Guild Wars 2

The reason I always use medkit is for the stimulant (fury/swiftness), speedy kit, and/or superior rune (6) stuff that triggers on healing skill.

I think TC might seem like a “mindless” zerg occasionally because we have trouble to keep even 1 person in a fully upgraded keep as scout to save our life. This includes myself who look for cheap thrills like escorting a yak to pvp yak slappers, well at least it seems to work out that way.

This is the TC Asura Engi who is running and jumping around a yak all the time giving it permanent swiftness. I lost a bunch but I also won a bunch of the 1v1 pvp (against both Yaks and CDs), thanks for the fun!

Ianervan.3415:

Well you can say there are some good engineer roamers and skirmishers, but we never see them. I’m a mesmer and roam often, and I can’t even remember when was the last time I saw roaming engineer, let alone die to one.

But this is a 5-man thread. What synergy does engineer provide? I honestly can’t think of anything when going through his skills.

Well engineers can do a lot of the “roles” listed in OP. Doubt they’ll be the “best” in any single one, but they can often do multiple of these things within the same build. I think the most problem I have with the engi class is trying focus and perform just one or two roles well because they can do so many different things. In a designated group of 5, it’ll be much easier to spec for it.

Swiftness for the group – Superior rune of centaur + medkit. Medkit is a healing skill, you can switch to medkit non-stop, there is no CD, so group swiftness based on the rune’s internal CD.
Control – Engi has decent numbers of immobilization, cripples, and launches skills. See wiki pages on immobilize and launches please.
Damage – Glass-cannon rifle + static discharge build can spike quite well. Problem is that’s all the build does and not much else imho.
AoE Damage – Grenadiers.
Condition Removal – Cleansing Formula 409 trait + elixir build, not to mention tossing elixirs effects. Kit Refinement trait + elixir gun gives super elixir and another super elixir from the gun ("While not mentioned in-game, Super Elixir also removes conditions on impact. " – wiki notes).

I should mention that supply drop is probably one of the best skirmish changing elite skills there is…

But honestly though, all those things mentioned above are pretty meh compared to stealth due to the culling issue imo. Hence a group of stealthers have the upper hand right now. (Case in point, try fighting glass cannon thieves along side NPCs and see how much weaker they suddenly seem because NPC aren’t affected by culling issue. Pay attention to NPCs movements to locate “unstealthed” thieves.) You’ll have to wait and see if the Nov 15 patch really fixes anything.

Chidawg.6315:

Katsumoto.9452:

5 Necromancer’s.
Why you look at me funny?

OH man… someone should post a video of a roaming team of 5 necromancers with all pets for utility and elite skill. That is 6 dots / person(2 bone minions). You would have 30 dots moving on a map with only 5 guys. That could scare people to go another direction. Just hope you don’t get engaged cause 5 minion specced necromancers would get rocked.

Hmm… very good farming though. I expect all 5 flesh golem to stop and attempt to kill every single animal in sight, completely UNSTOPPABLE!

Like somebody else already mentioned, if you want loot (badges included) go with small (5 people) camp-flipping gank groups. The camp supervisor drops badges and you actually get a decent amount of badges from ganking stragglers/lonely defenders.

An engi with superior rune of the centaur + medkit can almost keep group swiftness up by himself without sacrificing any skill/trait for roaming. If necessary, blowing up turrets inside a smoke field can stack group stealth. So an engi might be useful for 5-man roaming setup.

I believe you can treb the East Keep’s outer walls from FH cliff and the western hills. So if you lose your anti-treb siege weapons and you lack the man-power to overpower these treb spots, East Keep outer walls will fall just the same.

The one thing I find (at least on my server) is that people place too much emphasis on the outer walls and neglect the inner wall. They put up huge amount of siege fortifications on the outer wall, and nothing on the inner. So when the outer wall gets trebbed down, the inner falls quickly afterwards because there is little to no defense.

Imho the Western Keep’s outer walls are weak but the inner is pretty kitten strong, if proper siege were set up before the outer walls are down. Any assault treb/catapults within or on the outer walls can be counter sieged. So I wouldn’t bother repairing those outer walls and would attempt make the area between inner wall and outer wall a death trap if I were to try to last as long as possible.

