Guild Wars 2

Cures.7451:

On the first day everything is always veeery impossible for you guys
in some days, when better players show you how easily its beaten, only half of you will rage on. and the other half will start copying builds from people that know what theyre doing. Or didn’t you beat the trials t4 in the end? if not, this is just not meant for you. go on.

Stop building strawmen… Noone said it was impossible… We’re saying it’s 100% based on luck rather than skill for some classes in certain fights…

and another funny thing is that so much skills just dont work. skills like taking no damage or pain inverter and much more….

Im sorry that you have not played a ranger yet… Rangers CANNOT continiously dodge like that… At best we have Vigor+50% extra regen… That gives 2 dodges, and then at minimum, another 3 seconds before the next dodge is possible… Given optimal conditions… Given the right weapons or skills, we can get another dodge or two in, and then only have 1-2 seconds of not being able to dodge… These dodges however are highly limited in direction and range. It’s not a viable option during Salazan, so that leaves two dodges before the 3 second window of not being able to… Now, we can have a sigil that gives full energy, giving us another 2 dodges… At which point we’re still back no dodges… Now, here’s the kicker… Assuming you’re running a fully defensive build, a ranger have ~24k HP. Salazans fire, hit you twice per second for 2000-2500 damage, for 10 seconds… You have at best 4 dodges giving you 3 seconds of immunity provided you are lucky enough to not get hit inbetween the dodges, which with twice per second is very common… That’s 7 seconds to go in which you have no dodges left. That means 14 hits, at 2000 damage each, at best… That’s 28k damage… You can heal for ~9k of that resulting in a net loss of 19k damage… And that’s the first 10 seconds of the fight… Now, the luck part comes in… Because Salazan will either start throwing a couple of fireballs on you which is easily avoided, but for the most part, he’ll just throw another fire ring on you… Except this time, you have 1, perhaps 2 dodges… And you’re dead… But hey, we have more skills to consider. We can be inv for a couple of secs, so let’s add that too… Well the inv is 6 seconds. So we can actually avoid all damage from the first ring… But then we take full damage from the second ring, so it’s still a death at that point… So in essence, the only way for rangers to kill, is to kill prior to that second ring being cast… Which is, as I said before… 100% based on luck… There’s zero skill involved in that because we have no way of influencing when that is being cast…

showtime.9175:

and another funny thing is that so much skills just dont work. skills like taking no damage or pain inverter and much more….

The take no damage, or even invul skills have zero effect on scripted instakills such as the fire ring or the adds on last that much is correct… But that is also understandable really… Personally, I just hate people portraying gimmick fights, as skill, when they’re actually just relying on some specific mechanics… Look at Alpha as an example… That’s a much better example of difficult fights, that isnt just relying on some specific gimmick… Not saying Alpha is all that hard, but it’s a fight where the difficulty really is in the hands of the player and not just purely random…

Bovinity.8610:

Im sorry that you have not played a ranger yet… Rangers CANNOT continiously dodge like that… At best we have Vigor+50% extra regen… That gives 2 dodges, and then at minimum, another 3 seconds before the next dodge is possible… Given optimal conditions… Given the right weapons or skills, we can get another dodge or two in, and then only have 1-2 seconds of not being able to dodge… These dodges however are highly limited in direction and range. It’s not a viable option during Salazan, so that leaves two dodges before the 3 second window of not being able to… Now, we can have a sigil that gives full energy, giving us another 2 dodges… At which point we’re still back no dodges… Now, here’s the kicker… Assuming you’re running a fully defensive build, a ranger have ~24k HP. Salazans fire, hit you twice per second for 2000-2500 damage, for 10 seconds… You have at best 4 dodges giving you 3 seconds of immunity provided you are lucky enough to not get hit inbetween the dodges, which with twice per second is very common… That’s 7 seconds to go in which you have no dodges left. That means 14 hits, at 2000 damage each, at best… That’s 28k damage… You can heal for ~9k of that resulting in a net loss of 19k damage… And that’s the first 10 seconds of the fight… Now, the luck part comes in… Because Salazan will either start throwing a couple of fireballs on you which is easily avoided, but for the most part, he’ll just throw another fire ring on you… Except this time, you have 1, perhaps 2 dodges… And you’re dead… But hey, we have more skills to consider. We can be inv for a couple of secs, so let’s add that too… Well the inv is 6 seconds. So we can actually avoid all damage from the first ring… But then we take full damage from the second ring, so it’s still a death at that point… So in essence, the only way for rangers to kill, is to kill prior to that second ring being cast… Which is, as I said before… 100% based on luck… There’s zero skill involved in that because we have no way of influencing when that is being cast…

Which challenge? To survive the second ring of fire? Please, do tell how if you manage it… And then I dont just mean “I did it”… An actual breakdown of the fight…

Just did it with my nec. Think the encounter design is really cheat mode NPC at ts finest. Brings back memories from D3 crappy oneshot gameplay in inferno in the first week.

Tipps for other necs: use mark of doom or wh daze if you have to pick up an orb in the middle of a group of shadow clones.
Play power with 30/0/0/0/15, doesn’t matter where you put the rest of the points.
Once phase 2 hits pop lich and kite close to the center of the arena (shorter ways to get out of the gtaoe) and spam 1 like a madman without facing requirements (lich shoots targets behind him too).

Gibson.4036:

Haven’t played the content yet, so I can’t judge, but one thing did strike me as interesting.

