Guild Wars 2

@warbignime
Gems and Subcription play the same purpose.
It pays the devs and that means the game continues to build.
The difference is Gems ended up with a lot less return; then the money I use for the subscription. That alone makes me question the hell out of the price tag of the HoT expansion. The smoke and mirrors dont help Anets case at all for the price point.

warbignime.4610:

IcarusMelody.5312:

OP you crazy. Anybody whose been following Heavensward knows SE has been sharing just about everything about the expansion that does not involve story spoilers.
They are adding
New race
3 New jobs
Flying mounts for aerial expansion area
plethora of new dungeons
New raids
A bulk of new story
level cap increase (new skills and traits for all classes)
New primal encounter
etc etc
And the price tag on Heavensward isnt even as high as HoT but players know what they’re getting and certainly not throwing a fit about the $40 price tag.

Folks havent seen much of HoT compared to HW. So its completely logical that everybody isnt just throwing their money at the screen.

And how much sub fee you spent on FF14? Also those doesn’t sound like more than hot at all.

$120 yearly for sub. I easily spent three times that on GW2 with gems. Major content patches in XIV every 3 months more than justify why its the only recent MMO capable of maintaining a p2p along with older established titles.

Also its off topic. I listed some common knowledge additions to a game that isnt shy about showing what the consumer is getting. This is the big problem with HoT, and why again everybody isnt that happy to immediately buy HoT right away. I know what im getting for my sub. Can you say the same about HoT’s price tag? without a doubt?
is it REALLY worth $50 with what you’ve seen of it so far?

OP you crazy. Anybody whose been following Heavensward knows SE has been sharing just about everything about the expansion that does not involve story spoilers.
They are adding
New race
3 New jobs
Flying mounts for aerial expansion area
plethora of new dungeons
New raids
A bulk of new story
level cap increase (new skills and traits for all classes)
New primal encounter
etc etc
And the price tag on Heavensward isnt even as high as HoT but players know what they’re getting and certainly not throwing a fit about the $40 price tag.

Folks havent seen much of HoT compared to HW. So its completely logical that everybody isnt just throwing their money at the screen.

Vayne.8563:

My dislike for FFXIV isn’t just the game revolving around traditional quest hubs and raiding mentality (which personally sucks for me. I wouldn’t play it for free, nevermind pay monthly for it).

But even more than that, I get dialogue from strangers that say “I can tell by how you’re dressed that you’re an adventurer”. People say the dialogue in Guild Wars 2 is bad, but at least in Guild Wars 2, when I’m just starting out, I’m not “an adventurer”. I’m not just some random guy looking to make a name for myself.

Just playing those first few hours in FFXIV (when I’d already been level 15 in Guild Wars 1) and just listening to the inane NPCs that are beyond generic to me, it just makes me feel like I’m wasting my time.

I mean yes, I can go kill 3 giant lady bugs and then go back to the quest giver and get my reward…but why would I want to.

Guild Wars 2 still feels organic to me when I play it. FFXIV feels completely contrived.

XIV is as quest centric as you wanted it to be. You can literally just run the main scenario and dungeons to go from 1-50. I did it 3x on separate characters. First at launch,then with my brother, and later some friends.Dungeons teach you how to play with others. Teamwork is what made MMO’s great and addicting for me personally and despite how much GW2 likes to bunch up strangers it hardly requires it.

Triple wurm, and tequatl are also basically washed down versions of raid encounters that casual players can do in XIV.Except you do it with 24 players so its naturally more engaging because your actions matter much more than fighting it with 99 other randoms.New players might feel the game is stagnant/archaic in combat but any piece of the endgame would convince them wrong immediately.

That being said anyone with little to no experience with XIV still doesnt have 2cents worth noting. Not to mention the writing in XIV is definitely better and wittier where it matters; the story. GW2 doesnt have quest dialogue for a comparison anyways but I bet you’re still hearing the same 4-8 one liners from different npcs across Tyria.

I say the same to XIV players who say absurd statements about GW2 like: “I installed GW2,laughed, and uninstalled 10 mins later”. And thats fine and dandy thats there choice but also their loss.I Give credit where its due. GW2 did a hell of lot right and I still encourage friends to give it another try (because they basically did the above.)but how its being managed is so disheartening.

