Guild Wars 2

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

This isn’t any different than returning something to WalMart or Toys R Us though. You return an item, they give you a gift card. (Yes, there’s a bit more to it, but you get the general point here. Let’s not nit pick)

You spent money on gems. You spent those gems on an armor set. They are refunding you the gems you purchased. You can use those gems at any time on any other item. Whether you do or not…. is no different than whether or not you use that gift card. Although, unlike that gift card, your gems will never expire.

I also don’t have to worry about Wal-Mart or Toys’R’Us coming into my house to steal what I purchased and then leaving something else in return. When I buy something from Wal-Mart, I get what I purchase. If Wal-Mart makes a mistake they usually honor their mistake by correcting the issue to keep the customer happy.

Gift cards also never expire in Canada.

Didn’t know gift cards didn’t expire in Canada. That’s handy to know.

Anet did not steal anything. We were told, in a dev post on here that the t3 skin would be replaced when they had the new one done.

It should not have been a surprise. It was known that it was going to happen. They have opted to refund the gems that were used to purchase the armor for those that wanted the refund. WTF else can they do?

Some people like the new reskin. Others do not. There is nothing they can do to make every single person happy.

Fractured is the release launched on November 26, 2013.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Flamekissed-Armor-Skin was posted November 27, 2013.
That’s a 24 hour window of uninformed people. It’s not about making people happy, it’s about integrity and principal. What are they going to change next due to a select group’s outcry?

points at ascended

points at Karma nerf

Those are the biggest 2… shall we keep going?

You’re missing the point. Those are game mechanics, not purchased items.

You didn’t specify ‘only purchased’ items. And as it’s been stated, anyone that requests a refund is getting one.

“But its gems, not cash!” You realize it would probably cost them more in transaction fees to try to refund 10$ to everyone that demanded cash? Additionally, they would need time to verify that the person actually did purchase the gems with cash, and not gold?

I am really disappointed……I requested a refund but have not yet received anything……

Bait-and-switch is a form of fraud used in retail sales but also employed in other contexts. The unfair gain is that I’m out $10USD, and I have the ability to get in-store credit, not a refund.

Actually but also:
First, customers are “baited” by merchants’ advertising products or services at a low price, but when customers visit the store, they discover that the advertised goods are not available, or the customers are pressured by sales people to consider similar, but higher priced items (“switching”).

This is bait and switch and not what happened. Part of the function is there but not fully embraced. I do understand that some feel cheated. You do have options. Getting back T3 is currently not one of them.

Wait wait wait. Some people are expecting a refund of 10 dollars because they bought something that was a sham in the first place? Set armor on fire, and you people bought it like children and shiny objects. You paid 10 dollars for GEMS, and those GEMS were to be used to your discretion. Pretty sure the terms say gems are not refundable for cash value or something to that sort. They are refunding to the highest degree of the policy you agreed to when you played this game and bought anything out of the store.

Again, if you had spent a direct $10.00 USD for the flame armor; a refund would be required in cash, but instead you bought game currency with your real money. I feel people are too upset and won’t blame themselves so they blame it on the vendor. Don’t understand how this is still a hot ongoing thread.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

This isn’t any different than returning something to WalMart or Toys R Us though. You return an item, they give you a gift card. (Yes, there’s a bit more to it, but you get the general point here. Let’s not nit pick)

You spent money on gems. You spent those gems on an armor set. They are refunding you the gems you purchased. You can use those gems at any time on any other item. Whether you do or not…. is no different than whether or not you use that gift card. Although, unlike that gift card, your gems will never expire.

I also don’t have to worry about Wal-Mart or Toys’R’Us coming into my house to steal what I purchased and then leaving something else in return. When I buy something from Wal-Mart, I get what I purchase. If Wal-Mart makes a mistake they usually honor their mistake by correcting the issue to keep the customer happy.

Gift cards also never expire in Canada.

Didn’t know gift cards didn’t expire in Canada. That’s handy to know.

Anet did not steal anything. We were told, in a dev post on here that the t3 skin would be replaced when they had the new one done.

It should not have been a surprise. It was known that it was going to happen. They have opted to refund the gems that were used to purchase the armor for those that wanted the refund. WTF else can they do?

