Leather Farm

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Posted by: Justine.6351

Justine.6351

The whole point of the leather farm is to ensure players always have a reliable way to focus on acquiring leather without turning to the trading post. Not to make people rich by selling it, not to reduce trading post prices. I don’t get why people keep bringing up how expensive leather still is or how it is cost ineffective to promote t5 to t6.

I remember my very first exotic berserker armor I crafted near launch. Farmed minotaurs at Arundon Waypoint area and converted the t5 blood to t6. Salvaged my own ecto and mined my own orichalcum aswell. Didn’t have a trading post. The cost of the materials were irrelevant.

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Posted by: Ider.1276

Ider.1276

The whole point of the leather farm is to ensure players always have a reliable way to focus on acquiring leather without turning to the trading post.

And it fails it that way. You can get as much (or even more) hardened leather just by playing Silverwastes or other 80 lvl meta maps. You can get far more hardend leather by running around frozen chests in Bitterfrost. But that amounts are still not enough. Because recipe requirements are bonkers.
I don’t understand how can’t you see the problem. The problem is that Anet artificially overhyped the hardened leather. Since HoT start they cut all its the income and raised to ridiculous levels its requirements (gossamer patches are not gossamer anymore, they are hardened leather patches). I am not against exotic/ascended craft being expencive. But why leather is the only T6 that is valuable? Orichalcum, gossamer are trash with nearly zero rarity and vendor prices. Ancient wood is a little above the latter two T6 mats. And Anet tries to compencate it with obnoxious leather T6 rarity/prices.

(edited by Ider.1276)

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

Leather farm is simply that … a place to farm leather. It’s for players that want to play a challenging area that gives them leather. No more, no less. If that’s a losing proposition to you, then you can go back to doing what you did before for leather. It’s just another option. Anyone that thinks more into it that this is unrealistic.

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Posted by: Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

Personally, i don’t see why they added this. Simpler solution is just playing with the crafting tables again. All leather used to be 2 to make 1. Thick is now what 4 to make 1 and hardened 3 to make 1? They can just reset those #’s for a time, much like they did with soft wood. That used to be 2 logs per plank, then to 4, then to 3, then back to 2. In another 6 months or so watch it go back up to 3 or 4 logs per plank. They can do the same with leather. Would avoid the “need” to really farm it or spend hours to farm for minimal gain.

Changing the crafting tables is a ‘hard solution’ — it’s always the same. Adding a challenging leather farm is a a ‘soft solution’ — it becomes worth the effort/boredom if the price is right.

Since the economy is driven by human supply and demand, it’s largely “better” to have a dynamic solution — such as a farm — so that the supply can adjust itself it to the demand.

Given that someone has described it as precisely as easy (and dull) as labyrinth farming, it seems as if this is appropriate for the situation.

John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”

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Posted by: Tumult.2578

Tumult.2578

The whole point of the leather farm is to ensure players always have a reliable way to focus on acquiring leather without turning to the trading post. Not to make people rich by selling it, not to reduce trading post prices. I don’t get why people keep bringing up how expensive leather still is or how it is cost ineffective to promote t5 to t6.

I remember my very first exotic berserker armor I crafted near launch. Farmed minotaurs at Arundon Waypoint area and converted the t5 blood to t6. Salvaged my own ecto and mined my own orichalcum aswell. Didn’t have a trading post. The cost of the materials were irrelevant.

This would make sense except that it doesn’t ensure players have a reliable way to farm leather without turning to the trading post, for free players, or for paid accounts without HoT.
Simply changing the crafting formulas would not put any additional pressure on players to buy HoT, which is the actual point.

Totally agree on the armor. We got a stronger sense of accomplishment back then from doing it ourselves. Considering the addition of patches and the changed recipes, I’m glad I made what I could back then.

(edited by Tumult.2578)

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Posted by: Cristalyan.5728

Cristalyan.5728

Obtena7952

Leather farm is simply that … a place to farm leather. It’s for players that want to play a challenging area that gives them leather.

