Hey dude you are walking into a wall.
smack..Wut?…smack…smack…
smack..Wut?…smack…smack…
Anet Needs someone to Talk to the Forums
They absolutely need someone active on these forums to give players the sense that they’re being listened to. Because right now, while our feedback obviously IS getting to the developers, there’s still a disconnect because a lot of people NEED the reinforcement of “yes, we hear you.”
But at the same time, I think we also need to accept that even WITH that presence, the overall environment of the forums probably won’t change much (at least not right away), because there’s a significant population that want, and demand, more than any community manager or dev is willing or able to provide.
These people demand to know technical details, they demand promises, they demand immediate compensation the minute anything changes, and will even twist anything said INTO a promise if they have to. These people will not be mollified by a “we hear you.” If anything, it will make them ANGRIER.
But those people need to be ignored (if not banned if they become too belligerent). They cannot be allowed to dictate the conversation on the forums, like they have been especially this last year.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-27-guild-wars-2-preview?page=3
“Eurogamer: How are you handling endgame loot – will we be farming bosses?
Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game: armour pieces, potentially different potions – a lot of that is still up in the air and we’ll finalise a lot of those reward systems as we get closer to release. And those come off of things like the bosses at the end of dungeons – the raids."
Best statistical loot = BIS where I come from.
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
So Arena.net had to change course. It wasn’t a broken promise though, and a lot of the toxicity could have been avoided if players hadn’t twisted intent to make it one. We players ALSO have a responsibility to the environment we fester.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-27-guild-wars-2-preview?page=3
“Eurogamer: How are you handling endgame loot – will we be farming bosses?
Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game: armour pieces, potentially different potions – a lot of that is still up in the air and we’ll finalise a lot of those reward systems as we get closer to release. And those come off of things like the bosses at the end of dungeons – the raids."
Best statistical loot = BIS where I come from.
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
So Arena.net had to change course. It wasn’t a broken promise though, and a lot of the toxicity could have been avoided if players hadn’t twisted intent to make it one. We players ALSO have a responsibility to the environment we fester.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
I blame the players when they grossly overreact to anything. In this case, it was a bit of both; horrible communication from Arena.net (and what I would suspect is the right hand not knowing what the left hand was doing) and a vile overreaction from players.
Players had every right to question… but we went WAY over the top with some of the responses.
EDIT: I should say, the outrageous, over-the-top responses WERE from a very small group of players, and where Arena.net also failed. Rather than ignore the trolls, the company just left the room, and that’s probably the WORST response they could have made. It gave the rabble-rousers clout, and allowed them to dictate the environment.
The entire Ascended debacle WAS a cluster-kitten on Arena.net end, make no mistake.
(edited by chemiclord.3978)
There’s not much point. The most involved members of the community and the most knowledgeable were mostly perma banned from the forums a long time ago, or temp banned so many times they stopped coming back. What you’re left with isn’t really worth anet listening to.
If they were valuable then why did they get banned? Possibly calling out an A.Net employee or being abusive – which are bannable offenses BTW. If they did that, then they were definitely not the most valuable members of the community to me. One can definitely state their reasons and suggestions without being verbally abusive. That is not constructive.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
I blame the players when they grossly overreact to anything. In this case, it was a bit of both; horrible communication from Arena.net (and what I would suspect is the right hand not knowing what the left hand was doing) and a vile overreaction from players.
Players had every right to question… but we went WAY over the top with some of the responses.
I didn’t see these “vile gross overreactions” you’re claiming. I saw a lot of very factual posts that people were suspended for (which alienated people even more). I sense you’re trying to shift blame here in order to salvage your assertions, as I saw no evidence of what you claimed.
If they were valuable then why did they get banned? Possibly calling out an A.Net employee or being abusive – which are bannable offenses BTW. If they did that, then they were definitely not the most valuable members of the community to me. One can definitely state their reasons and suggestions without being verbally abusive. That is not constructive.
I know for a fact of people banned from the test forums for suggesting (in a very cordial way) that if ANet released certain content the way they intended it would spark a major backlash (which it did). After those incidents, a lot of the very good guilds who were invited to the test server decided to leave the game en masse.
(edited by NewTrain.7549)
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-27-guild-wars-2-preview?page=3
“Eurogamer: How are you handling endgame loot – will we be farming bosses?
Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game: armour pieces, potentially different potions – a lot of that is still up in the air and we’ll finalise a lot of those reward systems as we get closer to release. And those come off of things like the bosses at the end of dungeons – the raids."
Best statistical loot = BIS where I come from.
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
So Arena.net had to change course. It wasn’t a broken promise though, and a lot of the toxicity could have been avoided if players hadn’t twisted intent to make it one. We players ALSO have a responsibility to the environment we fester.
And if they actually explained to their playerbase why they had to do this, if they apologized that it goes against what we were told in the first place, but that it was a necessary change to keep the game going, then they could have saved themselves a -lot- of the hate they’ve received about this.
Instead they never did explain why they did it, and actually tried to masquerade that this was their intention from the get go, even though it completely went against what they said. -That’s- a big reason why people were kittened off, and it all stems from their lack of communication, and refusal to explain themselves.
I think they really do need to keep lines of communication open with their players on these forums, and not just the vague ’we’re looking into it’ stuff that game companies like to spout, I mean actually getting someone who knows what they’re talking about and can actually give us useful information, and if they’re not allowed to, then to tell us that. And of course to never over-hype things, or tell us things as fact if they’re not 100% certain they -will- be added, to let people know clearly if something may not happen.
(edited by Ridley.3691)
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-27-guild-wars-2-preview?page=3
“Eurogamer: How are you handling endgame loot – will we be farming bosses?
Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game: armour pieces, potentially different potions – a lot of that is still up in the air and we’ll finalise a lot of those reward systems as we get closer to release. And those come off of things like the bosses at the end of dungeons – the raids."
