Guild Wars 2

i do not get why everybody says liadri is “challenging” shes not she’s just stupid annoying hard, and almost the worst designed boss ever.

but she can be easily reworked to where people are punished and not murdered if they lag, make a mistake, or are colorblind.

1. the 1 shot kill aoe cone, take one of the 0’s off the 100k hits, that way it won’t kill everybody but only the zerkiest of the zerk.

2. the same 1 shot aoe, change the attack to shoot upwards instead of crashing down on the player this will make it easier for everybody to see the attack since a cone of black blobs will appear at their feat instead of hard to see red circles.

3. the the 1 shot adds who’s damage doesn’t show up in the combat log, change them to a stun or daze when they hit you with the same damage as her auto attack, and when they do they destroy the light crystal if you’re carrying it, maybe give a random condition like weakness, or vulnerability.

4. make the arena bigger, or open it up, there’s plenty of space up their for those domes to extend in size.

5. that blinding blur….take it out and make it a gambit, its stupid to be instagibbed because you’re blinded, if you really wanna make the fight harder than it already is just add in random condition blinds that won’t hide her attacks.

6. the light crystals, change them to orbs like many of the previous fights before her, so you can grab them on the go and not have to stop to pickup and throw, god forbid if you have 2 or more.

7. make it so the crystals last for more than 20 seconds, or don’t disappear in your hands.

8. instanced, instanced, instanced. nothing makes a rage inducing fight worse than culling and lag because there’s a gigantic farm right below in rendering distance.

9. make it so she’s not such a mad brah when you break her EZ mode shield, or slow down the add spawn rate in the second phase.

10. have the cone of 1 shot death go around in a preset pattern and not randomly going after you or not going after you, and have them change directions every time you hit her with a light crystal.

11. up the time limit to at least 5 minutes or higher than what it already is.

12. make it so in the second phase the 2 cones of 1 shot can’t hit you if you stand in the middle where she was, but don’t put it in the patch notes if you do, and put stability on her if you think people can abuse that and stunlock her to death. or have it so her adds go to her in the second phase and reward boons and in return their weaker. or add a dark circle there that puts vulnerability or random conditions on you if you stand in it to long.

13. make it so every form of damage mitigation works instead of only blocks.

all of these suggestions don’t have to all be implemented but at least some of them will drop the poor design and add to the fight as actually being challenging.

i’m going to use dark souls as a comparison since its literally a perfect example, if you go into that game new and inexperienced you are going to die, die, die, die, die, RAGE, die, RAGE, die, SUPER RAGE, destroy something. you then look up what to do you come back and succeed somewhat but still die, but you make it farther and farther until you get to the boss.
where you die, die, die, die, die, die RAGE, die, RAGE, die RAGE, die SUPER RAGE, stop playing before you break something else, look up how to beat the boss.
find out you can get good and beat it the old fashioned way, get it to jump off the plateform, or cheeze the fight with an exploit or certain build.

its challenging but exploitable so EVERYONE can enjoy it, and not have it RNG gated.

this fight should literally be the same way where if you don’t know what to do you are going to die, waypoint, repair, runback over, and over, and over. or you can be smart and look up how to beat her, much like dark souls.
its still gonna be challenging but at least people will know what to do.
and not have to go VIGOR, VIGOR, MOAR kittenING VIGOR!!!!!!!!!

theres plenty of challenging content in the game, like the champion risen baron guarding the skill point, fighting the eye(s) of zhaitan, soloing a dungeon, fighting a champion in general.
if you don’t want to look for them or challenge yourself then its your own fault not A-nets for not having skill gated content. you just don’t wanna look for it.

if you are really worried because more people will have that precious mini then add the mini to the 8 crystal challenge.

Dagraan.2854:

1. the 1 shot kill aoe cone, take one of the 0’s off the 100k hits, that way it won’t kill everybody but only the zerkiest of the zerk.

Naw, this is fine, part of the challenge is not instantly burning your dodges/escapes at the first sign of trouble….you just need to stay focused and it won’t actually hit you.

2. the same 1 shot aoe, change the attack to shoot upwards instead of crashing down on the player this will make it easier for everybody to see the attack since a cone of black blobs will appear at their feat instead of hard to see red circles.

This isn’t a bad idea, I never actually looked for the attack animation, just the red circles when dodging, it may as well not even have graphics since you don’t see it until its crashed down.

3. the the 1 shot adds who’s damage doesn’t show up in the combat log, change them to a stun or daze when they hit you with the same damage as her auto attack, and when they do they destroy the light crystal if you’re carrying it, maybe give a random condition like weakness, or vulnerability.

They move insanely slow….if you let these things kill you then you need to learn your basic W,A,S,D’s

4. make the arena bigger, or open it up, there’s plenty of space up their for those domes to extend in size.

Completely agree, most of the time the fight wasn’t even the most frustrating part, it was the fact that the camera was adamant on crawling into my anus while im in combat -.-

5. that blinding blur….take it out and make it a gambit, its stupid to be instagibbed because you’re blinded, if you really wanna make the fight harder than it already is just add in random condition blinds that won’t hide her attacks.

Go into your GFX options and turn off Post-Processing…problem solved.

6. the light crystals, change them to orbs like many of the previous fights before her, so you can grab them on the go and not have to stop to pickup and throw, god forbid if you have 2 or more.

I don’t think this needs changing, it is about timing.

7. make it so the crystals last for more than 20 seconds, or don’t disappear in your hands.

The entire arena is timed, if people need that much time to grab and throw these….they won’t make it to the end anyways.

8. instanced, instanced, instanced. nothing makes a rage inducing fight worse than culling and lag because there’s a gigantic farm right below in rendering distance.

Was probably the worst choice to make these right about the giant 800 mob farming zone right underneath, Perhaps move the domes to the layer that noone ever goes to (the portals that take you to the outer ring 1/2 way down the pit)

9. make it so she’s not such a mad brah when you break her EZ mode shield, or slow down the add spawn rate in the second phase.

