Showing Posts For irongamer.6014:
Add first person camera option
One of the Best Features of GW2
My friends and I love the jumping puzzles. These are perhaps one of the strongest elements in the game imho. Personally I think they are fine and I hope to see more added.
Rooted In MMO History
People would do this in other mmo’s to kill time waiting for raid logistics to work out or to just see if you could climb something. It is so awesome to see this type of adventure built into the game, I hope it spreads to other titles.
Add First Person Camera
The main issue I have with puzzles is not the puzzles themselves but the decision to have no first person camera view. Add a first person camera view, the camera is crazy annoying currently, even for just looking off of vistas let alone tight combat areas or small puzzle areas.
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That is what I’m leaning toward Kami. It does seem odd to make a sort of half skill change which it seems they did. Was the current retaliation allowing some crazy exploits or completely destroying others in pvp?
I also found that wording curious. I should have posted here to start with, so I’ll just post what I said in the other thread.
What type of counter are they talking about? If they are wanting to change this to a reactive ability is it going to negate or reduce damage from multi-hit attacks? Multi-hit attacks seem to be very strong and currently don’t have much of a counter. Sure you can roll from melee, but ranged multi hits still track you after your roll.
I would find it interesting if they are going to make a large change in an attempt to create a direct counter for multi-hit attacks. That type of change would make pulling out your big multi-hit attack a little more strategic. Especially if the counter is an symbol that affects allies in the area.
The whole % damage back never felt very guardian like to me for some reason.
Yeah, there are a number of issues with how they have setup traits and using a symbol in only one situation. Some of these problems may be offset by having more than one effect on the symbol or a sequence move on the symbol. The traits… well that is a bit more work.
Anyhow, their wording is curious, it would be nice if they would say more.
We are moving towards retaliation being more of a counter to taking many hits rather than a general boon to keep up all the time.
What type of counter are they talking about? If they are wanting to change this to a reactive ability is it going to negate or reduce damage from multi-hit attacks? Multi-hit attacks seem to be very strong and currently don’t have much of a counter. Sure you can roll from melee, but ranged multi hits still track you after your roll.
I would find it interesting if they are going to make a large change in an attempt to create a direct counter for multi-hit attacks. That type of change would make pulling out your big multi-hit attack a little more strategic. Especially if the counter is an symbol that affects allies in the area.
The whole % damage back never felt very guardian like to me for some reason.
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To be clear I understand that the guardian can mix in other heals (Symbol of Faith, Virtue of Resolve, Shield of Absorption Sequence, Ray of Judgement, Empower) during that 15 seconds which add up close to the same amount as the single dropped AoE skill. The guardian is a great class for those that like busy work. I do enjoy playing the class.
The issue is that the cone ability does not reward a skilled player for its use. Make Healing Breeze more usable in the action based setting and transfer more of the total class healing over to the skill to make it rewarding to land the skill. Make it a real option. A skill that we have to wrestle with if we want it on our skill bar or not.
Right now it is challenging to make it function in a useful manner, offers little to no reward for doing so, and is to easily toggled off the bar for a different heal ability.
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There seems to be a disconnect with the transfer of some skills from standard rpg mmos to action oriented rpg mmos. I understand ArenaNet is shying away from targeted heals. At the same time movement is a vital mechanic, especially in GW 2.
I have primarily been playing a Guardian and a Ranger.
For a while I tried running with Healing Breeze on my Guardian and found it lacking, primarily due to the movement mechanics inherent to the games combat mechanics. I have much more success dropping a Healing Spring with my Ranger.
Healing Spring is static while Healing Breeze can move with your character. How is it that Healing Spring is more effective in my experience? Voice from nowhere " L2P noob! " Perhaps, but there are number of items that come to mind.
Issues with Cone vs Dropped AoE
1. Healing Spring presents a visual that other players can clearly see. A large glowing circle on the ground with a defined edge. It is obvious where the zone begins and ends. Healing Breeze has no ground indicator and the effect does little to indicate range or arc.
2. The direction of Healing Breeze doesn’t seem to adjust unless you turn you character with your keyboard or you turn with the mouse and let it snap back into position. Maybe this is just a lag or a delay issue, but it doesn’t always heal in the direction I am facing. Or maybe it is an issue with strafing while using the skill.
3. The shape and area covered by Healing Spring allows players to dodge within or very close to within the healing zone. While healing breeze is “mobile” other players cannot take advantage of dodging and ending up within the healing field.
