Showing Posts For Diba.4682:
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I do think that removing asuras is an impractical solution and good luck trying to convince the developers to implement such a change. Meanwhile increasing their animations might be the first thing they can do to help us out and add something later.
It is hard though, one moment I have 3three charrs/norns around me and my team is about to win the fight, next moment everyone is dead because there was a zerker warrior with frenzy using hundred blades… who knew? I would have dodged if I saw it.
(BTW, you cannot “tab-target” a mesmer and expect to get the right one =/ )
The reason I would want to use it:
Because I remove upto 3 conditions for a successful hit.
I do not hit every time with my second weapon, and even so some builds constantly put conditions on me and while 2nd set is still on cooldown I would need to switch and use the burst to save myself.
Just saying it would be nice to have two burst skills that work if I am going to enjoy the use of my trait. Otherwise it seems like everyone else is having the same trouble so at least I know that and can move on.
Thanks for the input.
I just wanted a few thoughts on arcing slice for spvp. For the most part it seems like it is too slow to hit anything. The mace is fine (though it will be nerfed so we will see how this goes), the axe is fine because it locks onto the target and is nearly instant, the bow is fine, the hammer is fine, but arcing slice I have problems with. Outside of the enemy dodging, blind, etc, within the 3/4sec they either move an inch out of range, or change directions behind me and so I miss anyways. SO I never seem to get a hit off of it unless I hit a mesmer’s clone or something equally as simple.
Is this somewhat everyone else’s experience or do I need to just get over it?
Thanks,
Dean, let me clarify a few things. I brought up the face rolling points to show that I can not imagine much good coming out of the current system. Also that I found the system to have no significant difference from other games. There is skill required, as mentioned above, but it seems rather limited to me. If Anet was improving/modifying the combat I probably would not have much to say now. Seeing as they have been trying to balance the professions, I was convince they were not going to change anything.
Here is the R-P-S idea again. I did not say unlimited dodge, I said remove dodge and replace it with the “paper” skill which will be channeled. That means you have to hold the defense button down for as long as you want or until the end of endurance duration. It is not an instantaneous ability like the dodge roll. As long as the defense button is held down, the other players can not use their normal damaging abilities and expect progress. But the players must use a “Scissor” ability against the defense to break it so that he may continue normal damage.
For example if I used Scissors against a player using rock abilities, I wasted an ability which then goes on a short 3 sec CD. My enemy, who used rock, will be doing much greater damage for the time and will have three secs to block freely. If I used Scissors while he uses paper, which is his defense ability to block attacks, then I break it and for the next 3 secs or so, and I will be able to use Rock abilities freely. Therefore no one can just sit and block everything… it will be their failure if they do. There is no one way to kill a person, because it depends on what the other person does. The only reason I said “face-rolling” is because it feels like from time to time that the best thing I can do is keep max damage on my target while their dodge is on CD and that is the basic strategy. I get careless in group fights because I really do not need to pay any attention, next to that I am just spamming attacks just to get credit for it all.
For 3v1, I said this would “feel” more doable, not that it actually would be. Against three players no matter the game, it is always going to be hard-to-impossible. First person shooters it is possible because if the other three can not hit an enemy two feet in front, the lone player who can, will win. In GW2, that is not so because there is targeting involved. The other three players just need to be in range and start mashing keys for damage. My one character can only do so much because of CD, once CD is used for dodge and block abilities in weapons or utilities, I can do nothing and I am helpless. So, if I were to block abilities more constantly, the other players will need to use the counter of what I am using instead of throwing out their max damage because eventually I will die. However, there are three of them, and three has its advantage and so even one of them should be able to use the counter and so cause a win. With that, there will be no long battles or fights because one person is blocking all the time, neither will the fight all the sudden (at least solely based on the R-P-S plan) be easy for one person to take out 3.
WvW is not an accurate way to see the 3v1 idea because: 1. Not all the players are traited or geared which matters; I can tell that the enemy is not in level 80 just because of how fast he dies. 2. There are siege weapons which are incredibly helpful as should be. 3. Using abilities does impact the fight but is not everything. It could be that in their numbers they were cluttered and AOE’d. Naturally AOE is better than single target abilities in group fights.