Best statistical loot = BIS where I come from.
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
So Arena.net had to change course. It wasn’t a broken promise though, and a lot of the toxicity could have been avoided if players hadn’t twisted intent to make it one. We players ALSO have a responsibility to the environment we fester.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
^ this.
ANet could have avoided so much controversy if they had gone to the forums/Reditt/whatever and said something like this, “we originally had exotics as BIS, however we feel now that it’s best for the game if we put in another higher, optional level of gear for those that wish to get it”. Then maybe given reasons why it’s better for the game.
Instead they said that ascended had been planned for the game since day one, which is hard to believe as it’s not something that the casual gamers are likely to have as a full set, or even a partial as getting ascended weapons. Many of my guildies don’t even have one ascended weapon yet.
I also remember seeing a quote where they were surprised at how easily and quickly people got full exotics.
(edited by Astral Projections.7320)
I saw a posts demanding developers lose their jobs. A lot of angry protest linking the Manifesto (which really had nothing to do with the argument at hand), a lot of linking that particular interview and screaming “BROKEN PROMISE!!! RAAAAGE!!!”
You can pretend it didn’t happen, but it did.
The problem here, and why Arena.net response made the situation even worse, is something that actually plagues a lot of official forums for a ton of games. The extreme responses tend to be the loudest, and tend to draw the most attention, its an argument fueled by raw emotion rather than reason.
But rather than ignore the emotional response, and address the rational ones, Arena.net (much like those other companies tend to do) just decided to walk away from ALL of it, and it’s a stupid policy that is continuing to this day.
I saw a posts demanding developers lose their jobs. A lot of angry protest linking the Manifesto (which really had nothing to do with the argument at hand), a lot of linking that particular interview and screaming “BROKEN PROMISE!!! RAAAAGE!!!”
You can pretend it didn’t happen, but it did.
Maybe there were a small handful of posts like this (which I still never saw, so the jury is out on who is playing pretend), but even if that were true you think that justifies ANet’s current silence? Because that’s the argument you’ve made above.
The fact is that Anet still didn’t say BiS.
How is “best statistical loot” different from BiS? Read the link above, they clearly said “best statistical loot”. The fact is, you’re wrong.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
I blame the players when they grossly overreact to anything. In this case, it was a bit of both; horrible communication from Arena.net (and what I would suspect is the right hand not knowing what the left hand was doing) and a vile overreaction from players.
Players had every right to question… but we went WAY over the top with some of the responses.
I didn’t see these “vile gross overreactions” you’re claiming. I saw a lot of very factual posts that people were suspended for (which alienated people even more). I sense you’re trying to shift blame here in order to salvage your assertions, as I saw no evidence of what you claimed.
So, it is the new norm to be toxic, ignore common sense arguments from other forum posters, and generally stating opinion as fact. The issue is, many forum posters will argue with you ‘til you are blue in the face or ignore your comments out right, if it doesn’t agree with their position. This happens all the time and is the norm now-a-days – it is called the ‘Entitled’ mentality. I am assuming that it happened to an A.Net employee(s). Being abusive or calling out A.Net employees is against the rules and other official game forums are set up the same way.
You saw no evidence but you are reading the forums with your version of ‘rose-coloured’ glasses on, as everyone does. Our opinion shapes the way we read things, hence why there are so many opinions on out there. Looking objectively at many posts on this forum (mine included sometimes) I see no need for an A.Net employee to respond. They will just get talked over or out right ignored.
Maybe there were a small handful of posts like this (which I still never saw, so the jury is out on who is playing pretend), but even if that were true you think that justifies ANet’s current silence? Because that’s the argument you’ve made above.
Did you… just… not read the entire second half of my post, or something?
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
I blame the players when they grossly overreact to anything. In this case, it was a bit of both; horrible communication from Arena.net (and what I would suspect is the right hand not knowing what the left hand was doing) and a vile overreaction from players.
Players had every right to question… but we went WAY over the top with some of the responses.
I didn’t see these “vile gross overreactions” you’re claiming. I saw a lot of very factual posts that people were suspended for (which alienated people even more). I sense you’re trying to shift blame here in order to salvage your assertions, as I saw no evidence of what you claimed.
So, it is the new norm to be toxic, ignore common sense arguments from other forum posters, and generally stating opinion as fact. The issue is, many forum posters will argue with you ‘til you are blue in the face or ignore your comments out right, if it doesn’t agree with their position. This happens all the time and is the norm now-a-days – it is called the ‘Entitled’ mentality. I am assuming that it happened to an A.Net employee(s). Being abusive or calling out A.Net employees is against the rules and other official game forums are set up the same way.
You saw no evidence but you are reading the forums with your version of ‘rose-coloured’ glasses on, as everyone does. Our opinion shapes the way we read things, hence why there are so many opinions books, etc. Looking objectively at many posts on this forum (mine included sometimes) I see no need for an A.Net employee to respond. They will just get talked over or out right ignored.
Your post is such a ridiculous strawman (not to mention self-contradictory), there’s little point in responding. Yet I did. Masochism.
Did you… just… not read the entire second half of my post, or something?
So you’re saying it was your intention to contradict your own point made earlier in the thread? Either ANet’s silence is justified or it isn’t; you can’t have it both ways.
The fact is that Anet still didn’t say BiS.
How is “best statistical loot” different from BiS? Read the link above, they clearly said “best statistical loot”. The fact is, you’re wrong.
I’m not wrong … Anet didn’t say BiS. That’s there out. They aren’t that stupid so they fed us a line that doesn’t make sense. People interpret this as BiS … Anet says “well, we never said BiS, you did”.
The fact is that Anet still didn’t say BiS.
How is “best statistical loot” different from BiS? Read the link above, they clearly said “best statistical loot”. The fact is, you’re wrong.
