Guild Wars 2

I thought this would be a joke post, something about gear being traded around until you get the best one, but it’s just a typo =(

Anyways, yeah, Fractals is their shot at a gear treadmill because some people enjoy it, and although I don’t (played too much hardcore WoW already), I don’t like being forced to do it for the stuff I’d like to do.

Such as completing my monthly.
Or getting the best gear for WvW.

Reaver.9256:

Sylosi.6503:

Eladriel.7295:

How many times has Anet told you people that you will not get another tier of gear aside the ascended gear? Do they have to continue til they are blue in the face to get it through that thick head of yours that The ascendant gear is the only tier you will get?

Anet spent years promoting the game on horizontal progression, that progression would be cosmetic only and that a player would not be “less powerful” if they chose not to follow that progression, that the game would have no treadmill and was the “non -mmo” MMO, that the game would only be released when it was ready (LOL) etc, so they’ve already broken their pre-game philosophy, so Anet’s word they won; tbreak it further does not mean much, which part of that are you having difficulty getting through your own thick head?

They maybe promoted it to YOU that way, but I can assure you 100% they did not promote it to ME that way. From day one they promoted a game to me that would be a MMO and be played like one with no subscription fee. If I would have though for a second that it’d be like GW1 with that drab progression system(and not an mmo) I would have never came near it. I knew from the first time I read the announcement in pcgamer that it’d have stat progression and higher levels.

They promoted it that way in many videos / interviews / blog posts, they specifically stated it would not have a treadmill, that the progression would be optional, that people who did not choose to do that progression would not be “less powerful”, etc., the “non-mmo” MMO was their phrase not mine, they also spent years repeating “when it’s ready”, then released a half finsihed product that clearly was anything but ready, hence why many people don’t give Anet’s word much credence.

Anet has changed its course with GW2 a lot of times during previous development and today. I can’t wait to have my heart ripped out by not ever introducing Cantha in the GW2 world.

Sylosi.6503:

Reaver.9256:

Sylosi.6503:

Eladriel.7295:

How many times has Anet told you people that you will not get another tier of gear aside the ascended gear? Do they have to continue til they are blue in the face to get it through that thick head of yours that The ascendant gear is the only tier you will get?

Anet spent years promoting the game on horizontal progression, that progression would be cosmetic only and that a player would not be “less powerful” if they chose not to follow that progression, that the game would have no treadmill and was the “non -mmo” MMO, that the game would only be released when it was ready (LOL) etc, so they’ve already broken their pre-game philosophy, so Anet’s word they won; tbreak it further does not mean much, which part of that are you having difficulty getting through your own thick head?

They maybe promoted it to YOU that way, but I can assure you 100% they did not promote it to ME that way. From day one they promoted a game to me that would be a MMO and be played like one with no subscription fee. If I would have though for a second that it’d be like GW1 with that drab progression system(and not an mmo) I would have never came near it. I knew from the first time I read the announcement in pcgamer that it’d have stat progression and higher levels.

They promoted it that way in many videos / interviews / blog posts, they specifically stated it would not have a treadmill, that the progression would be optional, that people who did not choose to do that progression would not be “less powerful”, etc., the “non-mmo” MMO was their phrase not mine, they also spent years repeating “when it’s ready”, then released a half finsihed product that clearly was anything but ready, hence why many people don’t give Anet’s word much credence.

Sounds like we read and heard different things then. Also sounds like we’re playing different versions of the same game because I can assure you that I received a product that wasn’t “half finished”.

Reaver.9256:

Also sounds like we’re playing different versions of the same game because I can assure you that I received a product that wasn’t “half finished”.

So you find the statement that Ascended should have been in at release to be a pile of dog kitten as well?

Reaver.9256:

Sylosi.6503:

They promoted it that way in many videos / interviews / blog posts, they specifically stated it would not have a treadmill, that the progression would be optional, that people who did not choose to do that progression would not be “less powerful”, etc., the “non-mmo” MMO was their phrase not mine, they also spent years repeating “when it’s ready”, then released a half finsihed product that clearly was anything but ready, hence why many people don’t give Anet’s word much credence.

Sounds like we read and heard different things then. Also sounds like we’re playing different versions of the same game because I can assure you that I received a product that wasn’t “half finished”.

I watched / read things like this:

“We don’t need to make mandatory gear treadmills, we make all of it optional, so those who find it fun to chase this prestigious gear can do so, but those who don’t are just as powerful and get to have fun too.”