Disconnect
This is the disconnect I have seen in a number of mmos that attempt to carry over standard rpg cone and directional mechanics into an action setting. I remember using Healing Discs in Tabula Rasa, one was cone and the other aoe. Tabula Rasa also tried to bring more movement into the mmo setting but had a similar disconnect when it came to cone abilities. It was fun to hit a group with a good cone heal blast but it needs to be worth the effort.
It seems many of these games bring over these skill ideas into an action setting and balance them like they are in a standard rpg. If you are going to have a cone or directional ability in an action setting it needs to make up for the limitations listed above. Reward the skill of the player that can make use of the cone, make them useful.
Currently it appears healing breeze is hampered by this disconnect. Leaving the cone skill behind many other instant heals, pbaoe, dropped aoes, and targeted aoes.
Some simple adjustments might include: more healing to others, longer range, wider arc, ground indication where the heal is going, etc. I’m sure an individual being paid to do this stuff can come up with something even more interesting.
Healing Spring
Skill Type: Static AoE Zone
Radius: 240 (480 in Diameter)
Combo Field: Water
Duration: 15 secs (cast is instant)
Cool Down: 30 sec
Healing to self: 4,920
Healing to allies: 2340 Regen over 3 seconds
Total Healing to one ally: 11,700 Regen if you can stay in the defined zone
Healing Breeze
Skill Type: Mobile Cone
Range: 600
Combo Field: None
Duration: 3 seconds (this is a cast bar, can be interrupted)
Cool Down: 40 sec
Healing to self: 6,525
Healing to allies: 1,725
Total Healing to one ally: 1,725 (the duration ticks up to this total, it doesn’t tick for this amount. I tested this with my guardian on some damaged NPCs)
Summary
I understand that you can’t really compare different class skills directly as they are only a part of what makes up the class. However, I do believe that Healing Breeze is a prime example of a standard rpg cone mechanic working its way into a more action oriented rpg, while failing to adjust the skill for the action setting.
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Maybe you could add a sub section for professions and how their weapons / utilities function within a dungeon setting.
Too general. I tried starting a thread with more specifics about the class I play and how it used it on a run in a specific dungeon. I’d love to hear how other people are using their characters.
However, given the response to the thread (zero, the first response is the second part of my post) I’d say many of the people on the forums are here only to complain and point out what they feel is wrong.
If enough people post specifically how they play their character in dungeon encounters other could learn what works and/or any glaring issues with dungeon design will be revealed in a more detailed light.
More specifics of how I played my guardian in a CM explore mode are at this link:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/How-to-succeed-with-profession-X-in-a-dungeon/first#post236585
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Yeah, we need a first person view. Tight dungeon hallways, tight jumping puzzle area make you fight the camera more than fighting the enemies or dealing with the jumping puzzle.
CM hallways are another place that first person would be awesome. I don’t understand why this was not added. It would allow use to see what is going on in tight areas rather than fighting the camera.
I feel the same way. I tossed together the following thread: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/How-to-succeed-with-profession-X-in-a-dungeon/first#post236585
Although, I fear these approaches may be too positive to gain much attention. I do feel some of the dungeon mechanics are boring and almost feel like exploites, but I’m interested in hearing specifics about how people are successful in dungeons.
Bosses
Stand Your Ground!
The boss with the knock down shotgun I used Stand Your Ground!.
Wall of Reflection
Wall of reflection was also handy but teammates need to make the most of it once it is down.
The other boss in front of the giant door seemed to bug out. I was running Sword/Shield for some reason and just beat on him the entire time.
The last boss we all fought at range. I wasn’t sure what to run for utility on him because frost is not listed on stability. I ended up just running Smite Condition for the free boon because I was always frosted and the random boon/condition thing (allisa or something).
Wall of Reflection didn’t seem to work on his attack, but I’m not totally sure on that. Basically one person kited him around and everyone else range attack him. I used the root from the wand to help the person kite.
The 2h hammer may have been great for caging him but I didn’t have it equipped before the fight. Does his stability negate that cage?
I did notice one of the warriors kiting him very effectively in the mine deadend around the corner. I didn’t get a chance to see how he was doing that, but he would kite him while the rest of us downed the robots that jump into the fight.
Your Story
Anyhow, I have a lot more to learn. That was how we managed to best that explore mode.
What are you stories of success in dungeons? How did you succeed? What abilities did you use to succeed?