“Adjust your build” is pretty common advice, but I suddenly remembered something I haven’t thought about for a while. ANet has defended the hassle of having to find an NPC and pay a little money to respec by telling us that they want a sense of permanence in our builds. Our builds are supposed to reflect our play style and who our character is, not be something we easily swap out (with the exception of traits within the same line) with ease.

When people talk about swapping out the right builds for the content, are they talking about switching out weapon, utilities, and traits, or are they talking about investing in different trait lines?

And there is one of my problems with this content, because many of these fights (especially the last one) rely on a very, very, ‘you better not be even a little off’ specific build for some classes in order to complete. so yeah, you will be spending alot of time and gold running back to the pay money to reset your traits until you hit the sweet spot as Anet intended to kill these bosses the way they want you to.

And I feel bad for about 90% of the players in Guild Wars 2 right now. Many of them own only 1 or 2 full sets of exotic gear (and one of them is normally magic find gear). I have 6 full sets thanks to a precursor I found a few months ago, so I can change my build around pretty much as I please, most other players can’t do that unless they buy cheaper, inferior gear, and they will probably never be able to finish all the content in this release.

I’m not sure how many Testers with how many Classes and how many different Builds in those classes were able to complete the fight, and I am also not sure if they could repeat the results for redundancy or if they just did the fight once and said it was good.

All that said, This is still better and more doable than Tier 4 of the candidate Trials (where 99% of the playerbase, including me, stayed in the back pulling the plunderers, and there was no strategy other than that or any real specific build required)

Edit: Oh yeah, I also forgot, You can’t pick up enviromental weapons in the ring, which prevents you from using an entire family of pets(pigs) if you are a Ranger. It bugs out and disappears from your hands. So, yeah, I still stand by my statement that Anet wants us play the way ‘They’ want us to play. (the two pig pets that give you boons that way, like stealth, invulnerability, etc, would have be VERY useful. just saying…)

mtpelion.4562:

Not temporary. This is recurring content.

You can try again next year.

While it’s recurring, there are high chances the achievement rewards will change in future instances (same with Halloween, Wintersday or the Dragon Bash), so he can complain about not being able to get that mini.

I haven’t tried this yet so I can’t judge how hard it is, but I’ve said many times that hard content is fine, temporal content is fine, but hard temporal content is not. The mini looks very good and it would be a pity to miss the chance to get it.

Fancia.3746:

words

rangers are the kings of evades just after s/d thieves lol what planet do you live on.

try s/d with points into wilderness

The game delivers difficulty through cheesing rather than challenge. Instagibs by themselves aren’t bad, but when you combine them with poor telegraphing, this game’s fetish with instant cast AoE (no telegraphing them beforehand) and generally poor attack design (auto tracking missiles that deal ludicrous damage, hitboxes don’t synch to animations), it becomes a kitteneesey. You’d thinking this is something they’d address since launch, but nope! They design more stuff with that mentality…

TwoBit.5903:

The game delivers difficulty through cheesing rather than challenge. Instagibs by themselves aren’t bad, but when you combine them with poor telegraphing, this game’s fetish with instant cast AoE (no telegraphing them beforehand) and generally poor attack design (auto tracking missiles that deal ludicrous damage, hitboxes don’t synch to animations), it becomes a kitteneesey. You’d thinking this is something they’d address since launch, but nope! They design more stuff with that mentality…

Well, not really, the attack have telegraphs, problem is you cannot see them because of the camera and the freaking stroke/blind attack.

Cures.7451:

On the first day everything is always veeery impossible for you guys
in some days, when better players show you how easily its beaten, only half of you will rage on. and the other half will start copying builds from people that know what theyre doing. Or didn’t you beat the trials t4 in the end? if not, this is just not meant for you. go on.

Anet said 6 people out of 100 completed this, it should go back to drawing board, minimum should be 25.

Anet has no idea how to properly make chalenging content, they just throw anything that comes to their minds with 1 hit kills mechanics being on top of their favourites list closely followed by overwhelming numbers and hope fot the best.

Please do show me video of someone completing T4 trials with 50 mob kills (gold medal). None? So many people were screaming l2p, throwing their “wisdom” left and right, etc yet no one got it right? I wonder why…..

If they want to make content for 6% of their playerbase i hope they won’t mind of rest of us will go somewhere else.

and show me 1 guy who can multiply times do last boss with 8 crystal ^^ no one, because of pure RNG

Fancia.3746:

Bovinity.8610:

Im sorry that you have not played a ranger yet… Rangers CANNOT continiously dodge like that… At best we have Vigor+50% extra regen… That gives 2 dodges, and then at minimum, another 3 seconds before the next dodge is possible… Given optimal conditions… Given the right weapons or skills, we can get another dodge or two in, and then only have 1-2 seconds of not being able to dodge… These dodges however are highly limited in direction and range. It’s not a viable option during Salazan, so that leaves two dodges before the 3 second window of not being able to… Now, we can have a sigil that gives full energy, giving us another 2 dodges… At which point we’re still back no dodges… Now, here’s the kicker… Assuming you’re running a fully defensive build, a ranger have ~24k HP. Salazans fire, hit you twice per second for 2000-2500 damage, for 10 seconds… You have at best 4 dodges giving you 3 seconds of immunity provided you are lucky enough to not get hit inbetween the dodges, which with twice per second is very common… That’s 7 seconds to go in which you have no dodges left. That means 14 hits, at 2000 damage each, at best… That’s 28k damage… You can heal for ~9k of that resulting in a net loss of 19k damage… And that’s the first 10 seconds of the fight… Now, the luck part comes in… Because Salazan will either start throwing a couple of fireballs on you which is easily avoided, but for the most part, he’ll just throw another fire ring on you… Except this time, you have 1, perhaps 2 dodges… And you’re dead… But hey, we have more skills to consider. We can be inv for a couple of secs, so let’s add that too… Well the inv is 6 seconds. So we can actually avoid all damage from the first ring… But then we take full damage from the second ring, so it’s still a death at that point… So in essence, the only way for rangers to kill, is to kill prior to that second ring being cast… Which is, as I said before… 100% based on luck… There’s zero skill involved in that because we have no way of influencing when that is being cast…

