Guild Wars 2

Egocentric

Egocentrism is characterized by preoccupation with one’s own internal world. Egocentrics regard themselves and their own opinions or interests as being the most important or valid. To them, self-relevant information is seen to be more important in shaping one’s judgments than are thoughts about others and other-relevant information.¹ Egocentric people are unable to fully understand or to cope with other people’s opinions and the fact that reality can be different from what they are ready to accept. (Psychology 101)

This is to say that I am tired of peoples argument that include all the player base, or even refuse to see that others can have a far different experience. I do see that for what ever reason others do not like the game, I will not say go play another game yet I wonder why you don’t if you hate GW2/HOT and where it is headed. I how ever am happy. Do I find things un-fun in the game. Yes. Always have always will. Yet others find those very things I dislike as fun and I have always understood that. Hence I don’t beg for things I do not like to be removed or changed. Yes, there are things that might come out not right at first but constructive criticism not negative is a far better way to convey it to Arenanet. I have been playing since GW1 and love the game. Yes, I have also struggled with the game at times or get frustrated but eventually find a way around those problems. So yes, criticize yet please keep it civil and please remember we are all not you, nor hold the same opinions.

is it ‘ego’ or ‘ethno’?

Ethnocentrism is quite a different thing to egocentrism, and quite different to what you’re writing about. So I’m not sure why you chucked that in as if it were interchangeable?

It’s also very worth pointing out that people on an MMO forum not wanting to listen to other’s opinions does not make the egocentrics. If you’re studying psychology that’s probably something you should get a handle out. A singular characteristic does not a diagnosis make.

People get excited about the prospect of video games being how they want them to be. It’s very easy to assume that one’s own ideas will make everything amazing and that anyone else’s ideas are therefore in direct opposition. People are also generally less caring of other’s opinions in online situations. The internet gives people a voice with no culpability. So yeah, people on the forums can be a little bit self-oriented, but that doesn’t make them egocentrics.

I’d also really like to point out that there’s nothing wrong with people complaining or critiquing how the game is. It is really important for people to be able to voice issues or concerns, and also to be able to make suggestions. The forum exists partly for those very reasons. Yes there is a lot of non-constructive criticism that goes on here, but that doesn’t necessarily invalidate it either. Not everyone has been taught how to make their criticism constructive, that doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be allowed to speak up. It’s up to the developers to decide what’s constructive and what they’re going to listen to.

People complaining about things shouldn’t have an impact on your own enjoyment of the game. If it’s bothering you then I’d suggest avoiding the forums :/

Yes, I have seen those who are pro-HoT and anti-HoT claim that they speak for everyone. It is annoying and a weak attempt at strengthening an argument.

I agree that anyone who hates the game should probably find another game that they can enjoy.

I really like gw2 but don’t like the direction they went with HoT. Any criticism I level at the game is not based on hatred of the game. There are aspects of the game that I really don’t like and I want the company to know it. I also enjoy a lively debate.

I…don’t really understand this thread.

It’s one thing to say, “That’s your opinion, but I don’t feel that way,” when someone complains/praises something, but if you’re not talking about anything specific, what’s the point?

That’s the r/iamverysmartway of saying “Not everyone is having a bad time here!”
But it is a valid point. There are a lot of “This is why everyone does X” posts, when nine times out of ten it’s not what everyone does. It’s like a small handful of people with a complaint that just assumes everyone else thinks the same way.

It is not just the people with complaints that assume everyone else thinks the same way. I’ve seen plenty of people who like HoT assume the same thing….. for example I see this one a lot “Only people on this forum are players who don’t like HoT while the majority of people are enjoying the expansion and don’t have time to be visiting the forum”

I paraphrased a little but it usually goes something like that

Ethnocentrism is the belief of superiority is one’s personal ethnic group.
Ego centrism is having or regarding the self or the individual as the center of all things.
Think he means ego but I get what he’s taking about.

O.K. Guess I’ll have to be “that guy”. Excuse me while I whip out my ego.

The reason why it is everyone’s “claims” about HoT being good or not included everyone elses opinion, or appear to do so, is because those claims do not cater to opinions at all. They are the discussion of facts revolving around HoT, and the fact that you disagree means nothing to someone else.