Anet had a year headstart on launch and Yoshida’s passion for improving and delivering XIV passed them up in no time in quality updates. They listen to their players and are open with their future plans.No signs of slowing down, they’re not taking breaks every other update. They create polls for what new things should take priority outside steady content. Not to mention every Primal they introduce amazing boss themes and is akin to adding another Giganticus Lupicus encounter which I thought Anet would’ve tried to 1up by now but go figure.

TL;DR -No MMO gives you the best they have to offer in 2-3 hours. GW2 doesnt either.
XIV has a bright and exciting future.
GW2 : Anet wont say.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

IcarusMelody.5312:

Nah, its been mentioned theres a hardcore and a casual side for players. Take a guess at the quest hes talking about is considered? They always have alternatives to obtaining gear so that players do not get left behind. He isnt doing it because he HAS to but because he has the option too.

Still trying to level my Conjurer past 28 without spending hours killing or running Levequests, it takes hours to advance the main story sometimes with all the backtracking and “go talk to X, deliver X, or go investigate X spots”.

It’s tedious to me, and it does fit my definition of “grinding”. I could, surely, slide over to a class I don’t have yet and work on it but once I hit 20 it starts slowing down rapidly. I mean, I could throw money at crafting classes too, and I find the crafting style pretty interesting.

. . . but to actually advance? Ergh. It was painful this last round (between Ifrit and Thousand Maws, for anyone who plays).

Well to be fair I wont disagree with the story scenario bit but believe me reaching the finale pays off way more than it did in GW2’s 1-80 story with zhaitan fight. Of course it has its moments before that as well.

However the fastest way of leveling is running any dungeons because the exp reward for clearing scales to your level and the daily bonus for it speeds up the leveling process. Leves/fates/hunting log are there for you to complete while waiting in queue. The first class to level cap is the slowest, but anything you play lower than your highest level gains an xp boost and can reach cap considerably faster.

Man I wish leveling via dungeons wasnt largely looked down upon in GW2 without needing your lvl80 to do everything first before swapping out. I liked the challenge that was in dungeons at the level you unlocked them at. Folks have runned them so many times though that most have zero patience for it :x

Leo G.4501:

Glory.1493:

what kills ff14 for me is that grinding there is torture…I m actually an high end hardcore raider type player(cleared T9). but that grinding for animus/novus/nexus weapon is really aweful.u have to stand at specific spots for like 2hrs or even 4hrs each doing nothing to wait some thing spawn. I mean doing nothing but pay attention to ur screen so u can get something down in 10min or another 2-4hrs waiting ahead .u need to do this stuff repeatedly 9times to get animus weapon.thus sums to 18-36hrs staring ur screen while u cant do anything but wait.and this even not the worst part.cuz after u got animus weapon there are novus and nexus ahead.they are much more harder.someone may compare this to legendary weapons in gw2 but that’s totally a different things. at least u have something to do when u grinding not staring ur pc like idiots for 20+hrs repeatedly .kitten its not a game,its torture

Hah, I knew there was a side people weren’t talking about! This sounds very familiar with their last MMO and the purpose of my initial post in the game. If you are a casual player, sitting at the game for any period of 3 or more hours just isn’t viable and yet SE will want you to do just that and then some to accomplish these goals.

By how people were describing the game, I was actually starting to weaken and consider researching it further but frankly, all I have to do is watch people play it on youtube and I’ll be content.

Nah, its been mentioned theres a hardcore and a casual side for players. Take a guess at the quest hes talking about is considered? They always have alternatives to obtaining gear so that players do not get left behind. He isnt doing it because he HAS to but because he has the option too.

@Tobias
The only thing you were spot on though was your issue with p2p. Those other things you mentioned? Not really an issue. The only thing GW2 had on FFXIV for a short while was transmutations and seasonal events. Transmutations were added in the first quarter of the year because people wanted it. Seasonal events GW2 is still king between the two games.