Which challenge? To survive the second ring of fire? Please, do tell how if you manage it… And then I dont just mean “I did it”… An actual breakdown of the fight…

I did this on necro and that profession has less dodge ability than ranger. At least you actually have access to vigor. I also survived a 2nd fire ring. You don’t need to be continually dodging. You need to strafe out of the way of what’s coming toward you. It took me a couple of tries, no I don’t feel it is easy, but I certainly know you can’t blame dodging.

Sorry but this is actually a l2p issue and not an issue with your profession.

Lucyfer.9517:

Anet has no idea how to properly make chalenging content, they just throw anything that comes to their minds with 1 hit kills mechanics being on top of their favourites list closely followed by overwhelming numbers and hope fot the best.

You forgot knockdown spam.

Lothirieth.3408:

I did this on necro.

Screenshot or didnt happen.

Andele.1306:

Lothirieth.3408:

I did this on necro.

Screenshot or didnt happen.

For Salazan, which the person I replied to is complaining about? Srsly?? Considering there are other necros who have made it to the final boss (I’m one away.. needed a break), I hardly think that’s necessary :P

wow, this sounds stupid… Seriously? It is getting old to have all the “challenge” be NPCs that essentially break all the normal rules of combat. Moves that do insane amounts of damage, insta-casts, huge health pools, immunity to CC..

i mean.. what’s the point of all these abilities we have when the Boss design essentially revolves around different ways of nullifying our abilities?

The camera really is atrocious. What were they thinking? This is difficult but for all the wrong reasons.

Lothirieth.3408:

Andele.1306:

Lothirieth.3408:

I did this on necro.

Screenshot or didnt happen.

For Salazan, which the person I replied to is complaining about? Srsly?? Considering there are other necros who have made it to the final boss (I’m one away.. needed a break), I hardly think that’s necessary :P

No for the necros, i mean i got it (and posted) but i still think it was 60% luck 30% skill 10% painful muscle memory… Especially since the blinds hit when i knew that the blobs wouldnt hit me and i managed to avoid all orbs in phase 2.

Fungalfoot.7213:

The camera really is atrocious. What were they thinking? This is difficult but for all the wrong reasons.

Anet talks about telegraphed moves, and emphazized how much they playtested this in their livestream on monday, but you can’t even see half of them when the camera refuses to cooperate with you. I mean seriously, the camera….I haven’t had a major camera issue in a video game since atleast the PS2 era of gaming,….8 years ago….atleast until now.

If I were to make any suggestion at all, Like seriously, at all (I still stand by the criticisms I made a few posts ago), They need to do the same thing they have with the Airships in the last dungeon in the game, where they made it to where the camera isn’t an issue at all because there is nothing in the way preventing you from zooming in and out?

I have to wonder if any Norn or Charr characters have sucessfully done this all the way through yet, since your character blocks half of the screen anyways?

Fancia.3746:

Stark.1350:

Why don’t you noobs try changing your builds?

So, please, do tell what build a ranger use to survive Salazan with skill rather than pure luck?

You must suck on ranger then if you couldn’t beat him lol….God help you when you reach some of the other bosses then! All trolling aside I used GS and axe/axe and did fine. This is what I used to beat him:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fMAQNAR3XjIVJ2dVGWs2Bi2jMZJMxPcIPD/jqKm7B-j0yAYrIjvAIKwkFAiEUCsIasVwioxqsxUuRW7ioeDKA-w

Andele.1306:

Lothirieth.3408:

Andele.1306:

Lothirieth.3408:

I did this on necro.

Screenshot or didnt happen.

For Salazan, which the person I replied to is complaining about? Srsly?? Considering there are other necros who have made it to the final boss (I’m one away.. needed a break), I hardly think that’s necessary :P

No for the necros, i mean i got it (and posted) but i still think it was 60% luck 30% skill 10% painful muscle memory… Especially since the blinds hit when i knew that the blobs wouldnt hit me and i managed to avoid all orbs in phase 2.

Again, the person I was responding too was complaining about completing Salazan on ranger due to lack of dodges… not Liadra. Please actually read what I’m posting.

Lokheit.7943:

mtpelion.4562:

Not temporary. This is recurring content.

You can try again next year.

While it’s recurring, there are high chances the achievement rewards will change in future instances (same with Halloween, Wintersday or the Dragon Bash), so he can complain about not being able to get that mini.

I haven’t tried this yet so I can’t judge how hard it is, but I’ve said many times that hard content is fine, temporal content is fine, but hard temporal content is not. The mini looks very good and it would be a pity to miss the chance to get it.

