Guild Wars 2

you always have to see how much effort it would take to create class specific falling animations, anet is usually short on devs and i don’t think they would want to use their time for that.

you get the knockdown because of.. well… physics i guess, if you jump down from a high place you won’t be able to land on your feet in reality.

the only problem with merging falling damage traits with pve masteries or wvw masteries is how you’re able to use them when you’re in pve or when you go to wvw, you would kinda have to unlock them twice…

best thing would just be to make them baseline.

Please read this suggestion for Elementalists here.

Don’t get me wrong, I absolutely understand that these traits have places in the game.
Fall damage reduction during jumping puzzles is absolutely nice to have.
Fall damage reduction in wvw is definitely nice in certain places.
Reviving traits can definitely be useful when you actually need to revive, PvE/WvW/PvP.

But I really feel these things don’t belong in traits. They are too niche for that, and I really think they’re out of place.

They absolutely have a place in the game however. I really feel they serve better as food buffs. It makes it still a nice thing to opt in for, but it doesn’t cripple the specialization system this way.

How do you all feel about this? Is it too much of a trade off for your build (food vs revive&fall damage food)? Would it be missed a lot in PvP?

I personally liked the fall damage reduction in traits as it is, and I wouldn’t care if it stays or goes in the future.

If they wanted to remove it, they could just have it so you gain a 15 minute fall damage reduction after capturing a certain area in WvW. Some locations in WvW could offer different advantages.

There will be a way to absolutely get no fall damage in a certain area in the new WvW map, so there will be something like that already

But yeah, it’s still a nice idea regardless of that and I don’t see why you couldn’t have both.

I just think that if you really want to have 3 viable options in every trait spot, then you’d really not want to include something like this.

Food buffs, I dunno. Then I have to remember to eat the food all the time. I hardly ever remember consumables (a dedicated UI slot for them might help tremendously, but that’s been suggested enough times over the years that it’ll happen or it won’t but further requests won’t change the outcome).

They do belong on traits, there’s absolutely no reason it’s something you shouldn’t be able to have active all the time. I like being able to make my 500 ft jumps/slides on my ranger and still be standing…or my warrior for that matter. Removing from traits makes no sense.

Zaklex.6308:

They do belong on traits, there’s absolutely no reason it’s something you shouldn’t be able to have active all the time. I like being able to make my 500 ft jumps/slides on my ranger and still be standing…or my warrior for that matter. Removing from traits makes no sense.

Why exactly?

they should be traits or a mastery line, not a food buff.

eekzie.5640:

Zaklex.6308:

They do belong on traits, there’s absolutely no reason it’s something you shouldn’t be able to have active all the time. I like being able to make my 500 ft jumps/slides on my ranger and still be standing…or my warrior for that matter. Removing from traits makes no sense.

Why exactly?

The question shouldn’t be why, the question should be why not? (For reference the question is always, why not?, never why?) The reason behind that is you have to provide a more substantial case as to why not vs why.

I want to agree, but at the same time….warriors jumping off the sides of keeps or towers on top of rams is just so satisfying…

I just love how I’ve got a ton of useless traits in the lines I want. We really need a bit more choice and less reviving/fall damage will help.

The falling damage reduction ones purposed for thief and necromancer aren’t nearly as bad as they are built into different traits while other profession kept theirs separated not entire sure what prompted that decision other than lack of ideas on what else to put there.

As for the revive traits I don’t know again it might be lack of other option and just needing something to put in a empty place. Odd thing I’ve noticed is the ranger managed to keep two major revive traits while all the others have one.

Considering there will be air gusts pushing people off high paths in the new WvW (the no fall damage buff won’t work for those being pushed off, as they will be the ‘enemy’), I think a Falling Damage Trait may come in quite handy. I vote for keeping them in Traits.

I don’t like them in traits because it is a situational effect and traits are usually about defining the overall concept of the build, not what might be good in specific circumstances. I think it would be better implemented as a baseline passive effect on certain signets. That way it’s still part of the build selection but is a more adaptive choice for what the player is currently doing.

