Guild Wars 2

Been waiting 4 days… FOUR DAYS… to unlock the Balthazar trait.

I didn’t know how bad traits were for new players, until I emulated one with a new alt…

Given the direction of this latest info from the news page, I am having bigger doubts regarding any changes to the trait system. Anet. Seriously. I was with GW1 for over 6 years. Please don’t make me jump from GW2 in just over 2.

This thread is the living proof that feedback is indeed useless.

Over 2,000 posts… The latest blog post was really disappointing. I was hoping that the red post we got recently here was a bluff. It seemed implausible that they actually hadn’t thought about or discussed how much hate this system was getting.

CrashTestAuto.9108:

Over 2,000 posts… The latest blog post was really disappointing. I was hoping that the red post we got recently here was a bluff. It seemed implausible that they actually hadn’t thought about or discussed how much hate this system was getting.

Echo that. :\

After four months of almost consistently negative feedback and suggestions, to know they’ve barely looked at it is disheartening.

I had hopes that you would, and in fact, violated my “I’m not buying any new character slots till the fix it” rule because they were 40% off. I guess I don’t understand how you could not change them, after the 4 month long complain a thon that is the trait feedback thread. Of course, all my hopes were dashed when a red post said “you guys have some good ideas. We need to have some meetings.” Today just confirms it. It’s kind of disappointing, because the new trait acquisition method is awful.

its more disconcerting that when reading between the lines and jargon what they are essentially saying is: We are altering the leveling up system and the Personal Story system to drag it out a little more and essentially repackaging the new player experience without actually changing much outside of rewarding new players more for getting through the PS and hoping they like it more while staying engaged in it for longer. This makes me think that either new players will love it, or hate it and that their metrics tell them it is a 60/40 split which could translate into bigger gem gains in the long term from these new players. Vet players should basically be happy they’ve gotten to play the game they’ve played.

Me thinks traits are staying put as is since this is more an issue with vet players and my guess is Anet will only tweak them based on their potential new player feedback.

This seemed like the best to share this, so here we go…

If you really want to make the life of new players easier, just allow them to get traits more easily. I have a lot of alts and all I can tell you is that it was pretty fun and fluid to level them back when I started the game, there was nothing wrong with it to be honest.

On the other hand, just wanted to make az engineer, but waited a bit, because I was hoping that you will introduce another system to get traits, because unlock missions are cool in general if we are talking about a PvP reward track or something more “high-end” stuff, but this is simply killing build-diversity at the start and doesn’t help us to get to now a certain profession or even start to love them.

When I’m experimenting with new professions, I like to play around the build and traits, try out different ideas, see that what potentials are in there, and is that class for me or not. Without having a decent option to get access to all the traits this is pretty hard, and all I know is, that previously I loved leveling an alt, and now it feels like a bit painful for me, because of all the limitations I’m getting.

Yes, I know, I can unlock them at trait vendor, but I consider those prices pretty high, escpecialy when I’m drowning in skill points scrolls. I would be very pleased with an option, what offers us traits for only skillpoints without the money, or implement them for level ups. Maybe “trait books” dropping like skillpoint scrolls of level-up tomes?

Having the ability to scavengehunt certain Adept traits only above level 40 is not cool.
You have 5 trait lines, 6 adept, 4 masters and 3 grandmasters on each. Why not introduce them on level progressions?

What if from level 16 on (up to level 80) the player just selects a single trait to unlock? Like:
16-45 – Unlock an Adept trait
46-65 – Unlock a Master trait
66-80 – Unlock a Grandmaster trait

This way leveling up sure seems rewarding for me, plus it would feel really natural to learn new tricks with each level when I progress, not to mention the “what should I unlock now” excitement at each level.

I know that you probably want people to visit the different aspects of the game, experience everything, travel around in PvE, but I think if they enjoy the game, they would do them anyways, no need to force certain activites on people when they are leveling.

