Guild Wars 2

If it’s free now then why is it even a thing in the first place?

I could understand that in the past it could be used as a cash sink so people couldn’t endlessly try doing something that was above their ability’s. especially in dungeons this would create some pressure so you would keep yourself from dying to limit the repair costs. but if you’re going to throw that concept out of the window then why uphold the concept of armor repair at all?

the cost is getting armour damage and when durability hits 0 (red) you no longer gain stats.

its to make death punishing and to punish those who die over and over.

example it stops u camping in WvW and being resed by a thief friend who ran away from attackers when it goes wrong.
or in fractals.

the cost is taking the time to go repair. which is on all players minds and thus makes u play better by not dieing all the time.

even with a “cost” with the current gold u earn from dungeons even now would be a tiny ammount

Why would you support having your time wasted?

Wethospu.6437:

Why would you support having your time wasted?

A question asked of people that spend hundreds and thousands of hours playing a video game.

As krixis said. Destroyable armor imo is a good thing and should remain as it is.

I don’t disagree that the system needs to be tweaked. Currently you can die quite a few times with NO penalty at all (and with no repair cost on the back end).

I tend to think damaged armor should loose some effectiveness (either reduction in armor, stats or both). GW1’s death penalty system was very good at being both punishing and self-healing in my opinion. Not saying it would work untouched in a the current GW2 system but something similar.

Now the reality of the current status is that Anet wants the game,“’accessible to casual players”, so the move has been to make in-game death have no real consequences (beyond making you a corpse). I think their major issue with the system was that it “unfairly” punished bad player tactics (note that I don’t agree that it’s unfair). Despite how you feel about this issue, bad players also spend money on gems, so Anet has to view this from more than a, “if you suck, or are careless, it should hurt you in some way”, train of thought.

I’m not a fan of making it ok to be dead all the time, but that seems to be the direction they want to take the death system and if that is actually what they want, I don’t disagree that having the current armor damage / destroy / repair system is a waste of time.

It is indeed pointless now.

Rage.4693:

If it’s free now then why is it even a thing in the first place?

I could understand that in the past it could be used as a cash sink so people couldn’t endlessly try doing something that was above their ability’s. especially in dungeons this would create some pressure so you would keep yourself from dying to limit the repair costs. but if you’re going to throw that concept out of the window then why uphold the concept of armor repair at all?

It’s a death penalty. I think the intent is to prevent players from completing dungeon instances and/or fights if they’ve died too many times. I agree that it’s just severe enough to be annoying, but not severe enough to make a real difference. Like you, I’d rather see them scrap it.

Bernie.8674:

Rage.4693:

If it’s free now then why is it even a thing in the first place?

I could understand that in the past it could be used as a cash sink so people couldn’t endlessly try doing something that was above their ability’s. especially in dungeons this would create some pressure so you would keep yourself from dying to limit the repair costs. but if you’re going to throw that concept out of the window then why uphold the concept of armor repair at all?

It’s a death penalty. I think the intent is to prevent players from completing dungeon instances and/or fights if they’ve died too many times. I agree that it’s just severe enough to be annoying, but not severe enough to make a real difference. Like you, I’d rather see them scrap it.

Except dungeons have a repair anvil. Fractals dont have a repair but people just go char select then back into town to repair if they dont have cannisters. Honestly its a pointless mechanic.

You’ve hit upon the penalty, it’s time to go off and get them repaired. For those who want to maximize there play time it’s a valid penalty for repeated death.

i am already happy they removed the cost, it became ridicules to pay for both travel and repair.
it’s a penalty they added to replace the death penalty from GW1, IMO i rather have a timed death penalty then repairs but nothing i say can change that.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

Im fairly certain fall damage doesnt damage armor. Unless youre falling and almost dying then dying to the mobs. You so silly gaile.

Without the cost to repair it does seem a little pointless now to have it. It also decreased the reason behind having canisters by that much. I used to not repair damaged armor until all were damaged then use a canister to get a free repair. Now I just get repaired without really thinking about the matter. It’s a fairy trivial change but it does make dying much less of an impact.

I think that the way it is now is perfectly fine.

Having to spend money would be too punishing, while having no consequences (unbreakable amour) not punishing enough.
If you die 6 times in a row I think it’s fair that you start “loosing” stats.

Before, armor repairs served as a mild gold sink. Now that repairs are free, there’s really not much of a point to it anymore. If you’re dying so often that your armor is actually breaking then that’s a sign that the group your running the instance with isn’t working or that the solo content you’re attempting is beyond your level and/or ability.

