Guild Wars 2

displacedTitan.6897:

The other side of this argument is that without the 24/7 chance to come back HoD would have lost within the first weekend.
All it would take is a few hours of two servers ganging up like happened this weekend. SBI and ET essentially kept borders with each other while beating down HoD and put them back what 30k and 10k or so, respectively.
Now that its a complete 3 way and the scores are even in NA primetime there would be NO way to catch back up if not for nightcapping. Population balance is the ONLY way to fix these issues. The same has been true for ALL 24/7 pvp fights in any game. You can never mechanic your way out of this problem.

Well, pre-launch alliances broke WvW by stacking thousands of active pvpers on 4 servers to sit in the queue behind eachother 24/7. Free transfer fair-weather pvpers then proceeded to seal the deal.

Population imbalance and matchmaking as a solution was killed by the hardcore community who just want to win (what u get for winning btw?) and stacked those four servers. Every other server is just a different degree of bottom feeder under the current “mechanic” so yes, I think ANET needs to step in if they are serious about WvW long-term…

I am curious how long the winning servers will enjoy the lack of contentious matches. I have a bad feeling that the winning servers are all filled with alliances who stacked servers intentionally anyway.

I remember when the good pvp guilds would go to underdog servers on purpose in past games. My, how gamers have changed over the years…

Sky.9347:

You guys are all talking about the point system, which I used to do too – but you’re missing the point.

It isn’t about the points, it’s about the objectives themselves. Scaling the point system means the night capper is only 10k ahead instead of 50k ahead – BUT they still have fully upgraded and heavily sieged keeps in YOUR territory, massive stockpiles of supply, and long range siege pointed at your spawn zone.

Doesn’t matter what the point score is, you still have to find a way to get your first tower back.

I think you are right that the snowballing of objective based advantages is a problem. You are wrong though, to downplay the scores. The scores make the game pointless after getting nightcapped once.

I agree with the responses here for the most part. The entire WvW scenario is designed for advantages to snowball. Winning begets winning…

This may be fine if the only intention is to declare a fair winner at the end…but if the desired outcome is a fun match for the entire 1-2 week set then it is currently failing.

Rodarin.6058:

Lotro had/has a PvE dungeon too. Totally meaningless. Once people do it once or twice for the novelty factor it becomes a non issue.

ONLY way to do it and people dont want to hear it is dynamic population caps.

Have a floor to it so that it doesnt go below a certain number. Obviously on lower population servers this still wont help as I am confident some of those servers have less than 10 people on right now. I would say the 2 servers facing Borliss pass might be totally non existent in there as of this time. BUT if the match were close or semi competitive it might be.

There are a lot of issues. They (Anet) have to look at WHEN servers have peak player numbers in there. Posting graphs isnt enough, starting week long matches WHILE still allowing server transfers is not nearly enough., they didnt have enough data anyway.

Considering there are about 10 FULL servers right now in NA in terms of server population and other than maybe HoD, none of the have WvW queues, I think that says a lot. Especially when the only real ‘end game’ for people who are 80 is to PvP and WvW has the most potential to be epic and long lasting.

WvW is basically a failure as it sits right now, as people become more and more aware of how broken and meaningless it is the fewer and fewer people will be logging in to play, and most definitely willing to spend resources in there.

Seems a bit extreme. I will say though that it would certainly accomplish making people transfer off the dominant servers into the lower population ones.

That said, given the ANET has flatly refused to even acknowledge this as a problem I can’t see them doing something this extreme.

SpectacularYak.6518:

Darkness Falls.

Darkness Falls.

The solution is Darkness Falls.

Winning in WvWvW opens a PvE mega dungeon for the winning side. It siphons away X% of the winning side’s players, opening the door for the losing side to rally and start aggressively clawing back what was lost.

Worked beautifully in DAoC.

I never played DAoC so I am not familiar with the concept. Kinda like a jumping puzzle but only for the winning team?

Sounds cool though could backfire since some servers like Kaineng would never get to do the dungeon

Greetings folks,

We all know about some of the major issues hurting WvW right now. Right now timezone (off-peak all-capping) and population imbalance are creating deficits that cannot be overcome. There is a pattern in WvW that we have good fights for a few days and then the gap between the servers gets so large in points that you are left with an exhibition match for the 4-5 days with the lower ranked servers (and often bored winning server as well) just waiting for time to expire.