That was in a blog from their lead dev, this statement was true at release, when they introduced ascended gear it became a lie, if someone wants their character to be “just as powerful” they now have to hop on the treadmill and get ascended gear.

They also promoted the game on “play it how you want”, so the introduction of ascended gear broke that philosophy too when they rushed it in and it was only available if “play how you want” happened to coincide with playing dungeons. Which in turn broke yet another pre-release claim, their much repeated “when it’s ready”, instead of which they rushed it in.

In regard to half finished, you must have got the special copy of the game, mine had more bugs than any other MMO I’ve played at launch, hundreds of DE bugged, pages and pages and pages of class traits / skill bugs, a total lack of e-sport features on a game they promoted as an e-sport, etc.

But anyway the point isn’t you didn’t see / read these things, it is many of us did, hence don’t have much faith in Anet’s word.

Ansultares.1567:

Reaver.9256:

Also sounds like we’re playing different versions of the same game because I can assure you that I received a product that wasn’t “half finished”.

So you find the statement that Ascended should have been in at release to be a pile of dog kitten as well?

huh? I don’t care when they put it in.

Sylosi.6503:

a total lack of e-sport features on a game they promoted as an e-sport, etc.

What ever happened to that?

I mean, they’ve totally abandoned any pretense of chasing e-sport status, as far as I can tell.

But all you really need to qualify as an e-sport is 1) PvP, and 2) enough activity such that e-sport sponsors are interested. Any other qualifications are pointless, because they’ll be readily overlooked provided the game has a large enough PvP community.

Did we get gear progression because the PvP community so readily bailed on this game?

Reaver.9256:

huh? I don’t care when they put it in.

So was the game unfinished, or is Ascended just the last minute hack job some of us recognize it to be?

Because the quote I read suggested that they intended to have it in at release, so either they’re lying to cover their kitten (most likely) or the game was unfinished at release.

Ansultares.1567:

Sylosi.6503:

a total lack of e-sport features on a game they promoted as an e-sport, etc.

What ever happened to that?

I mean, they’ve totally abandoned any pretense of chasing e-sport status, as far as I can tell.

But all you really need to qualify as an e-sport is 1) PvP, and 2) enough activity such that e-sport sponsors are interested. Any other qualifications are pointless, because they’ll be readily overlooked provided the game has a large enough PvP community.

Did we get gear progression because the PvP community so readily bailed on this game?

Reaver.9256:

huh? I don’t care when they put it in.

So was the game unfinished, or is Ascended just the last minute hack job some of us recognize it to be?

Because the quote I read suggested that they intended to have it in at release, so either they’re lying to cover their kitten (most likely) or the game was unfinished at release.

I would hate to have a 100% finished MMO at release. I don’t know anyone who would play it knowing stuff would never be added to it again. Might as well play a single player game if you want a start and finish. MMOs are meant to be added too and I don’t know of ONE that is still going and is complete today.

Ansultares.1567:

So was the game unfinished, or is Ascended just the last minute hack job some of us recognize it to be?

Because the quote I read suggested that they intended to have it in at release, so either they’re lying to cover their kitten (most likely) or the game was unfinished at release.

What most probably happened was that they had one part of the Lost Shores patch ready, but not the other. Either the dungeon wasn’t ready, or the agony resistance mechanic buggy, who knows. Judging from how empty SCove is, my money is on unfinished maps/dungeon.

Narkosys.5173:

Now is the time for the fanboi rally – Tally ho all

^ The hallmark of a post based on a poor premise. Can’t back up what you said? Can’t articulate a compelling argument? Everyone who disagrees must be a fanboy!

This entire argument proves my point early on. This community is split. There are those that love grinding, and other that would like to be reasonable and others who hate it.

There are ways to make all 3 crowds happy.

1. Stat grind -there needs to a fix so people are not grinding their lives away to get the stats they want -this includes the new ‘ascended’ gear grind.

2. (to balance the above) more costmetic skins! Put a few ‘rare’ drops in dungeons for skins (that have no superior stats to others). People who love grinding will happily try to their hearts content to get these skins. You can also apply this to certian champions that apppear throughout Tyria. Now people who love to grind can camp these bosses and get their rare skins and be happey with them. Also these provide wonderful goldskins.

3. Dungeons -the amount of time to get a full set of armor is silly. Cut the requirments in half or refix the who 60 tokens then 20 tokens ideology with sill cutting the amount of tokens need instead of half by a quarter.

