Guild Wars 2

Assuming all buffs including spotter and full zerk, scholar runes, night/force sigils, power infusions, sweet and spicy butternut squash soup, and powerful potions.

5/5/0/4/0 GS+Hammer Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 20283 and DPS = 11606
4/6/2/0/2 GS+Sword/Focus Rotation with Bloodlust stacks EP = 21102 and DPS = 11359
4/5/0/0/5 GS+Sword/Focus Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 19835 and DPS = 11063
3/5/0/4/2 GS+Hammer Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 17095 and DPS = 10675
4/6/2/0/2 Sword/Focus Camping with Bloodlust stacks EP = 21102 and DPS = 8149
3/5/0/6/0 Staff Camping with Preception stacks EP = 17095 and DPS = 7778

People accepted sword camping as a great idea in the past. Some still do or are too lazy to do rotations. I guess those people mine as well have ran staff and cleaved better . Gandolf OP.

I wonder a bit, do you take full buffs into account? Because 11k dps seems a bit low to me, in that case.

The calcs that were run assumed vuln, banners, spotter, ea, fury, might, and 4 boons. Frost spirit and unscathed weren’t used.

I am a Staff/GS guardian and i don’t use Zerker gear, PvT/Cleric, I love the staff for Empower heals and might stacks, now there are some dungeons in which i go Hammer/Mace and Shield..

Sad truth.

Nemesis.2019:

I am a Staff/GS guardian and i don’t use Zerker gear, PvT/Cleric, I love the staff for Empower heals and might stacks, now there are some dungeons in which i go Hammer/Mace and Shield..

Why.

Nemesis.2019:

I am a Staff/GS guardian and i don’t use Zerker gear, PvT/Cleric, I love the staff for Empower heals and might stacks, now there are some dungeons in which i go Hammer/Mace and Shield..

We already know you suck, you don’t have to come and confirm it again.

Its a different one. :P

Anyway what about GS camping?

spoj.9672:

Its a different one. :P

Anyway what about GS camping?

There are more? Dear god…

spoj.9672:

Its a different one. :P

Anyway what about GS camping?

It’s only about a 10% loss. Hammer is the same. It’s really not that bad in comparison to others.

Just saw a guard with mace + shield in CoE.

My feels.

obal.3218:

Assuming all buffs including spotter and full zerk, scholar runes, night/force sigils, power infusions, sweet and spicy butternut squash soup, and powerful potions.

5/5/0/4/0 GS+Hammer Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 20283 and DPS = 11606
4/6/2/0/2 GS+Sword/Focus Rotation with Bloodlust stacks EP = 21102 and DPS = 11359
4/5/0/0/5 GS+Sword/Focus Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 19835 and DPS = 11063
3/5/0/4/2 GS+Hammer Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 17095 and DPS = 10675
4/6/2/0/2 Sword/Focus Camping with Bloodlust stacks EP = 21102 and DPS = 8149
3/5/0/6/0 Staff Camping with Preception stacks EP = 17095 and DPS = 7778

hendo.1940:

I wonder a bit, do you take full buffs into account? Because 11k dps seems a bit low to me, in that case.

Obal’s calculator here. I assumed 0% UC uptime, even on builds that could take UC. Of course, if you have even 1/2 UC uptime, then things look more like…

• 6/6/0/0/2 GS+Sc/F, 12 hits from Smite: 12186 DPS (12552 with spotter)
• 4/6/2/0/2 GS+Sw/F: 12151 DPS (12466 with spotter)
• 5/5/2/0/2 GS+Ham: 11627 DPS (12079 with spotter)

Theses figures are based on 30 second rotations that Obal recorded for me and include condition damage. The coefficients for WW on the wiki seemed really off to me so I estimated my own based on tooltips and sampling, so instead of getting about 3.9 for a full WW inside a hitbox I got something more like 3.6. The DPS estimates for guard seem pretty in line with warriors, where I estimated about 12.5k – 13k DPS without bleed damage for DPS builds and 10.9k DPS for an EA build. Ele’s come in around 13- 14.5k DPS without FGS.

Thanks Obal’s calcul… Dekeys for running these numbers, can’t wait to see the rest. Hopefully the dev’s will finally see this and maybe do something. Maybe…

They will nerf necromancers -_-

Azreell.1568:

GW2 has become such a toxic player base.