While you may be used to a world that is full of “to each their own” and “live and let live”, the real world isn’t like that. The real world actually cares about what works, and what doesn’t. The real world is objective. So, when players discuss what the mistakes are with HoT, they aren’t talking about what is “bad for them”. They’re talking about what is bad, period. If you feel like that you are constantly being looped in with their discussions, then maybe it is your own ego that is to blame. When people disagree, they voice those disagreements, and get into a discussion where (hopefully) something productive will emerge.

There are many standards for which to judge the content of HoT:

#1: Teleologic. That is, what it is designed to do. If something is designed to do one thing (say, the megaserver system is designed to group like players together on maps), and it fails to accomplish this objective (random kicking and gathering onto empty worlds, random undisplayed map closing, forcing guild shards to close at full population, etc), then it is bad design. Not “bad design for me”. It is bad design, period.

#2: Technical Merit. This is what separates good art from bad art. This is the way the pieces come together and compliment each other. Issues like having voice acting that varies wildly in tone between lines, storylines that are too predictable, plot threads that are nonsensical or end abruptly, dissonance between gameplay and narrative, etc. When the tonal flow of the story is abrupt, jarring, or so narrowly focused that it leaves people unsatisfied, it isn’t “bad for me”. It is bad, period.

#3: Basic function. This is the ability for the game system to actually run. This is issues like bugs and memory overload problems, which would cause people’s game’s to crash near the end of event chains. If the game doesn’t function properly, in that pressing space doesn’t deploy the glider or the game can’t load a map that it is meant to load, then it is bad. Not “bad for me”. Bad, period.

There’s probably more, too. But, think of it from a basic standpoint: If you like something, you should be able to explain why it is you like it, and what is good about something. Your opinions don’t bampf into existence from nowhere.

Giving feedback, even purely negative feedback is fine. Even centering that feedback exclusively around your own opinion is ok, since, if a sufficient amount of people give their personal opinion, the whole will be a good average of what the players actually want.
And even if people keep thinking that they represent the vast majority, even though they dont, their self-centeredness(?) will still be obvious for every unrelated observer.
You are also by far not the only one who enjoys the game. But nobody goes to the forums, unless there is (seems to be) a problem to be talked about.
Just like you created this very post in order to point out something that you dont agree with.
Most of the forum posts that you can take remotely serious hold a lot of good points, and provide valuable feedback with actual suggestions on how to solve a problem. The very best of authors are even open to suggestions themselves. The others suffer from dunning-kruger and shallt not be payed to much attention to.

That’s funny, I always assumed by that definition every person alive would fit that “egocentric” label then. The only reason someone would bother to conform to someone else’s opinion is if it’s either enforced by social or society laws, or benefit them personally in some way.

Asrat.2645:

Giving feedback, even purely negative feedback is fine. Even centering that feedback exclusively around your own opinion is ok, since, if a sufficient amount of people give their personal opinion, the whole will be a good average of what the players actually want.
And even if people keep thinking that they represent the vast majority, even though they dont, their self-centeredness(?) will still be obvious for every unrelated observer.
You are also by far not the only one who enjoys the game. But nobody goes to the forums, unless there is (seems to be) a problem to be talked about.
Just like you created this very post in order to point out something that you dont agree with.
Most of the forum posts that you can take remotely serious hold a lot of good points, and provide valuable feedback with actual suggestions on how to solve a problem. The very best of authors are even open to suggestions themselves. The others suffer from dunning-kruger and shallt not be payed to much attention to.

I believe some people frequent the forums without ‘a problem to be talked about’. As in-game, the population is made up of a whole spectrum of players.

This game, more than any other I’ve played, seems to have a large amount of people that fall into these mindsets:

1. “I’m not happy unless you are playing the game the way I think you should be playing the game so if I’m not happy, then you shouldn’t be happy either.”
2. Entitlement. Entitlement. Entitlement.

For my part, I’ve purchased the base game and I’ve purchased HoT. I’ve also tossed in a few gem card purchases over the years that I’ve played. Lets just pretend I’ve spent $500 on this game. I think I have well over 5,000 hours of entertainment from GW2. A movie at the theater costs around $10-12 just for two hours of entertainment. I’d say that GW2 has given me a darn fine return on my investment.