In fact I alraedy have 100% world completion for most of my alt, and want to have that for the remaining ones as well, because I just like to and I think it’s kind of fun, but I would be a happier player if I could experience a new class while I’m doing this.

So for me, your character leveling was just fine from the start already. I guess some new features will be useful for new players, but all in all I still think that “trait unlocking” is just a very unpleasent, overcomplicated experience right now, and that needs to be fixed somehow.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/New-blogpost/first#post4343136

Why did they even talk about something they changed in the past feature pack back in April? I find it very funny they called the old trait system "needlessly complicated or obtuse " . They should try the new system and tell me how needlessly complicated or obtuse it is.

Just on the one fact alone it shows how wrong that statement was before you could spend a few gold and have all your traits in about the amount of time it took to run two dungeon runs so lets say an hour. Now to get all your traits how long does it take? I really do not know the answer because now is a variable moving part. A whole lot of luck is involved in being at the right place at the right time of day when one event happens to be up. I waited over 5 days to fight the Risen High Wizard because he was not available to fight during my play times.

Not really play how you want mentality.

If you are going to keep the system in place the tasks needed need to be adjusted to things that can be done 100% of the time any time of day. My suggestion would be link it to Vista’s, Hearts, and POI’s. I would even be willing to finish “X” amount of events in said area. Just not specialized events because not everyone can be there when the event is up.

I also would like to see once you unlock a trait it unlocks for every character in the future regardless of class that is linked to that task. Once you finish a task with an account then it is unlocked for good. How many times have you thought to yourself "god I wish I was on my “X Class” so I could have unlocked this trait…

Rauderi.8706:

CrashTestAuto.9108:

Over 2,000 posts… The latest blog post was really disappointing. I was hoping that the red post we got recently here was a bluff. It seemed implausible that they actually hadn’t thought about or discussed how much hate this system was getting.

Echo that. :\

After four months of almost consistently negative feedback and suggestions, to know they’ve barely looked at it is disheartening.

They haven’t said this but I am surprised that more people haven’t come to this conclusion:

The months of silence on this and much more is because they have been very busy and fervently working on the China Rollout. It wasn’t just the initial month but fixing bugs and issues and making sure things went smoothly with China. This was a huge cash cow for them, or at least a potentially huge cash cow and so they wanted to make sure that everything went smoothly.

The second aspect of it is that they want to unify the two systems to make sure it is easy to roll things out to both systems. So that is what we are seeing. They roll it out to China and then they roll it out to us. These changes we are seeing in the latest “big push” are all changes for China and are now making their way to us.

The reason they haven’t read the 4 months of hated response is because they were busy with China. Also it allows them to see whether it is initial dislike or if it is long term dislike. If initial ride it out and it dies out. If it is long term then they have to make decisions now on how to implement changes to ours that they can also implement with china so that they can keep programming similar. It would be too expensive to have two different programming departments. Much cheaper to have one that works on both.

Disheartening to see they didn’t read it, but not unexpected. They weren’t ignoring us, they were simply busy with something more important. Remember it’s a business so they put their attention and their time where money is to be made.

Drunken Mad King.8193:

Rauderi.8706:

CrashTestAuto.9108:

Over 2,000 posts… The latest blog post was really disappointing. I was hoping that the red post we got recently here was a bluff. It seemed implausible that they actually hadn’t thought about or discussed how much hate this system was getting.

Echo that. :\

After four months of almost consistently negative feedback and suggestions, to know they’ve barely looked at it is disheartening.

They haven’t said this but I am surprised that more people haven’t come to this conclusion:

The months of silence on this and much more is because they have been very busy and fervently working on the China Rollout. It wasn’t just the initial month but fixing bugs and issues and making sure things went smoothly with China. This was a huge cash cow for them, or at least a potentially huge cash cow and so they wanted to make sure that everything went smoothly.

The second aspect of it is that they want to unify the two systems to make sure it is easy to roll things out to both systems. So that is what we are seeing. They roll it out to China and then they roll it out to us. These changes we are seeing in the latest “big push” are all changes for China and are now making their way to us.

