Guild Wars 2

Antipode.2518:

I’m surprised people still boast about questing in GW2. It seems like a clear case of the emperor’s new clothes.

I recently tried to pick up GW2 again and got instantly bored of collecting apples, trapping fish, and killings spiders. Removing a quest giver doesn’t suddenly make boring quests more interesting.

Tera: Horrible quest text, but combat makes the quest activities fun.
WoW: Bad quest text, but quest activities much more varied.
SWTOR: Great story cutscenes, but quest activities boring.
GW2: No quest text/bad story cutscenes, and boring quest activities.

Add in that GW2 has the least amount of leveling progression (very few ability upgrades), I get bored faster than any other MMO I’ve played. I do want to hit max level eventually, and appreciate the lack of sub, but I can’t stand the leveling in this game.

Let me introduce you to the 5 D’s of questing: Deliver, Destroy, Defend, Drop, Discover. Wow has them, gw2 has them, there is nothing different, except for the odd bombing run or whatever in WoW. What seperates wow from gw2 is that gw2 got rid of some of the quest text and having to run back and forth to an npc.

Lifeson.4352:

Antipode.2518:

I’m surprised people still boast about questing in GW2. It seems like a clear case of the emperor’s new clothes.

I recently tried to pick up GW2 again and got instantly bored of collecting apples, trapping fish, and killings spiders. Removing a quest giver doesn’t suddenly make boring quests more interesting.

Tera: Horrible quest text, but combat makes the quest activities fun.
WoW: Bad quest text, but quest activities much more varied.
SWTOR: Great story cutscenes, but quest activities boring.
GW2: No quest text/bad story cutscenes, and boring quest activities.

Add in that GW2 has the least amount of leveling progression (very few ability upgrades), I get bored faster than any other MMO I’ve played. I do want to hit max level eventually, and appreciate the lack of sub, but I can’t stand the leveling in this game.

Let me introduce you to the 5 D’s of questing: Deliver, Destroy, Defend, Drop, Discover. Wow has them, gw2 has them, there is nothing different, except for the odd bombing run or whatever in WoW. What seperates wow from gw2 is that gw2 got rid of some of the quest text and having to run back and forth to an npc.

Sure, but that’s an oversimplification. There clearly are games that have worse leveling than others despite having the “5 Ds”.

I still remember cool quests like the Titan quest chain in Stormpeaks, or the quest that has your invade Undercity alongside your faction champion. The activities that you did during those quests felt relevant to the universe.

Antipode.2518:

Lifeson.4352:

Antipode.2518:

I’m surprised people still boast about questing in GW2. It seems like a clear case of the emperor’s new clothes.

I recently tried to pick up GW2 again and got instantly bored of collecting apples, trapping fish, and killings spiders. Removing a quest giver doesn’t suddenly make boring quests more interesting.

Tera: Horrible quest text, but combat makes the quest activities fun.
WoW: Bad quest text, but quest activities much more varied.
SWTOR: Great story cutscenes, but quest activities boring.
GW2: No quest text/bad story cutscenes, and boring quest activities.

Add in that GW2 has the least amount of leveling progression (very few ability upgrades), I get bored faster than any other MMO I’ve played. I do want to hit max level eventually, and appreciate the lack of sub, but I can’t stand the leveling in this game.

Let me introduce you to the 5 D’s of questing: Deliver, Destroy, Defend, Drop, Discover. Wow has them, gw2 has them, there is nothing different, except for the odd bombing run or whatever in WoW. What seperates wow from gw2 is that gw2 got rid of some of the quest text and having to run back and forth to an npc.

Sure, but that’s an oversimplification. There clearly are games that have worse leveling than others despite having the “5 Ds”.

I still remember cool quests like the Titan quest chain in Stormpeaks, or the quest that has your invade Undercity alongside your faction champion. The activities that you did during those quests felt relevant to the universe.

There are alot of DE event chains though that are relevant to the universe, I feel you got to include events when you talk about questing in gw2. And talking to the NPC’s related to what you’re doing can have quite alot of text involved. But sure, epic quest lines like in WoW you won’t find in gw2. I too miss them sometimes.

critickitten.1498:

Vasham.2408:

TheDaiBish.9735:

Well, I used to raid.

I much prefer GW2’s design over just standing there, filling health bars (I used to heal). Maybe occasionally use a skill that reduced damage taken.

Most encounter designs from the trinity could be implemented without the trinity as well, outside of the obvious keeping aggro, filling healthbars and keeping the tank up.

So you fear responsibility. Got it.

I do hope you’re kidding.