The way I see it something has to be done about this.

Since ANET does not want to reduce the effectiveness of all-capping or off-peaking in itself we are left with the problem of scoring and how these unassailable gaps ruin WvW participation towards the end of matches. This is not fun for either team.

I propose that ANET scale the matches back down to 3 days. This is just long enough for teams to still bother investing in upgrades (hell, people still were investing with the one day matches)…but not so long as to let the scoring system ruin all the fun.

If you are wondering what is wrong with the scoring system I will quickly summarize to close this out: The system has no mechanism to create excitement in the event of a team leading for an extended period of time. Even a small advantage over a few days scales into a blow out. When this happens participation in the losing servers drops and we all suffer.

Sadly, ANET has all but confirmed that they don’t view nightcapping as a problem.
Funny though, that most of the server transfers are away from worlds with a shallow off-peak population into 24/7 servers.

Matchmaking won’t solve the problem because 24/7 servers don’t occur in groups of 3s but like so many MMO companies they are stubborn in their ways. Hope they don’t go the way of bioware.

Kyomu.8012:

Roland, you seem unreasonably angry at Tarnished Coast over a part of the game that should be fun. Did you transfer from there? Did they kick your dog? Did they say mean things about your sister?

I’m glad I’m not anywhere near leadership on any server because the more you go on the more I do want to talk to TC about an alliance. Seriously, take all the hot air you’re wasting here and go get your precious lead back – TC is supposedly too busy stomping a mudhole in our behinds to bother with you. (I can’t check)

How are things going anyway? A-Net should set up out-of-game displays of the scores and graphs that update every tick so I know what I’m in for tonight!

Actually you misread my post. Notice how I compliment TC on manipulating you Maggies into playing for second place and handing them the game?

Read my posts on this topic. I say several times that TC is smart for doing this..It was Mag that are fools. Also notice how I say I can’t wait til we are matched against Mag on friday without TC to hold their hand?

Learn to read before replying.

I find it hilarious how Mag and TC are now trying to re-write history now that the damage has been done.

Your big guilds teamed up over the weekend to evaporate Ehmry’s lead.
Basically, TC played Mag hard into thinking Ehmry was a bigger threat. Mag played for second place and essentially handed TC the game.

TC is a bigger night capping threat than Ehmry ever was. Good job TC. You played your little sister server Mag into doing your dirty work for you.

I truly hope we get matched vs mag next round without you to hold their hand and protect them in the vital early days of the match.

Hix.8925:

The new theory is that Mag thought that there was an alliance but TC ate Mag. But then Mag continued the alliance while TC continued to eat it. Or something.

Anyone who was on in the early afternoon knows TC and Mag didnt start attacking eachother until their combined efforts ran Ehmry completely off of Eternal Battlegrounds. Of course the alliance fell apart after you wiped us from the map lol..

Just stop. we all know what happened.

Antinoobian.7259:

Wow, If I hadn’t been fighting Mag for the last few hours tooth and nail I would’ve believed the guys at EB. The funny thing to me is that right now it looks from my point of view from the fight in Mag Borderlands like TC and EB are ganging up on Mag… when Mag is in last place.

They’re fighting back pretty well though. Can’t count how many times I defended Greenlake from EB from the west and Mag from the east, although I strongly suspect that Mag and EB have been fighting elsewhere in Mag’s borderlands.

-1. You obviously weren’t here this morning.

Btw, if you are TC i totally understand why you accepted this alliance. Basically a free win. Mag though…Playing for second. Should be ashamed.

Bigpopov,

How can you claim EB is playing the victim. Did we start this thread? No.

Lies, its so obvious. Hell, look at this thread. TC is in the lead and Mag continues to push us every time we attack TC. Hilarious

Jeul.1068:

I agree that it would make perfect sense for TC and Mag to limit the night presence of EB. It wasn’t bad last night, but you can definitely see that they still have more than TC and Mag.

It’s not like we’ll be teaming up against EB for anything large – just for the night hours to stop expansion.

Lies. Yall are allied right now lol. Look at the maps. Havent seen either side attack anything other than Ehmry. At least have the stones to admit it.