The reason they haven’t read the 4 months of hated response is because they were busy with China. Also it allows them to see whether it is initial dislike or if it is long term dislike. If initial ride it out and it dies out. If it is long term then they have to make decisions now on how to implement changes to ours that they can also implement with china so that they can keep programming similar. It would be too expensive to have two different programming departments. Much cheaper to have one that works on both.

Disheartening to see they didn’t read it, but not unexpected. They weren’t ignoring us, they were simply busy with something more important. Remember it’s a business so they put their attention and their time where money is to be made.

The fact that people are STILL posting about an April feature pack should raise some serious flags to ANet. The first half of the thread is dominated by hate and confusion for this new trait system (I’ve written a post here and there back when it was released to us). But as you get past the riots, you see a change in pace; players offering suggestions on how this can be fixed (or at the very least, optimized).

You say that ANet has been too busy with the China release to focus on a thread that even the Community Coordinator had started. This is why so many people are jumping on the hate bandwagon; it’s just another example of poor communication between devs and players. Yes, I can understand that rolling out to an entirely different community is time-consuming and focus-driven, but you can’t forget about your existing community, particularly since a great majority of us have been playing since GW1’s launch. Besides, if the devs have been so busy that they can’t reply to this thread, then why are there so many other dev replies in other threads? I see Chris and Stephanie coming back and becoming more active on the forums with us, and that’s great, but there hasn’t been much of a response by the devs in a thread that totals over 2000 posts? Really?

The trait system had great intentions, but was poorly implemented. So many ideas have been tossed on how to optimize the system so veterans can feel more comfortable making alts while at the same time making it understandable and very fluid for new players.

“Keep the level at which traits unlock the same, and just give us a trait skill and the 50/5% stat boosts every five levels.”

“Make trait skill unlocks relate to the conditions required to unlock them.”

“Make it cheaper to purchase traits so the game doesn’t turn into more of a grindfest.”

So many ideas from the playerbase, and yet we’re kept in the dark. Today’s feature release only confirmed that, if the devs really are keeping an eye on this thread, they aren’t saying anything. “We can’t say anything at this time.” ~ANet’s new motto.

TL;DR
The trait system is atrocious and more confusing than it was previously. ANet hasn’t said a word about this in months, even though plenty of other threads are receiving attention. It can be concluded that there’s a huge communication issue going on, and it’s only getting worse.

“We can’t say anything at this time.” And probably never will.

I am in the process of levelling a Thief. I created him before the trait changes, so don’t have to unlock anything, but I am still finding traits completely useless at the moment.

I am level 50, and would love to be experimenting with builds and trait combinations by now, and generally learning how to play the class properly. However, I have a grand total of 4 trait points, which gives me access to 2 major adept traits. Which is utterly useless. I can’t even put all 4 points in to the same line, and finding two traits which synergise is very hard. If I actually had to unlock the traits as well, then that would be even worse. Seriously, did any of the developers actually try playing a new character from scratch with the new system before they implemented it, because it’s utterly crap!?

I am so disappointed in the Feature Pack post from today, I read the title and was hoping anet was fixing the big mistake of having to unlock the traits, I even read the line where it mention the traits, wanting to read that you had them all unlocked once again.
Please fix that mistake and fire whoever suggested the stupid change in the first place.

Thanks,

Drunken Mad King.8193:

Rauderi.8706:

CrashTestAuto.9108:

Over 2,000 posts… The latest blog post was really disappointing. I was hoping that the red post we got recently here was a bluff. It seemed implausible that they actually hadn’t thought about or discussed how much hate this system was getting.

Echo that. :\

After four months of almost consistently negative feedback and suggestions, to know they’ve barely looked at it is disheartening.

They haven’t said this but I am surprised that more people haven’t come to this conclusion:

The months of silence on this and much more is because they have been very busy and fervently working on the China Rollout. It wasn’t just the initial month but fixing bugs and issues and making sure things went smoothly with China. This was a huge cash cow for them, or at least a potentially huge cash cow and so they wanted to make sure that everything went smoothly.