Pretty much this. Tying direct and indirect (achi boxes and all that) rewards to temporary achievements and content that are very hard (or, in this case, that require luck) is a really BAD idea, and it discriminates a big chunk of your playerbase (those that don’t have time to be 24/7 learning the fight, or those that are slower to do so, for example).

I’m all for hard things but, for God’s sake, don’t put them in temporary content UNLESS it’s recurring AND you can guarantee that all rewards will be obtainable again by then. If you can’t, stop doing this, please.

shimmerless.4560:

Fancia.3746:

words

rangers are the kings of evades just after s/d thieves lol what planet do you live on.

try s/d with points into wilderness

We’re the kings of movement, not evades… We have plenty of movement stuff but even assuming a the full amount of dodges, it’s simply not possible to dodge all the fires in the rings… Each dodge is 3/4 of a second… Even assuming all 3 supportskills was dodges, which we dont actually have… Combined with 2 dodges from weapon, and then another 2 from sigil on weapon swap… And then another dodge from the time it takes to regenerate the energy for that… That’s still 8 dodges… While indeed that’s quite nice, it’s simply not enough unless you have those 8 dodges for the next ring as well, which you dont have because 4 of those rely on cooldowns… 3 directly and 1 from the regen while using those… So you’re still screwed if not killing before the second ring…

Lothirieth.3408:

Andele.1306:

Lothirieth.3408:

I did this on necro.

Screenshot or didnt happen.

For Salazan, which the person I replied to is complaining about? Srsly?? Considering there are other necros who have made it to the final boss (I’m one away.. needed a break), I hardly think that’s necessary :P

No… I was the one commenting on it being the same for RANGERS on Salazan… Necros are not having to rely as on pure luck for Salazan, rangers do…

Setun.4368:

Fancia.3746:

Stark.1350:

Why don’t you noobs try changing your builds?

So, please, do tell what build a ranger use to survive Salazan with skill rather than pure luck?

You must suck on ranger then if you couldn’t beat him lol….God help you when you reach some of the other bosses then! All trolling aside I used GS and axe/axe and did fine. This is what I used to beat him:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fMAQNAR3XjIVJ2dVGWs2Bi2jMZJMxPcIPD/jqKm7B-j0yAYrIjvAIKwkFAiEUCsIasVwioxqsxUuRW7ioeDKA-w

So another “I did it” reply… Instead of the actual breakdown as asked for…

So ok… You’re using stone spirit, which is completely useless on Salazan as it’s dead the instant you summon it… Traits, you’re running basicly the same as I am… Minor diffrences in gear setup, except we’re using diffrent weapons normally but I’ve tried the GS as well… For Salazan, that’s completely useless…

So you still havnt explained which magic you’re using to get unlimited energy for the massive amounts of evade that is claimed to be needed…

I wonder why people are not helpful if you’re such a respectful and nice person?

salazan can be done without vigour or swiftness or even a movement speed sigil. why? because that’s how I did it – my mesmer had vigour but I avoided dodging as much as I could.

first off: don’t try to leave the ring. the ring is your space limiter and you have to stay inside.
secondly: the ground below your feet gets warm, so you have to move around while not moving into areas still hot from before (spiraling or just zigzagging)
and lastly: the fire attacks moving towards you are pretty slow and can be avoided by walking alone. this also reduces the risk of dodgeing into the flame ring or another projectile. stay on the safe side though, as their hitbox is pretty large.

that’s all that’s necessary to win this fight. just move around while autoattacking salazan.

if you can’t do this after several tries, then the gauntlet isn’t for you. either you can get better or you have to accept the fact that there are parts of the game you will not be able to do.

next time, try to ask nicely instead of insulting the people giving you help and you might get an answer sooner.

Fancia.3746:

-snip-

Now I know that you mentioned Salazan and the lack of dodges you have, I felt that I should note that it is perfectly possible to beat him without dodging at all.

Fancia.3746:

Stark.1350:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/jubilee/Liadri-the-Concealing-Darkness-tactic/first#post2569442

Im sorry that you have not played a ranger yet… Rangers CANNOT continiously dodge like that… At best we have Vigor+50% extra regen… That gives 2 dodges, and then at minimum, another 3 seconds before the next dodge is possible… Given optimal conditions… Given the right weapons or skills, we can get another dodge or two in, and then only have 1-2 seconds of not being able to dodge… These dodges however are highly limited in direction and range. It’s not a viable option during Salazan, so that leaves two dodges before the 3 second window of not being able to… Now, we can have a sigil that gives full energy, giving us another 2 dodges… At which point we’re still back no dodges… Now, here’s the kicker… Assuming you’re running a fully defensive build, a ranger have ~24k HP. Salazans fire, hit you twice per second for 2000-2500 damage, for 10 seconds… You have at best 4 dodges giving you 3 seconds of immunity provided you are lucky enough to not get hit inbetween the dodges, which with twice per second is very common… That’s 7 seconds to go in which you have no dodges left. That means 14 hits, at 2000 damage each, at best… That’s 28k damage… You can heal for ~9k of that resulting in a net loss of 19k damage… And that’s the first 10 seconds of the fight… Now, the luck part comes in… Because Salazan will either start throwing a couple of fireballs on you which is easily avoided, but for the most part, he’ll just throw another fire ring on you… Except this time, you have 1, perhaps 2 dodges… And you’re dead… But hey, we have more skills to consider. We can be inv for a couple of secs, so let’s add that too… Well the inv is 6 seconds. So we can actually avoid all damage from the first ring… But then we take full damage from the second ring, so it’s still a death at that point… So in essence, the only way for rangers to kill, is to kill prior to that second ring being cast… Which is, as I said before… 100% based on luck… There’s zero skill involved in that because we have no way of influencing when that is being cast…

Beat Salazan on my ranger first try. Didn’t think he was tough at all.

