Guild Wars 2

waves wand I fix dis. SWOOOOOOSH

Loved the “firey” typo.

Lucas.9157:

1. 1 lilith na/eu

PS: loved the “firey” typo.

Typo OP.

I tried to put #1 lilith, but it was nerfed

Being lilithist is a really hard life.

Re: Battle standard
You are looking at either of two situations:
1) You are in a pug and people are downing everywhere, you have no AOE fury, and you need all the might stacks you can get for bosses because that’s where your DPS will be most lacking.

2) You are in an organized group and you shouldn’t be running PS in the first place.

Re: Eles
I never said D/F was superior, you’re probably confusing me with someone else. I’m the one who argued for staff ele Lava Font spamming which no one really disputes is ridiculous DPS.

Re: Engis
You can go “I tried an engi for a few minutes and my DPS didn’t seem that good” all you want but I can easily flip that and say my warrior DPS isn’t that good either. There’s a reason the meta warrior build is an EA support build and not a raw DPS build. There’s a difference between engineers not being good for speedruns and people not being good at engineers in speedruns. I don’t think anyone’s ever disputed that a good engineer is anything short of amazing in any situation, speedrun or otherwise.

Re: Battle standard
1) You are in a pug and ressing scrubs isnt going to help. Better to keep your personal dps with perma fury and provide perma 25 might for the entire group. Battle standard uptime is way too low to even be considered for anything other than emergency res. But why would you res pugs who are just going to down again. Fractals is the only place where banner ressing is the safer option compared to just picking them up.

2) You are in an organized group but you dont care about class composition because its a casual run and you can complete the same run with 5 necros almost as fast. Or you are in fractals. So you take a phalanx warrior and get perma might for easy group dps in long duration fights where might stacking is more of a problem.

If you felt people were just going to down you’d honestly be better off just running 30/30 or 30/25 and keeping yourself up rather than trying to help them. But to be honest, pugs downing everywhere honestly rarely happen in my experience to justify battle standard, and I do my fair share of pugging

You can go “I tried an engi for a few minutes and my DPS didn’t seem that good” all you want but I can easily flip that and say my warrior DPS isn’t that good either. There’s a reason the meta warrior build is an EA support build and not a raw DPS build. There’s a difference between engineers not being good for speedruns and people not being good at engineers in speedruns. I don’t think anyone’s ever disputed that a good engineer is anything short of amazing in any situation, speedrun or otherwise.

So good nobody ever takes them on records.

Guang.

Please.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

As far as I know I was the only one advocating DPS guardian back when everyone was on the Strife anchor AH/EM meta, and the responses back then were basically:

1) “u dum guard cant dps like hundred badle”
2) “lol lets see u survive in fractals 20+ without anchor”
3) “post 5guardian cof speedclear vid plz”

Then DPS ranger:

1) “lol show ranger vid beat hb damag”
2) “post 5ranger cof speedclear vid plz”

Then DPS staff ele:
1) “lol ele for lh blast, warrior for dps not other way around”
2) “post 5ele speedclear vid plz”

So now we’re just waiting on DPS engie to catch on since we got through the “post 5engie speedclear” phase already. I think some of the DnT guys were testing it and getting good results? I don’t really know or care, I know I’m right.

I was on Guru back in these days. You used Sw/F and Scepter/F in this Guardian DPS build. And it wasn’t the facts that Guardian could do good DPS that bugs people out. Its the facts that you said that he was the best DPS of the game. Even now, a DPS guardian only bring more DPS than a Warrior if he have Aegis on (but keeping aegis on, is not an easy task in harder content when you need Aegis to survive).

DPS ranger : I miss that one from you. Didn’t know you were advocate of Sword Ranger at the beginning so i won’t comment on that.

For Ele Staff? You were partially right. I think (but can’t confirm) that we were one of the first to advocate that the staff ele that camp fire is one of the best dps. But it wasn’t until December 10th, with the boost to Burning Rage that this build received more attention form people like DEKeyz2Chaos. After December 10th, it was definetively one of the best Ele build, before that, that’s questionnable. But since you started to talk about it in september, we can leave you the benefits of the doubt.