The second aspect of it is that they want to unify the two systems to make sure it is easy to roll things out to both systems. So that is what we are seeing. They roll it out to China and then they roll it out to us. These changes we are seeing in the latest “big push” are all changes for China and are now making their way to us.

The reason they haven’t read the 4 months of hated response is because they were busy with China. Also it allows them to see whether it is initial dislike or if it is long term dislike. If initial ride it out and it dies out. If it is long term then they have to make decisions now on how to implement changes to ours that they can also implement with china so that they can keep programming similar. It would be too expensive to have two different programming departments. Much cheaper to have one that works on both.

Disheartening to see they didn’t read it, but not unexpected. They weren’t ignoring us, they were simply busy with something more important. Remember it’s a business so they put their attention and their time where money is to be made.

Then maybe they shouldn’t be rolling out huge new systems when they’re too busy to handle the repercussions? It’s not like the China launch was some big surprise that they couldn’t possibly have foreseen. They implemented the feature patch at the same time knowing full well they didn’t have the resources to manage both.

That said, it was pretty obvious that no changes to the trait system were coming in this “feature” patch, based on the post Mr. Cartwright made in this thread.

I really dislike the current direction ANet is heading with the “simplification” mantra, it is homogenizing the game by making it even more bland and far less engaging. The original trait and character progression was much closer to perfection than the “improved” system from the standpoint of the player. The game at release once had a more open feel to it; (albeit still on rails) but by gating content and adding in “mandatory” goal posts the experience has become further restrictive and the illusion of freedom shattered.

This ain’t China. Maybe someone at ANET should check an atlas or something.

I’m beginning to wonder if there is a disconnect between Anets requirement management and game desgin team, like if the teams can’t stand each other and don’t really communicate.

The requirement „Give us a sense of advancement and immersion by tying trait acquisition to content like (new) quests etc..“ becomes the design „let’s tie trait acquisiton to badly designed, rare, random, tedious and/or buggy content that few play for the aforementioned reasons“.

The requirement „Make the game friendlier for new players by actually explaining the game features in-game with guided tutorials and such“ becomes the design „let’s put options behind level gates and add wall-of-text info boxes when those gates are reached“.

I can’t help it, but think that something is off with the development process there.

On the other hand, stuff like that IS one of the traditional drawbacks of the waterfall software development process and it’s children. So it might just be the effects of Anets „hush, hush“ communication policy, which is the antipode of the constant customer feedback from more modern, agile processes.

2k replies and 90k clickes!!! I finally understand why people are furious after buying a new slot this week. When the new trait system was released all my toons are level 80s so I only need to unlock the elite traits which i think is fine. But rolling a new toon is just pain in da kitten , the new trait not only giving new player hard time but also making veteran frustrating with the among of time and work we need to do to unlock them.

I wonder how many dev actually took their time testing this and unlocking all the traits themselves. Now imaging people who bought this game after April and leveling 8 toons with each profession.

Mika.4791:

It was simple, not complicated and EVEN, because everybody had access to traits, now newcomers or/and non-hardcore vets with low resources (like myself) have to settle with a few traits for their new characters with no chance of experiencing with builds, like we used to in the beginning.

So please, revert the trait system to what it was and make it even for everybody again.

Very well said!
Sooo..was this an honest move to help new players, or just to be compatible with China? Anet, remember this, alot of us don’t like grinders and why we are here. Gee, might be why no more alts for me huh!

Hope your talks about this trait system are productive. We are waiting!

As I said much earlier in this thread (too lazy to pull it up), the unlocks for the traits needs an overhaul. One suggestion is to make it be based around how you play, with using certain skills unlocking the traits that help those skills after a certain criteria with them is met (such as using the skills 50-100 times). Another is to link each trait to an event or renown heart that fits them, such as linking the increased movement speed in stealth trait to that one Ash Legion sneak heart in Ascalon being completed. Things like that, where it makes sense on how you’re unlocking the traits.