I used full berserker gear and runes of ogre.
Went in with longbow/shortbow.
Traits set up 30/20/20/10/0

Don’t even need to dodge. Stay in the ring of fire and avoid your fire tail. It’s like playing Snake. Hit your tail – you die.

Oranisagu.3706:

I wonder why people are not helpful if you’re such a respectful and nice person?

salazan can be done without vigour or swiftness or even a movement speed sigil. why? because that’s how I did it – my mesmer had vigour but I avoided dodging as much as I could.

first off: don’t try to leave the ring. the ring is your space limiter and you have to stay inside.
secondly: the ground below your feet gets warm, so you have to move around while not moving into areas still hot from before (spiraling or just zigzagging)
and lastly: the fire attacks moving towards you are pretty slow and can be avoided by walking alone. this also reduces the risk of dodgeing into the flame ring or another projectile. stay on the safe side though, as their hitbox is pretty large.

that’s all that’s necessary to win this fight. just move around while autoattacking salazan.

if you can’t do this after several tries, then the gauntlet isn’t for you. either you can get better or you have to accept the fact that there are parts of the game you will not be able to do.

next time, try to ask nicely instead of insulting the people giving you help and you might get an answer sooner.

I know it can be done… I’ve done it… Is it a challenge? No… Not really… Is it dependant on skill? No, not really… Is it dependant on any factor beside luck as a ranger? nope… The gimmick to the ring, is dependant on block, which rangers dont actually have except for one GS skill which can only block melee attacks… Without block, there’s basicly nothing you can do aside from being lucky… Either by not having a second ring cast right after the first… Or with the pattern he sends the waves as… If he sends in certain patterns, you’re either dead or using every CD you have to stay alive once… And then you have nothing for the second ring which he’ll just repeat the same pattern…

Lue.6538:

Fancia.3746:

-snip-

Now I know that you mentioned Salazan and the lack of dodges you have, I felt that I should note that it is perfectly possible to beat him without dodging at all.

I know… The dodges was in reply to the person saying that the mechanic to beat him was to dodge, dodge, dodge… Dodges is just one of the ways to handle a single ring of his waves being in “the wrong” pattern… I’ve said it before… My comments on Salazan is in no way that I find him hard… Not at all… Im just saying it’s 100% luck based, rather than skill based… It’s either super simple because you’re in luck, or it’s impossible that try, because you’re not… There’s no skill involved in it at all…

WatchTheShow.7203:

Fancia.3746:

Stark.1350:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/jubilee/Liadri-the-Concealing-Darkness-tactic/first#post2569442

Im sorry that you have not played a ranger yet… Rangers CANNOT continiously dodge like that… At best we have Vigor+50% extra regen… That gives 2 dodges, and then at minimum, another 3 seconds before the next dodge is possible… Given optimal conditions… Given the right weapons or skills, we can get another dodge or two in, and then only have 1-2 seconds of not being able to dodge… These dodges however are highly limited in direction and range. It’s not a viable option during Salazan, so that leaves two dodges before the 3 second window of not being able to… Now, we can have a sigil that gives full energy, giving us another 2 dodges… At which point we’re still back no dodges… Now, here’s the kicker… Assuming you’re running a fully defensive build, a ranger have ~24k HP. Salazans fire, hit you twice per second for 2000-2500 damage, for 10 seconds… You have at best 4 dodges giving you 3 seconds of immunity provided you are lucky enough to not get hit inbetween the dodges, which with twice per second is very common… That’s 7 seconds to go in which you have no dodges left. That means 14 hits, at 2000 damage each, at best… That’s 28k damage… You can heal for ~9k of that resulting in a net loss of 19k damage… And that’s the first 10 seconds of the fight… Now, the luck part comes in… Because Salazan will either start throwing a couple of fireballs on you which is easily avoided, but for the most part, he’ll just throw another fire ring on you… Except this time, you have 1, perhaps 2 dodges… And you’re dead… But hey, we have more skills to consider. We can be inv for a couple of secs, so let’s add that too… Well the inv is 6 seconds. So we can actually avoid all damage from the first ring… But then we take full damage from the second ring, so it’s still a death at that point… So in essence, the only way for rangers to kill, is to kill prior to that second ring being cast… Which is, as I said before… 100% based on luck… There’s zero skill involved in that because we have no way of influencing when that is being cast…

Beat Salazan on my ranger first try. Didn’t think he was tough at all.

I used full berserker gear and runes of ogre.
Went in with longbow/shortbow.
Traits set up 30/20/20/10/0

Don’t even need to dodge. Stay in the ring of fire and avoid your fire tail. It’s like playing Snake. Hit your tail – you die.