Some people like the new reskin. Others do not. There is nothing they can do to make every single person happy.

Fractured is the release launched on November 26, 2013.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Flamekissed-Armor-Skin was posted November 27, 2013.
That’s a 24 hour window of uninformed people. It’s not about making people happy, it’s about integrity and principal. What are they going to change next due to a select group’s outcry?

points at ascended

points at Karma nerf

Those are the biggest 2… shall we keep going?

You’re missing the point. Those are game mechanics, not purchased items.

You didn’t specify ‘only purchased’ items. And as it’s been stated, anyone that requests a refund is getting one.

“But its gems, not cash!” You realize it would probably cost them more in transaction fees to try to refund 10$ to everyone that demanded cash? Additionally, they would need time to verify that the person actually did purchase the gems with cash, and not gold?

Sounds like a company problem. I’m sure Digital River and PayPal would not like to be associated with companies that commit fraud. Any company I’ve dealt with that made a mistake like this honors it’s mistake and corrects it in the favor of the customer. Rogers messed up my contract promised me free upgrades, then told me I was going to have to pay for them. I informed them it was their clerical error and they sent me my new phones. This is Anet’s problem, not mine. I shouldn’t have to lose out because someone on the company’s end messed up.

" OMG ANet! I spent 15 hard earned in-game silver on my full feathered set and now all the noobs are running around with a better armor bought from the Gem Store with 10$? I’m never going to buy “Gems” again! #lostmyFaithInANet"

That being illustrated, I am literally crying right now. I lost my favourite armor in the game. Yes, the reasons are right and wrong, here and there, fact is, I don’t care! RIP Light armors. Lucky I bought Phoenix set before gem prices went crazy again. I’m going to refund this new Flamekissed and reroll to thief with Magitech and Viper. Oh and to all those “purists” with the original T3 who insulted me throughout these 2 long months telling me: “hahahaha your armor is getting removed and you are getting kitten instead!”, and to whom I stood up against with pride and hope and faith that the new armor would make them cry instead… You win! I’m buying the original T3 now, with the gold converted from the very gems with which I once bought the best armor in the game, only this time it will be for my thief! Thank you and goodbye never-to-be-played-again mesmer!

DPrime.3954:

How many people from Anet saw this armor and approved it, before it hit the gem store? 10? 20? 30 maybe?

My money says 4.

The artist.
His boss.
A guy in Gem store.
His boss.

And I’d guess none of them play even half as much as the folks who were on and bought it in that 24 hour window. Because no one who plays the game enough to be dropping 100+ gold on T3 armor would have let that go through.

They wanted to sell T3 armor because they knew people would buy it.

Sure, but the person who thought that didn’t think “oh, that’s right, some of these sets are exclusive.” Its pretty obvious that the locks are arbitrary – the Asura Tixx wears human T1 light armor and it works just fine. From the artist’s terminal there might be little to no day-to-day reminders that some sets are ‘special’. They just picked one that looks nice on all races and got out a paintbrush to start adding flame patterns to the larger surfaces.

Give me a break that Anet came up with the idea themselves to pull the plug on this. They need to take responsibility for it.

And many folks agree that they ARE taking responsibility for it, by eliminating all in-game traces of the mistake.

It was stupid. We all agree on that. Rather than devalue all Racial armor (because once one is out, all of them become fair game) they chose to fix the one mistake. Enjoy the screen shots, get your gems back, and move on. Or don’t. But fact remains that the mistake is being erased to the extent that they are able.

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

DPrime.3954:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

This isn’t any different than returning something to WalMart or Toys R Us though. You return an item, they give you a gift card. (Yes, there’s a bit more to it, but you get the general point here. Let’s not nit pick)

You spent money on gems. You spent those gems on an armor set. They are refunding you the gems you purchased. You can use those gems at any time on any other item. Whether you do or not…. is no different than whether or not you use that gift card. Although, unlike that gift card, your gems will never expire.

I also don’t have to worry about Wal-Mart or Toys’R’Us coming into my house to steal what I purchased and then leaving something else in return. When I buy something from Wal-Mart, I get what I purchase. If Wal-Mart makes a mistake they usually honor their mistake by correcting the issue to keep the customer happy.

