All rewards are susceptible to our code that is dealing with people who are speed clearing dungeons. This means that if you are speed clearing and then play some new chain for the first time it may not reward the full 60 tokens. If you find yourself getting less rewards consider whether or not your rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.
Jon
So if your guild who runs dungeons all the time, takes time to learn them and becomes very efficient at running them at a fast time because they all know the mechanics of the dungeons, we get rewarded less for it?
How does this make any sense?
Isn’t the whole point to get GOOD at dungeons so you can run them faster?
What do you want us to do? Purposely wipe or take our sweet time going thru them?
I am really confused here and this kind of system does not make any sense!
Would be more reasonable if Anet comes out and tells us the exact time we need to finish each dungeon in in order to get 100% of rewards if they are going to be like this.
At this point I rather them come out and say “You need to finish CoF in at most 30min or else you get 90% tokens!” Then i will just sit at the boss and not kill him for another 10min… with my team. IF that’s the stupid system that they want to go with give us transparency.
When you look into an abyss, the abyss also looks into you.
A bit of misinformation I am seeing in the threads is that if you complete a single dungeon in ten minutes, we’re going to punish you for it, as though we are punishing you for being “too good” at it. This is not true.
Our DR system combats repeated runs, and has a global presence as well effecting other dungeons. So if you run multiple 10 minute dungeons, back to back then you are going to get hit with the DR system no matter which paths you choose.
However the notion that your group will be punished for clearing any single dungeon in any amount of time is incorrect. Running through multiple speed clears back to back will result in the DR system influencing your rewards.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
no, he didn’t say that
Sorry, let me rephrase what I said for Mr. Literal over here.
He said that you can be fast, but only be fast in one dungeon within a certain period of time. If I want to do all 3 paths of a dungeon; assuming I’m good at them I’ll be punished if I do the other two paths too quickly after the first path?
If I interpreted that correctly; that is beyond pathetic.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
no, he didn’t say that
Sorry, let me rephrase what I said for Mr. Literal over here.
He said that you can be fast, but only be fast in one dungeon within a certain period of time. If I want to do all 3 paths of a dungeon; assuming I’m good at them I’ll be punished if I do the other two paths too quickly after the first path?
If I interpreted that correctly; that is beyond pathetic.
you are the one that is hard to interpret
if by that you mean that on any one day, you can only speed-clear 1 dungeon path, then yes, but you can still be good at other dungeons…your post was ambiguous
Hey Robert correct me if im wrong. So your saying if we cleared a dungeon in like 20 minutes with friends that we shouldn’t run it again for a little bit. That we should wait and go do something else before doing dungeons again then I have a few questions.
1. what is the approx time to go do the dungeon again
2. so is the focus to not just solely do dungeon your entires time.
3. if 2 is true then what will happen to groups who focus on dungeons
Thats a few questions i have hope you could answer for me.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
You can be good at all dungeons. Just don’t run them back to back in rapid succession.
But what if dungeon running is “your thing”?
Back when I played Rift, once you hit the level cap, the only things to do were to run the dungeons, or run raids or do PVP. If you’re like me and prefer PVE over PVP than the latter isn’t going to be attractive, and if you’re like me and don’t have access to larger groups of people continually (This is assuming GW2 has some sort of raid content but I don’t think it does) all that leaves is running dungeons.
All this DR is going to do to players is reduce the amount of time they’re willing to spend in game, and the amount of interest they’ll have in it.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
no, he didn’t say that
Sorry, let me rephrase what I said for Mr. Literal over here.
He said that you can be fast, but only be fast in one dungeon within a certain period of time. If I want to do all 3 paths of a dungeon; assuming I’m good at them I’ll be punished if I do the other two paths too quickly after the first path?
If I interpreted that correctly; that is beyond pathetic.
Cry more. You don’t know the minimum and maximum amount of time in which the DR system kicks in, nor do you get that “speed clearing” the same path (or multiple easy paths) is the reason why DR was implemented in the first place.
Just stop. try harder content that takes longer, then you won’t hit the DR. This isn’t rocket science.
“I didn’t buy into GW2 being the second coming of christ.
I just wanted a AAA MMO with no sub made by ArenaNet. And it’s awesome.”
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
You can be good at all dungeons. Just don’t run them back to back in rapid succession.
why not? why shouldnt they run them back to back in successiong? so you are trying to dictate what players cant and cant do with there time? i’m sorry that just dumb… if that is the case then put lockouts on the content like they do in WoW and call them raids… your system is flawed and frankly poorly constructed.