4. Legendaries -these need to be ajusted for everyone. Generally the time it takes to get one is outrageous. I’m not saying make it easy but cut the time by a 1/4 at the very least. Even then for most people who can’t play around 3-6 hours a day it will still take a year or more.

These are only a few suggestions. But if they were implemented (which could easily be done) everyone is happy and no one is annoyed anymore.

If they had not made the ascended gear have higher stats I would say that the naysayers are correct but they did. That means it has better stats then the exotic, that means it’s a higher tier.

It’s poor opinion on the part of the naysayers to claim that those stat points won’t give people a particular advantage because even if it were only 5 points of vitality per piece that’s ten pieces which adds up to alot of vitality. It’s called math I do hope people are familiar with that concept of addition before they come on here claiming everything is perfectly fine.

I’ve posted this image before but apparently people need a reminder. This is exactly what’s wrong with ascended gear and people are lying when they are saying these stats don’t effect combat in any way.

Even people who simply do pve exploration or open world events would benefit from these higher scores.

NOW if they left the stats at exotic level but gave them an agony resistance….that’s completely different, they would no longer be higher tier gear to grind for.

There’s always going to be some form of gear treadmill. Going from rare to exotic is in itself a gear treadmill.

But if GW2’s treadmill is enough for you to say it’s a treadmill in the relative sense, clearly you haven’t played another MMO.

MRA.4758:

Patrikan Habaton.2548:

I ever since was a defender that gw2 is not that kind of game, since fractals were released I told ppl that it’s not since you don’t need any ar to get to lvl 80 (I’m there so don’t argue about that if it’s possible or not ) But after the update the game changed to what the dev stated now. I really think this is a bad direction the game takes and I’m as a former gw1 fan dissapointed and afraid that it goes in this direction.

You don’t enjoy the agony resistance treadmill of the fractals? Then just don’t visits fractals of level 10 and beyond, and enjoy the plenty of gaming content that GW2 has to offer and that is completely unrelated to agony resistance, instead.

Problem solved, you are welcome.

Now, can someone please proceed and close this thread, since it is as non-constructive as its 157.623 clones before? Thanks.

~MRA

I will totally agree with you when the rest of the game gets the same reward content that Fotm enjoys.

If Fotm is designed to be optional as you say i expect the optional part i play to have the same rewards drop and quantity, that you currently enjoy, not just ascended crap, rares, exotics, T6, Lodestones, until that happens i don’t Agree, the dungeon isn’t optional at all, we are forced there to get anything to make money to progress through the current treadmill..

UnderdogSMO.9428:

Red Falcon.8257:

Vayne.8563:

Funny, I know a lot of really good WvWers who don’t think they need those stats to remain competitive. One of you is obviously wrong.

My money is on you.

I’m actually one of those too and agree that stats dont matter a lot.
Infact in WvW there are some diminishing returns on stats, i.e. your attack stats is scaled down (I have 4000 attack in PvE but only 3600 in WvW).

Still does not change the fact that gear treadmills affect WvW overall performance, nor the fact this game was touted as treadmill-free.
The game is great but this does not prevent me from being objective and noticing when the game is being turned into a wow clone (treadmills, fetch quests dailies, and soon to come wow-esque rated arenas).

I think you need to ask yourself what of this content is WOW and whats just RPG?

at its core this game is still an RPG so it has RPG things ((hell Elder scrolls game’s are just a sieries of fetch quest))

its how there handling all the elements of this content (treadmills, fetch quests dailies, and arenas) that’s setting this game apart, not that there is a lack of it or not.

Plenty of RPGs have vertical progression of some kind. The difference between a gear treadmill and having some vertical progression is whether or not the game locks you out of content because you don’t have gear. Guild Wars 2 doesn’t. And it’s not a treadmill if they don’t keep introducing new sets of gear, like every six months.

Long term goals don’t make a gear treadmill. Making your gear worthless after six months does. My gear, so far, isn’t worthless. I can still do all the content in the game, so no content gating. Higher level fractals are sorta gated, except that you can do every fractal and enjoy it without ever needed the gear from the fractals. I know because I have. I even got all the fractal achievements bar one, without owning a single piece of ascended gear.

A gear treadmill means you have to go for the next gear after you go for this gear. But since Anet said that Legendary Weapons will always be top stats, no matter what, that means you don’t have a gear treadmill for weapons at all, since once you get one, it’s done.