Level syncing is there and you could help a new friend through via dungeons and story encounters. One thing SE is doing though is that the endgame requires strict coordination but that doesnt exclude casuals from enjoying it.

As they add more and more content for endgame; they indirectly make the older endgame content more accessible to casual players. However they still have to learn fight mechanics.They are also given alternative means to getting better gear via 24 man raids etc. So they can still play dress up even if they are unable to tackle the hardest content in the game.

Ykfox.3825:

Wow, slamfunction, way to start your post off by insulting someone just because they posted their opinion on a game you apparently like…

Well if you have played FFXIV for a fair amount of time and read OP’s post; it most certainly feels that way. The OP sounds as if he’s more interested in winning brownie points for Anet.

Aside from the numerous difference between the two games though they are both designed to polish up their gameplay designs/choices. Not to mention FFXIV is one of the few recent MMO’s that can sustain a p2p model because it does it right. The OP is trying to hard to downplay a great game but we all have our preferences.

lordkrall.7241:

Of course they can add stuff between expansion. But would it be as often as it is now?

People also seems to thing that an expansion will magically make the content different/better. Which is quite likely not the case. The only real difference would be that we got all the episodes in one pack rather than one every two week. The story-telling would be the same. The content would be more or less the same and so on.

Who have said anything at all about refusing to buy an expansion? I would buy an expansion if it was released, that doesn’t however change the fact that I personally prefer the current system.

No, most of everybody that wants an expansion wants it to be separate from living story. Were not talking about a past tense “what if” scenario. We’re talking about the future.Also most of everyone thats against the expansion are the same folk who dont want to buy one.

lordkrall.7241:

TheBlackLeech.9360:

I don’t understand why there are so many people opposing the OP.

I mean….. who doesn’t want an expansion?

I personally prefer the current system.

Some people prefer to have new stuff often but in smaller part rather than waiting a year or so for a big bunch of stuff that will be completed in a week or two and then go back to waiting another year.

I like when people say this. Why is it so hard to fathom that content can be added inbetween expansions such as the unsatisfying ones they are currently doing? Expansions put meat back on the bone. Imagine! An expansion that adds new content with REPLAY value again and tell a far bigger, and maybe better story as well.

They have sponged the hell out of launch content for two years now. Why couldnt an expansion provide entertainment for a year or so as well? instead of just two weeks? Thats kind of what happens when content has replay value. We all know how GW2 is centered around skins and no theres no reason that has to change.

MFW players that happily support Anet would refuse to buy an expansion from them.

Antara just dropped some knowledge on you guys. Too bad the GW2 fanboys prefer to pay more money/GRIND for gem store skins instead. Whatever sense that makes..

Reverence.6915:

As someone who’s been playing since launch with around 3k hours logged, I’d say that gw2 isn’t repetitve or boring at all. I mainly play WvW (around rank 1400, a few ranks admittedly gained in EoTM) but dabble in fractals (only level 12 still for that), sPvP (low rank still, only rank 17), dungeons, living story and world boss trains occasionally. Hell, I’ve yet to do an Arah dungeon path or complete the aetherblade TA path. I still log on and think ‘kitten ot enough time to do that tonight’.

People not expanding into other game modes will most definitely get bored. You’re not experiencing the game as a whole but just a small fraction of it. What do you expect? Eat too much chocolate and you’ll get sick of that too, no matter how many different flavours and variations you try. No wonder they’ll complain

That said, development into areas outside of PvE is sorely needed. PvE gets all the attention and WvW and sPvP are crying out for more maps and changes. Especially WvW. We WvW players haven’t gotten anything substantial since they added wxp ranks and masteries

Implying that many players havent already seen the best and worst experience of all game modes. Then didnt play them to death due to lack of substantial content.

Ragnarox.9601:

I played FF14arr year ago…pretty good game + story and dungeons but with no pvp.

Gl there.

(dont put screenshots..just make me sad seeing some materials that i need for finalising my juggernaut :S )

The beauty of actual content updates (something Anet should take notes on) is that they have added pvp in two separate forms: small scale / big scale team fights. since a year ago.

