2) Downed state sucks in PVP
I wholeheartedly embrace the motivation behind the introduction of downed state and universal rezzing but the current implementation is bad in the PVP context. In a nutshell it makes stomping/reviving more important than the actual combat.
In WVW, downed is especially bad — it encourages zerging and discourages small-man teams. There is also the issue of downed intel gathering, where oft times the best thing you can do for your team is stay dead, rather than getting back into the action.
I don’t know what your data/surveys show, but anecdotally, I don’t know anyone who likes downed in PVP. IMO, get rid of it, at least for PVP.
As someone who plays a lot of TPvP, I love the down state and everything it brings. I would like to see some changes and more of a normalization of abilities for downed players but it is a great aspect of the game.
Sorry Ragnar, it really isn’t that different. Yes they are different industries but once things become standard features, consumers expect those features to be a complete product.
But keep defending ArenaNet and calling people children, your arguments are very compelling and persuasive.
Player ranking systems and tournaments are already in the works for the launch of private servers. Dragon Arena http://arena.dragonseason.com/index.php/tournaments/teams was setup before the game launched I believe, because a lot of people thought the game would launch with private servers.
I am actually much happier to have private servers first over a ladder system by arena net. With private servers teams will have a much easier time practicing with other teams, evaluating their own team members etc and I think that private ladders will sort things out decently until arena net gets one working.
I am just hoping that private servers are something that is closer to being weeks away rather than months away.
World of Warcraft’s Honor system wasn’t even patched in until 8 months after launch. Battleground’s weren’t launched until a month after that. Wanting new maps or modes barely a month after launch is ridiculous.
Gamer’s these days. What the kitten? Have some patience. That game the majority of you are basing your expectations off of didn’t even have a PvP system in place at this stage in it’s life.
You seem to lack the knowledge of how products evolve in the real world marketplace. If someone was to start a new car company and they tried to sell a car without the standard amenities like power windows, a radio etc, and they were aiming their product at the luxury car consumers, would you be making excuses for their lack of features as well because they were new?
It’s the same logic you are using to defend ArenaNet.
People aren’t using all the exact same setups OP. But please keep crying about how you can’t kill bunkers. L2P, you have already spent enough time learning to cry.
The stock market doesn’t look happy with the blog post. NCSoft lost 5% of their value since the blog post came out.
@Tyrion.5243
You get them for getting first place.
No time frame to expect any of these features.
It took 23 days to get this blog post. He says there will be another blog post detailing custom arenas, meaning another 23+ days before more info is released, and if in the same fashion of this one, with no time frame.
It has seriously taken so long that I feel like it’s finished and they have been trolling the community for the last week. I feel like that would be more excusable than over a week being spent on localization.
http://postimage.org/image/s5731ti0f/
Put the wrong image, although the first one shows the trend since release, the 2nd one shows from the time of the blog post being announced.
While waiting for the blog post, which us children have been told takes time because in the real world things don’t happen quickly….
http://postimage.org/image/71uyad0vf/
Losing 10% of your market cap in under a month is a sign that investors have faith in the decisions being made by the companies officers right?
I know that ArenaNet is only a subsidiary of NCSoft and while I haven’t done “due diligence” to determine how big of a factor ArenaNet is in NCSoft’s share price, I am going to make the assumption that NCSoft hasn’t had any other product releases of projects with 5+ years of development time in the past month, and the recent price action is reflective of the results of GW2.
Now I will not be naive to the extent that the blog post being out would have held back the drastic loss of market cap, but neglected customers don’t often result in future revenues.
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I disagree with a lot of the posters here saying that balanced builds aren’t viable. The problem with any discussion of this though is that what is considered a “balanced build” is a semantics game. Some classes may balance out their aggressive amulet/trait choices by using defensive utility skills or weapons with defensive capabilities.
I agree somewhat. I think there needs to be more catering to middle-ground builds. The fact for example Vitality, scales differently by class it really skews the system. If a thief for example wants to build for a balanced build, they are still only gonna truck around 15k maybe 16k hp. Where an 80% offensive (glass) Warrior build can have 20-21k if not a few thousand more……
seems kind of silly
Vitality doesn’t scale differently by class. 100 vitality = 1000 hps for any class.