I’m not wrong … Anet didn’t say BiS. That’s there out. They fed us a line that doesn’t make sense. People interpret this as BiS … Anet says “well, we never said BiS, you did”.
I’ll ask again, how is “best statistical loot” different from BiS? Until you can explain that (which you can’t since the terms are synonymous), you’re still very very wrong.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
I blame the players when they grossly overreact to anything. In this case, it was a bit of both; horrible communication from Arena.net (and what I would suspect is the right hand not knowing what the left hand was doing) and a vile overreaction from players.
Players had every right to question… but we went WAY over the top with some of the responses.
I didn’t see these “vile gross overreactions” you’re claiming. I saw a lot of very factual posts that people were suspended for (which alienated people even more). I sense you’re trying to shift blame here in order to salvage your assertions, as I saw no evidence of what you claimed.
So, it is the new norm to be toxic, ignore common sense arguments from other forum posters, and generally stating opinion as fact. The issue is, many forum posters will argue with you ‘til you are blue in the face or ignore your comments out right, if it doesn’t agree with their position. This happens all the time and is the norm now-a-days – it is called the ‘Entitled’ mentality. I am assuming that it happened to an A.Net employee(s). Being abusive or calling out A.Net employees is against the rules and other official game forums are set up the same way.
You saw no evidence but you are reading the forums with your version of ‘rose-coloured’ glasses on, as everyone does. Our opinion shapes the way we read things, hence why there are so many opinions books, etc. Looking objectively at many posts on this forum (mine included sometimes) I see no need for an A.Net employee to respond. They will just get talked over or out right ignored.
Your post is such a ridiculous strawman (not to mention self-contradictory), there’s little point in responding. Yet I did. Masochism.
Did you… just… not read the entire second half of my post, or something?
So you’re saying it was your intention to contradict your own point made earlier in the thread? Either ANet’s silence is justified or it isn’t; you can’t have it both ways.
Well, you can’t have it both ways either. Hence why I posted the way I did. Not reading the WHOLE post, taking things out of context, and generally ignoring posts that disagree with one’s stated opinion (sorry for you it is fact).
What I see, generally on official game forums, is the vocal minority beating up on the company and developers because they can’t have the game their way. It may or may not be a viable opinion but it doesn’t matter – civility is thrown out the window.
If one wants a game written a specific way, go develop one.
The fact is that Anet still didn’t say BiS.
How is “best statistical loot” different from BiS? Read the link above, they clearly said “best statistical loot”. The fact is, you’re wrong.
I’m not wrong … Anet didn’t say BiS. That’s there out. They fed us a line that doesn’t make sense. People interpret this as BiS … Anet says “well, we never said BiS, you did”.
I’ll ask again, how is “best statistical loot” different from BiS? Until you can explain that (which you can’t since the terms are synonymous), you’re still very very wrong.
I’m not wrong because I’m not claiming it’s the same or different. I’m just telling you the FACT that Anet NEVER said BiS.
(edited by Obtena.7952)
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
I blame the players when they grossly overreact to anything. In this case, it was a bit of both; horrible communication from Arena.net (and what I would suspect is the right hand not knowing what the left hand was doing) and a vile overreaction from players.
Players had every right to question… but we went WAY over the top with some of the responses.
I didn’t see these “vile gross overreactions” you’re claiming. I saw a lot of very factual posts that people were suspended for (which alienated people even more). I sense you’re trying to shift blame here in order to salvage your assertions, as I saw no evidence of what you claimed.
So, it is the new norm to be toxic, ignore common sense arguments from other forum posters, and generally stating opinion as fact. The issue is, many forum posters will argue with you ‘til you are blue in the face or ignore your comments out right, if it doesn’t agree with their position. This happens all the time and is the norm now-a-days – it is called the ‘Entitled’ mentality. I am assuming that it happened to an A.Net employee(s). Being abusive or calling out A.Net employees is against the rules and other official game forums are set up the same way.
You saw no evidence but you are reading the forums with your version of ‘rose-coloured’ glasses on, as everyone does. Our opinion shapes the way we read things, hence why there are so many opinions books, etc. Looking objectively at many posts on this forum (mine included sometimes) I see no need for an A.Net employee to respond. They will just get talked over or out right ignored.
Your post is such a ridiculous strawman (not to mention self-contradictory), there’s little point in responding. Yet I did. Masochism.
Did you… just… not read the entire second half of my post, or something?
So you’re saying it was your intention to contradict your own point made earlier in the thread? Either ANet’s silence is justified or it isn’t; you can’t have it both ways.
Well, you can’t have it both ways either. Hence why I posted the way I did. Not reading the WHOLE post, taking things out of context, and generally ignoring posts that disagree with one’s stated opinion (sorry for you it is fact).
What I see, generally on official game forums, is the vocal minority beating up on the company and developers because they can’t have the game their way. It may or may not be a viable opinion but it doesn’t matter – civility is thrown out the window.
If one wants a game written a specific way, go develop one.
I’m not asking for anything both ways. If you had bothered to read anything I’d written you’d see that. Once again, your post responds to something I’ve never said (and is still self-contradictory). Completely off the mark. Why would you even type a response to me if you don’t actually intend to respond to my point?
I’m not wrong because I’m not claiming it’s the same or different. I’m just telling you the FACT that Anet NEVER said BiS.
You do realize how ridiculous your argument is, right? “They never said BiS, but they used a term that means the exact same thing”. Wow. Really? Utterly ridiculous.
(edited by NewTrain.7549)
So you’re saying it was your intention to contradict your own point made earlier in the thread? Either ANet’s silence is justified or it isn’t; you can’t have it both ways.
I think, to some extent, Arena.net’s response was understandable (the people who, at least in theory, manage these forums ARE human beings, too), and is fairly consistent with what other game companies are doing with increasing frequency.