Because the assertion that every player having to self-regulate their own health, damage, and control statuses somehow makes them less responsible than a player who just shifts that job off onto the healer’s shoulders is laughable.

Post of the Year, all years.

There are definitely a lot of things in GW2 that just should be standard fare. I really dig TERA on a lot of levels, but Jesus, every time I attack I get rooted and then I frown.

THe only thing I don’t want to do in other MMO’s is to take a very long time to get the final stats for equipments. In GW2 we have a relatively easier access on getting the exotic stats we want and then play whatever content we really enjoy. For me, it’s usually guild vs guild, which this game doesn’t have. So I’m just working on another legendary for now. Until playing well becomes a bit more glamorized in wvw or PvE areas. WvW doesn’t hold much recognition for really good players. Only commanders get to have renowned. I’d rather have my achievements recognizable by other servers too. If they’d only put character names instead of the generic “server invader” it would hold much more value to me.

VOLKON.1290:

<snip>

You’re trying too hard. Slow down and relax. You’ll make less spelling errors that way.

In competitive PvE types of games, everyone races to be the first. If you’re not, you’re s.o.l. and get nothing. With me so far? Good.

In GW2, people race to get in events. The more people that get there, the more mobs show up, the tougher they get, etc. Plus many events have timed scenarios, so this “instagibbed” scenario you present isn’t possible. It’s different completely, because everyone is racing to be a part of something, not the exclusive person to get credit for a single mob.

Actually – outside the ‘boss’ part of events and an occasional veteran or two, people do rush to tag normal swarms of mobs because they die very fast.
And people do this on the off chance of getting loot, and not because they a) want to help others complete the event or b) to get credit for the event.

It’s quite visible in Orr for example. People farm them, and they farm them because the mobs go down easy meaning if you’re not one of the few classes that can do a lot of damage to many mobs at once, you’re at a disadvantage.

So the poster you quoted was quite correct and does not really need to “slow down” or “relax”.

Antipode.2518:

I’m surprised people still boast about questing in GW2. It seems like a clear case of the emperor’s new clothes.

I recently tried to pick up GW2 again and got instantly bored of collecting apples, trapping fish, and killings spiders. Removing a quest giver doesn’t suddenly make boring quests more interesting.

Tera: Horrible quest text, but combat makes the quest activities fun.
WoW: Bad quest text, but quest activities much more varied.
SWTOR: Great story cutscenes, but quest activities boring.
GW2: No quest text/bad story cutscenes, and boring quest activities.

Add in that GW2 has the least amount of leveling progression (very few ability upgrades), I get bored faster than any other MMO I’ve played. I do want to hit max level eventually, and appreciate the lack of sub, but I can’t stand the leveling in this game.

I basically agree.
I think – however – the reason is that because it’s changed in how quests are provided/given to the player make the illusion that the quests are actually “new” as well.
And then naturally a case of ‘defending’ the game when somebody says something negative always kicks in.

I liked the model they had in GW1 – basically a single player RPG structure, that you can play multiplayer. (and then esport PvP.)

I dont want “quests.” I want a linear(ish) story, with subquests being optional activities for completionists. (like a JRPG.) And then repeatable skill based content like ranking mode for individual missions, an infinite dungeon of increasing difficulty, etc. And esport PvP.

If GW2 followed that structure, but added the dodging and action based combat (actually GW2 is not actiony enough for me – I want something like Dark Souls, God of War / Devil May Cry, or Dragons Nest), then that would be my ideal game.

(While we’re at it, make the item and loot system singleplayer. You can’t trade or give items or currency in game. Everyone has their own personal economy, and the rarity/prices are scaled to a singleplayer game.
No more bots, no more greed/envy, no more gold sellers.)

Anyways, here’s to hoping someone out there gets it one day.

LoL and GW2 both ruined any kind of multiplayer game that isn’t a casual shooter like L4D.

They’re always so… fresh and, what’s the opposite of repetitive and dull?

Lifeson.4352:

Antipode.2518:

Lifeson.4352:

Antipode.2518:

I’m surprised people still boast about questing in GW2. It seems like a clear case of the emperor’s new clothes.

I recently tried to pick up GW2 again and got instantly bored of collecting apples, trapping fish, and killings spiders. Removing a quest giver doesn’t suddenly make boring quests more interesting.

Tera: Horrible quest text, but combat makes the quest activities fun.
WoW: Bad quest text, but quest activities much more varied.
SWTOR: Great story cutscenes, but quest activities boring.
GW2: No quest text/bad story cutscenes, and boring quest activities.

