Guild Wars 2

Wreckdum.8367:

Gear grind used to be a way to show initiative. You could tell who actually cared about the game and would put in the work. Now you have people who have no idea how to play but they are wearing the same gear as you…

Funny, I’m more used to people wearing better gear than me, who have no idea how to play.

There is absolutely no reason for them to be increasing the stats on anything. If there was a gap between exotic and legendary, it was NOT the stats, they had the same stats. They could have introduced Ascended armor as merely another ascthetic upgrade, between exotic and legendary.

Nobody would be mad at that. There wouldn’t be these threads complaining about being lied to, about gear treadmills.

We’re all down with grinding out skins, because it’s for fun, because we want to — not because we need to in order to keep pace with the game. I don’t want to keep pace with the game. I want to keep pace with myself, and only be as good in-game as I am good at playing the game.

Gear treadmills are for people who never want to improve their game, who want to just do the same thing over and over and get cookies for it and to blow through content that’s too hard for them by simply smashing their head against it over and over until they’ve collected enough gear that their mushbrained tactics finally win.

Me, I’m more of an FPS guy, and not a console FPS guy with the lovely built-in aimbot those have — harsh stuff, old stuff. fun stuff. If I win, it’s because I’m smarter, faster, just plain better than someone else. If I lose, it’s because they’re better than me. Not because I spent more time collecting garbage stats than them, or them than me, but because it’s player skill against player skill with all the intervening layers stripped away.

Back in WoW, pre-expansions, I’d run around in my dungeon gear — there wasn’t tier 1.5, there wasn’t tier 1, there was just scholo/strat/UBRS, and MC that I never got gear from (aurastone hammer, actually, that was it..). Up until Naxx, I could still beat pretty much anyone in a 1v1 (on a PvP server, I used to flag myself as /afk in moderately high-traffic areas — I called it thief-fishing, and it was wonderful, because they’d pop on me from stealth and then I’d drop them. lulz). At that point, their gear advantage outweighed my skill advantage, and I began to completely hate the game and realize that a game with a gear treadmill is not for me.

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

RoChan.1926:

Zoolad.9748:

What I don’t really understand is why everyone is calling this a “gear treadmill”. If I’m not mistaken, a tier above “exotic” already exists in the original build of the game (legendaries). There is currently a massive gap (progression-wise) between standard exotics and legendaries, and the “Gift” exotics don’t help much. The ascended stat improvements seem marginal at best (likely not affecting game balance outside of Fractals in any meaningful way), and Anet has stated that legendaries will be boosted to remain the “best” tier. If everyone is already working towards a legendary, the established “ceiling” for in-game progression, and existing legendaries get upgraded, all this update really does is even out the progression curve a bit.

Legendaries are not higher in tier than Exotics currently. They will be when the next tier Ascended comes out and they will be bumped up. So no…. there isn’t a current higher tier as Legendaries = Exotics.

What I meant was, Legendaries are higher in the sense of “progression”. Something people work towards after reaching high level exotics (kind of like how obsidian Armour was a “higher” tier than standard Droks gear back in GW1.)

Aedelric.1287:

A hundred or so elitists on a forum that have little else to do with their time other than complain about an unreleased feature should not be taken seriously. Especially since it is being given to them for free and none of them have even tried it.

If Arena Net have any sense, which they do. They will wait till a week after the content has been released before taking any serious feedback.

Exactly my thought.

However I’d really like to see this topic merged, cuz you know, I wanna see more discussion about the actual game at the moment ( The orr snare, the DR ) rather than something Ascended related.

That’s just me though.

They are adding vertical progression when they bodly stated GW2 would only be horizontal. That is essentially throwing 5 years of promises right out the window.

Now that the gate has been opened, so begins the treadmill.

Shall I start digging up the direct dev quotes and vids? Or maybe put some effort in and go through that 8k+ post thread and see them there for yourselves. It’s right there in print for all to see.

p.s. i love new content, I love new things to do. I am all for it and appreciated it fully. What I don’t love is STAT creep in a game that said it would never ever have it and that is my complaint. Now take that out of context, I expect it.

Guild Wars 2 still is and will remain the best Buy To Play MMORPG on the market.

I have a hard time believing that people will quit the game over this.

+1 OP

Thank you, Anet, for putting up the fight to keep your game relevant for years to come!