I also think it’s the wrong thing to do… if your goal is to prevent your official forums from turning into a cesspool.
So you’re saying it was your intention to contradict your own point made earlier in the thread? Either ANet’s silence is justified or it isn’t; you can’t have it both ways.
I think, to some extent, Arena.net’s response was understandable (the people who, at least in theory, manage these forums ARE human beings, too), and is fairly consistent with what other game companies are doing with increasing frequency.
I also think it’s the wrong thing to do… if your goal is to prevent your official forums from turning into a cesspool.
Okay, if your point was essentially “ANet’s response is unjustified but explainable” I can agree to that. However, your posts above made it sound a lot more like “ANet’s response is justified because of the negativity of the community.”
I think I’m not on board with the use of “justified” either for or against. Justified really only means that an action has a rationale behind it that can be defended. You can make a perfectly justifiable action and it can still be the wrong decision to make.
I’m sure Arena.net thinks they are perfectly justified to back out of a lot of discussion. And I’d be in agreement, at least to some extent. There’s a lot of discussion here that adding some red posts really wouldn’t add anything to the conversation that would matter… and would only give the trolls ammunition to use later if things have to change.
But at the same time, for what I feel to be the majority of the players, the point isn’t that anything immediately comes out of the discussion, but the assurance that we are being heard. So, to back out of that conversation is the wrong decision.
(edited by chemiclord.3978)
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
Then they wanted a different game. GW2 was not the game they were looking for. Catering to people that AREN’T your target market will make BOTH sides quit.
So they tried to add in power creep and those people still quit anyway to games like FF14.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-27-guild-wars-2-preview?page=3
“Eurogamer: How are you handling endgame loot – will we be farming bosses?
Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game: armour pieces, potentially different potions – a lot of that is still up in the air and we’ll finalise a lot of those reward systems as we get closer to release. And those come off of things like the bosses at the end of dungeons – the raids."
Best statistical loot = BIS where I come from.
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
So Arena.net had to change course. It wasn’t a broken promise though, and a lot of the toxicity could have been avoided if players hadn’t twisted intent to make it one. We players ALSO have a responsibility to the environment we fester.
They did change course, whether they had to or not might be debatable, though I’ll grant they probably thought they had to. Regardless, I’m not sure an overwhelming majority of players wanted stat creep. What I remember is a lot of players saying they had nothing to do. I believe Ascended was put in to give them something to do and signified a large change in direction for the game from cosmetic endgame to other options.
I believe the cosmetic endgame met the twin realities of, “What do we sell?” and players reaching goals at “unexpected” speeds. Reaching such a crux, a company intent on a cosmetic endgame would step up and: create more looks obtainable through play on an ongoing basis, adding content that those looks would be gained from as they went. This would be similar to how companies with stat progression endgames make new content and stat gain gear to accompany it. Instead, what we’ve gotten is a few skins tied to content and some sold for gems. To me, this makes Ascended the stand-in for the robust cosmetic endgame that might well have given players “something to do.”
Don’t get me wrong, I don’t think ANet really had much choice. After all, they have to sell something and selling power would generate more bad press than Ascended did.
You do realize how ridiculous your argument is, right? “They never said BiS, but they used a term that means the exact same thing”. Wow. Really? Utterly ridiculous.
Your right its a ridiculous argument, but it still stands they never said BiS. Its how PR and politics work. You choose words carefully so you don’t get backed into a corner or caught. You leave an ‘out’ so you can say ‘I didn’t mean it like that’. Its a stupid trick to cover kitten in case the idea goes wrong.
So while, yes, it is the same, they know the lingo in MMOs is BiS. So they made sure to NOT say BiS so they could have an out.
I think I’m not on board with the use of “justified” either for or against. Justified really only means that an action has a rationale behind it that can be defended. You can make a perfectly justifiable action and it can still be the wrong decision to make.
I’m sure Arena.net thinks they are perfectly justified to back out of a lot of discussion. And I’d be in agreement, at least to some extent. There’s a lot of discussion here that adding some red posts really wouldn’t add anything to the conversation that would matter.
But at the same time, for what I feel to be the majority of the players, the point isn’t that anything immediately comes out of the discussion, but the assurance that we are being heard. So, to back out of that conversation is the wrong decision.
Now we’re splitting hairs. Or rather, arguing semantics. For an action to be justified in needs be “done for, or marked by a good or legitimate reason.” A minority negative forum response is not a “good or legitimate” reason.
I chose the words justified and explainable for a reason. Explainable means a reason exists for a behavior. Justified means that a reason exists and it is a legitimate reason.
Your right its a ridiculous argument, but it still stands they never said BiS. Its how PR and politics work. You choose words carefully so you don’t get backed into a corner or caught. You leave an ‘out’ so you can say ‘I didn’t mean it like that’. Its a stupid trick to cover kitten in case the idea goes wrong.
So while, yes, it is the same, they know the lingo in MMOs is BiS. So they made sure to NOT say BiS so they could have an out.
Typically when you engage in politispeak like that, you don’t choose a term that is 100% synonymous. I mean, it’s like someone saying “I never said the shirt was damp, I said it was moist.” It has the exact same meaning.
Being unable to obfuscate well even when trying is just more evidence of ANet’s inability to communicate adequately, I suppose.
(edited by NewTrain.7549)
I think I’m not on board with the use of “justified” either for or against. Justified really only means that an action has a rationale behind it that can be defended. You can make a perfectly justifiable action and it can still be the wrong decision to make.
I’m sure Arena.net thinks they are perfectly justified to back out of a lot of discussion. And I’d be in agreement, at least to some extent. There’s a lot of discussion here that adding some red posts really wouldn’t add anything to the conversation that would matter.