The rule of thumb when fighting very tanky teams is to never let them get control of a point since it is so hard to get them off of it.
If this team is getting kills against your team then you and your team is doing something very wrong. Maintaining poison on whoever is the focus target is also necessary.
Should the toolbelt skill from the rifle turret have higher dmg and CD?
in Engineer
Posted by: Seether.7285
You should really try to get a thorough understanding of the class before asking for changes. As Aristio mentioned, there is the static discharge trait which adds an extra damage attack to your tool belt abilities, something which makes the short cool down of surprise shot a positive. Also, all your keyboard commands can be altered, if you have issues reaching your f1 key then maybe you should move it to a key which is more readily available.
This ability is great the way it is and is one of the more valuable tool belt abilities.
@TsukasaHiiragi.9730
If you are speaking about PvP then I completely disagree with everything you say.
It’s funny reading all the posts from bad eles saying that staff ele is the only viable build lol.
So the first 2.5 weeks can be explained with the whole collaborative process of writing I suppose, even though it was supposedly a few days away when it was originally mentioned, but I believe its been a week or more since while streaming you said it was finished and being translated.
In another post you stated that the reason the translation has taken so long was because the localization team was busy with other things as well. This last piece of information is what I find the most disconcerting. It seems that everything in PvP has taken a back seat to PvE in this game. I believe it was you, who in beta told the players that up until 1month before release, only 1 person had been working on PvP balance. If you glance over the patch notes since release, the vast majority of fixes are specifically for PvE things. There are just so many clear examples that PvP is taking a backseat to everything else in this game.
Pretty much everyone hates 8v8, there is no dueling, and teams can’t face teams on their own competitive level reliably even with the upcoming paid tournaments. Also, there is currently nothing worthwhile for SPvP players to buy with real money. You can please all of these groups and print money by putting out rent-able private servers. The fact that this game launched without rent-able private servers is a head-scratcher as a player and pretty mind blowing from a business perspective.
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We will have some idea when the blog post is released “soon”. I imagine that some day in the future there will be some great device or computer program which will be able to translate from one language to another in a reasonable time period. Maybe even google could look into making a program like this.
It has taken so long to have this blog post translated that I am surprised there hasn’t been an influx of “how many arenanet employees does it take to translate a blogpost” jokes.
Engineer kits in general are not that amazing but 3 of them are completely unusable.
in Engineer
Posted by: Seether.7285
Bomb and tool kit, are the 2 that are least useful out of all the kits.
You might be talking about PvE, but in PvP both of these kits are very valuable.
I can deal with them being unkillable, but I really think they should be CCable.
A second thread was clearly needed.
Ok, so first of all, you can craft builds where the rifle does very high damage, although you will be very glassy.
There is a reason you don’t see any classes with long range high damage abilities, that is because the game has been designed overall with the idea that the shorter the range of your attack the more damage it does overall. Thus, in this game you will never be able to expect for the very long range attacks to be doing the type of damage output of a melee weapon.
Risk vs Reward is built into the damage of weapons.
AE cond damage with bombs/grenades and p/p and Crit/Power rifle build are viable if you want to go dps. The cond build is probably stronger overall, the rifle builds tend to be pretty squishy but its fun blowing people up as fast and seeing big numbers.
Bunker builds are obviously an option too. However, while people might think the most common role for an engi on a TPvP team is bunkering I do not feel that is as viable in high level team comps as the AE cond build.
Ok, then another question: if I get beat down, then, while down, I spam skill #1 and I kill someone should I get rally or not?
Because I was defeated in a match, a second after I’ve got beaten down I killed an enemy (beat him down, not completely killed) but I did not get rally. Is this normal behaviour of rally?
Another example: I spammed condition on an enemy (n.1), I get beat by another enemy (n.2), the #1 is outside the range of my down skill n.1 but he die due to condition damage. Do I get rally this way? (It’s pretty much the same case but in the previous I beat him down with downed skill, in the second with DoT before I get beaten).