Asbrandr.6324:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Asbrandr.6324:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Drium.8509:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Thats pathetic. Ehmry doesnt even have a great night presence.

You may certainly claim so, but those of us playing late last night saw otherwise.

Y’all are sad. Bet you guys were picked last at kickball in elementary school.

Ehmry gets nightcapped in our matchups not the other way around.

the stats back this up. This is just an excuse for you guys to punk out of real pvp.

Structured PvP’s that way. /points to the forum above this one

Says the guy supporting his server allying with their enemy. playing for second place is pathetic no matter how you slice it.

You automatically assume that Maguuma will not be a target if they start to pose more of a threat; you’re misinformed. Additionally, I never claimed to be a real PvPer, you did. Therefore, my status was never in question. For the record, I consider myself a casual PvPer, at best.

Maguuma is playing for second place. Look at the maps. pathetic.

P.S You cheesers now have EB divided between the two of ya. Gonna start fighting now or keep holding hands?

Asbrandr.6324:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Drium.8509:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Thats pathetic. Ehmry doesnt even have a great night presence.

You may certainly claim so, but those of us playing late last night saw otherwise.

Y’all are sad. Bet you guys were picked last at kickball in elementary school.

Ehmry gets nightcapped in our matchups not the other way around.

the stats back this up. This is just an excuse for you guys to punk out of real pvp.

Structured PvP’s that way. /points to the forum above this one

Says the guy supporting his server allying with their enemy. playing for second place is pathetic no matter how you slice it.

Drium.8509:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Thats pathetic. Ehmry doesnt even have a great night presence.

You may certainly claim so, but those of us playing late last night saw otherwise.

Y’all are sad. Bet you guys were picked last at kickball in elementary school.

Ehmry gets nightcapped in our matchups not the other way around.

the stats back this up. This is just an excuse for you guys to punk out of real pvp.

Thats pathetic. Ehmry doesnt even have a great night presence.

Azure Prower.8701:

I play on an unofficial oceanic server. We usually get owned during your “day” and lose every thing. It happens. Still don’t see the problem. Nor see the need to complain about it.

North American time zoners are FAR more distributed across servers than oceanics..

Comparison is deeply flawed. The status quo benefits you. We get it. Nothing else to see here.

Azure Prower.8701:

The whole thing about people upset about other people playing a different time zone than them baffles me.

If you don’t have enough on during the off-peak hours. Then it is a population issue.

I don’t think you get it. People aren’t upset about other people playing in a different time zone.
They are upset that the matches are completely decided by whether you have people playing in the other time zone. As in, if you play in the U.S and you have no Oceanic population or very little (ya with me so far?) and you are matched against a server with a large oceanic population you automatically lose. Coordination? non-factor. Strategy? non-factor. Pvp skill? non-factor.

Starting to understand why people are upset and why tons of people are transferring to the 24/7 servers?
Auto-loss is not fun.

Firefly.4165:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Of course you want to keep the status quo. Right now, U.S primetime is completely meaningless and the entire game is decided by Australians logging in during their primetime.
Most of us U.S players are just asking for U.S primetime and Aussie primetime to be equal in terms of point contribution to the final score since all-capping the map is mysteriously (sarcasm) so much easier during the aussie primetime…

Who is really being selfish here?

Anet Intended this game to be a 24/7 Global event. A global community is required to work together in order to progress. If you don’t have a global community on your server, you will then face others that are in the same position. Build your community. And don’t ignore Asians either. Time to accept the facts.

So if your server is not global.. you will face other not global servers.. and the fun times will return.

This is untrue unless 24/7 servers happen to occur in groups of 3s. Think about it for a sec before spouting the same old party line rhetoric…
Also, happening to have Oceanic guilds on your server is not working together. Its winning due to sheer coincidence and 99% of players in this game did no pre-game strategizing. Are they SUPPOSED to be screwed now?

Well you created a thread with a pretty inflammatory title. If you want to change the tone of the discourse here I would start by changing the title of your thread and taking the time to educate yourself on the heart of what the non-trolls on the U.S side are complaining about. To be honest, most of the talk about “nerfing time zones” came about because ANET deleted a 500 reply thread (started by me) where both sides were compromising and talking about possibilities to fix the scoring so that matches arent essentially over within a day or two of off-peak all-capping…

kylia.4813:

Seriously… The maps are not capped during Aussy primetime… There is a timezone after ours..