But at the same time, for what I feel to be the majority of the players, the point isn’t that anything immediately comes out of the discussion, but the assurance that we are being heard. So, to back out of that conversation is the wrong decision.
Now we’re splitting hairs. Or rather, arguing semantics. For an action to be justified in needs be “done for, or marked by a good or legitimate reason.” A minority negative forum response is not a “good or legitimate” reason.
I chose the words justified and explainable for a reason. Explainable means a reason exists for a behavior. Justified means that a reason exists and it is a legitimate reason.
Your right its a ridiculous argument, but it still stands they never said BiS. Its how PR and politics work. You choose words carefully so you don’t get backed into a corner or caught. You leave an ‘out’ so you can say ‘I didn’t mean it like that’. Its a stupid trick to cover kitten in case the idea goes wrong.
So while, yes, it is the same, they know the lingo in MMOs is BiS. So they made sure to NOT say BiS so they could have an out.
Typically when you engage in politispeak like that, you don’t choose a term that is 100% synonymous. I mean, it’s like someone saying “I never said the shirt was damp, I said it was moist.” It has the exact same meaning.
Being unable to obfuscate well even when trying is just more evidence of ANet’s inability to communicate adequately, I suppose.
Yes, I know. But you have to understand the weight of the word or term. BiS is more commonly heard in MMOs, it carries more weight.
Think of someone who is overweight. You can try to use softer words like chunky, or heavy, etc. But you’ll get a bigger rise out of them if you just call them fat or some form of the word.
Yes, I know. But you have to understand the weight of the word or term. BiS is more commonly heard in MMOs, it carries more weight.
Think of someone who is overweight. You can try to use softer words like chunky, or heavy, etc. But you’ll get a bigger rise out of them if you just call them fat or some form of the word.
Again though, anyone who understands English understands that BiS (best in slot) and “best stastical loot” are the exact same thing. It’s not like the difference between calling someone chunky and fat, it’s more like fat and fatty.
Yes, I know. But you have to understand the weight of the word or term. BiS is more commonly heard in MMOs, it carries more weight.
Think of someone who is overweight. You can try to use softer words like chunky, or heavy, etc. But you’ll get a bigger rise out of them if you just call them fat or some form of the word.
Again though, anyone who understands English understands that BiS (best in slot) and “best stastical loot” are the exact same thing. It’s not like the difference between calling someone chunky and fat, it’s more like fat and fatty.
You aren’t going to change anyone’s opinion in this thread. You were right early on that the people who had constructive criticism on this game have either been banned or quit, and all that’s left is a circlejerk with the odd person coming in with a criticism getting attacked and finally having his post deleted because it was “toxic”. Honestly the game itself is really great, but those of us who play more than a couple hours a week(except the tp players) have done EVERYTHING in this game so many times we are burn’t out, and I don’t see this changing anytime soon.
Communication isn’t going to help 1 bit, when there isn’t anything new other than 15 mins of story released every 2 weeks. My guild and I are only here till a better game comes out, which is sad because we’ve all been supporting anet since the beginning of GW1.
Pinnacle of Responsibility[Mom]-Yaks Bend
Unstable Shield, Unstable Light
Unstable Shield, Unstable Light
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-27-guild-wars-2-preview?page=3
“Eurogamer: How are you handling endgame loot – will we be farming bosses?
Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game: armour pieces, potentially different potions – a lot of that is still up in the air and we’ll finalise a lot of those reward systems as we get closer to release. And those come off of things like the bosses at the end of dungeons – the raids."
Best statistical loot = BIS where I come from.
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
So Arena.net had to change course. It wasn’t a broken promise though, and a lot of the toxicity could have been avoided if players hadn’t twisted intent to make it one. We players ALSO have a responsibility to the environment we fester.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
Why can’t it be both? The interview was from 11 months before the game went live. It’s possible that during the beta that it was impressed onto ANet that they needed one last level of gear that players would have to work hard to get and at that point it became part of their plan. It just took them a while to figure out how to add it into the game. Trinkets they simply folded into the FotM system and later Laurels but how long did it take them to fold it into the crafting system, a year or more after the game went live?
See as long as they had plans in place before the game went live, then in their minds it was always planned to be added. They just didn’t say anything until after the game went live to players. The code for even the trinkets and changes to FotM had to be in development well before the game launched (people always underestimate the time required to write and alter software, including programmers). They didn’t launch the game and then decided to change it. It was just added to the plan late and wasn’t in the game at launch.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
(edited by Behellagh.1468)
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2011-09-27-guild-wars-2-preview?page=3
“Eurogamer: How are you handling endgame loot – will we be farming bosses?
Colin Johanson: Everyone, including casual gamers, by level 80 should have the best statistical loot in the game. We want everyone on an equal power base. The rare stuff becomes the really awesome looking armours. It’s all about collecting the unique looking stuff and collecting all the other rare collectable items in the game: armour pieces, potentially different potions – a lot of that is still up in the air and we’ll finalise a lot of those reward systems as we get closer to release. And those come off of things like the bosses at the end of dungeons – the raids."
Best statistical loot = BIS where I come from.
I suspect stuff like this is also part of the reason why Arena.net has backed off on this sort of candid discussion. I mean, read that interview… it’s a candid statement of intent… it’s what they WANTED to do. It wasn’t a promise. It’s what they even TRIED to do.
And then they went live… and it apparently didn’t work. Too many players didn’t buy into it. They wanted that power creep. They wanted that grind. And when they didn’t get it, they quit.
So Arena.net had to change course. It wasn’t a broken promise though, and a lot of the toxicity could have been avoided if players hadn’t twisted intent to make it one. We players ALSO have a responsibility to the environment we fester.
The toxicity doesn’t stem from the change in direction. It stems from the fact that, when ANet announced ascended gear, they denied they ever made this statement in the first place. They claimed ascended gear had always been their intention. Stop trying to blame the players here.