What you have in Guild Wars 2 is bad RNG to get BIS gear. That I can agree with. I don’t like that system. But calling it a gear treadmill is simple incorrect.

More, since we don’t know how this gear will be obtainable in the future, we don’t know if it will become a gear treadmill. At the moment it is not. You can’t get off a treadmill…that’s the point.

Last point, the game LAUNCHED with vertical progression and everyone ignores it. Once you hit 80, you have golds and you have exotics. They’re both level 80 gear, but they have different stats. That IS vertical progression. It was there and no one had a problem. The problem is Anet added a level of gear between legendary and exotic, but let me ask you this.

What if they’re right and it was actually needed. What if they miscalculated the amount of people who would work for a solely cosmetic upgrade, and the amount of people who wouldn’t get a legendary at all, because it was too daunting. This tier of gear was necessary. It should have been in the game from the start.

And if it had, no one would be saying a single word about vertical progression. I know this, because no one said it about exotics.

If it were up to you guys you’d all be standing around in the best in slot gear after one week of game play. Then what would you complain about?

tigirius.9014:

If they had not made the ascended gear have higher stats I would say that the naysayers are correct but they did. That means it has better stats then the exotic, that means it’s a higher tier.

It’s poor opinion on the part of the naysayers to claim that those stat points won’t give people a particular advantage because even if it were only 5 points of vitality per piece that’s ten pieces which adds up to alot of vitality. It’s called math I do hope people are familiar with that concept of addition before they come on here claiming everything is perfectly fine.

I’ve posted this image before but apparently people need a reminder. This is exactly what’s wrong with ascended gear and people are lying when they are saying these stats don’t effect combat in any way.

Even people who simply do pve exploration or open world events would benefit from these higher scores.

NOW if they left the stats at exotic level but gave them an agony resistance….that’s completely different, they would no longer be higher tier gear to grind for.

Common sense exists in this forum?! IMPOSSIBLE!

You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action. The big problem with most of the mmorpg forms is that ppl only part-lee understand what they are saying when they use buzz words. They can only tell you a small part of the idea and try to use it to label something that they see has that small part in it too. We could label the person story as a type of trademill but its not a true one just only bits of it are like a true trademill.

At this point is just ppl adding in buzz words to make an argument seem more then it truly is.

Jski.6180:

You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action. The big problem with most of the mmorpg forms is that ppl only part-lee understand what they are saying when they use buzz words. They can only tell you a small part of the idea and try to use it to label something that they see has that small part in it too. We could label the person story as a type of trademill but its not a true one just only bits of it are like a true trademill.

At this point is just ppl adding in buzz words to make an argument seem more then it truly is.

Your argument when a merry-go-round fallacy type. You essentially used the same information twice trying to confuse the viewer as if you brought new information to the table.

And to finish I ask everyone who is against How long do you play everyday? 3, 5 hours? Since my day even if I tried wouldn’t allow it.

Revolution.6301:

Jski.6180:

You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action. The big problem with most of the mmorpg forms is that ppl only part-lee understand what they are saying when they use buzz words. They can only tell you a small part of the idea and try to use it to label something that they see has that small part in it too. We could label the person story as a type of trademill but its not a true one just only bits of it are like a true trademill.

At this point is just ppl adding in buzz words to make an argument seem more then it truly is.

Your argument when a merry-go-round fallacy type. You essentially used the same information twice trying to confuse the viewer as if you brought new information to the table.

And to finish I ask everyone who is against How long do you play everyday? 3, 5 hours? Since my day even if I tried wouldn’t allow it.

So your best counter argument is the say my is flawed but not saying why its flawed? I gave you a reason.

“And” fractal just to get the gear should not take much longer then 1hr a day and now with the new ways to get rings and necks should only take at worst 30 mins a day for the stander daily run.

There ARE things you can do to make thing easier to get but ppl are instead going out of there way to post why they cant do it on the forms vs just simply doing it.

Jski.6180:

Revolution.6301:

Jski.6180:

You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action. The big problem with most of the mmorpg forms is that ppl only part-lee understand what they are saying when they use buzz words. They can only tell you a small part of the idea and try to use it to label something that they see has that small part in it too. We could label the person story as a type of trademill but its not a true one just only bits of it are like a true trademill.

At this point is just ppl adding in buzz words to make an argument seem more then it truly is.

Your argument when a merry-go-round fallacy type. You essentially used the same information twice trying to confuse the viewer as if you brought new information to the table.