Zoolad.9748:

RoChan.1926:

Zoolad.9748:

What I don’t really understand is why everyone is calling this a “gear treadmill”. If I’m not mistaken, a tier above “exotic” already exists in the original build of the game (legendaries). There is currently a massive gap (progression-wise) between standard exotics and legendaries, and the “Gift” exotics don’t help much. The ascended stat improvements seem marginal at best (likely not affecting game balance outside of Fractals in any meaningful way), and Anet has stated that legendaries will be boosted to remain the “best” tier. If everyone is already working towards a legendary, the established “ceiling” for in-game progression, and existing legendaries get upgraded, all this update really does is even out the progression curve a bit.

Legendaries are not higher in tier than Exotics currently. They will be when the next tier Ascended comes out and they will be bumped up. So no…. there isn’t a current higher tier as Legendaries = Exotics.

What I meant was, Legendaries are higher in the sense of “progression”. Something people work towards after reaching high level exotics (kind of like how obsidian Armour was a “higher” tier than standard Droks gear back in GW1.)

If what you say was true, then Ascended armor would not be an increase in stats over Exotic armor, it would be merely cosmetic as it was in GW1.
That’s not the case unfortunately.
I wouldn’t mind this one bit if that WAS how things were — if Ascended was just Exotics with an Infusion slot that would only be used for PvE content, just to damage / not be damaged by the new dungeons. That’s.. whatever, I could totally live with that by never taking part in it and never being punished for not taking part in it.
That’s not the case, unfortunately.

phanmc.6759:

Derk.3189:

They said they won’t add a new tier every 3 months. But hey, 4 months is totes fine!

In this case, I actually believe they won’t release another tier. I think they’re hoping the ascended and legendary gear will hold people over until their expansion. Then they’ll raise the level cap and add level new appropriate gear within the existing tiers and go “see! we didn’t add any more tiers (but your level 80 stuff are going to be obsolete anyway).”

They’ve said they wouldn’t add more levels to the game. I don’t have an exact quote on where/when they said it, to show you though.

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They are adding vertical progression when they bodly stated GW2 would only be horizontal. That is essentially throwing 5 years of promises right out the window.

Now that the gate has been opened, so begins the treadmill.

Shall I start digging up the direct dev quotes and vids? Or maybe put some effort in and go through that 8k+ post thread and see them there for yourselves. It’s right there in print for all to see.

For starters that “8k post thread” is a large group of the same crybabies crying over and over again I’ve looked over it…. Second off Just in today : "Our goal is not to create a gear treadmill. Our goal is to ensure we have a proper progression for players from exotic up to legendary without a massive jump in reward between the two. " If you still say that that means nothing all you have is an opinion not facts…. so come back with proof…

Alright… I’ll bite. If the goal is to create a proper progression from point A to Point C why not create a Point B? All they did was create a Point A to Point C again as Exotics will not be on the same standing ground as both Ascended or Legendaries. In other words if the goal was to create a bridge between the poor man’s armor and the rich man’s armor why not just create a middle class armor? Why create another level for the poor man’s armor (Ascended) to compete with the rich man’s armor (Legendary)?

RoChan.1926:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They are adding vertical progression when they bodly stated GW2 would only be horizontal. That is essentially throwing 5 years of promises right out the window.

Now that the gate has been opened, so begins the treadmill.

Shall I start digging up the direct dev quotes and vids? Or maybe put some effort in and go through that 8k+ post thread and see them there for yourselves. It’s right there in print for all to see.

For starters that “8k post thread” is a large group of the same crybabies crying over and over again I’ve looked over it…. Second off Just in today : "Our goal is not to create a gear treadmill. Our goal is to ensure we have a proper progression for players from exotic up to legendary without a massive jump in reward between the two. " If you still say that that means nothing all you have is an opinion not facts…. so come back with proof…

Alright… I’ll bite. If the goal is to create a proper progression from point A to Point C why not create a Point B? All they did was create a Point A to Point C again as Exotics will not be on the same standing ground as both Ascended or Legendaries. In other words if the goal was to create a bridge between the poor man’s armor and the rich man’s armor why not just create a middle class armor? Why create another level for the poor man’s armor (Ascended) to compete with the rich man’s armor (Legendary)?

For starters the amount of stats that actually go up in ascended gear is very small. Especially because ascended gear cannot use a traditional state upgrade item… They are stuck with Infusions which will only be useful for endgame content. So if you account for the upgrade item on an exotic you get a whopping +2-3 per stat increase compared to ascended and it will make almost no difference at all…. here’s a picture for reference :https://d2vn94glaxzkz3.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Ascended-EN.png

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes/sigils and infusions with stats on them in the future.

This is sort of thing I totally expect in an expansion, a year or two from now: not 2.5 months later.