Are there things I absolutely despise about this game? Sure. But the pros SIGNIFICANTLY outweigh the cons and I’m generally pretty happy with GW2.

gaile has outlined well what to post, but not so much what not to post. the problem is when this:

“I don’t like this because [reasons]”

becomes instead:

+/- a few kittens, paragraphs, and typos:

“i kittening hate this kittening kitten kitten [censor dodge] cuz [dev] is a kittening kittenty piece of [censor dodge] and anet needs to kittening fire some kittenes and spend money on [something full of kittens] instead”

which is obviously garbage and gets deleted, but is reposted, deleted again, and then the OP complains that anet deletes negative feedback and the mods are fascists in a 3rd repost resulting in a 3rd infraction, prolly a ban, and deleted again.

and yes, people do this. over 3 years, ive watched and laughed and had tons of “this thread was moved to subforum trashcan” notifications and laughed again.

keep it civil and your criticism wont be deleted. but the people who need to understand this walk into the forum angry with no posting history and post vitriol without ever reading the forums or code of conduct or even taking a look at whats on the front page of the relevant sub and get kicked out with a ban.

First off sorry for the misused word at the top, somehow it got auto corrected and I did not catch it.

Gaile Gray.6029:

I don’t often get into moderation policies,

Perhaps it’s time you start doing so. I mean, if you’re not dealing with this, then who is?

Also, I was not posting about not criticizing something just the manner of how it is done. And that those that respond to that posting debating that point have a right to their opinion and point of view also with out being called names or flamed. Also, I believe that If something is not working as it should, bugs and such, I believe that Arenanet has a place to post and report those problems. Separate from the regular forums.

So…many….blocks of texts….

o.o;;

Gaile Gray.6029:
First, to address what I feel is the reason for this thread. I agree that posting an opinion as an opinion, not fact, is the correct thing to do. I also agree that making sweeping statements isn’t appropriate, for each of us players represents ourselves, not the community at large.

Problem is on these forums you invariably get throngs of ‘clever’ posters attacking any opinion as ‘illogical’ or whatever other buzzword they’ve latched on to. Clearly insulting peoples intelligence but getting no punishment because it strictly isn’t an insult, but a descriptive of their argument, though used with full intention to insult intelligence and character of the poster.

And worse, these types of posters frequently get moderator support for their actions simply because of the subject matter.

Heck try posting a thread in favor of mounts or open world PvP if you don’t believe me. You could post bloody fully functional code and the thread would still within minutes be filled with spamming, sarcastic remarks, and round after round of the most vitriolic attacks on the character of anyone who dares share a supportive opinion of the suggestion. And if you report any of these attacks, nothing happens, I know, I’ve reported many such posts which were incontestably against the rules. Entire threads of hundreds of posts of nothing but mockery and insults and general mean-spiritedness, totally ignored. Seemingly for no reason other than it has just become the norm to treat those of certain opinions like second class citizens on these forums, to the point that even the moderators turn a blind eye to it.

Well if you don’t like the rules of the forum... then don’t use them. If you choose to use them, then you choose to abide by what ever the moderators do. I love the persecuted act though, I am sure the moderators stalk and punish some more than others.

Neural.1824:

You didn’t just remove the offensive word post, Gaile, you infracted half the thread for it.

This forum software writes “kitten” all over half of creation at even the slightest hint of potential vulgarity, yet somehow a word got through that is so “highly offensive” that you have to punish 4 people merely for the sin of quoting it?

Meanwhile, another thread is allowed to stand with a title change, even though you know as well as I do that if it had be me that posted the thread, I’d have gotten in trouble for it.

you do not accumulate infraction points for posts deleted because of quoting an infracted/deleted post unless something is naughty about your post too. theyre simply deleted, and a notification spams your inbox.

Conncept.7638:

Gaile Gray.6029:
First, to address what I feel is the reason for this thread. I agree that posting an opinion as an opinion, not fact, is the correct thing to do. I also agree that making sweeping statements isn’t appropriate, for each of us players represents ourselves, not the community at large.

