Has there been any mention of any kind of compensation for those who bought HOT? Like some gems or anything?
Why would there be any compensation?
Because a majority of players are not pleased with the cancellation of something that was promised. Additionally they have not even released half of the legendaries, and have given no date of when they will even return. Also, many people bought HOT exclusively for legendaries.
It’s not rocket science, try thinking before asking.
Sadly I’m not gonna read 50 pages of threading to see 2-3 constructive feedback and 49 Pages of whining. I did read the first 10 or so pages and got tired of seeing everyone whine. I then started only looking at what Mo had to say and then moved on to the later opinions people had. Still the majority is whining which in my opinion is really sad for such a big community game.
Well , in many cases, history tends to repeat itself. Complaints or praises , all these posts are here for posterity. Because those with a short memory will come to grief. Bad.
Should they be willing to give partial refunds, the big dilemma is how does ANet distinguish between those who bought HoT primarilly for the legendaries and those who’d just want a partial refund ‘cause it’s being handed out?
Why even ask such a question? Why people bought HoT is irrelevant.
What is relevant and what cannot be denied is this: Anet took money for something they advertised and didn’t deliver. Therefore, any refund given should be given to everyone who bought HoT, because everyone who bought HoT didn’t get what anet told them they would get for their money.
Should they be willing to give partial refunds, the big dilemma is how does ANet distinguish between those who bought HoT primarilly for the legendaries and those who’d just want a partial refund ‘cause it’s being handed out? If legendaries were even a partial consideration for some (which is more likely) how do you draw that line in how much consideration makes one eligible for a partial refund? If they just give a partial refund to everyone across the board, how much is appropriate? There’s too much ambiguity for such a solution to make it viable.
Everyone that bought HoT, bought the same product, sold as including the same promoted content. It doesn’t matter if the undelivered portion was of particular value to each person, they are all entitled to the same product, or equal compensation in its place. The fault is with the company, and they are required to treat all purchasers the same.
Footsteps Of War [FoW] | Yak’s Bend
Seer Of The Divine | Sarina Starlight | Tireasa | Caedyra
Also, many people bought HOT exclusively for legendaries..
Once again, I think you mean some people rather than many people.
I get that it is an important issue but don’t exaggerate it.
Where are the statistics that say how many people own legendaries? And even if what you say is true, did you ever consider that a lot of them might not have gotten legendaries because half of them are joke weapons or just plain dumb? Also many people have already started or finished getting some of the other gifts required for legendaries and were waiting for one they like to show up. And now they are cancelled indefinitely.
Has there been any mention of any kind of compensation for those who bought HOT? Like some gems or anything?
Why would there be any compensation?
Because a majority of players are not pleased with the cancellation of something that was promised. Additionally they have not even released half of the legendaries, and have given no date of when they will even return. Also, many people bought HOT exclusively for legendaries.
It’s not rocket science, try thinking before asking.
How do you know what the majority of players think. Please give actual numbers that support your position. I bet you don’t even know how many people play GW2.
I would be utterly shocked if more than 10% of players with more than 1 level 80 character actually supported this decision. I literally haven’t seen anyone in game support it. The closest thing is a SINGLE person in map chat remarking disparagingly on the “complainers”(possibly insincerely, as it was mentioned in passing in a conversation about SAB) in map chat.
Every guild member I’ve interacted with has complained about it, and we have a solid chunk of regular players(30+ I’ve interacted with throughout the week).
Ironically the only people in my guild who seem to think its a good idea are the raiders. Funny how quickly they would change their minds if it was their content that was marginalized.
Half my guild dont even know that the new legendaries have been haltered and they dont care because they feel it is worth to much effort and they making the old ones instead. Im also making the old ones instead as it is still easier and cheaper and they d the same thing. Anyway if you want legendary stuff u can still make the backpack and armour from raids soon…
Some players are not pleased. The majority of players will never own a legendary.