In both cases I did not get rally, I also take screenshots in these cases but those say not much about these situations.
You only get rallied when someone is completely killed, not by simply being brought into the downstate.
They should definitely implement some influence sinks for SPvP. A finisher with your guild’s emblem on the banner would be a cool addition. I feel like there is a decent amount of potential for fun things that could be implemented as influence sinks which would not have an effect on the game.
Blog post is still coming, just has been pushed out about a week, it is written and sitting in locs hands!
The turnaround time on the blog post seems pretty silly but I’m glad you were able to give us an update and let us know that you there were people at least working on things for tournies.
This thread is based on some thoughts I was having regarding Paid Tournaments and based on the info Jon Peters released while talking to players in the mists.
A player asks about separation of premade/pugs and potential rating system. Based on Jon’s response, the only thing that seems close to happening to alleviate these issues is paid tournaments. This, according to Jon’s theory will separate premades groups from pug groups.
While the final structure is not available for analysis, I remember their costs originally listed as five tournament tickets per team member. The problem with this being their “competitive” format should be obvious to anyone with knowledge of what fosters competitive environments; barriers to entry such as the tournament tickets forces teams to either farm pugs in the free tournaments or purchase tournament tickets. This barrier to entry has nothing to do with the skill of the players on their team but rather how interested they are in farming pugs or buying tournament tickets.
Since Paid Tournaments sound like they will not be releasing with a rating system, playing in the tournaments will be about gear for many teams. While there are many teams who are just looking for the chance at competitive play after going against so many pugs, there will be lower tier teams who will not want to “waste” their tournament tickets if they see big name teams appearing in the tournaments with them.
Does anyone else agree that this seems to be a really poorly thought out solution to the issues facing the current tournament system and the requests of the PvP community?
I know personally that I would not give one kitten about the paid tournament system if there were either player controlled private servers or an ELO matchmaking system. It seems like ArenaNet doesn’t have the manpower to implement ratings anytime soon or even translate a kittening blog post, if ArenaNet opened up server rentals then players could create their own ladders and competitive play and expand the competitive community.
It seems that if we are to rely on ArenaNet’s timeline this game won’t have the infrastructure for a competitive scene for several months and by that time the interest of the competitive groups will have likely waned dramatically.
Dashel, the counter to bunkers in general is overwhelming them with conditions to counter their removal, maintaining 100% poison uptime. Killing a bunker in a time effective manner will normally involve 2 people, but bunker guardians are pretty susceptible to bomb/pistol condi engis and can be taken out by 1 engi if the engi is able to land their burst.
I really don’t get how Jon is saying that the counter to bunker builds is burst since I am pretty sure everyone makes bunkers to counter burst specs….
It was nice to know that NO ONE is going to get any PvP info until the localization team finishes their “work on other aspects” AKA the team works on more quest dialog fixes while the PvP community waits in the corner, because that’s where the red-headed stepchild is supposed to stand until they are called in for the dinner scraps.
OP, you are entirely incorrect with your statement that PvPers are unwilling to put more money into the game. The community is begging for private servers, which would be administered by ArenaNet and would be a source of income from PvP players.
I’m pretty positive there is actually a 2s internal cd that they added. Although in beta there was no icd.
I play primarily in TPvP and the shield is very strong in this aspect of the game and a large portion of point defense guardians use the shield.
@zeta, in stun your non stun break abilities are on cd, this does not happen with immobilize.
Hey guys, lets try not to put any deadlines on ArenaNet, their policy of when it’s ready[sup]tm[/sup] is clearly the gold standard of game development and customer relations.
It is with this policy of not releasing things until it’s ready that we have such a complete competitive PvP system that has worked flawlessly since release. We also know we will soon be treated with a PvP blog post informing us of upcoming amazing features and there is a rumor that the reason the post has taken so long is because they are weaving it into what will be the next great American novel. If you are not a resident of America, do not worry, this novel is being localized for the various regional gw2 players, it just needs a few more days for translation work.
