Guild Wars 2

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

How big do you expect a squad to be?
What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

1. As big as possible without being a major restricting factor to the features you can introduce.

2. Living world, stuff like the tower or tequatl in particular, it is just a matter of awareness (also temples).

3. Commented earlier, short version: not really.

LostBalloon.6423:

Thorn.1703:

Regarding the scout point tree, I think the ability should not be to see them on the map, but just within targeting range. Different tiers might be like:
-Tier 1: Shows enemy commander icons within sight every 20 seconds for one second.
-Tier 2: 15 seconds
-Tier 3: 10 seconds
-Tier 4: 5 seconds
-Tier 5: Constantly

That would work with the timer of WvW ticks, every X seconds of it, it would send a ping of the commanders across the map, and anyone with that trait line would see it. You’re the programmers sooo yeah :P

If that would happen, guild groups would go back to running tagless and all the hard work ANET would put in commander tags would go to waist.

If it’s within sight and not on the map… why exactly would guild groups go tagless? the commander is used as a focus point (rally on it, etc). Without it, people would have trouble moving around except to general places (a specific camp or mark in the terrain).

If it doesnt ping it on the map and just shows up above enemy commanders name for a second during those intervals, it’s literally the same thing as clicking the enemy commander yourself and seeing the buff on him. It just speeds the process along. In zergs it would be tough to click it anyways…

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

How big do you expect a squad to be?
What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

1. Why is there a limit? Make it whatever the WvW map limit is. Instead of turning off other tags while in a squad, just take them off the mini-map. That way you can still see other tags on the map screen, but only ‘your’ commander on the mini-map and in-game.

2. pass

3. Yes but it has not accounted for inflation. 100 gold is not what it used to be. It should adjust to gem prices constantly.

Make the UI changes. Sure, we can pick a few small quick changes now, they shouldn’t be too hard to do. But honestly as a commander with over 5000+ hours of game time leading in WvW, commanding pugs/militia/guild groups that has been playing since launch on Tarnished Coast and all through the tiers we’ve been through, all I want is a simple UI that shows my squad members names/class/HP with all the functions of inviting/kicking and manually moving certain classes into parties within the squad (since the change to buffs that was made, it only makes sense). IMHO, that UI system should have been in since launch, and no, squads as they are now are hardly used.

>The icon as it is right now is only used as a physical landmark on the field, used for directions/rally point. It promotes mindless following and lack of intelligent decision making, and unfortunately, is heavily replied upon for full map organization because it has been this way for so long. People are so scared to pop an icon anymore in because it is too much weight… more functions including visibility toggle/different colors/etc would greatly increase the willingness for more people to activate icon, spreading the load and responsibility.

>Spies really aren’t that dangerous if a commander is fully prepared for any situation (which they should, and be ready to adapt). Information from a spy only goes so far, until it gets down to the actual combat… and no spy can tell a zerg how to win a fight. Also, you might argue that it can ruin a golem rush… well true, but then you need to focus up and force the enemy to choose between two evils… force them to lose one objective over the other hitting two objectives at once, and change up your plan accordingly. This makes for good WvW, and is the way it’s mean’t to be played IMO.

>No to Squad benefits. Perhaps things like 5% WXP boost is alright, but really, any good group with a commander will be earning way more WXP then others already. Putting stats onto a radius around a commander… hello? Do I need to remind everyone about original orb buffs? No matter how you put it, that idea is a bad idea. Sure you can prevent solo roamers getting extra advantages by putting a requirement for a certain number of people in a squad before the stats are activated, but that just completely overrides any chance of smaller groups taking on bigger groups at all. Do we really want to snowball the winners winning even more? The bloodlust buffs as they are now are very powerful, both in combat and overall points, but it is a just and fair system. If your server isn’t able to focus and hold in a continued and communal effort, then you don’t deserve it. But merely popping an icon to have an advantage because you potentially grinded and karma trained your way to the benefits is not really thought through.

And let me state: I would be one of the commanders that could probably buy and have all these suggested upgrades with WXP ranks having earned them, and I reject them.

Again, a lot of amazing ideas, but some really not great ones, which is fine. This thread is supposed to be about discussion, but we should also make it known which ones will not work so we can focus on the ones that could be potentially added.

Squad UI. Squad UI. Squad UI. Long term or short term, that is all that really needs to happen.

P.S. It is true that IMO there is only a majority need for functions to squads for WvW as in PvE you can easily pull through with having icons as -just- physical landmarks and rally points, but the squad UI will also help there too. Need a group to do something specific? At least you can communicate that with your squad, and perhaps ask them via squad chat/voice chat/put a waypoint ping unique to that party within your squad to locations that need that party. I would assume that future PvE content will have more moving parts to the overall success, thus making the ability for PvE commanders to separate and keep track of their parties within a squad would greatly help.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

How big do you expect a squad to be?
What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

The question of squad size comes down to functionality that ends up being added to the system.
If it becomes a raid ui like some want I would want the number low like maybe 25. Any more than that and I wouldn’t be able to see from all the health bars. As it is on my old screen buffs can stack well into the center of my play field making the left 3rd of my screen unclickable as it wants to interact with the potraits and by extension the 25 buffs on them.
If you don’t add that and keep it a simple overall text display. Or a bar that shows supply in your squad like a health bar then you could set the squad limit to be as high as the map limit or just above or below. We never have to know for sure but a high limit could work too.