Add in that GW2 has the least amount of leveling progression (very few ability upgrades), I get bored faster than any other MMO I’ve played. I do want to hit max level eventually, and appreciate the lack of sub, but I can’t stand the leveling in this game.

Let me introduce you to the 5 D’s of questing: Deliver, Destroy, Defend, Drop, Discover. Wow has them, gw2 has them, there is nothing different, except for the odd bombing run or whatever in WoW. What seperates wow from gw2 is that gw2 got rid of some of the quest text and having to run back and forth to an npc.

Sure, but that’s an oversimplification. There clearly are games that have worse leveling than others despite having the “5 Ds”.

I still remember cool quests like the Titan quest chain in Stormpeaks, or the quest that has your invade Undercity alongside your faction champion. The activities that you did during those quests felt relevant to the universe.

There are alot of DE event chains though that are relevant to the universe, I feel you got to include events when you talk about questing in gw2. And talking to the NPC’s related to what you’re doing can have quite alot of text involved. But sure, epic quest lines like in WoW you won’t find in gw2. I too miss them sometimes.

I think in a wqay this is what the live story will be atempting to fill How ever we have yet to get into the real meet of the (vary first live story) so there’s no telling how that will go.

DreamOfACure.4382:

Pretty sure PlanetSide2 is doing fabulously.

blinkxzero.8035:

The best part of GW2 is the dodge mechanic. I can’t play any other MMO that doesn’t let me dodge or evade attacks coming at me — and I’m not talking about using LoS like in WoW. I wish every game got rid of “hit chance”, and just let you either dodge it or not.

If you like it that much, you should give TERA a try. They just went Free2Play.

It’s actually an action MMO (unlike GW2 which just added Dodge), where you can dodge everything once you’re good enough at it. All attacks are skill-shots and hitboxes are more relevant in combat.

I did play Tera and I could not bring myself to get pass lv10. The GRIND was just to much for me. It goes something like this: Run up to npc get quest, quest says go kill 10 tree. Ok off I go, after killing 10 tree and completing the quest. Then I walk up the next npc and took his quest. What does the quest say, it says go kill 10 more tree….. – Facepalm -

I believe the aspect of heart quests that makes it superior to quest text is the option to choose the method you wish to use in order to complete it.

Maple Story is MMO missed by many. Cause it’s anime, cause it’s 2d etc. But bottom line is that thing may match WoW in player base and for a good reason – combat is hard hitting, 100% action and satisfactory. Now if it just wasn’t pay to win run by horrible company…

Nurse.1085:

I think game’s like WoW offer things GW2 can’t, which is more “challenging” content/Raids and a Trinity system.

I won’t comment about the Trinity because that’s opinion and that’s cool. But WoW raids are no more difficult than GW2’s explorable mode dungeons EXCEPT for the logistical element of having more people involved. More people means more room for kittenup and more effort required to organize and control them. That has little to do with the content itself, but is an artificial inflation of difficulty based on numbers of participants.

Try organizing an outing with three friends and then try it with thirty. Where you’re going and what you’re doing is irrelevant to the difficulty of the task. It’s the numbers of participants that makes the task hard.

And so far as the content goes, all raids eventually end up on farm mode once the dance steps have been learned and disseminated. That means they are done on autopilot, and usually with a kittenton of addons acting as crutches to make it even easier. Sure, explorables are farmed now too, but I was around when people first started running them and the typical reaction from players at the time was horror. Even story modes were responsible for continuous wipes UNTIL people learned the dance steps.

Explorables are simply a concise version of raids, but with the arbitrary participant difficulty multiplier removed. And good riddance. I’ve had my fill of listening to 20 whiny children, throwing hissy fits over losing out on loot rolls.

Affter GW2 i can only play TSW (the secret world) cuz every other MMO looks pretty old…. i am actually close to uninstall every other MMO from my pc (just leaving gw2 and tsw.. may wakfu 4 social too xD )

GW2 has ruined all mmos for me. I think all future games are going to be run like this. GW2 seemed to be the shining beacon that would respect the player and our time, but even it got corrupted.

I now believe every MMO is run by dishonest people and are going to string me along, making my experience frustrating, unrewarding and a waste of time in order to pressure me into paying to win. And I feel like as a community we are enabling them more and more to release bugged content and unfinished games due to our impatience, fickleness or addiction. They’re going to find better and better ways of manipulating customers, duping them, pressuring them. I see it as only getting worse in the future and will stay away from MMOs after I can’t bear GW2 anymore.

Clark Skinner.4902:

GW2 has ruined all mmos for me. I think all future games are going to be run like this. GW2 seemed to be the shining beacon that would respect the player and our time, but even it got corrupted.