Engineer? Again, people didn’t like your post about that, not because you shown a good DPS engie build. But because you talked about how much the engie is the best DPS build of the game.

You usually bring good idea to the table (them that was hard to admit), but you are so full of yourself and alway scream how much THIS IS SO kitten, ITS THE BEST BUILD AND THIS PROFESSION IS THE BEST DPS OF THE GAME. This is the kind of bullkitten that make people jump and decide that they will attack your build right away.

maha.7902:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Why would you use Signet of Rage? You want Battle Standard.

I only put SoR on my bar for Deep Strikes to max out crit chance.

errr….

why would you use battle standard in a dungeon?

I announce on ts that I’ll use battle standard for “x” fight (usually lupi), sometimes.
To humiliate them.
/evil laugh

Thaddeus.4891:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

As far as I know I was the only one advocating DPS guardian back when everyone was on the Strife anchor AH/EM meta, and the responses back then were basically:

1) “u dum guard cant dps like hundred badle”
2) “lol lets see u survive in fractals 20+ without anchor”
3) “post 5guardian cof speedclear vid plz”

Then DPS ranger:

1) “lol show ranger vid beat hb damag”
2) “post 5ranger cof speedclear vid plz”

Then DPS staff ele:
1) “lol ele for lh blast, warrior for dps not other way around”
2) “post 5ele speedclear vid plz”

So now we’re just waiting on DPS engie to catch on since we got through the “post 5engie speedclear” phase already. I think some of the DnT guys were testing it and getting good results? I don’t really know or care, I know I’m right.

I was on Guru back in these days. You used Sw/F and Scepter/F in this Guardian DPS build. And it wasn’t the facts that Guardian could do good DPS that bugs people out. Its the facts that you said that he was the best DPS of the game. Even now, a DPS guardian only bring more DPS than a Warrior if he have Aegis on (but keeping aegis on, is not an easy task in harder content when you need Aegis to survive).

DPS ranger : I miss that one from you. Didn’t know you were advocate of Sword Ranger at the beginning so i won’t comment on that.

For Ele Staff? You were partially right. I think (but can’t confirm) that we were one of the first to advocate that the staff ele that camp fire is one of the best dps. But it wasn’t until December 10th, with the boost to Burning Rage that this build received more attention form people like DEKeyz2Chaos. After December 10th, it was definetively one of the best Ele build, before that, that’s questionnable. But since you started to talk about it in september, we can leave you the benefits of the doubt.

Engineer? Again, people didn’t like your post about that, not because you shown a good DPS engie build. But because you talked about how much the engie is the best DPS build of the game.

You usually bring good idea to the table (them that was hard to admit), but you are so full of yourself and alway scream how much THIS IS SO kitten, ITS THE BEST BUILD AND THIS PROFESSION IS THE BEST DPS OF THE GAME. This is the kind of bullkitten that make people jump and decide that they will attack your build right away.

There’s a difference between “taking one of these will improve your party DPS” and “this class is the best DPS in the game”. There’s also a difference between me saying “this class is the best in the game overall” or “this class is super broken” etc. and “this class is the best personal DPS in the game”. Offhand I can’t remember if I’ve ever actually affirmatively claimed that any build other than the formerly super broken Kit Refinement spamming engineer, and the current Fire Staff ele build, was the best DPS in the game (and I’m pretty sure I was right on both those counts) but if I have you’re free to take it literally, as hyperbole, or in light of the “warrior HB is best deeps 40k on last hit alone” “meta” stuff that always gets tossed around. I do use “better than warrior” as a point of DPS comparison a lot but it should be pretty obvious by now that I don’t mean that to be “warrior is second best DPS so this class is best DPS since it’s better”.