Challenging ….. farm. Farming = challenge? Are you serious? With such kind of ideas, no wonder the devs transformed the game in a farmfest claiming that GW2 is now more challenging as ever.
Comparing to the Leather farm in Lake Doric, the Champion Train in Cursed Shore is much more challenging. There, at least, you should know how to approach an event chain to maximize the return.
The actual farming is very much similar with the Labyrinth run from Halloween. On the same challenging level. And requiring the same amount of attention. Farming is not challenging. Is boring.

In my opinion this “challenging farming spot” is an insult to the playerbase coming from the devs. They and not the players changed the drop ratio from salvages. They and not the players changed the recipes and the amount of material for each component. They and not the players added countless sinks for leather.
And now they said these are issues difficult to fix by changing something in the dropratios/recipes. And these issues should be solved by players. How? By FARMING

GODS of GW2 ! Where are you? Come and see what the game is now. And, if you come, please farm some leather. Is challenging.

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Posted by: Astralporing.1957

Astralporing.1957

Leather farm is simply that … a place to farm leather.

If the intended “leather farm” place is the worst place to farm leather on the whole map, something is wrong.

Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November

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Posted by: TorsoReaper.8530

TorsoReaper.8530

In my opinion this “challenging farming spot” is an insult to the playerbase coming from the devs. They and not the players changed the drop ratio from salvages. They and not the players changed the recipes and the amount of material for each component. They and not the players added countless sinks for leather.
And now they said these are issues difficult to fix by changing something in the dropratios/recipes. And these issues should be solved by players. How? By FARMING

This is the best summary by far of the situation. All they have to do is try increasing the salvage rates by 1 or 2% a day until they hit reasonable prices. NOPE. All they have to do is change the refinement or recipe requirements 1 a week. NOPE. Instead lets waste developer time and company money making an area nobody will be at within a few weeks because the drop rates and salvage rates are so crap and content is so boring, people are better off doing almost anything else.

The most hilarious part of all of this is that leather prices are already going back up because people are realizing the leather farm is a complete failure.

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Posted by: Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

Leather farm is simply that … a place to farm leather.

If the intended “leather farm” place is the worst place to farm leather on the whole map, something is wrong.

It’s the best place: it’s out of the way of everything else on the map, so people can farm leather without interfering with anyone else’s activities. The farm itself includes the possibility for an achievement.

John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”

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Posted by: Astralporing.1957

Astralporing.1957

It’s the best place: it’s out of the way of everything else on the map, so people can farm leather without interfering with anyone else’s activities.

I don’t think you understood me, so i will repeat. Killing white mantle mobs and doing events elsewhere is a better method of farming leather than this so called “leather farm”.

Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

LOL I think its hilarious what I said gets called QQing “unreasonably” when I’ve been saying pretty much what a lot of other people have been saying in this thread 10/10. Sorry I asked anet to do what they said they’d do. My bad.

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

Obtena7952

Leather farm is simply that … a place to farm leather. It’s for players that want to play a challenging area that gives them leather.

Challenging ….. farm. Farming = challenge? Are you serious?

That’s not my claim, it’s Anet’s. You should be asking them if you don’t think it’s challenging.

LOL I think its hilarious what I said gets called QQing “unreasonably” when I’ve been saying pretty much what a lot of other people have been saying in this thread 10/10. Sorry I asked anet to do what they said they’d do. My bad.

Anet did do what they said they would do … introduced a place to farm leather. They made no expectations it would be the best, or that it would fill your pockets with T6 or anything else. It’s people’s imposition of their own expectations on reality that fail here.

(edited by Obtena.7952)

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

No. They said they wanted to lower the price of t6. That’s what they said. That was the intended purpose of the leather farm. The price hasn’t been lowered. It’s increased. Don’t challenge me to find quotes, coz I will.

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Posted by: OriOri.8724

OriOri.8724

Did they specifically mention T6? I don’t remember if they did or not

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

Yeah on reddit.

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

No. They said they wanted to lower the price of t6. That’s what they said. That was the intended purpose of the leather farm. The price hasn’t been lowered. It’s increased. Don’t challenge me to find quotes, coz I will.