I now believe every MMO is run by dishonest people and are going to string me along, making my experience frustrating, unrewarding and a waste of time in order to pressure me into paying to win. And I feel like as a community we are enabling them more and more to release bugged content and unfinished games due to our impatience, fickleness or addiction. They’re going to find better and better ways of manipulating customers, duping them, pressuring them. I see it as only getting worse in the future and will stay away from MMOs after I can’t bear GW2 anymore.

You could always quit gaming?

I did try SWTOR just the other day, simply because I’ve never played a scifi rpg, online or otherwise. First thing I thought was, what do you mean I have to pay to play a Twi’lek?! Either pay, or invest hours playing a species that I don’t want, in order to start over completely once I get enough Legacy to unlock the species that I do want? SWTOR’s business model sucks, plain and simple. Since it bombed so badly at the beginning, I guess Bioware couldn’t afford to use a B2P model like GW2 that would allow new users to enjoy the whole game, so they made a stupidly restricted F2P model instead.

Still, I rolled a human just to see what the content was like. I got I there… Yuck and yuck. I hear that SWTOR storyline is actually good, but I couldn’t get into it because I’m spoiled by GW2 graphics. But come on! It’s not like they even had to do any creative work – the Star Wars universe is already beautiful and amazing and PREDESIGNED. All they had to do was do it justice graphics-wise and they somehow still managed to crap it up! Aion was released 2 years before SWTOR and is visually superior. Bioware has no excuse. Boo and boo.

Anyway. I went on a tangent, sorry. Point is, yes I concur that other MMO’s are ruined for me too. I may be swayed by TESO, but we will see.

Yes i can admit GW2 is not bad mmo with some serious issues like any other new/beta software but still can playable.

Anyway we’ll see when the Elder Scrolls Online hit the market, tbh i’m waiting it very solicitously.

azazil.9541:

Yes i can admit GW2 is not bad mmo with some serious issues like any other new/beta software but still can playable.

Anyway we’ll see when the Elder Scrolls Online hit the market, tbh i’m waiting it very solicitously.

It’s funny… I enjoyed Skyrim quite a bit, but I’m leery of ESO. It’ll be so easy to screw that up in an MMO environment that even if I felt like playing another game I’d still wait a few months for a shaking out period first.

I’m a fanGIRL, tyvm. Can’t you tell by my uber personalized forum profile?

schizandra.4587:

I’m a fanGIRL, tyvm. Can’t you tell by my uber personalized forum profile?

Do you know offhand if there’s an age cutoff in going from a fanboy to a fanman? I’m pretty sure I’ve exceeded it if one exists…

GW2 stripped MMOs of the minutia of irritants and added some fun gameplay elements. Levelling to 80 the first time is fun in a beautiful world.

As previously mentioned it made gameplay faster and more dynamic during the levelling process. The storyline quest added a bit of flair to the traditional 5Ds of questing this game has without the tedium of tracking a quest log. It’s easy to play and there are a lot of side distractions to keep you busy; crafting, exploring, jumping puzzles.. all great fun.

But I’ve started looking for another game honestly. While I find GW2 beautiful and fun to play it is missing key elements which promote longevity.

Having recently hit 80 (I have 5 other characerts 45+) I find that completely the personal story is the only main reason to play.

While I see commentary on how “difficult” GW2 dungeons are as a long time raider every fight in GW2 appears basically hit stuff; dont stand in the red circles. While many accuse other games of “oh you just have to learn the script.”

I know alot of raiding groups that couldn’t do just that; nor could they put together a crew large enough; get them to the right places; or instill them their lines of the script. Sorry but big teams of 30 people are more complicated than that saturday afternoon bowling league.

Not to mention that under the “trinity” systems there is more than just hitting stuff; Aggro management, shifting/transferring aggro, target selection; peeling; intercepting adds; recovering lost aggro.

If looking at bars and healing was sooooo easy than you would see more healers; but healing in a dynamic environment managing not only health levels; decursing; curing; maintaining positioning; dpsing; balancing spiking damage levels while managing mana; it’s ALL more chaotic than any fight in GW2 which consists of one single mitigation “run away until skill recharge”

I miss the trinity. I like the challenge of keeping people alive as a healer.. In GW2, even support specs go unnoticed amongst the masses because most people I meet in open world do not understand basic gaming concepts or mechanics past “oh look there’s a circle to stand in or shoot out of” In some ways GW2 has dumbed down group game play.

There is no true improvement in your character for me. My skills do not really expand dramatically and I often have friends do dungeons nekkid just to show me how little the gear matters.