You know worst thing about this system is it has killed crafting entirely, we cant grind for materials anymore, we cant go searching for regents we need to make new gear because doing so we get punished for it… this is #1 reason i stopped crafting…and probably not be playing till its removed. I refuse to pay stupid AH prices when cash is scarce as is.
I think the main problem here is the reward vs fun argument again. People do not want to do dungeons if there is no reward, or a lower reward than if not grinded.
I am literally running out of words to express how stupid this system is. I can understand wanting to implement DR for people that are repeating the same path over and over. This makes sense. But with the current system, no matter how you try and phrase it, you are penalising skilled players. It isn’t difficult to finish three different paths of a dungeon in under 30 minutes each. It’s the design of the dungeons that makes it possible to finish them this quickly. It’s poor design. It would be even faster if you didn’t give us monotonous auto attack bosses with insane amounts of health; some of them take literally 5-10 minutes of just standing there attacking with the occasional dodge. Seriously, you are destroying end game PvE. I still play dungeons because I enjoy playing with friends. Eventually, most of the community is going to get sick of dungeons and stop doing. The rewards are horrendously under unrewarding, and you make this even worse with the current DR system.
He said that you can be fast, but only be fast in one dungeon within a certain period of time. If I want to do all 3 paths of a dungeon; assuming I’m good at them I’ll be punished if I do the other two paths too quickly after the first path?
If I interpreted that correctly; that is beyond pathetic.
You have concerns and questions, which is why I am answering them to the best of my ability without divulging the full mechanics of our DR system.
To answer your most recent question, No, you would not honestly get punished with our DR system for that. Hitting the same path 2-3 times in rapid succession would result in DR influence, but hitting different paths quickly won’t initially draw the influence of the DR system. That being said, there is a limit to the amount of paths you can run in a period of time before global DR kicks in.
The lengths you content designers are going to is absolutely rediculous to say the least, Why not hit this problem at its source instead of slapping huge inconvenience bandages over everything? You realise that this whole crusade against dungeon runners you’re on is shattering an already fragile PvE Dungeon community? I really don’t care if people run dungeons in 5 minutes or in 5 hours. If they have the skill to do that then why should they be slapped in the face? It is due to your testing negligence that exploits have happened. Granted the exploiters should have their items removed, but why do we all have to suffer? It’s like you don’t care about content but only about people making in game money which in turn means less gem store sales for you.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
You can be good at all dungeons. Just don’t run them back to back in rapid succession.
So you have a full set of armor players want that costs like over 1000 tokens making players want to do the dungeon successively to get them…. and so they get less reward (Punishment) for it…. or they have to go do another dungeon which is another few hours (something they don’t want to do) to get it.
wow that sounds like so much fun…. yeah no thanks
basically what the above comments said, You are going to dictate what the players can and cannot do in their time by making it not worth it.
Robert your saying that if I completed 5 dungeons in a hour, just that we able to do that the DR will activate since im assuming you guys estimate at least 20 minutes to over an hour for a dungeon. So to this example if i did 3 instead of five i would still get my normal 60 token rewards.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
You can be good at all dungeons. Just don’t run them back to back in rapid succession.
And why, for goodness sake, I cannot run dungeons whenever I want and at whatever speed I want?
I have met a few good players while running dungeons. We assemble from time to time just for doing some runs, have fun together and gaining tokens. We have become pretty good at it and we enjoy improving our performance if we can. Oh but, we are now punished for it. Because someone thought it was cool to prevent people from playing however they want. Thanks, really. And on top of that, I have lost something around 500 tokens to some bug which affects even first runs. Tokens I guess I’ll never see from Anet. Hours of commitment without any proper reward. Luckily enough, I enjoyed playing with those good people, and this is the only thing preventing me from quitting this dumb game once and for all. I can only hope that, one day, maybe, the programmers will realize how idiotic this whole “diminished returns” system is.
Nobody actually knows the amount of DR the system currently puts on the players. There is a bug at the moment which is screwing things up, so before you all start going in to a rant, lets just wait for the bug fix first?
Nobody actually knows the amount of DR the system currently puts on the players. There is a bug at the moment which is screwing things up, so before you all start going in to a rant, lets just wait for the bug fix first?
Or you know, Instead of saying you will have “deminished rewards when you do too many dungeons” they could just let the community know what their plans are instead of leaving us in the dark.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
You can be good at all dungeons. Just don’t run them back to back in rapid succession.