Pve tags are best in Guild missions. In an environment where you can organize ahead of time who will follow who. They are worst in events like Scarlet invasions as many commanders will start but quickly all end up together as the is little prep time to get sorted and make a plan beyond mass zerging. On a semi related note I can understand when events like this start the drop eberything and rush to the zone nature is part of the appeal. But let’s face it given the living story lore shouldn’t we have an early warning system in place by now? I mean beyond the global message. Couldn’t we get the invasion and arrive to a central local on each map with a say 5 minute buffer before the enemy portals are strong enough to open and let mass troops through as a chance to try and coordinate a plan of attack over just ‘omg its timed kill as much as possible with as many people in one place as you can!!’. For more involved scenarios like teq having a moments warning to be able to send the call for people to come fight and organize before the timer is 1/3rd gone would help pve commanding be more than a mobile point of interest.

Money is a great gate for the first tag on an account. 100 is reasonable to keep it from casual buys but not impossible to get with a week or two of determined pursuit. Additional tags for the same account however should be a more casual buy price. IE once you have one commander tag additional tags cost 10g (maybe even as much as 20g) something even easier to earn the Gold for but still enough that you give it a moments thought so it doesn’t become an impulse buy. I am firmly a fan of character based tags but it could be added that accounts that have more than one tag hovering over a tag on the map displays the current characters name but hovering for 3 seconds of more expands the tooltip to display an aka list.

This tooltip expansion I am sure would take a while to add but added advantage is it can be used around the world as a way to inspect objects. This would add depth in lore around the game world. Mouse over to see that this is “blank” stay focused on it to recurve a little more information on it. Potentially flavor text at first but I could see it used to spawn events for staring at a certain character too long or gazing into a cursed object.

On the subject of wxp based trait skills for commanders. I would not be in favor of basic command functions being gated within such a system as using wxp points to gain the tageither leaves you far less useful unless you tag up as you spent all your points on that. That being said if the tag was still gold based then perhaps if your wxp points could be split to one setup while tagged and another when not. This way you could choose the pricey commander expanding skills while still being able to choose basic functionally for when you are not leading.

That being said I could still see commander options being added to wxp. Not a seperate line or anything like that. But instead a sub line to every existing line. This sub line would let’ a commander rebuy a point they already have purchased at 5x or 10x the original cost. Doing so would enable that skill as an aura to all squad members within a certain readouts. For example if a commander takes ram 1 and then pays the amplify cost all squad members would gain that as well if they did not already.

This hybrid system would allow basic command functionality to be seperate from wxp but to be enhanced by it. This would also make it worth while to join a squad without it being a detriment if you don’t to avoid it becoming blob combat that buffs like +wxp would. This would also increase the reputation of commanders that can offer certain buffs so you can spend your personal points on other things. This could also lead to server wide strategy.

edit: I would like to mention to avoid endless power creep of power commanders in the coming years of insane rank make it that you can only utilize one or two auras at a time. so while you can buy them all you wouldn’t be able to supply them to everyone else at once.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Thanks for all the answers might be hard for me to answer everyone but I’m up for a bit any questions I could answer?

How are decisions on designs and ideas reached within ANet? That actually could help with some suggestions.

How many devs completed their Season 1 WvW meta?

Has there been any kind of discussion about a /announce and a macro system for GW2 in the past (not necessarily tied to commanders) that may have been dropped for various reasons?

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Thanks for all the answers might be hard for me to answer everyone but I’m up for a bit any questions I could answer?

Out of the suggestions given so far, how many do you think will be put into action? Which ones? When is the earliest we could see a change to the commander system?

I have a ton of other questions and could talk to you about GW2 for hours. I wish you had some time to do so

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Any questions I could answer?

Sure. I just logged off WvW for the night, and as usual the last thing I did before logging out of GW2 altogether was to create some superior siege and send it to the commander I had been following. He – like most major commanders – relies on donations of siege and gold from players in order to continue being an effective commander.

Is this something you see as a problem? Or working as intended? Or which could be improved?

I do not mind the idea of gating the commander tag behind 100g plus some number of WvW badges+raw rank score (or dungeon tokens or guild commendations). I do mind the idea of having to spend Wxp rank points on commander tag/abilities. Right now, Wxp is really aimed squarely at attack-only; if you scout or defend a lot, or even just run small havok groups around to capture camps and the like, you’re just not rolling in the Wxp.

Those sorts of people do not often tag up, it’s true, as tagging up typically equates to going on the offensive with a largish group. However, I have noticed that often there are downtimes to when there’s an available commander on the map, and it’s quite useful for someone who doesn’t command ALL the time to tag up. Players who don’t command ALL the time are far more likely to have spent their Wxp wisely in other ways that will be more useful to them the 80% of the time they’re not running as a commander. We shouldn’t be penalized for wanting to help, being capable of helping, but not being able to in a limited situation (commanding) because we’ve chosen to be more helpful in other situations (AC/ram mastery, etc).