Problem is on these forums you invariably get throngs of ‘clever’ posters attacking any opinion as ‘illogical’ or whatever other buzzword they’ve latched on to. Clearly insulting peoples intelligence but getting no punishment because it strictly isn’t an insult, but a descriptive of their argument, though used with full intention to insult intelligence and character of the poster.

And worse, these types of posters frequently get moderator support for their actions simply because of the subject matter.

Heck try posting a thread in favor of mounts or open world PvP if you don’t believe me. You could post bloody fully functional code and the thread would still within minutes be filled with spamming, sarcastic remarks, and round after round of the most vitriolic attacks on the character of anyone who dares share a supportive opinion of the suggestion. And if you report any of these attacks, nothing happens, I know, I’ve reported many such posts which were incontestably against the rules. Entire threads of hundreds of posts of nothing but mockery and insults and general mean-spiritedness, totally ignored. Seemingly for no reason other than it has just become the norm to treat those of certain opinions like second class citizens on these forums, to the point that even the moderators turn a blind eye to it.

+1 again. Thank you for fixing and reposting it.

insanemaniac.2456:

Neural.1824:

You didn’t just remove the offensive word post, Gaile, you infracted half the thread for it.

This forum software writes “kitten” all over half of creation at even the slightest hint of potential vulgarity, yet somehow a word got through that is so “highly offensive” that you have to punish 4 people merely for the sin of quoting it?

Meanwhile, another thread is allowed to stand with a title change, even though you know as well as I do that if it had be me that posted the thread, I’d have gotten in trouble for it.

you do not accumulate infraction points for posts deleted because of quoting an infracted/deleted post unless something is naughty about your post too. theyre simply deleted, and a notification spams your inbox.

My inbox begs to disagree with this.

As it clearly states

Your post in Egocentrism was infracted by a moderator:

Moderator Note:
Your post in “Egocentrism” has been removed because it quoted a post that contains a highly-offensive word. You are welcome to share your thoughts, but please use care in what you are quoting, because to keep the forums reasonable we do remove quotes of comments that themselves were removed for offensiveness.

Hope that clears up this non-sense.

They do issue infractions is the TL;DR and if they aren’t then they definitely need much clearer auto-gen messages, or just human intervention would be a nice civil start.

That said, the original point of moderating double standards existing is evident as it is seen on the first page of the forums. Satire, does not produce discourse, especially when it’s about topics that otherwise get locked for not having anything of discourse, nor being related to GW2.

Conncept.7638:

Gaile Gray.6029:
First, to address what I feel is the reason for this thread. I agree that posting an opinion as an opinion, not fact, is the correct thing to do. I also agree that making sweeping statements isn’t appropriate, for each of us players represents ourselves, not the community at large.

Problem is on these forums you invariably get throngs of ‘clever’ posters attacking any opinion as ‘illogical’ or whatever other buzzword they’ve latched on to. Clearly insulting peoples intelligence but getting no punishment because it strictly isn’t an insult, but a descriptive of their argument, though used with full intention to insult intelligence and character of the poster.

And worse, these types of posters frequently get moderator support for their actions simply because of the subject matter.

Heck try posting a thread in favor of mounts or open world PvP if you don’t believe me. You could post bloody fully functional code and the thread would still within minutes be filled with spamming, sarcastic remarks, and round after round of the most vitriolic attacks on the character of anyone who dares share a supportive opinion of the suggestion. And if you report any of these attacks, nothing happens, I know, I’ve reported many such posts which were incontestably against the rules. Entire threads of hundreds of posts of nothing but mockery and insults and general mean-spiritedness, totally ignored. Seemingly for no reason other than it has just become the norm to treat those of certain opinions like second class citizens on these forums, to the point that even the moderators turn a blind eye to it.

What if whatever the OP posted was indeed so ridiculous that it makes whatever logical response to it seem sarcastic. Maybe OP posted, oh I want to PvP in the blighting towers in dragon stand. How do you respond to that kind of post in a way that is not sarcastic nor derogatory. I’ll slap myself if I needed to respond to such posts in a sugary coated politically correct response like honey dear you know killing players during a boss fight is just not civil or sweetie pls leave ppl alone in ‘x’ and ‘x’ situation because it is rude.