Also, given the sheer number of people who always respond with “let’s see your 5 [insert class here] speedclear” or “go make a video of you soloing [boss] with [class] faster than [other class]” and don’t seem to understand the concepts of boonsharing or DPS contributions, I’d say it’s fair for me to simplify some of these concepts down just so it makes it easier for them to understand. “Engie big deeps kill thing fast” is easier for the average pug to understand than explaining how shifting vuln and might stacking to the class capable of contributing as much of it as possible with the least DPS tradeoff enables other party members to build for max raw DPS numbers and thus improves overall DPS etc.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Re: Eles
I never said D/F was superior, you’re probably confusing me with someone else. I’m the one who argued for staff ele Lava Font spamming which no one really disputes is ridiculous DPS.

Reading comprehension OP?
You’ve been telling staff has superior dps than any other elementalist weaponset and is the “to-go” set. Zelyhn proved you wrong that D/F is superior damage and I was correct about S/X + FGS being way superior. Remember, that was before staff eles got a huge buff with persiting flames.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Re: Engis
You can go “I tried an engi for a few minutes and my DPS didn’t seem that good” all you want but I can easily flip that and say my warrior DPS isn’t that good either. There’s a reason the meta warrior build is an EA support build and not a raw DPS build. There’s a difference between engineers not being good for speedruns and people not being good at engineers in speedruns. I don’t think anyone’s ever disputed that a good engineer is anything short of amazing in any situation, speedrun or otherwise.

I have nothing to say on this, it’s just laughable. For one, I did not try just for a few minutes, actually not for much less than I did on warrior. An hour of going through different builds is enough to see the potential of the thing you’re currently on. Never said I’m a perfect engineer, neither am I a perfect warrior. For sure, though, I’m along the better ones in this game. I might be better on warrior than I am on engineer, but that would not explain warriors dealing almost twice as much direct damage as engineers in any tests I did. And for the last sentence… seriously, start playing the game.
You don’t take staff camping eles into speedruns, not because people can’t handle them, but because they suck. You don’t bring engineers into speedruns, not because people can’t handle them, but because they suck. I’m always flattered again on how far off reality you live, although I should know after such a long time.

hendo.1940:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Re: Eles
I never said D/F was superior, you’re probably confusing me with someone else. I’m the one who argued for staff ele Lava Font spamming which no one really disputes is ridiculous DPS.

Reading comprehension OP?
You’ve been telling staff has superior dps than any other elementalist weaponset and is the “to-go” set. Zelyhn proved you wrong that D/F is superior damage and I was correct about S/X + FGS being way superior. Remember, that was before staff eles got a huge buff with persiting flames.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Re: Engis
You can go “I tried an engi for a few minutes and my DPS didn’t seem that good” all you want but I can easily flip that and say my warrior DPS isn’t that good either. There’s a reason the meta warrior build is an EA support build and not a raw DPS build. There’s a difference between engineers not being good for speedruns and people not being good at engineers in speedruns. I don’t think anyone’s ever disputed that a good engineer is anything short of amazing in any situation, speedrun or otherwise.

I have nothing to say on this, it’s just laughable. For one, I did not try just for a few minutes, actually not for much less than I did on warrior. An hour of going through different builds is enough to see the potential of the thing you’re currently on. Never said I’m a perfect engineer, neither am I a perfect warrior. For sure, though, I’m along the better ones in this game. I might be better on warrior than I am on engineer, but that would not explain warriors dealing almost twice as much direct damage as engineers in any tests I did. And for the last sentence… seriously, start playing the game.
You don’t take staff camping eles into speedruns, not because people can’t handle them, but because they suck. You don’t bring engineers into speedruns, not because people can’t handle them, but because they suck. I’m always flattered again on how far off reality you live, although I should know after such a long time.

Correction: They don’t take YOUR engi or staff ele into speedruns because YOU suck. Maybe, I dunno, not like I’ve ever seen you play, but if you can’t even hit half the DPS of a warrior on an engie, you’re probably doing something wrong and shouldn’t really be talking about meta at all.