Shrouded.6450:

I have heard that some TC squad has a habit of leading people around the map though, which is somewhat amusing imo….I remember one server getting spooked out because of it( I’m thinking Blackgate?)…

Well I always see a lot of small guild groups do their own thing and disregard our zerg in general. For a larger roaming party, in EB at night Team Pam is running around the map for “ethnic slaughter” and making money. Although I believe Team Pam only formed last week v.s. SoR (Pam was trying hard to let us have fun despite everything), so I’m not sure that’s the group you’re referring to.

TheFug.5278:

Except we don’t have 30 guys for each BL like you guys do. That is the point. We have about 15 guys in each BL at any given time, but we don’t zerg them all together and only attack 1 BG at a time like TC is doing. The fact is that even if we seige up a keep an defend it, TC will leave the BG instead of trying to attack it and come back 3 hours later to try again when there are less people defending it until they finally do it at a time when everybody is at work or in bed. I don’t know why you guys like to PvDOOR so much.

Ah, that is unfortunate and I do not have any answer for you. Generally when this out-manned thing happens to TC (and it surely did when we got slaughtered, like vs. BG and SoR), we tend to just stick to one BL and fight it ‘til the bitter end and let our opponent PvDoor all the other maps. I know this isn’t the answer you’re looking for, so I apologize here.

TheFug.5278:

This is your idea of fun, zerging keeps 60-1? Why not have 30 people defend each borderland and actually play the game instead of just rolling everything for the free karma train. This is not fun for anybody. We don’t even get to attack defended keeps either, because you guys immediately leave the BG and we have to PvDOOR all day.

This is not fun. You are not playing the game, you are taking advantage of the fact that there is no 3rd server and you realize that you cannot fight even numbers, so you zerg around to avoid anything close to PVP.

Now I have never played around this time of the day due to work, so I might be a bit off here. However it seems rather easy to counter this horrible TC tactics. You leave 30 guys in each BL and defend it instead of leaving that BL open for PvDoor. So you’ll stall this terrible TC 60-man zerg until your reinforcement arrives, and everybody is happy.

Vagrant.1094:

CD, you played better than TC for the period of time I was on and watching tonight, well done. I’m hoping we’ll be able to face you and Yaks’ next week on more even footing.

~Nyari Cil, Queen.

Your Royal Highness missed out on how awesome we were after you left. =) Although I have a nagging suspicion it was due to most CDs went to their homeland and TC people left that place to come to EB…. Anyways I had a lot of fun helping to defend Anz tonight. Both times we used up all our supply and we were in the “uh-oh” stage, then our cavalry suddenly showed up and saved the day.

- Hella Firestarter, lvl 80 Engi

Good stuff. Let me add some simple things about supply and towers/keeps.

Basically towers/keeps get their supplies from dolyaks. You do not need to take over camp(s) to starve a tower/keep from getting supply, you simply have to make sure no dolyaks get there. For towers, each default dolyak adds 35 supply, and upgraded dolyak adds 70 supply. For keeps/castle, each dolyak adds 70 supply or 140 if upgraded. If you think there is a good chance that you can keep the camp for a while, it’s a very good idea to upgrade the camp for at least increased supply and guards (vs random NPCs).

Let’s talk about cannons and oil pots upgrades on tower/keep. Very often people neglect these because “well they’ll just get destroyed again anyways” and do not rebuild them after successfully repelling an attack. Yes they’ll be destroyed again, but they buy time just as a repaired, reinforced gate buy time for the defense. When assaulting a gate using rams, the invading zerg will first take out cannon(s), second take out oil pot, then rams down. The oil pot and the cannons can deal massive amount of damage to the rams otherwise. If cannons and oil pot are not built, then it’ll be rams down right off the bat and it’ll save the zerg a lot of precious time. So please do a supply run from the nearest camp and rebuild those cannons and oil pots.