TexZero.7910:

insanemaniac.2456:

Neural.1824:

You didn’t just remove the offensive word post, Gaile, you infracted half the thread for it.

This forum software writes “kitten” all over half of creation at even the slightest hint of potential vulgarity, yet somehow a word got through that is so “highly offensive” that you have to punish 4 people merely for the sin of quoting it?

Meanwhile, another thread is allowed to stand with a title change, even though you know as well as I do that if it had be me that posted the thread, I’d have gotten in trouble for it.

you do not accumulate infraction points for posts deleted because of quoting an infracted/deleted post unless something is naughty about your post too. theyre simply deleted, and a notification spams your inbox.

My inbox begs to disagree with this.

As it clearly states

Your post in Egocentrism was infracted by a moderator:

Moderator Note:
Your post in “Egocentrism” has been removed because it quoted a post that contains a highly-offensive word. You are welcome to share your thoughts, but please use care in what you are quoting, because to keep the forums reasonable we do remove quotes of comments that themselves were removed for offensiveness.

Hope that clears up this non-sense.

They do issue infractions is the TL;DR and if they aren’t then they definitely need much clearer auto-gen messages, or just human intervention would be a nice civil start.

That said, the original point of moderating double standards existing is evident as it is seen on the first page of the forums. Satire, does not produce discourse, especially when it’s about topics that otherwise get locked for not having anything of discourse, nor being related to GW2.

dude.
it tells you when you get an infraction point.

trust me.
no infraction point there.
…

Conncept.7638:

…snip…

Treat others as you would wish to be treated. If you wish to be insulted, insult others. If you wish to have fingers pointed at you, point fingers at others. If you wish to have a rational discussion, then discuss things rationally.

It’s not always going to work because you are the only person you have control over, but it’s a start. Getting angry and rage-posting isn’t going to help anyone.

~EW

Gaile. Do you think y’all can look at the auto messages from moderators, rethink the word infraction and not use it when it’s only thread clean up. To you it may mean action taken. To me it means the account was disciplined. So seeing a message that the account was infracted is confusing as it can mean nothing happened or it can mean your account was disciplined and it can take several readings through the message to parse it out.

For example, it took me several readings to figure this one out. I had trouble telling if it was a clean up only or a clean up and my account got a warning.

Your post in [name of thread deleted] was infracted by a moderator:

[Deleted Posts]

Moderator Note:
Removing post that quoted a moderated post. No points of penalty — just cleaning up the thread. Thanks.

This infraction serves only a warning. Additional infractions may award Infraction Points which can negatively affect your account. Infraction points may cause loss of privileges, including forum suspension.

Your message was deleted.

This is an automated message generated by an infraction given by a human moderator. If you believe you have received this infraction in error or wish to make an appeal, please send an e-mail to forums@arena.net.

Odd that he gets notifications like that when I normally get something like the following:

Your post in (thread name) was removed because it quoted a post that was deleted by a moderator. This notification is intended only to inform you of why your post was removed. The removal does not result in any points of penalties and does not affect your forum account in any way.

That’s all that’s in the message. Why the difference?

insanemaniac.2456:

Neural.1824:

You didn’t just remove the offensive word post, Gaile, you infracted half the thread for it.

This forum software writes “kitten” all over half of creation at even the slightest hint of potential vulgarity, yet somehow a word got through that is so “highly offensive” that you have to punish 4 people merely for the sin of quoting it?

Meanwhile, another thread is allowed to stand with a title change, even though you know as well as I do that if it had be me that posted the thread, I’d have gotten in trouble for it.

you do not accumulate infraction points for posts deleted because of quoting an infracted/deleted post unless something is naughty about your post too. theyre simply deleted, and a notification spams your inbox.

Unfortunately this is not always true.

insanemaniac.2456:

TexZero.7910:

insanemaniac.2456:

Neural.1824:

You didn’t just remove the offensive word post, Gaile, you infracted half the thread for it.

This forum software writes “kitten” all over half of creation at even the slightest hint of potential vulgarity, yet somehow a word got through that is so “highly offensive” that you have to punish 4 people merely for the sin of quoting it?