By the way, the in-game help for commanders is abysmally lacking. I only knew about /supplyinfo from other commanders. I had no idea there was a way to mark waypoints!

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Blackarps.1974:

Out of the suggestions given so far, how many do you think will be put into action? Which ones? When is the earliest we could see a change to the commander system?

I have a ton of other questions and could talk to you about GW2 for hours. I wish you had some time to do so

I think it’s hard to say how many but from the other CDI threads I know they spawn a lot of discussions internally and give a lot of different perspectives on the issue. I think overall this discussions will help shape the feature and backlog list of things to do with commander which could lead to many ideas here spawning improvements. As for time frame thats not really what this thread is for so I’ll dodge roll that question.

Hit me up in game if I’m not doing something I’m always up for discussing/debating. Char name is Izzy or Izzys Rose.

Thanks for getting back! I can tell the discussions in the CDI threads are great and have a lot of great feedback for you guys. Its super important to have developer-customer talks and relationships and I’m glad to see you guys know this. Its what makes a happy community that will stick with you for years to come.

I figured you wouldn’t have a timeframe lol. Its all good, I’m just glad the ball is now rolling a little and we can hopefully get some more news soon about what has been tested. Keep us updated and let me or any of us know if we can help!

I’ll be sure to add you the next time I play. I’m always willing to help out and give ideas, suggestions, concerns.

What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?

Any content where more than five people are doing a given task and there are multiple places to be on the map. Any content in which it’s a good idea for everyone to stand in a single location. In recent memory, the Labyrinth was WAY more difficult to manage without a commander, because someone would have to relay map coordinates for muster points that were not always clear. The Tequatl fight was a good example of wanting players to stack right on top of Commanders, which would be difficult without the tags. The Scarlet Invasions were also greatly benefited by commander tags to focus forces. Basically ANY large scale open world events benefit from having a commander tag involved.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

How big do you expect a squad to be?
What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

Squad size: no limits (besides technical ones of which I don’t know.

Gate: While money can be part of a gate, it is not good enough in my opinion. For wvw I would at least require a certain amount of ranks, like 200 or so. For pve, all world boss achievements (or most of them) may be?

Regarding chat limit: I vote for lifting the chat limit completely. To get a commander icon with my proposed alterations you have to play a while, which is not attractive for gold selling advertisers. The rest, the incurable trolls, you can block or report or both. There are cheaper ways to troll than to invest 100 gold and 200 wvw ranks worth of playing time. But if you are determined to keep a limit, make it dependant from squad size. Commander with no squad: current chat limit. For every member more add 10% to the allowed number of messages. 20 and more members: no limit. That way a gold seller or troll has to acquire 20 people on the map to be able to troll endlessly. If that is possible on a given map, GW2 would have some serious problems with its population…

I don’t think gold should be the only gate for the tag. Maybe incorporate the legendary mentality? 500 badges for a gift followed by a selection of things?

Gift of battle (easy time gate which makes you play wvw for the tag)
Gift of commandment (replaces commanders compendium)
Bloodstone (this gates it based on time spent actually PLAYING the game)
50 mystic coins? Daily system means you have a minimum of 50 dailies done to get it.

Stick that into the forge and you get your tag. Times gates it based on play time rather than just gold sink. Stops troll commanders.

WXP line for commanders is interesting, however it shouldnt give any bonus to direct stats. It should give increased gold drop, magic find, much like the hero banners do when within a radius of said commander. But give it a good range.

I would also like the tags on the map to pulse when I open the map, if it’s off screen, put the icon at the top and make it pulse three times. Much like a map ping on live. Also, I’d like it to flash on the mini map when in combat. Visibility is a big issue at the moment.

Other than that, most things have already been said.

Edit: can we please have a tag on siege on who placed it? It would help with the trolling.

In addition to any shape/color changes to the commander tags, one thing I’d really like to see (speaking as a PUG) is that when the tag is active the commander’s chat is somehow distinctive. Ideally it’d display their chosen tag next to their name in-chat so there’ s an easy correlation between map icon and chat icon but even a sensible color change (e.g. pink tag is pink text) would help tremendously in sifting out orders in the chat.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Thanks for all the answers might be hard for me to answer everyone but I’m up for a bit any questions I could answer?

What are some surprising ideas you have seen suggested so far that you don’t think have been tossed around internally before hand? Just a curiosity

Access to separate visual effect only skills, ground targeted or otherwise, that only your squad members could see so you can indicate/draw on the fly what needs to happen.

eg marking out where to attack or a position to be aware of.

Nike.2631:

Soren.9316:

Alcyone.8695:

No to a special WXP line for commanding. New commanders are already at a large disadvantage in terms of a lack of player support in the field and it would not help them to have a restricted set of tools as compared to other commanders; we want to make it easier for them, not harder.

100% agreeed. We shouldn’t be trying to do anything that will limit/handicap a new commander. It’s hard enough when you pop the icon and have evryone flock to you. If you don’t have all the tools how can you be expected to lead properly? May as well give the new leaders a fair chance at getting things right the first time. Everyone has to start somewhere right?

“Starting somewhere” can and should be at the bottom.