Gift cards also never expire in Canada.

Didn’t know gift cards didn’t expire in Canada. That’s handy to know.

Anet did not steal anything. We were told, in a dev post on here that the t3 skin would be replaced when they had the new one done.

It should not have been a surprise. It was known that it was going to happen. They have opted to refund the gems that were used to purchase the armor for those that wanted the refund. WTF else can they do?

Some people like the new reskin. Others do not. There is nothing they can do to make every single person happy.

Fractured is the release launched on November 26, 2013.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Flamekissed-Armor-Skin was posted November 27, 2013.
That’s a 24 hour window of uninformed people. It’s not about making people happy, it’s about integrity and principal. What are they going to change next due to a select group’s outcry?

points at ascended

points at Karma nerf

Those are the biggest 2… shall we keep going?

You’re missing the point. Those are game mechanics, not purchased items.

You didn’t specify ‘only purchased’ items. And as it’s been stated, anyone that requests a refund is getting one.

“But its gems, not cash!” You realize it would probably cost them more in transaction fees to try to refund 10$ to everyone that demanded cash? Additionally, they would need time to verify that the person actually did purchase the gems with cash, and not gold?

Sounds like a company problem. I’m sure Digital River and PayPal would not like to be associated with companies that commit fraud. Any company I’ve dealt with that made a mistake like this honors it’s mistake and corrects it in the favor of the customer. Rogers messed up my contract promised me free upgrades, then told me I was going to have to pay for them. I informed them it was their clerical error and they sent me my new phones. This is Anet’s problem, not mine. I shouldn’t have to lose out because someone on the company’s end messed up.

You may want to be careful throwing around the term fraud. No fraud has been committed here. They acknowledged a mistake. They clearly stated how they were going to go about rectifying said mistake, and clearly stated that a refund would be given to those that ask (though they didn’t specify the type of refund).

According to their refund policy:
Gem Refunds
If you purchased Guild Wars 2 Gems from the Gem Store and would like a refund, please submit a request to our Support team and provide the following information:
The amount of gems purchased.
Your billing zip code or postal code.
If the payment was attempted by credit/debit card, please provide ONLY the last 4 digits of the credit/debit card used.
If the payment was attempted using PayPal®, the invoice ID or transaction ID from your PayPal® payment history for the transaction.
Note: If you have used the purchased gems, you may not be eligible for a refund.

Have you asked if you could get your 10$ back? They may be able to, they may not. Having used the gems, you may only qualify for a gem refund, not a cash refund. Which, personally, I feel should be perfectly sufficient.

You, on the other hand, are committing libel claiming an act of fraud has occurred, when it has not. They have honored everything they said they would do.

Luca.9638:

I am really disappointed……I requested a refund but have not yet received anything……

It might take a little bit of time. I’m sure they are inundated with requests like yours. All of which will require verification.

The male version is total garbage. So happy I refrained from buying it originally.

Still waiting for REfund

Pretty close to 24 hours here and no refund.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

“But its gems, not cash!” You realize it would probably cost them more in transaction fees to try to refund 10$ to everyone that demanded cash? Additionally, they would need time to verify that the person actually did purchase the gems with cash, and not gold?

Yes, but that burden should be shouldered by the merchant in a situation where the merchant caused, even if inadvertently, the problem.

If a merchant sells a product, gems in this case, advertised as having a specific function (being tradable for the first iteration of the armor skin), and then changes the product so that it can no longer fulfill that function, they should refund the money spent on that product.

ANet sold gems while advertising that they could be used to acquire the previous iteration of the armor skin. Those gems, purchased for that advertised purpose, cannot serve the purpose for which they were sold and bought. They should be returnable for a cash refund. Any additional resource burden (time or money) should be born by the merchant that made the mistake. At no point should the customer be made to suffer (defined here as having spent the money without receiving the desired end product) because the merchant made a mistake.

I completely understand, and agree with, the decision to withdraw the original iteration of the armor skin. I actually like the new version better, but ANet should be fully refunding money spent on gems to purchase the original version for those who dislike the new.

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

That is Guild Wars 1. Even so , it is unique/ one of a kind skin that doesnt share any other armor mesh in GW2.