And yet another not actually reading what I’ve written… I didnt say it was tough… I did not say it was hard… I said it was 100% based on luck… That has NOTHING to do with hard OR easy… Because luck isnt a factor of skill no matter how much some people claim that to be… The entire fight is all about either being lucky, and then he dies with no effort what so ever… Or you’re unlucky, and then you die… The damage done if you’re unlucky, is simply not something that rangers have a skill arsenal to handle more than once… But in no way does that make the fight hard… It’s super easy, but that doesnt change that it’s 100% based on luck…

Fancia.3746:

Oranisagu.3706:

I wonder why people are not helpful if you’re such a respectful and nice person?

salazan can be done without vigour or swiftness or even a movement speed sigil. why? because that’s how I did it – my mesmer had vigour but I avoided dodging as much as I could.

first off: don’t try to leave the ring. the ring is your space limiter and you have to stay inside.
secondly: the ground below your feet gets warm, so you have to move around while not moving into areas still hot from before (spiraling or just zigzagging)
and lastly: the fire attacks moving towards you are pretty slow and can be avoided by walking alone. this also reduces the risk of dodgeing into the flame ring or another projectile. stay on the safe side though, as their hitbox is pretty large.

that’s all that’s necessary to win this fight. just move around while autoattacking salazan.

if you can’t do this after several tries, then the gauntlet isn’t for you. either you can get better or you have to accept the fact that there are parts of the game you will not be able to do.

next time, try to ask nicely instead of insulting the people giving you help and you might get an answer sooner.

I know it can be done… I’ve done it… Is it a challenge? No… Not really… Is it dependant on skill? No, not really… Is it dependant on any factor beside luck as a ranger? nope… The gimmick to the ring, is dependant on block, which rangers dont actually have except for one GS skill which can only block melee attacks… Without block, there’s basicly nothing you can do aside from being lucky… Either by not having a second ring cast right after the first… Or with the pattern he sends the waves as… If he sends in certain patterns, you’re either dead or using every CD you have to stay alive once… And then you have nothing for the second ring which he’ll just repeat the same pattern…

You’re consistently being given statements that contradict your belief, and you’ve consistently decided to brush it off and say “Nope, only luck. All luck, always luck. I don’t care how you did it, it was luck.”

I’m sorry that you’re such a perfect player that nothing we can say to you will help improve you and all of our accomplishments have nothing to do with our skill, but are purely based on luck.

I sincerely don’t understand why people continue to respond.

… I say as I respond.

Kirschwasser.3972:

Fancia.3746:

Oranisagu.3706:

I wonder why people are not helpful if you’re such a respectful and nice person?

salazan can be done without vigour or swiftness or even a movement speed sigil. why? because that’s how I did it – my mesmer had vigour but I avoided dodging as much as I could.

first off: don’t try to leave the ring. the ring is your space limiter and you have to stay inside.
secondly: the ground below your feet gets warm, so you have to move around while not moving into areas still hot from before (spiraling or just zigzagging)
and lastly: the fire attacks moving towards you are pretty slow and can be avoided by walking alone. this also reduces the risk of dodgeing into the flame ring or another projectile. stay on the safe side though, as their hitbox is pretty large.

that’s all that’s necessary to win this fight. just move around while autoattacking salazan.

if you can’t do this after several tries, then the gauntlet isn’t for you. either you can get better or you have to accept the fact that there are parts of the game you will not be able to do.

next time, try to ask nicely instead of insulting the people giving you help and you might get an answer sooner.

I know it can be done… I’ve done it… Is it a challenge? No… Not really… Is it dependant on skill? No, not really… Is it dependant on any factor beside luck as a ranger? nope… The gimmick to the ring, is dependant on block, which rangers dont actually have except for one GS skill which can only block melee attacks… Without block, there’s basicly nothing you can do aside from being lucky… Either by not having a second ring cast right after the first… Or with the pattern he sends the waves as… If he sends in certain patterns, you’re either dead or using every CD you have to stay alive once… And then you have nothing for the second ring which he’ll just repeat the same pattern…

You’re consistently being given statements that contradict your belief, and you’ve consistently decided to brush it off and say “Nope, only luck. All luck, always luck. I don’t care how you did it, it was luck.”

I’m sorry that you’re such a perfect player that nothing we can say to you will help improve you and all of our accomplishments have nothing to do with our skill, but are purely based on luck.

I sincerely don’t understand why people continue to respond.

… I say as I respond.

Im not giving statements that contradict no… You are missunderstanding the statement if you think that…

Nor have I brushed off anything that is relevant… But people responding with “hey it’s easy, just do X”, is not relevant… It has NOTHING to do with what I’ve said… Unless they can give a method to survive the bad streaks, then I stand by my statement that indeed, is is entirely based on luck…

I have also never said Im in any way a perfect player… Im struggling with Deadeye 5 gambits atm which many have done so Im hardly perfect… Far from it… That doesnt in any way change anything that I’ve said… Quite the contrary actually…

i just beat every challenge (boss) with my ranger, cheers. (not every achievement yet, i doubt ill try the 8 orbs, thats pure madness at this point with the bugs and all).

I came to the conclusion the other day that ArenaNet despises their playerbase with a passion. How?

~Stuns.
~More stuns,
~Knockbacks,
~Temporary Content.
~And more Knockbacks.
~Poor/Untelegraphed one-shots.