Once you figure out the AoE pattern, she barely even scratches you…seriously

10. have the cone of 1 shot death go around in a preset pattern and not randomly going after you or not going after you, and have them change directions every time you hit her with a light crystal.

The last place it hits is a safe zone….keep that in mind, and phase 2 is a set pattern soooo…not in need of changing

11. up the time limit to at least 5 minutes or higher than what it already is.

this induces tension, it is there for that reason and that reason alone, it loses that reason when it becomes less of a factor. These types of things have been around since old school NES games.

12. make it so in the second phase the 2 cones of 1 shot can’t hit you if you stand in the middle where she was, but don’t put it in the patch notes if you do, and put stability on her if you think people can abuse that and stunlock her to death. or have it so her adds go to her in the second phase and reward boons and in return their weaker. or add a dark circle there that puts vulnerability or random conditions on you if you stand in it to long.

Second phase is fine, learn the pattern.

13. make it so every form of damage mitigation works instead of only blocks.

No real input for me on this one, it seems like its either a 1-shot or not…so not sure how this would change anything….unless you want it to make it easier, not needed.

on a side note i do love how they implemented the new skins, even if they are a complete rip off, for skins, but its 100000000x better than wasting a kitten ton of money and praying to the RNG gods, while having a ritual sacrifice of your cash going on.

to the above poster i take it you beat it because the RNG gods loved you, and now you don’t want it easier because you had to work harder for it than if the rest of the people if they changed it.

this fight is not fine, at no part is a hard to see 1 shot a challenge, and the 1 shot adds will spawn behind you while you focused on the camera and everything else.
and no the crystals are not about timing their about luck, the only part about timing is picking them up and throwing them before the short timer is up.
iv’e made 6 accounts all 80 and have played this game since its release its not about learning your forward, backwards, and side to sides.

and no why should i have to screw around with my graphics just to defeat some stupid mechanic? why do i have to lower my graphics to not what they could be? and lower my enjoyment?
the aoe does not have a pattern, just because you got lucky doesn’t mean there’s a pattern, iv’e watched and done this fight plenty of times to see theres no pattern.
and with the second phase there is a safe zone right after the 1 shot, but is there a safe zone when its filled with 1 shot adds and some mad chick spamming cripples?

remember this is to make it better and still be challenging not poorly designed just because you had to get lucky and completely change your build or even character does not make it a good boss fight.

it’s poorly designed, NOT challenging.
there is a GIGANTIC difference between the two.

if EVERYBODY can enjoy the content by looking up a guide or doing it the hard way then that will add to the enjoyment of the game by everybody, thereby increasing the number of people playing thereby making A-net more money; therefore letting A-net make better content.

see where im going here?

To quote the great Edna ‘E’ Mode: “Too much of it, Darling. Too much!”

I’m not saying she isn’t doable, she clearly is as many have done it now. However, she’s just a tad on the much side.

The first phase is just fine. You practice some and voila at this point you consistently get through it. But then…

Phase two is where it goes crazy…
Giant one shot aoe? No problem, it has a pattern and we can adjust to that. However, with Liadri going berserk on us, jumping us at every possible time and a load of walking ohko bombs running at us and pulling orbs messing with our movement and Liadri spamming cripple and weakness on us and she having a way too big health pool…

Too many and ’s. To make this still challenging, but doable with enough skill, something should have been dropped in phase two.

Stopping the visions would have made close ranging viable.
Stopping the cripple allows for more movement.
Stopping the rifts is the same.
Reducing her health makes it a short all out burst.

Alas, I’ll continue trying. With post-process rendering off of course, who wants to deal with another and, am I right?

-not about RNG at all o.O

- The red circles arent really hard to see, camera angles make it harder, but the circles themselves aren’t an issue

- The adds stand still for a few seconds after they spawn, like I said, W,A,S,Ds

- The crystals have nothing to do with luck….they spawn when the enemy hits the white field…that is the opposite of luck, you are controlling its spawn o.o

- 6 accounts? i’m sure you mean classes…and I’ve done the same, this has nothing to do with anything, it sounds like an excuse.

- You don’t have to change the graphics, it just removes that effect, it is still possible with the effect. It is just like the drunk effect in GW1, it is simply handled by the post-processing. Now you just sound angry, calm down and think about what you are saying before you hit the enter key.

- Phase 2 has a pattern, it is North/South, then West/East in an hourglass shape….you literally just have to run in a circle around the arena to avoid it. And Phase 1 is slow enough and gives you the safe-zone that it shouldn’t be an issue.

- The adds again, move pretty slow, get destroyed by the white field (still appearing btw) and the cripples are annoying…but if you know the pattern, even with cripple you can avoid it, and even mitigate by using ranged.

You think it is poorly designed because you are simply adding your personal opinions, like many others, these are suggestions, but you are treating them as if they are requirements. You simply bash the creators for making something you haven’t mastered yet, this is not the way to go about it….if it was actual impossible that would be a different matter.

Please proof-read your messages and try to avoid the callouts and blatant bias trying to defend your claims. I am telling you how you can try and finish this, but you are taking it the wrong way and refusing to adapt.

The challenge in the battle is that it will punish panicking and punish mistakes, you have to focus and know what you are doing, or else a mistake will end you….that is the nature of a challenge.

If anything practical, the orbs should be removed for Phase 2….that I will also agree with (if it were on your list to begin with)

you know back before there where achievements where there were still challenging bosses or things you could do to handicap yourself.
and you did them for no reward, other than the simple fact that you could do it, and nothing else.
would you honestly do this if it didnt have the now valuable achievement points, or that mini? would you do the 8 crystal achievement if it had a 0 behind it.

Do you know what I love the most? The four cakefruit pirates! Gosh, feels so good to use my P/D condition thief on it’s full potential!