But again Asuran and Charr looked NOTHING like T3 and yet they got switched. That was the best looking armor, in my opinion, in game for Asurans.

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

Sorry, I still cannot corroborate any statements of receiving the refund and also retaining the skins already applied to armor; I still have no response to my refund request. I’ll be sure to update if/when I hear back on my very straight-forward refund request with what I am left with afterward.

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

I can confirm that in my case, the GM refunded my 800 gems, a makeover kit, and I kept the skin. No use for it, but eh. Trying to find a use for the only piece I actually like (the headpiece). No luck so far. Lol

So you have to use the gems they give you, to reskin the armor they changed? The makeover kit just changes the appearance of your un-armored character correct?

Jester.1236:

So you have to use the gems they give you, to reskin the armor they changed? The makeover kit just changes the appearance of your un-armored character correct?

Yeah, but my skin was on a lvl 13 alt. I bought a makeover kit when the original armor came out to change the look of my char to match, and so I requested one to change her back.

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

Arenanet can’t change the skin back so unless they provide 6 transmutation stones as well they can’t actually do anything. In my case once I receive the refund I will be changing the skin anyway cause the new skin is godawful IMHO.

The entire thing sucks, Flame Kissed Light T3 Version was what got me to buy gems for the first time ever in this game. And this is what I got for it. It’s annoying to say the least.

ANet should be happy that I’m okaw with getting screwed over and still smile and say, “Thank you sir give me more!” I’m so stupid.

You can put in a support ticket for a refund. They said they would do this when they pulled the skin from the gem store originally. You might have to delete your armor though or they may give you transmutation stones or something

There’s already a ton of threads about the new flamekissed armor and you felt you needed to make another one?

Edit: This was merged in.

morrolan.9608:

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

Arenanet can’t change the skin back so unless they provide 6 transmutation stones as well they can’t actually do anything. In my case once I receive the refund I will be changing the skin anyway cause the new skin is godawful IMHO.

So people that don’t like the new look will get a refund of gems but then will have to buy spliters or transmutation stones/crystals and a new armor set off the TP with the gems that were refunded? Or are they providing splitters as well?

JustTrogdor.7892:

morrolan.9608:

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

Arenanet can’t change the skin back so unless they provide 6 transmutation stones as well they can’t actually do anything. In my case once I receive the refund I will be changing the skin anyway cause the new skin is godawful IMHO.

So people that don’t like the new look will get a refund of gems but then will have to buy spliters or transmutation stones/crystals and a new armor set off the TP with the gems that were refunded? Or are they providing splitters as well?

I think if you ask, you could either get splitters, trans crystals, or just gems to convert to the gold you need in order to revert back to your armor (like real t3 cultural) because using the splitters on a Flamekissed exotic set that used to be t3 cultural will not get the cultural armor back, instead you’ll get the skin and the exotic armor back.

morrolan.9608:

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

Arenanet can’t change the skin back so unless they provide 6 transmutation stones as well they can’t actually do anything. In my case once I receive the refund I will be changing the skin anyway cause the new skin is godawful IMHO.

I requested a refund for the armor set plus six transmutation splitters or my original armor back. Anet refunded me 2000 gems. I think if you are sure to indicate that you want your original armor back, they will compensate for that.

rhapsody.3615:

morrolan.9608:

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

Arenanet can’t change the skin back so unless they provide 6 transmutation stones as well they can’t actually do anything. In my case once I receive the refund I will be changing the skin anyway cause the new skin is godawful IMHO.

I requested a refund for the armor set plus six transmutation splitters or my original armor back. Anet refunded me 2000 gems. I think if you are sure to indicate that you want your original armor back, they will compensate for that.

Well that’s good to know. At first I thought I would have to use my refund to buy items to change out of the armor. I had a flame catcher skin I only used to go with the armor but I guess I’m probably out of luck on that one.