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

The vocal minority are the ones who got them to back out on their philosophy in the first place by ADDING a treadmill, sooo..yeah Anet please don’t cave to them. If you read the merged thread, there’s literally about 8000 people are angry about this vs 100 who are in support of ascended.

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

That for me is the biggest problem. We were nothing short of lied to by the president of AN. Are we honestly expected to believe anything they say at this point?

Wrong, those ascended item have rune like stats already baked into them. Look at that ring; stats under the first one is essentially a higher tier jewel.

Also, you are dodging the issue where legendaries will have best dmg and stats in the game which is a fact they already stated in the gear blog.

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

8% comes from non-infused Ascended Ring versus fully upgraded Exotic Ring.

I wonder how much more once infusion comes in (worse: if they add sigil/rune slot to Ascended ones).

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

Actually the stats are estimated with the upgrade slot. The new gear has the standard jewel added into the base stats.

Now to touch on the legendary part ill quote a bit out of Linsey Murdock’s post:

“You’ll also see more Legendary items in the future and an update to our existing Legendary weapons. Legendary items were always intended to be on par with other “best-in-slot” items. So fear not, all existing Legendary weapons, which are currently on par with Exotics, will be upgraded to be on par with Ascended weapons at the same time that we add Ascended weapons to the game. Thus Legendaries will remain “best-in-slot” items. All Legendary items going forward will be of Ascended power. We also have plans to add more fun ways to acquire Legendary precursor items with a more “scavenger hunt” feel than they are acquired currently”

So that being said legendary’s are being brought to the same stats as ascended. They have infact not put a tier between exotic and legendary stats. Otherwise legendary’s would infact be higher than the new ascended. All they did is make exotic’s useless.

So after all of that you could have simply avoided all this by simply adding an infusion slot to current existing gear, you know like infusion of GW1 worked, that changed the tier to ascended. Very few would have an issue with this as stats would not have improved and you would have added that “tier” between exotic and legendary that you were looking for.

toomuchtatose.6874:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

8% comes from non-infused Ascended Ring versus fully upgraded Exotic Ring.

I wonder how much more once infusion comes in (worse: if they add sigil/rune slot to Ascended ones).

Whoever did that math then is totally wrong…. because the exotic items stats mixed with the upgrade only add about anywhere around 2-5 per stat…. also the infusion slot will only include resistances to conditions like Agony nothing more…. do your own research before arguing don’t use other peoples….

Shanna.4762:

The vocal minority are the ones who got them to back out on their philosophy in the first place by ADDING a treadmill, sooo..yeah Anet please don’t cave to them. If you read the merged thread, there’s literally about 8000 people are angry about this vs 100 who are in support of ascended.

So that 8100 people represent every single person in the game then?

Seriously people? The amount of people posting on the forum, even that 8000 post thread if every single post was unique, which they aren’t, don’t even represent 10% of the people playing this game right now.

Get over yourself.

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

Skykiller.3160:

toomuchtatose.6874:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

8% comes from non-infused Ascended Ring versus fully upgraded Exotic Ring.

I wonder how much more once infusion comes in (worse: if they add sigil/rune slot to Ascended ones).

Whoever did that math then is totally wrong…. because the exotic items stats mixed with the upgrade only add about anywhere around 2-5 per stat…. also the infusion slot will only include resistances to conditions like Agony nothing more…. do your own research before arguing don’t use other peoples….

Please make sure to re-read the section of the blog again regarding infusions. It is not limited nor is it intended to be limited to just Agony
“There are multiple types of Infusions and Infusion slots. In November, we’ll introduce Offensive, Defensive, and Omni Infusions of Fine rarity from new Mystic Forge recipes”

In the update we’ll be receiving 3 types and they are alluding to even more infusion types. Or are you saying that the Offensive infusion will attack Agnoy a status debuff?

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

You don’t know if you have to grind for it or not. I’m fairly certain the ring and back piece will be given to everyone attending the event this weekend.

It’s very likely you’ll get the full set of ascended gear just by playing the game. No grinding needed. Not that you needed to grind to get full exotics in the first place.

Saying “BiS” means it has the best stats of all weapons. It is an item you use because it is the BEST. So unless he mis-typed which I highly doubt, it means what it means; legendaries will be the top tier. I am just going by what that dude said. You don’t throw the term “BiS” around lightly imo, especially in an MMO.

[quote=730361;Hawkmoon.5849:]

RoChan.1926:

Skykiller.3160:

toomuchtatose.6874:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

8% comes from non-infused Ascended Ring versus fully upgraded Exotic Ring.