And you wonder why people are continually leaving this game….

I’m going to use this analogy. For players like you to try and see from seasoned dungeons runners perspective.

When you apply for a certain college course, they have certain grades/requirements. Now these certain college course have a standard to uphold – they aren’t going to accept anyone with any grade level. If you don’t fulfill these requirements, then the college course has the right to deny you a place on the course. In favour of someone that does meet their requirements.

If these courses are only accepting people with certain grades – why can’t the dunegon runners on GW2?. If there is an issue with attitudes, which you get from a minority of the dungeon player base – I get that. However you can’t hold the rest accountable for it. They can’t do much, if they don’t know who the player is. They can advise you as to what you can do, if certain players are behaving inappropriately in dungeon runs. Like for instances, lfg: “all welcome – casual run. No experience needed”, you joined and then for no fault of your own, they kick you (and others) and then change it to “zerk gears, lvl 80. No noobs” at some point in the dungeon.

Good analogy.

I’ve been known to run staff as my alternate weapon for the Might stacks and heals (while waiting for weapon cooldown), plus that speed buff and knockdown line can be pretty handy when running through a bunch of mobs. My GS is for DPS. If there’s another class that is spamming Might, I run Scepter/Torch or Scepter/Shield depending on what dungeon.

I’ve only run into one PUG guardian that was using staff exclusively. I just asked him what his other weapon was, he said GS, and I said use that instead, and he did.

Other than that it’s typically hammer or GS from what I’ve experience, with scepter/shield as alternate.

Guess I’ve been lucky.

Want some fun? Pm Azreell ingame with “I’ve been waiting three hours for you at 5 am.”

Staff guard is OP solo vs Belka (Arah p2). It’s a good set of training wheels, as you can hide behind the barriers and aa through them, (slowly) doing damage to Belka while also clearing out some barrels. The heal from #4 isn’t much, but it’s often enough to top things off there.

A lot of terribad guardian builds end up being useful while soloing. Spirit weapons are great when I need something else around to hold aggro.

hendo.1940:

Want some fun? Pm Azreell ingame with “I’ve been waiting three hours for you at 5 am.”

My version was much funnier Sadly Mr. Whisker has been waiting for hours at his door but he never answered.

deSade.9437:

hendo.1940:

Want some fun? Pm Azreell ingame with “I’ve been waiting three hours for you at 5 am.”

My version was much funnier Sadly Mr. Whisker has been waiting for hours at his door but he never answered.

He must not be a cat person.

Clumsy.6257:

Theres no reasoning with the average pug guardian. Your only decent solution is to kick all pug guardians.

Or better, do not pug in the first place if you can’t deal with people not playing the way you want. Alternatively, make it clear you don’t want them in your group in the first place so at least they partly deserve the kick.

Haters gotta hate, and I hate it.

Yup, I confirm. Having even a bad ele that makes only 2 blasts and pinging my Phalanx gear definitely is enough to have staff guardians change their weapons, basically telling them that their weapon is useless. So far on 8 occurrences, it worked 7 times. The last one stuck to his staff and was kicked, not even by me but by the others because he “provided useless might, which was the only benefit of staff” according to the others :P

u must be a kid if ur an elitist in a game, amirite or amirite guise?

Well, I’m only 12, so I don’t really know what entitlement means, but that guy was a poo-poo head.

I felt so old. Friday in TS someone told me they were 15. I felt like I had to sign off because I’d get in trouble for being a cougar or something.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

I felt so old. Friday in TS someone told me they were 15. I felt like I had to sign off because I’d get in trouble for being a cougar or something.

I know the feeling (the age thing not the cougar ). Sadly i’m getting youngophobe as i’m getting older. They are getting on my nerve way too fast for it to be an healthy response.

It not about having a issue with casual players that just don’t have enough time to dedicates to the game to become better. Its about mutual respect when we party up in a dungeon. We are into that dungeon together are when you see a staff guardian or bearbow ranger, you know that he bring so little to the party that he could just stay AFK at the beginning of the path while the rest of the group do the jobs. (That’s a figure of speech). Its like building something. You see someone working with you and he’s using a screwdriver to install nails. You ask him to use a hammer for that, because that’s a better option and you don’t want him to install 2 nails, while you are doing all the job. Its normal to ask him to use a hammer (even if it to build something for fun) and not a screwdriver. And its normal to ask someone in a dungeon to use a sword, a hammer or a greatsword in a dungeon and not a staff. Staff have its use in WvW but its really limited in dungeon.