Why can’t it be both? The interview was from 11 months before the game went live. It’s possible that during the beta that it was impressed onto ANet that they needed one last level of gear that players would have to work hard to get and at that point it became part of their plan. It just took them a while to figure out how to add it into the game. Trinkets they simply folded into the FotM system and later Laurels but how long did it take them to fold it into the crafting system, a year or more after the game went live?
See as long as they had plans in place before the game went live, then in their minds it was always planned to be added. They just didn’t say anything until after the game went live to players. The code for even the trinkets and changes to FotM had to be in development well before the game launched (people always underestimate the time required to write and alter software, including programmers). They didn’t launch the game and then decided to change it. It was just added to the plan late and wasn’t in the game at launch.
If that was the case, what do you think the prudent thing to do would be? Oh yeah, clearly explain it. They could have preemptively fended off tons of criticism had they done that. I mean, that is if the scenario you outlined were actually what happened, which is highly highly doubtful.
Instead they lied and claimed that their original statement didn’t exist. Look how well that worked out.
I say, SHUT DOWN THE FORUMS GW1 did just fine without forums, GW2 can as well, I mean after all “they” do what “they” want irregardless of what the community asks for 98% of the time anyway.
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger
If that was the case, what do you think the prudent thing to do would be? Oh yeah, clearly explain it. They could have preemptively fended off tons of criticism had they done that. I mean, that is if the scenario you outlined were actually what happened, which is highly highly doubtful.
Instead they lied and claimed that their original statement didn’t exist. Look how well that worked out.
Again, an 11 month pre-launch interview stating intent isn’t a promise. They didn’t promise anything. If they didn’t promise then they aren’t going back on said promise and the original statement wasn’t a promise. You read an intent and thought promise.
This is exactly why they don’t talk to us anymore.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
I say, SHUT DOWN THE FORUMS GW1 did just fine without forums, GW2 can as well, I mean after all “they” do what “they” want irregardless of what the community asks for 98% of the time anyway.
It’s not their job to implement what the vocal members of their community wants. It’s ANet’s game. At the end of the day it’s up to the players to accept it or reject it. Unlike a book or a movie where you can’t ask the creators to change the ending gamers believe it’s in their power to force a game’s creator to change it. While aspects of a game may not be working as intended by the devs and those could be altered, there are parts of their “vision” that will never be changed. If you really dislike those parts, then this isn’t the game for you.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
I have been asking Anet to hire a Forum manager, or a communication specialist for a long time. I think it would do wonders for the community to have a clear and concise corporate response to many unanswered and ignored questions that repeatedly come up in the Forums. Using a single voice would enable Anet to put forth a concerted ideal to the community to look upon. It would avoid many , uh, unintentional problems.
I would also like to suggest that they hire a continuity manager for the game as well.
I’ll do it. Where do I sign up for this position?
Ok folks, calm down, we hear you and we are working on _________ (insert your issue here)
How’s that? Does that work?
Find Bel Geode- THE Purple Norn on twitch tv.
“Doing The Dailies " Weeknights at 8PM EST.
http://www.twitch.tv/belgeode
“Doing The Dailies " Weeknights at 8PM EST.
http://www.twitch.tv/belgeode
If that was the case, what do you think the prudent thing to do would be? Oh yeah, clearly explain it. They could have preemptively fended off tons of criticism had they done that. I mean, that is if the scenario you outlined were actually what happened, which is highly highly doubtful.
Instead they lied and claimed that their original statement didn’t exist. Look how well that worked out.
Again, an 11 month pre-launch interview stating intent isn’t a promise. They didn’t promise anything. If they didn’t promise then they aren’t going back on said promise and the original statement wasn’t a promise. You read an intent and thought promise.
This is exactly why they don’t talk to us anymore.
Where did I say they promised anything? Let me put this in caps so you can understand it: THIS IS NOT A DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT PROMISES WERE/WERE NOT MADE. Please read what I wrote before responding. I’m getting really sick of people failing to understand what’s being discussed before chiming in with their 2 cents.
I made it very clear, the problem is not that they changed direction, but that they claimed a very clearly documented statement that they made actually didn’t exist. It was an outright lie. If you had read the post you quoted, you would know that.
Where did I say they promised anything? Let me put this in caps so you can understand it: THIS IS NOT A DISCUSSION ABOUT WHAT PROMISES WERE/WERE NOT MADE. Please read what I wrote before responding. I’m getting really sick of people failing to understand what’s being discussed before chiming in with their 2 cents.
I made it very clear, the problem is not that they changed direction, but that they claimed a very clearly documented statement that they made actually didn’t exist. It was an outright lie. If you had read the post you quoted, you would know that.
Instead they lied and claimed that their original statement didn’t exist. Look how well that worked out.
Right there. They claimed they didn’t make a statement promising anything so that wasn’t a lie. You claiming otherwise is saying they did make a promise.
Not saying they don’t desperately need a PR person so that they are crystal clear about what they mean. Too often people talk in generalities that others take as specifics. Sound bite mentality.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
(edited by Behellagh.1468)
I really don’t see why Anet need to talk to us.
I remember the WoW forum or Diablo 3 forum. It was full of complaints on the same topic everyday. The dev didn’t really talk to the players much. But in the end, what I notice is at their next big patch or expansions, they always address the issues.
When Anet was doing the Collaborative Development Initiative(CDI), I just wonder to myself why is it even necessary. People complaints are always the same, some people are making fun that you can make forum complaint bingo because the complaint are always the same. Does Anet not know what people are complaining?
Since that debacle was before my time, I joined at the start of Dec 2012, I can’t say what they did say or didn’t say and the search here is horrible to even try to find it. Google isn’t much better in this case.