Also, staff ele IS and always WAS the highest DPS build from the moment they added the ONE extra tick to Persisting Flames. LH was closer than it is now, sure, so there was a bit of room for debate, but lol @ dagger/anything being remotely comparable. I assumed you were attributing ’dagger is superior" to me because arguing for dagger DPS, really, lol.

On the topic of staff DPS, let’s give the credit to those who actually deserve it:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Elementalist-Skill-Data/first#post2363920
The post includes a nice piece of stupidity from myself
I think this was the first time a staff rotation had been recorded and published on the forums.

Then we refined our calculations:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/elementalist/Staff-s-greatly-underestimated-damage-9-17/first#post2504554

So that is basically three months before Guang wrote his thread. Oh and in his thread there were so many many mistakes like casting fireball counts as a channeling spell, or swapping attunement would cancel eruption, PF adding only one tick on lava font, etc

Edit: I almost forgot! Guang wasn’t even including Meteor Shower at first, I had to insist for him to finally take it into account haha

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Re: Battle standard
You are looking at either of two situations:
1) You are in a pug and people are downing everywhere, you have no AOE fury, and you need all the might stacks you can get for bosses because that’s where your DPS will be most lacking.

You completely fail to refute my points. In fact, your statement “you need all the might stacks you can get for bosses” only helps reinforce the fact that SoR is useful since the permafury uptime helps you maintain a high level of might stacks more consistently than Battle Standard.

You are just planning for failure.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Also, staff ele IS and always WAS the highest DPS build from the moment they added the ONE extra tick to Persisting Flames.

Yeah except you argued it was the strongest months before that.
And during all those months, Dub and I spent time proving you wrong.
I even had to use your own spreadsheet to show you your many calculation mistakes.

2k14

still trying to make guang understand hes wrong

yawn

@Dub:

LOVE ARROWS
NEVER FORGET

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

hendo.1940:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Re: Eles
I never said D/F was superior, you’re probably confusing me with someone else. I’m the one who argued for staff ele Lava Font spamming which no one really disputes is ridiculous DPS.

Reading comprehension OP?
You’ve been telling staff has superior dps than any other elementalist weaponset and is the “to-go” set. Zelyhn proved you wrong that D/F is superior damage and I was correct about S/X + FGS being way superior. Remember, that was before staff eles got a huge buff with persiting flames.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Re: Engis
You can go “I tried an engi for a few minutes and my DPS didn’t seem that good” all you want but I can easily flip that and say my warrior DPS isn’t that good either. There’s a reason the meta warrior build is an EA support build and not a raw DPS build. There’s a difference between engineers not being good for speedruns and people not being good at engineers in speedruns. I don’t think anyone’s ever disputed that a good engineer is anything short of amazing in any situation, speedrun or otherwise.

I have nothing to say on this, it’s just laughable. For one, I did not try just for a few minutes, actually not for much less than I did on warrior. An hour of going through different builds is enough to see the potential of the thing you’re currently on. Never said I’m a perfect engineer, neither am I a perfect warrior. For sure, though, I’m along the better ones in this game. I might be better on warrior than I am on engineer, but that would not explain warriors dealing almost twice as much direct damage as engineers in any tests I did. And for the last sentence… seriously, start playing the game.
You don’t take staff camping eles into speedruns, not because people can’t handle them, but because they suck. You don’t bring engineers into speedruns, not because people can’t handle them, but because they suck. I’m always flattered again on how far off reality you live, although I should know after such a long time.

Correction: They don’t take YOUR engi or staff ele into speedruns because YOU suck. Maybe, I dunno, not like I’ve ever seen you play, but if you can’t even hit half the DPS of a warrior on an engie, you’re probably doing something wrong and shouldn’t really be talking about meta at all.

Also, staff ele IS and always WAS the highest DPS build from the moment they added the ONE extra tick to Persisting Flames. LH was closer than it is now, sure, so there was a bit of room for debate, but lol @ dagger/anything being remotely comparable. I assumed you were attributing ’dagger is superior" to me because arguing for dagger DPS, really, lol.

really Guang? You want to call people who have demonstrated their skill time and again bad? Do you not think all of us have ammunition we could unload about your level of play or do you just not care enough about opening yourself up for public humiliation?