Obviously there are a number of people upset with dungeons. There are individuals that believe they are fine. Both groups mention they can complete the dungeons. Yet, some people still can’t make it through.
How are you succeeding with your class in a dungeon? Be specific, what weapons are you using, what utility skills are you using, how are you approaching “pulls”, how are you approaching boss encounters, etc.
I ran my first explore mode CM (Golem related path, Mr. Frost at the end). We had 2 warriors, 1 elementalist, 1 ranger, and 1 guardian. I was the guardian.
We managed to complete the dungeon, although we did have a number of deaths due to a few pulls that we didn’t do just right. This was a pug group and one guy said it was the most smooth run he had been on for a quite a while. I’m still getting used to the mechanics so I was surprised at that statement, it felt like failure in some ways. Completion of the dungeon does not equate success, that may just be my mindset.
So, I’m still a noob and trying to understand the mechanics of dungeons. It feels much different from top world combat where there is some forgiveness if you do something just a little wrong.
Here is what I did on that explore CM run:
Profession: Guardian
My guardian traits are setup for consecration cd/length, larger symbols, and something else, not remembering at this point.
Pulls
This seems to be the part where people get killed instantly if not done correctly. The group started with a thief that wanted to run into a room and try to AoE the static archers…. we tired to talk him out of it but he ended up leaving after the dungeon booted everyone for some reason. After the dungeon boot he quit the group and we picked up one other to form the group mentioned above.
1. Line of sight pulls. Just about every initial aggro pull we used a wall to force the mobs to run to us.
2. The elementalist would pull and use wind to knock down ranged attacks.
3. I would pull and use wall of reflection. If mobs would not break off me I’d basically cycle through all the mace/focus blocks/blinds, refresh aegis, drop sanctuary, or use renewed focus. Sometimes this was not enough and the mobs would burn through all these blocks/blinds/dodges and still down me.
It would seem if a pull did not go just right someone would die or we would even wipe. We did have 2 bad pulls that we did recover from pretty well.
Dodge can only do so much and after 2, I’m out of endurance. In the majority of fights I’m out of endurance most of the time.
Fighting Trash
For the most part we would try to block ranged mobs by using LOS. As a guardian I would always place Wall of Reflection between us and any ranged mobs.
Symbol of Faith Virtue of Courage Virtue of Resolve
I may focus too much on dropping symbol of faith (so little help in a system with no forgiveness if you mess up, ala mobs hit like trucks). I also try to keep protection up. If an individual or a pull has gone bad I will trigger Virtue of Courage to help mitigate 1 cycle of mob attacks. If players are all low I will often trigger Virtue of Resolve.
2h Hammer
I have not so successfully used the 2h hammer to cage melee mobs and use the knockback. I think this could be handy, but will require more experimenting.
Sanctuary
For downed players I will often drop Sanctuary, if it is a hot spot, and try to get them back up.
Sanctuary seems hit and miss at times. Sometimes the mobs run right in and attack me other times they get knocked down. Not sure what is happening there, does stability negate sanctuary?
I have used Sanctuary to basically stun lock a mob in a corner. When this works it really works great. The mob is knocked down, gets back up, and immediately falls back down.
Purging Flames
I usually have this for the fire field combos and if I see a lot of conditions on team members I use it to clear one off for them.
This feels a little weak in some ways and I have been playing around with other utilities on this slot.
Wall of Reflection
I always have this on my bar for trash pulls. This most likely does more dps then I could ever dream of with any of my weapon sets. Maybe I just suck at dps. I find myself quite busy doing other things, like helping downed players.
Wand / Shield
There were a number of mobs we engaged at range. These guys were usually standing on a platform above us. I would just use the wand 1,2, and 3. Buff team with protection. I didn’t really make good use of shield 5, which absorbs projectiles (any success stories out there?) I mainly used shield 5 to knock back any melee that tried to charge in.
Continued Below
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My first dungeon run was an AC story mode pug. Dodging out of circles: easy. The bosses: relatively easy.
But the trash…oh the trash… they ate us, spit us out, and came back for more. We basically beat the trash from the floor of the dungeon.
I see so many posts saying, “oh just dodge the red circles.” That is not the issue. The issue is lack of well designed telegraphed moves for attacks that are not ground targeted (there is no red circle on these attacks), leaving little to no reaction time. The mobs that do telegraph are often obscured by so many particle effects you can’t see the telegraph or only get a glimpse of it too late.
