I’m sure plenty of you have noticed that if you are launched or knocked down, your character feels like it just lays there for a good full second before getting up.
And you can’t cleanse / remove either CC because they’re not registered as ‘Conditions’. The only way to deal with it is Stability, which is quite limited in sources.
I don’t know about you all, but I find this greatly dissatisfying to sit through repeatedly in combat. It just feels very inconsistent, whereas all other areas of combat are fairly fluid (even things like immobilizes and fears)
Arena Net, my suggestion is:
I would like to be able to expend the endurance-cost for a dodge roll to be able to be able to do a tumbling move
If on the ground (from knock down), the character will roll immediately, but for half the distance of a normal roll
If in the air (from being launched), the character will tuck and land on their feet instead of getting completely knocked down
I feel this would make combat against KD-heavy mobs and players much more fluid and high-depth if we gain the choice to sacrifice evasion for recovery from.
If you like this idea, please show your support with a post.
If you don’t like it, feel free to post feedback.
This idea isn’t set in stone, constructive criticism is always welcome.
“Bleeding, Poison, Confusion, Torment, they all look delightful on you.”
Lv80s: Guard, Thief, Necro. Renewed my Altaholic’s card on the HoT Hype-Train. Choo choo~
I like the idea of dodge being turned into a tuck while being knocked or a tumble when downed, i think it might add a nice layer of depth to PvP or 1v1 duels if they ever decide to add them. They want their system to be very action oriented, so go big or go home i say. Right now, the combat is lacking some serious depth, i feel.
By “tumble when downed”, I’m going to presume you mean ‘knocked down’ and not the ‘Downed State’.
As for depth… “Meh.”
I feel there’s plenty of depth already. Too many players are used to have 30+ skills available at all times, and have mixed up ‘depth’ with ‘complexity’.
If I’ve learned anything from the Riot Games staff on the LoL forums, it’s that complexity does not equate to depth.
For example:
The Thief prof, at first glance, is thought of as a damage dealing type.
But if you look closer, you see a variety of control and support type aspects from Venomous Aura for sharing Basilisk Venom, to Shadow Refuge for cloaking multiple allies in a pinch.
So, even if you were to go up against a team of 5 Thieves in s/tPvP, you could be fighting a very will balanced team between DPS, CC, Support, and the jack-of-all-trades Bunker types.
Complexity is nice too, it’s just not worth the elitism it breeds in games… It always leads to veteran-B screaming at newbie-C because newbie-C has yet to learn such-and-such… :/
And even now, we have a ton of that.
“Bleeding, Poison, Confusion, Torment, they all look delightful on you.”
Lv80s: Guard, Thief, Necro. Renewed my Altaholic’s card on the HoT Hype-Train. Choo choo~
in pvp its bad..
because but would it defeat the knocking purpose of the hammer build players.
in PVE its good because i hate enemies knocking me off…
as far as my 2 main characters are concerned (thief and ranger) roll for initiative can get away from being knocked down and the same goes for lightning reflex skill of the ranger
as far as my 2 main characters are concerned (thief and ranger) roll for initiative can get away from being knocked down and the same goes for lightning reflex skill of the ranger
Neither of those skills allow you to recover from knock down.
They’re just addition dodge rolls backward.
They do not break knock downs – They can only allow you to avoid them entirely if timed correctly.
“Bleeding, Poison, Confusion, Torment, they all look delightful on you.”
Lv80s: Guard, Thief, Necro. Renewed my Altaholic’s card on the HoT Hype-Train. Choo choo~
Sweet Hammer will be nerfed to the point of uselessness.
Not really.
If you make the enemy use up their endurance, that can be considered useful too.
Just depends on how well you plan ahead, instead of betting all your success on a single knock-down.
i actually like that idea, but i’m not sure how much PvP balance would be affected by it. can’t say i don’t like the image of my character swiftly tumbling after being hit.
What the op and many other people here seem not to understand is that all knockdown type abilities are classified as stuns, and therefor any skill with the note: ‘breaks stun’ will get you out of the knockdown.
What the people here are truly missing is. Yes a evading or tumble would defeat a key skill in PvP.
Although most knock downs have a wind up and is easily dodged. I still like the idea and I think it should be put in as I can’t think of how many times I aggro-ed to many ettins and was victim of multiknockdowndeath.
So here is my solution to this, I say put it in the game evade or Tumble, but instead of making it cost 50% endurance like a dodge does make it cost 100% endurance. This way when the Hammer builds in PvP miss the knockdown they are not out of luck with dealing damage as the person can not dodge you for at least 5 to 8 seconds. As the Damage still took effect you just didn’t stun them for 3 to 5 seconds which is about the same time it will take them to get their endurance back anyhow, they just have a chance to fight back is all
As I see this games fighting mechanics more in line with that of your typical fighting game (like mortal kombat, only without the 23 sequence moves) I feel some method of ending a knock down early would be very much appreciated.
