gtAE targets or any kind of timing.)
Can we not just get the camera centered on the character’s head, as would seem to make sense?
This has to be a priority fix.
I’ve been perfectly happy running PvE and sPvP while waiting on WvW queues, but other guildies aren’t quite so happy/patient. Moreover, it makes it a REAL chore to get full groups (let alone multiple groups/raids) into WvW at the same time. Invariably one or two people get in, then have to kick their heels waiting for the rest.
It’s simply not viable to have an end-game system based on large-scale cooperative play where a single group of players can’t even get into the same map at the same time.
Other fixes needed:
- The ability to queue for multiple Borderlands simultaneously.
- An indication of which Borderlands (single or multiple) you are currently queued for.
- The ability to un-queue from any given Borderlands.
- An indication of the current queue size for each Borderlands.
- An indication of your current position in queue for each Borderlands. (And maybe estimated time remaining.)
- The ability to queue a full group together and have them receive travel invites simultaneously (much like queuing for a PvE instance).
- An account-wide queue, which gives you the option to select the character you wish to take into WvW. (I realize this is more toward the “pie-in-the-sky” end of the wishlist.)
- A WvW slot reservation time in case you crash out/temporarily DC, so you can log back into WvW immediately within the allotted time. Dumping people back to PvE and forcing them to queue all over again from a simple network error or client crash is frustrating for the entire group.
The above suggestions are simply to make it less user-unfriendly, by giving the players more information. Because queuing is currently a cr-pshoot: you don’t even know whether you’re going to get into WvW before you head to bed, let alone whether your whole group will make it in.
By all accounts, I’m on a server that isn’t suffering the worst from WvW queues, and it’s still frustrating…. primarily from the simple lack of information.
Edit: Added a #8
(edited by Flim.4608)