I think some of the difficulty people are having with the dungeons is getting used to new combat mechanics. However, I believe more of the issue is related to poor telegraph design, poor combat visibility particle design (especially for melee), and some issues with burst damage.
A friend of mine and decided to see how nasty CM explore mode was with just two of us. We didn’t expect to do anything but pull a mob or two and see how hard they hit.
We took a guardian and a warrior. We were both 46. The auto attacks from the ranged pistol mobs would take the guardians life to 1/3 or 1/2. These are not red circle attacks, not even telegraphed attacks. Just one mob with one auto attack. Protection (33% less damage) didn’t really reduce that damage at all.
We used LOS to slowly kill the two we pulled from a group of 4. We then switched to as many knock down and stuns as possible. Wall of reflection did great on gun wielding mobs. However, ranged attacks went right through shield of absorption… it absorbed nothing.
Our little experiment leaves me with the belief that for trash, control (stuns, daze, interrupt, knockdowns) is really the only thing that is really effect with how these dungeons are currently designed.
I know that GW 2 PvE combat is basically an experiment, an attempt at something different from the trinity. I just think they could have executed it much better than its current state. Hopefully some of the issues are addressed in the future.
Currently I find this the weakest area of Guild Wars 2, at least for the pace that I’m moving through the game. I’m only 45, trying to take this mmo slow, it has so much to offer.
The particle effects completely ruin the tactics of group play. I love combat with a friend or two. The combat feels great, I can see most telegraphs, the combat flows nicely.
But, step into a dungeon (let alone a dynamic event) and all that is tossed out the window. There is little to no visual room for tactical play. This is extremely hard on melee characters. This really needs to be addressed to improve (or completely restore) the flow and tactics in group combat in this game.
Totally agree. Spell effects are limiting good tactical play and the feel of combat. There are a number of threads on this subject.
This really needs to be addressed. Currently I find dungeon combat and a number of the world events to be spam fests because there is no visual room for tactical play.
The particle effects block so much of my view I can’t see if the enemy is telegraphing a move. At this point I have to start guessing when to use skills. The inability to see telegraphs in small group (let alone large group) settings is really hurting the tactical feel of combat. I can understand some tactical loss in the large groups but it is really sad to see this loss in dungeons.
Now, play solo or with one or two friends and the combat suddenly flows better and feels more tactical. A large part of this, for me, is that I can actually see to make real tactical decisions based on what the enemy is doing.
I killed screen shake in the first few hours of the head start. An option to remove friendly effects, minimize effects, or some other way to make combat visible would go a long ways for improving the feel and tactics in combat.
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Wouldn’t one, which summons a usable spirit weapon, be nice? (Although that might be to similar to the Elementalist conjured weapons).
Or we could have a new elite spirit weapon (staff?)
I like these ideas. I don’t see an issue with a little overlap, there is already overlap in a lot of the classes. The Guardian is a magic caster of sorts, why not be able to wield a spirit weapon ourselves. More Swiss army knife please!
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My guild knows the difference between me being there and not. I like to bounce between the front lines and the back line. I love sitting on a wall and just buffing and healing and protecting the guys raining death down.
Also, Retreat and Symbol of Swiftness gets groups where they need to get fast.
I wish the game also reward support in WvW, but it’s not. Badges only for killing not for supporting. -.-
This is very common across a number of mmo genres. It’s persistence is curious. Are developers so single minded that DPS should be the only thing that counts (more likely just the easiest thing to gauge) or has no one figured out how to effectively rate support? A few years back a few titles started to throw healing into the formula for gaining credit. This may work in some game systems but GW 2 has spread out healing so much it is not likely to function as well. It would be nice to see a better system for determining credit.
I have seen some individuals saying support is supposed to happen between DPS in GW 2 and maybe that is part of the issue. Perhaps people are playing this game like other MMO’s where you focus on one element of combat. Admittedly it will take more skill or at least some adjustment for players to learn to toss support in between DPS.
At any rate I was a little surprised to see GW 2 with its MMO manifesto fall back to a simple DPS count for contribution in an event.
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I totally agree. After playing a number of the other classes range options the scepter is about the most boring option. The scepter itself is effective but the “gameplay”, or lack there of, involved with its use is quite dull.
I’m sure it would not be high priority, but it would be nice to see some changes that spice up the use of this weapon a bit.