@R E F L H E X.8413
Transmogrify was not 30 seconds in PvP, all cc was capped at 8s and cc in that game had diminishing returns. Bringing it up and comparing it with Moa is pretty unreasonable. There were also a lot of complaints about it too.
There are a lot of new players in tournaments and even in the final round you can see teams that you wonder how they managed to beat two teams. I can see playing and winning with comps like this can be fun for the people playing them but I don’t think its worthy of posting a screenshot to show off because it isn’t really that funny or that big of an accomplishment.
…that sometimes when you fight players in 1v1 and u down them few seconds before they down you, they manage to kill you later because of their superior downed abilities.
Even these 3 simple abilities (excluding heal) while downed are not balanced, come on Anet. >.<
The downed state is part of any encounter, plan accordingly. Ele’s have what is commonly referred to as the worst downstate because they are an easy stomp. Now, while a down state vs down state is uncommon, the ele who is seen as sucking in a downstate can defeat pretty much any other profession in a downstate.
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Putting all your points into fire and air and equipping berzerkers, this is clearly an amazing new spec that no one has tried before.
No actual gameplay footage to show how bad it really is against non ai opponents that attack back =p
I think this is a good example of the importance of having a team comp with balanced damage sources. While you can’t really tell from just the score panel, based on the classes in the group and the “normal” specs people play on those classes, the other team appears to have little to no ae damage, which turns minion masters into jokes.
The five minutes is valuable time to configure a build based on your opponents and the map. I am all for the five minutes, but I come from GW1 where every tournament had a pretty decent amount of wait time between matches, and in those there wasn’t a ready up option. Once you begin to figure out hey, I can adjust my build or situation based on who I am against, you will start to value that time.
The fact is, this time is rarely used for these purposes. I would be fine with 5min pre match times if we were using a match making system, the fact that it is a tournament system means that 5min waits happening in other peoples matches affect you as well.
I feel that it would be nice if we could have our hotkeys saved for 1 specific character and have different layouts for different professions. The difference in how class profession skills operate makes the ideal button mapping different for each class but we are currently forced to use one for all our characters. This isn’t a huge issue by any means but would be a big quality of life improvement.
Well, there are tons of glory farmers here, there is no reason to add the emote since, as said before, it is no more related to a player’s skill.
In HA in GW, it was impossible to farm fame, so the emote made sense.If they make a GW2 version of HA or TA, I would be really happy to see emotes again.
Who said PvP emotes have to be relegated to just 1 section of people? Why not have glory emotes + special emotes that require actual accomplishments outside of grinding.
There have been a few posts on this in beta and release and no word at all from Trion. The amount of waiting in TPvP is ridiculous, especially when most of the waiting is to fight a disorganized pug in a blowout match.
Guardians need two things to be killed effectively, near constant poison application and applying damage.
Guardians tend to have higher armor but lower hps than other bunker builds. This makes them susceptible to condition damage. As others have stated though, nearly every guardian will have condition removal. That is why it is important to stack a wide variety of conditions forcing the guardian to burn all their removal.
Yes they are a pain in thekitten to kill and they often take a while to bring down but they are not OP and can be countered.
The counter to high toughness is in general condition damage. They are countering your power burst build with the thing designed to counter burst and you are complaining?
While 21k hps is a decent amount of hps, Necros share the lowest base armor, so if you don’t get some toughness via your spec or amulet you are going to be in trouble.
I’m gonna be posting about this soon. I’m working on a blog post right now to outline the features that are coming, the big picture, what we’re working on now, etc.
If you don’t hear from us for a while, it’s not because you’re being neglected or forgotten, it’s actually the opposite – we’re in meetings with our teams to get you guys the stuff you need.
Stay tuned, I’ll post more info as soon as I can.
-Chaplan
Remember when people saw this post and got excited about upcoming changes, or at least the idea of knowing what changes were on the way?
Damage done and healing would be good stats, I personally think the more statistics available the better. I think this should probably restricted to TPvP though to preserve the casual level of hot join and so that new players are not alienated as many ArenaNet decisions seem to have been based around that reasoning.
+1
This was something I asked for in beta, at minimum it should show the number of downs/revives/stomps/times stomped for your team members in a tourney.