Most (admittedly, not all) of us “elitists” have absolutely no problems with inexperienced players, or even the “Play how I want” crowd.

What annoys us is when these people join our speedclear runs and don’t have the first clue when it comes to doing a speed run. Things stop being fun very quickly.

To the PHIWs that stick with groups that they’ll actually have fun in and not prevent the rest of the group from enjoying the run…we love those guys.

Personally, I don’t mind getting new people, even with “bad” builds in a PUG. As long as they listen, pay attention, and aren’t allergic to teamwork, it’s a nice change of pace from my usual group that just blows through dungeon after dungeon, night after night xD

Thaddeus.4891:

It not about having a issue with casual players that just don’t have enough time to dedicates to the game to become better. Its about mutual respect when we party up in a dungeon. We are into that dungeon together are when you see a staff guardian or bearbow ranger, you know that he bring so little to the party that he could just stay AFK at the beginning of the path while the rest of the group do the jobs. (That’s a figure of speech). Its like building something. You see someone working with you and he’s using a screwdriver to install nails. You ask him to use a hammer for that, because that’s a better option and you don’t want him to install 2 nails, while you are doing all the job. Its normal to ask him to use a hammer (even if it to build something for fun) and not a screwdriver. And its normal to ask someone in a dungeon to use a sword, a hammer or a greatsword in a dungeon and not a staff. Staff have its use in WvW but its really limited in dungeon.

My guardian recently hit 80 and I barely touched the staff other than map running… and I know that it is possible top 3 worst weapons for a dungeon run, but still, I know it can provide 12 mights, swiftness all the time, 2 heals and a wall to either keep mobs at bay or keep them close so they won’t run (also used wisely it could be a perma interrupt as it keeps knocking a target against a wall). Point is, even on its uselessness, it provides something; and if that is what makes him happy, then I don’t see it as much of an issue to deal with, asking him to change his way of playing so I can be doing another stupid thing in this game in a different scenario. I find it more fun-killer when a prick start bashing a player in the group rather than a player who does less damage than the rest.

My thought is, am I really going to annoy this guy so I don’t get out of here 5 minutes later? what’s the point? to enter another dungeon 5 minutes earlier? Am I that kind of person? It’s just a video game…

For fun sake: Attitude > Skill. It would be different if we were talking about business where real money is involved, but for recreation? I prefer the guy that has fun by his own than the guy who can’t have fun if the rest is not doing what he thinks is best.

obal.3218:

Assuming all buffs including spotter and full zerk, scholar runes, night/force sigils, power infusions, sweet and spicy butternut squash soup, and powerful potions.

5/5/0/4/0 GS+Hammer Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 20283 and DPS = 11606
4/6/2/0/2 GS+Sword/Focus Rotation with Bloodlust stacks EP = 21102 and DPS = 11359
4/5/0/0/5 GS+Sword/Focus Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 19835 and DPS = 11063
3/5/0/4/2 GS+Hammer Rotation with Preception stacks EP = 17095 and DPS = 10675
4/6/2/0/2 Sword/Focus Camping with Bloodlust stacks EP = 21102 and DPS = 8149
3/5/0/6/0 Staff Camping with Preception stacks EP = 17095 and DPS = 7778

People accepted sword camping as a great idea in the past. Some still do or are too lazy to do rotations. I guess those people mine as well have ran staff and cleaved better . Gandolf OP.

Our numbers are a bit different but the relative values look similar so it’s probably just an issue of the way we calculate things specifically. That said you should keep in mind that you’ve got Spotter and banners on the Guardian in this case which is putting your sword crit chance at like 107% which is basically entirely wasting the point of taking sword in the first place. Once you cut out Spotter GS/Hammer becomes 11817 (for me) versus 10558 for sword, which is a lot closer in overall daamge.

For a pug, sword is probably the best failsafe option for AFK if you don’t want them screwing up fire fields with a hammer, since expecting a pug ranger to have Spotter is pretty unrealistic, and Fury is pretty spotty as well. If you’re looking solely at self-buffed damage, sword camp actually comes pretty close to hammer camp since that extra 15% crit chance makes a way bigger difference when you’re sitting at around 50% than when you’re at 85%.