RyuDragnier.9476:

As I said much earlier in this thread (too lazy to pull it up), the unlocks for the traits needs an overhaul. One suggestion is to make it be based around how you play, with using certain skills unlocking the traits that help those skills after a certain criteria with them is met (such as using the skills 50-100 times). Another is to link each trait to an event or renown heart that fits them, such as linking the increased movement speed in stealth trait to that one Ash Legion sneak heart in Ascalon being completed. Things like that, where it makes sense on how you’re unlocking the traits.

That sounds like it would take a lot of time and effort to develop. And it would probably confuse new players. And…. uh…. something-something-something Scarlet.

Guhracie.3419:

RyuDragnier.9476:

As I said much earlier in this thread (too lazy to pull it up), the unlocks for the traits needs an overhaul. One suggestion is to make it be based around how you play, with using certain skills unlocking the traits that help those skills after a certain criteria with them is met (such as using the skills 50-100 times). Another is to link each trait to an event or renown heart that fits them, such as linking the increased movement speed in stealth trait to that one Ash Legion sneak heart in Ascalon being completed. Things like that, where it makes sense on how you’re unlocking the traits.

That sounds like it would take a lot of time and effort to develop. And it would probably confuse new players. And…. uh…. something-something-something Scarlet.

…so that’s who is behind the trait system huh? Even in death she mocks us.

I sincerely hope they aren’t simply merging the chinese progression model into the NA client.

No game rolls out with the same systems in place in the two different parts of the world and works in both. No game ever. North American and Chinese players.. the mores involved are pure antithetical.

NA players loathe pay-to-win and long grindy progression systems. Chinese players loathe anything where they can’t achieve a show-offy ‘edge’ on other players.

Of course.. if Anet doesn’t mind throwing one market under the bus for the sake of courting the other.. well. I ain’t being run over by a bus, just what I’m saying.

I think a good middle ground is to make adept traits free, and lock master and grandmaster. That gives people something to work with, and lets them play around with traits, while still giving them something to work for.

On my older characters it has not been a problem. I just re-spent my points and have the same trait setup I had before. But I just started my first new character since the trait changes – it is horrid! This is the worst thing for new players I have seen. But after so many months I doubt they would change it back ha ha…

This thread shows a lot of customer dissatisfaction though.

Becka Williams.4978:

I think a good middle ground is to make adept traits free, and lock master and grandmaster. That gives people something to work with, and lets them play around with traits, while still giving them something to work for.

Yes, please. That would work for me.

Tukaram.8256:

This thread shows a lot of customer dissatisfaction though.

It shows a lot of NA and EU customer dissatisfaction.

But many of us have gold aplenty so don’t use the Gem Store so much. So we are not as valuable as spendthrifty new players from China. They don’t care about us so much anymore.

Wow so one red post from Izzy then nothing, back to zero communication again I guess

kitten Already – SKILL POINTS ACCOUNT BASED.

Please promptly remove head from @$$.

I am against the trait system, ankitten ew to this topic. Pretty surprised they didn’t take anything from this topic.

Kohlteth.3715:

Wow so one red post from Izzy then nothing, back to zero communication again I guess

To be fair, if ANYTHING in the next week’s announcements is capable of impacting this situation, they need to hold off and make that announcement first. THEN they can see what we say to that change, and go from there.

There’s a lot of things that might impact it, too. Account wide skill points, for example. Or being able to unlock traits with laurels. Or buy level up or skill scrolls. Some might make it better, some might make it even worse.

Even if nothing in the next week’s announcements impacts this problem, I’d rather have them talk about it for more than a week or two before deciding how they’ll address it. They might change it once, but I doubt they’ll change it twice. If there’s a fix, it needs to be right the first time.

Palador.2170:

Kohlteth.3715:

Wow so one red post from Izzy then nothing, back to zero communication again I guess

To be fair, if ANYTHING in the next week’s announcements is capable of impacting this situation, they need to hold off and make that announcement first. THEN they can see what we say to that change, and go from there.