Now some people may disagree and think the oil pots are a waste of supply. Quite often some zergs will ignore it and build rams before taking it out, and they just make sure to cover the oil pot with AoEs. This is a risky gamble because the oil pot does massive damage to the rams. In fact it does so much damage in such a short amount of time that it is very worthwhile for a defender to pop all his defensive CDs and then sacrifice himself working that oil until death. Actually that’s how I always defend, oil still up and rams down below. Time for a good virtual death.

Edit: Supply caravan amount correction.

http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA
So even after the nightly mauling, TC’s ranking is only -11 over the week? In fact our overall ranking went from 8 to 7? Interesting.

Yes, I have no clue how these ranking works.

I wouldn’t mind this as the casting time makes sense, but it might encourage even more class/race imbalance since stealth-WP will be the only escape for roaming. You will still not have the PvP that you wanted AND you introduced more incentive to skew the class/race ratio.

Great stuff. Another thing that might be good to add is to explain the map a little, especially the various gates of the keeps and castles. My coworker hardly ever WvWvW and everytime he tries he ends up with some questions that are map-related because a lot of the important team chats are things like “check Overlook underground gate”, or “get to garrison watergate now”, etc. So I generally pull up http://www.fist-of-the-empire.com/GW2-WvW-Map.html and explains stuff to him which seemed to help.

scetpus.9415

Well after the display I witnessed from some of my TCers tonight, I think SoR won this match in more ways than one. They are all standing around the spawn. They claim they would rather taunt them at spawn than do something. There is more of them standing here than there are enemies in front of them. Looks to me like they got the fight beat out of them.

I think you just showed up at a bad time because Pam built a golem, took Meldon, WP back and then some troll took it out front for SoR to kill. So we ended up standing around waiting for the next Team Pam train to flip camps and make money a bit longer than usual…

Edit: Yes I was there standing around waiting for the next Team Pam adventure. I remember seeing you running in and then saying something along the line of better doing something than nothing. For clarification we just finished taking several camps, took out frogs and moles, and took Meldon on the last trip. The spawn/bridge dancers were practically handing out badges to SoR, so we didn’t really feel like joining them.

Gunshow.3485:

ChairGraveyard.2967:

Get rid of the orbs and the 7 day matches would be fine.

As it is, the match is only meaningful until the server with the most population inevitably gets all three orbs (otherwise known as the “I Win Button”).

Naw. Competitive matches have orb swings all day, back and forth. I think that quite often the correlation of a winning server having 3 orbs is misinterpreted as causation.

Orbs make WvW more interesting.

This point is correct. These winning servers would still keep the 3 orbs and most of the map without the 3 orbs bonus. This begs the question, why give these dominating servers even more bonuses to make their enemies more miserable?

I’m sure most of us here have been on the dominating side AND on the side getting crushed. When we’re dominating, we would like to think that we “outplayed” (more likely outnumbered, heh) our opponent without needing the 3-orb bonuses. So the scores might be closer, but I don’t think we need it and I don’t want it. When we’re on the losing side because we were outplayed since the beginning of the match, the 3-orb bonus is just adding insult to injury because suddenly you get a lot more “macho” glass-cannon enemies acting like they’re something special.

Fighting for the orbs are fun, and there should be an incentive for winning/holding on to the orb. However it’s also quite obvious that something isn’t quite right and hopefully a minor change to the orb incentive could make Wv3 more interesting.

This so-called “spawn camping” issue is really demoralizing for some of us here in TC. Numerous occasions we (who used the “side-doors”) are trying to defend Lang, Dane, QL, Umber, Bravost, or even Valley Keep but we lack the extra bodies. So we defenders died inside (occasionally multiple times because we can get there consistently) and the place fell, then we respawned to see 15-20 people performing this strange PvP dance on the bridge in front of the spawn. I hoped they meant well and that they thought they were doing something useful, but they weren’t because that bridge was an effective choke point. There were a lot more room behind Lang and Bravost to flank and/or break through the siege to get inside the place lacking defenders.

This is demoralizing for me and a few others I regularly fight with, and it is not caused by anything that SoR is doing to TC. Like seriously, how did you think we managed to regularly flip all those camps and towers every night? Is there really a lot of badges to be had to perform that dance at a choke point filled with enemy siege support + 3 orbs bonus? I ask because I see more dead TCers than dead SoRs.