And to finish I ask everyone who is against How long do you play everyday? 3, 5 hours? Since my day even if I tried wouldn’t allow it.

So your best counter argument is the say my is flawed but not saying why its flawed? I gave you a reason.

“And” fractal just to get the gear should not take much longer then 1hr a day and now with the new ways to get rings and necks should only take at worst 30 mins a day for the stander daily run.

There ARE things you can do to make thing easier to get but ppl are instead going out of there way to post why they cant do it on the forms vs just simply doing it.

Here here is 1 flaw.
“You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action.”

Okay fine I will tell you.
First off tell me how this is logically sound or valid. You can’t since its neither nor.

Revolution.6301:

Jski.6180:

Revolution.6301:

Jski.6180:

You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action. The big problem with most of the mmorpg forms is that ppl only part-lee understand what they are saying when they use buzz words. They can only tell you a small part of the idea and try to use it to label something that they see has that small part in it too. We could label the person story as a type of trademill but its not a true one just only bits of it are like a true trademill.

At this point is just ppl adding in buzz words to make an argument seem more then it truly is.

Your argument when a merry-go-round fallacy type. You essentially used the same information twice trying to confuse the viewer as if you brought new information to the table.

And to finish I ask everyone who is against How long do you play everyday? 3, 5 hours? Since my day even if I tried wouldn’t allow it.

So your best counter argument is the say my is flawed but not saying why its flawed? I gave you a reason.

“And” fractal just to get the gear should not take much longer then 1hr a day and now with the new ways to get rings and necks should only take at worst 30 mins a day for the stander daily run.

There ARE things you can do to make thing easier to get but ppl are instead going out of there way to post why they cant do it on the forms vs just simply doing it.

Here here is 1 flaw.
“You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action.”

Okay fine I will tell you.
First off tell me how this is logically sound or valid. You can’t since its neither nor.

I see your point of view i think your argument as ran its cores.

Point being that this game has not hit a trademill for gear this comes up every few weeks and nothing every comes of it. The major thing that every one must deal with is that there is no stopping any of this set from coming out so i am not sure what the goal is here.

Its one tier of gear that’s really not overwhelmingly more powerful than the last with alternate options to aquire it being implemented.

I honestly found Borderlands 2 single player action/rpg more of a gear treadmill.

Compare it to WoW where your starter welfare epics were so far removed from the raid gear that you would have to farm lesser raids every week praying for a drop before you could experience the end game.

The only restricting mechanic is AR which is needed beyond lvl 10 fractals, however you can experience all of the content without it in the same gear you crafted/bought the day you hit 80.

It’s all in your head.

Jski.6180:

Revolution.6301:

Jski.6180:

Revolution.6301:

Jski.6180:

You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action. The big problem with most of the mmorpg forms is that ppl only part-lee understand what they are saying when they use buzz words. They can only tell you a small part of the idea and try to use it to label something that they see has that small part in it too. We could label the person story as a type of trademill but its not a true one just only bits of it are like a true trademill.

At this point is just ppl adding in buzz words to make an argument seem more then it truly is.

Your argument when a merry-go-round fallacy type. You essentially used the same information twice trying to confuse the viewer as if you brought new information to the table.

And to finish I ask everyone who is against How long do you play everyday? 3, 5 hours? Since my day even if I tried wouldn’t allow it.

So your best counter argument is the say my is flawed but not saying why its flawed? I gave you a reason.

“And” fractal just to get the gear should not take much longer then 1hr a day and now with the new ways to get rings and necks should only take at worst 30 mins a day for the stander daily run.

There ARE things you can do to make thing easier to get but ppl are instead going out of there way to post why they cant do it on the forms vs just simply doing it.

Here here is 1 flaw.
“You can only call it a true geartrademill when there is more then one new set as things stand there is no trademill unless you think a one step is a trademill action.”

Okay fine I will tell you.
First off tell me how this is logically sound or valid. You can’t since its neither nor.

I see your point of view i think your argument as ran its cores.

Point being that this game has not hit a trademill for gear this comes up every few weeks and nothing every comes of it. The major thing that every one must deal with is that there is no stopping any of this set from coming out so i am not sure what the goal is here.

Ran its cores? Ran its coures I’m assuming. Do not dimiss my argument. I realized what you did there and that is another logical fallacy if I may add. If you truly believe this thread has no point then don’t comment. Simple.

Reloading.3260:

Its one tier of gear that’s really not overwhelmingly more powerful than the last with alternate options to aquire it being implemented.