Sure, find me a quote, not because I don’t believe it exists, but because I want to understand the context of the statement. To be frank, I don’t always believe that Anet staff are all that smart and their statements are always reflecting what will really happen. Quote please.

And no, to be fair, you are wrong … the price has gone down … it was above 30s before the leather farm was announced. It’s about 25s now.

(edited by Obtena.7952)

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Posted by: Inculpatus cedo.9234

Inculpatus cedo.9234

I looked on Reddit, and could not find any statement about T6 Leather, specifically; at least not by Mike O’Brien.

I did find a statement about the Leather Farm here on the forums, but it only mentions leather; nothing about tiers.

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Posted by: OriOri.8724

OriOri.8724

@Obtena – When they referenced price I believe they were referencing the fact that the price fell when the farm was announced, and now that people realize the farm isn’t what they thought it was, the price has gone back up.

Even at 25 silver a section, that shows that a full 50% of the price reduction that came about when this farm was announced has already been reversed, and its been less than a week. That’s not a good sign for the far if ANet did intend for this farm to lower T6 leather prices. Even if the price remains at 25 silver, which would still be a 16% decrease in price, T6 leather would still be 12 times more expensive than T6 ore, 6 times more expensive than T6 wood, and 37 times more expensive than T6 cloth. So, so far I consider this farm to be ineffective at normalizing the price of T6 leather with the other T6 mats, but I also don’t know if that was Anet’s intention with it or not.

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

That doesn’t change the fact that the price did fall, contrary to exactly the claim he made that the price increased. Yes, it’s going up, but it’s still cheaper than the over 30s it was. Maybe that’s a subtle difference, but in my book, that’s just not truth. I don’t have time to talk to people that can’t distinguish what is true and what they want to believe to make their point. If someone is going to be in a discussion, being honest with their words is the LEAST we should expect.

I still don’t see where Anet claimed the purpose of the leather farm was to make T6 leather cheaper … yet apparently the threat to find the quote is there. I can wait. The price of what leather is relative to other mats is not relevant. I don’t believe it was put in there as an effective measure to normalize the price of T6 leather to other T6 mats because there is no reason to make that a goal in the first place and it doesn’t need to be normalized to them. It doesn’t even make sense to me that Anet puts in a leather farm to affect pricing on T6 leather; we already know they are taking a step back from fiddling with the economy. No, I think this is simply there for people that want to farm leather, no more no less … and it does that.

Again, I don’t think this is anything more than a place that will challenge people to team to farm leather. I don’t actually see Anet doing anything like making claims that have been suggested here because devs are rather sheepish about making absolute statements like “this is designed to make T6 leather cheaper”. Just putting the instance in won’t do that and they know it, so why they would say something so foolish to being with is rather ridiculous, given their past history for making these kinds of statements.

(edited by Obtena.7952)

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

I never said they specifically said that this was the intended purpose I said they said they said they wanted to lower the price of t6. And I added that the intended purposed of this was to lower the price of t6 because they said that. Don’t put words into my mouth.

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

And I will find the quote when I have a spare moment coz I, you know, actually play the game.

edit

Basically there was a thread where John Smith said he was concered about t6 leather and it was discussed about how they were going to lower the price but they didn’t want to mess with recipes again.

(edited by Fremtid.3528)

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

I never said they specifically said that this was the intended purpose I said they said they said they wanted to lower the price of t6. And I added that the intended purposed of this was to lower the price of t6 because they said that. Don’t put words into my mouth.

OH, so some truth comes out now. I didn’t add any words to your mouth. You outright admit you make this correlation between lower prices and the introduction of the leather farming zone. So you don’t actually KNOW if that’s true … you simply made that correlation yourself. That’s exactly what I thought …

You see, in your mind, Anet wanted lower prices (still debatable until you provide this quote) and you associated that with the introduction of this leather farming zone. Those two things are not necessarily completely dependent. Anet may want lower prices, but introduced leather farming zone with a completely different motive. What motive you may ask? To me, it’s simple … why try to manipulate prices when you can simply provide a method for people that want leather to get it more directly … that makes WAY more sense to me than any ridiculous notion that Anet thinks they can control leather prices through a method that is highly dependent on player activity. I don’t believe they are that dumb to think such a thing.