I just hate how most of people who join my Berserker speed run, think “they are exaggerating, they won’t notice my PVT gear” yes we do, and yes you slow up the whole thing. If I ask for melee lupicus, melee it. Most of the time my LFG are plain and I don’t ask for anything in particular, but when I do it’s because I don’t have much time and I don’t want to deal with a kitten bearbow or staff guardian.

Also there is a huge influx of shortbow camping thieves recently and it scares me.

Mesket.5728:

Thaddeus.4891:

It not about having a issue with casual players that just don’t have enough time to dedicates to the game to become better. Its about mutual respect when we party up in a dungeon. We are into that dungeon together are when you see a staff guardian or bearbow ranger, you know that he bring so little to the party that he could just stay AFK at the beginning of the path while the rest of the group do the jobs. (That’s a figure of speech). Its like building something. You see someone working with you and he’s using a screwdriver to install nails. You ask him to use a hammer for that, because that’s a better option and you don’t want him to install 2 nails, while you are doing all the job. Its normal to ask him to use a hammer (even if it to build something for fun) and not a screwdriver. And its normal to ask someone in a dungeon to use a sword, a hammer or a greatsword in a dungeon and not a staff. Staff have its use in WvW but its really limited in dungeon.

My guardian recently hit 80 and I barely touched the staff other than map running… and I know that it is possible top 3 worst weapons for a dungeon run, but still, I know it can provide 12 mights, swiftness all the time, 2 heals and a wall to either keep mobs at bay or keep them close so they won’t run (also used wisely it could be a perma interrupt as it keeps knocking a target against a wall). Point is, even on its uselessness, it provides something; and if that is what makes him happy, then I don’t see it as much of an issue to deal with, asking him to change his way of playing so I can be doing another stupid thing in this game in a different scenario. I find it more fun-killer when a prick start bashing a player in the group rather than a player who does less damage than the rest.

My thought is, am I really going to annoy this guy so I don’t get out of here 5 minutes later? what’s the point? to enter another dungeon 5 minutes earlier? Am I that kind of person? It’s just a video game…

For fun sake: Attitude > Skill. It would be different if we were talking about business where real money is involved, but for recreation? I prefer the guy that has fun by his own than the guy who can’t have fun if the rest is not doing what he thinks is best.

You’re missing one key element. We’re talking dungeons and a team here, not a bunch of people doing solo content and being randomly called out. No we are to work as a team and if someone makes a request if it’s not too much trouble following it would be nice.

If you can’t change your weapon out you’re quite the stubborn player. I like my hammer on guard, it really makes some things easy because what would be one shots are no longer one shots with protection. It’s nice. But if an Ele or someone asks me to drop it so they can use their fields, I’m dropping it.

I don’t like kicking people, and I rarely even second them, but I have no problem with selfish people getting kicked from dungeons I’m in.

We really should change the topic title to “How to hand staff guardians in speed clears”….

dlonie.6547:

We really should change the topic title to “How to hand staff guardians in speed clears”….

I will not change the topic. With 2 exceptions (the 2 TA paths), the staff is a bad weapon for a guardian in a dungeon. Period.

Fror.2163:

dlonie.6547:

We really should change the topic title to “How to hand staff guardians in speed clears”….

I will not change the topic. With 2 exceptions (the 2 TA paths), the staff is a bad weapon for a guardian in a dungeon. Period.

I agree, staff is bad.

But you want people to understand your point of view, it’ll help to show some understanding of theirs. Casuals want to have casual fun, and that’s fine in casual groups. If the entire team is PHIW and doesn’t mind non-optimal builds, there’s no harm.

Not really being serious about the topic change, I’m just amused by the amount of bootie-ouched (avoiding a cat here) people don’t read and think that we’re talking about all parties.

But then, I read things like the post I’ve quoted above, I can see why they lump us all together as narrowminded elitists.

shrugs

Mesket.5728:

My guardian recently hit 80 and I barely touched the staff other than map running… and I know that it is possible top 3 worst weapons for a dungeon run, but still, I know it can provide 12 mights, swiftness all the time, 2 heals and a wall to either keep mobs at bay or keep them close so they won’t run (also used wisely it could be a perma interrupt as it keeps knocking a target against a wall). Point is, even on its uselessness, it provides something; and if that is what makes him happy, then I don’t see it as much of an issue to deal with, asking him to change his way of playing so I can be doing another stupid thing in this game in a different scenario. I find it more fun-killer when a prick start bashing a player in the group rather than a player who does less damage than the rest.