Oh well, I guess this post is probably pointless because some of you are just doing the obligatory Wv3 for your PvE stuff and legendary weapon. I don’t mind that because TC never was supposed to be a hardcore Wv3 server. We already have instant queues so I shouldn’t be too hard for the extra diversion we got.

Are they also camping the side exits? Let’s not get overly excited until they block off all exits on every map. Here is a good site that clearly illustrates the side exit I’m talking about.

http://www.fist-of-the-empire.com/GW2-WvW-Map.html

Basically both HoD and ET simply do not have the Wv3 population to belong in the top tiers right now. So they are gradually going down in ranks but that takes time. Of course that could change in a moment if mass transfers happen.

The up-and-coming servers are still moving up in ranks. Take SoR for example, they were basically tied with SoS last week and the match wasn’t decided until the very end. So both SoR and SoS should definitely be in top six as it stands. It’ll be next week before SoR gets up there though.

There are other servers that are moving up or going down. Until the Wv3 population settle down on their real home server, the ranking will be messed up and lop-sided matches will occur. Even then it’ll probably take a bit of time before the ranking system makes any sense.

See here for the current scores. Basically half of all NA matches are unbalanced right now. Some more extreme than others.
http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA

Meh about the scores. Both tier 2 and tier 3 are pretty messed up at the moment.
http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA

As for Tier 3, ironically it seems the people who’re suffering the most are the people winning. I just had a really fun night playing for TC and it sounded like some ET folks had fun too.

Thanks everybody (both SoR and fellow TCers) for a very entertaining night. I had a lot of fun. I have to say that you [TW] guys are truly something. I was happily maintaining a modest killing to dying ratio until you folks came along and stomped me in Dane and QL several times in a row.

I missed all the fun at Dawn’s. =( I was the self-appointed yak runner because I can give it 100% swiftness uptime. Ah well it was neat watching a wall suddenly pop into existence and mess up an assault because a yak slipped in.

- Hella Firestarter, lvl 80 Asura Engi, self-proclaimed “Yak Runner”

You should try those Halloween events if you haven’t. A lot of people are having loads of fun doing that on Tarnished Coast. The LA map chat was filled with insane amounts of LFG last night.

If that doesn’t appeal to you, you should consider taking a short break from the game and come back fresh on Fri night.

I agree with Sceptus, SoR’s organization and dedication really surprised me. On Fri and Sat, it seems every key camp SoR owned are upgraded and had 3-5 people defending them. Those upgraded guards really hurt and we probably should’ve used 10 men to take each camp. The key dolyaks are also protected by 3-5 players full time. We’re used to having independent 5-men teams for yak sniping and camp flipping, so none of that worked effectively on Fri and Sat.

Each tower and keep always seemed to have around 3 people inside, even when the whole map was green. All the towers are fully upgraded. I have spent hours defending towers where no attacks come, so I know just how boring it could be. When we played BG and they own most things, a lot of the towers are wooden and unguarded. So I was really impressed by the dedication of SoR defenders.

Overall I gained much respect to to SoR server and its players. I’m not quite sure why you do /laugh when you gank stragglers in a group but whatever. I hope you guys get all the way to Tier 1 ASAP and stay away from us in Tier 3. I’ll continue to fight in this asymmetric war but I’m not sure how much difference it’ll make from your point of view.

- Hella Firestarter, lvl 80 Asura Engi from [HOT] or [LEV]

Ok, this spawn camping talk is seriously bugging me as another TCer. Look it’s not really a spawn camp if you can just walk out the side. TCers know about the side doors but instead they fight with the people in the front gate.

Let me summarize my day today to demonstrate what I mean.

Morning: Went into EB, people were pushing back and forth in the front gate of spawn. Seemed a waste of time because neither of the side doors were covered. So I left to SoR or ET BL (can`t remember) and joined some fine folks from [FIRE]. We happily ran around in circles flipping camps and killing yaks.

Afternoon: Went into EB, people were still pushing back and forth in the front gate of spawn. Felt silly, said so. Went to SoR BL and met Commander Ashem from [RELM] and he led us running around the map flipping stuff.