Meanwhile, another thread is allowed to stand with a title change, even though you know as well as I do that if it had be me that posted the thread, I’d have gotten in trouble for it.

you do not accumulate infraction points for posts deleted because of quoting an infracted/deleted post unless something is naughty about your post too. theyre simply deleted, and a notification spams your inbox.

My inbox begs to disagree with this.

As it clearly states

Your post in Egocentrism was infracted by a moderator:

Moderator Note:
Your post in “Egocentrism” has been removed because it quoted a post that contains a highly-offensive word. You are welcome to share your thoughts, but please use care in what you are quoting, because to keep the forums reasonable we do remove quotes of comments that themselves were removed for offensiveness.

Hope that clears up this non-sense.

They do issue infractions is the TL;DR and if they aren’t then they definitely need much clearer auto-gen messages, or just human intervention would be a nice civil start.

That said, the original point of moderating double standards existing is evident as it is seen on the first page of the forums. Satire, does not produce discourse, especially when it’s about topics that otherwise get locked for not having anything of discourse, nor being related to GW2.

dude.
it tells you when you get an infraction point.

trust me.
no infraction point there.
…

Infractions have been given for quoting a deleted post in the past. Unfortunately we cannot speak of it without also having that post infracted as per forum rules.
I have had discussions with others in this thread about this very subject in the past and it is one of the primary reasons I stopped posting here. Also, you can also get infracted for saying something good about the game, not only something bad. See the thread below:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Recent-interactions-with-support/first#post5723049

ShiningSquirrel.3751:

insanemaniac.2456:

TexZero.7910:

insanemaniac.2456:

Neural.1824:

You didn’t just remove the offensive word post, Gaile, you infracted half the thread for it.

This forum software writes “kitten” all over half of creation at even the slightest hint of potential vulgarity, yet somehow a word got through that is so “highly offensive” that you have to punish 4 people merely for the sin of quoting it?

Meanwhile, another thread is allowed to stand with a title change, even though you know as well as I do that if it had be me that posted the thread, I’d have gotten in trouble for it.

you do not accumulate infraction points for posts deleted because of quoting an infracted/deleted post unless something is naughty about your post too. theyre simply deleted, and a notification spams your inbox.

My inbox begs to disagree with this.

As it clearly states

Your post in Egocentrism was infracted by a moderator:

Moderator Note:
Your post in “Egocentrism” has been removed because it quoted a post that contains a highly-offensive word. You are welcome to share your thoughts, but please use care in what you are quoting, because to keep the forums reasonable we do remove quotes of comments that themselves were removed for offensiveness.

Hope that clears up this non-sense.

They do issue infractions is the TL;DR and if they aren’t then they definitely need much clearer auto-gen messages, or just human intervention would be a nice civil start.

That said, the original point of moderating double standards existing is evident as it is seen on the first page of the forums. Satire, does not produce discourse, especially when it’s about topics that otherwise get locked for not having anything of discourse, nor being related to GW2.

dude.
it tells you when you get an infraction point.

trust me.
no infraction point there.
…

Infractions have been given for quoting a deleted post in the past. Unfortunately we cannot speak of it without also having that post infracted as per forum rules.
I have had discussions with others in this thread about this very subject in the past and it is one of the primary reasons I stopped posting here. Also, you can also get infracted for saying something good about the game, not only something bad. See the thread below:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Recent-interactions-with-support/first#post5723049

appeal it thru the email.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Ayrilana.1396:

Odd that he gets notifications like that when I normally get something like the following:

Your post in (thread name) was removed because it quoted a post that was deleted by a moderator. This notification is intended only to inform you of why your post was removed. The removal does not result in any points of penalties and does not affect your forum account in any way.

That’s all that’s in the message. Why the difference?

It’s a procedural difference. There are two ways to remove a post, and although the core messaging is the same, there is other messaging around it in the one case, as you saw in JaFW’s example. Both result in removal; both result in appropriate core messaging as long as the moderator is sure to write it; both would not give points, as you can see. However, the message that JaFW received is actually the result of use of the better procedure because it retains more information in case of an appeal or questions.

ShiningSquirrel.3751:

insanemaniac.2456:

Neural.1824:

You didn’t just remove the offensive word post, Gaile, you infracted half the thread for it.

