Guild Wars 2

Battlegroups, alliances, whatever… are just another name for server merge.

Most disagreements seems to essentially be over what WvW is supposed to be. To me, WvW, as the name suggests, is worlds fighting against other worlds, like war between countries. Like real war between countries, not all countries (worlds) are equal or the same. They may have different populations, cultures, ideologies, etc.

When I used to play Cabal Online, that was split into two factions, and there was a game mode where factions could battle one another to claim/defend objects on a map. This game mode only happened a few times a day and lasts an hour each round. Prior to each round, would-be participants would gather in a waiting room. When the battle started, only equal numbers on each side would be allowed to proceed. So if one faction had 50 people waiting in queue, and the other had 5, only 5 from each team was allowed into battle. The game selects the highest level players in as a priority. If someone logged out during the battle, too bad, no one else can jump in, you have to wait for the next round.

Now, I think it wold be interesting if GW2 had something similar, but thinking about it, that’s more of a sPvP thing, not a WvW thing. A lot of the suggestions I see being thrown around give me the same impression: it’s not WvW, you might as well scrap WvW and tell everyone to go play sPvP.

Otokomae.9356:

So, you’re saying that THERE IS NO PROBLEM WITH POPULATION IMBALANCE in your Tier? Awesome, that’s 1 less server for Anet to worry about! Leave EBay alone Anet, they’re doing just fine (^_^).

Population imbalance? Yes. Problem? No

The population will always be imbalanced, that’s the reality. It’s not like the human population, or rather the population of people who play GW2 is evenly spread across time zones.

Any sort of grouping/merging/de-merging will eventually result in mercenaries and fairweathers who primarily care about winning hopping to where the grass is greener. So I ask again, what problem does server merging (or merging by any other name) solve?

And I would be thrilled if EBay was left alone I don’t mean for it to remain static, people come and go and it’s always been fun. I started WvW when EBay was at it’s peak in the middle tiers, when reset night meant that most maps were queued. That was fun in its own way. Now, running solo or in small group is also enjoyable in its own way. The way our core community adapts to changing conditions forms part of our server identity.

I don’t consider population imbalance to be the problem. I think the real issue is how to adjust gameplay so that winning isn’t primarily determined by who has the highest population.

Can’t be bothered individually quoting all the people who made incorrect assumptions about what things are like in the lower tiers..

First of all, not all lower tier servers are poorly organised, or lack TeamSpeak, etc… I may not be able to speak for all servers as I have been on Ehmry Bay from day one, Ehmry Bay has TeamSpeak, and people do get organised. Yes, we are small, we have less people, and I’m ok with that. Historically, Ehmry Bay has never done much recruiting, not because we’re “unorganised” but because many of us feel that if people want to join us, great. If not, then whatever, server-hoppers should join a server that suits them. Small and organised, just the way I like it

Ghost town? As an oceanic, yes it tends to be quiet during the times I play, but there are always a dedicated group of players online at any given time, and when we band together, we can flip and defend objectives and still have fun. Or we spread out and solo roam, whatever tickles our fancy. I would much rather play with a small group of like-minded people than a horde that doesn’t give a toss about server pride.

So many ignorant posters proudly proclaim that merging servers is THE solution! But to what problem? I’m sure many low tier players like myself are happy with the way things are on the server of our choice. Why can’t we be left alone? Why should upper tier players trample over our wishes in a vain attempt to temporarily solve their coverage problems?

Firstly, be wary of the vocal minority. In my town, we have a line of big gorgeous fig trees. I love how beautiful they are an how they attract birds to the area. But the other day, I found out that 26 residents complained about the trees and petitioned to have them cut down. The council initially agreed, but once the wider community found out, they started their own petition, which I signed. Over 200 local residents signed that petition, and the trees were saved, hooray! Why should only ~10% of the population dictate what happens to the town?

Back on topic: merging servers. This has been discussed to death before.

One viewpoint that especially strikes a chord with me is that players from higher tier seem to only want a server merge for their own personal gain, and view lower tier servers as a resource to be picked and plundered.

The way things are now, if you don’t enjoy how things are on a server, you can transfer elsewhere. My brother started on Sea of Sorrows, then moved to Blackgate, then to Jade Quarry, then to Blackgate again, if he wants to hop from place to place, go for it! I’ve been on the same server (Ehmry Bay) since day one and have experienced various fluctuations in tiers, and I have a great time, whether it’s the chaos of being heavily outnumbered, or effortlessly steam rolling through maps devoid of enemies.