The thing is right now commanders are nearly toothless. They get a map marker and some intel on allies (supply carried). We have the possibility of giving people Tools with actual mechanical value and bite, but to do so there would have to be appropriate costs. Right now commander tags are one of the closest brushes the game has with Pay2Win. Instead of having a time play in WvW or skill displayed to make it on stage to even attempt being a commander its “Do you have gold/did you buy gems?”

This ‘all or nothing’ attitude is fine for what we have now (because ‘all’ is virtually ‘nothing’…) but if we start to add things like group buffs, increased survivability in friendly zergs, reduced costs for upgrading siege equipment, and other things that actually set a commander apart for building and directing squads, we benefit from some sort of progression scheme, and progression fueled by something other than Gold.

Everything we have now can stay purchased with the 100g commander book. The possibilities open up from there for those commanders willing to invest in more.

I don’t think a commander should be able to buff groups or find survivability increased just by spending some points, and I think that a reduced costs for upgrading towers buff would be more appropriate in some other traitline.

Dream In A Dream.7213:

This a great simple way to do it. I do think that we should watch amount of commander icons on the map. Its currently clattered at times, and with all the different colors it will be a headache reading a map.

Can you perhaps do a bit of an edit and try different shapes for the commander tags?
Maybe use the ones from spvp minimap.

Dream in a Dream, I can try to make different shapes for it, but as i am not really that good in photoshop it might be hard for me. Got any suggestions as shapes? Triangles, Squares, etc..?

I agree with about every point you make there, except for one. Being charged per color is simply not needed. After paying 100 gold you should have the color options by default.

My reasoning is this. In WvW or PVE the ability to assign different colors to different commanders makes everything run smoother, and will increase players experience with the game.

Laiboch, This is a idea i simply took over from other people, but i do understand you the case i made it around 10 gold is the game needs a money sink on certain stuff. The suggestion you made and other people made about making commander tag account bound is possible but brings allot with it. As for starters they have to refund everybody that has more then 1 tag 100 gold or people will dislike it. If this is the case then allot of gold gets back into the economy which wasn’t there before so then you would need a new money sink for those people. That’s why i made the colors 10g each

Nike.2631:

Ok, first off I want to say those mock ups look great! .
Allowing commanders to type into “billboard text” is a GREAT idea either for squad members, or in some sort of localized area about the same size as a /say. I’d probably put it in a 45 second cooldown to avoid malicious or accidental spamming (and to give a little tension to the decision when to blow your big in-your-face command opportunity…).

Thanks Nike! Yes the warning system has to be worked out good to avoid spamming beside that currently it is possible to have 10+ commanders on one map if you like that. This would mean 10+ people can use this command and that will become messy.

Or so called ‘troll commanders’ might go and abuse this. It’s allot to take in consideration but i think in the end it can make a big difference in either WvW or PvE. Cause not everybody reads chat that much so in order to call a big strike or a defense call you can use that people would see it immediately

Thanks for the feedback so far guys!

Porqington.3189:

Something I haven’t seen mentioned yet is cross map commander chat/visibility. Being able to see which (if any) commanders are on any given map and having the ability to communicate with them would be amazing.

that is an excellent idea! After all, WvW may be 4 different maps, but they are all part of the same event.

Porqington.3189:

Something I haven’t seen mentioned yet is cross map commander chat/visibility. Being able to see which (if any) commanders are on any given map and having the ability to communicate with them would be amazing.

Love this idea for a Commanders Only channel. I’d also add a function where it automatically inserts a [tag] at the beginning of each message posted that indicates which map the speaker is on. Being able to tell at a glace could cut down on a LOT of “Wait, where are you?” chatter.

Tags could be as simple as:
[EB] Eternal Battleground
[BBL] Blue Borderland
[GBL] Green Borderland
[RBL] Red Borderland

To stop the siege trolling, you could give commanders a command like “/build [number] [(optional) superior?] [siege]” which stacks on itself and disallows building of siege other than the specified type and number in the area (say range 900 maybe?) for a certain time (5 minutes maybe?).
The command also tells everyone in the area that the commander wants those sieges built there.

So say that the commander zergs to Durios and says the command
/build 3 rams
This would allow the building of 3 rams or superior rams in a 900 radius of the commander.
Everything else is disallowed and can’t be placed.

If the command was
/build 3 sup rams
Then only 3 superior rams, no ordinary, would be allowed.

Say that the commander wants to siege Wildcreek, but it’s defended by siege.
He may then say
/build 4 catapult
/build 4 arrow cart
/build 2 ballista
Which allows for the building of 4 catapults, 4 arrow carts and 2 ballistas in the area since the command stacks on itself.

The command could also have multiple inputs, but it would be important that you can give the command multiple times and have it stack.
Like “/build [number] [(optional) superior?] [siege], [number] [(optional) superior?] [siege], [number] [(optional) superior?] [siege], …”
So the last command sequence could also be said like
/build 4 catapult
/build 4 arrow cart, 2 ballista
Which allows the building of 4 catapults, 4 arrow carts and 2 ballistas.

/build 2 catapult
/build 3 catapult
would allow for building 5 catapults.
Useful if you notice the old number wasn’t enough.