After dinner: Went into EB, people were STILL pushing back and forth in the front gate of spawn. Seriously this was the dumbest crap I have ever seen. Obviously some other people felt similarly, so we quickly joined up and dropped off the side, took Dane, and proceed in a clockwise trip of camp flipping all the way to Orgath. Later I joined the awesome Commander Pam from [EP] and we went through the whole flipping camp process again. Ended my night defending TC BL’s northern camp and yaks.

Now this isn’t spawn camping. It’s a bunch of willing people playing a strange kind of pvp that shove back and forth. From the map it doesn’t even seem like people are dying, so I probably earned more badges from flipping camps and ganking the unlucky straggler today.

So can we stop this spawn camping talk please? I would rather hear more about how bored our SoR friends are and how much fight TCers have while most of the people on my contact lists are farming the Mad King (or whatever, unsure ’cause I only did WvWvW today).

- Hella Firestarter, Lvl 80 Asura engi

Every commander have his/her own style and not everyone is a karma-collecting crowd-pleaser. The most important thing for me is the difference in number of holdings with the commander v.s. without the commander. So I would like to give a shout out to Coryphaeus on Tarnished Coast for doing a lot of the difference-making, menial work (setting up defenses, escorting Yaks, setting up supply disruption teams, etc.) that the average zerg tends to neglect.

Wulfe.8092:

HenryAu.7523:

DB looks to be primarily made up of leveling alts and are squishy to my toughness stacked engi.

When your outnumbered you bring any able bodies. I have had people in my groups that were level 19 and 20 at times. It’s still another body and they are getting experience both towards their levels and on how to Wv3 at the same time.

Oh I have no problem with leveling people in Wv3 myself. Levels and gear are easy to come by compared to how hard it is to get Wv3 participation. I just thought some DB people are leveling alts because the majority (more than 60%) of your players I met have the big green arrow. I was going to do the same and play my ele but my engi is still in the middle of gearing up.

FA is pretty much in the same position as TC was in last week. DB looks to be primarily made up of leveling alts and are squishy to my toughness stacked engi. This week I see a lot of PvE people playing for TC that are actively trying to complete the maps. So no doubt we got a big influx of non-regulars to join our zerg this week. (I hope a bunch of them stay around for next week’s WvWvW when the going gets tough as well.)

So yeah the facts are TC #s > FA #s. DB #s are few AND they go down quick. (Speaking for myself only,) I don’t really see any problems with anybody pointing out the facts. So hats off to those of you FA and DB guys who kept fighting. I had quite a bit of fun in a number of the sieges. I hope you FA guys get better coverage soon because some of you guys are really good and the score really shouldn’t be this lopsided.

For TC, I have seen our groups carry out a number of successful “tactical” maneuver which I believe will help us in the future. Granted having numerical superiority all over the place makes it easier to carry them out, but it’s definitely a sign that we’re improving. We’ll see how we fair again in T3…

- Hella Firestarter, the naked asura in jumping puzzles

Here in TC we have very interesting (RP?) people that make for some downright hilarious fights, even when we’re hopelessly behind with no way to recover. Yes we’ll get the occasional bickering on the map chat but who doesn’t? Overall people are helpful and friendly, I rarely see any accusation being thrown at individuals and that is a great thing imho.

I also noticed that there are some quite different strategies and philosophies employed in the different maps due to individual commanders/guilds coverage, so it’s very possible that you don’t really like the style of one zone but love another’s.

Just be warned though, I think we’re currently at the in-between stage of T3 to T4. So we might win in T4 and then get schooled in T3 (I hope not because we’re improving but still). But I actually had more fun last couple of weeks when we got trashed than this week. There were a lot of hilarious “famous last stands” that didn’t really do much to help the score but fun to take part in.

Thrumdi.9216:

Alodar.5794:

This is true. I have also offered to buy beer for those following my Commander Icon for all their hard work and effort they put in.

One of the stipulations however that is saving me is that you must come to me to get your beer… apparently nobody else on my server is from Vancouver so it’s saved me a few rounds.

The offer still stands!