Vayne.8563:

Illuminati.2431:

kta.6502:

GW2 has its flaws which have been mentioned zillions of times on this forum. I get that. This game is the best non-subscription game on the market. At least you’re not wasting $12 a month on this game!

Have you seen the patch notes for 2.4?
That’s more new content in 1 patch than Guildwars has ever had + everything from next year if they keep going down the same road. I would be so happy if I had to pay GW2 a couple of bucks a month and they would pump out this kind of patches with this kind of content.

Oh and btw, housing is not only for guilds anymore, they introduced personal housing in the latest patch, which added tons of other stuff too.

All the content in the world doesn’t matter if you don’t like the content. WoW has entire expansions that for all I want to play them might as well not exist. I can’t talk about FF, specifically, but from what I know, it’s more or less a traditional MMO. I’m here, as a lot of people are, because they don’t like traditional MMOs.

I’d rather play this for 100 years with no new content than a new WoW expansion.

If you havent played XIV, and GW2 extensively; you dont have a point.

Zoso.8279:

IcarusMelody.5312:

Zoso.8279:

IcarusMelody.5312:

Zoso.8279:

Skugga.5298:

Zoso.8279:

and its all free.

Do you think they have an ingame gemstore and updates that revolve new skins because it is all free ? Think again ! I know off people who spend double the price of other MMORPGS a month and most people who do that just do it to SUPPORT A-net but what do they get in return for support ? Grind , and more grind.

Yeah but all items in gem store can be bought with in game gold. If they support the game so much to spend double than other MMO then for them its not a grind. And the “grind” in this game is light compared to ALL other MMO.

No, the grind is as heavy if not more so than other MMO’s. Everyone has been doing the same content for two years after they had their run of their daily living story zerg content. I spent close to $400 on the game supporting Anet.. hoping their would’ve been more fleshed out dungeons and new armor sets to strive for. Instead of getting that content though they just popularized mindless zergs for rewards to convert gold to gems to get new armor sets.

IDK….. If playing the game is a grind then why play? How do you define grinding?

Doing the same thing over and over. With the same content over and over. The idea being is that some people get fed up with the grind and just pay for the gems. Or after you grind the gold you needed to get that new set from the gem store; you go right back to doing it again to be ready for whatever the new set might be in the gem store later.

You just described every MMO ever created. GW2 give you free story and new zones to explore to get new gear specific to the zone and its all free.

Let me clarify; new content doesnt require gear treadmill. It does require new skins though because thats the only thing to strive for in GW2. Most skins new skins are locked behind the gem store and not content. I expected new dungeons to be in placed by now.. along with new tokens for said dungeon(s). What I was pointing out is that the “free” aspect is what makes the game a grind, if you dont want to buy gems.

More content is never bad and this game lacks it. I saw this over a year ago and I stopped playing over a year ago because everyone was still like “living story is so cool so unheard of!” even though all MMO’s have literally already done it and provided much more content and story while doing it.

Zoso.8279:

IcarusMelody.5312:

Zoso.8279:

Skugga.5298:

Zoso.8279:

and its all free.

Do you think they have an ingame gemstore and updates that revolve new skins because it is all free ? Think again ! I know off people who spend double the price of other MMORPGS a month and most people who do that just do it to SUPPORT A-net but what do they get in return for support ? Grind , and more grind.

Yeah but all items in gem store can be bought with in game gold. If they support the game so much to spend double than other MMO then for them its not a grind. And the “grind” in this game is light compared to ALL other MMO.

No, the grind is as heavy if not more so than other MMO’s. Everyone has been doing the same content for two years after they had their run of their daily living story zerg content. I spent close to $400 on the game supporting Anet.. hoping their would’ve been more fleshed out dungeons and new armor sets to strive for. Instead of getting that content though they just popularized mindless zergs for rewards to convert gold to gems to get new armor sets.

IDK….. If playing the game is a grind then why play? How do you define grinding?

Doing the same thing over and over. With the same content over and over. The idea being is that some people get fed up with the grind and just pay for the gems. Or after you grind the gold you needed to get that new set from the gem store; you go right back to doing it again to be ready for whatever the new set might be in the gem store later.