I honestly found Borderlands 2 single player action/rpg more of a gear treadmill.

Compare it to WoW where your starter welfare epics were so far removed from the raid gear that you would have to farm lesser raids every week praying for a drop before you could experience the end game.

The only restricting mechanic is AR which is needed beyond lvl 10 fractals, however you can experience all of the content without it in the same gear you crafted/bought the day you hit 80.

It’s all in your head.

You’d have to be ingornant of this game to not see an issue Or you play 3 – 5 hours a day and yeah I guess for those that have that much time its not an issue at all. But for those of us who have a life outside of this game it is. And WE were the targeted market not you, check any interview with Anet and we were who they were targetting.

And stop comparing this to WoW. Its like comparing apples and oranges -redundent and silly.

Casual players should be happy with casual rewards. The reason this game is good for casual players is because A) you’re not barred from content by not having ascended gear (except for the one place ascended gear drops which is fine), and the stat difference is minimal. You don’t NEED ascended gear, as much as you want it.

Anet is trying to give everyone something. They gave something for the grinders without breaking the rest of the game. The big open casual world is still there. All the dungeons, still there. WvW is still there. SPvP is still there. None of it has changed except in the minds of those who think they can’t play without this crap.

The persistent world is easy enough were you can do it in greens. I’m pretty sure most dungeons can be done in greens, but if not, golds for sure. You can do fine in WvW without having ascended gear. This is a storm in a teacup. People want it because they want it…but they don’t NEED it.

And so the game remains casual friendly. If you think it doesn’t, you’re focusing on the wrong thing.

Revolution.6301:

Reloading.3260:

Its one tier of gear that’s really not overwhelmingly more powerful than the last with alternate options to aquire it being implemented.

I honestly found Borderlands 2 single player action/rpg more of a gear treadmill.

Compare it to WoW where your starter welfare epics were so far removed from the raid gear that you would have to farm lesser raids every week praying for a drop before you could experience the end game.

The only restricting mechanic is AR which is needed beyond lvl 10 fractals, however you can experience all of the content without it in the same gear you crafted/bought the day you hit 80.

It’s all in your head.

You’d have to be ingornant of this game to not see an issue Or you play 3 – 5 hours a day and yeah I guess for those that have that much time its not an issue at all. But for those of us who have a life outside of this game it is. And WE were the targeted market not you, check any interview with Anet and we were who they were targetting.

And stop comparing this to WoW. Its like comparing apples and oranges -redundent and silly.

See what issue exactly? When I finish leveling up a character I’ve made enough to outfit him in exotics which provide me with the max stats available in the game except for accessories. Are you trying to tell me that ascended gear provides such a huge advantage over exotics outside of fractals that it’s prohibiting your style of gameplay? Or are you actually incapable of outfitting yourself in exotics in the first place?

Comparing gw2 which has been claimed to be a gear treadmill game to a true gear treadmill game is in no way redundant. Stop being silly.

Revolution.6301:

Ran its cores? Ran its coures I’m assuming. Do not dimiss my argument. I realized what you did there and that is another logical fallacy if I may add. If you truly believe this thread has no point then don’t comment. Simple.

Ran its coures? Ran its course I’m assuming. Do not dismiss anyones argument.

You just realized that?

It has always been a gear threadmill when Ascended Gear was introduced.

Reloading.3260:

Revolution.6301:

Ran its cores? Ran its coures I’m assuming. Do not dimiss my argument. I realized what you did there and that is another logical fallacy if I may add. If you truly believe this thread has no point then don’t comment. Simple.

Ran its coures? Ran its course I’m assuming. Do not dismiss anyones argument.

nice attempt there but I didn’t dimiss anyones argument? Failed comback.
Try again sir.

Revolution.6301:

nice attempt there but I didn’t dimiss anyones argument? Failed comback.
Try again sir.

Failed comback? Failed comeback I’m assuming.

So I think the community as a whole would like to know if Anet is going to do somthing about this.

So do you think ascended gear should be removed?

Revolution.6301:

So do you think ascended gear should be removed?

No. People have invested time into getting them, and they won’t be happy if they’re gone.

Well the stat gains, and in exchange make them easier to get.

Revolution.6301:

Well the stat gains, and in exchange make them easier to get.

They’re already working on this. Some people really are just too impatient.

Heijincks.9267:

Revolution.6301:

Well the stat gains, and in exchange make them easier to get.

They’re already working on this. Some people really are just too impatient.