Hey, I’m from Vancouver.

East Van represent!

(And I have a hollow leg).

Wait wait… So you mean I could’ve gotten free beer?! I guess I should spend less time in EB and find out which BL and time Alodar.5794 leads. I have followed you briefly but normally that’s just waiting for my EB queue to pop.

- Hella Firestarter, occasionally naked scout

Speaking as a free-lance TCer with no WvWvW guild ties, it certainly does seem we’re a lot more organized than last couple of weeks put together. We certainly do have a lot more people running about and I know from personal experience that some PvE people joined the zergs to grab POIs and vistas for the 100% map completion. Last week it made no sense for them to show up at all.

Yes I also agree WvWvW needs to be fine tuned. The current system has a heavy bias towards the leading server and it is obviously not working out well.

Hello, here are some basic starting ideas for you. They are my own ideas only so please take them with a grain of salt.

• Follow a successful zerg to begin with. As you run all over the map to raid and pillage, you’ll get a basic idea of everything.
• Go into a tower/keep and look at the upgrades and costs. If it is currently being upgraded (event to say protect workers), “guard” the place until upgrade is done to get a feel for how the yaks, supply, and upgrades work. Understand first hand why taking supply from a tower/keep might be a very bad idea.
• Anytime you visit a place loaded with defensive siege weapons, try them all out. Feel free to ask the defenders how they ought to be used. However please leave the mortars, catapults, and trebs in the same angle as before.

After all that it’s just observation to pick up things that you feel is useful to know. If you find all the waiting stuff is too boring, see if there are any small skirmishing 5-men groups that you can join up with.

Hope this helps a little.

I definitely saw a lot of familiar faces staying up way past their normal sleeping hours (more like regular logging off hours) on TC. We’ll see how the rest of the week goes.

What I think TC sorely lacks are small teams made of dedicated PvPers to kill yaks, gank stragglers, destroy unsuspecting siege weapons, and flip camps without relying instructions from a zerg commander. Groups of 3 will be good (enough for a sneaky counter siege ballista) and they will operate independent of the zerg. I have seen Urrid and a few other people do this stuff but from my experience we generally lack in this area compared to CD and BG the last 2 weeks.

I know some people within our own server might disagree with this idea and worried about the lack of organization and control. It might also take away people from our “supposedly all-mighty” zerg. But from the time I spent sitting behind a mortar/treb and waiting for upgrades, random skirmishers really annoy the heck out of me and do far more damage than you would think.

Yes I have personally met quite a number of leveling players that are trying WvWvW for the first time in TC. (Heck I only dinged 80 the week before and I’m still working on getting geared myself. I’m also still learning a lot of things about WvWvW right now.) However I am very glad to see a lot of these leveling players who have shown a lot of heart despite getting stomped everywhere. IMO levels and gear are the easier things to acquire than the will to fight in desperate situations.

There are actually a lot of things a low level player can bring to any WvWvW match-up. The character level doesn’t matter for running supply chain, calling out enemy numbers and locations, and manning any siege. Considering that TC frequently has instant queues, I would encourage more of our TC people to show up and try WvWvW out. Fighting in the field doesn’t work? Work on your mortar/treb skill and take down enemy siege weapons like a pro.

To be fair, quite a number of the BG people I encountered during the weekend were absurdly better geared compared to most of our average TC people. Face it a lot of us TCers are not really hardcore PvPers. At one point one of our TC commanders basically sighed in /t that we probably don’t have enough 80s right now to counter the BG zerg.

One more thing I noticed in a zerg vs zerg was that our TC zergs tend to scatter by reflex. The “good” BG zerg that I saw would stack up and abuse the AoE 5-man cap to the fullest. We probably doesn’t have enough dedicated support builds for our stack either. So TC loses here.

So yeah BG are better than TC in the field right now. It’s something that we can improve over time in TC and I’m not particularly concerned about it at all.

klineshrike.9034:

Basically for us on FA, if we want a fun an engaging matchup next week we are going to either need to pull much closer to TC or outright surpass them in points to keep them below SOR and put them in Tier 4 with us. SOR vs FA vs DB will be a horrible match, but TC vs FA vs DB will be awesome matchup.