I intentionally left my character that I applied the skins to at level 73 unplayed and in limbo since the initial situation happened just because I wasn’t sure how they would handle refunds if I was not happy with the re-skin. I have plenty of transmutation stones to use to correct my appearance, but had I advanced to level 80 I was not sure I would also be refunded transmutation crystals to correct my appearance as I was not 80 at the time the skins were applied. I wasn’t sure how much they would cleverly get around supplying refunds. If we were only getting the 800 gems, as we were kind of told was all we would get as a refund, then I would just be forced to waste the refunded gems on transmutation crystals to correct my character’s appearance. I didn’t see that as desirable, so my character sat for over 2 months. :\

All I requested for my refund (that I’m still waiting for a response on) was the 800 gems spent on the initial purchase; no additional items whatsoever. I almost applied the skins over my sylvari cultural snapdragon skins. Thankfully I had the mind to put them aside for the future…just in case. I nearly used a makeover kit to change my sylvari glow color, but due to the situation reaching the level that it did before I used one, I was luckier than most others and saved myself that aspect in my refund request.

Per the topic of before and after, I will only include my before image as the after image is too much of an embarrassment to even be seen in.

DPrime.3954:

DPrime.3954:

Fractured is the release launched on November 26, 2013.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Flamekissed-Armor-Skin was posted November 27, 2013.
That’s a 24 hour window of uninformed people. It’s not about making people happy, it’s about integrity and principal. What are they going to change next due to a select group’s outcry?

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

points at ascended

points at Karma nerf

Those are the biggest 2… shall we keep going?

You’re missing the point. Those are game mechanics, not purchased items.

Anet didn’t take from you the item you purchased. They changed it to look different. Anet didn’t take from me the game i have purchased. By introducing ascended and declaring they will now have vertical progression they changed the game philosophy to something different.

Pretty much the same to me.

Sent a ticket in yesterday asking for a refund, logged in today and had my 800 gems already. Also, my old armor was untouched. Bought myself the Trickster set and I look much better, so that’s good. Need to replace the boots and maybe the skirt.

StinVec.3621:

I intentionally left my character that I applied the skins to at level 73 unplayed and in limbo since the initial situation happened just because I wasn’t sure how they would handle refunds if I was not happy with the re-skin. I have plenty of transmutation stones to use to correct my appearance, but had I advanced to level 80 I was not sure I would also be refunded transmutation crystals to correct my appearance as I was not 80 at the time the skins were applied. I wasn’t sure how much they would cleverly get around supplying refunds. If we were only getting the 800 gems, as we were kind of told was all we would get as a refund, then I would just be forced to waste the refunded gems on transmutation crystals to correct my character’s appearance. I didn’t see that as desirable, so my character sat for over 2 months. :\

All I requested for my refund (that I’m still waiting for a response on) was the 800 gems spent on the initial purchase; no additional items whatsoever. I almost applied the skins over my sylvari cultural snapdragon skins. Thankfully I had the mind to put them aside for the future…just in case. I nearly used a makeover kit to change my sylvari glow color, but due to the situation reaching the level that it did before I used one, I was luckier than most others and saved myself that aspect in my refund request.

---

Per the topic of before and after, I will only include my before image as the after image is too much of an embarrassment to even be seen in.

That’s a shame they took your armor away, it looked good on your character… I also have a sylvari and the look of the t3 flame kiss looked awesome on mine as well… I am now really looking forward to another game… Something like Star Citizen or World of Darkness.

Golgathoth.3967:

Sent a ticket in yesterday asking for a refund, logged in today and had my 800 gems already. Also, my old armor was untouched. Bought myself the Trickster set and I look much better, so that’s good. Need to replace the boots and maybe the skirt.

Glad to hear you got your refund! Enjoy your new Trickster set.

Bankai.3749:

That’s a shame they took your armor away, it looked good on your character… I also have a sylvari and the look of the t3 flame kiss looked awesome on mine as well… I am now really looking forward to another game… Something like Star Citizen or World of Darkness.

Thank you!
Yeah, it really is a shame. I’d love to see some pics of your sylvari in the old armor if you happen to have any and want to share them.

@Innicus

I’m surprised that you didn’t notice/mention the fact that this replacement armor also shows half of the females’ butt crack. (Sorry, not sure how to say that in a nicer way)

@ Nike

At first, I agreed with you about the mistake being made. But, if this really was a simple mistake, then I have two questions:

1. If the T3 Flame Armor wasn’t supposed to exist, then how did it come about?
2. If it truly wasn’t the armor they intended to “ship” to the Gem Store, then why did it take two months to “ship” the intended armor that should have already existed?