And if the commander doesn’t want, he doesn’t have to use it since not using it wouldn’t limit anything and everything stays buildable. He can then use the chat as normal to communicate what he want and people can do as he says or not do as he says.
However if the commander wants to stop trolling or specifically tell the zerg what to build, he may feel free to use it.
It also stops people from missclicking siege, unintentionally placing a siege of the wrong type. But that probably doesn’t happen very often.

Edit: This command also stacks between commanders to disallow troll commanders using the command to troll so that no siege can be built

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

How big do you expect a squad to be?

If it’s blobbing time it could become as large as 60+ people usually (map minus randoms and roamers). In theory if re-doing the squad system is the long run it should be up to map cap. But as this is regarded a trade secret by Anet it won’t be done. Also the map cap seems to be different on EB compared to borderlands….

So I see 50 as a reasonable size for a squad blob. But I think we all can agree that 30 is too low if the squad system is enhanced in the long run.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?

Any content where the position needs to be known to group up. Currently number one are champ trains, so people do not ask “where’s the train at?” all the time in map chat. This is where you see PvE commanders most of the time. No skill required, just someone tags up for convenience.

The rest would be zerging events to group up at a certain position on the map. But honestly it is most useful on large scale encounters that need to be coordinated. The only content we have here is Tequatl (future encounters like this should scale a bit better and don’t require always to have a full map. Map Cap – X scaling up to map cap would be better).

In addition it is helpful in Guild Missions as well. But basically it comes down to “where to go” as not all people know for example where a guild challenge or race starts.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

For WvW it isn’t that much of a problem, as people quickly realize if a commander is up to the job or not. Some additional gating is not a bad idea. But by the time they can spend the 100g they probably already met that requirement anyway.

So the question is: change from 100g to something that requires more playing time/experience and just make the 100g additional or even waive it? I personally would favour something like a high number of badges of honors and levels. Maybe 2000 badges and 150 levels or what is reasonable for a 3 months period. Swtich the 100g to 100 laurels instead?

You guys have the metrics what more dedicated WvW players achieve in a given number of hours of WvW playtime .

If the time gating changes for WvW in the future if should be something that requires an equivalent of 3 months of dedicated WvW gameplay.

For PvE? Doesn’t really matter. But certain amout of AP won’t hurt. Let’s say 5000 or so? And throw 100 laurels on top it maybe?

If you make a change here: all current commanders get back their Commander Compendium on an alt and can sell it for 100g to the vender. Then they have to buy the new one. And there will be a WvW and PvE one. Both are seperate!

Yeah, I might be over the top here for some people, but I do not have the metrics to make a better suggestion.

Alcyone.8695:

I don’t think a commander should be able to buff groups or find survivability increased just by spending some points…

Out of curiosity, why? People are reporting that they get specifically targeted for being the commander – that says “being a commander might merit some added survivability while they are clearly on-the-job.” People report they have trouble getting people to mass up – that says “make it more rewarding for doing so.”

We have TONS of ways of improving our damage or survivability with wxp… but very few ways of providing Support or Control. Its an imbalance that shouldn’t be enshrined as ‘the way things have always been’. Its something that should be fixed.

A few other ideas that may or may not have been mentioned before (sorry for not reading the thread beforehand):

It would be nice if the supplycheck command had an optional variable range.
/supplyinfo [(optional) range]

Without specified range, it goes on the normal range but if you say
/supplyinfo 1200
it would count the supplies in a 1200 range.
The range would naturally have a maximum range allowed to avoid using it on the whole map and potentially causing smaller havocs to the server.
.
.
.
Custom color for the commandner tag
Make the tag white with changeable hue.
Have some standard colors predefined, but allow for the input of RGB values so that a group of commanders can customize their colors as they wish to allow for a visible chain of command.
For example
/color 255 153 153
would make the tag some light red color
/color standard
would make the tag the standard blue color
/color red
would make the tag a preset red color.

The chain of command idea is to perhaps have a light red, a red and a dark red to show that the dark red is the commander of the commanders and the red is under his rank and the light red are under the red rank.
.
.
.
Chat will have a commander tag of the commander color infront of the text.
When the tag is active and you are talking on a certain channel, perhaps with a suffix to the channel or by a certain command, the text will have a commander tag infront of it in the chat or the text itself.

This way, people can more easilly see if it’s a commander writing the text and which commander it is that is writing the text. This way they can more easilly decide what chat is meant for them and what chat is meant for other people. You can also see if it’s a player trolling with commands or if it’s a commander saying the commands.

The channel suffix could be like this:
/mapc
instead of
/map
c stands for “commander” and the command would put the tag infront of the chat message in the channel “map” if the player is a commander and writing to this channel.
Thus the commander can still be a commander and writing without a tag if he wants.
This would work like the usual channels and let the commander continously write to the channel with the suffix without having to type it every time.
The same could work for
/sayc
/guildc
/teamc

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

FirstRyder.2091:

Is this something you see as a problem? Or working as intended? Or which could be improved?