Ah, but there are costs involved in transferring. I suppose Anet has good reasons for this, such as avoiding having too many people flocking on to a server, or maybe it’s a good money-maker for them.

If it were up to me, server transfers would be free, so all those whiners who hate the way the server players can go somewhere else, and leave the rest of us in peace. In regards to server merging, I don’t see what problem is solves that can’t already be solved via transfers. All I see server mergers doing is kittening off a whole lot of people who are being forced into an environment they don’t want to be in.

Alas, I don’t see transfers ever being free, and I would offer to pay people to transfer but I would be broke in no time.

Do people only get worked up over “2v1” when they are the 1?

You will always have two servers against one. That is the very nature of WvW where there are three servers fighting each other.

Red and blue can attack green. 2v1
Blue and green can attack red. 2v1
Green and red can attack blue. 2v1

WvW is one big “2v1” fight.

If it is in a server’s best interest to focus on a particular server, then so be it, they are just playing strategically. This seems to be a difficult concept to grasp for some people.

And the way the rules are worded can be open to interpretation, and should probably be reworded to clarify its intentions.

Does doing your best to become first equal “match manipulation”? Should a server go “Oh, we have more players in WvW than the other two players combined, we’re a shoo-in for first if we log in and fight, better not do that as that would be fixing the match to make us first.”

Torsailr.8456:

I’m not suggesting we take an item, just get a copy of it.

I think a similar suggestion has been brought up before, and one possible problem…

“S> rare items, kill me over and over in WvW, 100 gold per kill”

Virtute.8251:

Again, already addressed. Most players (note players as in a game) will use “stacked” here in terms of unfairness, even when utilizing the word objectively to indicate “numbers”. At minimum they mean both meanings.

Incorrect, just because “stacked” has a negative connotation doesn’t suddenly mean players = pack of cards. Again, this argument is as silly as the numerous forum threads on how to define a zerg/blob.

Virtute.8251:

The Oxford ordering has no influence upon contextual interpretation.

“I’m going to tell everyone that according to the (Oxford) dictionary, everyone is a pack of cards, but if someone else refers to the same dictionary and points out an alternate meaning, they are wrong because I say so”.

But in the interests of not confusing OP, I suggest everyone replace the term “stacked server” with “relatively highly populated server” so that OP can’t dismiss everyone’s arguments based on incorrect semantics.

Virtute.8251:

My condolences. I hope things work out for you somehow that you’ll accept without too much upset or anguish, yet I don’t believe that your emotional attachment to the name “Ehmry Bay” is sufficient justification for its continued existence.

I don’t believe that your lack of emotional attachment to any server is sufficient justification for its non-existence.

If you think that “attachment to a name” is all that holds server pride together, then you obviously have no idea how people who willingly stay on a particular server feels.

Since you don’t have access to ArenaNet’s finance data, then I doubt you can claim that the costs of running the server is justification for closing them down. So why is the current situation so bad that ArenaNet needs to kitten off their paying customers by shutting down some servers?

My brother has no attachment to any server, or even guild, he plays for himself. He initially started on Sea of Sorrows, was paid to transfer to Blackgate, then paid again to move to Jade Quarry, then voluntarily moved back to Sea of Sorrows when his guild became inactive. If that’s how you like to play, good for you, keep it up, whatever floats your boat. The existence of additional servers doesn’t stop you from doing that.

First of all, I find it most amusing how OP is trying to argue the definition of “stacked” by pulling the number TWO meaning from the Oxford dictionary, not to mention that it refers specifically to a pack of cards (are people a pack of cards?). With the number ONE definition being:

“(Of a number of things) put or arranged in a stack or stacks:”

Now I’m pretty sure people/players/characters/toons are considered “things”, not a pack of cards. Sure, we are not literally arranged on top of each other in-game, but I’m sure that we are arranged as a stack in the databases.

Nevertheless, in this forum, a “stacked server” is the general terminology for a server that people flock to. OP trying to tell people that there’s no such thing as a “stacked server” is as hilarious as someone trying to tell someone their character is not a tank because it’s not a large metal vehicle, or there’s no such thing as a karma train because choo-choo trains aren’t made of karma.