I did take a break for about a month from the game. Whether I am bored or not is irrelevant. Also, I only mentioned (once?) about the design being boring, but the whole three pages was not about me being bored. It was about what I had observed in the combat system, and how I think it might be better. Therefore, I am not sure how you concluded that it “boils down” to me being bored or not. Either this system is generally the same as other games or it is not. My thoughts are that it is the same, with a few differences that would make it not seem so. My point was to say that improvement is needed somewhere, and the idea I had was the R-P-S. Re-reading what I had written earlier it seemed like I might have had a negative tone, but I really did not. I still think highly of this game, but I do want something more with the combat for more reasons than mentioned here.
“This kind…” as in what I am suggesting or as it is?
I actually never played Skyrim, so I do not know what your referring to.
You are either using R,P,S. As such, there are no Cool Downs to the uses of these, or at least none so significant as 5+secs (utilities can be a different matter). That way, it is not about using abilities at the right time and then face-rolling. It is about a constant careful consideration of which ability to use at what time. This means players need to pay more attention to the enemy and what he is doing, instead of face-rolling all the abilities… wait for their dodge… face-roll some more… dodge, heal… face-roll some more…
Since CD is not an issue, neither is the strategy going to be based on CD. Players are not going to burst all their damage, and then hold out or run away while waiting for the CD and do it all again. Rather, players will need to actively use their abilities, and determine not by CD, but by the circumstances of the moment. Players will not be fighting ‘at’ their target, but will be forced to fight ‘with.’ I cannot just throw all my damage out in the open without first checking my enemy.
This will also be more compatible with the 5-skill weapon set. Because each ability used will have its unique function to the battle. Instead of: This one hits hard, this one bleeds, this one cripples…(I know, just face-roll them all for max damage!) It would be that each are needed to help determine the battle. One of the five will always need to be (S) the other four do not necessarily need to have an (R ) function.
Traits can also help improve R-P-S. (S) can have an extra 2 secs of disability capability. (P) Can have faster endurance regeneration, or even retaliation while channeling. (R ) Is normal and is already traited for. These will give players more active roles because pvp and pve will depend on effective use of R-P-S, while not having a “tank” or “healer.” Also, healing will not be a problem, but can actually be significantly decreased if not cut off entirely (except for boons perhaps).
Final Word
Now, I am not saying that there is no skill in the game, nor am I saying that you can literally face-roll and win. Yet, in comparison to other games, I find the skill required to be structurally the same. Three players can carelessly face-roll and kill one player, and it does not have to do with skill. Therefore I present this alternative to the combat system.
This idea of course will turn the game upside down and will require plenty of work to reform. But, it will make it fun to play (as long as other changes are still being made), and require skill to execute. I am actually tired of this game, there has been too much attention on balancing when I am still looking for it to be less boring. Stop balancing a bad system, and start making it more fun. I am still having the same simple problems with playing my character. It has been months while your attention has been on adding… 2D game additions. I do not want to play Mario, I want to play GW2. Please redesign the combat to be more fun and then start balancing.
Parry? Block?
Realistically every soldier learns to block and parry attacks, and not just how to swing their sword mindlessly at their opponent. It is their “bread and butter” to be able to know what to do to avoid attacks and strike while avoiding getting killed themselves. There is no such thing in this game except abilities. By that I mean all the problems previously mentioned, I can only parry, block, or dodge once and then wait for a CD. After I use such an ability, I can do nothing to defend myself and then go right back into the face-rolling to kill. Face-rolling is possible, because essentially there is nothing I can do to stop the enemy from killing me, all I can do is slow it down and kill them faster.
Skill?
Therefore I do not think there is as much skill in this game as there could be. The skill required is very similar to other games. A game of skill leaves possibilities such as these:
One verse three feels possible. This is not necessarily true, but a game of skill allows even the weakest of players to have a fighting chance. At level 80 I had no hopes of besting the others because of gear. As soon as I put gear back on, it was easy again. This does not sound like skill, and once again I can do nothing to stop their continual strikes of heavy damage. Which means, the player with the highest damage wins, which also means gear matters. Therefore I said “1v3 feels possible” because a game of skill would not have a general process of elimination. Three is not better than one as long as the one is far more skillful (not more gear, not higher level, etc.). Since however, there is no way to continually avoid damage, all a player can do is dodge twice and then take in three other players hits.