There’s a lot of things that might impact it, too. Account wide skill points, for example. Or being able to unlock traits with laurels. Or buy level up or skill scrolls. Some might make it better, some might make it even worse.

Even if nothing in the next week’s announcements impacts this problem, I’d rather have them talk about it for more than a week or two before deciding how they’ll address it. They might change it once, but I doubt they’ll change it twice. If there’s a fix, it needs to be right the first time.

This just kills me. Closing in on 5 months since implementation of a system that couldn’t possibly have been discussed for more than a day or two, and we’re still sitting here with fingers crossed that they’ll spend more than a week or two discussing how to fix it.

I agree with you, Palador. It just makes me really sad.

Guhracie.3419:

This just kills me. Closing in on 5 months since implementation of a system that couldn’t possibly have been discussed for more than a day or two, and we’re still sitting here with fingers crossed that they’ll spend more than a week or two discussing how to fix it.

I agree with you, Palador. It just makes me really sad.

Me too. I try not to think about it too much, but…

With the unlocks change I lost any interest in having new characters, and I’m usually an altoholic in every game.

The only reason I’m still playing is because I still have some chars created before April that I haven’t yet leveled up.
When I’m done with those I’m afraid I’l be done with the game as well if they don’t fix this mess.

:( Just hit 30, was super excited for traits and whatnot, and now I find out that I need to do some pretty insane stuff to even be able to make use of my trait points.

Not impressed

the trait system, as implemented is directly opposed to what they say they wanted to achieve with it.

It is not simpler
The UI is worse (more clicks for less understanding)
The implementation makes making a build fairly complex
Its repetive and not adapted to the actual traits being used

What it does do, is not what they said its goals are.
lengthens the leveling experience, gives short term goals, etc.
It probably works better overall within the new system they currently added,
which gives you more reinforcement for leveling, and has large gaps (now that story doesnt lead you to zones at the appropriate levels) Which now needs goals to distract you for 10 levels at a clip.

That said, its still a pretty poor peice to the puzzle.

the tasks are generic and not well tested for fun
the tasks require pvers to pvp and pvpers to pve
the replayability factor is low (people will only be new to the game one time, it should have been more focused around being new to a PROFFESION being fun)
The UI is poor
Blah blah, its bad

My ranger is now level 64. I have unlocked 4 traits through mapping (about 8-10 maps completed). Build diversity???? Where? I’ve been using the same setup since I started. You can’t build with 4 adept traits. By the time I reach level 80 what will I have, without going completely out of my way to get specific traits? 6-7 adept traits, most of which I probably wouldn’t even want to use? That’s pathetic.

I made a new character yesterday that I’ve been wanting to create for ages. I spent ages on the design, picked a name, and hovered over the accept button. Then I went back to the character select screen and logged off.

I am a relatively new player, so naturally I’ve only ever known the current system.
I gotta say, unlocking the traits has been a real chore: I was able to start to experience some build diversity only long after reaching lvl 80.
There are still a couple I’m missing (think “The Long Way Around”…) and I can’t be bothered to spend gold on them since I can’t be certain I’ll ever need them.

Also, thinking that I’ll have to do it all over again for every new character feels disheartening…

I think that this way of unlocking traits is the kind of thing that maybe looked good on paper, but then in practice end up being a hassle.
I get it, it’s supposed to feel rewarding, but instead you actually feel extremely limited.

I think if they are going to make them so hard to unlock ( or have to spend a puppyload of Skill Points and money on) that they should make them account bound at least… That way people would be more likely to make alts knowing they no longer have the CHORE of having to yet again try to unlock the traits the SAME WAY again on every alt…

I wonder if they even realise how much of a puppyfest it is trying to do Obsidian Sanctuary on an Charr or large Norn to unlock the falling damage mitigation trait ( kinda ironic concidering this JP is one that makes you fall the most )

I actually wonder if this is just a method to absorb all the skill scrolls they’ve pumped into the game.