Nopeeeeeee

Perma revealed all the way babe! I mean, I CAN’T EVEN USE MY COMBO TO APPLY CONDITIONS! It would be no problem, actually a walk in the park, if it didn’t have the freaking timer, dropping me off the arena every kitten time! It already disrupts condition specs, but when you remove the only way a profession can apply those conditions, you make it impossible to do it. And no, I won’t respec just for the sake of this stupid challenge.

Oh, and before I forget, even if you manage to kill one of the pirates (especially the one that heals them all), every single one of them heals all the way back! So Anet doesn’t want me to use my single target conditions (P/D Cnd+Sneak combo) nor my AOE conditions (Caltrops and SB). GG

I completed it on my Necromancer without too much trouble… you know the class with no blocks, no additional evades, no vigor, no invincibility, no mobility and poor health regeneration.

And then there’s the fact that CC and DOT are the best things to have for most of the fights. Necro is probably one of the best classes to play in the gauntlet.

I do feel that she is too difficult for what this is.

The fact that there’s all these gambits to take on to the arenas says to me that the basic fights should be completable by the average player. Then tie the special achievement to defeating the bosses with the extra gambits.

That said, tonight I actually felt like I might have a chance of beating her. Just need a LOT more practice. Having to grind out all these tickets to keep entering is probably the most annoying part of fighting her.

all of these suggestions don’t have to all be implemented but at least some of them will drop the poor design and add to the fight as actually being challenging.

this is at the bottom and these suggestions will make the boss a better design, it’ll still be a challenge like dark souls is but more easily doable since someone can easily make a guide. so that everybody can enjoy the content.

making a purely skill gated content into the game for a very small minority is a very stupid decision that only adds work, and loses customers. especially since its a T rated subscription free game.

Dagraan.2854:

i may think its poorly designed because iv’e played enough games and fought enough bosses to know what good design, and challenging is. you obviously haven’t. if you want good design, and or a challenge then go play demon souls or dark souls. that will sate your need for a challenge.

I beat Demon Souls a long time ago, as well as recently beating Dark Souls doing a soul level 1 run. Yet, I think the bosses design is very good, the only problems being the glare and the fps drop/culling from the fights below (mechanic wise I think it is very well done).

But hey, what do I know? I’m just some partially colorblind person (who had trouble seeing the red circles, but understands the AoE pattern) who enjoyed the fight.

i get why people want challenging content that not everybody can do, it comes with prestige, but those people have to also understand their playing a MMORPG with a lot of emphasis on special items and looks.

GW2 does not have to be your challenge, there are thousand of games out there that are challenging.
i’ll name a few that are somewhat cheap as well and that you can easily get on steam.

the binding of isaac. wrath of the lamb.
rouge legacy, or any rouge like game.
super house of dead ninjas
the demon souls and dark souls
FPS games, they vary but they have older and more realistic FPS war games.
chivalry medieval warfare, again its skill based.

all these games you can watch pro players do it and learn some secrets but it won’t make it that much easier.
you have to learn on you’re own, almost all of them don’t have stupid hard to see 1 shots, and even if they do their easily telegraphed.
liadri is none of this.

• at this time i have to log out now because its super late, so if you reply to me and i don’t answer or provide a counter thats why. its not because im ignoring you. *

Dagraan.2854:

Zietlogik.6208:

-not about RNG at all o.O

- The red circles arent really hard to see, camera angles make it harder, but the circles themselves aren’t an issue

- The adds stand still for a few seconds after they spawn, like I said, W,A,S,Ds

- The crystals have nothing to do with luck….they spawn when the enemy hits the white field…that is the opposite of luck, you are controlling its spawn o.o

- 6 accounts? i’m sure you mean classes…and I’ve done the same, this has nothing to do with anything, it sounds like an excuse.

- You don’t have to change the graphics, it just removes that effect, it is still possible with the effect. It is just like the drunk effect in GW1, it is simply handled by the post-processing. Now you just sound angry, calm down and think about what you are saying before you hit the enter key.

- Phase 2 has a pattern, it is North/South, then West/East in an hourglass shape….you literally just have to run in a circle around the arena to avoid it. And Phase 1 is slow enough and gives you the safe-zone that it shouldn’t be an issue.

- The adds again, move pretty slow, get destroyed by the white field (still appearing btw) and the cripples are annoying…but if you know the pattern, even with cripple you can avoid it, and even mitigate by using ranged.

You think it is poorly designed because you are simply adding your personal opinions, like many others, these are suggestions, but you are treating them as if they are requirements. You simply bash the creators for making something you haven’t mastered yet, this is not the way to go about it….if it was actual impossible that would be a different matter.

Please proof-read your messages and try to avoid the callouts and blatant bias trying to defend your claims. I am telling you how you can try and finish this, but you are taking it the wrong way and refusing to adapt.

the red circles are a problem, the floor along with the bad camera not to mention if you are colorblind then red circles won’t be as obvious.
you’re just gonna alienate a player base because YOU don’t have a problem?

the adds will spawn behind you out of your line of sight, W,A,S,D has nothing to do with the kittening problem.

the crystals have everything to do with luck, nobody in the entire world has enough micromanaging skill to time and run everything perfectly in this fight especially since its a 2 min time limit.
not to mention the short time they exist not the ground, their entire being is time dependent.

and yes i do mean character, and no its not an excuse that W,S,A,D bullkitten is a stupid excuse to why its poor design.

the adds may move pretty slow but they all don’t spawn behind white circles not to mention you have to focus on killing liadri before the time runs out. and slow moving things are naturally going to be out of your mind before its to late, because they aren’t that big of a threat until theres to many of them.
and you may can range her but she still fast and mad and jumps at you all the time.

i may think its poorly designed because iv’e played enough games and fought enough bosses to know what good design, and challenging is. you obviously haven’t. if you want good design, and or a challenge then go play demon souls or dark souls. that will sate your need for a challenge.

really you are telling me to proof read? you know you can google the word ironic right? how are you so sure that you aren’t doing the same thing with your blatant bias defending some poorly designed boss because you already defeated it and want everybody else to go through the same pain and luck

and yes i dont have to fix my graphics but i also don’t have to use my heal skill, but that still won’t stop me from dieing because i get blinded then immediately killed because i can’t see anything to time my W,S,A,D or dodges.