It may have been a case of left hand not knowing what the right hand was doing. Or simply forgetting because if someone linked that Eurogamer article in that thread then ANet would have no recourse other than apologizing. However I’m tempted to say, sight unseen on the thread they disavowed every saying that, that the preceding posts from players were stating that it was a vow/promise. The people have long memories.
They really need someone to bullet point what was said in every published interview, press release (print, web or video) and timeline it so they either don’t misstep or they can quickly counter a claim that they said one thing but did another without clarifying it first publicly.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
Since that debacle was before my time, I joined at the start of Dec 2012, I can’t say what they did say or didn’t say and the search here is horrible to even try to find it.
Then what made you feel like you were qualified enough to argue with someone about it? If this was a subject you had no knowledge of and couldn’t find the information for, perhaps you should have remained silent instead of going all white knight and arguing a strawman.
(edited by NewTrain.7549)
Because I thought you were ticked over an assumed promise, not that they disavowed Colin’s interview.
And because in the 20 months I’ve been here I seen how people overreact to old statements, holding them aloft like some kind of stone tablets from God. Stuff changes, explanations are sound bited and ANet doesn’t share when plans are altered because I expect either they didn’t think it was a big thing or because it could be altered again. Best wait until something is in closed beta before talking about it.
So nobody says nothing now. Can’t accuse them for going back against their “word” if there isn’t any “word” to go back on.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
(edited by Behellagh.1468)
Not going to search out the links again, but:
It was stated before launch that it was expected that we would have BiS gear by level 80.
It was subsequently stated, post launch, that it was never intended for us to have BiS gear that fast.
Changing their mind by saying, “we have determined that our original intention is not going to meet the needs of the game or the player base,” is one thing. To deny that the first statement was ever true means that either the first statement was a lie or the second one is.
We were told that grind would be reserved for cosmetics but not for stats.
The best stats are now gated behind grind.
“McDonalds is delicious,” isn’t a falsehood, its an opinion.
We were told before launch that this was an iterative company that changed things if they found they weren’t working. If something wasn’t working in their opinion they were always going to change it.
And there are 300 people in the company. I’m sure there are people who are antigrind in the company and people who aren’t. I’m sure there are factions of people who want different things. No company ever really speaks with one voice.
We know this is an MMO and things change. We’re not getting a new tier of gear every 3-4 months like other games.
Companies go into things with intentions and then something happens and they change what they do. That’s how MMOs work. If you don’t expect that at this point, I’m not sure what to tell you.
None of that addressed Ashen’s point. Forgive me for speaking for someone else, but his/her point WAS NOT that the direction changed, but rather ANet’s deceptive position that no change occurred and claiming the original statement was never made.
It’s like someone saying “My favorite food is pie” in June and then in July saying “My favorite food is cake.” When pressed about what caused the change, the person responds “I never said pie was my favorite.”
I’ve addressed this in other places before, and it’s not really on topic for this thread, but to make it short, who says what depends often on who you ask. We get little fast, truncated answers from people asking casually, not long involved detailed answers.
It’s entirely possible that they were going to have another tier before launch and didn’t get to put it in. I’m convinced the game launched early to get out before MoP and that’s why it was in the state it was when it came out…incomplete. This happens with lots of games.
Now, those involved in those conversations can say sure we planned to have this new tier, we thought about it. To another person who wasn’t as heavily involved in those convos, or came online after the plan was pushed back abandoned, they’d have a different recollection. Hell, I have a different recollection of things from my wife even though we were both there.
No one is researching answers to stuff before casual interviews which is where some of this info came from. Human memory? Not really all that accurate.
Fans hang on every single word Anet says, and then they memorize it, whether Anet employees are talking casually or not. People forget stuff all the time. A year or two after something happens, if someone asks a question, discrepancies in answers are bound to happen. That’s why historians want corroborating evidence.
It’s all very well and nice to say this person lied. People get stuff wrong all the time. That’s what makes us people. I wish we’d hold devs to the same standards we hold ourselves.
Again, you totally missed the point.
The problem doesn’t lie with ANet changing direction or priorities. That’s expected.
The problem lies with them denying they ever made very clearly documented statements to begin with.
If you have to try and type a 4 paragraph explanation of why that’s somehow okay, you might as well admit to yourself you’re just engaging in mental gymnastics.
Nope you missed my point. I did answer it.
I saw a posts demanding developers lose their jobs. A lot of angry protest linking the Manifesto (which really had nothing to do with the argument at hand), a lot of linking that particular interview and screaming “BROKEN PROMISE!!! RAAAAGE!!!”
You can pretend it didn’t happen, but it did.
Maybe there were a small handful of posts like this (which I still never saw, so the jury is out on who is playing pretend), but even if that were true you think that justifies ANet’s current silence? Because that’s the argument you’ve made above.
The fact is that Anet still didn’t say BiS.
How is “best statistical loot” different from BiS? Read the link above, they clearly said “best statistical loot”. The fact is, you’re wrong.
You never saw a manifesto broken promise thread? Really? You must have have been on the forums. Even years later they were relatively common. And yes I’ve seen posts saying that people should be fired…or even worse.
You do realize how ridiculous your argument is, right? “They never said BiS, but they used a term that means the exact same thing”. Wow. Really? Utterly ridiculous.
Nothing ridiculous about it. In fact it’s clever because overly assuming people make their own interpretations of what ‘best statistical’ means and Anet can balk on their plans because of players misunderstanding what they meant. Clearly, it’s working on you. If I was Anet, I would claim that Ascended was best statistical gear because of stats AND relative ease of crafting it. You’re just being narrow minded in your interpretation because it fits your stance.
(edited by Obtena.7952)
You do realize how ridiculous your argument is, right? “They never said BiS, but they used a term that means the exact same thing”. Wow. Really? Utterly ridiculous.