I wonder how much more once infusion comes in (worse: if they add sigil/rune slot to Ascended ones).

Whoever did that math then is totally wrong…. because the exotic items stats mixed with the upgrade only add about anywhere around 2-5 per stat…. also the infusion slot will only include resistances to conditions like Agony nothing more…. do your own research before arguing don’t use other peoples….

Please make sure to re-read the section of the blog again regarding infusions. It is not limited nor is it intended to be limited to just Agony
“There are multiple types of Infusions and Infusion slots. In November, we’ll introduce Offensive, Defensive, and Omni Infusions of Fine rarity from new Mystic Forge recipes”

In the update we’ll be receiving 3 types and they are alluding to even more infusion types. Or are you saying that the Offensive infusion will attack Agnoy a status debuff?

Well fine then… I was wrong but until we see what the stats are on infusions there is no reason to complain about them.

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

No one is forcing you to grind at all…. you get the new items from the new dungeon… which means doing the new content to get the new stuff. Holy crap lol do your research before complaining…

And for those that dont like dungeons, but still like to be relevant?

Now that being said infact the dungeon is NOT the only way to get it. They have stated existing content will provide ascended gear. We just dont know how it will do that yet.

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

No one is forcing you to grind at all…. you get the new items from the new dungeon… which means doing the new content to get the new stuff. Holy crap lol do your research before complaining…

the point is NOT EVERYONE WANTS TO DO DUNGEONS. Some of us just want to WvW. And now we have to grind a PvE dungeon to remain competitive.

Even if they add other means of getting the gear, but they raise the tiers every 3-6 months. And I take a break from the game for a year. What then? I’ll be a few tiers behind? I have to grind to catch up? That’s my concern.

Skykiller.3160:

RoChan.1926:

Skykiller.3160:

toomuchtatose.6874:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

8% comes from non-infused Ascended Ring versus fully upgraded Exotic Ring.

I wonder how much more once infusion comes in (worse: if they add sigil/rune slot to Ascended ones).

Whoever did that math then is totally wrong…. because the exotic items stats mixed with the upgrade only add about anywhere around 2-5 per stat…. also the infusion slot will only include resistances to conditions like Agony nothing more…. do your own research before arguing don’t use other peoples….

Please make sure to re-read the section of the blog again regarding infusions. It is not limited nor is it intended to be limited to just Agony
“There are multiple types of Infusions and Infusion slots. In November, we’ll introduce Offensive, Defensive, and Omni Infusions of Fine rarity from new Mystic Forge recipes”

In the update we’ll be receiving 3 types and they are alluding to even more infusion types. Or are you saying that the Offensive infusion will attack Agnoy a status debuff?

Well fine then… I was wrong but until we see what the stats are on infusions there is no reason to complain about them.

To be honest infusions them selfs most likely wont be an issue. The mobs that attack infusions are designed for have been stated to have abnormal defense. The issue most have is infact with the ascended stat boost. There was no reason for it.

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

No one is forcing you to grind at all…. you get the new items from the new dungeon… which means doing the new content to get the new stuff. Holy crap lol do your research before complaining…

the point is NOT EVERYONE WANTS TO DO DUNGEONS. Some of us just want to WvW. And now we have to grind a PvE dungeon to remain competitive.

Actually ascended gear from what they are saying will be able to be gotten from WvW.

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

No one is forcing you to grind at all…. you get the new items from the new dungeon… which means doing the new content to get the new stuff. Holy crap lol do your research before complaining…

the point is NOT EVERYONE WANTS TO DO DUNGEONS. Some of us just want to WvW. And now we have to grind a PvE dungeon to remain competitive.

So by “having to grind to remain competitive” you mean that a tiny +2-5 stats per item is going to help?

I have a feeling Anet won’t cave in to the forums. They’re confident in their plan, whatever that is – it’s for them to know and us to find out, I guess.

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

No one is forcing you to grind at all…. you get the new items from the new dungeon… which means doing the new content to get the new stuff. Holy crap lol do your research before complaining…

the point is NOT EVERYONE WANTS TO DO DUNGEONS. Some of us just want to WvW. And now we have to grind a PvE dungeon to remain competitive.

So by “having to grind to remain competitive” you mean that a tiny +2-5 stats per item is going to help?

When its that many per piece it actually does add up. It can be 5%+ crit change, 1000+ hp, and such. Not to mention with this higher tier weapon damage and armor will naturally go up due to it being this “Higher Tier”.

Malediktus.9250:

Please go ahead and keep adding more item and character progression. Its a very good way to keep pve interesting for a long time. New skins are good, but what if you dont like the new skins or like the one you have more? After all visuals are personal preference.