My thought is, am I really going to annoy this guy so I don’t get out of here 5 minutes later? what’s the point? to enter another dungeon 5 minutes earlier? Am I that kind of person? It’s just a video game…

For fun sake: Attitude > Skill. It would be different if we were talking about business where real money is involved, but for recreation? I prefer the guy that has fun by his own than the guy who can’t have fun if the rest is not doing what he thinks is best.

Its not a white and black issue. If I ask for speed clear, exp, fast run or something like that and you join on a clerics staff guardian, then i’ll kick you, because I ask for something in particular. But if i didn’t ask for something particular and a clearic staff guardian join, i won’t kick him. I’ll carry him and try to point him in the right direction (because clerics staff guardian is really like using a screwdriver on a nail, it work, it could be fun, its really not the right way of doing it). I don’t mind that he follow my advice or not. I’ll carry him with my team since i didn’t ask for something specific. And most of the time he won’t change anything for the path if the rest of the group is decent and he follow some basic direction (stack here, don’t aggro that, etc). But if there is 1 bearbow, 1 staff guardian and 1 minion master in my group, then it won’t take 5 more minutes, its will be A LOT MORE than that. 3 days ago, it took me 55min to go through a AC path 2. The party description was saying BE PRO OR BE KICK, so I joined since ac path 2 in a good pug group take less than 15-20min. But the party leader that created that description quit the party and they didn’t change it. By the time i figure out that 2 were relatively new and 1 had a freaking minon build that screw up half the stacks, it was too late. I had created the instance and i’m not a prick and kick everybody out of the instance, so i finished it with them. But it was 55min of frustration compare to a 45min of fun doing ALL the path of AC with my guild or a good pug group. I don’t mind if you play a staff guardian because you find that fun, but when your fun destroy my fun, then I prefer we go our separate ways so that everybody have fun.

Thaddeus.4891:

I don’t mind if you play a staff guardian because you find that fun, but when your fun destroy my fun, then I prefer we go our separate ways so that everybody have fun.

This sums it all up I think. And insert whatever you want for “staff guardian” there.

^ Especially when it is likely you’re speaking with your peers.

Forum buginesssss

Guild Wars is a pretty casual MMO. I don’t think that’s a huge shock to anyone here.

mmh im not a guard but it feel like this thread is a bit “sloppy”.

If you are speaking of premade\guild party yeah staff guard isnt allowed and you all are right.

If you are speaking of pugs i really dont believe that you usually find war\ele capable to hold up 25 might stack every fight.

Common pugs party might it’s around 10/15 might stack.

I am not speaking as a guard, im speaking as a mesmer and everytime i have to pug i have (sadly) to take off a single mantra to take inspiration to 2x might cause pugs arent blasting.

So speaking of pugs i dont feel to blame a guard who is using staff to stack 12 more might before the fight to cover war and ele lack

And, on math side, if you’re party is 12 might stack rather than 25 the 12 additional stack from empowerer it’s around 10% more party dps.

10% more party dmg or hammer? kinda crap question 10% more party win. math is math.

On good party staff is crap, on normal lowend party staff add more dmg than hammer so before kick the staff guard kick the ele\war everytime you dont have 25 might stack

my 2 cents

aelfwe.4239:

mmh im not a guard but it feel like this thread is a bit “sloppy”.

If you are speaking of premade\guild party yeah staff guard isnt allowed and you all are right.

If you are speaking of pugs i really dont believe that you usually find war\ele capable to hold up 25 might stack every fight.

Common pugs party might it’s around 10/15 might stack.

I am not speaking as a guard, im speaking as a mesmer and everytime i have to pug i have (sadly) to take off a single mantra to take inspiration to 2x might cause pugs arent blasting.

So speaking of pugs i dont feel to blame a guard who is using staff to stack 12 more might before the fight to cover war and ele lack

And, on math side, if you’re party is 12 might stack rather than 25 the 12 additional stack from empowerer it’s around 10% more party dps.