Irrelevant. Anet took money for something they advertised and didn’t deliver. Do you want that to become a habit?
On the other hand there are things we got which were not advertised (not specifically now with HoT but with core game as well). It is tricky to start to count things because if one want compensation for unreleased promised things, then we should pay a compensation for released unpromised things.
I think this will just put Anet to their previous behavior of being secretive about what they’ll release with next expansion and only talk about ready-to-ship things.
But let’s just be honest for a second, if HoT would have only set 1 precursor crafting advertised, who wouldn’t have bought the expansion just because “no new legendary”? People having decided to buy the expansion just because of the new weapons must be far less numerous than the amount of posters in this thread. It doesn’t cancel their bad advertisement, but it is certainly not the sole reason for spending money on HoT.
They could just have emphasized the crafting feature and say “oh and by the way we have 4 new legendaries included, have fun… maybe later there will be more but for now we don’t talk about it”.
Basically we never feel robbed or betrayed for things we don’t know we could have had… so expect a long time of no promises and just discoveries of what they have decided to ship….
Some players are not pleased. The majority of players will never own a legendary.
Irrelevant. Anet took money for something they advertised and didn’t deliver. Do you want that to become a habit?
On the other hand there are things we got which were not advertised (not specifically now with HoT but with core game as well). It is tricky to start to count things because if one want compensation for unreleased promised things, then we should pay a compensation for released unpromised things.
I think this will just put Anet to their previous behavior of being secretive about what they’ll release with next expansion and only talk about ready-to-ship things.
But let’s just be honest for a second, if HoT would have only set 1 precursor crafting advertised, who wouldn’t have bought the expansion just because “no new legendary”? People having decided to buy the expansion just because of the new weapons must be far less numerous than the amount of posters in this thread. It doesn’t cancel their bad advertisement, but it is certainly not the sole reason for spending money on HoT.
They could just have emphasized the crafting feature and say “oh and by the way we have 4 new legendaries included, have fun… maybe later there will be more but for now we don’t talk about it”.
Basically we never feel robbed or betrayed for things we don’t know we could have had… so expect a long time of no promises and just discoveries of what they have decided to ship….
To my understand Anet did say here 3 legendaries the rest are to come. Now atm they say they gonna work on otherthings besides the legendary weapons which isnt bad IMO
The majority of player do not come to the forums, do not read the patch notes and do not even know that anything has changed.
And it’s pretty obvious that the majority of players do not have legendaries because:
1. They cost a huge amount to make, more than most players will ever see.
2. Just look around you in game. Even in the harder areas, legendaries are still in the minority.
Some players are not pleased. The majority of players will never own a legendary.
Irrelevant. Anet took money for something they advertised and didn’t deliver. Do you want that to become a habit?
On the other hand there are things we got which were not advertised (not specifically now with HoT but with core game as well). It is tricky to start to count things because if one want compensation for unreleased promised things, then we should pay a compensation for released unpromised things.
I think this will just put Anet to their previous behavior of being secretive about what they’ll release with next expansion and only talk about ready-to-ship things.
But let’s just be honest for a second, if HoT would have only set 1 precursor crafting advertised, who wouldn’t have bought the expansion just because “no new legendary”? People having decided to buy the expansion just because of the new weapons must be far less numerous than the amount of posters in this thread. It doesn’t cancel their bad advertisement, but it is certainly not the sole reason for spending money on HoT.
They could just have emphasized the crafting feature and say “oh and by the way we have 4 new legendaries included, have fun… maybe later there will be more but for now we don’t talk about it”.
Basically we never feel robbed or betrayed for things we don’t know we could have had… so expect a long time of no promises and just discoveries of what they have decided to ship….
Interesting, but still irrelevant. Anet took money for things they specifically advertised but have now decided to not deliver. If you don’t feel ‘robbed or betrayed’ now, how will you feel if they do it again? Especially considering that your current acceptance of such behavior is an open invitation for it to happen again.
People: do you want this to become standard operating procedure?