You should calm down, if this fight upsets you so much stop trying, Its supposed to be hard (Anets eyes that means 1 shot mechanics and great timings). The poster is just trying to help you, I have done it and what hes been saying is true. You really can’t blame the camera too much (although I know it sucks believe me… did it with a max sized Norn) and since you are refusing to turn your graphics down you will get hit hard by the blind effect, I got utterly destroyed my 1st couple tries but there is a pattern and once you learn it the only problem is killing her before the timer runs out.

The fight is really easy, its just the lag that kills it. If it weren’t for the lag I don’t think many (skilled) players would be complaining. I ended up hopping on a lower pop server where I wouldn’t be pushed to a just as full overflow and doing it during an off hour and I laughed my way through it.

you know whats fun? trying to avoid her 1 shot adds that fill the arena and avoiding the 1 shot aoes while you’re stuck staring at your beautiful back because the dome doesn’t allow you to back up to it. or go near it.
i have a new appreciation for my holographic shatterer wings, because of the close up i get whenever im running around the arena.

and that poster was defending some poorly made boss because he managed to defeat her while it was hard and doesn’t want it to be any easier because he thinks it will devalue his achievement, and mini.

Dagraan.2854:

you know back before there where achievements where there were still challenging bosses or things you could do to handicap yourself.
and you did them for no reward, other than the simple fact that you could do it, and nothing else.
would you honestly do this if it didnt have the now valuable achievement points, or that mini? would you do the 8 crystal achievement if it had a 0 behind it.

Well I for one didn’t do it because of the achievements. I did the gauntlet because it sounded like nice challenge. Sure I had 60-70 attempts before I actually completed it and in the process I was raging too but I know its possible because there is a pattern. Once you learn the pattern its easy really…

You keep talkinga bout it being luck dependent and such, but there is practically nothing random in the fight. While I do agree that 1 shot kills are pretty lazy design mechanics – it’s very silly to claim that it’s all about RNG because you aren’t able to pay attention to what’s happening around you (the instakill AOEs do follow a pattern, there is no ‘RNG’ to that).

Personally I think the biggest problem is that it’s really difficult to see the red circles/instakill AoEs beofre they hit while you’re in the arena – I found while observing people that they were pretty easy to see but while fighting Liadri I often couldn’t see where the red circles actually were.

The timer might be a little too strict, but I don’t have much of an opinion on that since I never actually ran out of time on any boss in the gauntlet anyway, but people with tanky items would likely have a harder time (retraiting is one thing, but people shouldn’t be expected to replace an entire set of equipment).

As far as the camera angles go while running around at the edge of the map – I never found that a problem. I’m not sure why you actually would want to be running around at the edge of the map for Liadri since it’s much harder to run out of range of the AoEs there since it has a cone shape. Similarly adds spawning behind you shouldn’t be a big problem if you aren’t at the edge of the map, as long as you keep moving.

4. make the arena bigger, or open it up, there’s plenty of space up their for those domes to extend in size.

For the love of god this. The fights aren’t even that hard. Having to see the inside of my own skull through most of it (if I’m lucky to not have the camera go nuts) is the kitten problem.

Why does the ceiling again have to be designed around human/asura character sizes. There is plenty of room. Does Anet really not have one single kitten charr/norn tester? The skill part should not be about “did I get lucky enough to see the fight”. That isn’t skill, that is bad game design. I’ve learned though this isn’t going to change. The aetherblade were a great example of this. The jumping puzzle I could do, but I could never see the goggles to do the jump because all I could see was the sky dome. Design content so that at least if I have to change my build repeatedly I don’t have to level a while new character to do it. I’m sick of being punished because I prefer norn/charr to the other races.

i get why people want challenging content that not everybody can do, it comes with prestige, but those people have to also understand their playing a MMORPG with a lot of emphasis on special items and looks.

Um no, those people are not the same as people that want a challenge. I’m one of those that likes a challenge, and I don’t care if I get an achievement or a mini. In fact they could easily remove all of that and I would still solo it. I solo champions, I solo group content, but not for an achievement or a mini. I do it to see if I can, and to get better. For people really wanting a challenge that is more than enough. The other people you are referring too are all about their ego. Please don’t compare the two, because they are not the same. It’s an insult to be put into the same group.

What I’m getting from this thread is: Content is too hard. Please make it easier so I can get my mini.

I have given all the advice I can, but it seems you are simply hell bent on ignoring any rationality behind the ability to complete this.

It is possible, it is hard, it is challenging, there are just alot of annoying bits to the fight (camera for example…)if you actually re-read my first response, I agree with alot of your points, but you went into rage, singled out some bits that you just wanted to complain about on the forums, and seemingly ignored the rest.

The patterns are there, the ability to complete it is there, and with some practice it will all come together.

I can’t even begin to imagine how jaded people would be, if open forums to complain existed back when this type of difficulty and challenge was a staple to basic “end-game” design and developers caved to the feedback.

Regardless, I don’t care about the mini, or the achievement. I simply like to complete things, and if I start something, I intend to finish it regardless of how many tries it takes, because it makes the victory all the more sweeter…that is just the type of gamer I am.

This type of content is for a certain type of gamer, and I am actually glad that Anet is appealing to a wider audience with it now (similar to Halloween Clocktower). If you are not that type of gamer then this will not be something you will enjoy doing even if you complete it. You are not being forced to do this, you don’t need that mini to survive, or those few achievement points to continue playing the game. This is content you can choose not to participate in.

Wow.. to the OP of this thread. If it’s too hard for you then don’t do it. No one forces you to. A lot of us enjoys this challenge because not a lot of thing in this game is challenging. Stop blaming the game mechanics just cause you can’t do it. So many people completed it already.