Zoso.8279:

Skugga.5298:

Zoso.8279:

and its all free.

Do you think they have an ingame gemstore and updates that revolve new skins because it is all free ? Think again ! I know off people who spend double the price of other MMORPGS a month and most people who do that just do it to SUPPORT A-net but what do they get in return for support ? Grind , and more grind.

Yeah but all items in gem store can be bought with in game gold. If they support the game so much to spend double than other MMO then for them its not a grind. And the “grind” in this game is light compared to ALL other MMO.

No, the grind is as heavy if not more so than other MMO’s. Everyone has been doing the same content for two years after they had their run of their daily living story zerg content. I spent close to $400 on the game supporting Anet.. hoping their would’ve been more fleshed out dungeons and new armor sets to strive for. Instead of getting that content though they just popularized mindless zergs for rewards to convert gold to gems to get new armor sets.

kta.6502:

SundayTrash.9562:

X T D.6458:

cya in a couple months when you realize nothing else comes close to beating gw2, eso,wildstar,wow? take your pick

Actually moving FFXIV

Unlike GW2, there is no dodging to avoid an enemy’s attack, and it takes time for skills to activate. Players have to stand in place while fighting esp. if you’re a mage. If you’re soloing a fast enemy, your character is forced to take damage while casting one dinky spell. Not even WoW’s mages were THAT bad.
Then there are the FF14 Raids. If one player on a team makes a mistake, the whole team fails. It’s too easy for a griefer or troll to mess up a team. Unlike Tequatl, there is no way to recover if a griefer interferes with the fight.
In FF14’s event system (aka FATE), only the person who does the most damage to the enemy gets the gold and loot. If you come in late during an event, you get next to nothing.

Then there is the monster camping. Yes,you have to camp for monsters like WoW. ((cringe))
During Sept, there were a couple of festivals, but those events were devoid of players when I got to the festival area.
In the end, Final Fantasy 14 is not worth $12 a month.
GW2 has its flaws which have been mentioned zillions of times on this forum. I get that. This game is the best non-subscription game on the market. At least you’re not wasting $12 a month on this game!

Except that FFXIV has major content updates every 3 months and surpassed GW2’s year long life cycle in content, very shortly after launch.It has an expansion in the works and released a new Class/job recently.
You can argue that XIV has no dodge feature but thats because its made up with encounters actually having fight mechanics.

What I will agree with is that the maps are kind of empty but its not due to low player count. Most have already maxed out all their classes. Right now the open world plays little roles outside advancing story quests via updates because the endgame is all instanced.Open world is more of just a lobby for lvl 50 players. Zergs were just as boring in XIV as it is in GW2. And thats Gw2’s way to keep the open world populated.

And the Fate rewards are determined the same way GW2’s is. Except that healing also contributes. FFXIV has no build variety or much rotation variety, but you cant cheapskate any fights or dungeons because of it either. Considering GW2’s amazing combat keeps being dwindled down to “stack here” methods or just zergs by the community.However since the crawl that is gw2’s content update its also understandable.The combat in both games are well done in their own right.

http://youtu.be/4rsWL6Z_NJE?t=4m5s

And yes the endgame might be punishing for mistakes but thats not a new concept for MMO’s. The link shows a Titan extreme run, a challenging but fun encounter when he was released (some people still cant beat him). Its what team work would like in Gw2 if it ever was ever needed outside zergs(zerg is hardly teamwork too).

So folks rather pay more for significantly less i.e. gem store nonsense; than to pay a set amount for an expansion that would actually add to the core game? Yeah.. Go figure GW2 community.

GW2 certainly makes FFXIV: ARR terribad in comparison.ARR’s community is to blame for that though. They don’t want the devs to do anything that could only add to their game experience!

marnick.4305:

This post presumes the silly idea that an mmo could run on a console.

It won’t happen. Many have tried, all failed. If anyone could do it, it would be arena.net but even they won’t manage I think.

Really? Because last time I checked Square Enix and Sega accomplished that already. Should probably get a clue seeing as how you’re using the internet anyways.