Leablo.2651:

I don’t like them in traits because it is a situational effect and traits are usually about defining the overall concept of the build, not what might be good in specific circumstances.

Not my cup of tea but at least back in the day “perma stealth” thieves used this to troll us, so they were contesting our wps and using the stealth “on fall” to escape us. And at least mesmers can use this trait as well, either if they want to port people in PvE or in WvW -no idea about the falling damage reduction of the other classes but that trait does define a build – just not mine and there should be several options in a tier, for thieves in the master tier of SA it’s all about group play (and one falling damage) -but nothing useful for another play style and that shouldn’t be. (I have no idea about the planned traits of other classes or other traitlines).

fall damage traits have such a tiny niche, I’d like to see them transferred to gear, e.g. the snowfall runes and maybe a toy, e.g. kites and balloons

Not a fan of these as traits, especially with the reduced choices with the new system. New weapon Sigils would be a better option imo.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

fall damage traits have such a tiny niche, I’d like to see them transferred to gear, e.g. the snowfall runes and maybe a toy, e.g. kites and balloons

Well, what trait doesn’t have a tiny niche? It’s usual only suitable for one purpose/build – with exceptions but in the end it is all about the whole picture and that’s how it should be.

I would make both of those traits innate to the profession, unlocked at level X. I never use the rez ones, and I usually just swap in/out fall damage when it’s needed at that moment.

Just make falling and reviving all that more fun knowing these perks are accessed through a level instead of traits.

Jana.6831:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

fall damage traits have such a tiny niche, I’d like to see them transferred to gear, e.g. the snowfall runes and maybe a toy, e.g. kites and balloons

Well, what trait doesn’t have a tiny niche? It’s usual only suitable for one purpose/build – with exceptions but in the end it is all about the whole picture and that’s how it should be.

Just from Guardian, Radiance (current iteration): Justice is Blind, Renewed Justice, Radiant Power, Healer’s Retribution; Shimmering Defense; Inner Fire, Searing Flame and Blind Exposure are all generally useful to all Guardians, primarily because of their synergy with Virtue of Justice, a passive or active class mechanic that all Guards have (at least until Elite Spec).

Other professions and other lines have a mix of niche and more generally useful traits. The same is true of the new iteration — there’s a mix of general and niche traits. The issue comes in when niche traits are in the same line and tier — and falling and revive traits appear together in more than one profession. In at least one case, the third trait is also niche (Guardian, Honor).

The remaining traits in the line: Signer Mastery, Radiant Fire, A Fire Inside, Inscribed Removal, Powerful Blades and the 3 GM traits are all mores specific.

I think Anet should just make -50% falling damage as baseline.
It is silly you have to trait for it…

Would be interesting if they integrated falling into certain fights, like having to dodge extreme situations…or just jumping down a pit to escape instead or boss attacks that launch you high up and make you take fall damage (I can think of one fight that does that).

IndigoSundown.5419:

Jana.6831:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

fall damage traits have such a tiny niche, I’d like to see them transferred to gear, e.g. the snowfall runes and maybe a toy, e.g. kites and balloons

Well, what trait doesn’t have a tiny niche? It’s usual only suitable for one purpose/build – with exceptions but in the end it is all about the whole picture and that’s how it should be.

Just from Guardian, Radiance (current iteration): Justice is Blind, Renewed Justice, Radiant Power, Healer’s Retribution; Shimmering Defense; Inner Fire, Searing Flame and Blind Exposure are all generally useful to all Guardians, primarily because of their synergy with Virtue of Justice, a passive or active class mechanic that all Guards have (at least until Elite Spec).

Other professions and other lines have a mix of niche and more generally useful traits. The same is true of the new iteration — there’s a mix of general and niche traits. The issue comes in when niche traits are in the same line and tier — and falling and revive traits appear together in more than one profession. In at least one case, the third trait is also niche (Guardian, Honor).

The remaining traits in the line: Signer Mastery, Radiant Fire, A Fire Inside, Inscribed Removal, Powerful Blades and the 3 GM traits are all mores specific.