10% more party dmg or hammer? kinda crap question 10% more party win. math is math.

On good party staff is crap, on normal lowend party staff add more dmg than hammer so before kick the staff guard kick the ele\war everytime you dont have 25 might stack

my 2 cents

1. Since the inception of Phalanx Ive yet to be in a group where atleast 1 war isnt it. (barring pre 80 groups)
2. Is ele that stacks might though Cant to 25
3. Most staff guards dont ONLY stack might they ^STAY^ on staff for the whole dungeon
4.LOL kick ele before guard

DonQuack.9025:

aelfwe.4239:

mmh im not a guard but it feel like this thread is a bit “sloppy”.

If you are speaking of premade\guild party yeah staff guard isnt allowed and you all are right.

If you are speaking of pugs i really dont believe that you usually find war\ele capable to hold up 25 might stack every fight.

Common pugs party might it’s around 10/15 might stack.

I am not speaking as a guard, im speaking as a mesmer and everytime i have to pug i have (sadly) to take off a single mantra to take inspiration to 2x might cause pugs arent blasting.

So speaking of pugs i dont feel to blame a guard who is using staff to stack 12 more might before the fight to cover war and ele lack

And, on math side, if you’re party is 12 might stack rather than 25 the 12 additional stack from empowerer it’s around 10% more party dps.

10% more party dmg or hammer? kinda crap question 10% more party win. math is math.

On good party staff is crap, on normal lowend party staff add more dmg than hammer so before kick the staff guard kick the ele\war everytime you dont have 25 might stack

my 2 cents

1. Since the inception of Phalanx Ive yet to be in a group where atleast 1 war isnt it. (barring pre 80 groups)
2. Is ele that stacks might though Cant to 25
3. Most staff guards dont ONLY stack might they ^STAY^ on staff for the whole dungeon
4.LOL kick ele before guard

1. Since the “inception of Phalanx” in pugs i had only 1 phalanx war, you are really luck or you arent puggin
2. in fact i’ve spoken of ele+war not just ele, combo, ever heard of that?
3. in fact i’ve spoken of guard who HAVE to go staff when war+ele arent stack might
4. in fact i’ve spoken of ele who isnt stacking might, putting reliable vuln and using conjured on the right spot, ofc i kick him. cause its fail regardless being ele.

If there something else you have not understood but you will to change\missunderstanding feel free to keep, my eng is bad but i have patience

aelfwe.4239:

DonQuack.9025:

aelfwe.4239:

mmh im not a guard but it feel like this thread is a bit “sloppy”.

If you are speaking of premade\guild party yeah staff guard isnt allowed and you all are right.

If you are speaking of pugs i really dont believe that you usually find war\ele capable to hold up 25 might stack every fight.

Common pugs party might it’s around 10/15 might stack.

I am not speaking as a guard, im speaking as a mesmer and everytime i have to pug i have (sadly) to take off a single mantra to take inspiration to 2x might cause pugs arent blasting.

So speaking of pugs i dont feel to blame a guard who is using staff to stack 12 more might before the fight to cover war and ele lack

And, on math side, if you’re party is 12 might stack rather than 25 the 12 additional stack from empowerer it’s around 10% more party dps.

10% more party dmg or hammer? kinda crap question 10% more party win. math is math.

On good party staff is crap, on normal lowend party staff add more dmg than hammer so before kick the staff guard kick the ele\war everytime you dont have 25 might stack

my 2 cents

1. Since the inception of Phalanx Ive yet to be in a group where atleast 1 war isnt it. (barring pre 80 groups)
2. Is ele that stacks might though Cant to 25
3. Most staff guards dont ONLY stack might they ^STAY^ on staff for the whole dungeon
4.LOL kick ele before guard

1. Since the “inception of Phalanx” in pugs i had only 1 phalanx war, you are really luck or you arent puggin
2. in fact i’ve spoken of ele+war not just ele, combo, ever heard of that?
3. in fact i’ve spoken of guard who HAVE to go staff when war+ele arent stack might
4. in fact i’ve spoken of ele who isnt stacking might, putting reliable vuln and using conjured on the right spot, ofc i kick him. cause its fail regardless being ele.