I think it’s less of an issue now that you can trade siege and I wouldn’t exactly say it’s working as intended. I think our goal was siege placement was done but lots of different people but in reality it’s much easier and more practical for the commander to do it as they have a better understanding of supply and are paying more attention to these things. I could see features to support easier donations but in the end I think people can do this pretty easily now so I honestly haven’t given a feature like that much thought or discussion but now typing this got some ideas flowing about it and I could see a few neat ways that could be improved. : )

Maybe commander can activate siege lock in area around him that will basically mean “Only I place siege in this zerg”.

You have siege lock and you can use the mechanics of a baner holed in hands that refreshes area of effect each few seconds.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

How big do you expect a squad to be?
What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

1. As big as possible. At least for all map characters
2. Being guild commander, commander being account status, 1 name for account commander (showing commander name instead of characters name), making sub squads, commander being able to see every person in squad like they are in a party (yellow color?), making one squad with more than one commander, different commander tag shapes and colors.
3. Money seeps to be OK. Some people buy them just because they are buy able, but they don’t do much damage aside for making people in LA map crowded with tags.

There would be also a nice way if you could click on tag and disable seeing this commander for 1 day, 7 days and forever. If we see a troll commander we can use that.
Please make blocked commander list similar to blocked list.

Septemptus.7164:

2. Being guild commander, commander being account status, 1 name for account commander (showing commander name instead of characters name), making sub squads, commander being able to see every person in squad like they are in a party (yellow color?), making one squad with more than one commander, different commander tag shapes and colors.

I like this way of making the Commander tag account bound but still enabling for commander recognizability. For timing: perhaps when the Commander ability is unlocked, the system propmts the user for their unique Commander name?

Think some kind of abuse-safe priority to commanders to login back without Q or being firstplace in Queue.

DevonCarver.5370:

2) How would it feel to have a system that gradually unlocked more commander abilities and icons, but that required dedication to WvW? Let’s say we added a commander line to the ability panel and you unlocked it with WvW ability points. What is the right starting price for that? 100 points? more? If that happens, does it make sense for the system to remain character based? Would requiring commanders to spend their WXP in this way limit them to the point that they didn’t want to do it? What if you still acquired the current tag by spending 100g, but you upgraded to new shapes via the WXP system?

It is fine if you add a progressive achievement system to the commander line but I think that it should be outside of the usual WvW system. It should be not a personal progression but a recognition of the community.
Add an specific reward (trophy) to the WvW daily achievement. The commander line and abilities would be reached by spending a particular number of trophies. Trophies could be shared but not sold, so the people could share their own trophies with thier liked commanders. These good commanders would grow in their commander skills and utilities line much faster than bad commanders, thanks to the community.

Best,

Haltair, one of the Twelve Shadows

Commanding is about making decisions and making them quickly, not about typing endless commands and tactics in chat or swapping to the map to ping a target location.

Lots of good suggestions here, but please, whatever you do, keep it simple and effective rather than overly complicated.

Sadly the game does not allow third party add-ons otherwise most of the good ideas would have been ingame months ago

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

How big do you expect a squad to be?
What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

I expect a squad to be bigger, the better the commander is. The squad should be capable of supporting at least 30 people though, as this is the size of a decent zerg in WvW. Most people these days dont even seem to join squads anymore, they just follow the pretty blue tag. Which reminds me actually… how about an auto invite feature for squads? I press a button and every friendly unit in 500 range gets an invite to join my squad. Was discussing the route we were going to take to get some omega golems into a keep last night before discovering that all my drawing on the map was useless as only about 10 people had joined the squad.

PVE commanders have been most useful for the Queens Jubilee event. They were fine for the Scarlet invasions, but they really shine when you need somebody to lead a large group through a large quantity of very powerful enemies. Outside of these situations, they are little more than markers on the map that people may find it useful to head towards.

Unless you create seperate PVE and WvW commander roles, money will have to be a good enough gate. 100g, whilst not being the huge quantity that it was at release, is still a sufficiently high enough sum of money that it keeps most people away. People that tag up in WvW generally do so because they genuinely want to command, not because they had some money spare and want to troll.

Here’s what may be a controversial idea; how about limiting the number of commanders per team and per map?
From a programming point of view, it makes colour-coding different commanders easier as you can choose from a set number of distinctive colours.
And while people may object to a limitation, I can’t help but feel that it would promote more coherent teamplay. I would say that maybe 8 commanders maximum per map per team would be a good limit, maybe even less.
I think it would allow for more clearly defined goals.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

How big do you expect a squad to be?
What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

As big as the map limit, regardless of what type (WvW or PvE).

Currently, none really, except for Tequatl. All other uses have been strictly to provide a visual aid for the following-impaired.

Yes. Ineffective commanders never have followers anyway and there is no need to punish new ones. The only ‘issue’ is troll and/or vanity commanders, but if you add levels of visibility this becomes a non-issue.

Thank you for your time!

Mungrul.9358:

Here’s what may be a controversial idea; how about limiting the number of commanders per team and per map?
From a programming point of view, it makes colour-coding different commanders easier as you can choose from a set number of distinctive colours.
And while people may object to a limitation, I can’t help but feel that it would promote more coherent teamplay. I would say that maybe 8 commanders maximum per map per team would be a good limit, maybe even less.
I think it would allow for more clearly defined goals.