I don’t think it was ever ment to be a gold sink .

To be blunt ;

It is a reminder that you get killed a lot and need some l2p or a tweak to your build.

I die way more in WvW than I do in PvE. About the only place I die in PvE anymore is when I make an egregious mistake, like trying to defend a scaled-up Indigo Cave when the people who scaled it are dead (gone back to the WP, or not) or ran off to fight the nearby Champion (because bag, apparently).

In WvW, armor repair just adds another few seconds to the minutes it takes to run back 3/4’s of the length of the map. That’s the real death penalty in WvW. Well, that and maybe losing the fight for the objective.

I don’t mind armor repair, nor am I attached to it.

Fractals /15chars

zcearo.1897:

I don’t think it was ever ment to be a gold sink .

To be blunt ;

It is a reminder that you die a lot and need some l2p or a tweak to your build.

Dying can be faster than trying to just get out of combat to teleport. With that said its not all a matter of l2p. If anything its a nuicense and serves no purpose but to annoy the players at this point. It at one point served as a money sink that punished newer players harder than it did veteran players, thats why ANet got rid of the cost.

Armor repair was a slap in the face – double death penalty was ridiculous (especially at release when a few silver was a LOT.) Just to be clear when I say double, I mean pay for repair+pay to WP after a death. Personally I think it would of been better for the game to remove WP costs and keep armor repair – it would of given people an incentive to not die (armor repair) while at the same time not stay dead waiting for a rez instead of being cheap and not WP’ing (even worse when the dead are still scaling a boss/champ…)

I do like that Idea of removing way point cost and putting the cost back on armor repair.

The thing I liked about GW1’s death penalty system is that you started getting a fairly small penalty from your first defeat that wasn’t enough to seriously hamper you, and could be worked off fairly quickly, but was enough to make you pause and consider what you were doing. Compare that to GW2’s system where you have absolutely no penalties until you’ve been defeated 6 times.

Now, I don’t want some masochistic death penalty system where you’re afraid to try anything even remotely dangerous or team up with strangers because a single death results in a 45 minute corpse run and losing all the experience you gained for the day. But on the flip side, I feel like the current system – with its virtually non-existent death penalties – allows for too much “bang your head against the wall” game-play (i.e. you’re immune to headaches, so just keep rushing in with reckless abandon and banging your head against the wall until it finally breaks, rather than stopping to consider which tool would be most effective so you can avoid getting a headache).

The GW1 death penalty system was really effective because it gradually ramped up in severity, but you could easily remove the penalty by recovering from a mistake and PLAYING WELL. That’s what a death penalty is supposed to do – give an incentive to play well. GW2’s death penalty system only seems to give a minor inconvenience for playing extremely horribly.

I also miss morale boosts. That was like the opposite of a death penalty – more like a survival bonus.

TL;DR: bring back the GW1 death penalty / morale boost system. It was cool.

How about returning fees for repair armor and add 2 quests:

1 – making all blacksmiths on the world very grateful for Your hard work and repair all equipment for free

2 – making by some power all armor indestructible or as reward some potion that will make for limited time armor indestructible

I wonder which quest would be more popular ^,^

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

While traversing the jumping puzzle in Metrica Province with the timed platforms over hot lava, my necro found it much less punishing to just attempt the jumps in her undies.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

Anyone else find it slightly disturbing that devs don’t know that falling deaths don’t damage armor?

The only time I ever need to repair my armor is in SW… stupid terragriffs and their nonsensical AOE, damage invulnerability, and stacking dmg kill me at least 3 times a play session.

I do think the armor repair should stay, because of various reasons mentionned above.

But I would prefer if the Death Penalty would make its come back from GW1 to GW2. Maybe like 10% stats reduction per penalty up to maybe 40% and it would clear up by killing mobs and bosses just like in GW1 (or with time) or visiting a town (Grove, Lion’s Arch, etc.) .

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

Anyone else find it slightly disturbing that devs don’t know that falling deaths don’t damage armor?

The only time I ever need to repair my armor is in SW… stupid terragriffs and their nonsensical AOE, damage invulnerability, and stacking dmg kill me at least 3 times a play session.

I find it more disturbing that some people don’t realize what a Community Manager is. Definitely not a developer.

Anyway, +1 to all you folks who realize how pointless armor damage is now that there’s no repair cost. It’s another MMO artifact that can go the way of the dodo.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

Anyone else find it slightly disturbing that devs don’t know that falling deaths don’t damage armor?