How? Have they already stated this? I hope your right just where did you get that information?

Laundrels is terrible really if that is them working at it.

Revolution.6301:

Heijincks.9267:

Revolution.6301:

Well the stat gains, and in exchange make them easier to get.

They’re already working on this. Some people really are just too impatient.

How? Have they already stated this? I hope your right just where did you get that information?

Laundrels is terrible really if that is them working at it.

It’s emphasized hundreds of times over if you’ve been paying attention to what ANet’s been saying. Laurels isn’t even the end of it.

Is the ascended issue bothering you that much? For every post related to grind or ascended you seem to be quite involved.

Of course GW2 has a gear treadmill, it’s where they went horribly wrong. They shouldn’t have tried to cater to everyone, they should’ve stuck to their original philosophy that they seemed so proud of pre-release. If they did that, at least they would have a strong core of players. Instead they decided to broaden their market, thus kitten off those that bought into the manifesto. Now we are left with a game that has no real direction. They lost their focus.

They could’ve quite easily introduced ascended gear, but without the extra stats. They may be minimal, but I ask why have those extra stats at all? They want you chasing that carrot, but that’s not what I and many bought the game for. It was marketed as not having a carrot, no more senseless grind. Unfortunately somewhere along the line they changed their mind.

LOCO.1785:

Of course GW2 has a gear treadmill, it’s where they went horribly wrong. They shouldn’t have tried to cater to everyone, they should’ve stuck to their original philosophy that they seemed so proud of pre-release. If they did that, at least they would have a strong core of players. Instead they decided to broaden their market, thus kitten off those that bought into the manifesto. Now we are left with a game that has no real direction. They lost their focus.

They could’ve quite easily introduced ascended gear, but without the extra stats. They may be minimal, but I ask why have those extra stats at all? They want you chasing that carrot, but that’s not what I and many bought the game for. It was marketed as not having a carrot, no more senseless grind. Unfortunately somewhere along the line they changed their mind.

So, where in the manifesto does it say they won’t have gear grind. Quote please.

Heijincks.9267:

Revolution.6301:

Heijincks.9267:

Revolution.6301:

Well the stat gains, and in exchange make them easier to get.

They’re already working on this. Some people really are just too impatient.

How? Have they already stated this? I hope your right just where did you get that information?

Laundrels is terrible really if that is them working at it.

It’s emphasized hundreds of times over if you’ve been paying attention to what ANet’s been saying. Laurels isn’t even the end of it.

Is the ascended issue bothering you that much? For every post related to grind or ascended you seem to be quite involved.

Well the thing is, I enjoyed GuildWars2 immensely while getting to 80. I will admit thought the story was so terrible but the heart questions and overall look of the game struck a cord called enjoying an mmo.

Then after 80 suddently I realized I needed exotic which is fine but I began to grind and grind but then school started to take up time then I realized it would take me quite some time just to get lv 80 gear that is properly stated and runes (rings + jewlery included).

Then I learned about FOTM which was great. Tried one run with an okay group took me TWO hours. Basically I can’t do FOTM since I don’t have 2 straight hours to blow just on that. I don’t mind an hour or less though but 2 seriously?

Then the fact that I was going to be out stated occured. I know I will probably take forever to get a nice skin which is FINE (same thing with Gw1) but stats really?

Thats why I am involved because I was told that the game was going to be tailored to people like me who have a life but enjoy a good mmo to play.

@Revolution

Fotm doesn’t take 2hrs, or at least its not supposed to. The only long ones are the cliffside and the dredge. Fracs generally are shorter than dungeon runs (except cof path 1). I understand your concern, but as someone with only 1 ring (a ring with stats diff from my build so I won’t use them outside fotm anyway), I don’t feel that underpowered in other content like wvw or pve or dungeons. Actually if you still haven’t gotten your exotic trinkets yet, this is gonna be a good time for you to get your ascended rings (you can run fractals with masterwork trinkets no problem). This way, you won’t have to shell out cash for it only for it to be replaced.

Sorry, with the gear grind comment I was referring to an article that first caught my interest

Quote from Mike O’Brien:
“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.”

Article: http://venturebeat.com/2012/05/21/guild-wars-2-interview-monetization/#s:guildwars2-16

It’s been so long, I forgot where I saw it originally. In any case, t’was all marketing hype. It read to me as horizontal progression. Sure there may be gear grind, but you were grinding for a better visual, not better stats.