So no offense to the guys at TC, but for the sake of next weeks matchup, we really need to overcome you tonight.

ROFL, now here’s a great excuse that I can understand for FA to attack TC.

OCDouglas.5401:

@HenryAu

but the whole point of taking the towers is because theyre in reach for trebs to siege the next objective. Though SM 3rd floor does seem kind of excessive, if you decrease the range, trebs would drop in efficiency like crazy on all the other BL.

Yeah I understand and I guess that’s why the trebs have that exact amount of range. It just barely hit the keep/garrison wall from the towers. However the treb stuff going on in EB just seems ridiculous to me.

I think some people stack for crit and use the Incendiary Powder trait from explosives for burns.

Edit: Sorry what I mean is people aren’t really trying to do much with that 1 sec of burn from the actual flamethrower.

Here is my thoughts on the glass-cannon Rifleman (imho a close range fighter) in WvWvW, you’ll mainly be useful for taking out stragglers, assaulting camps with small numbers, etc. I mean that stuff is very useful. But if you were thinking of using the build in a zerg vs zerg battle, or doing any kind of hard-fought sieges, you’re going to have a tougher time than the glass-cannon grenadier who is effective at max range. If you want to fight close range in a mass battle, you might want to consider switching over to some of the defensive traits and get more escape utilities.

On the topic of siege weapon, I would like the trebs have a shorter range but pack even more structure damage. They should be in the field where the defenders can try to push out and kill them because they are such a threat. Make it more exciting than the “Ok I built this treb on SM 3rd floor where no enemies can reach it, now you push 2 for the next hour until that tower wall is broken.”

http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA

Interesting… I wonder if Sanctum of Rall can surpass TC and end up in the 9th rank. I would actually like that because TC would be 10th and I need some green vista for map completion in EB. =P

Otherwise TC stays in 9th, it may be an even worst week for TC to be sandwiched between CD and the powered up SoS. On the other hand it might be fun because CD and SoS might be close in strength and TC gets to play kingmaker by being a pest.

TCer here.
Welcome back Odinzu, it’s awesome to see your commander icon leading the fight tonight.
Thanks Nyari Cil, I really don’t know how the heck you can hold on to QL for so kitten long but it’s rather inspiring.

To the good folks of Blackgate, thanks for all the catapults. I don’t like your trebs though.

- Hella Firestarter, Toast Mortar Team member

yertle.5837:

Isn’t there a ram “sweet spot” where you can hit the door but not get hit by a cata’s aoe through the door?

I know that one of our commanders go on and on about not putting our rams too close to the gate due to the catapult inside. So I guess so? Or maybe the ram still takes damage but the controller isn’t knocked back?

Basically it’s all working in a very strange way. If your siege weapons are too close to the gate, you can hit them by hitting the inside of your gate. But stuff close to the gate/wall can’t be hit by mortar/treb from the inside. If your siege (catapults) is far away from the gate, then hitting the inside of the gate does nothing but the mortar/treb can probably hit those siege.

It doesn’t make a lot of sense, but a lot of these siege implementation doesn’t make much sense to me anyways. They seem to work together at the moment though.

RPers join the RP server to RP. They probably will jump into WvWvW once in a while but you can’t always expect them to do WvWvW full-time. When I run around Divinity’s Reach, I see people standing around and happily making RP conversations in some sort of storyline. I go out into a map where a big dynamic event is happening nearby and people are dying, and you see a group of guys sitting around and talking about the sun god or something.

TC is the NA RP server, and RP comes first for many people.

Sotaudi.1265:

I am 100% against this idea. Here is why.

First, it is already hard enough to get the average player to run to a supply camp only a short jog away in strongly held territory to build siege rather than take it from the tower supply needed to upgrade the tower. Honestly, do you really think any fortified position would have a chance of actually having supply if it had to depend on players making supply runs?