Zietlogik.6208:

I have given all the advice I can, but it seems you are simply hell bent on ignoring any rationality behind the ability to complete this.

It is possible, it is hard, it is challenging, there are just alot of annoying bits to the fight (camera for example…)if you actually re-read my first response, I agree with alot of your points, but you went into rage, singled out some bits that you just wanted to complain about on the forums, and seemingly ignored the rest.

The patterns are there, the ability to complete it is there, and with some practice it will all come together.

I can’t even begin to imagine how jaded people would be, if open forums to complain existed back when this type of difficulty and challenge was a staple to basic “end-game” design and developers caved to the feedback.

Regardless, I don’t care about the mini, or the achievement. I simply like to complete things, and if I start something, I intend to finish it regardless of how many tries it takes, because it makes the victory all the more sweeter…that is just the type of gamer I am.

This type of content is for a certain type of gamer, and I am actually glad that Anet is appealing to a wider audience with it now (similar to Halloween Clocktower). If you are not that type of gamer then this will not be something you will enjoy doing even if you complete it. You are not being forced to do this, you don’t need that mini to survive, or those few achievement points to continue playing the game. This is content you can choose not to participate in.

the clock tower was easy to do, so was the Christmas JP after it, but it had no factor of luck other than getting a random crash, this fight however does, you can try to defend some poorly designed boss all you want, but the fact is she is not a hard boss, she is not a challenging boss, she is just a poorly designed boss with artificial difficulty. her aoes do not have a pattern ive done the fight enough times to see if it there was one.
take out her stupid attacks that 1 shot that is highly dependent on lag and if theres a zerg ball below, those adds that spawn behind you because your staring through an eye in your stomach
and what do you have? some invulnerable boss that goes crazy when you break it. in other words a trash mob.
but fix some of the bad design and guess what you have? a better boss fight without the artificial difficulty.
not to mention de syncing because of the drop in FPS and lag.
explain to me how im supposed to dodge an attack thats 2 seconds ahead of its animation? and goes in and out.

yes i don’t have to do this rage inducing fight, but by that same notion i don’t have to complete the story missions i don’t have to go to orr, i dont have to WvW, i don’t have to level up my crafting, i dont have to create alts to experience the full game.
like i said before poor design does not = challenging. this fight isn’t challenging its just stupid.

a poorly seen 100k attack and insta kill mobs in a fight are never a challenge, its just poor design.
challenge does not mean rolling the lottery, im not saying take out the insta gib attacks im saying drop their damage so they punish you if you make a mistake and don’t just outright murder you and then be denied because an orb spawned and it was “obstructed” right before you die.
your only piece of advice was learn to W,S,A,D instakill mobs spawning out of your sight.

whakittens like on the forums,

everybody that beat it: content is fine L2p a broken boss
everybody who hasn’t: poor design.
if you sooooo desperate for a challenge there are plenty of other cheap games, but A-net is a business company wanting to make money, they still have to compete with every other MMORPG, and making skill gated content is stupid for drawing customers in.

Dagraan.2854:

her aoes do not have a pattern ive done the fight enough times to see if it there was one.

Pattern of AoE:

Phase 1:

You are placed in a random spot in the arena, however, the light field is always in the same spot. 1st AoE is on opposite side of light field, 2nd AoE is on light field (forms a / in turns 1 and 2). After that the AoE goes adjacent then opposite again (forms a \ in turns 3 and 4). The AoE then cycles in that exact same order until phase 1 is over. Light fields and bombs always spawn in the same spots, only thing RNG is where the rifts spawn (the time in which they spawn is not RNG), which, if you’re paying attention to, you will always have enough time to kill before they pull.

Phase 2:

AoE now covers 2 spots rather than 1. Always forms an hour glass (forms a / in first turn, forms a \ in second turn). The safe spot it always where the AoE just landed and the danger spot is where it was just safe.

GoldenTruth.2853:

Dagraan.2854:

her aoes do not have a pattern ive done the fight enough times to see if it there was one.

Pattern of AoE:

Phase 1:

You are placed in a random spot in the arena, however, the light field is always in the same spot. 1st AoE is on opposite side of light field, 2nd AoE is on light field (forms a / in turns 1 and 2). After that the AoE goes adjacent then opposite again (forms a \ in turns 3 and 4). The AoE then cycles in that exact same order until phase 1 is over. Light fields and bombs always spawn in the same spots, only thing RNG is where the rifts spawn (the time in which they spawn is not RNG), which, if you’re paying attention to, you will always have enough time to kill before they pull.

Phase 2:

AoE now covers 2 spots rather than 1. Always forms an hour glass (forms a / in first turn, forms a \ in second turn). The safe spot it always where the AoE just landed and the danger spot is where it was just safe.

that is wrong, iv’e watched enough fights and done enough to know those light fields and mobs spawn in random places hell you can watch people do it for long enough to see that, not to mention those aoes are completely random they do not have a pattern.
this fight is completely RNG based
the second phase is more predictable but those safe areas aren’t safe with most likely 5 1 shot adds and some crazy chick spamming med range cripples, in the same area and not to mention 9 times out of 10 those adds are gonna hug her, and not to mention the random spawning light portals don’t help at all.
it be great if the light portals decreased the damage of the 1 shot instakill attacks but they don’t the only use they have on the second phase is if you’re going after the 8 crystal achievement.

not to mention the add will explode and throw you, and kill you if your standing somewhat in the portal when they hit because they don’t hit the hitbox soon enough.
there is no pattern on this fight other than the 2 insta kill fields on the second phase.

Dagraan.2854:

GoldenTruth.2853:

Dagraan.2854:

her aoes do not have a pattern ive done the fight enough times to see if it there was one.