Survival is not limited. That is to say, whenever I choose an ability it should not be limited to a long CD. If I choose to parry or dodge, it should not be another 20 secs before I can do it again. Because, if I can not have a fairly continual option to avoid damage, then: 1v3 is never possible, gear will matter, damage will matter, and in the end skill matters little. At this point the reader is probably thinking, “well then the player would always parry or block, and nothing will ever get done.” Quite true, which is why I have a solution.
Rock, Paper, Scissors
This is actually an old idea, and I have seen it on a few games about ten years old (or more). I call it “Rock, Paper, Scissors.” This is how it works: Rock® is always better than Scissors (S), Scissors is always better than Paper (P), and Paper is always better than Rock.
My suggestion is to either take out the dodge mechanic and replace it with a parry/block mechanic, or to simply add a parry block mechanic (which may be easier). This will be the players “Paper.” It is not a twice used ability. It is a channeling ability, which allows the player to block every attack (except an AOE perhaps). The channeling will drain the endurance over time, but can still be used again fairly soon.
Next is Scissors (S). It is the only effective way to deal with some one who wants to be a turtle in his shell (P). It is an ability which breaks the channel for a small duration as to allow the normal flow of damage once again. (S) only works if the enemy is using (P), if not then it is a wasted strike. It is also not superior enough in damage to be of use in any other circumstance, because Rock will always be superior to it.
Rock is the standard damage. It is the sum of all the damaging abilities except the (S). It is of course useless as long as the enemy is using (P). Yet if the player is deciding to use (S) for damage or else in hopes that soon the enemy will use (P), then (R ) will overwhelm it.
Continue…
I am sorry for the length, but would hope that you will still take the time to read and consider this.
My greatest favor of Guild Wars 2 was that it would not be like any other game, especially in the combat system. Combat is essentially what the game is built on; you can do stories, quests, pvp, pve, wvwvw, etc. and combat is what gets you through to the end. Therefore how you design combat is a big deal! It felt like it would be different as I first played, the dodge mechanic seemed different even. However as time went on the game became less fun and I realized there is really not that much more skill in comparison to other games. I will show how:
First: overall use of the abilities
Literally “face-rolling” will not make you a winner. There is some discernment as when to use certain skills, but that is the same as every other game. What is the difference? Certainly there are differences on a micro level, but at the end of the day the skill required for both is the same. If the enemy runs away I press charge; if I am range I keep my distance and snare; if I am dying I heal; if they knock me down I break stun. These basic features are shared by different games. This is because the abilities are designed to be less strategic in a partnership of fighting (fight with), and so it depends on me as to how fast I can kill without getting killed (fight at). (More on this later.)
Second: Dodge acts just as another ability
Dodge works just like any other ability: You have a Cool Down before you use it, you use it 1-2 times just like using shield block, and you have traits that can decrease Cool Down. The skill to use dodge is just like any other ability. When I want to block with a shield, I push a button and wait for Xsecs, then do it again. Same thing with dodge, and same thing with other games. That is, I can avoid damage by pushing a button at the right time, and then wait for Cool Down and do it all over again.
Skill Summary
The skill in this is based on getting the right sequence of abilities at the right time and the basis of judgement is on Cool Down time. Take away the Cool Down, take away the strategy and thus the skill requirement. This is just like other games, and there is not that much skill involved. The purpose is therefore to kill your opponent by “face-rolling” or rather using what abilities you can at the right time because of CD.
What do I mean by “face-rolling?”
For starters, there are not many ability options. That means combined with the skill involved (which is not much) the basis for being a good player is: Traiting right; Equipping right (weapons); Picking right (utilities). After that, not too much can go wrong. Either your a causal player and will not improve anyways or you will be a serious player. Based on the player? Yes, but that has been the case for other games. Since it is all about how you trait, how you use your abilities is not that big of an issue.