Colour coding shouldn’t be problem as there are over 400 dyes and if commanders get RBG slider amount of possible colours is bigger than screens can produce.

If I remember correctly there was atleast talk of system limiting amount of commanders based on achievement points at the time of launch of the game. Might be good or very bad idea; I personally think that it is players problem to choose what commander they are following and it shouldn’t be affected by some artificial rule. Sure, commander limit could decreese amount of grieffing commanders but it could limit uses of commander tag. (if we have scouting, roaming etc commanders)

I have to say that what could be better way to troll commanders with siege than suggested commanders ability on commanders to limit siege placed on certain spot? If other commanders have ability to bypass that it wouldn’t really do anything against those who really want to grief with siege, they just get commander tag if they don’t have it already. And if commanders cannot bypass other commanders limit trolls just pop limit on before actual commander arives. System would be either bad or semi useless→not used.

I keep seeing people mention chat suppression. That was fixed(at least partially) several patches ago. When you have your commander tag on, you can use team chat as much as you like without being suppressed.

@ Commander ranks based on WXP ranks or time progression.

I’ve been reading a lot of suggestion posts about different tiers of time or progression to be able to unlock commander abilites. Commander abilites should NOT be based on how much a free time a player can accumulate WXP or farm gold. Functional and basic abilites should be available to everyone with a pin.

Like many in our guild, we are older veteran gamers with limited time to play, but decades of gaming experience. Commander and Squad is a grouping system for more than 5 players, and the ONLY way in the game to coordinate 5 or more players through the UI. It should have basic abilites for all to use evenly and have public/private/guild only options to be used in the way that works best for each guild and player.

Give the players the basic tools, and they will use it the way that works best for their playstyles. I don’t think grouping systems should be effected or determined by WXP bonus’s.

I would like to see a To Do List similar to the one for daily/achievements that a Commander to activate for his/her squad. Generic like take tower, Get supply, Take Camp, Build Siege at gate/wall.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Seems like people really enjoy answering questions so I’ll throw out a few more.

1. How big do you expect a squad to be?
2. What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?
3. Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

1. It would really depend on the functionality. I like the idea of being able to assign lieutenants very much. If you could assign 3-4 lieutenants and have the commander I would say squad size of 100 so you could divide into groups of 25 or 20.

2. I’ve only every found them useful for Guild Missions, with increased functionality I believe this would change.

3. As I mentioned before, to be a commander is to step up and lead, you shouldn’t have to grind for it. I believe the 100 gold is sufficient.

It sounds like what a lot of people want is this: https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Fleet_options

The eve system includes almost everything suggested in this thread, with a couple of differences specific to game mechanics (colored tags for example).

As a new wvw player, I’d like to point out a few things from my perspective.

1. I’ve been doing it for two weeks and its already obvious that people with commander tags often feel like they own the map. Certainly not all or even most feel that way, but enough do to make it very, very annoying. If there are multiple capable commanders on a map, they should be able to run with their own groups without the constant screaming of “tag down MFer” by whichever zerglord is currently tagged up. I’d like to be able to choose who I follow, so the suggestions related to those sorts of options are good. However, allowing a commander to form a non-guild-specific group and then restrict access to that group should not be allowed. They’re either commanding for the server and have to deal with their server-mates (good or bad) or they’re commanding for their guild and can do whatever they want.

2. As is common in many games, especially first person shooter team games, voice communication is a big benefit. Well, it’s a benefit for everyone but the hearing impaired. Typing on the fly can be difficult for a commander. It’s understandable they’d want the most efficient communications. However, it doesn’t do the hearing impaired much good to be locked out of that venue. But that’s not the only group affected. Many, many people would rather not be in TS (or whichever app you use) to hear the endless jabber of knuckleheads, the self-important/overserious, and, of course, [insert name of monster that commonly lives under bridges]. If you check out that eve link, you’ll see the Broadcast system. This is a command shorthand for various actions. It stands to reason you could come up with one that would allow a commander to issue non-voice commands in a reasonably efficient manner. It doesn’t get you to “kill that particular mesmer” but it could get you to “attack gate,” “attack wall,” “repair gate,” “go for supplies and return to this point,” “next stop is [name of point],” etc.

3. The gold for commander tag scenario is silly. Just add a new item to the wvw skill list labeled Commander and they can pour points into it. Maybe do like some of the items you can buy (x gold + x honor) and make it x points + x honor.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

How big do you expect a squad to be?

The limit should be at least 50, but I think 100 would be ideal.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

What kind of content is a PvE commander most useful?

Scarlet’s invasions are a prime example. In a chaotic environment with a lot of events, where people need to organize to complete them, commanders are great for drawing attention to certain objectives. Recently I’ve also had great success using my commander tag to gather players for “toxic” living story events and climbing the tower of nightmares.

Isaiah Cartwright.8569:

Is money a good enough gate for commander tags?

For a basic tag to use in PvE, yes, but I’d like to see more requirements to distinguish seasoned commanders from “gem store commanders”. I think there needs to be some WvW requirement for WvW commanders. Requiring at least world rank 100 to use a commander tag in WvW would be fair, and including visual upgrades of some sort for much higher ranks could help distinguish even more. Higher tiers of PvE tags could also be available for players with higher achievement points or even specific achievements.