(edited by Obtena.7952)

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

We’re trying to be as hands-off as possible with item prices, recognizing that players ultimately drive item prices by hoarding things they perceive as cheap and by unloading or farming things they perceive as expensive. On the other hand, it’s kind of unfair for us to say that about hardened leather, because there’s not a good way to farm hardened leather. So we also want to give this early warning that we’ll introduce a way to farm leather in a future release.

Notes from a reddit ama Idk maybe i was mistaken about it being John Smith I couldn’t find the ama I was google searching coz it’s impossible to search on reddit
http://dulfy.net/2016/11/21/gw2-a-crack-in-the-ice-developers-reddit-ama/

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

Idk about you but putting those two together in that sentence makes it seem as if the leather farm is for the hardened leather.

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

That just confirms what I said … that quote is pretty clear … nothing to do with lowering prices. It’s all about providing players a way to farm leather because holding leather hostage on the market was unfair to players … Glad you posted that so we can get the “leather farm = lower prices” nonsense out of the way now.

I never said it wasn’t about the hardened leather and frankly, the leather farm still does exactly what Anet says it will do, even based on that quote. So back to it .. YES, the farm does what Anet intended and said it would. You shouldn’t have been sorry you asked Anet to do what they said they would do … because they did it. You were wrong about the intended purpose of the farm being related to lowering the price of T6 leather. … unless you have a quote for that too.

(edited by Obtena.7952)

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Posted by: Ashen.2907

Ashen.2907

Yeah that quote seems to pretty solidly indicate that they dont want supply to be completly dependent on the market (as referenced by mentioning a lack of a farm) and so a farm was being planned.

This very much looks like a desire on the devs part to give players a source of supply not dependent on the market, such as craftable precursors did, not specifically to drive prices down. Of course increasing supply does also tend to lower prices (has it done so yet?).

(edited by Ashen.2907)

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Posted by: nottsgman.8206

nottsgman.8206

here is the part in the AMA about the leather farm:
https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/5e6uxb/a_crack_in_the_ice_devs_here_ask_us_anything/daa4e1w/

it does mention later about the players having the ability to balance prices. not arguing either way, just posting the link

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

But the farm doesnt give t6 leather… so

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Posted by: Ashen.2907

Ashen.2907

But the farm doesnt give t6 leather… so

Does it give something that a player can turn into t6?

Honest question, I am interested in it but havent done mkre than dabble for the kittens and giggles so far.

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

Yes but if you sold the mats that you’d use to turn it into t6 and bought t6 you’d save money so it’s pointless.

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Posted by: Ider.1276

Ider.1276

Does it give something that a player can turn into t6?

Of course! There’s plenty of wood in Lake Doric, people can chop it down, sell in TP and buy h.leather. Seriously, this statment of yours is absurd. Leather promote = loss of money and spiritshards. And still you bring it up over and over again.

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Posted by: Fremtid.3528

Fremtid.3528

Re ashen’s question about prices: there was a panic sale when the farm was announced that drove the prices down to 19s 99c now the prices have gone back up to ~25s so no it hasn’t really brought the prices down.

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Posted by: Ider.1276

Ider.1276

And the price is conctantly rising. I’m pretty sure in a week it will be at 30-33s (as was before the market panic).

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Posted by: Ashen.2907

Ashen.2907

Does it give something that a player can turn into t6?

Of course! There’s plenty of wood in Lake Doric, people can chop it down, sell in TP and buy h.leather. Seriously, this statment of yours is absurd. Leather promote = loss of money and spiritshards. And still you bring it up over and over again.

First time asking. Perhaps you meant to quote someone else?

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

Yes but if you sold the mats that you’d use to turn it into t6 and bought t6 you’d save money so it’s pointless.