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Correction: They don’t take YOUR engi or staff ele into speedruns because YOU suck. Maybe, I dunno, not like I’ve ever seen you play, but if you can’t even hit half the DPS of a warrior on an engie, you’re probably doing something wrong and shouldn’t really be talking about meta at all.

It’s funny how you always catch the obvious. And at no point in the game staff elementalist was higher dps than S/F + FGS. Especially not when lava font only had four ticks.

Substract all the condition damage from the former, there you go.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Offhand I can’t remember if I’ve ever actually affirmatively claimed that any build other than the formerly super broken Kit Refinement spamming engineer, and the current Fire Staff ele build, was the best DPS in the game

Well, you were right on kit refinement engineer build. Don’t know if it was the best DPS of the game, but that build was totally broken. But for the staff ele. Again, the first time you talk about it, it was in september 2013. But it was only in October 15 that persisting Flames was fixed and at December 10th, that Burning Rage was buff. When you first talk about that build, its was a good build, but not the TOP build it is now. Back then, LH S/X was a superior build all around, right now both these build are equally good. 1 give more might, while the other have better DPS.

Uh, PF gave one extra tick when I wrote the guide. Then it was “fixed” to add 2. There were a few holdouts but it was generally accepted that staff was the best DPS, while LH was a bit behind but gave better might. All the PF “fix” did was push staff so far ahead that the holdouts had to stop pretending LH was better DPS, and fall back to the “but it still gives more might” argument. Which is entirely legit, as is the fact that LH gives you more multipliers for FGS rushing. I don’t think I’ve ever denied those points.

Also IIRC I had KR Engie clocking at something like 20k DPS full buffed and mine was a conservative estimate. I remember Knox doing a similar crunch but assuming 100% perfect rotations that would be outrageously hard to pull off consistently and he was getting something like 25k. For reference the current firestaff max DPS spec is about 17k., and the KR build existed before Persisting Flames was even a thing. So yeah, it was definitely broken in a lot of ways.

To be fair, the engineer is doing good damage now, especially with riffle. He obviously doesn’t have the banners or self stack might abilities from the warrior, but in a group setting where he does, he does some good damage. All in all, I am impressed with that engi solo lupi.

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Uh, PF gave one extra tick when I wrote the guide. Then it was “fixed” to add 2.

Yep, and you did not even notice it. I had to point it out to you.

Edit: talking about when you first wrote the guide, at that time you didn’t even include meteor shower, yet you claimed that staff ele was top DPS just by spamming lava font and fireball. You talked about it dealing 18k+ dps.
You see I never denied that staff was good. In fact I had been playing staff since the start of the game myself. But you were wrong.

Can one of you ele knowitalls help me? I think he’s wrong but I don’t know why cause I’m a scrub.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/The-legend-insanely-expensive/first#post4019582

thanks ily.

Just saying Guan. You a good theory crafting, but you think too much of yourself and of what you come up with and that’s what kitten people off on the forum. From Guru to here, you always have people attacking every single line you write (for good or bad reason) simply because you make people hate you and always have to push it a bit too far.

Everybody say that Staff Ele is NOW (after the December 10th and October 15th patch) one of the best DPS of the game, better DPS than LH + S/X but serious lacking in might stacking. Both build are complementary and are good addition to a speed run group. But no, you have to say that Staff Ele is the BEST dps of the game no doudt and that LH + S/X is kitten.

Back in the day, people use to say to you. Ya Guardian is good DPS, but not as good as Warrior, especially if you use scepter in that build. A year latter, Guardian was offensively buff, while the warrior was nerf and now the Guardian CAN have higher DPS than a warrior only if he can keep aegis always up (which is impossible). How’s that make you right back then? You had a good build, but you were wrong.