We can assume that they’ll eventually add a new tier of gear in 2014. If content remains un-gated (You don’t need to run Arah 50 times to be able to do Fractals) i don’t see the issue. It’s only a slight issue in WvW.

Heijincks.9267:

Revolution.6301:

So do you think ascended gear should be removed?

No. People have invested time into getting them, and they won’t be happy if they’re gone.

They won’t be happy after level cap raise or new better eq introduction either, and at least one of those (likely both) is already considered. I see no difference here.

Astralporing.1957:

Heijincks.9267:

Revolution.6301:

So do you think ascended gear should be removed?

No. People have invested time into getting them, and they won’t be happy if they’re gone.

They won’t be happy after level cap raise or new better eq introduction either, and at least one of those (likely both) is already considered. I see no difference here.

Level cap is likely raised through expansions which is fine. Introduction of better than ascended isn’t guaranteed, and if it is happening we don’t know in what circumstances they’d be introduced either, plus it’s certainly not happening in 2013.

The cynicism on this forum…

Heijincks.9267:

Introduction of better than ascended isn’t guaranteed

I’m basing my expectations on dev info, in which they clearly said that they are going to continue forward with “item progression” (including such things as adding items with increased stats within already existing tiers, for example). And 2014 is, interesingly enough, the moment just after all ascended eq will be released (so, we can expect it to be obsoleted as soon as a month after you complete the full set).

And i didn’t start as cynical – my attitude changed as a result of things happening in this game since release. In fact, i’m still afraid that i’m not cynical enough.

LOCO.1785:

Sorry, with the gear grind comment I was referring to an article that first caught my interest

Quote from Mike O’Brien:
“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.”

Article: http://venturebeat.com/2012/05/21/guild-wars-2-interview-monetization/#s:guildwars2-16

It’s been so long, I forgot where I saw it originally. In any case, t’was all marketing hype. It read to me as horizontal progression. Sure there may be gear grind, but you were grinding for a better visual, not better stats.

Right, my point is it was one line, in one interview. I think there was a second line somewhere. Dozens of things have been changed in this game since then. People keep saying Anet went against their manifesto. They didn’t. They said one thing in an interview, with one guy, and that in essence is the problem.

So what would you do. Anet had a game with exotics being easy to get. They saw people not going after lengendaries, the grind was too long. And you have a TON of people who came to this game who wouldn’t go for cosmetic gear unless there was SOME stat increase. You’d do what they did. You’d compromise.

You give people a single dungeon to grind. You’d keep the main damage to that dungeon, and you’d make the stat upgrade really really minor, which it is. It’s a compromise. It wasn’t their original idea. Big deal. But so many things have changed since this game was annouced.

They announced energy potions and then changed it so the game had no energy. They talked about energy potions endlessly, trying to sell us on the idea. Until they did away with energy. And no one said word one because they liked it.

This was a change they didn’t like and suddenly everyone is saying that they went against their manifesto. No. They didn’t. They changed a single aspect of the game to appeal to a certain type of player, while trying to affect everyone else as minimally as possible.

One line in an interview in an MMO, a game type that changes constantly isn’t a betrayal, or even going back on your word…because I’m sure when that was said that the dev who said it believed it could work. And then they found it wouldn’t.

The only thing going on here is that fans are seeing this as a precusor (pun intended) to a full blow gear grind, and it’s not. It’s Anet making a compromise to try to keep the larger number of players. It’s a sound business decision.

LOCO.1785:

Sorry, with the gear grind comment I was referring to an article that first caught my interest

Quote from Mike O’Brien:
“Here’s what we believe: If someone wants to play for a thousand hours to get an item that is so rare that other players can’t realistically acquire it, that rare item should be differentiated by its visual appearance and rarity alone, not by being more powerful than everything else in the game. Otherwise, your MMO becomes all about grinding to get the best gear. We don’t make grindy games — we leave the grind to other MMOs.”

Article: http://venturebeat.com/2012/05/21/guild-wars-2-interview-monetization/#s:guildwars2-16

It’s been so long, I forgot where I saw it originally. In any case, t’was all marketing hype. It read to me as horizontal progression. Sure there may be gear grind, but you were grinding for a better visual, not better stats.

Thay may still believe that but at the end of the day there still a business and there in it to make a profit. You may believe that people like you who want only horizontal are the majority but thats just not true.

As is Anet is trying to compromise, giveing us new tears of gear but without forceing us to have them in order to do content. At a slow rate with minnamul stat jump. NO other mmo dose it this way.