This forum software writes “kitten” all over half of creation at even the slightest hint of potential vulgarity, yet somehow a word got through that is so “highly offensive” that you have to punish 4 people merely for the sin of quoting it?

Meanwhile, another thread is allowed to stand with a title change, even though you know as well as I do that if it had be me that posted the thread, I’d have gotten in trouble for it.

you do not accumulate infraction points for posts deleted because of quoting an infracted/deleted post unless something is naughty about your post too. theyre simply deleted, and a notification spams your inbox.

Unfortunately this is not always true.

That is generally true. It is rare for someone to receive points for quoting a removed post. In those cases, it’s most likely that they are receiving points not for the removal but for what they said below the quoted content.

In the case I was speaking about, the user was specifically infracted for “quoting a deleted post”. That is the exact reason given. When it was pointed out that it was not possible to quote a post that had already been deleted, the infraction was removed. In this case, the mod admitted the infraction should never have been given in the first place. You and I had discussed this over a year ago in private.
Check the link I posted in my previouse response. I came back after not playing for a year and thanked support for doing a great job getting me back in to my account and fixing several issues I had. I was infracted for pointing out how great support is. I do support myself for a living and know how much it sucks getting nothing but complaints all the time so I thought it would be nice for you guys to get a compliment when it was deserved. I just thought it was funny that saying thank you was against the rules as well. ;-)

Gaile Gray.6029:

ShiningSquirrel — you are not infracted. This is exactly what you were told, and exactly what happened:

“The thread " Recent interactions with support" was moved from the Guild Wars 2 Discussion sub-forum because it was a better fit for the Account & Technical Support sub-forum.”

The thread then was moved. No points, no penalty — just keeping things on topic where the topic best fits. The subject was support. The moderator felt it was best expressed in the support sub-forums. Makes sense to me!

Edit to add: It was very kind of you to post that, and I admit I blanched when I saw the content and read that you believed it was infracted. I hope all is forgiven with this explanation, and thank you for the post!

Nothing to forgive Gail, I may complain, but I still love you guys! Like I said, I was actually amused by it. I am back in game after taking some time off (best thing to do if your feeling burnt out) having fun, and have no real complaints about the game. If anything, I feel kind of embarrassed about some of the complaints I used to have as I have seen just how wrong I was.

Gaile Gray.6029:

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

Conncept.7638:

…snip…

Treat others as you would wish to be treated. If you wish to be insulted, insult others. If you wish to have fingers pointed at you, point fingers at others. If you wish to have a rational discussion, then discuss things rationally.

It’s not always going to work because you are the only person you have control over, but it’s a start. Getting angry and rage-posting isn’t going to help anyone.

~EW

I would go with the first sentence and call it good: Treat others as you would wish to be treated. That says it all.

Agreed… But, I’m chronically verbose.

~EW

All people are egocentric. It is just a matter of degree. For who can feel the pain of others?

Gaile Gray.6029:

TL;dr: The messaging is poor and we can’t change it, I wish with all my heart that we could, but we’re stuck with those auto-messages at this time. We do our best to write personal and very clear messaging in the body, though.

“At this time”? I guess that brings up an important question, if there’s any chance of replacing the forum software at any point in the relatively near future? It’s one of those things you guys REALLY need to fix, sometime.

Normally I’d have more to say, and likely be somewhat bitter in the process, but it seems I’ve a need to rethink a few things. This thread sent me back through my private messages to review the infraction messages I’ve gotten in the past, and now I realize that only a couple of them actually had points on them. The use of the term “Infracted” lead me to think they all had. It’s luck that I saved them all, or I’d have likely continued to believe that.

DGraves.3720:

All people are egocentric. It is just a matter of degree. For who can feel the pain of others?

Not sure if you were trying to be funny, but to answer your question, just about anyone who is not a sociopath since all humans have mirror neurons.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3510904/

The extent to which individuals are/feel egocentric differs per individual. While issues regarding basic needs and instincts will trigger more egoistical responses from individuals, more abstract thoughts and emotions will vary in response severity.