Kohlteth.3715:

I think if they are going to make them so hard to unlock ( or have to spend a puppyload of Skill Points and money on) that they should make them account bound at least…

I agreee, having both the unlocked traits and the skill points account bound would be great… and would make the chore of unlocking them worth it.

The more I play, the more this system annoys me.

I just unlocked all adept tiered traits on my warrior. Some were unlocked by their appropriate task but most were bought from the trainer. What made it worse was the amount of coin I lost doing so, and that’s only the low tier. I don’t think getting grandmaster tier is even feasable for me in the near future.

This means that I can’t really play my Warrior, as I cannot use any build whatsoever. This is a huge blow to the “play how you want” concept, because it basically makes it not true.

Also: give us more trait points.

Since the devs are now finally starting to look at this thread, and they clearly haven’t planned on changing the trait system yet, I’ve decided to quote my old post about my proposed ideas:

ThanatosAngel.8024:

Hey everyone, I’ve been thinking a lot about the new trait changes and reading a lot of opinions, and that inspired me to come up with what I believe is a better solution. If you like what you read, spread the word and hopefully maybe ArenaNet will make some changes like these. Here goes:

For starters, players should unlock traits at level 15, and gain one trait point every five levels until level 80. Master tier once again unlocks at 40, and Grandmaster at 60. This is how it worked before the patch, only each point will still be worth five, and new players don’t have to wait to level 30 just to use traits. It’s a win-win.

Traits are still locked and can still be unlocked by purchasing guides, but acquisition out in the field should be different. Players will be able to complete specially-marked Trait Challenges for trait guides much like they can complete Skill Challenges for skill points.

Trait Challenges could be marked on the map as either empty or filled hexagons (similar to hearts), and are based on the type of profession you play: Soldier, Adventurer, or Scholar.
Warriors and Guardians will have to display their strength by dueling a NPC to gain a new trait.
Rangers, Thieves, and Engineers stretch their adventuring muscles by going off road and deep into caves and crevices to reach special chests containing their trait guides.
And since Elementalists, Mesmers, and Necromancers like to use their brains in battle, they have to complete mind puzzles or quizzes in order to win their traits.
We already more or less do these things for skill challenges, but they can be slightly harder and more specific to profession type.

Additionally, if your profession doesn’t match up with that specific challenge, then it does not show up on the map and it cannot be activated. For example, a Soldier or Scholar would not be able to see a hexagon on the map for an Adventurer challenge, and if they manage to reach the chest, will not be able to open it. Similarly, a Scholar or Adventurer will not be able to pick fights with Soldier challengers, though if the fight is in session, they can at least give aid.

Adept challenges could be found on maps between the levels of 15-40, Master challenges on maps level 40-60, and Grandmaster challenges on maps level 60-80.

Oh, and Trait Challenges should not count towards map completion.

Thoughts?

Another idea that I will add is that they could make Trait Challenges work something like paths in WildStar. Adventurers could have challenges similar to Explorers; Soldiers would have challenges like…Soldiers; and Scholars would match up with Scientists.

This might be too much work for them to implement, but I still think that the general idea could work very well. It’s still better than what we have now.

There is a goldmine of feedback within this thread, and yet it feels like this is all for nothing. Over four months worth of comments and only just recently did they make a reply! This thread was even started by a dev, which makes it even more concerning that there is no meaningful communication going on here…

I posted my grievances back in April in regards to the unlock challenges being too difficult (map complete Frostgorge Sound for an Adept trait, etc.), and while ridiculous requirements as in my example have since been removed (thank you!), this entire system is still remains to be very unappealing to me, mostly due to the fact that many unlocks are still linked to events that rely on time of opportunity (boss kills, wvw towers), or the support of other players (dungeons, boss kills, wvw towers). While I am pleasantly surprised that some tweaks were made to remedy the initial round of requirements, I still feel like the adventure from level 1 to 80 remains to be vastly underwhelming and unrewarding because of this.