Again, you people are missing the point here … if a person is purposefully going to farm leather there, their concern isn’t what the value of the drops are. I mean, we all know there are better ways to get that leather through earning lots of gold and buying it, so that’s not even a valid response to conversion to T6 from T5 leather. The point here is that this isn’t a gold farm, it’s a leather farm. If you can’t separate the two, you’re opinion is very misplaced. If Anet’s intention was to give you gold to buy leather, that’s what they would have given you … gold. If you’re going there expecting to earn as much gold value in leather as you can farm gold elsewhere … then you missed the point entirely of the area.

… and BTW, that farm does give T6 leather, despite your claim it doesn’t. That’s just more distorted ‘truths’ from you. I love the subtle ways Anet put things to people. you’re all going to complain about the price and right in front of your face, Anet is telling you your complaints are no longer justified because there is a direct way for your to farm leather. You don’t really get it; Anet’s new approach isn’t to manipulate prices or recipes … it’s to provide you options to get what you need, through focused play. If that doesn’t suit you, then I’m sure they will further subtly lead you down the path of money/gems/gold/leather. Either way, they aren’t going to simply hand you over a princely sum of leather.

(edited by Obtena.7952)

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Posted by: Ider.1276

Ider.1276

… and BTW, that farm does give T6 leather, despite your claim it doesn’t. That’s just more distorted ‘truths’ from you. I love the subtle ways Anet put things to people. you’re all going to complain about the price and right in front of your face, Anet is telling you your complaints are no longer justified because there is a direct way for your to farm leather. You don’t really get it; Anet’s new approach isn’t to manipulate prices or recipes … it’s to provide you options to get what you need, through focused play. If that doesn’t suit you, then I’m sure they will further subtly lead you down the path of money/gems/gold/leather. Either way, they aren’t going to simply hand you over a princely sum of leather.

Yeah, subtle. Like you’re renting a house, and one day landlord come in and says: “now you have to pay me 3x the rent. Cause I want so. Your complains are unjustified because there is a direct way to make more money for you – get a second and a third job. I’ve heard the restorant cross the road needs someone to clean the toilets.”
Basically the situation above happened. It was Anet, not the players, who cut the leather income and raised it requierments in recipes. And now players have to clean their mess by no-brain farming. Of couse, Anet has all the rights to do anything they want with their game. But neglecting your playerbase is never a wise choice. As making your playerbase pay for your mistakes.

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Posted by: Obtena.7952

Obtena.7952

Your spin on the situation changes nothing I’ve said. Anet has now created the option to allow players to farm leather … with no expectations for the amount or how it relates to price … as it should be. This was a deficiency in the game from the beginning that is now corrected. The tactic is a result of their new hands off approach to the economy. This not neglect of the playerbase; neglect would have been to allow the situation to persist. There isn’t a reason to be disingenuous and sensational here. Just because it’s not the solution you want, doesn’t mean it’s not the solution that should exist. Your response to the solution is not mature and conducive to a reasonable discussion.

So unless you have something other than angst to add to the thread, I guess I will just wish you luck and advise you align your expectations to a more realistic tact.

(edited by Obtena.7952)

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Posted by: Ider.1276

Ider.1276

This was a deficiency in the game from the beginning that is now corrected.

It was not a deficiency before HoT. I’ve crafted a full ascended armor then, I know what I’m talking. And I was a poor guy, who couldn’t afford buying it from TP. And still crafting exotic and ascended could easily be achieved just by playing the game, not farming. It is deficiency now, with recipe prices raised to the top and leather income cut down. So please don’t try to twist the facts.

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Posted by: OriOri.8724

OriOri.8724

Your spin on the situation changes nothing I’ve said. Anet has now created the option to allow players to farm leather … with no expectations for the amount or how it relates to price … as it should be. This was a deficiency in the game from the beginning that is now corrected. The tactic is a result of their new hands off approach to the economy. This not neglect of the playerbase; neglect would have been to allow the situation to persist. There isn’t a reason to be disingenuous and sensational here. Just because it’s not the solution you want, doesn’t mean it’s not the solution that should exist. Your response to the solution is not mature and conducive to a reasonable discussion.