We have full servers as well… I can provide video evidence of the large scale fights and wait times we have during our prime time… of course staying up last night waaay past my wife approved bed time showed me the issue your all raving about… But its not us Aussies…

It doesn’t matter who it is. Americans, Aussies, EUs, Asians. Who cares? The scoring system is terrible and the matches are being completely decided by one side being able to all-cap the maps with no resistance. Anyone who is ok with that can’t call anyone else selfish.

Azure Prower.8701:

I’m pretty sure people are confusing “night capping” with population issues.

There is no such thing as “night” in the international/global arena.

Its semantics. Pretending not to understand the basis for the term is actually laughable and discredits your integrity.

kylia.4813:

Roland Falantyr.3290:

Of course you want to keep the status quo. Right now, U.S primetime is completely meaningless and the entire game is decided by Australians logging in during their primetime.
Most of us U.S players are just asking for U.S primetime and Aussie primetime to be equal in terms of point contribution to the final score since all-capping the map is mysteriously (sarcasm) so much easier during the aussie primetime…

Who is really being selfish here?

Facts… Until Anet supply you raw numbers its hearsay.
Aussy prime time here, we have ques to get into EB and Borderlands, have intense fights to take objectives (man repeating myself.. anyone looked at the TZ after Oceanic. The big gap between Oceanic and EU…)

Its called common sense. Funny how the fights are even all day and then MAGICALLY the whole map is capped during Aussie prime time. The whole map DOES NOT get capped during “intense fights”.

This only happens when
A.) A server gives up completely or B.) There is a huge numbers disadvantage.

If what you are saying is true, then why do even fights disintegrate into all-cap scenarios during aussie primetime in these matchups? Riddle me that.

Of course you want to keep the status quo. Right now, U.S primetime is completely meaningless and the entire game is decided by Australians logging in during their primetime.
Most of us U.S players are just asking for U.S primetime and Aussie primetime to be equal in terms of point contribution to the final score since all-capping the map is mysteriously (sarcasm) so much easier during the aussie primetime…

Who is really being selfish here?

Zohar.4576:

I really feel that we are ready for one week matches and these sadly are just the growing pains we need to endure for the first week (though if I’m wrong after this week I’ll probably be complaining :P).

The way I feel is that one day for most servers is NOT a good indicator at how best to match your server. For example, my server Anvil Rock dominated I think it was Tuesday – Thursday but now is getting destroyed on the weekend. As a result we got bumped up in the rankings (due to the one day thing) and now are getting floored by Yak’s bend. I think they need this week to see how each server performs for the duration of an entire week and then we’ll see some better matchups.

The problem is that since this is the first week…well it’s going to be horrible for some of us.

I still have a great time on WvW with Anvil rock, though we are losing atm by a huge margin, we can work as a team and do succeed in securing objectives and making progress. It’s not lasting due to the huge disparity in our opponent (Yak’s bend) but the other server (Darkhaven) is only beating us by about 5,000 so our other opponent is pretty dead on.

Again, this first week is gonna be painful I think, but after the matchups should be better.

Think of the one server a day thing as a broad range match maker, this a more fine adjustment before we settle in to two weeks once we’ve had maybe a month or so of these one week matches. Just my two cents (and if I’m wrong after this week I’m wrong)

I am not so optimistic. The problem is not the matchmaking. It is the scoring system which rewards off-peak capping and encourages a snowball effect and impossible margins after short periods of play.

Hey guys,

I think its pretty clear the current system has an extreme tendency towards utter domination. For my server we either win in a landslide or lose in a landslide based on who we are matched up with at the time. Losing pushes us down to a landslide bracket…then winning pushes us back up into a bracket where we get utterly destroyed by servers with bigger off-peak populations.

At this point I am hoping ANET abandons their plans for 2 week matchups since they don’t seem to want to balance scoring for lower pop servers.

Yes, in the current form WvW rankings have nothing to do with skill.

Determining victory comes from:

1.) Oceanic Population

2.) Keeping a full cap of numbers at all times

3.) Oceanic Population

Ben K.6238:

They are more co-ordinated. Everyone has the same population cap.

off-peak some servers dont hit the cap. others do.