It’s called butt cleavage. Or Plumber’s crack.

Lilith Ajit.6173:

JustTrogdor.7892:

So I’m still confused for those of you that got gem refunds what happened to the new skin? Did Anet remove it and change your skin back to the armor type you placed it on or do you still get to keep the new skin as well?

I can confirm that in my case, the GM refunded my 800 gems, a makeover kit, and I kept the skin. No use for it, but eh. Trying to find a use for the only piece I actually like (the headpiece). No luck so far. Lol

Same here.
I recieved a refund of 800 gems without any trouble. I also got to keep the skin. I’m not sure if it will be removed later on, or if i can keep it forever though.
All in all, they’ve been correct on the refunding matter.

Worked out for me with the refund to. Still miffed at losing my “T3 Skin” but I’ll live.

StinVec.3621:

Bankai.3749:

That’s a shame they took your armor away, it looked good on your character… I also have a sylvari and the look of the t3 flame kiss looked awesome on mine as well… I am now really looking forward to another game… Something like Star Citizen or World of Darkness.

Thank you!
Yeah, it really is a shame. I’d love to see some pics of your sylvari in the old armor if you happen to have any and want to share them.

I wish I did, but kinda glad I don’t at the same time, lol. Since if I had a picture of my old armor set up I think it would just make me disappointed…. Since I had a great set up and now it no longer exists :/ Forgetting about it just seems like the best course and having hopes that maybe ANet will create something that is equal or better then the t3 flame in future products.

Ashen.2907:

Yes, but that burden should be shouldered by the merchant in a situation where the merchant caused, even if inadvertently, the problem.

I would argue that the merchant only did what it’s customer’s wanted in the first place. The removal of the flamekissed armor. They did not cause the issue, we did. They were simply trying to keep us happy. This is a prime example of being kitten ed if they do, kitten ed if they don’t.

If a merchant sells a product, gems in this case, advertised as having a specific function (being tradable for the first iteration of the armor skin), and then changes the product so that it can no longer fulfill that function, they should refund the money spent on that product.

ANet sold gems while advertising that they could be used to acquire the previous iteration of the armor skin. Those gems, purchased for that advertised purpose, cannot serve the purpose for which they were sold and bought. They should be returnable for a cash refund. Any additional resource burden (time or money) should be born by the merchant that made the mistake. At no point should the customer be made to suffer (defined here as having spent the money without receiving the desired end product) because the merchant made a mistake.

They stated that they would give refunds, they did not state what type. Perhaps we are at fault for not clarifying. However, their gem refund policy clearly states that they do refund the cash spent in instances where they can. If you have spent the gems, you may not be eligible for a refund. Refund not ‘cash refund’. Refund, period. The fact they did state that they would do a refund for anyone that didn’t like the new skin, when the gems have clearly been spent says a lot in regards to how their attempt to satisfy their unhappy customers. In some instances merchants simply can’t refund the cash spent for any number of reasons. It happens. They could be like some other companies out there that tell their customers ‘tough luck, deal with it.’ How some of them stay in business, I have no clue, but they do…

I completely understand, and agree with, the decision to withdraw the original iteration of the armor skin. I actually like the new version better, but ANet should be fully refunding money spent on gems to purchase the original version for those who dislike the new.

Do we know for certain that they are not refunding cash in any/all instances? Are they only refunding gems?

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Ashen.2907:

Yes, but that burden should be shouldered by the merchant in a situation where the merchant caused, even if inadvertently, the problem.

I would argue that the merchant only did what it’s customer’s wanted in the first place. The removal of the flamekissed armor. They did not cause the issue, we did. They were simply trying to keep us happy. This is a prime example of being kitten ed if they do, kitten ed if they don’t.

If a merchant sells a product, gems in this case, advertised as having a specific function (being tradable for the first iteration of the armor skin), and then changes the product so that it can no longer fulfill that function, they should refund the money spent on that product.

ANet sold gems while advertising that they could be used to acquire the previous iteration of the armor skin. Those gems, purchased for that advertised purpose, cannot serve the purpose for which they were sold and bought. They should be returnable for a cash refund. Any additional resource burden (time or money) should be born by the merchant that made the mistake. At no point should the customer be made to suffer (defined here as having spent the money without receiving the desired end product) because the merchant made a mistake.