So unless you have something other than angst to add to the thread, I guess I will just wish you luck and advise you align your expectations to a more realistic tact.

I disagree that this has been a deficiency in the game since the start. It only became a deficiency when HoT dropped, since HoT both massively increased the required amounts of leather to craft anything and also reduced salvage rates of leather. Because both of these happened at the same time, one could reasonably salvage most-all of the leather they needed in a very reasonable amount of time before HoT dropped. So this deficiency was a direct result of ANet changing too many things surrounding leather at the same time and by too much.

I think it still remains to be seen as to whether this farm rewards enough leather for it to justify the development time of putting it in as opposed to just changing either recipes or salvage rates for leather, which could have alleviated the need for a farm.

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Posted by: TorsoReaper.8530

TorsoReaper.8530

Your spin on the situation changes nothing I’ve said. Anet has now created the option to allow players to farm leather … with no expectations for the amount or how it relates to price … as it should be. This was a deficiency in the game from the beginning that is now corrected. The tactic is a result of their new hands off approach to the economy. This not neglect of the playerbase; neglect would have been to allow the situation to persist. There isn’t a reason to be disingenuous and sensational here. Just because it’s not the solution you want, doesn’t mean it’s not the solution that should exist. Your response to the solution is not mature and conducive to a reasonable discussion.

So unless you have something other than angst to add to the thread, I guess I will just wish you luck and advise you align your expectations to a more realistic tact.

Are you a new player or something? Your comments make it sound like you have absolutely no idea whatsoever about the history of leather in this game.

This not neglect of the playerbase; neglect would have been to allow the situation to persist.

Seriously? So if I raise your rent from $1,000 a month to $5,000 a month and you scream and complain it’s too much so I say, “You’re right, I’ll give you a $5/mo credit, your rent is only $4,995, but otherwise I’m going to be hands off”. You’re right, that isn’t neglect, it’s incompetence. Neglect would just be not doing anything, doing something useless and pretending like it’s a solution is incompetence.

(edited by TorsoReaper.8530)

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Posted by: TorsoReaper.8530

TorsoReaper.8530

Re ashen’s question about prices: there was a panic sale when the farm was announced that drove the prices down to 19s 99c now the prices have gone back up to ~25s so no it hasn’t really brought the prices down.

This 100% is the biggest proof that the farm is a complete failure. In the investment business we call this “buy the rumor, sell the news”. Many people feared the leather farm but when it turned out to be uneconomical, boring, with DR’s, and group gated, people realized it wouldn’t impact the supply of leather AT ALL.

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Posted by: Inculpatus cedo.9234

Inculpatus cedo.9234

Maybe he meant ‘in the beginning’ of the leather shortage/change. I don’t know.

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Posted by: Neural.1824

Neural.1824

Re ashen’s question about prices: there was a panic sale when the farm was announced that drove the prices down to 19s 99c now the prices have gone back up to ~25s so no it hasn’t really brought the prices down.

Not on T6 anyway.

-For quite some time, there were threads on the forum and on reddit, where people complained about the cost of T6 leather.
-Anet, as quoted in a previous comment in this thread, stated that they were concerned about the cost of T6 leather, and were looking at introducing a leather farm.
-Anet announces a couple weeks back that there is a leather farm coming, and all the investors dump their leather, including T6 onto the market in a panic resulting in a huge drop in price overall.
-Patch hits, and….prices are recovering.

Anet simply added another source for leather, as opposed to adding a source or adjustment for a specific type of leather that was seen as a problem (per John Smith).
What players wanted and what Anet delivered are two different things.
If the players follow through anyway and farm the leather so they can make money selling T6 materials, the other 5 tiers are going to suffer greatly due to an influx of supply.
T5 leather squares had buy orders of around 95copper late last night and, according to gw2Spidy, have only just come back to being above silver in the past 12 hours.
IF players farm for T6, the side effect will be a slow crash of the other tier leathers.
So the players get what they want (cheaper T6). Meanwhile we head back to T5 being vendor trash (which, if you’ll remember, is why all these changes to refining amounts and patches were done in the first place). Bravo!