Im a little lost as to why people cannot run them in rapid succession?
Im not even receiving the correct rewards from dungeons, so obviously the path was botched a little, and am slowly getting bored with things not being fun anymore after each patch.
But to not be able to farm a dungeon for tokens to get gear.. is a step back in progression, better off giving more tokens the more you run a dungeon.
You could even make achievements for this kind of thing.
How is Punishing people for completing a full path of a dungeon repeatedly supposed to be a fun system?
BTW.. this is what i got from a dungeon on my 3rd attempt yesterday.
WvW = Flawed system(whole reason I came to GW2) now you change dungeons which I actually have hated in every game since I can remember from something I like, to something which beats the purpose of the entire system. You are dictating what I want to do. If I want to do a dungeon over and over, that is MY decision. You screwed up with Arah, yet you punish the player base. Lol what are you doing with your game. :-/
Nobody actually knows the amount of DR the system currently puts on the players. There is a bug at the moment which is screwing things up, so before you all start going in to a rant, lets just wait for the bug fix first?
Correct. People can speculate about the timing involved and how it works – we will not be divulging this information since it opens the system up to people finding ways around it. While we are confident in the system, we are doubly confident that people are amazing at finding holes in systems and breaking them.
The system is currently bugged, and is treating people unfairly. We’re actively working on it.
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
no, he didn’t say that
Sorry, let me rephrase what I said for Mr. Literal over here.
He said that you can be fast, but only be fast in one dungeon within a certain period of time. If I want to do all 3 paths of a dungeon; assuming I’m good at them I’ll be punished if I do the other two paths too quickly after the first path?
If I interpreted that correctly; that is beyond pathetic.
Cry more. You don’t know the minimum and maximum amount of time in which the DR system kicks in, nor do you get that “speed clearing” the same path (or multiple easy paths) is the reason why DR was implemented in the first place.
Just stop. try harder content that takes longer, then you won’t hit the DR. This isn’t rocket science.
1. “Cry more” is something only a childish person would say.
2. We do not know it because they are not willing to let us know it, apparently. Thanks for that.
3. I don’t want to “try harder content that takes longer”, nor any other content at all. THIS content is giving me the tokens I NEED to buy the gear I WANT. If there was another way, or multiple other ways, to get thekittenrewards I desire, I would gladly do them.
Nobody actually knows the amount of DR the system currently puts on the players. There is a bug at the moment which is screwing things up, so before you all start going in to a rant, lets just wait for the bug fix first?
Correct. People can speculate about the timing involved and how it works – we will not be divulging this information since it opens the system up to people finding ways around it. While we are confident in the system, we are doubly confident that people are amazing at finding holes in systems and breaking them. The system is currently bugged, and is treating people unfairly. We’re actively working on it.
So why keep it in there? As it stands now dungeons are not even worth doing, how many people do you think will stick around while you try and figure out whats wrong and based on how well you can fix bugged skill points ( not at all) we will never be doing dungeons again.
Nobody actually knows the amount of DR the system currently puts on the players. There is a bug at the moment which is screwing things up, so before you all start going in to a rant, lets just wait for the bug fix first?
Correct. People can speculate about the timing involved and how it works – we will not be divulging this information since it opens the system up to people finding ways around it. While we are confident in the system, we are doubly confident that people are amazing at finding holes in systems and breaking them.
The system is currently bugged, and is treating people unfairly. We’re actively working on it.
I can imagine the things you guys have to go through, to stop people abusing systems to get the most out of it, i don’t envy that job.
And im glad you Acknowledge that the system is bugged.
I Have tried to run dungeons the past week and its just getting worse and worse for me, I don’t enjoy running these dungeons anymore.
Please have a look at the screenshot i posted in a previous post.
Nobody actually knows the amount of DR the system currently puts on the players. There is a bug at the moment which is screwing things up, so before you all start going in to a rant, lets just wait for the bug fix first?
Correct. People can speculate about the timing involved and how it works – we will not be divulging this information since it opens the system up to people finding ways around it. While we are confident in the system, we are doubly confident that people are amazing at finding holes in systems and breaking them.
The system is currently bugged, and is treating people unfairly. We’re actively working on it.
You seriously think that by not telling us how it actually works that we won’t find out? I give it less than a month.
The amount of ignorance and childish behaviour refusing to fix the REAL problem which is the exploitable nature of your dungeon designs and instead punishing all players for doing your content is mind boggling.
Thus will ultimately lead straight to the graveyard of failed MMO’s.