The majority of player do not come to the forums, do not read the patch notes and do not even know that anything has changed.
And it’s pretty obvious that the majority of players do not have legendaries because:
1. They cost a huge amount to make, more than most players will ever see.
2. Just look around you in game. Even in the harder areas, legendaries are still in the minority.
I have yet to see anyone with the New Axe or Pistol. Only seen about 10 if lucky Staffs. Sooooo is everyone waiting or no one actually able to make them that quickly or easily due to grind and cost?
Should they be willing to give partial refunds, the big dilemma is how does ANet distinguish between those who bought HoT primarilly for the legendaries and those who’d just want a partial refund ‘cause it’s being handed out?
Why even ask such a question? Why people bought HoT is irrelevant.
Many people in this thread feel it’s relevant…. hence why I rhetorically asked it.
What is relevant and what cannot be denied is this: Anet took money for something they advertised and didn’t deliver. Therefore, any refund given should be given to everyone who bought HoT, because everyone who bought HoT didn’t get what anet told them they would get for their money.
A full refund across the board is unreasonable. And, a partial refund I addressed in a later rhetorical question when I asked how much is appropriate… all that leading to my point that a partial monetary refund is murky territory at best, and substituting future sustainable content is a much more viable option.
Everyone that bought HoT, bought the same product, sold as including the same promoted content. It doesn’t matter if the undelivered portion was of particular value to each person, they are all entitled to the same product, or equal compensation in its place. The fault is with the company, and they are required to treat all purchasers the same.
Yup, which is again why my point was to discount individual reparations as well as ambiguous murky reparations, and instead focus on what’s realistic. Which is sustainable content as a substitution for what they aren’t/weren’t able to provide. Unfortunately that still takes time.
Some players are not pleased. The majority of players will never own a legendary.
Irrelevant. Anet took money for something they advertised and didn’t deliver. Do you want that to become a habit?
On the other hand there are things we got which were not advertised (not specifically now with HoT but with core game as well). It is tricky to start to count things because if one want compensation for unreleased promised things, then we should pay a compensation for released unpromised things.
I think this will just put Anet to their previous behavior of being secretive about what they’ll release with next expansion and only talk about ready-to-ship things.
But let’s just be honest for a second, if HoT would have only set 1 precursor crafting advertised, who wouldn’t have bought the expansion just because “no new legendary”? People having decided to buy the expansion just because of the new weapons must be far less numerous than the amount of posters in this thread. It doesn’t cancel their bad advertisement, but it is certainly not the sole reason for spending money on HoT.
They could just have emphasized the crafting feature and say “oh and by the way we have 4 new legendaries included, have fun… maybe later there will be more but for now we don’t talk about it”.
Basically we never feel robbed or betrayed for things we don’t know we could have had… so expect a long time of no promises and just discoveries of what they have decided to ship….
Interesting, but still irrelevant. Anet took money for things they specifically advertised but have now decided to not deliver. If you don’t feel ‘robbed or betrayed’ now, how will you feel if they do it again? Especially considering that your current acceptance of such behavior is an open invitation for it to happen again.
People: do you want this to become standard operating procedure?
I don’t think Anet undersold the Expansion. They havent released some of the content yet and that may have been their only faulter. Other than that no one is perfect adn they dont have an easy job and running away from a game because they didnt release 12 legendaries ( which they said were a work in progress and maybe in the future again. I dont see a lie there), well thats sad IMO.
The majority of player do not come to the forums, do not read the patch notes and do not even know that anything has changed.
And it’s pretty obvious that the majority of players do not have legendaries because:
1. They cost a huge amount to make, more than most players will ever see.
2. Just look around you in game. Even in the harder areas, legendaries are still in the minority.
I have yet to see anyone with the New Axe or Pistol. Only seen about 10 if lucky Staffs. Sooooo is everyone waiting or no one actually able to make them that quickly or easily due to grind and cost?