Cyninja.2954:

Not sure if you were trying to be funny, but to answer your question, just about anyone who is not a sociopath since all humans have mirror neurons.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3510904/

The extent to which individuals are/feel egocentric differs per individual. While issues regarding basic needs and instincts will trigger more egoistical responses from individuals, more abstract thoughts and emotions will vary in response severity.

Overread the link, they are talking about synaptical signals when observing a similar action to our own on others.
True empathy is still impossible, since every humans brains is unique and will react different to the same situation. All you can do is observe the situation another person is in and their outside reactions and try to imagine how you would feel in order to relate to that other persons feelings. Its very questionable, how close to ‘feeling someone else’s pain’ that actually gets you.
However, that may be ‘a little’ offtopic.

insanemaniac.2456:

gaile has outlined well what to post, but not so much what not to post. the problem is when this:

“I don’t like this because [reasons]”

becomes instead:

+/- a few kittens, paragraphs, and typos:

“i kittening hate this kittening kitten kitten [censor dodge] cuz [dev] is a kittening kittenty piece of [censor dodge] and anet needs to kittening fire some kittenes and spend money on [something full of kittens] instead”

which is obviously garbage and gets deleted, but is reposted, deleted again, and then the OP complains that anet deletes negative feedback and the mods are fascists in a 3rd repost resulting in a 3rd infraction, prolly a ban, and deleted again.

and yes, people do this. over 3 years, ive watched and laughed and had tons of “this thread was moved to subforum trashcan” notifications and laughed again.

keep it civil and your criticism wont be deleted. but the people who need to understand this walk into the forum angry with no posting history and post vitriol without ever reading the forums or code of conduct or even taking a look at whats on the front page of the relevant sub and get kicked out with a ban.

Even if you do keep it civil it can still be deleted, trust me on this one.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3510904/

The problem with that article is it quotes a certain “disorder” but that disorder was classified by psychologists, not scientists. Lots of people on the spectrum are so diverse in their symptoms that it’s hard to believe it has the same root cause. If a prodigy has that “disorder” no one says the disorder helped him excel in his talent and a new term was invented called “splinter ability” to minimize people’s talents whereas if they’re on the opposite end of the IQ spectrum the “disorder” is somehow responsible. Even psychometrics has lots of subjectivity to it since you could ask for the odd one out and one person would say the vowel for being a vowel whereas another would say it lacks straight lines.

The article also has a very bigoted tone. Defects in the mirror neuron system are being linked to disorders like autism. This review is a brief introduction to the neurons that shaped our civilization. Implying that people with the “disorder” are somehow inferior. Since racism and homophobia are taboo in “polite” circles the targets have moved.

If you Google neurotypical privilege you’ll understand that the legal system has been very lenient towards murderers, despite the prosecution having more than enough resources for expert witnesses and the deck stacked in its favor in general, especially against a poor or middle class defendant. The prosecution in general even tries getting irrefutable proof of innocence suppressed since the legal system gets treated like a game where one must convict for the private prison industrial complex at all costs. Because of a corrupt and biased legal system and having far too many laws (85% in American prison are non-violent offenders and overwhelmingly of color and even among the violent offenders are people in there off a technicality or evidence against their guilt suppressed) the label “criminal” is worthless as a measure of moral judgment. Abolitionists on the Underground Railroad were “criminals”, so crime in some cases is even morally just.

Discrimination against certain types of “disabled” is just as bad as racism, it being socially acceptable makes it no better.

Other than the practical side. The reason why discrimination based on racism is bad is because it is factually incorrect: the color of your skin doesn’t determine the content of your character. But if someone is “disabled” in such a way as to be extremely violent and dangerous, then of course they will be discriminated against. They’re operationally different, and in such a way that refusing to pass judgement leads to bodily harm.

I have aspergers myself. I literally cannot understand social etiquette and social norms. It doesn’t feel like I’m some kind of super unique snowflake that is equal to everyone else in my own unique snowflakey way. It feels like my head is broken; that I am deaf to the extrasensory noise that everyone else readily hears and understands. I’m horrible at customer service jobs (I’ve literally sent customers away crying before, not sure how), and if someone doesn’t want to hire me for a customer service job, that is the a practical, reasonable, and logical choice, not an evil one.