If there something else you have not understood but you will to change\missunderstanding feel free to keep, my eng is bad but i have patience

\ doesnt usually mean AND

but I think you know that considering you used slash @ “change\missunderstanding”

DonQuack.9025:

aelfwe.4239:

DonQuack.9025:

aelfwe.4239:

mmh im not a guard but it feel like this thread is a bit “sloppy”.

If you are speaking of premade\guild party yeah staff guard isnt allowed and you all are right.

If you are speaking of pugs i really dont believe that you usually find war\ele capable to hold up 25 might stack every fight.

Common pugs party might it’s around 10/15 might stack.

I am not speaking as a guard, im speaking as a mesmer and everytime i have to pug i have (sadly) to take off a single mantra to take inspiration to 2x might cause pugs arent blasting.

So speaking of pugs i dont feel to blame a guard who is using staff to stack 12 more might before the fight to cover war and ele lack

And, on math side, if you’re party is 12 might stack rather than 25 the 12 additional stack from empowerer it’s around 10% more party dps.

10% more party dmg or hammer? kinda crap question 10% more party win. math is math.

On good party staff is crap, on normal lowend party staff add more dmg than hammer so before kick the staff guard kick the ele\war everytime you dont have 25 might stack

my 2 cents

1. Since the inception of Phalanx Ive yet to be in a group where atleast 1 war isnt it. (barring pre 80 groups)
2. Is ele that stacks might though Cant to 25
3. Most staff guards dont ONLY stack might they ^STAY^ on staff for the whole dungeon
4.LOL kick ele before guard

1. Since the “inception of Phalanx” in pugs i had only 1 phalanx war, you are really luck or you arent puggin
2. in fact i’ve spoken of ele+war not just ele, combo, ever heard of that?
3. in fact i’ve spoken of guard who HAVE to go staff when war+ele arent stack might
4. in fact i’ve spoken of ele who isnt stacking might, putting reliable vuln and using conjured on the right spot, ofc i kick him. cause its fail regardless being ele.

If there something else you have not understood but you will to change\missunderstanding feel free to keep, my eng is bad but i have patience

\ doesnt usually mean AND

but I think you know that considering you used slash @ “change\missunderstanding”

5. “\” in fact means “or” cause “/” is too mainstream

aelfwe.4239:

mmh im not a guard but it feel like this thread is a bit “sloppy”.

If you are speaking of premade\guild party yeah staff guard isnt allowed and you all are right.

If you are speaking of pugs i really dont believe that you usually find war\ele capable to hold up 25 might stack every fight.

Common pugs party might it’s around 10/15 might stack.

I am not speaking as a guard, im speaking as a mesmer and everytime i have to pug i have (sadly) to take off a single mantra to take inspiration to 2x might cause pugs arent blasting.

So speaking of pugs i dont feel to blame a guard who is using staff to stack 12 more might before the fight to cover war and ele lack

And, on math side, if you’re party is 12 might stack rather than 25 the 12 additional stack from empowerer it’s around 10% more party dps.

10% more party dmg or hammer? kinda crap question 10% more party win. math is math.

On good party staff is crap, on normal lowend party staff add more dmg than hammer so before kick the staff guard kick the ele\war everytime you dont have 25 might stack

my 2 cents

No doubt Staff has a lot of utility. I think the complaint is people who stick on their staff. It just isn’t worth it.

Pull the staff out when it’s helpful, but when the fight starts, put the dang thing away =)

I play guard, I use staff a lot, but I almost never fight with it, especially in dungeons. Rare occasions where the wide cone is helpful, or to stack bloodlust if I’m leaving the staff in. But, that’s it. I do see PUG guards who camp it though, and even myself being a big fan of the utility it provides I’m facepalming when I see that.

If you have crappy warrior / ele, who can’t stack might, Empower won’t really help.
Also the might from it last for only 10 second, which often useless, especially how pugs doing this. Stack might, wait to minutes, agro boss. Blasting might is 20 second by default, just sayin.

The reason i see every time when i dare to ask a guard, why on earth s/he uses staff, the answer is “support”. What support? Apart from Empower, which is overall a bad skill imo, it has nothing to offer, especially on single targets. GS, hammer and sword/focus has so much more potential, hell, even if you need to range scepter has an immobilize on it which is actually helpful and can be used on every boss, not like Line of warding ….