Fancia.3746:

shimmerless.4560:

Fancia.3746:

words

rangers are the kings of evades just after s/d thieves lol what planet do you live on.

try s/d with points into wilderness

We’re the kings of movement, not evades… We have plenty of movement stuff but even assuming a the full amount of dodges, it’s simply not possible to dodge all the fires in the rings… Each dodge is 3/4 of a second… Even assuming all 3 supportskills was dodges, which we dont actually have… Combined with 2 dodges from weapon, and then another 2 from sigil on weapon swap… And then another dodge from the time it takes to regenerate the energy for that… That’s still 8 dodges… While indeed that’s quite nice, it’s simply not enough unless you have those 8 dodges for the next ring as well, which you dont have because 4 of those rely on cooldowns… 3 directly and 1 from the regen while using those… So you’re still screwed if not killing before the second ring…

I beat salazan with my berserker d/d elementalist…that’s a melee class…just strafe left and right when he throws out fire lol.

It is possible, but it is very hard. I think they wanted it to be hard haha. Took me 35 tries and 6g of sprockets and frustrating camera angles to do it. Granted I did it by taking advantage of infinite swiftness and vigro with blocks and invurnablities. The necro of which, has none. Sorry necros, I feel bad for you all.

Fancia.3746:

Lue.6538:

Now I know that you mentioned Salazan and the lack of dodges you have, I felt that I should note that it is perfectly possible to beat him without dodging at all.

I know… The dodges was in reply to the person saying that the mechanic to beat him was to dodge, dodge, dodge… Dodges is just one of the ways to handle a single ring of his waves being in “the wrong” pattern… I’ve said it before… My comments on Salazan is in no way that I find him hard… Not at all… Im just saying it’s 100% luck based, rather than skill based… It’s either super simple because you’re in luck, or it’s impossible that try, because you’re not… There’s no skill involved in it at all…

Salazan puts down a ring of fire arround you then proceeds with firing “waves of fire” right at you, if you wait for the wave to be just about to reach you before you take a step to the side and repeat this process, there will be nothing luckbased about it as you will constantly have room to move within that ring of fire while still avoiding his groundtargeted spell… There’s no luck involved in it at all…

I honestly have no idea why so many people are complaining about this. Its completely doable and the insane difficulty on Liadri is refreshing and to me it was one of those things that you cant really get mad at cuz you respect how crazy it is (again, to me).

The whole “its impossible for Necro” thing also makes no sense to me considering I watched a Necro consistently beat her easily. He saw the pattern of the aoe and just layed on conditions while running. Was able to save his dodges for when she leaped at him and then cleansed any cripple or weakness put on him. Sounds like a l2p issue to me. Its supposed to be hard.

Fancia.3746:

Nor have I brushed off anything that is relevant… But people responding with “hey it’s easy, just do X”, is not relevant… It has NOTHING to do with what I’ve said… Unless they can give a method to survive the bad streaks, then I stand by my statement that indeed, is is entirely based on luck…

actually, you just brushed off my whole post, which in detail explained how to beat salazar without any luck or dodgeing. swiftness is a nice bonus but not necessary.. even though a ranger has good swiftness access anyway.

you’re continuing to ignore all the facts while you make up stories nobody believes anyway, except you might have convinced yourself.

Fancia.3746:

WatchTheShow.7203:

Fancia.3746:

Stark.1350:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/jubilee/Liadri-the-Concealing-Darkness-tactic/first#post2569442

Im sorry that you have not played a ranger yet… Rangers CANNOT continiously dodge like that… At best we have Vigor+50% extra regen… That gives 2 dodges, and then at minimum, another 3 seconds before the next dodge is possible… Given optimal conditions… Given the right weapons or skills, we can get another dodge or two in, and then only have 1-2 seconds of not being able to dodge… These dodges however are highly limited in direction and range. It’s not a viable option during Salazan, so that leaves two dodges before the 3 second window of not being able to… Now, we can have a sigil that gives full energy, giving us another 2 dodges… At which point we’re still back no dodges… Now, here’s the kicker… Assuming you’re running a fully defensive build, a ranger have ~24k HP. Salazans fire, hit you twice per second for 2000-2500 damage, for 10 seconds… You have at best 4 dodges giving you 3 seconds of immunity provided you are lucky enough to not get hit inbetween the dodges, which with twice per second is very common… That’s 7 seconds to go in which you have no dodges left. That means 14 hits, at 2000 damage each, at best… That’s 28k damage… You can heal for ~9k of that resulting in a net loss of 19k damage… And that’s the first 10 seconds of the fight… Now, the luck part comes in… Because Salazan will either start throwing a couple of fireballs on you which is easily avoided, but for the most part, he’ll just throw another fire ring on you… Except this time, you have 1, perhaps 2 dodges… And you’re dead… But hey, we have more skills to consider. We can be inv for a couple of secs, so let’s add that too… Well the inv is 6 seconds. So we can actually avoid all damage from the first ring… But then we take full damage from the second ring, so it’s still a death at that point… So in essence, the only way for rangers to kill, is to kill prior to that second ring being cast… Which is, as I said before… 100% based on luck… There’s zero skill involved in that because we have no way of influencing when that is being cast…

Beat Salazan on my ranger first try. Didn’t think he was tough at all.

I used full berserker gear and runes of ogre.
Went in with longbow/shortbow.
Traits set up 30/20/20/10/0

Don’t even need to dodge. Stay in the ring of fire and avoid your fire tail. It’s like playing Snake. Hit your tail – you die.