You know what, thinking about it made me think back to a movie with a lot of good examples in one fight …. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEfq-Jrj-QE watch the whole fight if you have not seen this before, and you can see alot of real life methods that incorporate into a fight to do exactly what the OP wants with this ….or at least I think he wants this kind of avoidance. Anyway if its anything like the moves Sub Zero pulls out I am for it.
a evading or tumble would defeat a key skill in PvP.
Explained this repeatedly. Knock down wouldn’t be rendered useless.
Scenario 1) You’re out of endurance – Knock down is still effective
Scenario 2) You do not want to tumble, because you need to save your dodge for something else.
This argument that my idea would “defeat” knockdown’s purpose is totally exaggerated.
It’s like saying Dodge defeats the point of skill-shots. NOT TRUE
So here is my solution to this, I say put it in the game evade or Tumble, but instead of making it cost 50% endurance like a dodge does make it cost 100% endurance.
If you have 100% endurance during serious combat for more then 2-3 seconds (excluding Boss PvE where someone else is holding aggro), you’re probably doing something wrong…
Just saying.
“Bleeding, Poison, Confusion, Torment, they all look delightful on you.”
Lv80s: Guard, Thief, Necro. Renewed my Altaholic’s card on the HoT Hype-Train. Choo choo~
You know what, thinking about it made me think back to a movie with a lot of good examples in one fight …. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEfq-Jrj-QE watch the whole fight if you have not seen this before, and you can see alot of real life methods that incorporate into a fight to do exactly what the OP wants with this ….or at least I think he wants this kind of avoidance. Anyway if its anything like the moves Sub Zero pulls out I am for it.
Pretty close.
1:07 – Shirtless guy kicks Ice Ninja and launches him into the air. Ninja flips backward to recover.
“Bleeding, Poison, Confusion, Torment, they all look delightful on you.”
Lv80s: Guard, Thief, Necro. Renewed my Altaholic’s card on the HoT Hype-Train. Choo choo~
By “tumble when downed”, I’m going to presume you mean ‘knocked down’ and not the ‘Downed State’.
As for depth… “Meh.”
I feel there’s plenty of depth already. Too many players are used to have 30+ skills available at all times, and have mixed up ‘depth’ with ‘complexity’.
If I’ve learned anything from the Riot Games staff on the LoL forums, it’s that complexity does not equate to depth.
For example:
The Thief prof, at first glance, is thought of as a damage dealing type.
But if you look closer, you see a variety of control and support type aspects from Venomous Aura for sharing Basilisk Venom, to Shadow Refuge for cloaking multiple allies in a pinch.
So, even if you were to go up against a team of 5 Thieves in s/tPvP, you could be fighting a very will balanced team between DPS, CC, Support, and the jack-of-all-trades Bunker types.
Complexity is nice too, it’s just not worth the elitism it breeds in games… It always leads to veteran-B screaming at newbie-C because newbie-C has yet to learn such-and-such… :/
And even now, we have a ton of that.
Why is it that whenever someone says the combat needs more depth, people immediately scapegoat that old “oh, we dont need 30 skills” garbage? In GW1, you had 8 skills and the customization and tangible effectiveness of your build in that game was deeper than this game could ever hope to achieve without a complete re-vamp.
Why is it that whenever someone says the combat needs more depth, people immediately scapegoat that old “oh, we dont need 30 skills” garbage? In GW1, you had 8 skills and the customization and tangible effectiveness of your build in that game was deeper than this game could ever hope to achieve without a complete re-vamp.
Careful, you’re starting to sound very elitist.
Designers who have worked on GW1 have also stated that it was ridiculously difficult to balance because of all the extra features that allowed for the depth.
If what you say is truly accurate, then It was depth at the cost of clarity and balance.
(That’s bad)
“Bleeding, Poison, Confusion, Torment, they all look delightful on you.”
Lv80s: Guard, Thief, Necro. Renewed my Altaholic’s card on the HoT Hype-Train. Choo choo~
This would need to take 100% of your endurance to be even remotely viable.
Otherwise you would be able to negate almost every single knockdown since your endurance will recharge (to at least 50%) before the knockdown skill recharges.
Which makes knockdown skills completely worthless.
No, slot a utility skill with a break stun skill. THAT is your evade roll.
If you wish to avoid knockdowns build defensively, slot your skills defensively, or suffer the effects of your own inability to prepare.
The ability to do what you want is already there, no need for a change. This is coming from someone that doesn’t even use knockdowns.