Face-rolling is possible because it does not matter what abilities I use, eventually the enemy will die. There is never a time I need to stop and think, “what I am doing is ineffective, I need to do something else.” Here is why:
Continue…
I am actually looking less skimpy clothing. Nearly half the options are already too skimpy for me. If Anet adds more I might just have to quit. Even so, I am trying to find decent looking armor that covers me, and there really isn’t any. Either they are too skimpy or else too boring or ugly. Its sad that people want to mix their gaming experience with a pornographic sight seeing. Yet not everyone is going to appreciate that, and I am certainly one of them.
Increasing difficulty: -Focus on the Fractals
I know many want the game more challenging, and I agree. Some of the greater downfall of other games is that they make the game easy enough for any and everyone to play. When everyone can do it, then there really is no skill required. So as I progress in the fractals, I want to reach a level where I can say “only good skills can bring me here.” However, there are a few things I really dislike about the increase in difficulty through more health and more damage with mobs.
As the mobs hit harder, the outcome is that players get single-shot-killed. Dodging is designed to not dodge every hit, but to be used for strategic purposes. Certainly there are other ways to avoid damage, but those are for strategic use also. So what can we do to survive with these limits and high vulnerability to attacks?
Answer: Range. Many benefits in the game have been given to anyone who ranges. Consider attacking a ranged-mob, just strafe left and right and you can avoid many of their attacks. Consider a melee-mob, snare and run away while continuing damage. Also consider that while range, you have a few more seconds of reaction time to avoid getting hit (ie. agony from bosses). Can players do the same while in melee? No. That makes a severe disadvantage to melee, because there are no benefits to being melee. The range-to-melee is imbalanced. Now everyone stays ranged because it is too hard to melee. I am a bit stubborn, so I will continue melee regardless of being called a “noob” but I know my limits and from time to time I need to range.
I know this may be a hard thing to adjust, and that my suggestion really is a not good one, but consider that in melee (at least with swords) a lot of the survival is based on parry. Right now, I feel like I am mindlessly swinging a sword while the other guy is mindlessly swinging his, the difference? His hits way harder. (why? is it sharper? better metal? no, just because he is a boss). Why do I always have to move for his hits and he does not care that I am hitting him? He is too full of himself. If there is a way to increase survival for melee that would be much appreciated since I will be able to actually fight according to the role I chose.
(edited by Diba.4682)
2 More skills – cuz after unlock all skills gameplay is dull and boring
3 More skills again
In order to add more skills, there are several things that will need to be considered, (and I do agree that more abilities could be better).
First off, if you add more utilities, it may work for awhile but then there would be the problem that every class can basically do everything. This may lose the uniqueness of each character. Yet certainly a few more will help form uniqueness because right now I feel like every warrior basically has the same abilities as me.
The second place to add abilities is in the weapons. Which presents at least three ways to do this:
1. Add weapon customization like that of utilities. That is, for Weapon slot 1, you have say, 3 different choices of auto attacks reflecting more dps, more survival, more support (depending on weapon type, maybe even power dps, condition dps, or prec. dps). Then slot 2 have three options to choice from, and slot 3 and 4 and 5. Each having their own choices to choose from separated from each other. A benefit and a caution with this is: Players will have more flexibility to choose a weapon, but if you allow players to do anything with any weapon (bleed with hammer?) then it will lose the realistic feel that certain weapons can only do certain task.
2. Add weapon customization like a new “attunement.” This is not to say we can switch in combat like an elementalist, nor that the option is so easy to switch as an elementalist. However, like the previous suggestion, being able to switch abilities of weapons but instead of each individual slot, the whole 5 skills in the weapon line.
3. Another way to increase weapon customization is through a separated trait field (not attached or included with the already existing trait line).
a) Being able to upgrade traits with certain weapons, making them grant certain benifits.
b) Or, instead of providing boons/conditions for our weapons, allow us to choose from a selection. (Ie. Greatsword for warriors grants vunerability, disallow that and instead provide the options: vunerability, bleed, and whatever.)
Of course all these options have downfalls, but these are ideas none the less. I certainly like the customization so far, and have spent hours playing around with it. But for those who want more, would this be what your looking for?