One of the people in my guild has HOPE, and spams it in chat ALL THE TIME because he loves the puns.
And I ran Caudecus’ Manor a few weeks ago with a Greatsword/Axe Warrior from Chains of Duty [RPcd] who had Eternity as one weapon, and Astralaria as the other.
Right … making a mistake, recognizing a bad business decision and stopping low-value development now equates to immaturity.
The bad business decision was taking people’s money and then deciding not to give them what they paid for. Whether or not it’s immature is irrelevant; it most certainly is unethical.
Do you not agree? Will you give them money in the future, knowing that you might not get what you paid for?
I don’t see how it’s unethical at all and I don’t agree. Anet intended to deliver that content and even attempted to do so in good faith. It’s just not working out for them.
Will you give them money in the future, knowing, as you do, that if whatever you’ve paid for ‘just isn’t working out for them’ to deliver, not only will you not get whatever it is, but they will also keep your money?
I will because I understand what my money pays for, how much entertainment value I get from it and think the game is worth supporting. I don’t ‘act out’ and demand a full refund if a single feature is only partially delivered because I’m just not that selfish.
Even if I was due a refund, it would only be reasonable for it to be the part of the expansion that pertained to the partially delivered feature, not the whole thing, since I have been satisfied with other aspects AND got entertainment value from it. I just don’t have the audacity to eat a whole buffet and ask for a refund because they didn’t deliver chocolate ice cream that day.
So people are ok to get a partial refund now so how much is that 10-15-20-25-30-35 bucks?
considering the legendarys provided longer lasting content then the other features it should be around 50% refund imo, I still have only got 2 precursors since I refuse to buy of the tp I want to find and craft my legendarys myself. ( and thats 2 of the old ones in 3 years. )
I don’t know how much, that’s not my call. I was just saying hypothetically if a refund were to happen, it certainly wouldn’t be a fully refund for HoT; that would just be stupid. You can justify whatever percentage you want with whatever argument you’ve convinced yourself with. It’s just an academic exercise because frankly, I don’t think you will see a dime of refund.
Right … making a mistake, recognizing a bad business decision and stopping low-value development now equates to immaturity.
The bad business decision was taking people’s money and then deciding not to give them what they paid for. Whether or not it’s immature is irrelevant; it most certainly is unethical.
Do you not agree? Will you give them money in the future, knowing that you might not get what you paid for?
I don’t see how it’s unethical at all and I don’t agree. Anet intended to deliver that content and even attempted to do so in good faith. It’s just not working out for them.
Will you give them money in the future, knowing, as you do, that if whatever you’ve paid for ‘just isn’t working out for them’ to deliver, not only will you not get whatever it is, but they will also keep your money?
I will because I understand what my money pays for, how much entertainment value I get from it and think the game is worth supporting. I don’t ‘act out’ and demand a full refund if a single feature is only partially delivered because I’m just not that selfish.
Even if I was due a refund, it would only be reasonable for it to be the part of the expansion that pertained to the partially delivered feature, not the whole thing, since I have been satisfied with other aspects AND got entertainment value from it. I just don’t have the audacity to eat a whole buffet and ask for a refund because they didn’t deliver chocolate ice cream that day.
So people are ok to get a partial refund now so how much is that 10-15-20-25-30-35 bucks?
considering the legendarys provided longer lasting content then the other features it should be around 50% refund imo, I still have only got 2 precursors since I refuse to buy of the tp I want to find and craft my legendarys myself. ( and thats 2 of the old ones in 3 years. )
I don’t know are they? That’s not my call. I was just saying hypothetically if a refund were to happen, it certainly wouldn’t be a fully refund for HoT. You can justify whatever percentage you want with whatever argument you’ve convinced yourself with. It’s just an academic exercise because frankly, I don’t think you will see a dime of refund.
How does crafting a legendary use more content? Some people can make legendaries in a day and then its done. If you grind enough and play like a monster with no sleep or day job you could prob make a legendary really quickly. Each piece of content is equally valuable. Im sure it would take longer to get to level 100 fractals and all achievmeents in game than it would to make a new legendary….