Personally, I have stopped buying char-slots. I want to make more alts because I used to find it very enjoyable. However, every time I consider buying another slot, I always decide against it whenever I think about grinding for their traits. I have already tried making a new character, and I got frustrated with grinding him and quit before he reached level 50. I could not feel my character developing like I had with my pre-April characters, and after hours upon hours of working on him, I was nowhere near unlocking all of his Adept traits. I felt like I was doing all that work for something that used to be within my grasp. Why did they have to change something when there was nothing wrong with it to begin with?

And while many people will simply say “hurr durr, just buy your traits then”, I honestly believe that forcing players into buying their traits is not pointing players in the direction that allows them to experience the game to its fullest potential. Rather, it comes across as a sleazy money grab. Some players have said that they don’t mind paying because it is similar to how GW1 worked… but this is not GW1. Even if it was, unlocking skills in GW1 was nowhere near as frustrating (or expensive) as unlocking traits in GW2…

Furthermore, if ANet thinks that “the downed system is too overwhelming to new players” among the concerns about new players not getting a good first impression of the game, how do you suppose they are going to react to the tedious and nonsensical slog of crud they are going to have to deal with to unlock their traits? Don’t get me wrong, I am not against accommodating new players by changing the introduction of the game… rather, I’m more concerned about the perception of how enjoyable it is to build a new character for newbies and veterans alike.

I have read so many great suggestions being proposed by players in this thread, but alas, it seems pointless to do so. I am still cautiously optimistic that ANet has secret plans to make improvements that actually improve the traits system. We will just have to patiently wait and see what they do after they finish their discussions. Heck, for all we know, they could think that there is nothing wrong with their perfect masterpiece, and we are all futilely partaking in the longest QQ thread on the forum for no reason whatsoever.

JonPeters.5630:

At the end of the day this system has helped spread out the teaching of the system and the feeling of accomplishment through acquisition, but it has done it in ways that are sometimes counterproductive and still not nearly visible enough to impact as many players as it could.

Guild Wars 2 is a game that is going to continue to evolve and it will be because of your feedback and our efforts so do not get discouraged from posting feedback and be patient with change and I hope we will reward that patience.

TLDR;
We added this system as a direct result from the horizontal progression CDI. We are always reading your feedback, however, we don’t always have time to respond right away or action it quickly. We updated some trait unlocks in the past but we can do more. How can you help?
1) Give us a list of the most offensive trait unlock locations.
2) Keep giving feedback and be patient as this is a big ship and it takes time to steer it.

I was an active participant in that CDI, Mr. Peters, and this system doesn’t resemble anything that was suggested there. It obviously draws on some of the ideas, but if you really think this is more user-friendly than your old system was, I’d like to suggest you roll a new character and actually unlock a build this way.

The most offensive trait unlocks are map completions, dungeons that are more than 10 levels higher than the trait tier, and traits tied to bugged events.

Here, maybe this will help:

Just put it back the way it was and stop tinkering with things that don’t need tinkering. I have a friend who was tinkering with his wife’s car and somehow managed to break four – FOUR! – spark plugs, leaving portions of them still stuck in the engine. My question: why did you keep going after you broke the first one? His answer: CDI!

That’s what it looks like you guys are doing. Tinkering needlessly and making things worse in the process. It was fine before. It was better than it is now. Just change it back already. You’ll make lots of folks happy.

Magic word: PLEASE.

(Just kidding about the CDI thing. He didn’t actually say that.)

Guhracie.3419:

I was an active participant in that CDI, Mr. Peters, and this system doesn’t resemble anything that was suggested there. It obviously draws on some of the ideas, but if you really think this is more user-friendly than your old system was, I’d like to suggest you roll a new character and actually unlock a build this way.

The most offensive trait unlocks are map completions, dungeons that are more than 10 levels higher than the trait tier, and traits tied to bugged events.

Sigh

If you’re not happy how unlocking traits works, BUY THEM.