Julenal.3907:

Colour coding shouldn’t be problem as there are over 400 dyes and if commanders get RBG slider amount of possible colours is bigger than screens can produce.

Sorry, I wasn’t clear with my idea. If there are too many colours, there is more chance of not being able to distinguish between certain ones at a glance. With limited colours, they can each be a distinct one that is impossible to confuse with others. It’s a user interface design issue.

ptitminou.6489:

LostBalloon.6423:

Thorn.1703:

Regarding the scout point tree, I think the ability should not be to see them on the map, but just within targeting range. Different tiers might be like:
-Tier 1: Shows enemy commander icons within sight every 20 seconds for one second.
-Tier 2: 15 seconds
-Tier 3: 10 seconds
-Tier 4: 5 seconds
-Tier 5: Constantly

That would work with the timer of WvW ticks, every X seconds of it, it would send a ping of the commanders across the map, and anyone with that trait line would see it. You’re the programmers sooo yeah :P

If that would happen, guild groups would go back to running tagless and all the hard work ANET would put in commander tags would go to waist.

Waist or waste? that is the question!

LOL definitely waste XD -_- 5am → grammar suffers

Honestly, I’ve been thinking a lot about it and with the tag “only” costing 100g a lot of people see to have one these days. A lot of people dont use them or few keep them up & troll.
Should tags become harder to get? I dont think so. On SoR we had a tagged troll that went into WvW every day. At first maybe a few ppl followed him, being new to WvW, but very fast he found himself running alone even though tagged. Now when it comes to guild groups running, even when we run tagless, others are very good at finding us even if you try to shake them off to get an even numbered fight against your opponents.

Moral of the story, other players recognize guilds & their commanders and will follow only if they want to follow wether you have a tag or not. This is why I dont think acquiring a tag should become any harder. Maybe adding something like hiding a tag that would work a bit like the blocked list you have in your contacts (though it would be low priority as it doesnt really change much)

EDIT: by adding more requirements, you are blocking legitimate new commanders & new players to the game, whereas existing trolls will still get their hands on the feature regardless…

Mungrul.9358:

Julenal.3907:

Colour coding shouldn’t be problem as there are over 400 dyes and if commanders get RBG slider amount of possible colours is bigger than screens can produce.

Sorry, I wasn’t clear with my idea. If there are too many colours, there is more chance of not being able to distinguish between certain ones at a glance. With limited colours, they can each be a distinct one that is impossible to confuse with others. It’s a user interface design issue.

That problem is really up to the commanders themselves though.
If commanders want to have 5 different red colors to show a chain of command for a certain group, let them.
If they want indistinguishable colors, let them.
If they want to have 5 different standard colors, let them.

I mean.. It’s in their interest to make it so that people can see them.
So there is no reason to limit what they can do when it’s easy to implement a system where they can do anything.

That is… Don’t make a problem out of something that isn’t a problem.

I’d like to see two things done for commanders – improve general functionality for all (maybe add options to get tags through badges and guild unlocks) and add some ranks in wvw to make them even better/more focused.

General improvements –
Account bound tags (commanders on their alts, usually get ctrl-T on their heads anyway).
Increase squad size, a lot, like up to 80 or 100. It’s better to have room and not need it than to need room and not have it.
Color changing tags and ability to make it invisible to non-squad members.
Designate lieutenants/scouts (with temporary minitags visible to squad members/commanders only).
Commander chat, visible to all tagged commanders and their scouts on all wvw maps.
No suppression in squad chat (only commanders and scouts can use squad chat).
Supply info needs a wider radius, maybe 1200 or 1500.
Called targets should be visible to squad members.

WvW ranks: (yes, I think these should be bought per character, even thought the general tag and wxp is account bound)

offensive commander ideas for bonuses
ability to change tag to crossed swords and activate higher-tier bonuses
increase to wxp gain (or magic find if on pve map) to encourage squad joining
add a glow/beacon of light from above visible to squad members while in combat
faster rezzing for those around you when you’re not in combat
ability to kick people out of/take over golems

defensive commander ideas for bonuses
ability to change tag to a shield and activate higher-tier bonuses
increase the defense of npcs and yaks that are near you (1200 range)
increase the defense of siege that is near you (including mortars, cannons and oil)
increase the effectiveness of supply used to repair when you are near
siege you tag now has a two-hour decay timer

havoc commander ideas for bonuses
ability to change tag to a circle/skull, something different, and activate higher tier bonuses
squad members have 25 percent speed boost when near you
supply spent by squad members is twice as effective when near you
you can see enemies on the minimap when in range (3000 range?)
siege you place is invisible (but usable) for 5 minutes

Most of this seems simple to me, and wouldn’t require a big UI rework. Maybe just a little one. A better raid UI system would also be good someday, but the general changes at least would help a lot. And I don’t think it would put new commanders too far behind as most wvw’ers have quite a lot of wxp points. Hopefully there will be periodic resets (maybe every four months) so future new commanders can respec into command functions.