On topic: OP is essentially suggesting that several servers be shut down, with ranking being the determining factor as to which server gets shut. People from the servers that get shut will be forcibly placed on another server.

This is essentially transferring everyone from other servers to another server so that you have lots of people on certain servers.

This already happens when people voluntarily transfer to another server. The only difference between what already happens now and what OP is suggesting is that we currently have the choice of not moving to a “stacked” server. OP seems to want that choice taken away.

The day they close Ehmry Bay is the day I quit GW2.

As has already been said, you can’t control an entire server, so alliances don’t work. I certainly wasn’t informed of any alliances (EBay player). The only time I saw an attempt at an alliance, or rather a truce, was when a commander in map chat announced that they made an agreement with the red server where if they didn’t attack our towers, we won’t attack theirs. That “truce” lasted less than a minute.

Even a game feature where you can’t attack an allied server would do nothing to resolve the population imbalance as you are effectively merging two servers (what if two more highly populated servers were allied against one smaller server?), which ruins the concept of WvWvW.

I don’t normally attack other players because my main is a ranger equipped with random stuff that I get from loot, so I usually avoid enemy players like the plague.

But there was one time in Eternal Battleground when I was trying to flip the ogre camp by myself, and I stumbled across another player whom fired the first shot. Now in combat mode, I was unable to run away, so I figured that I might as well fight, even though I was fully expecting to lose.

After downing my pets, the enemy player then turned his attention to my character. We ended up downing each other simultaneously, so it became a battle of the downed. A battle which I won by a very small margin

I read this thread earlier today and was wondering what everyone was talking about because I had already done the instance twice yesterday and all I had to do was leisurely walk up to Scarlet and press F.

I just did the instance again 5 mins ago on my staff elementalist… wow that was annoying. I kept getting pushed back over and over and over again, to the point where I considered giving up. But I finally managed it by getting as close to Scarlet as I could, evading the shield with a well-timed dodge, then hit F to finish Scarlet off. No special skills required

I got my guardian from 55-80 in 3 days, combination of joining as many events as possible in Lion’s arch, and buying/using Tomes of Knowledge. And this was without any boosters at all.

I’m now working on my elementalist which was level 35, started this morning, did three or four runs of Lion’s Arch today, didn’t use any boosters, except for one run when I used some low level food, ankitten ow level 40. I also bought more Tomes of Knowledge, but I’ll save them for when my elementalist is closer to level 80.

Setting traits to increase damage and using AoE attacks helps a lot with tagging mobs.

Roe.3679:

The biggest issue with this idea is that some people play on lower tier servers because they want to. Merging them with a larger server just takes that away.

It’s an interesting idea that I like but it also takes that decision away from players. If people like bigger WvW populations they can always transfer.

This.

When I first started playing GW2, Sea Of Sorrows was touted as the place to be for oceanic players such as myself, but I wanted to choose Jade Quarry as my home server because my IRL name means “jade”.

However, my partner created his character first and joined Ehmry Bay, so I followed suit and made Ehmry Bay my home server. I initially intended to eventually transfer to Jade Quarry, but I joined a nice friendly guild on Ehmry Bay with fellow oceanic players and NA night owls, and given how stacked and lag-inducing Jade Quarry turned out to be, I no longer have any desire to transfer there (although I have been guesting there recently for the Escape from Lion’s Arch event, Ehmry Bay is not very populated during the times I play, but during peak times, 1200 rescues is easy).

TL; DR I’m on a not-as-populated server by choice.

I thought being able to whisper enemy WvW’ers was normal? I remember when pets used to have a longer range, so I used to stand around on my ranger and sent my pet off to attack random stuff. In most cases this would be random mobs on the map. But one time I saw an enemy player lurking around our keep, so I sent my pet after him while I stood near the gate of the keep.

Normally enemy players run off out of range and my pet just comes back. But for whatever reason, this guy continued to run around near our keep, and was eventually downed and killed by my pet.

He then sent me a whisper accusing me of picking on down-levels. Now, he was close enough for me to send my pet after him, but not close enough that I could see his name or level, so I politely replied back saying so. We ended up having a nice chat about various WvW and GW2 related topics, despite the fact that he was running with the enemy zerg attacking our keep, and I was trying to defend

I solo roam, mainly because I have gotten sick of being lead on suicide missions by overambitious commanders.