Anet is part of that “vocal minority” that said this was so terrible they would never do it.

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

aocypher.9172:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

They uh back tracked on their Manifesto and all the things they said for the past 5 years so what makes you think they won’t back track again? Whatever things they say now can be changed at a whim later on. They already did it once; so what’s to stop them from doing it again and again?

How did they go back on their manifesto? They are NOT adding a gear grind… they are adding a new tier nothing more…. whats more is that you can only get that new gear from that new dungeon…. Also what if the game had launched with Ascended Gear? would they still “be going against their manifesto” as you say? No they would not be… your only complaining because they are adding it post launch. So your argument is invalid.

No. They are going back on their manifesto. I have full exotics (other than the backpiece) on 3 of my characters. Now I have to grind to get full ascended.

And yes. I would be still be complaining if the game was launced with rares being the top tier and they added exotics. Why? Simply because they are forcing me to grind to keep up.

No one is forcing you to grind at all…. you get the new items from the new dungeon… which means doing the new content to get the new stuff. Holy crap lol do your research before complaining…

the point is NOT EVERYONE WANTS TO DO DUNGEONS. Some of us just want to WvW. And now we have to grind a PvE dungeon to remain competitive.

So by “having to grind to remain competitive” you mean that a tiny +2-5 stats per item is going to help?

That’s a 2-5 difference in the minor stat of the item. It is the major stat that I’m primarily concerned with. Like take berserker’s gear. The major stat is power, the minor stats are precision and crit damage. If the difference in the minor stat is 2-5, the difference in the major stat will be at least ~5-10. Taken across all 12 item slots, that’s what? at least a +60-120 stat difference? You can’t say that’s not significant; otherwise people will not be running orbs and runes.

SiNoS.2147:

Actually ascended gear from what they are saying will be able to be gotten from WvW.

Very true which is great, however, if it like it is now where it’s a super long grind to get full set compared to PvE then nothings really changed. Also like to point out that you can only get one set of stats currently in Wv3 which is P/T/V; you can’t get other stat combos…they can only be proccured outside of Wv3.

Have to wait I guess. Don’t forsee them revamping Wv3 gear progression for quite some time….they have to smooth out this new content pack first and fix the guarenteed bugs that will come with it. Then they have to release the rest of this stuff before they start focusing on Wv3….so until then, forced dungeon runs. Ugh. /dread.

Skykiller.3160:

RoChan.1926:

Skykiller.3160:

toomuchtatose.6874:

Skykiller.3160:

fixit.7189:

8% increase per item. 26% increase for whole set. This is going by stat budget math others have put much work into already to compute. 26% is a massive change in gear power. This not even factoring in how much they are buffin legendaries. You scoff at such marginal increases but when you put it all together, it may very well trump any rune combination if you are focusing on only pure stats in those slots (like I do). Best part is you get an extra slot to help you in PvE and whos to say they won’t eventually cave in, letting you use runes there in the future.

Wrong because those “estimates” do not account for upgrade slots….

8% comes from non-infused Ascended Ring versus fully upgraded Exotic Ring.

I wonder how much more once infusion comes in (worse: if they add sigil/rune slot to Ascended ones).

Whoever did that math then is totally wrong…. because the exotic items stats mixed with the upgrade only add about anywhere around 2-5 per stat…. also the infusion slot will only include resistances to conditions like Agony nothing more…. do your own research before arguing don’t use other peoples….

Please make sure to re-read the section of the blog again regarding infusions. It is not limited nor is it intended to be limited to just Agony
“There are multiple types of Infusions and Infusion slots. In November, we’ll introduce Offensive, Defensive, and Omni Infusions of Fine rarity from new Mystic Forge recipes”

In the update we’ll be receiving 3 types and they are alluding to even more infusion types. Or are you saying that the Offensive infusion will attack Agnoy a status debuff?

Well fine then… I was wrong but until we see what the stats are on infusions there is no reason to complain about them.

While I agree we shouldn’t be running around shouting the sky is falling, it is naive to think that we shouldn’t be complaining about it now. Expressing our concerns and complaints prior to letting them settle and become permanent is vastly as important as not breaking out the torches and the pitchforks. Most complaints are grounded on the same fact that there is no information leaving us to wildly guess, speculate, and bump around in the dark hoping to find reassurance.