Svarty.8019:

Got my Guardian to level 32.

A horrible, complicated class without the survivability or healing it claims to have.

I am sorry you are not enjoying your Guardian. What is your spec?

MikeFerguson.8921:

Unsure how long we’ll run them right now. Thats why I only said a couple weeks

The 24 hour matches were good for getting servers into initial ranking brackets, but it does significantly change how people approach the game and we’re hoping the 1 week matches will make people feel a little better about investing significant resources into their holdings.

No guild on a server without an oceanic population should invest anything into their keeps and upgrades. It will all be capped at 4 am. We go to bed with a lead and wake up to being down by 10s of thousands of points every night. Its an Aussie/Big alliance world. The rest of us are just tourists.

If they push us out to 2 week matches before fixing the scoring issues associated with timezone variances WvW is pretty much over as a competitive enterprise…

Bobby.2918:

Hit Banish, watch the mob sail through the air, wait for them to stop, then hit Judge’s Intervention. Beautiful combo. Don’t hit it too early after Banish though, you might teleport to where they are at that moment then still have to chase them as the keep sailing.

nice combo. You can do something similar with sword and shield if you knock them back with shield of absorp and then use blinding flash to teleport to them and blind them for what will inevitably be a panicked attack.

Draeka.5941:

Hammer, meet enemy. Enemy, meet cliff. Say hello to the bottom for me.

Yea…the #4 hammer attack is sooo beast when you have to 1v1 someone.

Sword and scepter are actually both very powerful weapons. Sword has nice damage for a one hander and the number 3 attack has high burst potential.

I do agree that all weapons should have combo field or combo finisher ability. This is more of a quality of life thing than a balance thing though.

Romanus.8023:

My guild knows the difference between me being there and not. I like to bounce between the front lines and the back line. I love sitting on a wall and just buffing and healing and protecting the guys raining death down.

Also, Retreat and Symbol of Swiftness gets groups where they need to get fast.

Hey Roma,

Have you had the pleasure of using Tome of Wrath to break an enemy siege line yet? Fun stuff!

This is an appreciation thread since I am not sure if players fully understand just how much the Guardian impacts battles in WvW.
Sure, we arent the best at castle sieges or defending keeps with our limited array of ranged weapons but what we do bring to the table is the ability to turn the tide of battles even when our team is viciously outnumbered.
There are a lot of ways to do this but i prefer to use shouts in combination with our tomes and virtues.
It is so satisfying to charge at the front lines knowing that YOUR buffs fundamentally changed the outcome.

My only complaint about the Guardian is that other players cant really tell in the heat of battle just how much you have increased their effectiveness and protected them from harm.

How do you 100% cap Eternal Battlegrounds?

Simple: Play on a server with a heavy Oceanic population.

Thought I would throw in that if you apply using the site you will still need to look one of us up in game for an invite Came up recently.

I read that there were plans to allow guilds to purchase sPVP servers. I see no option to do this in the Black Lion tab. Any ideas?

Home World: Ehmry Bay
Guild Name: Triumviratus
Guild Website: www.thetriumvirate.enjin.com
In-Game Contact: Roland Falantyr.3290
Focus: WvW/PVE
Quick Notes: Active guild with a great core of people. Join today!

Hail Ehmry Bayites!

As leader of Triumviratus I would like to extend an opportunity for you to join an active guild with a focus on organized WvW and clearing dungeon content.

WE:
-Do not have a level limit and we have room for both hardcore players and casuals.

-Run guild grouped WvW every night

-Have at least 2 organized weekly events (typically 1 WvW event where we grab a keep and defend it all night, and a PVE event where we clear dungeons and group content.)

-Have a dedicated officer team available to aid you and provide guidance where needed.

-Have a ton of influence upgrades including: guild bank, a stockpile of WvW bonuses, around the clock +5% PVE experience upgrade, guild armorer, and more!

If you are interested please pop over to url: thetriumvirate.enjin.com and apply!

Also, you can look me up in game anytime and say hi!

I posted a ticket in game a week ago and never received any confirmation of receipt.

My issue is I cannot receive any in game mail from players and my Black Lion Merchant purchases never show up in my email either.
Never received a ticket number as my issue was reported in game.