And yet another not actually reading what I’ve written… I didnt say it was tough… I did not say it was hard… I said it was 100% based on luck… That has NOTHING to do with hard OR easy… Because luck isnt a factor of skill no matter how much some people claim that to be… The entire fight is all about either being lucky, and then he dies with no effort what so ever… Or you’re unlucky, and then you die… The damage done if you’re unlucky, is simply not something that rangers have a skill arsenal to handle more than once… But in no way does that make the fight hard… It’s super easy, but that doesnt change that it’s 100% based on luck…

So I finally got sick and tired of you insulting other people’s success at this boss and invalidating all their hard work by calling it completely “luck based” and decided to do a bit of an experiment.

I went back on my ranger, without changing any traits, without any optimization, without any food buffs, and decided to try the “100% luck” Salazan boss.
And guess what? I one shotted it. I didn’t even need to dodge.

ALL I had to do (and listen up, because I’m about to explain what you need to do to finish this fight) is strafe. If you stay still the fire patches will kill you. If you stay still the traveling fire wave will kill you. Simply strafe around the ring until it dissipates, keep moving, and continue to kill him with a shortbow (which I wasn’t even specced for).

I did this on one of my least played characters, 41 hours played compared to the 2500 on my ele and 100+ on other characters.

My conclusion? This is 100% a l2p issue. You need to practice with your class until you’re able to succeed with your own skill and not with “luck.”

Just pointing out that there was a picture of someone doing Liadri on a lvl 2 necro somewhere in these forums.

The fight is (apart from camera issues) completely skill based.

No, the good players are sadistic.
They want the game to be harder because they want to “a challenge” and because they want other people to recognize they have “the skill”. As the result, the game becomes because harder and harder to keep the good players from being bored.
But if everything is going to be too hard (like this boss), the (large) majority of players will leave as they will feel the content of this game is not for them. These “noobs” are the main people who pay the bill of Arenet as they don’t play 24h/7d and don’t have the gold to buy the “top” stuffs.

Kiriakulos.1690:

Unless you’re on a Necro you have 0 right to complain.
DS now overflows and we have NO blocks, NO invuls, NO vigor, NO sustain, NO mobility.

If a Necro did this, he was lucky or still had DS when it didn’t overflow attacks.

I did it on my necro… It was hard at first… till you notice the safe spot in Lidria’s second phase shifts counter-clockwise EVERY drop. Just get in the safe spot once, and keep running along the wall with it kiting her. I used a cond/rabid necro with a scepter/dagger, for a quick and easy win:)

I beat liadri on my condition necro. I felt like many of the posters here for awhile, like necs were kitten in this fight(with no vigor they r a little). but once you learn liadri’s patterns she does the same things everytime. You just need to learn where her aoe drops so you can move to the next safe spot. Took me over 50 tries to learn this tho…

yesfourme.8906:

No, the good players are sadistic.
They want the game to be harder because they want to “a challenge” and because they want other people to recognize they have “the skill”. As the result, the game becomes because harder and harder to keep the good players from being bored.
But if everything is going to be too hard (like this boss), the (large) majority of players will leave as they will feel the content of this game is not for them.

“But if everything is going to be too hard…”
Yea…you lost me there. All of these fights, with the exception of Liadri, range from easy to moderate difficulty.

People think that as players they should be entitled to getting every single achievement in every single category. But guess what people? They’re “achievements”. In MMOs the term ‘achievements" has been watered down so much that they reward you for killing “X amount of critters” or eating “Y amount of food items”. I’m glad Anet is finally making content that players have to actually WORK towards, instead of completing it in one or two tries and then patting themselves on the back like they earned something.

If all achievements are accessible to every player, then it is no longer an acheivement, instead we’re left with a laundry lists of tasks to complete so we can give ourselves little e-medals.

Anet creates a lot of casual content, and I’m glad that they’re finally starting to branch out and create some bosses that not everyone will be able to complete. I say that not because I want the winners to brag about their success, but because I think it’s a healthy dose of reality for those that came up short to realize that you can’t win every challenge, and not everything will be spoon-fed to you.

Don’t start acting as though Anet is suddenly disregarding the casual player and catering only to the “hardcore” crowd. Most of the stuff in this game is accessible to the casual player, so why not have a boss or two for those with the will to keep trying?

OMNIBUS.2913:

I beat liadri on my condition necro. I felt like many of the posters here for awhile, like necs were kitten in this fight(with no vigor they r a little). but once you learn liadri’s patterns she does the same things everytime. You just need to learn where her aoe drops so you can move to the next safe spot. Took me over 50 tries to learn this tho…

LOL that’s exactly how I felt! I was having a hell of time, then I was watching someone else dodge her AE in phase 2 and noticed the safe spots were ALWAYS rotating along the wall… next try… I win

Noctes.2537:

Don’t start acting as though Anet is suddenly disregarding the casual player and catering only to the “hardcore” crowd. Most of the stuff in this game is accessible to the casual player, so why not have a boss or two for those with the will to keep trying?

First: accomplishments affect your account (ex: magic find).
Second: Gw2 was aimed at casual players. That’s been said, I understand you want something worth you game time (after all the nerfs of Arah p4, CM story, fire elemental boss, etc…). This boss feels a bit too hard and too random imho, and it is at the limit of what I can do. And please don’t act like it is the first time you got something “hard”: We had the mad king jumping puzzle, the winter puzzle, AR dungeon, fractal level 80, etc…