On a mostly unrelated note, if anyone actually does want to do any 5 engi speed runs, please invite me.

That full asc set I made for her just might get some use =d

Hi, I’m back from the shadows again. I had a post prepared, and in the middle of typing it, I figured out how to solve the problem. Basically, the meta is about to change, and Guang is right.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Hi, I’m back from the shadows again. I had a post prepared, and in the middle of typing it, I figured out how to solve the problem. Basically, the meta is about to change, and Guang is right.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Hi, I’m back from the shadows again. I had a post prepared, and in the middle of typing it, I figured out how to solve the problem. Basically, the meta is about to change, and Guang is right.

Can Eugene come out and play?

Thaddeus.4891:

Just saying Guan. You a good theory crafting, but you think too much of yourself and of what you come up with and that’s what kitten people off on the forum. From Guru to here, you always have people attacking every single line you write (for good or bad reason) simply because you make people hate you and always have to push it a bit too far.

Everybody say that Staff Ele is NOW (after the December 10th and October 15th patch) one of the best DPS of the game, better DPS than LH + S/X but serious lacking in might stacking. Both build are complementary and are good addition to a speed run group. But no, you have to say that Staff Ele is the BEST dps of the game no doudt and that LH + S/X is kitten.

Back in the day, people use to say to you. Ya Guardian is good DPS, but not as good as Warrior, especially if you use scepter in that build. A year latter, Guardian was offensively buff, while the warrior was nerf and now the Guardian CAN have higher DPS than a warrior only if he can keep aegis always up (which is impossible). How’s that make you right back then? You had a good build, but you were wrong.

you dont need 100% aegis uptime to deal more dps than warriors.
and if the warrior is running EA build its even easier to deal more dps than them.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

Hi, I’m back from the shadows again. I had a post prepared, and in the middle of typing it, I figured out how to solve the problem. Basically, the meta is about to change, and Guang is right.

I hope you’re serious!

The general idea I’m thinking of is:

• Staff Ele
• LH Ele
• EA Warrior
• Engineer
• Ranger

Ranger / Engineer probably have enough reflects for most things, Engineer has stealth, basically replaces Guardian and Thief. That frees up a slot for Ranger, so you get access to Spotter and Frost Spirit. Does it work in every situation? No, but i think it’s probably a good general template

Well, it’s a comp I adore to use. It’s not like I’m giving a kitten if the superprol33tspeedzrecordz meta changes; if all the characters in your party are built properly and know what to do you complete all runs in more or less the same time with any comp – as long as there’s a parvence of a warrior and maybe an elly.
It’s just some people that are obsessed with having a very specific comp with 300 ellys, thieves and warriors. You don’t need that.

TheMaskedParadigm.3629:

The general idea I’m thinking of is:

• Staff Ele
• LH Ele
• EA Warrior
• Engineer
• Ranger

Ranger / Engineer probably have enough reflects for most things, Engineer has stealth, basically replaces Guardian and Thief. That frees up a slot for Ranger, so you get access to Spotter and Frost Spirit. Does it work in every situation? No, but i think it’s probably a good general template

Surely nice for a casual run or individual speedtest, would suck in an actual dungeon run setting, though.

I guess you’d still want a guardian in fractals. The engi reflect is meh because of rng and long cd. Ranger one roots you. It seems very unreliable.
But by all means, make engi meta. I’m sick of 3-4 war groups and given how slow pugs catch up with meta the sooner the better.

deSade.9437:

Well, it’s a comp I adore to use. It’s not like I’m giving a kitten if the superprol33tspeedzrecordz meta changes; if all the characters in your party are built properly and know what to do you complete all runs in more or less the same time with any comp – as long as there’s a parvence of a warrior and maybe an elly.
It’s just some people that are obsessed with having a very specific comp with 300 ellys, thieves and warriors. You don’t need that.

Engie is even better if you’re minmaxing the minutiae precisely because they cover all the bases and give good DPS to boot. A single engie will give you might, vuln, DPS, and stealth by default and he can swap into reflect if necessary, although I’m not totally sold on the effectiveness of said reflects.