Now that I have hit 80; what do I have to look forward to? Everything is a grind. Which armor set do I grind for? Because that means just running the same dungeon ad nauseum with no increase in difficulty. None of it matters because the set stats are roughly the same.

Hell I even have hundreds of thousands of karma just sitting there because it’s a worthless reward. What good is a reward if you have nothing to spend it on? At least have interns churning out a variety of armors for purchase would be an improvement.

Effort and or longevity is simply not rewarded. Spend 20 minutes killing that Champion Risen Giant or spend that time killing risen chickens; which one will net you the better rewards? Who cares though; because even if I get something “exotic” it’s just a larger scale vendor trash so I can spin the Zomorros epic lottery wheel of frustration and wasted coin.

GW2 streamlined alot of painful elements; but as mentioned I think it will be proven to be a stepping stone to those games that combine the best of the past with some of the foundation they have established here.

Khai.6435:

I miss the trinity.

I never thought I’d say this, but I find myself missing the trinity approach to groups at times, too. I don’t miss the long wait to find a “tank” or a “healer,” but I sometimes miss the clearly defined roles. Too often, the “everyone can do everything” concept feels “messy” to me, as though players are struggling to figure out what they’re supposed to do in a dungeon.

Still, I applaud GW2 for trying to break the usual mold and do things more creatively, even if what they’ve come up with isn’t exactly my cup of tea.

Teso will grab a lot of people.
will they stay there ? or come back to gw2 as people came back to wow everytime?

thats the question.
Teso have enough “pull” to grab 5+mil players right off the bat.
if the first few gameplay videos are convincing.
i know i have 3 friends (not mmo players usually) who will give it a try an they dont “feel” like trying gw2 for whatever reason.

“elder scrolls” is a kitten IP… lots of power.

(btw neverwinter will totally fail to be any threat to gw2, take that for granted)

Celtic Lady.3729:

Khai.6435:

I miss the trinity.

I never thought I’d say this, but I find myself missing the trinity approach to groups at times, too. I don’t miss the long wait to find a “tank” or a “healer,” but I sometimes miss the clearly defined roles. Too often, the “everyone can do everything” concept feels “messy” to me, as though players are struggling to figure out what they’re supposed to do in a dungeon.

Still, I applaud GW2 for trying to break the usual mold and do things more creatively, even if what they’ve come up with isn’t exactly my cup of tea.

there is no “defined role” but there are “roles to be taken” in some dungeons. (dredge fractal switches and last boss for exemple).
probably anet should expend on this idea of having the dungeon create the role.
then players can discuss and see who does what.
this way, no matter your class, its about your playstyle!

i just feel the dungeons are not quite there yet in term of design possibilities.
fractals are an improvement, but they can make them much more “teamwork” than what they are now.
and the same could be said of the world events.

problem is the the game, its the content designers that are not totally comfy with it yet (or should i say, were not back then when they did the content).

future is bright imo.
i you imagine what this game “can be”.

Went back to RIFT and TERA. The amount of times i cancelled my skills by moving when they were casting is ridiculous. I love how on GW2 you can move around while casting…. TERA and RIFT have decent graphics, but thats it.

Completely agree with OP, GW2 is imo hands down the best MMO and arguably the best game ever made. You can’t go back to old MMO’s after this.

DreamOfACure.4382:

Pretty sure PlanetSide2 is doing fabulously.

blinkxzero.8035:

The best part of GW2 is the dodge mechanic. I can’t play any other MMO that doesn’t let me dodge or evade attacks coming at me — and I’m not talking about using LoS like in WoW. I wish every game got rid of “hit chance”, and just let you either dodge it or not.

If you like it that much, you should give TERA a try. They just went Free2Play.

It’s actually an action MMO (unlike GW2 which just added Dodge), where you can dodge everything once you’re good enough at it. All attacks are skill-shots and hitboxes are more relevant in combat.

Lol, I tried it 2 months ago. I love PvP and I love how TERA is based around PvP. However, once you get to max level, NO ONE PvPs!!! It’s a good game ruined by a bad community. Also, due to the fact that you can player kill without any consequences is the dumbest idea ever.

Back onto topic though, GW2 did not offer me anything special. However, neither did GW1 when it first came out. So I am definitely expecting some major improvements like they did on GW1. One thing I don’t like about this game is that there is no world PvP. World PvP is amazing and always keeps you on alert. But seeing how loot is not based on who does the most damage, world PvP would probably be a bit dull since you are not fighting for bosses or anything.

Avatar.1923:

Teso will grab a lot of people.
will they stay there ? or come back to gw2 as people came back to wow everytime?

thats the question.
Teso have enough “pull” to grab 5+mil players right off the bat.
if the first few gameplay videos are convincing.

