Revealed Training – Good if it applies to hits from stealth, otherwise meh. Could work well for builds lacking power…. maybe with cavalier’s gear? Would suggest moving to Critical Strikes.
Suggestion: Have Bewildering Ambush as GM in DA, move Revealed Training to Critical Strikes. I would also suggest Panic Strikes be buffed to provide an alternative for direct damage builds, seen as immobilize / stun is now common in PvP / WvW. Perhaps grant X stacks of might for Y secs in addition to the immobilize. This seems more fair than Revealed Training seen as it gives opportunity to counter.
Invigorating Precision – Mmmm…. no. Up against executioner and hidden killer. Also, consider downing a 20k target: you get only 1000 vitality assuming every hit is a critical. Would be good for sustained fights, but only condition builds tend to do this. Condition builds tend to lack precision and can generally find more appropriate trait lines to invest in. Putting a defensive trait as a GM in a direct damage trait line is just a crazy idea.
Suggestion: Take Revealed Training, ensure duration makes it competitive with hidden killer and executioner. This would provide a go to trait for less bursty builds that already have high precision.
Shadow Arts: Resilience of Shadows – Perhaps if using a gimmicky stealth medic build, otherwise no. A lot of damage during stealth comes from AOE, which has a tendency to cause conditions and stuns, neither of which are mitigated by this trait. Generally seems like bad trait design, inferior to the very similar Shadow’s Rejuvenation trait. Resilience of Shadows would help more with incoming damage bursts…. but who’s going to burst you with direct damage while you are in stealth?
Suggestion: Replace. Gain a random boon for X seconds every Y second in stealth? Something else?
Acrobatics: Assassin’s Equilibrium – 1s if far too short to help with pumping damage into hammer wielding heavy classes. Thieves can effectively replicate this trait already dodging backwards after attacking from stealth. A poor counter to telegraphed CC, since you need to attack to break stealth. Your attack cast will likely be too slow to break stealth in time to counter any oncoming CC. Perhaps up the time to 2s? Personally I would much prefer an alternative trait, as a lot of acrobatics thieves do not make heavy use of stealth.
Suggestion: Up time to 2s? 4s stability on stun, can only occur every 60s? Gain 2s of stability for every successful evade? Needs a strong new GM since the others are a little lacklustre.
Trickery: Bewildering Ambush – Seems good on paper… but using sleight of hand with perplexity runes is a much better alternative to this trait: shorter steal times, daze, interrupts and 5 stacks of confusion on interrupt for 10s. The increased steal time from not choosing sleight of hand would be detrimental to the synergy commonly found in condition builds using mug.
Suggestion: Move to deadly arts as GM. Transfer a condition from yourself to your target and break stun, immobilize on steal? Something else?
(edited by Gallant Pigeon.5807)
A video of me roaming in Augury Rock borderlands. Mostly 1vX, a couple 2vX fights.
I use quite an unusual D/D condition build; it was adapted from what I used to PvE with. The build relies on high evade uptime for survivability. Damage comes from being able to rapidly apply long lasting conditions to multiple targets with deathblossom and caltrops. Sigils and runes provide additional conditions to conceal bleeds from cleanses.
Very good for flipping camps and quickly taking out small parties. Not so great at sustained fights due to a lack of stealth – definitely a struggle to fight bunker necromancers and P/D thieves.
(edited by Gallant Pigeon.5807)
D/D, SB
20/0/0/20/30
WvW, PvE
I must admit…. pairing thieves guild with the ambush trap can be hilarious. Especially if you can catch a player with the ambush trap about to come off cool down. Nothing funnier than watching them panic as a 1v1 turns into a 1v4.
I used to use thieves guild a lot, but would never even think of using it now. The damage output is kinda meh for such a long CD. Most good players (the ones you want to worry about) will dodge the scorpion wire and just continue to focus on you. I’ve also found the cast time can open you up to some nasty bursts.
As a condition thief, dagger storm is my go to elite skill. Lots of bleeds and can act as a secondary heal with signet of malice. Also a good counter to someone who just switched to a ranged weapon. Would probably take basilisk venom on a back stab build.