Pattern of AoE:

Phase 1:

You are placed in a random spot in the arena, however, the light field is always in the same spot. 1st AoE is on opposite side of light field, 2nd AoE is on light field (forms a / in turns 1 and 2). After that the AoE goes adjacent then opposite again (forms a \ in turns 3 and 4). The AoE then cycles in that exact same order until phase 1 is over. Light fields and bombs always spawn in the same spots, only thing RNG is where the rifts spawn (the time in which they spawn is not RNG), which, if you’re paying attention to, you will always have enough time to kill before they pull.

Phase 2:

AoE now covers 2 spots rather than 1. Always forms an hour glass (forms a / in first turn, forms a \ in second turn). The safe spot it always where the AoE just landed and the danger spot is where it was just safe.

that is wrong, iv’e watched enough fights and done enough to know those light fields and mobs spawn in random places hell you can watch people do it for long enough to see that, not to mention those aoes are completely random they do not have a pattern.
this fight is completely RNG based
the second phase is more predictable but those safe areas aren’t safe with most likely 5 1 shot adds and some crazy chick spamming med range cripples, in the same area and not to mention 9 times out of 10 those adds are gonna hug her, and not to mention the random spawning light portals don’t help at all.
it be great if the light portals decreased the damage of the 1 shot instakill attacks but they don’t the only use they have on the second phase is if you’re going after the 8 crystal achievement.

not to mention the add will explode and throw you, and kill you if your standing somewhat in the portal when they hit because they don’t hit the hitbox soon enough.
there is no pattern on this fight other than the 2 insta kill fields on the second phase.

Everything I wrote about the pattern of the AoE is 100% true, whether you want to believe me or not. I’m not sure if the Light Field itself spawns in a random spot, however, the AoE and bombs spawn in the exact same area compared to the light field (always looks the same from the inside, you just start off in a different spot). The moment you enter the ring and see the light field you can instantly know which area the AoE is going to cover for the entirety of the 1st phase (ie. although the light field isn’t really in the middle of the AoE it will always be opposite side of light field for the 1st AoE, on the light field for 2nd AoE, adjacent to light field on the 3rd AoE, opposite side of the 3rd attack for the 4th AoE, then the cycle repeats).

Dagraan.2854:

GoldenTruth.2853:

Dagraan.2854:

her aoes do not have a pattern ive done the fight enough times to see if it there was one.

Pattern of AoE:

Phase 1:

You are placed in a random spot in the arena, however, the light field is always in the same spot. 1st AoE is on opposite side of light field, 2nd AoE is on light field (forms a / in turns 1 and 2). After that the AoE goes adjacent then opposite again (forms a \ in turns 3 and 4). The AoE then cycles in that exact same order until phase 1 is over. Light fields and bombs always spawn in the same spots, only thing RNG is where the rifts spawn (the time in which they spawn is not RNG), which, if you’re paying attention to, you will always have enough time to kill before they pull.

Phase 2:

AoE now covers 2 spots rather than 1. Always forms an hour glass (forms a / in first turn, forms a \ in second turn). The safe spot it always where the AoE just landed and the danger spot is where it was just safe.

that is wrong, iv’e watched enough fights and done enough to know those light fields and mobs spawn in random places hell you can watch people do it for long enough to see that, not to mention those aoes are completely random they do not have a pattern.
this fight is completely RNG based
the second phase is more predictable but those safe areas aren’t safe with most likely 5 1 shot adds and some crazy chick spamming med range cripples, in the same area and not to mention 9 times out of 10 those adds are gonna hug her, and not to mention the random spawning light portals don’t help at all.
it be great if the light portals decreased the damage of the 1 shot instakill attacks but they don’t the only use they have on the second phase is if you’re going after the 8 crystal achievement.

not to mention the add will explode and throw you, and kill you if your standing somewhat in the portal when they hit because they don’t hit the hitbox soon enough.
there is no pattern on this fight other than the 2 insta kill fields on the second phase.

Perhaps the light fields look like they are in different locations, because you’re moving around?

If you are facing the north side of the dome, it will look like it starts on the right. If you are facing the south side of the dome, it will look like it starts on the left. So I can fully understand why you think this fight has no set mechanics. But when you learn to play it, you’ll be fine!

As much as I hate ArenaNet for this update, at least Liadri does have set patterns, on mostly everything (as long as you use the same arena dome). The clouds of doom always spawn in the same pattern, and always follow the same rotation. If you can watch someone do the fight from outside the arena, you can easily spot the pattern for that dome. Same goes for second phase, it’s the same exact pattern where it will start, and it cycles between two dangerous spots, and two safe spots, diagonal to one another. Basically requires kiting in half circles. Here’s another thing, the light fields on the ground that you need to kite the visions into, they always spawn in the same spots as well, as do the visions themselves. If you can learn the pattern, you can very efficiently, as quickly as it would be possible (due to visions movement speed), create the orbs you throw at her.

The fight itself is not too bad, the arena design is. Basically the only random thing in this fight is the gravity orbs that pulls you around. A tip, at least it’s worked for me every single time, is to rush over to the gravity orb that spawns at the start and killing it, that should be in a safe spot for the first cloud of insta-death.

A problem is also the second phase and needing five additional orbs for one of the achievements. As a Guardian, even in my DPS glass cannon setup, which melts stuff normally, I can barely get her down in time before the floor falls out below me, multiple times I just fall to my death with Liadri at 2-3% of health. I have no time to kite visions into additional light fields, I need to spend all that time attacking her and nothing else. If I were to spend the seconds it’d take to pick up the orbs and throw them, I would simply run out of time. This is where it gets frustrating. I can survive forever in there at this point, but I’m limited by a slightly too short timer that makes me plummet to my death. It wasn’t seemingly balanced for my profession to do this without some serious luck. Even if the visions at times do walk over light fields in the second phase, the kitten orbs disappear before I can manage to get myself over there without being bombarded with a doom cloud and dying.

And then you have the terrible camera that likes to showcase your behind more than anything else in the cramped arena, the horrible floor design that hides red circles (at least for those who are color weak/blind) and a stupid blind effect that probably cause seizures for some people (but that can be turned off by lowering graphical settings granted, though it technically feels like exploiting).