I said nothing differently – mug for example is a useful trait for all thieves, because we all steal and we all need power and it’s in the first line -I still don’t use it,because I serve a different purpose and found that all the niche traits are more important for me.
So what is the alternative to getting rid of falling damage traits? Food? Then you would die to conditions/not do enough damage in wvw, so it’s only good for pve. Same goes for sigils and runes – there’s no room for that in wvw.
I agree that all tiers should have enough options so people aren’t forced to take useless traits or forced into a play style they don’t want. But I wouldn’t get rid of that trait, or maybe merge healing and falling.

Jana.6831:

Not my cup of tea but at least back in the day “perma stealth” thieves used this to troll us, so they were contesting our wps and using the stealth “on fall” to escape us. And at least mesmers can use this trait as well, either if they want to port people in PvE or in WvW -no idea about the falling damage reduction of the other classes but that trait does define a build – just not mine and there should be several options in a tier, for thieves in the master tier of SA it’s all about group play (and one falling damage) -but nothing useful for another play style and that shouldn’t be. (I have no idea about the planned traits of other classes or other traitlines).

Perma stealth is used without fall damage. The trait is situationally helpful but not definitive of what the build does (falling is done to enhance stealth, not stealth to enhance falling). Moving the fall damage effects to a skill wouldn’t change the possibility to perform any of these activities.

Why is there falling damage in the game at all? It’s not really necessary.

Leablo.2651:

Perma stealth is used without fall damage. The trait is situationally helpful but not definitive of what the build does (falling is done to enhance stealth, not stealth to enhance falling). Moving the fall damage effects to a skill wouldn’t change the possibility to perform any of these activities.

Kitten, is my english that bad?
I said “perma stealth thieves used it to troll us” and they stealh by jumping down from somewhere – they do it on purpose and they use that trait on purpose.
Moving it to a skill would be okay, i guess, better than make people using food for it.

Edit: Whatever you call “perma stealth” is unimportant I even said it in quotation marks the first time around -but it’s more fun to pretend to not get my point at all, right?

I heard the new trait system will enforce you to pick a full trait instead of just taking part trait for specific purposes. (For example, instead of 6/2/6/4/0, you can only pick 6/6/6)

In terms of balance, it’s a reasonable concern. However, when you look at traits like falling damage, it becomes an inconvenience.

Now if you want to spec for -falling damage for that specific situation, you’re forced to grab the whole trait-line you probably don’t want to pick/use at all. Anet, can you work around things like this, like making -falling damage baseline or something? What’s the point of these traits?

This is a question a lot of us are asking. It really doesn’t make a lot of sense. It’s wasting a lot of realestate since there are only two other options now, instead of the five you had before. But it’s also something that most wouldn’t want to just go away, it’s a nice convenience item for many of us, if you have the room for it.

Any official respond according to this issue?
Is it justifiable to get a -falling damage by sacrificing the whole trait despite it may not synergize well with your weapons/skills choice?

Changing the traits like this is a an insane move. Absolutely crazy. So many people will quit when their many alts become useless.

Why will alts become useless? Can you please explain?

I would very much love to see all 25% movement speed traits (and skills) and falling damage traits REMOVED from the combat-centric trait (and skill) system altogether, and instead be implemented into their own Master Movement track within the Mastery System.

warduke.1780:

Changing the traits like this is a an insane move. Absolutely crazy. So many people will quit when their many alts become useless.

Please elaborate. I do not understand your concern at all.

The only thing i can see is moving fall damage for all classes to be baseline. It adds something unique (though it could be confusing for new players – hue).

The falling traits are very underwhelming and a lot of trait lines will be too much limited because these traits. For example, the Honor line will be really weak on adept if you are not going support or using mace.

Most if not all classes have this problem with this trait. There should be added a new extra effect to those traits, maybe proc their skills on high cooldown (45~60 sec) on stun, or when affected on some condition or something else.

This trait will limit the choices becouse there will be only 3 per tier.

I’d take that suggestion, but then remove the falling part altogether.

I agree that something should be in the game to reduce fall damage, but I’m not on board with it being tied traits at all.

While traits are now hot swappable, they still have this sort of building block feel. They are sort of the foundation of your build. I just don’t see why you’d build based on the one or two unique situations in the game where you’d need to fall extra far.