More importantly, however, I think you are missing the whole point of Dolyaks being interdictable. As pointed out, a small team, or even one person, can kill a Dolyak, meaning supply can be interdicted even if you are greatly outnumberd. By contrast, a server with a large numerical advantage doesn’t have to bother killing Dolyaks. They can just take and keep a supply camp. No supply camp, no Dolyaks at all, so why bother interdicting one at a time if you have a large presence? This mechanic actually helps balance numerical disadvantages in that a smaller presence can still disrupt supply and can force larger forces to have to protect supply routes, not just face-roll supply camps as soon as they are taken.

Additionally if players can carry supply (assuming you can actually get them to), a large force that has a numerical advantage can easily run groups of players to deliver supply, daring a smaller force to try and stop them. Not so for a smaller force. If you can get players to make supply runs to start with, they will have to face zergs looking for player kills who would only bother interdicting a yak if they happened to be near it.

So, no thanks. All this would do is further the supply problems in the game, especially for servers who are outnumbered, making it that much tougher for those who are already behind to catch back up.

I think you bring up some very valid points. However the only difference between our current situation right now and the proposal is that the “outnumbered servers” can snipe some yaks. I’m not really convinced these yaks sniping will turn the table around for the outnumbered servers. Let’s see this week’s current scores in NA.

http://mos.millenium.org/matchups#NA

Check out the top NA tiers. The losing servers are actually very very good servers. I’m sure if sniping yaks make that much difference some of those scores ought to be different. I really don’t think the suggestion is as game breaking as you imply.

Another thing is I believe people don’t escort yaks because it seems pointless. They die no matter what you do and however desperate you want that upgrade. Unless you want to have a zerg to escort each yak, it’s just not really viable.

I have faith in the player base that they will actually run supply when they are allowed to do so. I know that we already make supply chain to repair and build siege defenses. It also seem potentially more fun to have players chasing each other and fighting to intercept supply.

CharliePrince.2071:

HenryAu.7523:

JohnnyRockets.7593:

What I proposed is just a simple idea (basically that it just seems weird to me that supply routes are totally NPC controlled and automatic). But what I wrote is by no means a complete plan. I’m sure others, like you have, can come up with tons of other great ideas and improvements too!

Yeah the current implementation of the dolyaks have always felt wrong to me. A dedicated squad are pretty much guaranteed to kill off the dolyak if they’re determined. That thing just die too fast. Defending it sucks and nobody want to do it. I am very glad you brought this topic up for discussion.

you don’t see much value in starving an objective in supplies do you..

just curious, how’s the server you on doing..

are you guys crushing or being crushed

honestly speaking.. dolyak ambushes is a very valid strategy.. it’s part of an overlal bigger picture when it’s necessary to starve an objective of supplies

No, I completely agree with you that starving your target in supply is a great strategy. My problem is with the current implementation of it because it is so easy to kill the dolyaks. The other thing is that it really isn’t very exciting to kill or escort the thing…

JohnnyRockets.7593:

What I proposed is just a simple idea (basically that it just seems weird to me that supply routes are totally NPC controlled and automatic). But what I wrote is by no means a complete plan. I’m sure others, like you have, can come up with tons of other great ideas and improvements too!

Yeah the current implementation of the dolyaks have always felt wrong to me. A dedicated squad are pretty much guaranteed to kill off the dolyak if they’re determined. That thing just die too fast. Defending it sucks and nobody want to do it. I am very glad you brought this topic up for discussion.

The whole idea of a siege is to surround/camp the entrances to prevent reinforcements and supply. There are a number of famous war heroes in real life where all they ever did was to smuggle in much needed supply into a besieged keep. I don’t see anything wrong with forcing more PvP along the way with this idea.

The whole “you can get a lot of supply really quick” worry is trivially resolved when you set a good cap on how much crates you can accumulate on each camp and the frequency of spawn.

I actually like this idea. It forces people to pay attention to the supply lines where the current implementation is largely ignored by the majority of players until someone has tried to upgrade something.

I would like to make a few suggestions:

• Supply crates build up at the camp over time (might want a max cap). You can only pick up crates in camp if you control it.
• Accumulated supply crates at camps do not disappear when a camp is taken over.
• You can deliver the crates to any tower/keep/castle you want.
• Successfully delivering a crate is like completing an event and the player gets rewarded accordingly.

What do you think?