Nothing ridiculous about it. In fact it’s clever because overly assuming people make their own interpretations of what ‘best statistical’ means and Anet can balk on their plans because of players misunderstanding what they meant. Clearly, it’s working on you. If I was Anet, I would claim that Ascended was best statistical gear because of stats AND relative ease of crafting it. You’re just being narrow minded in your interpretation because it fits your stance.
Well, before GW2 is out, all people spam about on the forum is telling people like me the best gear is easy to get, and there will be no new tier. Obviously Anet never said anything.
Also, I don’t think people should take things said in the “Manifesto” too much, obviously they say lot of thing to get people to buy the game, like every advertisement too.
Anet is a business after all, and they would say whatever things to benefit themselves, like when they say “an expansion worth of content”, obviously they are under pressure to keep people playing. And some time giving players hope will keep them a little longer, and maybe the players invest enough time in the game that they wont’ quit.
Look, Anet clearly did change direction when they introduced ascended gear. They changed direction against a huge backlash. Now, you have to ask yourself, with all the negativity associated with it, with all the people leaving the game, why would a company change direction.
The only answer I can come up with is because they thought it was necessary. But even back then, having a real conversation with us would have stopped anyone but the most fundamental in their beliefs from feeling that Anet had done something underhanded.
I’m not saying they did do something underhanded. I’m saying the communication that came out in reference to it made it feel like they did, and that’s not a good look.
A person who communicated with us wouldn’t stop the bottom percentage of anti gear progression people from leaving or complaining. But most reasonable people, even if they don’t agree with a change, if they can see reason for a change would be far more accepting.
So again ascended gear ?
Get over it finally .. i also was very bitter about it in the beginning especially since i
play a lot of alts and don’t play dungeons ..
However .. in the end at least ascended is not really that much better than exotic
that you really feel a difference. I crafted some weapons .. and that also was a motivation
to do world events .. bought some amulets and rings from laurels .. never cared
about earrings .. and also i don’t care about armor.
If we go after all the “berserker > all” thing that says that defense is totally unimportant
a full set of ascended armor gives you 1% more damage .. thats it .. the rest is 4-5%
more defense.
So .. thats really just something you care about as a min-maxer .. but not really
something that you really even notice .. and not compareable to raid-loot vs.
normal loot in other MMOs.
In the end i loose more damage because i use traveller runes and not the best
damage runes than what i loose because i don’t have ascended armor.
EVERY MMO is awesome until it is released then its unfinished. A month after release it just sucks.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
Nope you missed my point. I did answer it.
No, you really didn’t. You obfuscated quite well, but never addressed the actual issue at hand. I once had a grad school professor tell me, “if your answer to a simple question is a page long, you’ve admitted you don’t know the answer.”
Nothing ridiculous about it. In fact it’s clever because overly assuming people make their own interpretations of what ‘best statistical’ means and Anet can balk on their plans because of players misunderstanding what they meant. Clearly, it’s working on you. If I was Anet, I would claim that Ascended was best statistical gear because of stats AND relative ease of crafting it. You’re just being narrow minded in your interpretation because it fits your stance.
How exactly is “best statistical” up for interpretation? It’s not. It has a very distinct meaning. You’re talking out your kitten and it shows.
The simple answer is that people’s memories aren’t perfect. That’s the simple answer. I added detail because these answers were given very briefly by different people in different interviews who may very well have different memories and interpretations. That IS an answer.
Not sure why you’re bringing memories into this when ANet’s words are clearly documented. No need for memory when it’s written down and time/date stamped.
When the question was asked, Anet wasn’t sitting there with notes. They were depending on memory. I’m not sure at one point during the interviews you saw them pull out their filing cabinet to answer the questions. They answered interview questions and two people gave different answers. Were they both lying? Was one lying? Did one have a memory lapse? Did they have different points of view? You don’t know. It’s very easy to say people are lying. But it’s just as easy to not remember the orders that events occurred a year later. I suppose that’s never happened to you, but it’s sure happened to me.
Nope you missed my point. I did answer it.
No, you really didn’t. You obfuscated quite well, but never addressed the actual issue at hand. I once had a grad school professor tell me, “if your answer to a simple question is a page long, you’ve admitted you don’t know the answer.”
Nothing ridiculous about it. In fact it’s clever because overly assuming people make their own interpretations of what ‘best statistical’ means and Anet can balk on their plans because of players misunderstanding what they meant. Clearly, it’s working on you. If I was Anet, I would claim that Ascended was best statistical gear because of stats AND relative ease of crafting it. You’re just being narrow minded in your interpretation because it fits your stance.
How exactly is “best statistical” up for interpretation? It’s not. It has a very distinct meaning. You’re talking out your kitten and it shows.
The simple answer is that people’s memories aren’t perfect. That’s the simple answer. I added detail because these answers were given very briefly by different people in different interviews who may very well have different memories and interpretations. That IS an answer.
Not sure why you’re bringing memories into this when ANet’s words are clearly documented. No need for memory when it’s written down and time/date stamped.
When the question was asked, Anet wasn’t sitting there with notes. They were depending on memory. I’m not sure at one point during the interviews you saw them pull out their filing cabinet to answer the questions. They answered interview questions and two people gave different answers. Were they both lying? Was one lying? Did one have a memory lapse? Did they have different points of view? You don’t know. It’s very easy to say people are lying. But it’s just as easy to not remember the orders that events occurred a year later. I suppose that’s never happened to you, but it’s sure happened to me.
So you’re saying that when Colin gave that interview he forgot ANet’s whole design philosophy regarding BiS loot? He had a memory lapse about one of the key points of the game? Really? Or maybe you’re suggesting that later when when ascended gear was announced they forgot they originally had a different design philosophy. They forgot they had worked FOR YEARS on one system of obtaining BiS only to implement a different system. That doesn’t sound ridiculous to you? Come on. Take off the blinders and be realistic.