Unrelated to Liadri herself, there’s also stupid bugs with in example the Meatless Murderer achievement. I know, 100% that Chomper never ate any of the meat that was thrown out when I did that on my D/P Thief 9 times in a row. He never got the buff, and I always munched the meats. Still, I never got the achievement. This is just stupid and frustrating. You’re doing the criteria (unless it is explained poorly), but simply don’t get rewarded for your efforts. This event showcases everything that’s wrong with Living Story, well basically every update over the past months has shown it, 2-4 weeks, or however long they get to develop these things, are simply not enough time. There’s clearly not enough testing being done, with all the bugs going in here. The fact that there’s a arena placed over a farming area that for some people causes framerate and latency issues is poor planning. The fact that the arenas are so cramped when ArenaNet themselves have said the camera is not perfect and suffers from cramped spaces, is just plain stupid. The fact that they make really hard achievements, in temporary content, is alienating players. I want challenging content, don’t get me wrong, but I want challenging content in permanent additions to the game.

Living Story so far is like giving a lollipop to a baby and ripping it out of its mouth shortly after. We get all these fairly good content additions (a little patching there, some fixing here would make them pretty good), only to have them ripped away from us again as the two weeks has passed. It becomes stressful and frustrating, it makes me not have fun anymore. I feel like I can’t do anything else than these darn Living Story updates. I have no time to do World vs. World, sPvP, dungeons, general lollygagging and what not. If it was permanently there, and I had all the time in the world to complete everything, I wouldn’t be so frustrated and angry with the game.

As it is, Living Story is what is going to kill the game for me. The world doesn’t feel alive, it just feels like the game has a load of poorly executed events, full of frustration and annoyances.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Dagraan.2854:

GoldenTruth.2853:

Dagraan.2854:

her aoes do not have a pattern ive done the fight enough times to see if it there was one.

Pattern of AoE:

Phase 1:

You are placed in a random spot in the arena, however, the light field is always in the same spot. 1st AoE is on opposite side of light field, 2nd AoE is on light field (forms a / in turns 1 and 2). After that the AoE goes adjacent then opposite again (forms a \ in turns 3 and 4). The AoE then cycles in that exact same order until phase 1 is over. Light fields and bombs always spawn in the same spots, only thing RNG is where the rifts spawn (the time in which they spawn is not RNG), which, if you’re paying attention to, you will always have enough time to kill before they pull.

Phase 2:

AoE now covers 2 spots rather than 1. Always forms an hour glass (forms a / in first turn, forms a \ in second turn). The safe spot it always where the AoE just landed and the danger spot is where it was just safe.

that is wrong, iv’e watched enough fights and done enough to know those light fields and mobs spawn in random places hell you can watch people do it for long enough to see that, not to mention those aoes are completely random they do not have a pattern.
this fight is completely RNG based
the second phase is more predictable but those safe areas aren’t safe with most likely 5 1 shot adds and some crazy chick spamming med range cripples, in the same area and not to mention 9 times out of 10 those adds are gonna hug her, and not to mention the random spawning light portals don’t help at all.
it be great if the light portals decreased the damage of the 1 shot instakill attacks but they don’t the only use they have on the second phase is if you’re going after the 8 crystal achievement.

not to mention the add will explode and throw you, and kill you if your standing somewhat in the portal when they hit because they don’t hit the hitbox soon enough.
there is no pattern on this fight other than the 2 insta kill fields on the second phase.

Perhaps the light fields look like they are in different locations, because you’re moving around?

If you are facing the north side of the dome, it will look like it starts on the right. If you are facing the south side of the dome, it will look like it starts on the left. So I can fully understand why you think this fight has no set mechanics. But when you learn to play it, you’ll be fine!

no this isnt about which side wall of the dome they spawn on, i mean the light circles will appear in different random locations for each fight.
theres more than 3 spawns for the circles, and none of them are set.

this fight is completely RNG based, i’ve played FPS games and learned what to do theres still luck but not as much as this, iv’e learned pvp for this game and what each class can and cannot do and what most people will do. again theres luck involved but not as much as this.

iv’e played rouge like games and learned the patterns of the enemies, learned the secrets thats less RNG based than this.
this fight is just bad.

the only challenging part of this is like going up 10 stories of stairs with no legs, for some stupid reward that will be cool for 30 seconds then go into storage for the rest of time, and you thank god that, this ordeal is over.
tell me, do you re fight this boss because its fun? or because you want the other achievements tied to this fight? do you try to fight this “challenge” with only white gear or naked? do you try to add handicaps to the fight because its just not challenging enough? and you want artificial difficulty? do you re fight just because you found this fun?

1) RNG means Random Number Generator. There are not random numbers here. It’s called Mechanics. <puts on fallacy hat> It’s like saying there’s RNG in driving a car with manual transmission.

2) FPS means First Person Shooter. GW2 is not an FPS. <puts on fallacy hat> It’s like saying “I do well in Counter Strike, so I should do well in Tetris.”

3) I play this game for fun. Getting achievements is fun, esp. when you earn them after hard content.

yes you earn them after hard content, not broken content.

why is it the only reliably good strategy is to go complete zerker and nuke her before she even spawns the second phase?

Dagraan.2854:

yes you earn them after hard content, not broken content.

See below

Smooth Penguin.5294:

The challenge is learning from your mistakes, and applying the knowledge to the situations as they present themselves.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

If you can do something without trial and error, then it isn’t much of a challenge. And to be clear, I haven’t beaten Liadri yet, but at no point will I complain to Anet that it’s bad content simply because I can’t do it. I need to L2P, and with practice and repetition, I will.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

The “Dodge” mechanic is straight forward. Double tap or key bind it, and the action happens. But you need to know how to dodge, and where to dodge to. If you dodge something, but roll off a ledge, or into AOE, you’ll still be in a world of hurt.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

It’s only frustrating if you don’t learn from your mistakes or failures. But I find it fun to keep trying. If I time my dodge wrong, it’s still my fault, not Anet’s. The mechanics are the same each time I play. I just need to get better in paying attention to patterns and tells.