I know you wanted to have great weapon effects on the mobs, such as blue fire from guardians, but can we scale down these effect? It becomes hard to see what the bosses are doing and if I need to dodge or move away because they are covered with so many glowing effects. Not a problem with the Super size bosses, but the humanoids or smaller it is definitely hard to see.
I am sorry that this may be a bit of a repeat, but I didn’t feel like reading 25 pages of post just to make sure (even using the search), and so I would like to emphasize or re-emphasize these things. If there is another place I can throw ideas at let me know, because there is much more to say than what I have here.
1. Improve melee combat (Warriors perspective). I am a warrior class; I love to melee. Yet sometimes I feel like I have to range the whole fight just to stay alive. I realize this will be a great challenge to bring about, but for example: going into the fractals-Ascalon, the warriors will practically one-shot me even though I have 2000 Toughness. Some bosses will hit really hard without giving much of a chance or even a sign to dodge/ even as I learned to be quicker, which is good because it makes me a better player but… I can only dodge twice then leave combat for awhile to wait for healing or endurance. 100-blades is a hit or miss ability. In PvE, it is the ability which in order to use I have to stand still and take all the hits. To help this, Frenzy is nice for its quickness but why give the %50 damage intake to the one class who is most likely going to be in the middle of the fight? Even so, since I die fast anyways, why do we need the extra %50? The best abilities are the ones that allow you to strike and evade at once (ie. whirlwind). 100-Blades has perhaps the best damage build up, but is slow and either the enemy does not stay in it, or the enemy kills you faster than you can kill it. Both of these make it seem to have no point unless nothing is attacking you or your target is snared (in which case forces me to use quickness or immobilize). Anyways I know there is much more to say on this, more details, even mentioning other weapons such as 1h-swords, but in short I would like to melee (especially) bosses more and not be so limited to what I can do in order to make that happen. Just to mention another class, with rangers 1hand, I get stuck in attacking that I can not even move or dodge properly.
2. Dragon fights. I know that many have mentioned about his already, but I will say that I was a little disappointed when coming to Orr and not have a single dragon fight (even fighting three at the same time but having weapons to kill them as fast as a normal fight). Sure there are fights in Arah with the dragons, but I really thought, looking up and seeing lots of dragons, that I may get attacked by 2-5. Add on to the fact that the dragon fights are boring, they just sit around and roar, instead of running around causing fear to the players experience. I feel like it doesn’t matter if I move left or right, the Dragon is just going to go through his routine. When killed the loot is not worth it. Can there at least be one rare with the chance of more rares/exotics? While the fight is easy, making it harder does not mean the dragon one shots everything like the Priest of Balthazzar. Which is frustrating because I spend most of the fight running back even with the 2000 toughness.
3. Events. All the “good” events are usually massed with many players that it is impossible to lose, the only thing that is impossible is getting any loot or credit from the kills. is there a way we can increase the scaling, maybe not more (assuming that more will cause bad lag) but maybe include veterans?
I like seeing the massive number of armies. However, (and this may just be for future reference then an actual change) I think it would be nice to see a meta event to involve a full scale fortress- complete with turrets, catapults, walls, much like the WvWvW experience or even similar to Claw Island Story quest. Maybe this is asking for too much, maybe it might make everyone’s computer crash, I really wouldn’t know, but it is an idea.
4. Loot. Unfortunately everyone needs to feel like things are worth it, and the main judge for its worth is in its loot. So instead of making rare items less rare (which I am guessing you do not want to do), perhaps increase the coin income from these fights?
5. The every day mobs I just want to encourage it more as I have seen it. I like seeing the mobs travel in groups across the mob and not roaming around by themselves in a limited area. When attacking a camp, it is silly just having one enemy come at me at a time while the rest sit still. The most fun I had was in an event when only me and my friend attacked a champion with his army of 22 (2vs22+champ). It was challenging (even over my level), but perhaps one of the most memorable to me (and yes we did succeed).
There is certainly more to say, but I trust that it may have already been covered. Sorry I could not go into more details with these but I hope the point is made.
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