They stated that they would give refunds, they did not state what type. Perhaps we are at fault for not clarifying. However, their gem refund policy clearly states that they do refund the cash spent in instances where they can. If you have spent the gems, you may not be eligible for a refund. Refund not ‘cash refund’. Refund, period. The fact they did state that they would do a refund for anyone that didn’t like the new skin, when the gems have clearly been spent says a lot in regards to how their attempt to satisfy their unhappy customers. In some instances merchants simply can’t refund the cash spent for any number of reasons. It happens. They could be like some other companies out there that tell their customers ‘tough luck, deal with it.’ How some of them stay in business, I have no clue, but they do…

I completely understand, and agree with, the decision to withdraw the original iteration of the armor skin. I actually like the new version better, but ANet should be fully refunding money spent on gems to purchase the original version for those who dislike the new.

Do we know for certain that they are not refunding cash in any/all instances? Are they only refunding gems?

Logic check: “they did what we wanted” when “we” is people who didn’t lose money over the victory of the soiled diaper brigade… so they made 2 very big mistakes right off the start and only made it worse with such a low quality, and VERY poorly chosen replacement

And no, when asked for cash they blew smoke in my face by basically ignoring the request

Inimicus.7162:

Logic check: “they did what we wanted” when “we” is people who didn’t lose money over the victory of the soiled diaper brigade… so they made 2 very big mistakes right off the start and only made it worse with such a low quality, and VERY poorly chosen replacement

There were plenty of people that purchased it that agreed that it should not have been a t3 reskin.

There are plenty of people that do like the reskin. More who have since purchased it because they like the reskin better….

Conversely there are those that liked neither. Those that didn’t really mind the t3 reskin. Those that didn’t bother buying either.

They cannot please everyone. You don’t like the reskin. Fine, that’s your right.

And no, when asked for cash they blew smoke in my face by basically ignoring the request

Did you provide the card number (last 4 digits) you purchased it with? Did you respond and ask why? They may not be blowing you off, although I’m sure it feels like it. They have a lot of requests to process I;m sure.

Then again, if you’re an kitten about it, yeah I can see getting blown off. No customer service person enjoys getting kittened at when it’s not their fault. Too many people forget that the customer service rep is not the company. They are just the sorry sap that has to put up with our ire.

They should have just made this a flame kissed dye pack, for 1000 gems,

And then show you what it would make each armor look like, that way if you wanted the old T3 style armor, you had to go buy the T3 armor, then add the flame dye pack to it. I think they will be handing out more refunds than people buying it for sure.

Further, I think a lot of you don’t understand the entire reason for the way the loot and item teirs work in GW2, or GW1 for that matter.

When this first landed, many people told me I was insane for creating an entire character for the sole reason of wearing this armor. Yes, I bought a new character slot, rolled a new mesmer, leveled it to 80 wearing its beautiful flamekissed t3 ripoff and now she looks like some failed kitten.

Why make a whole new character? UnutzBro? Well, considering sylvari universally look like the fell from heaven and landed face first in a blender, and human females look like 15 year olds with more surgical augmentations than Pam Anderson…Yes, the opprotunity to have a functional looking, beautiful, showy, classy, non-kittenty outfit on a norn was a godsend. I’d have made a necromancer as well if the stuff wasn’t yanked so soon, and while I’m thankful for that on some level, they really violated all trust i have in their company over this. A few gems relating to the very looks that caused an entire character and all costs from start to finish to exist just…vanishing? Yea, I’m mad. The armor set was that good looking, it never was race exclusive (High Councilor Flaxx—an asura, if the diaper squad is worth listening to then go find him and put him in feathered, else thats massive screw up #4 at least on anet’s part)… and it was able to handle all the horrid design issues they refused to fix with norn females from word go that made finding them light armor that fits the look i want (remember, the look IS THE ENTIRE ENDGAME HERE, it isnt a raid treadmill, it isnt wvw or pvp… its making your character look good by your own tastes) and I feel far worse over this for having had it now and losing it.