5+ million right off the bat, eh? Methinks you grossly overestimate.

I seem to recall a lot of people saying the same thing about SWTOR. Being a huge single-player game franchise doesn’t mean that your MMO will sell well.

critickitten.1498:

Being a huge single-player game franchise doesn’t mean that your MMO will sell well.

Or survive well. There’s nothing to say that 5 million initial comers would still be there 1 month, 3 months, or 6 months down the road.

VOLKON.1290:

azazil.9541:

Yes i can admit GW2 is not bad mmo with some serious issues like any other new/beta software but still can playable.

Anyway we’ll see when the Elder Scrolls Online hit the market, tbh i’m waiting it very solicitously.

It’s funny… I enjoyed Skyrim quite a bit, but I’m leery of ESO. It’ll be so easy to screw that up in an MMO environment that even if I felt like playing another game I’d still wait a few months for a shaking out period first.

While many hard core RPG’ers would say that TES games get more ‘watered down’ with each iteration I enjoyed the fact I was not creating spreadsheets while deciding on gear and abilities. I actually simply played the game as I wanted to and got +400hrs of entertainment out of it.

Imagine being able to craft armor and weapons orders of magnitude more powerful than what could be bought or found as drops in the game, having targets that give a SPECIFIC type of damage that you could gear up to negate, being able to deal specific damage that some targets were especially sensitive to or even MAKING a target sensitive to the type of damage you have equipped?

Marry a TES game with ‘dynamic leveling’ (IMHO: the ONLY enduring feature of GW2 brings to the table) and then you’ve got something.

Over the years just about everyone has gotten the let down from the marketing hype of one title or another. When it comes to TESO I’m not holding my breath.

I miss EQ and camping quest mobs. Raster of Guk can kiss my kitten lol

“Ruined” is a bit strong for me, but I certainly acknowledge GW2 as being (in my mind) the leader in the genre.

I’m currently playing through Rift to see what the Storm Legion expansion has to offer. Even in a game as exceptionally well made as Rift, full of dynamic events and innovative approaches to grouping (such as instant adventures, invasions and rifts) I find myself wishing it elements of GW2. The game does much to hide the static nature of its combat, but it is static nevertheless.

TSW: another very good game. I enjoy the combat, build system, quests and the pulp novel feel of the the cut scenes and the world. But I find the frequency of combat and enemy density (combined with lots of knock down mechanics) to be a bit too unforgiving, particularly for ranged weapons. Getting to objectives can be outright frustrating at times. But there’s nothing out there like it, so its refreshing even so.

Tera: Excellent combat. Beautiful vistas. Mind numbingly meaningless and routine quests. And it is entirely possible to play the game without reading one word of text. You kill X of one kind of monster, turn in your quest, and kill X number of slight variation on the monster you just killed. It never varies. And depending on your viewpoint the female armor (not to mention animations) is the best – or perhaps worst – thing in all of games.

When I play these games I find myself missing innovations found in GW2, but rarely is the reverse true.

critickitten.1498:

I seem to recall a lot of people saying the same thing about SWTOR. Being a huge single-player game franchise doesn’t mean that your MMO will sell well.

Or be any good as an MMO for that matter.

Celtic Lady.3729:

critickitten.1498:

Being a huge single-player game franchise doesn’t mean that your MMO will sell well.

Or survive well. There’s nothing to say that 5 million initial comers would still be there 1 month, 3 months, or 6 months down the road.

It really is possible. TES is an amazing franchise with a massive fanbase. Remember TES is loved by not only MMO players but western RPG lovers and console gamers, unlike GW2 so it has a much larger demographic. Also certain devs on the dev team worked on DAoC so the 3v3 faction pvp will be done right.

Remeber also, Diablo 3 sold 6Mil on it’s launch. TESO could easily sell 3 to 4 mil within 1 month or on release of it’s launch.

I know im playing it and many of my friends are.

Kakeru.2873:

It really is possible. TES is an amazing franchise with a massive fanbase.

Was said about SWTOR.

Remember TES is loved by not only MMO players but western RPG lovers and console gamers, unlike GW2 so it has a much larger demographic.

Was also said about SWTOR.

Also certain devs on the dev team worked on DAoC so the 3v3 faction pvp will be done right.

This is speculation, not fact.

Remeber also, Diablo 3 sold 6Mil on it’s launch. TESO could easily sell 3 to 4 mil within 1 month or on release of it’s launch.

It certainly could. But I don’t think it will, especially if they do end up going with a subscription model.

Kakeru.2873:

It really is possible.