Right … making a mistake, recognizing a bad business decision and stopping low-value development now equates to immaturity.
The bad business decision was taking people’s money and then deciding not to give them what they paid for. Whether or not it’s immature is irrelevant; it most certainly is unethical.
Do you not agree? Will you give them money in the future, knowing that you might not get what you paid for?
I don’t see how it’s unethical at all and I don’t agree. Anet intended to deliver that content and even attempted to do so in good faith. It’s just not working out for them.
Will you give them money in the future, knowing, as you do, that if whatever you’ve paid for ‘just isn’t working out for them’ to deliver, not only will you not get whatever it is, but they will also keep your money?
I will because I understand what my money pays for, how much entertainment value I get from it and think the game is worth supporting. I don’t ‘act out’ and demand a full refund if a single feature is only partially delivered because I’m just not that selfish.
Even if I was due a refund, it would only be reasonable for it to be the part of the expansion that pertained to the partially delivered feature, not the whole thing, since I have been satisfied with other aspects AND got entertainment value from it. I just don’t have the audacity to eat a whole buffet and ask for a refund because they didn’t deliver chocolate ice cream that day.
So people are ok to get a partial refund now so how much is that 10-15-20-25-30-35 bucks?
considering the legendarys provided longer lasting content then the other features it should be around 50% refund imo, I still have only got 2 precursors since I refuse to buy of the tp I want to find and craft my legendarys myself. ( and thats 2 of the old ones in 3 years. )
I don’t know are they? That’s not my call. I was just saying hypothetically if a refund were to happen, it certainly wouldn’t be a fully refund for HoT. You can justify whatever percentage you want with whatever argument you’ve convinced yourself with. It’s just an academic exercise because frankly, I don’t think you will see a dime of refund.
How does crafting a legendary use more content? Some people can make legendaries in a day and then its done. If you grind enough and play like a monster with no sleep or day job you could prob make a legendary really quickly. Each piece of content is equally valuable. Im sure it would take longer to get to level 100 fractals and all achievmeents in game than it would to make a new legendary….
I don’t even get what you’re question is about; I don’t know how crafting a legendary uses more content. It’s that kind of ambiguity around what wasn’t delivered as content that makes the whole question about a refund very difficult to answer. Frankly, the only thing I see Anet not delivering is more Legendary weapons. I don’t know how many, I don’t know over what period of time. The whole notion we get compensated for content that was never specified is actually ridiculous to me. Anet could just sit back and say they never specified exactly what they were going to deliver, so no compensation is deserved. For all we know, their intent was one new Legendary skin every 2 years … and they would currently be AHEAD of schedule. They never said … and like smart game devs, they never do. I’ve seen that so many times. This isn’t new because they know that their efforts depend on … revenues!
I don’t think Anet undersold the Expansion. They havent released some of the content yet and that may have been their only faulter. Other than that no one is perfect adn they dont have an easy job and running away from a game because they didnt release 12 legendaries ( which they said were a work in progress and maybe in the future again. I dont see a lie there), well thats sad IMO.
If you were to buy HoT from Anet, and pay only part of the money, claiming that you have financial problems and cannot pay more, i’m sure they would be equally understanding. [/sarcasm]
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Right … making a mistake, recognizing a bad business decision and stopping low-value development now equates to immaturity.
The bad business decision was taking people’s money and then deciding not to give them what they paid for. Whether or not it’s immature is irrelevant; it most certainly is unethical.
Do you not agree? Will you give them money in the future, knowing that you might not get what you paid for?
I don’t see how it’s unethical at all and I don’t agree. Anet intended to deliver that content and even attempted to do so in good faith. It’s just not working out for them.
Will you give them money in the future, knowing, as you do, that if whatever you’ve paid for ‘just isn’t working out for them’ to deliver, not only will you not get whatever it is, but they will also keep your money?