Before you say “well be happy you had it” go get $1 million, lose it all for someone else’s screw ups and see how you feel, hyperbole yes, but not far different

Inimicus.7162:

Before you say “well be happy you had it” go get $1 million, lose it all for someone else’s screw ups and see how you feel, hyperbole yes, but not far different

Or buy a nice real fur coat with PETA standing outside, enjoy wearing it out long enough for them to throw paint, acid and/or feces on it

Refunded.

Thnx

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

There were plenty of people that purchased it that agreed that it should not have been a t3 reskin.

There are plenty of people that do like the reskin. More who have since purchased it because they like the reskin better….

Conversely there are those that liked neither. Those that didn’t really mind the t3 reskin. Those that didn’t bother buying either.

They cannot please everyone. You don’t like the reskin. Fine, that’s your right.

Even if the assertion that “plenty” like the new armor and there are “more” who have purchased it is accurate, it doesn’t change the fact that ArenaNet took one side in an argument between two parties in the player base, giving one side everything they wanted while showing no acknowledgement of or concern for the desires or feelings of the other side.

They didn’t even apologize to the people who bought and liked the original armor and wanted to keep it. The resentment some people are feeling right now is justified. They haven’t just had something they bought taken away from them, they’ve been treated like they are second-class people throughout the process.

Thelgar.7214:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

There were plenty of people that purchased it that agreed that it should not have been a t3 reskin.

There are plenty of people that do like the reskin. More who have since purchased it because they like the reskin better….

Conversely there are those that liked neither. Those that didn’t really mind the t3 reskin. Those that didn’t bother buying either.

They cannot please everyone. You don’t like the reskin. Fine, that’s your right.

Even if the assertion that “plenty” like the new armor and there are “more” who have purchased it is accurate, it doesn’t change the fact that ArenaNet took one side in an argument between two parties in the player base, giving one side everything they wanted while showing no acknowledgement of or concern for the desires or feelings of the other side.

They didn’t even apologize to the people who bought and liked the original armor and wanted to keep it. The resentment some people are feeling right now is justified. They haven’t just had something they bought taken away from them, they’ve been treated like they are second-class people throughout the process.

+1’d
More like third class or lower since we lost something we paid for on the complaints of those who didn’t.

And people who thought it was wrong but bought anyway: Why? You void your own arguments for removal pointing out these people, it’s why this set made it into the gem store in the first place: IT IS THE ONLY GOOD LOOKING LIGHT ARMOR SKIN THAT BALANCES SEXY, CLASSY AND AN AIR OF POWER PROPERLY. They didn’t like it but bought anyway, I see them either grabbing a deal for their humans, getting something that was/is completely peerless compared to anything else, or maybe thinking that something like this was eventually going to be done with other cultural armors. If they bought it, thought it was wrong, and started demanding it be taken away, that particular sub-set of those who felt it’s sale unjust should be ignored for being hypocrites…the rest are screwed every bit as bad as people like me who grabbed a peerless armor skin, and ignored the totally tacky flames that really made the set second-rate to what humans (and asuran npcs) still get anyway.

How about a little more fuel for thsi fire: they have legal protection from giving cash refunds, its written into those ula agreements… but, since they really did screw people out of real money over this, should they not have put this idea up for vote among the people who had this new effluent crammed down our throats? At least then we would know for sure a “majority” of people liked whatever the final product would have been… I’d have been able to keep it a bit cooler on this issue if I had some say, even if only limited to an indirect up/down on whatever idea they put forth.

EDIT: And keep in mind, the scope of this is VERY narrow, and would only apply to those who bought the armor in question, and could be applied to inevitable future foul ups along similarly narrow circumstances… main thing being; real money was spent on a very, very easily defined product, and it got pulled for whatever reason after the money is spent and with no risk of damaged to the merchant(s) involved in selling them… I think we deserve at least that consideration.

More like third class or lower since we lost something we paid for on the complaints of those who didn’t

There are different ways to “pay” for things.

Some how I doubt that if someone bought the armor they wanted it taken away or changed. If they bought it, then I would guess they liked it.

IT IS THE ONLY GOOD LOOKING LIGHT ARMOR SKIN THAT BALANCES SEXY, CLASSY AND AN AIR OF POWER PROPERLY

This is an opinion, not everyone shares it.