Alternatively, players decide that “farming” for an hour for 8 or 9 T6 sections isn’t really worth the time, and as soon as the next most profitable gold farm is found, they move to that. and then the next living story patch hits, and most players, rightfully, move on to the next zone. Resulting in leather prices going back up.

Where are my gem sales? I want gem sales! Nerf EVERYTHING!

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

Maybe he meant ‘in the beginning’ of the leather shortage/change. I don’t know.

There was a leather deficiency at the beginning of the leather shortage? You really think there’s a chance he meant that?

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Posted by: Cristalyan.5728

Cristalyan.5728

Do you remember the way Collin joked about the ginding/farming existing in other MMO’s?
" I killed a centaur! I killed a centaur again! …. Woaaaaa ! Look ! I killed another centaur!" Or it was “sword” instead of “centaur”? No matter :-))
Now look at Mike O’Brien’s own words in the GW2 Manifesto:
“GW2 doesn’t fall into the traps of traditional MMORPGs. It doesn’t suck your life away and force you onto a grinding treadmill; it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun
………………………………………………………………………………
Our games aren’t about preparing to have fun, or about grinding for a future fun reward. Our games are designed to be fun from moment to moment.

And now, with this leather FARM Anet team considers that they followed the Manifesto. Moreover, they expect us to have fun from this?

This “challenging farming spot” is one of the most important proofs that the actual Anet team discarded the vision of the initial Manifesto. Or, because of so many changes in the team, it may be very possible the actual team is not even aware that such vision exists.

And you are still wondering why the playerbase get smaller and smaller?

The most worrying thing is that even if the old vision was discarded, a new declaration/statement/Manifesto was never released. In this moment, without a document stating the direction/goals/intentions, GW2 looks like a sail floating adrift. The efforts of the passengers (the players) to save the sail may be not enough as long as the crew do almost nothing in the right direction.

Back to the “challenging farming spot”: In a game with ample antifarming rules, going from diminished return to forcibly limiting the number of samples of certain materials you can receive daily, the idea of farming seems to be a way to mock the playerbase.

Why mocking? Because you can farm as long as Anet wants! Even this method to address the leather issue has a limited use. Limit left at Anet will under the form of DR.

And another evidence: The players complained about the very small quantity of T2 / T3 / T4 leather a lvl 80 player can get by playing the endgame. And for the limited quantity of T6 leather you can get – no matter what content you play. Anet solution: they invented the “challenging farming spot” – the output is more than 65% the T5 leather. Nobody complained about T5. Thanks Anet :-)). If the farming spot will be a successful idea, the game will be flooded with T5 leather.

We had this situation in the past. Because of the abundance of T5 Anet decided to reduce the input of all tiers leather. It may be possible that in few months Anet will decide that too much T5 leather is on the game, so they will reduce again the input of the T2/T3/T4/T6 leather :-))))

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Posted by: Astralporing.1957

Astralporing.1957

Yes but if you sold the mats that you’d use to turn it into t6 and bought t6 you’d save money so it’s pointless.

Again, you people are missing the point here … if a person is purposefully going to farm leather there, their concern isn’t what the value of the drops are.

Seriously, do i have to repeat it every time? If you want to farm leather (directly), there are far better spots for this. Even on the same map. If something is designated as a leather farming spot by devs, it should be better for leather farming than other places. Not worse.

Yes, you can farm it for leather, but at this point you might as well farm queensdale moas. It is doable, but what’s the point?

This was a deficiency in the game from the beginning that is now corrected.

There was never any need to farm t5 leather. And yet it’s what this farm offers almost exclusively.

The deficiency in the game remains completely unchanged, this “farm” has zero impact on it.

Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November

(edited by Astralporing.1957)

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Posted by: Carighan.6758

Carighan.6758

@Cristalyan

Now to be fair, since that manifest was written a lot of players whined endlessly about GW2 having no “goals”, no “longevity”, “nothing to do”. Basically they missed the endless farming and grinding from other MMOs, “giving them something to do” (this is the part where I make a gesture suggesting they might not be quite alright in their heads).