Or the damage. Even if you are not into math, just look at the numbers. You just look at it and after the first hit you realize how bad it is compared to everything else, but i guess these kind of players never tryied any other weapon.
Pug logic is far from human logic. I don’t get it. :/

The other obsession is full shout builds with soldier runes. I guess it has something to do with WvW again or strife’s videos still has an influence on a lot of players (his videos just outdated, at that time it looked good), but why on earth you stack condi removal, when there isnt much content where you actually need it?

Dalanor.5387:

If you have crappy warrior / ele, who can’t stack might, Empower won’t really help.
Also the might from it last for only 10 second, which often useless, especially how pugs doing this. Stack might, wait to minutes, agro boss. Blasting might is 20 second by default, just sayin.

I know blasting might is 20 sec, but, as you told, we are speaking of pugs party with “crappy warrior / ele who can’t stack might”.

Empowerer 10 sec isnt the optimal solution ofc, but it’s kinda better than anything when you are with craps.

I point out fact 12 might stack it’s 420 power that on full zerk party means around +12% party dps increase (and that’s math). If your party during fight stand under 15 might stacks you wont find any other skill (outside fury) who add more dmg than empowerer.

And about “how pugs stack might” you arent a bot, you have a brain and if you have to cast empowerer to cover craps fault and you cast it before the pull it’s your bad. Pull, empowerer, switch.

On general point of view im totally agree about guard meta build\weapons.

Guard should NOT go staff.

But it would be nice to be a little realistic too. Pug party often doesnt have 25might stacks, perma fury and 25 vuln on boss like premades.

So before complaing guard it would be nice to check out might\fury\vuln with pugs.

If your party might is 20+ and the guard stay staff, blame the guard.

If you party might is 10 stack start blaming other then right after you reach 20 might stack if the guard keep stayin on staff blame him.

I’m kinda tired of people who act like a pro on a casual game where 95% of fights are soloable just cause they copy builds on forum without realizing that meta build are made upon the statement you have 25might\25vuln\fury\disc etc.

This game deserve some REAL challenging content to push people to understand why they are using a metabuild and what they have to do about buff during fight to take 100% advantage from the build they’re using

aelfwe.4239:

Dalanor.5387:

If you have crappy warrior / ele, who can’t stack might, Empower won’t really help.
Also the might from it last for only 10 second, which often useless, especially how pugs doing this. Stack might, wait to minutes, agro boss. Blasting might is 20 second by default, just sayin.

I know blasting might is 20 sec, but, as you told, we are speaking of pugs party with “crappy warrior / ele who can’t stack might”.

Empowerer 10 sec isnt the optimal solution ofc, but it’s kinda better than anything when you are with craps.

I point out fact 12 might stack it’s 420 power that on full zerk party means around +12% party dps increase (and that’s math). If your party during fight stand under 15 might stacks you wont find any other skill (outside fury) who add more dmg than empowerer.

And about “how pugs stack might” you arent a bot, you have a brain and if you have to cast empowerer to cover craps fault and you cast it before the pull it’s your bad. Pull, empowerer, switch.

On general point of view im totally agree about guard meta build\weapons.

Guard should NOT go staff.

But it would be nice to be a little realistic too. Pug party often doesnt have 25might stacks, perma fury and 25 vuln on boss like premades.

So before complaing guard it would be nice to check out might\fury\vuln with pugs.

If your party might is 20+ and the guard stay staff, blame the guard.

If you party might is 10 stack start blaming other then right after you reach 20 might stack if the guard keep stayin on staff blame him.

I’m kinda tired of people who act like a pro on a casual game where 95% of fights are soloable just cause they copy builds on forum without realizing that meta build are made upon the statement you have 25might\25vuln\fury\disc etc.

This game deserve some REAL challenging content to push people to understand why they are using a metabuild and what they have to do about buff during fight to take 100% advantage from the build they’re using

I wanted to point out the fact, that if your party have a crappy warrior and a crappy ele and you are a crappy staff camper guardian, 60% of your party is crap, therefore 12 stack of 10 second might wont help. End of story. Not even if you guardian swaps to something else.

ps: I’m almost 100% sure it’s not that much dps increase in itself.

If support was really your main concern you’d be running a Phalanx warrior or Grenade engie. Hell, even hammer guard with Purging Flames/Hallowed Ground gives better average might stacking so you don’t even really have the “well I rolled a guardian so I’m working with what I got” excuse to fall back on.