Nonetheless they are good in any circumstance because:

1) They are a huge damage boost to pugs due to all the might and vuln, plus their own high personal DPS.
2) They are a decent damage boost to casually-organized groups, because those groups aren’t likely to max vuln on their own.
3) They are a net DPS boost to absolutely minmaxed groups, because they enable the organizer(s) to drop out certain “necessary” utilities for DPS. That also includes stuff like might and vuln stacking, i.e. an ele can drop Weak Spot and go something like 6/2/2/4/0 instead of 5/5/0/4/0 for more DPS.

Which is what I’ve been saying since the start, but you know, HURR HB DMG BESS

Do eles run 5/5/0/4/0 apart with FGS? :o

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

deSade.9437:

Well, it’s a comp I adore to use. It’s not like I’m giving a kitten if the superprol33tspeedzrecordz meta changes; if all the characters in your party are built properly and know what to do you complete all runs in more or less the same time with any comp – as long as there’s a parvence of a warrior and maybe an elly.
It’s just some people that are obsessed with having a very specific comp with 300 ellys, thieves and warriors. You don’t need that.

Engie is even better if you’re minmaxing the minutiae precisely because they cover all the bases and give good DPS to boot. A single engie will give you might, vuln, DPS, and stealth by default and he can swap into reflect if necessary, although I’m not totally sold on the effectiveness of said reflects.

Nonetheless they are good in any circumstance because:

1) They are a huge damage boost to pugs due to all the might and vuln, plus their own high personal DPS.
2) They are a decent damage boost to casually-organized groups, because those groups aren’t likely to max vuln on their own.
3) They are a net DPS boost to absolutely minmaxed groups, because they enable the organizer(s) to drop out certain “necessary” utilities for DPS. That also includes stuff like might and vuln stacking, i.e. an ele can drop Weak Spot and go something like 6/2/2/4/0 instead of 5/5/0/4/0 for more DPS.

Which is what I’ve been saying since the start, but you know, HURR HB DMG BESS

Awaiting your sub 7 second lupicus kill with engi(s).

Darox.8069:

Do eles run 5/5/0/4/0 apart with FGS? :o

Not that I see any reason to, but apparently yes. #6u4n6v3r53

Darox.8069:

Do eles run 5/5/0/4/0 apart with FGS? :o

5/5/0/4/0 or 5/5/2/2/0 is going to the best DPS you’ll get per Fiery Rush. I dunno what else you would run but anything else is going to bring down your DPS even more and thus make 6/2/2/4/0 or 5/2/2/5/0 that much more attractive.

hendo.1940:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

deSade.9437:

Well, it’s a comp I adore to use. It’s not like I’m giving a kitten if the superprol33tspeedzrecordz meta changes; if all the characters in your party are built properly and know what to do you complete all runs in more or less the same time with any comp – as long as there’s a parvence of a warrior and maybe an elly.
It’s just some people that are obsessed with having a very specific comp with 300 ellys, thieves and warriors. You don’t need that.

Engie is even better if you’re minmaxing the minutiae precisely because they cover all the bases and give good DPS to boot. A single engie will give you might, vuln, DPS, and stealth by default and he can swap into reflect if necessary, although I’m not totally sold on the effectiveness of said reflects.

Nonetheless they are good in any circumstance because:

1) They are a huge damage boost to pugs due to all the might and vuln, plus their own high personal DPS.
2) They are a decent damage boost to casually-organized groups, because those groups aren’t likely to max vuln on their own.
3) They are a net DPS boost to absolutely minmaxed groups, because they enable the organizer(s) to drop out certain “necessary” utilities for DPS. That also includes stuff like might and vuln stacking, i.e. an ele can drop Weak Spot and go something like 6/2/2/4/0 instead of 5/5/0/4/0 for more DPS.

Which is what I’ve been saying since the start, but you know, HURR HB DMG BESS

Awaiting your sub 7 second lupicus kill with engi(s).