Dagraan.2854:

why is it the only reliably good strategy is to go complete zerker and nuke her before she even spawns the second phase?

You have absolutely no clue what you’re talking about because that strategy is not even possible let alone reliable.

Dagraan.2854:

whakittens like on the forums,

everybody that beat it: content is fine L2p a broken boss
everybody who hasn’t: poor design.
if you sooooo desperate for a challenge there are plenty of other cheap games, but A-net is a business company wanting to make money, they still have to compete with every other MMORPG, and making skill gated content is stupid for drawing customers in.

Do you want GW2 to never have any content that’s more difficult than reading a book?

OtakuDFifty.2965:

Dagraan.2854:

whakittens like on the forums,

everybody that beat it: content is fine L2p a broken boss
everybody who hasn’t: poor design.
if you sooooo desperate for a challenge there are plenty of other cheap games, but A-net is a business company wanting to make money, they still have to compete with every other MMORPG, and making skill gated content is stupid for drawing customers in.

Do you want GW2 to never have any content that’s more difficult than reading a book?

have you never searched for content more difficult than reading a book? cuz its there, you can solo dungeons you can solo plenty of bosses.
so you want A-net to hand out broken bosses because you’re to lazy to look?

Kithros.7634:

Dagraan.2854:

why is it the only reliably good strategy is to go complete zerker and nuke her before she even spawns the second phase?

You have absolutely no clue what you’re talking about because that strategy is not even possible let alone reliable.

im sorry? i couldn’t read your post over watching her get nuked down before the second phase has a chance to do anything.

What I saw in that video was a warrior killing her in the 2nd phase, not bursting her down before the 2nd phase.

the fight is fine, l2p.
yes you might have to respecc,
and no the patterns are not random, nothing in this fight is.
the spawnpoints for adds are set, so are the aoe attacks, even in p1
and the orbs that pull you are also in set locations.
she barely does any damage, the autoattack in p1 can be avoided completely witout even dodging, and the clones move so kitten slow, that it boggles my mind how that could be a problem for anybody.

Dagraan.2854:

i’m going to use dark souls as a comparison since its literally a perfect example, if you go into that game new and inexperienced you are going to die, die, die, die, die, RAGE, die, RAGE, die, SUPER RAGE, destroy something.

Are you seriously comparing Dark Souls with GW2? In Dark Souls, every boss has a very different AI mechanics and beating the boss actually feels like an accomplishment. In GW2 I have dungeon master and fractals level 20 and never felt accomplished beating a boss. Why? because what matters in GW2 boss fight: dodge AoE, dps spam the boss’s large health pool, don’t get downed, and done, move on.

In Dark Souls, no boss can one shot you if you are in the right gear and have balanced your stats correctly. On the other hand in GW2, it doesn’t matter if you are a tank lvl 80 guardian with exotic/ascended gear and all the traits set right or if you are a level 10 in fine/blue armor. You still get one shot. You might as well fight naked.

Also in Dark Souls NG+ or higher, every boss’s health is balanced. You can actually one shot the boss with the buffs. Is this possible in GW2? No? Because GW2 boss fight is is not about challenge. It is about spam/grind mechanics.

Here is the video of one shotting one of the hardest bosses in Dark Souls. So please don’t compare Dark Souls with GW2 PvE. GW2 PvE is a joke to any other game.

(One-Shotting Challenge: Ornstein and Smough (Dark Souls).
http://youtu.be/cH4EY68yVzk?t=53s

Kithros.7634:

What I saw in that video was a warrior killing her in the 2nd phase, not bursting her down before the 2nd phase.

the second phase has about 5 ish seconds before it spawns and does anything, he killed her in the transition before she could do anything.

Dagraan.2854:

why is it the only reliably good strategy is to go complete zerker and nuke her before she even spawns the second phase?

it’s not. i did it with low ranged damage and had plenty of time left.

Zylonite.5913:

Dagraan.2854:

i’m going to use dark souls as a comparison since its literally a perfect example, if you go into that game new and inexperienced you are going to die, die, die, die, die, RAGE, die, RAGE, die, SUPER RAGE, destroy something.

Are you seriously comparing Dark Souls with GW2? In Dark Souls, every boss has a very different AI mechanics and beating the boss actually feels like an accomplishment. In GW2 I have dungeon master and fractals level 20 and never felt accomplished beating a boss. Why? because what matters in GW2 boss fight: dodge AoE, dps spam the boss’s large health pool, don’t get downed, and done, move on.

In Dark Souls, no boss can one shot you if you are in the right gear and have balanced your stats correctly. On the other hand in GW2, it doesn’t matter if you are a tank lvl 80 guardian with exotic/ascended gear and all the traits set right or if you are a level 10 in fine/blue armor. You still get one shot. You might as well fight naked.

Also in Dark Souls NG+ or higher, every boss’s health is balanced. You can actually one shot the boss with the buffs. Is this possible in GW2? No? Because GW2 boss fight is is not about challenge. It is about spam/grind mechanics.

Here is the video of one shotting one of the hardest bosses in Dark Souls. So please don’t compare Dark Souls with GW2 PvE. GW2 PvE is a joke to any other game.

(One-Shotting Challenge: Ornstein and Smough (Dark Souls).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH4EY68yVzk

im comparing it to dark souls because A-net is trying to make dark souls quality bosses and failing hard, they wanna make skill gated content for a very small minority to lazy to look for a challenge or go to somewhere else for a challenge.

Dagraan.2854:

Kithros.7634:

What I saw in that video was a warrior killing her in the 2nd phase, not bursting her down before the 2nd phase.

the second phase has about 5 ish seconds before it spawns and does anything, he killed her in the transition before she could do anything.

No, he did not, he killed her after she used the whirling attack which is an attack that is only used during the 2nd phase. There is no time where the boss just stands there idling.