I had previously expressed elsewhere that humans in general plan how they spend and invest their time. The current situation is that right now everyone is standing at an unknown vs a known. The known was that obtaining Exotics was supposed to be the last of it and that the time spent and invested would pay off in the future. Currently it is unknown if that still holds true since statistically it doesn’t seem so and Anet is not confirming that it’s merely a growing pain in an attempt to rectify an oversight. Since everyone has to gauge on their own how they are going to spend their time, their out cries are greatly justified since they currently are being lead to believe that the previous 3 months have been a waste.

The difference between Ascended and Exotic will be roughly the same as no WvW orbs vs. 3 WvW orbs.

That difference was too great, and so they removed the orbs.

Now you can get that same level of completely-overpoweredness, you just will need to make sure you’ve always grinded your gear to top-tier and find yourself some targets that haven’t!

Or, more likely, I’ll get tired of re-running content to try and keep up, give up, try to just stick to WvW and find that because I didn’t run their treadmill, I can’t compete. So maybe I’ll just live out the rest of my days in the Mists doing sPvP, and come out once per year to laugh at how out-of-date and useless my exotics are compared to Ascended’s successor tier (LOL@U if you think this is the end. I’m pretty sure they stated in their blog that this is just the beginning. Go check it out. they did.)

fixit.7189:

SiNoS.2147:

Actually ascended gear from what they are saying will be able to be gotten from WvW.

Very true which is great, however, if it like it is now where it’s a super long grind to get full set compared to PvE then nothings really changed. Also like to point out that you can only get one set of stats currently in Wv3 which is P/T/V; you can’t get other stat combos…they can only be proccured outside of Wv3.

Have to wait I guess. Don’t forsee them revamping Wv3 gear progression for quite some time….they have to smooth out this new content pack first and fix the guarenteed bugs that will come with it. Then they have to release the rest of this stuff before they start focusing on Wv3….so until then, forced dungeon runs. Ugh. /dread.

Eh i was just going off the fact they were talking about reworking the WvW gear issue. Sadly nothing is ever perfect but i will give them that in reguards to WvW it sounds like they are atleast listening to you all. Well atleast to a point…

fixit.7189:

Saying “BiS” means it has the best stats of all weapons. It is an item you use because it is the BEST. So unless he mis-typed which I highly doubt, it means what it means; legendaries will be the top tier. I am just going by what that dude said. You don’t throw the term “BiS” around lightly imo, especially in an MMO.

Im under the view this is about legendary weapons.

It was said that legendary would always be equivalent to the “current BiS” gear. Meaning it would never be hands down the top teir with nothing else touching it as they tried to make it sound when refering to why they are making exotics useless.

fellyn.5083:

They’ve said they wouldn’t add more levels to the game. I don’t have an exact quote on where/when they said it, to show you though.

Colin Johanson:
“The level cap will be 80 on the initial release of the game, and we absolutely would increase it further into the game, probably through expansions is the most likely place we would do that.”

camoflaugz.5031:

Anet really though don’t cave in to this whole anti gear thing. These people want to be so different to a point that it will hold you guys back. You don’t want to have a slogan like this..

(GUILDWARS 2 THE MMO THAT HATES GEAR AND PROGRESSION WE MAKE SURE YOUR CHARACTERS ARE STUCK AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO LOOK FORWARD TO GEAR THE WAY MILLIONS OF MMO PLAYERS WANT IT. BECAUSE WE ARE DIFFERENT. TRY OUR REVOLUTIONARY MMO TODAY FOR 30 DAYS)

LOL You can’t possibly think that sounds right.. this is what some of the people are asking you to do. Its totally backwards

You clearly dident do any research on this game as the BIGGEST selling point was the fact there was no gear grind. Most people do not infact enjoy gear grind. Thats obvious by the overwhelming outcry about this.

Also you can infact have a very successful and fun game without gear grind. It was called GW1. The game that this ones designed around.

phanmc.6759:

fellyn.5083:

They’ve said they wouldn’t add more levels to the game. I don’t have an exact quote on where/when they said it, to show you though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLHfq2lJY5A

Colin Johanson:
“The level cap will be 80 on the initial release of the game, and we absolutely would increase it further into the game, probably through expansions is the most likely place we would do that.”

Which is a HORRIBLE idea. Adding more traits to the game would just ruin it. You think guardian’s and such are bad now wait till they can not only buff them selfs but also there group mates into that dreaded bunker at the same time.

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

Anet really though don’t cave in to this whole anti gear thing. These people want to be so different to a point that it will hold you guys back. You don’t want to have a slogan like this..