An item maybe, but not a trait.

As the title says, replace them, but make a mastery for acquiring them. Unlock passive abilities through mastery, maybe only add to a trait the special effect upon landing, but people shouldn’t sacrifice an important trait for getting -50% falling damage.

Oh, and it’s just an idea.

Tag this post with [Suggestion]
Because I very much like this idea.

GinsuChef.3765:

I think it can be made into a passive effect and added to existing utility skills. A few classes have signets that give extra toughness and making fall protection a passive effect to those signet seems natural. Another possibility is to add it to a healing skill as a passive effect.

I’m sure there is much to consider but finding a spot for it in utilities seems like a better fit.

I don’t think it’s even a good idea to have it under a healing skill or utility skill. Why? Imagine when you are thinking of jumping off a cliff while being chased down. I bet you won’t be able to change to the relevant fall damage reduction utility in time, considering you are in combat.

Or maybe you already have it equipped (and assuming its passive effect reduces fall damage), then you use the active portion of the skill.. what happens? What we know is that passives won’t work if the active skill is used and is on CD.

Or maybe we place it on the active skill itself… I’m sure when we jump cliffs, we jump more than one time – in succession if it’s from a very highpoint.

Fadhli.9086:

GinsuChef.3765:

I think it can be made into a passive effect and added to existing utility skills. A few classes have signets that give extra toughness and making fall protection a passive effect to those signet seems natural. Another possibility is to add it to a healing skill as a passive effect.

I’m sure there is much to consider but finding a spot for it in utilities seems like a better fit.

I don’t think it’s even a good idea to have it under a healing skill or utility skill. Why? Imagine when you are thinking of jumping off a cliff while being chased down. I bet you won’t be able to change to the relevant fall damage reduction utility in time, considering you are in combat.

Or maybe you already have it equipped (and assuming its passive effect reduces fall damage), then you use the active portion of the skill.. what happens? What we know is that passives won’t work if the active skill is used and is on CD.

Or maybe we place it on the active skill itself… I’m sure when we jump cliffs, we jump more than one time – in succession if it’s from a very highpoint.

All of those disadvantages are already present in the current setup. And all those alternatives are still better than being a traited effect.

I’m all for having it as a signet passive, for example. I’d still have to be out of combat to change into that signet, but it would be a lot less work then re-traiting.

Fadhli.9086:

I don’t think it’s even a good idea to have it under a healing skill or utility skill. Why? Imagine when you are thinking of jumping off a cliff while being chased down. I bet you won’t be able to change to the relevant fall damage reduction utility in time, considering you are in combat.

Or maybe you already have it equipped (and assuming its passive effect reduces fall damage), then you use the active portion of the skill.. what happens? What we know is that passives won’t work if the active skill is used and is on CD.

Or maybe we place it on the active skill itself… I’m sure when we jump cliffs, we jump more than one time – in succession if it’s from a very highpoint.

In your first case, its the same as not having it traited.

In the second case, if its added to another utility, it wouldn’t need its own slot. Signets have a passive and active use, so I think it would work nicely as we’d get another benefit as oppose to fall protection being its own separate utility. Signets do have that dilemma whether to active it or leave it in passive. Maybe having it as a passive on a healing would be bad if you needed to heal before jumping lol.

It could be made a passive for all signets, then we have more choices.

In the third case, I think you are bring up the problem with having a cooldown? As a trait, fall protection already has a cooldown.

If Anet makes build templates, then we just need a fall built and switching would be very easy, lol.

Fall protection is just squeezed into traits. We find them in adept, master and even as a grandmaster trait(thief). I’m sure thieves would like another gm trait.

Anyway, none of this is happening, but having a discussion on it might lead to something better. Maybe as a new offhand weapon? lol

I rather see fall damage traits become a learned passive at a certain level. Could even make a fun quest for new players where you have to take a leap of faith from the quest npc you trained from.

I don’t see this breaking balance in any game modes, just a fun perk for the professions.

I don’t understand why someone would come in here asking for their utility options to be limited when some classes already have enough utilities that are close to mandatory.