The only time I ever need to repair my armor is in SW… stupid terragriffs and their nonsensical AOE, damage invulnerability, and stacking dmg kill me at least 3 times a play session.

Gaile is a community manager (a great one at that,) not a game developer. Having said that, I wouldn’t even expect every developer to know the ins and outs of the entire game except (in this case) for the person who actually programs the armor durability game logic :p

This is a public service announcement to any player that wants to pay for amour repairs.

If you have that much gold lying around that you find yourself longing for a new gold sink, please send that unwanted gold to me.
I will put it to good use.

GoddessOfTheWinds.2937:

I do think the armor repair should stay, because of various reasons mentionned above.

But I would prefer if the Death Penalty would make its come back from GW1 to GW2. Maybe like 10% stats reduction per penalty up to maybe 40% and it would clear up by killing mobs and bosses just like in GW1 (or with time) or visiting a town (Grove, Lion’s Arch, etc.) .

That was one of the most poorly designed and illogical choices in GW1.

“Oh look you just died to this enemy. I think you should try to beat it again while you are 10% weaker than before.”

Khisanth.2948:

GoddessOfTheWinds.2937:

I do think the armor repair should stay, because of various reasons mentionned above.

But I would prefer if the Death Penalty would make its come back from GW1 to GW2. Maybe like 10% stats reduction per penalty up to maybe 40% and it would clear up by killing mobs and bosses just like in GW1 (or with time) or visiting a town (Grove, Lion’s Arch, etc.) .

That was one of the most poorly designed and illogical choices in GW1.

“Oh look you just died to this enemy. I think you should try to beat it again while you are 10% weaker than before.”

Another reason for armor damage to not be a thing.
…Then again, I had a young fractal team beat Jade Maw in their skivvies.

Honestly, in 2+ years of playing I never used a single instance armor repair canister. I did not do that even when I have a bunch for free available thru AP chests. I do not know who will use that and for that matter who will actually spend gems in buying them.

Also, armor damage does not make me play more cautiously but, longer revival time does.

tl;dr — No cost Armor repair does not add any value to a player’s gameplay experience and possibly does not aid in generating revenue from gemstore. It’s best to remove armor damage concept from the game.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

Anyone else find it slightly disturbing that devs don’t know that falling deaths don’t damage armor?

The only time I ever need to repair my armor is in SW… stupid terragriffs and their nonsensical AOE, damage invulnerability, and stacking dmg kill me at least 3 times a play session.

Funny, I’ve had armor damage from falling. If you fall enough times, you do sustain damage. I’ve done it on Goemm’s lab JP. No other reason for the damage but falling… and it booted me to the beginning after so many times.

I still have a problem with waypoint costs, what was the logic behind that? Lets disuade people from using a feature we put into the game to remove grind and discourage players from getting together when events are taking place.

Waypoint costs are the only fee for damaged armour now

Conaywea.5062:

Fractals /15chars

Character select

Rage.4693:

If it’s free now then why is it even a thing in the first place?

I could understand that in the past it could be used as a cash sink so people couldn’t endlessly try doing something that was above their ability’s. especially in dungeons this would create some pressure so you would keep yourself from dying to limit the repair costs. but if you’re going to throw that concept out of the window then why uphold the concept of armor repair at all?

It’s meant as a bit of a temporary death penalty, similar to GW1’s but with a lot more leeway. You don’t start losing stats until you’ve died 6 times without repairing.

They could take the repair anvils out of the beginning of the dungeon I suppose

Current system is fine. After a wipe I’m usually using the time to sell anyways. So selling and repairing together works pretty well right now.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

I feel the complete opposite.

I don’t even realize the mechanic exists until a piece of armor is broken

It basically gives you 6 free lives before it starts making you rethink anything….then you can just talk to some NPC, and not have to think about it anymore.

It is pointless, doesn’t add any sense of caution and does nothing until an armor peice is broken, when it simply becomes a slight annoyance at that point.

Devildoc.6721:

They could take the repair anvils out of the beginning of the dungeon I suppose

So bad pugs just give up…?

No. I don’t need that anvil, but some players definitely would miss it dearly, especially those that tackle with dungeons for the first times.