(GUILDWARS 2 THE MMO THAT HATES GEAR AND PROGRESSION WE MAKE SURE YOUR CHARACTERS ARE STUCK AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO LOOK FORWARD TO GEAR THE WAY MILLIONS OF MMO PLAYERS WANT IT. BECAUSE WE ARE DIFFERENT. TRY OUR REVOLUTIONARY MMO TODAY FOR 30 DAYS)

LOL You can’t possibly think that sounds right.. this is what some of the people are asking you to do. Its totally backwards

You clearly dident do any research on this game as the BIGGEST selling point was the fact there was no gear grind. Most people do not infact enjoy gear grind. Thats obvious by the overwhelming outcry about this.

Also you can infact have a very successful and fun game without gear grind. It was called GW1. The game that this ones designed around.

Actually, it wasn’t the biggest selling point for me. The selling point for me was no class roles. No its not obvious that people don’t want the new patch. why dont you come meet me on my server and say that… People are pumped up for it. Jade Quarry come meet me anytime.

camoflaugz.5031:

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

Anet really though don’t cave in to this whole anti gear thing. These people want to be so different to a point that it will hold you guys back. You don’t want to have a slogan like this..

(GUILDWARS 2 THE MMO THAT HATES GEAR AND PROGRESSION WE MAKE SURE YOUR CHARACTERS ARE STUCK AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO LOOK FORWARD TO GEAR THE WAY MILLIONS OF MMO PLAYERS WANT IT. BECAUSE WE ARE DIFFERENT. TRY OUR REVOLUTIONARY MMO TODAY FOR 30 DAYS)

LOL You can’t possibly think that sounds right.. this is what some of the people are asking you to do. Its totally backwards

You clearly dident do any research on this game as the BIGGEST selling point was the fact there was no gear grind. Most people do not infact enjoy gear grind. Thats obvious by the overwhelming outcry about this.

Also you can infact have a very successful and fun game without gear grind. It was called GW1. The game that this ones designed around.

Actually, it wasn’t the biggest selling point for me. The selling point for me was no class roles. No its not obvious that people don’t want the new patch. why dont you come meet me on my server and say that… People are pumped up for it. Jade Quarry come meet me anytime.

Ok ill rephrase that. ONE of the BIGGEST selling points was no gear grind. Most people dont realize just what this update actually is. And infact i’ve personally seen and talked to way more people upset over this than that are happy. Most when i point out what the gear actually is tend to get upset over it.

Most people are not upset about the fact were getting a new mechanic. Most are upset that they are going back on there word and increasing the stats.

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

Anet really though don’t cave in to this whole anti gear thing. These people want to be so different to a point that it will hold you guys back. You don’t want to have a slogan like this..

(GUILDWARS 2 THE MMO THAT HATES GEAR AND PROGRESSION WE MAKE SURE YOUR CHARACTERS ARE STUCK AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO LOOK FORWARD TO GEAR THE WAY MILLIONS OF MMO PLAYERS WANT IT. BECAUSE WE ARE DIFFERENT. TRY OUR REVOLUTIONARY MMO TODAY FOR 30 DAYS)

LOL You can’t possibly think that sounds right.. this is what some of the people are asking you to do. Its totally backwards

You clearly dident do any research on this game as the BIGGEST selling point was the fact there was no gear grind. Most people do not infact enjoy gear grind. Thats obvious by the overwhelming outcry about this.

Also you can infact have a very successful and fun game without gear grind. It was called GW1. The game that this ones designed around.

Actually, it wasn’t the biggest selling point for me. The selling point for me was no class roles. No its not obvious that people don’t want the new patch. why dont you come meet me on my server and say that… People are pumped up for it. Jade Quarry come meet me anytime.

Ok ill rephrase that. ONE of the BIGGEST selling points was no gear grind. Most people dont realize just what this update actually is. And infact i’ve personally seen and talked to way more people upset over this than that are happy. Most when i point out what the gear actually is tend to get upset over it.

Most people are not upset about the fact were getting a new mechanic. Most are upset that they are going back on there word and increasing the stats.

Ok that sounds better, however honestly when I talk to people in orr on my server they are pretty excited. You gonna meet me to see because I’m not making this up.. There are some hardcores on my server that probably havent slept:) And no they are not bots they actually talk:)

camoflaugz.5031:

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

Anet really though don’t cave in to this whole anti gear thing. These people want to be so different to a point that it will hold you guys back. You don’t want to have a slogan like this..