“The DR System is not restricting players, it just here to help them realize how they want to play!”
Correct. People can speculate about the timing involved and how it works – we will not be divulging this information since it opens the system up to people finding ways around it. While we are confident in the system, we are doubly confident that people are amazing at finding holes in systems and breaking them.
The system is currently bugged, and is treating people unfairly. We’re actively working on it.
I get you don’t want to give away the specfics of the system cause then people will just exploit that too. Honest suggestion though if Anet is really going to keep the system the way it is (after fixing bugs obviously): Give us a DR debuff so that we can see when we are going to be affected by it and know when its safe to go into dungeons again expecting full rewards.
Its really annoying to not know how long you have to wait to play again, speaking as a player who loves to just run dungeons all the time, back to back. I don’t exploit them, barely ever even run past a trash mob. But my groups are usually fast and good, and I play through dungeons a lot. Most of them I have nothing I want to spend the tokens on yet anyways, but it is really disheartening to get no reward when another person, who is just as good or fast at the dungeon gets full rewards simply because I play more often then them. Thats like punishing me for being a stay-at-home mom who can play the game more.
Kromica.2831 because it takes time to fix a bug and make sure it’s working when hundreds of thousands of people are playing it. I’m sure it will be fixed very soon. Then we can have this conversation again when it is working properly.
You have concerns and questions, which is why I am answering them to the best of my ability without divulging the full mechanics of our DR system.
This is one of the problems Robert. People will figure out your system so you may as well just tell us what it is. Not knowing when we will incur the wrath of Anet is incredibly frustrating. I agree exploiters need to be punished but you are going about it all wrong. Basically you are punishing the whole class for one students outbreaks.
Please read my post on alternate ways to handle people clearing your content too fast. We are gamers, I personally have played an average of 10 hours a day for the last 32 days(just did a /age), we are good at what we do, i’m sorry your content is not as hard as you thought it was.
If we know your timeframe we can at least run a dungeon and then go wait around for 10 to 20 minutes before running another one…which by the way is not fun.
Kromica.2831 because it takes time to fix a bug and make sure it’s working when hundreds of thousands of people are playing it. I’m sure it will be fixed very soon. Then we can have this conversation again when it is working properly.
Like the time they should have taken fixing dungeons instead of making a DR system that they also not took the time to test?
“The DR System is not restricting players, it just here to help them realize how they want to play!”
So basically what Robert is saying; is that we can only be good at one dungeon.
… No comment.
You can be good at all dungeons. Just don’t run them back to back in rapid succession.
I don’t believe I’ve ever heard of a system that punishes people for playing the game. If your group is good and knows how to get through content quickly and efficiently, you will be limited. Seriously? It’s akittengood thing this thing has no sub, but even at the cost of purchase this angers me.
Kromica.2831 because it takes time to fix a bug and make sure it’s working when hundreds of thousands of people are playing it. I’m sure it will be fixed very soon. Then we can have this conversation again when it is working properly.
Like the time they should have taken fixing dungeons instead of making a DR system that they also not took the time to test?
I’ll repeat for the 100th time, I think they know that their DR system works, but currently there is a bug that is forcing harsh DRs on everyone. Wait until it is fixed, and THEN you can complain more effectively. At the moment this is all speculation.
I don’t see how this doesn’t frustrate you. It’s like your ISP saying you can look at a certain number of web pages but once you go past our limit, of which we are not going to tell you, then we will stop loading half of the words for your pages. It’s down right rediculous.
Reading your post I was thinking “Oh god, another one of these”
Then I saw it was you, and was relieved that there are not more of you. Selfish comments are not very constructive.
Can you please stop with the personal attacks? We are all here to make this game better and just because you can see no evil and hear no evil does not mean others have to agree with you all the time.
If you can not handle other peoples opinions then please do ignore them.
Thank you.
“The DR System is not restricting players, it just here to help them realize how they want to play!”
Robert, out of curiosity, why is the speed at which people run dungeons such a concern? Aren’t the rewards identical to all other exotic gear? If someone spends 100 hours running the exact same path over and over to obtain a cosmetic reward, that doesn’t seem broken to me (in fact it seems more than a little crazy, and if they are willing to bore themselves to death for 100 hours…).
And even if you disagree, isn’t limiting reward somewhat counter to some of your overall design goals? Diminishing returns is something that doesn’t “feel fun” to players, it feels arbitrary, and from some perspectives punishes success. A player will only be considering what they could have gotten, which changes the entire conversation to something negative.