I will because I understand what my money pays for, how much entertainment value I get from it and think the game is worth supporting. I don’t ‘act out’ and demand a full refund if a single feature is only partially delivered because I’m just not that selfish.
Even if I was due a refund, it would only be reasonable for it to be the part of the expansion that pertained to the partially delivered feature, not the whole thing, since I have been satisfied with other aspects AND got entertainment value from it. I just don’t have the audacity to eat a whole buffet and ask for a refund because they didn’t deliver chocolate ice cream that day.
So people are ok to get a partial refund now so how much is that 10-15-20-25-30-35 bucks?
considering the legendarys provided longer lasting content then the other features it should be around 50% refund imo, I still have only got 2 precursors since I refuse to buy of the tp I want to find and craft my legendarys myself. ( and thats 2 of the old ones in 3 years. )
I don’t know are they? That’s not my call. I was just saying hypothetically if a refund were to happen, it certainly wouldn’t be a fully refund for HoT. You can justify whatever percentage you want with whatever argument you’ve convinced yourself with. It’s just an academic exercise because frankly, I don’t think you will see a dime of refund.
How does crafting a legendary use more content? Some people can make legendaries in a day and then its done. If you grind enough and play like a monster with no sleep or day job you could prob make a legendary really quickly. Each piece of content is equally valuable. Im sure it would take longer to get to level 100 fractals and all achievmeents in game than it would to make a new legendary….
I don’t even get what you’re question is about; I don’t know how crafting a legendary uses more content. It’s that kind of ambiguity around what wasn’t delivered as content that makes the whole question about a refund very difficult to answer. Frankly, the only thing I see Anet not delivering is more Legendary weapons. I don’t know how many, I don’t know over what period of time. The whole notion we get compensated for content that was never specified is actually ridiculous to me. Anet could just sit back and say they never specified exactly what they were going to deliver, so no compensation is deserved. For all we know, their intent was one new Legendary skin every 2 years … and they would currently be AHEAD of schedule. They never said … and like smart game devs, they never do. I’ve seen that so many times. This isn’t new because they know that their efforts depend on … revenues!
“legendarys provided longer lasting content” Linken posted that. Thats what i was commenting on. Im all for not getting my money back im just impatient and want more content already. But i found 1 or 2 games to play while i wait for it so im not stressed.
If you don’t feel ‘robbed or betrayed’ now, how will you feel if they do it again? Especially considering that your current acceptance of such behavior is an open invitation for it to happen again.
People: do you want this to become standard operating procedure?
Over three years of history, has it been the case for so many things? It is so easy to just have seemingly deep thoughts about Anet psychology and how they robbed us and will do it again because we don’t complain enough.
I don’t feel robbed or betrayed because it is now almost 10 years that this studio has made games that suits my needs as a gamer. I tried other games but never felt home like I did on GW and GW2. For ten years, this very company entertained me almost on a daily basis, gave me new friends, even lovers!
Sometimes I got upset by some choices, many times I got surprised by how a simple game can turn my excited about a new feature. And during those ten years of daily entertainment I did not even gave this company enough money to pay one month of salary of one of their employee…
So no I don’t feel robbed, I am not happy with this cancellation but I’m not suddenly suspicious about Anet which should be some bad devil who wants to eat all my money by making me believe in Santa and then fool me. I have a brain and I use it to analyse the present, to sometimes speculate about the future… but also to remember the past !
Yup, which is again why my point was to discount individual reparations as well as ambiguous murky reparations, and instead focus on what’s realistic. Which is sustainable content as a substitution for what they aren’t/weren’t able to provide. Unfortunately that still takes time.
~EW
Except, that’s generally not an acceptable compensation for a marketed product/feature that failed to be delivered. When such compensation does get offered, it is typically presented as an alternative option to a refund(whether full or partial) or other monetary compensation. The customer cannot be expected to simply accept whatever other product the seller decides to deem as equal to the previously undelivered product.