Nobody is saying TESO being a success isn’t possible. We’re saying it’s too early to tell. Star Wars is a massive name with millions of fans worldwide. That didn’t translate into spectacular long term numbers for SWTOR. Elder Scrolls being popular now doesn’t mean much of anything for their MMO yet, either.

Also, you and your small circle of friends deciding to play the game means nothing in terms of ultimate success.

Arsenal.2601:

“Ruined” is a bit strong for me, but I certainly acknowledge GW2 as being (in my mind) the leader in the genre.

I’m currently playing through Rift to see what the Storm Legion expansion has to offer. Even in a game as exceptionally well made as Rift, full of dynamic events and innovative approaches to grouping (such as instant adventures, invasions and rifts) I find myself wishing it elements of GW2. The game does much to hide the static nature of its combat, but it is static nevertheless.

I enjoyed Rift for about a month. Then I got frustrated trying to get credit for closing Rifts. The high level folks would shut the rifts down in the low level lands to recharge, and all the low levels just wasted time and got zero reward. It also mattered who you were in a party with, although a whole party of low levels couldn’t compete with one high level coming through and closing the rift. I really love the way GW2 handles participation in events, and I really like the level scaling, so that at 80 I can do whatever content I feel like it without completely screwing things up for lower level folks.

I also found the dailies in Rift tedious. For some reason, I don’t feel the same pressure to do dailies that I felt in Rift (or SWTOR for that matter), and I’m not sure why. Maybe because there is only one daily quest in GW2, and I don’t have to wander around chatting up various NPCs to get it. I really like that I know immediately that the daily has reset if I’m logged in.

Must agree, but it’s more the combat system for me than anything else, I tried playing Rift again a few months back and just couldn’t get back into the groove of the static hotkey based combat system.

I do also prefer dynamic events though I think a mix of old-school questing and dynamic events would work best, heart quests really don’t cut it for story-telling.

The only MMOs I can play at the moment are GW2, TERA and I expect Neverwinter when it gets released.

Pandemoniac.4739:

Arsenal.2601:

“Ruined” is a bit strong for me, but I certainly acknowledge GW2 as being (in my mind) the leader in the genre.

I’m currently playing through Rift to see what the Storm Legion expansion has to offer. Even in a game as exceptionally well made as Rift, full of dynamic events and innovative approaches to grouping (such as instant adventures, invasions and rifts) I find myself wishing it elements of GW2. The game does much to hide the static nature of its combat, but it is static nevertheless.

I enjoyed Rift for about a month. Then I got frustrated trying to get credit for closing Rifts. The high level folks would shut the rifts down in the low level lands to recharge, and all the low levels just wasted time and got zero reward. It also mattered who you were in a party with, although a whole party of low levels couldn’t compete with one high level coming through and closing the rift. I really love the way GW2 handles participation in events, and I really like the level scaling, so that at 80 I can do whatever content I feel like it without completely screwing things up for lower level folks.

I also found the dailies in Rift tedious. For some reason, I don’t feel the same pressure to do dailies that I felt in Rift (or SWTOR for that matter), and I’m not sure why. Maybe because there is only one daily quest in GW2, and I don’t have to wander around chatting up various NPCs to get it. I really like that I know immediately that the daily has reset if I’m logged in.

Well …. the exact opposite is true now … although not necessarily for great reasons. I am told everyone is on the new expansion continent, but I’m still a little bit under-leveled to go there and see for myself. Accordingly, the lower/mid level zones are fairly devoid of life – a player here and there from time to time*. So, if you want a rift closed, you’re closing it solo. Since most of the repeatable quests basically revolve around closing rifts and killing creatures spawned from rifts or invasions, one can hit that goal without even trying.

Rift remains a solid game. And Trion is a solid company. The thing is, because of GW2 (and to an extent, TSW and Tera), it feels like a game from a previous generation. The enjoyment I derive from it is that of visiting an old favorite, as opposed to a game where I will invest large amounts of my future time.

*the very lowest level zones containing the free to play players, do have some people.

neverwinter combat is not good imo.

gw2 is almost the best i can wish for in a themepark.
designwise, the only problem i see is how to deal with “zergs and farmers”.

i think a zerg breaks the open world fun & challenge.. dragons are boring, temples too, aoe spamming stuff… cursed shores is almost ridiculous right now when you step into it for the first time; its like “wtf is going on here”.

I agree with the OP. I will never be able to play a MMO again that has an energy source for skills (mana) again. I was a healer in other MMO’s, and healers always had major mana issues. In the games I played atleast. I despised having to decide to not help fighting in a dungeon because I’d run out of mana.