You will know what they’re talking about pretty quick if you read the tool tips in the trait lines. They will mention stat buffs depending on adrenaline level.

ODB.6891:

IcarusMelody.5312:

Oglaf.1074:

Not in comparison to keeping at full Adrenaline with Berserker’s Power/H. Focus and keep chopping away with your auto-attack, no.

At least, that’s my take on it.

Well granted if your traited for Axe crit damage the burst is well worth it. The average from my axe bursts I tend to hit 12k+ for burst and recover adrenaline in 4-6 seconds less if I just use the healing ability to get max right away after using.

That 12k+ burst is not a regular occurrence…at least not in pve. If a dungeon boss or tougher mob in pve is fully debuffed with 25 stacks of vulnerability, then yeah, a build based around eviscerate will likely hit for 12k+. I run a full beserker build with dual axe/rifle with all exotic power/precision/crit gear except for two of my accessories (I try to stay at least close to 20k hp). 25/25/0/0/20 is my build. The majority of the time, eviscerate is not worth it in pve dungeons unless the mob is already low on hp. I get more benefit from keeping my adrenaline for berserker’s power and hightened focus bonuses with my auto attacks. I agree adrenaline does refill quickly in a proper dual axe build, but in the same time frame as it takes to refill my adrenaline…I can do about as much damage as the average eviscerate…just with my auto attacks (which hit multiple targets instead of just one with eviscerate). Eviscerate just becomes a finisher for low hp targets…which is kind of lack luster for our “burst” axe skill. It would be nice if it hit multiple targets and/or applied vulnerability or protection. That would be worth dumping adrenaline on repeatedly during combat at the expense of berserker’s power+hightened focus.

It certainly is a regular 12k+ for me. 20/20/0/10/20.
6/6 Superior runes of divinity.
Have about 53% crit chance (19% more from traits) and 74% Crit dmg(10% more axe crit dmg)
And to be fair I usually only ever run dungeons with my brother whose uses staff guardian for certain party setups so im always buffed. However the above is not counting food,potions,buffs etc.

However even then when im solo I still burst up there around 12k mark. I dont run dual axes as I use Axe/shield for survival but utilize the axe burst when I get level 3 adrenaline and swap weapons as often as I can; rebuild’s adrenaline fast. I will agree that axe burst isnt worth it when it does not crit. But I crit more often than I dont.

Oglaf.1074:

The Axe trait is not exlcusive to the Burst; it also works with auto-attacks. The biggest advantage of the Axe is also somewhat of a disadvantage; the auto-attack is so good that you penalize yourself far too much if you stop using it in favour of something else – which is why Axe is generally a poor choice for Off-hand weapons due to Whirling Axe not coming close to the damage of the auto-attack.

Yes but the point is, it gives the burst that can easily make up just auto attacking the entire time.Espescially if something or you is about to die you have no reason not to burst anyway. Better to finish the fight sooner than later. And axe offhands purpose isnt really damage but more for building adrenaline quickly. It’s as I said earlier though, Adrenaline is built up much more quickly than the CD on bursts.

Oglaf.1074:

Not in comparison to keeping at full Adrenaline with Berserker’s Power/H. Focus and keep chopping away with your auto-attack, no.

At least, that’s my take on it.

Well granted if your traited for Axe crit damage the burst is well worth it. The average from my axe bursts I tend to hit 12k+ for burst and recover adrenaline in 4-6 seconds less if I just use the healing ability to get max right away after using.

Oglaf.1074:

Hammer, Sword, Longbow and Mace are considered worth “sacrificing” the Adrenaline on, while Greatsword and Axe aren’t.

Um, What? Axe burst is the only one worth using for DPS;because its actually a burst of damage. And if you cant recover 3 levels of adrenaline fairly fast you’re doing something wrong anyway.

While I know its pretty inconvenient; have any of you guys considered server hopping to where it does work? It’s free but the downside is that you will have to wait a week before you can do it again to get back to your server.

Arrah has for the most part; been functional on Fort Aspenwood server. Only time it is closed is when no one defends it from the risen events. It’s inconvenient but if you really want to finish story or just run explorable its an option.