Just another vote for paying for armor repair rather than WP costs, especially with the new daily map-specific event problem. Events are over in a fraction of the time and if you don’t bampf, you stand little chance of getting in on the action. I’m already spending far too much time every day in maps every one of my characters cleared in the first month I played just to get the daily…which I consider a fun specific goal and part of the game as it’s designed to be played, so please don’t say I don’t have to do the daily.

If WP were free, I could play smarter and not die, which I tend to do anyway, and I could spend the time taking out a baddie slowly rather than running across country one more time because I don’t have the spare cash.

I know there are ways of farming to make money, but I not only don’t have that kind of time, I don’t have the interest. I want to play the game, not play games. (There’s nothing quite as rude as a dedicated farming group who bad mouths you for actually completing an event. Finish an event? Heavens, must I be thinking?)

I want to run a variety of characters. I want to explore all the life stories and races and types. I want them ALL to get BTDT… and ultimately, I want to make ascended gear. That means saving the money. Obviously, perfection from my POV w/b free repair AND bampfing, but I’d settle in a heartbeat for paying for repair and free bampfs.

Bottom line, I don’t have a lot of spare time to game and I want to maximize game play.

Anyway…FWIW, that’s my take.

In the current model of armor repair, the only behavior that’s reinforced is for the player to remember to talk to the repair NPC every time he sees the NPC. That makes it a bad mechanic.

By the way, the in-game armor damage/broken graphic doesn’t even show all the relevant information: no backpiece info.

It is an inconvenience. That’s all. Which is the point. If you keep dying over and over, you will have to inconveniently seek out an armor repair guy, which in fractals for example, will require leaving and coming back, which will make the rest of the party roll their eyes at you.

They had to do it this way because too many people found the money cost to be unfair. So instead of removing punishments at all, they downgraded it to an inconvenience.

Current system is fine.

Really I go days without repairing armor sometimes. I just forget to visit that shield. And I haven’t had a fully broken piece of armor in a very long time. Only place my armor gets damaged mostly is in WvW, and you gotta go back to spawn often enough you can visit the repair on the way back into the fray.

If your armor is going red and disabling then that’s your sign you need to seek out skills or knowledge on how to not die so much.

Keep armor repairing and armor damage. Thanks!

Armor damage has no real purpose aside from being an annoyance, and ought to be removed. Of course, they probably won’t do that…

If armor damage is removed, then how would they sell Instant Repair Canister for 70gm a piece from the gem store?

So far, I haven’t seen any proposal that I would prefer to the current system:

• There should be some consequence to dying besides waypoint costs.
• The game shouldn’t become immediately more difficult, since that would discourage experimentation.
• The penalty should be only as painful as needed to encourage people to be on their toes.

For me, the current system meets those three requirements. I can imagine other systems that would also meet the requirements, but none different enough to make them worth the time/effort to implement.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Interesting thoughts here. I always think of it as a gentle reminder of my need to use care in what I do. Especially that #%@$ jumping puzzle amongst the trees… at which I died multiple times. You know, “Play more wisely.” I don’t love the runs to the repair NPC, but I don’t resent them.

It’s good to see other players’ thoughts on the matter.

Anyone else find it slightly disturbing that devs don’t know that falling deaths don’t damage armor?

The only time I ever need to repair my armor is in SW… stupid terragriffs and their nonsensical AOE, damage invulnerability, and stacking dmg kill me at least 3 times a play session.

If you are in combat and die to falling dmg your armor breaks. As for other situations… well it wasn’t even that way in betas :/ Also I like having the repairing thing since there should be some penalty for death.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

So far, I haven’t seen any proposal that I would prefer to the current system:

• There should be some consequence to dying besides waypoint costs.
• The game shouldn’t become immediately more difficult, since that would discourage experimentation.
• The penalty should be only as painful as needed to encourage people to be on their toes.

For me, the current system meets those three requirements. I can imagine other systems that would also meet the requirements, but none different enough to make them worth the time/effort to implement.

I generally find the waypoint cost and Walk of Shame back to what you were doing is sufficient demotivation for dying. =P

Why can’t someone with the appropriate crafting skills fix their own (or anyone else’s) armor?

But but but, one might say, forge! Loom! Hide stretcher! Or whatever those leather guys use…

To which I say thee, nay! If someone who has no armor crafting skills whatsoever can fix their armor — in the field! — with an instant repair kit, then someone who knows what he or she is doing should be able to improvise something, even without a kit. Especially if he or she is an engineer!

So I submit to you, fellow Guild Wars 2ians — armor damage is a detriment to immersion and should be glossed over just like weapon damage (or the lack thereof). Seyla!