(edited by Gallant Pigeon.5807)
What I dislike about p/d is inconsistent stealth access to for bleed stacks – you’re left far too vulnerable if you blow your utilities as an opener. The cloak and dagger / shadow strike combo is risky and costs a 10 initiative. A lot of builds carry 1 long cool down cleanse which will remove all of these conditions and make you go on the defensive for ~ 8/10 secs. Anyone decent with a high health pool is a pain to kill with p/d, it lacks sustained condition damage without sacrificing your own defences.
I play an aggressive condition d/d carrion/rabid build. Constant evades and dodges keep me alive. When you throw weakness into the mix incoming damage is usually pretty low. Generally I only use stealth from shadow refuge for escaping or for the surprise shot immobilize on the shortbow.
“No condition thief relies on one condition” babazhook is right – the best way to kill someone is to bury your bleeds under other conditions. Not a fan of venoms, they seem weak untraited considering their long cooldowns. I use a sigil or torment and runes of perplexity for my extra conditions. One my favourite tactics is a counter burst: interrupt on steal and cause damage, weakness, poison, daze and 5 stacks of confusion – death-blossom – heartseeker (gap closer) -death-blossom – dodge (for the cripple and avoid their counter). I often chuck in devourer venom if fighting another thief. Signet of malice – caltrops – daggerstorm combo is good for group fights.
I tend to find some condition duration hadny – I’m at 70% with food. You might lose damage due to conditions being removed before the full duration, but its all about maintaining pressure to control the fight (force them to blow their cleanse early). The only other builds I regularly struggle with fighting are condition necromancers and 1v1 against full glass d/p thieves.
Rough strategy vs class X:
Necro: Usually a difficult fight for condition builds. Be prepared for your conditions to come back. Target them first in group fight. Make use of stolen fears to go on the offensive.
Guardian: Some pack a lot of cleanses, but a successful burst will kill them pretty quickly due to their small health pool. Make sure aegis is down before stealing. Be wary of their circle of pain; a shortbow comes in handy for using shadow shot to escape. Its possible to dodge/death-blossom inside the circle without hitting the sides – don’t be afraid to try this if you have the upper hand.
Mesmer: Don’t waste initiative on clones unless they’re grouped. Spam heart seeker to stay on the real mesmer, they will usually die quickly if you can pull of a death-blossom burst. Signet of malice, daggerstorm combo can come in handy if the mesmer gets all their clones out.
Warrior: Usually the class I find easiest since they have very telegraphed attacks. Apply constant pressure with alternating death-blossoms and dodges. Have a stun breaker or dodge ready so you can back off when they burst. Counter burst with stun on steal and perplexity runes works well here. Occasionally I come up against hammer / bow bunker builds with scary amounts of condi damage – these need to be treated with care. I would recommend using dagger storm to counter their bow (best elite for condition thief).
Thieves: For backstab thieves you want to pace your dodges. Don’t try to out stealth them unless running away. If you see a miss flash up, turn around and death-blossom. Save your steal and bide your time – your waiting for them to run down their stealth skills / initiative. Dodge/stun break then counter burst if they land their back stab. Once again stun on steal and perplexity runes works well here (especially since it works when your hit with basilisk venom). I tend to treat p/d thieves like mesmers, hound them with heartseeker then death-blossom.
Elemental: They have lots of evades and can pull a chain of condition cleanses, so be prepared for a long fight – make use of opportunities but don’t overextend.
Engineer: If they start laying bombs, dodge through the AoE then death blossom after it detonates and before they lay the next bomb – you might need to hit them with a dancing dagger to ensure they don’t kite you (The best class for fighting while facing the wrong way :-)). Don’t be tempted to tank the bombs / grenades, go ranged if you must. Counter their turret elite with daggerstorm.
Rangers: If you can close on them they will die very quickly – I use a signet of agility for this (6 back to back evades with feline grace). Second to top priority in group fights since it’s a quick kill and one less person kiting you. Some rangers can stack up some nasty bleeds, steal for healing seed to counter.
d/d condition is very viable for PVE,depending on your party, and roaming / small group WVW.