What

maha.7902:

hendo.1940:

Awaiting your sub 7 second lupicus kill with engi(s).

What

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

3) They are a net DPS boost to absolutely minmaxed groups, because they enable the organizer(s) to drop out certain “necessary” utilities for DPS. That also includes stuff like might and vuln stacking, i.e. an ele can drop Weak Spot and go something like 6/2/2/4/0 instead of 5/5/0/4/0 for more DPS.

hendo.1940

Dat

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Darox.8069:

Do eles run 5/5/0/4/0 apart with FGS? :o

5/5/0/4/0 or 5/5/2/2/0 is going to the best DPS you’ll get per Fiery Rush. I dunno what else you would run but anything else is going to bring down your DPS even more and thus make 6/2/2/4/0 or 5/2/2/5/0 that much more attractive.

I knew you had no idea about actual gameplay, but it seems you have no idea about theorycrafting either.

maha.7902:

hendo.1940:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

deSade.9437:

Well, it’s a comp I adore to use. It’s not like I’m giving a kitten if the superprol33tspeedzrecordz meta changes; if all the characters in your party are built properly and know what to do you complete all runs in more or less the same time with any comp – as long as there’s a parvence of a warrior and maybe an elly.
It’s just some people that are obsessed with having a very specific comp with 300 ellys, thieves and warriors. You don’t need that.

Engie is even better if you’re minmaxing the minutiae precisely because they cover all the bases and give good DPS to boot. A single engie will give you might, vuln, DPS, and stealth by default and he can swap into reflect if necessary, although I’m not totally sold on the effectiveness of said reflects.

Nonetheless they are good in any circumstance because:

1) They are a huge damage boost to pugs due to all the might and vuln, plus their own high personal DPS.
2) They are a decent damage boost to casually-organized groups, because those groups aren’t likely to max vuln on their own.
3) They are a net DPS boost to absolutely minmaxed groups, because they enable the organizer(s) to drop out certain “necessary” utilities for DPS. That also includes stuff like might and vuln stacking, i.e. an ele can drop Weak Spot and go something like 6/2/2/4/0 instead of 5/5/0/4/0 for more DPS.

Which is what I’ve been saying since the start, but you know, HURR HB DMG BESS

Awaiting your sub 7 second lupicus kill with engi(s).

What

rT killed Lupicus in 7 seconds, the fight was highly theorycrafted and nothing was left to chance. No engis were involved. If Guang is right, which is very unlikely considering his pas record, then he should be able to make a sub 7 seconds kill.

Record a speed kill without fgs, no engi, then record a speed kill again with no fgs but with an engi. There’s no point mentioning that record when it’s done with an overpowered weapon, of course an engi isn’t going to be able to beat that kind of damage, but in a conventional setting, who knows.

Also highly unlikely there, aside of which, there are just a very, very few boss kills without the use of conjured weapons.

maha.7902:

Record a speed kill without fgs, no engi, then record a speed kill again with no fgs but with an engi. There’s no point mentioning that record when it’s done with an overpowered weapon, of course an engi isn’t going to be able to beat that kind of damage, but in a conventional setting, who knows.

Yeah there was the Ascension Challenge for stuff like that but we don’t do that anymore

hendo.1940:

Guanglai Kangyi.4318:

Darox.8069:

Do eles run 5/5/0/4/0 apart with FGS? :o

5/5/0/4/0 or 5/5/2/2/0 is going to the best DPS you’ll get per Fiery Rush. I dunno what else you would run but anything else is going to bring down your DPS even more and thus make 6/2/2/4/0 or 5/2/2/5/0 that much more attractive.

I knew you had no idea about actual gameplay, but it seems you have no idea about theorycrafting either.

Enlighten me then.

0/4/5/5/0

There’s an easy way to test this. Guang, make a 5 person theorycrafted team. Have rT test it and record the run so we can all see they made a good faith effort.

We can make a Google doc and take bets to make up for Azreel bailing on Hendo.