Now, I don’t buy any fancy equipment, I just use what I pick up from loot, so most of my gear is yellow, with a few orange exotics that I picked up. I run around with my ranger and choose skills/traits/equipment based on what I find fun. So when it comes to 1v1, I’m no doubt going to lose, thus I avoid fights and run away when I spot enemy players. So what do I do if I’m not fighting players? I run around and start upgrades on everything (camps/towers/keeps), I flip un-defended camps, scout, escort dolyaks, kill enemy NPCs, flip dredge/hylek/ogres, build siege, repair walls/gates, gather/mine/chop stuff in EBG. If the zerg happens to be in the same area that I am current at, then I might join in, depending on what they are doing.

I’m from Ehmry Bay, and as someone who works full time, I don’t play as much as I would like to, so I am mainly limited to playing on weekend evenings, but throughout the week I satisfy my GW2 cravings by reading both the official forums and Ehmry Bay’s forums (mainly the WvW subforums).

There certainly is a sort of rivalry between Ehmry Bay and Borlis Pass, which I believe was born out of the constant match ups we had, where BP were our strongest rival (and Anvil Rock seemed like a background character or bystander). Everyone wants to see their server win, and that naturally results in rivalry. So when you are frequently matched up against certain servers, one can’t help but feel an even stronger desire to defeat that server.

And similar to what someone from BP posted in our current matchup thread, I believe noone has the right to speak on behalf of a server. I used to be proud of the fact that Ehmry Bay rarely trash-talked on the official forums, so it’s sad to see it pop up more and more lately.

Back to rivalry… my brother used to play on Sea of Sorrows, so as a bit of sibling rivalry, I looked forward to seeing a matchup between Ehmry Bay and Sea of Sorrows. But by the time that matchup happened, my brother had already transferred to Blackgate (and he is now on Sanctum of Rall).

Side note: reading all the drama about the Ehmry Bay alliance is laughable. If there was an alliance, my guild were either not informed or completely ignored it.

The thing with IP address locking to a particular worlds is, what if there are multiple people in a household playing on different servers?

My brother initially joined Sea of Sorrows, then moved to Blackgate, and I believe he is now on Sanctum of Rall because he and his guild were paid to move there. Meanwhile, I have always been on Ehmry Bay and have no intention of moving anywhere else because my guildies are awesome (and they cannot be bought).

I would imagine that such IP locks would cause issues for us… if I were still living at my parents’ place, I have since moved out. But still, it happens.

Ah, I know how that feels. I am also on Ehmry Bay, playing at oceanic times. I don’t like to follow the zerg, so I run around either home borderlands or eternal battleground to upgrade keeps/towers/camps, refresh seige, repair walls and doors, escort dolyaks etc.

One time, I had fully upgraded a camp in eternal borderlands, was running supply from camp to a not-yet-fully-upgraded keep. On one trip back to the supply camp, I saw dredge attacking it. I was on my up-levelled guardian so I can speed up the dolyaks, but nowhere strong enough to fight off dredge, even with the help of NPC. I called for help, noone came because the keep was under attack. If I had been on my 80 ranger, I could’ve saved the camp myself. But no, not a single person came, I attempted to fight the dredge on my little guardian, inevitably died and watched as dredge claimed the camp. I ended up relogging onto my ranger to take back the camp.

Another time, I was busy upgrading all the keeps on home borderland. Most of the keeps were either fully upgraded or very close to it. But two keeps fell into enemy hands, leaving just garrison which I was working on upgrading. The main zerg was on eternal borderlands attacking enemy keeps or something. I gave a heads up that two keeps on our home borderlands have fallen and now they were headed to garrison. The commander that was online at the time decided it was not worth switching maps because reset was just a few hours away, and with just me and my juvenile stalker guarding garrison, it went the same way as the rest of the keeps on the map.

WvW can be very disheartening for a defender, but I have long since accepted that no one will help me defend the tower/keep that I have spent hours upgrading. I have countless examples of times where I had to flee a tower/keep because it was being attacked by an enemy zerg and I was the only one defending. But I will continue to run dolyaks and upgrade stuff because I believe that is the greatest contribution I could make towards the server’s WvW efforts because my characters are just not built for downing enemy players.