(GUILDWARS 2 THE MMO THAT HATES GEAR AND PROGRESSION WE MAKE SURE YOUR CHARACTERS ARE STUCK AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO LOOK FORWARD TO GEAR THE WAY MILLIONS OF MMO PLAYERS WANT IT. BECAUSE WE ARE DIFFERENT. TRY OUR REVOLUTIONARY MMO TODAY FOR 30 DAYS)

LOL You can’t possibly think that sounds right.. this is what some of the people are asking you to do. Its totally backwards

You clearly dident do any research on this game as the BIGGEST selling point was the fact there was no gear grind. Most people do not infact enjoy gear grind. Thats obvious by the overwhelming outcry about this.

Also you can infact have a very successful and fun game without gear grind. It was called GW1. The game that this ones designed around.

Actually, it wasn’t the biggest selling point for me. The selling point for me was no class roles. No its not obvious that people don’t want the new patch. why dont you come meet me on my server and say that… People are pumped up for it. Jade Quarry come meet me anytime.

Ok ill rephrase that. ONE of the BIGGEST selling points was no gear grind. Most people dont realize just what this update actually is. And infact i’ve personally seen and talked to way more people upset over this than that are happy. Most when i point out what the gear actually is tend to get upset over it.

Most people are not upset about the fact were getting a new mechanic. Most are upset that they are going back on there word and increasing the stats.

Ok that sounds better, however honestly when I talk to people in orr on my server they are pretty excited. You gonna meet me to see because I’m not making this up.. There are some hardcores on my server that probably havent slept:) And no they are not bots they actually talk:)

I experience exactly the opposite. A lot of my friends are totally pissed, some of our most active WvW players are about to quit and the general activity has gone down.

camoflaugz.5031:

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

SiNoS.2147:

camoflaugz.5031:

Anet really though don’t cave in to this whole anti gear thing. These people want to be so different to a point that it will hold you guys back. You don’t want to have a slogan like this..

(GUILDWARS 2 THE MMO THAT HATES GEAR AND PROGRESSION WE MAKE SURE YOUR CHARACTERS ARE STUCK AND WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO LOOK FORWARD TO GEAR THE WAY MILLIONS OF MMO PLAYERS WANT IT. BECAUSE WE ARE DIFFERENT. TRY OUR REVOLUTIONARY MMO TODAY FOR 30 DAYS)

LOL You can’t possibly think that sounds right.. this is what some of the people are asking you to do. Its totally backwards

You clearly dident do any research on this game as the BIGGEST selling point was the fact there was no gear grind. Most people do not infact enjoy gear grind. Thats obvious by the overwhelming outcry about this.

Also you can infact have a very successful and fun game without gear grind. It was called GW1. The game that this ones designed around.

Actually, it wasn’t the biggest selling point for me. The selling point for me was no class roles. No its not obvious that people don’t want the new patch. why dont you come meet me on my server and say that… People are pumped up for it. Jade Quarry come meet me anytime.

Ok ill rephrase that. ONE of the BIGGEST selling points was no gear grind. Most people dont realize just what this update actually is. And infact i’ve personally seen and talked to way more people upset over this than that are happy. Most when i point out what the gear actually is tend to get upset over it.

Most people are not upset about the fact were getting a new mechanic. Most are upset that they are going back on there word and increasing the stats.

Ok that sounds better, however honestly when I talk to people in orr on my server they are pretty excited. You gonna meet me to see because I’m not making this up.. There are some hardcores on my server that probably havent slept:) And no they are not bots they actually talk:)

Honestly jade is know as being hardcore central. Very few servers agree with them. Most servers dont have the same mind set.

Now that being said ofcourse those people would be excited by it. No offence but the locust you hear us talking about. That would be them. And they are truly a small group in the total population. Granted a very loud group. As such they tend to screw up the numbers people get because in general they are not looking at the total of people setting at that point but instead are looking at the fact people are at that point. Thats obvious when they stated that the very most dedicated have smashed threw there content already. They dident say most have got threw it.

Skykiller.3160:

morrolan.9608:

Skykiller.3160:

Seriously guys they are adding ONE new tier to items! ONE! They have already said that they will not be adding more.

No they haven’t.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/A-message-from-our-Studio-Design-Director-Chris-Whiteside “We will not be adding a new tier of gear every 3 months that we expect everyone to chase after and then get the next set and so on.” I rest my case…

it only says they wont be adding a new tier every three months. It doesn’t say they will never add a new tier.

brilliant, i hope they will increase level 100 in the first expansion pack, thats good for us players, especially the ones who like to grind for more gear again since obviously u will not keep ur level 80 gear in a level 100 char, i do hope this game also gets mounts while they are at it and also bring healer back, make warrior more of a tanker so it finally can be like all other mmorpgs out there

PS im forced to talk like this… for some reason.