I’ll also never be able to play a MMO again that has no dodge function and makes you stand still when you cast a skill. I was frustrating as a Mage type of player to not be able to kite decently because you had to stand still every now and then and just stand there having the mobs run at you to tear you apart, while waiting for the skill to go off.

This is probably also going to be the first game where I’ll reach level cap, as the grind to level cap in other MMO’s always made me quit somewhere half way (I can’t believe I managed to get half way in a game called Luna Online, where at one point I got 0.01% per six mobs). Here I’m already level 60 and not once I stared at my exp bar frustrated, in this game I’m always like “oh, guess I leveled again”. I don’t even notice it sometimes.

And I ain’t going to be wading through quest logs, having to look for a NPC for a wuest and having to return to that same NPC every single time just to get your reward.

Rieselle.5079:

I liked the model they had in GW1 – basically a single player RPG structure, that you can play multiplayer. (and then esport PvP.)

I dont want “quests.” I want a linear(ish) story, with subquests being optional activities for completionists. (like a JRPG.) And then repeatable skill based content like ranking mode for individual missions, an infinite dungeon of increasing difficulty, etc. And esport PvP.

If GW2 followed that structure, but added the dodging and action based combat (actually GW2 is not actiony enough for me – I want something like Dark Souls, God of War / Devil May Cry, or Dragons Nest), then that would be my ideal game.

(While we’re at it, make the item and loot system singleplayer. You can’t trade or give items or currency in game. Everyone has their own personal economy, and the rarity/prices are scaled to a singleplayer game.
No more bots, no more greed/envy, no more gold sellers.)

Anyways, here’s to hoping someone out there gets it one day.

Sounds like you want Monster Hunter then.

Seveleniumus.5973:

Completely agree with OP, GW2 is imo hands down the best MMO and arguably the best game ever made. You can’t go back to old MMO’s after this.

Agreed because both games focus on your skill with your class/champion, the synergy with teammates, and how skillful your enemy is. From a pvp standpoint exotic gear in GW2 is meant to be easy to acquire so that you get the look you want, while getting the stat combos you’re buidling around so you can get right into doing what you want to do: pvp. So a game that rewards people who spend time mastering their class mechanics as opposed to rewarding someone who wins because the numbers on his gear is better than someone elses because he spent 5 weeks grinding out gear will always have my vote.

I don’t know if TESO will be a success. I’ve always felt that the Elder Scrolls had a system that would translate very well into a MMO setting, but at the same time… Most of the enjoyment I and my friends got from the ES games was from being able to fully immerse ourselves in a massive fantasy world. That sort of immersion just won’t be possible in an MMO; you’ll have players jumping around everywhere, having stupid names like “Capn Jack Sparrow” or “N00bSl@y3r69” or “Xx Legolass xX” (who yes, is also a female elf), or running around town chucking fireballs at shopkeepers for a laugh (and if you CAN’T do that, that kinda ruins part of the fun of the ES games).

Long story short, I enjoy MMOs, but I buy games like Dragon Age or Oblivion for a different kind of experience, and that experience isn’t found in MMOs. If there are many more players like me, TESO isn’t likely to be a game that will keep our interest.

Zaxares.5419:

I don’t know if TESO will be a success. I’ve always felt that the Elder Scrolls had a system that would translate very well into a MMO setting, but at the same time… Most of the enjoyment I and my friends got from the ES games was from being able to fully immerse ourselves in a massive fantasy world. That sort of immersion just won’t be possible in an MMO; you’ll have players jumping around everywhere, having stupid names like “Capn Jack Sparrow” or “N00bSl@y3r69” or “Xx Legolass xX” (who yes, is also a female elf),

Those kind of names hinder immersion in any game IMHO.

Zaxares.5419:

I don’t know if TESO will be a success. I’ve always felt that the Elder Scrolls had a system that would translate very well into a MMO setting, but at the same time… Most of the enjoyment I and my friends got from the ES games was from being able to fully immerse ourselves in a massive fantasy world. That sort of immersion just won’t be possible in an MMO; you’ll have players jumping around everywhere, having stupid names like “Capn Jack Sparrow” or “N00bSl@y3r69” or “Xx Legolass xX” (who yes, is also a female elf), or running around town chucking fireballs at shopkeepers for a laugh (and if you CAN’T do that, that kinda ruins part of the fun of the ES games).

Long story short, I enjoy MMOs, but I buy games like Dragon Age or Oblivion for a different kind of experience, and that experience isn’t found in MMOs. If there are many more players like me, TESO isn’t likely to be a game that will keep our interest.

Or poplolita… oh wait