Fall damage is a niche situation that only occurs in certain kinds of gameplay situations. People can be running a variety of builds in those situations and utilities are significant to rounding out a build. Fall damage isn’t a build, it’s a situation.

Fall damage reduction has been a trait for 3 years. Any difficulty you’re facing incorporating it into your trait setup now with the new trait system would only be more aggravating if it was stuck on one particular skill out of the entire skill pool…

Mo Mo.1947:

I don’t understand why someone would come in here asking for their utility options to be limited when some classes already have enough utilities that are close to mandatory.

Fall damage is a niche situation that only occurs in certain kinds of gameplay situations. People can be running a variety of builds in those situations and utilities are significant to rounding out a build. Fall damage isn’t a build, it’s a situation.

Fall damage reduction has been a trait for 3 years. Any difficulty you’re facing incorporating it into your trait setup now with the new trait system would only be more aggravating if it was stuck on one particular skill out of the entire skill pool…

Except now you have to switch out the enitre trait line if you want to trade in fall damage protection temporarily. The fact that it’s a niche situation is why it would be good for a utility slot instead—you make one change and it’s done, one change and it’s undone, instead of having to shuffle around six different traits every time you want to do a jumping puzzle.

Mo Mo.1947:

Fall damage is a niche situation that only occurs in certain kinds of gameplay situations. People can be running a variety of builds in those situations and utilities are significant to rounding out a build. Fall damage isn’t a build, it’s a situation.

Indeed. It isn’t a build. I agree with OP, it shouldn’t be, especially as you can’t anymore just easily switch out one individual trait without it affecting an entire trait line.

How about we keep the fall damage traits for those who want to use them “passively” in WvW?

But how about we also add a utility skill for those players who want to use fall damage reduction situationally, i.e. PvE exploring/during a jumping puzzle? These two things don’t have to be seen as mutually exclusive.

I can think of a few other possible skills that add non-combat utility, such as:

• Conjure a light source
• Portal skill that can only be used out of combat, with a short or non-existing cooldown. Portal entry expires as soon as player takes damage.
• A skill that allows us to point somewhere in the landscape, so we can point something out to another player. Long range. (Throwing 3 grenades in the general direction is not a very good workaround for this. )
• A few seconds of fall damage reduction on the push of a button fits right in.

I’d be happy to have some non-combat utility skills available in open-world PvE. They would make little sense in PvP and I’d be fine with them being disabled in WvW and dungeons/fractals. I’d be fine if they stopped working as soon as you get into combat.

I like your thinking, Pixelpumpkin and OP. I’ve been against fall traits since they first showed the new system. As someone who finds them vital parts of my permanent builds to the point that my reflexes include them in judging jumps, their location dictates an entire trait line for me, and then removes two other trait choices in their tier.

When the Elite Specs come, that will mean that while playing Elite I will be Elite, Fall Trait Line, and one other of my choice. Not a lot of flexibility there ><

(Yes, I know a lot of you find the fall damage reduction useless and will say I am shackling myself. You might even be right. But my enjoyment of running around maps includes the fun of taking those long plunges and firing off the special effect at the end, and the new system makes it very hard to retain that fun while selecting useful build options).

I think Fall protection could be moved from Traits to a ‘potion’, or better yet make it passive under the ‘protection’ tree.

Either way, I think Fall damage in this game is kittened, and how Anet ‘patched it’ is even more stupid. There are times where you fall 6+ times in the same instance, and if you are not traited you would be dead. Never mind the fall activation skill, which was OP for some classes at at time, its now just a gimmick to make your falls ‘look pretty’.

Nothing against keeping the trait and adding an utility. How about as a racial utility? We get them free so it won’t cost us hero points and I’m sure the designers could make some cool stuff. lol

In the distant past (read: one patch ago) necromancers had a unique fall damage negation ability: spectral walk. Just activate spectral walk and recal before you fall and tada no fall damage. It had many other functions like swiftness, life forcee, stunbreak. So maybe we could we implement this as well in other skill: a skill with a usefull function(s) but with the added effect of reducing/breaking a fall?