The strength of heart to face oneself has been made manifest. The persona Carighan has appeared.

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Posted by: Ider.1276

Ider.1276

Fun fact: today I leveluped my alt (elementalist) to lvl 80 and was going to get good exotic gear for her. So, I just sold 10 hardened leather that are needed only for 1 (!) insignia. And on that gold I bought myself lvl 80 exotic Zhed’s (zerk) coat and leggings. And if I was patient enough to place buy orders for this things i could buy like 3-4 lvl 80 zerk exotics with a price of 1 insignia. So exotic craft is basically dead now. Cheers.

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Posted by: TorsoReaper.8530

TorsoReaper.8530

Do you remember the way Collin joked about the ginding/farming existing in other MMO’s?
" I killed a centaur! I killed a centaur again! …. Woaaaaa ! Look ! I killed another centaur!" Or it was “sword” instead of “centaur”? No matter :-))
Now look at Mike O’Brien’s own words in the GW2 Manifesto:
“GW2 doesn’t fall into the traps of traditional MMORPGs. It doesn’t suck your life away and force you onto a grinding treadmill; it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun
………………………………………………………………………………
Our games aren’t about preparing to have fun, or about grinding for a future fun reward. Our games are designed to be fun from moment to moment.

And now, with this leather FARM Anet team considers that they followed the Manifesto. Moreover, they expect us to have fun from this?

This “challenging farming spot” is one of the most important proofs that the actual Anet team discarded the vision of the initial Manifesto. Or, because of so many changes in the team, it may be very possible the actual team is not even aware that such vision exists.

And you are still wondering why the playerbase get smaller and smaller?

The most worrying thing is that even if the old vision was discarded, a new declaration/statement/Manifesto was never released. In this moment, without a document stating the direction/goals/intentions, GW2 looks like a sail floating adrift. The efforts of the passengers (the players) to save the sail may be not enough as long as the crew do almost nothing in the right direction.

Back to the “challenging farming spot”: In a game with ample antifarming rules, going from diminished return to forcibly limiting the number of samples of certain materials you can receive daily, the idea of farming seems to be a way to mock the playerbase.

Why mocking? Because you can farm as long as Anet wants! Even this method to address the leather issue has a limited use. Limit left at Anet will under the form of DR.

And another evidence: The players complained about the very small quantity of T2 / T3 / T4 leather a lvl 80 player can get by playing the endgame. And for the limited quantity of T6 leather you can get – no matter what content you play. Anet solution: they invented the “challenging farming spot” – the output is more than 65% the T5 leather. Nobody complained about T5. Thanks Anet :-)). If the farming spot will be a successful idea, the game will be flooded with T5 leather.

We had this situation in the past. Because of the abundance of T5 Anet decided to reduce the input of all tiers leather. It may be possible that in few months Anet will decide that too much T5 leather is on the game, so they will reduce again the input of the T2/T3/T4/T6 leather :-))))

Very sad that Anet is going this way. I really really enjoyed Bitterfrost and then this patch comes out and it’s almost more lucrative to farm leather from the white mantle than the actual leather farm. There’s something clearly wrong with that. Anet, please, we want this game to start doing better. I’m sure you do to.

But as it stands, you’re making less money than Aion which came out in 2008. Clearly something is driving away customers. HOT was obviously one of those things, the vast majority of people hated HOT and the maps. You slowly start fixing it with newer, better maps, yet fail to address other glaring issues. The crafting issue, also adding to those things (just look at The Division population after the crafting nerf). People want to craft things like legendaries, that is part of your end game. When you make crafting so prohibitively expensive that people don’t want to do it anymore, you’re pushing people away from the end game and pushing people away from your own game.

For reference:
http://i.imgur.com/gMAmcve.png

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Posted by: Ayrilana.1396

Ayrilana.1396

It’s 2017 and people are still misinterpreting the manifesto? The leather farm is not a deviation from it.