In fact, this is essentially what Anet has tried to do in this case. Their “compensation” was moving devs from legendary weapons to the live team to bring better living world content. This is the very “compensation” that people are angry about.
Footsteps Of War [FoW] | Yak’s Bend
Seer Of The Divine | Sarina Starlight | Tireasa | Caedyra
Yet we have advertised HoT content put on indefinite hold while 70 employees continue to work on the next expansion.
I guess Anet considers their customers gullible. Who is going to believe anything they say about the new expansion. Are players really going to get excited about any of the selling points of the new expansion?
Most players don’t even know about this change. However, regardless to who I mentioned MO’s decision, they were simply disapointed.
Also, the only statistic that we have about the players involved with the legendary weapons, is the one from gw2efficiency.com which gathers info based on the gw2api. Of course, it’s not accurate, however, it is atleast some kind of info. Based on the graph, 42,5% of players own at least 1 legendary weapon.
I’d like to repeat a few facts from a few pages back:
Journeys being the hardest part to develop is a player speculation: *
- In 2014 ANET told us that the precursor scavenger hunt system they were developing didn’t work well with the other newer implemented systems, so they canceled it. They said they’ll have to come up with a different system.
– In 2015 ANET released HoT which included 20 journeys for the old precursor weapons and 3 for the new precursor weapons.
This is 23 journeys in 1 year.
– In 2015, during one of the October’s Guild Chat, the lead developer for the legendary weapons said she was surprised that dataminers didn’t find the other 2 new legendary weapons together with the “raven staff” as they were put in the client at the same time.
– The raven staff was datamined in the test server in December 2013.
This is 3 skins in 2 years.
– In 2016 ANET announced that they would work on the new legendary weapons for years to come.
– Taking in consideration the short bow, ANET would have to develop 12 journeys (half of what they did in 1 year = 1/2 year) and 12 weapons (4 times more they did in the last 2 years = 8 years) it is safe to assume that the issue here are not the journeys, but rather the skin and visuals of the weapon.
The theory that ANET disbanded the legy team because the feature is being used by a small group of players while it’s also taking a lot of developing resources is also a theory that some player came up with: *
- To craft the Legendary armor the player will undergo the same farming process as they undergo when crafting a legendary weapon x6.
– Raids are being approached by a small part of the community to begin with, out of which an even smaller amount will go after the armor.
– ANET has to develop more than 50 armor pieces (for different genders and races).
It is tricky to start to count things because if one want compensation for unreleased promised things, then we should pay a compensation for released unpromised things.
Those are called gifts. People don’t expect payment for them, or are considered extremely rude if they do.
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
Some of them own at least 1 legendary weapon.
They simply don’t read the news, or were simply busy during it’s announcement since it was announced on the beginning of holidays, when people tend to go on vacations, ect.
As I said, they were disapointed – so it affected them.
Yup, which is again why my point was to discount individual reparations as well as ambiguous murky reparations, and instead focus on what’s realistic. Which is sustainable content as a substitution for what they aren’t/weren’t able to provide. Unfortunately that still takes time.
~EW
Except, that’s generally not an acceptable compensation for a marketed product/feature that failed to be delivered.
Except that it is… substitutions are offered frequently when a provider can’t deliver what they advertised. Whether or not the consumer thinks it’s enough is a different matter, but substitutions are frequently given in all areas of consumer goods. Your local store advertises buy one get one free cans of green beans, you go there and they’re out of green beans, they give you a substitute of corn (or a rain-check for a future visit, or whatever). Substitutes happen frequently enough.
When such compensation does get offered, it is typically presented as an alternative option to a refund(whether full or partial) or other monetary compensation.
Technically it is in this case. You can accept that the legendary team is moved to the LW team to more quickly bring content than what would otherwise happen. Or, you can get a full refund (which unfortunately locks your account). Or, you can walk away from the game. But, the alternative compensation has been enacted in lieu of a refund.
The customer cannot be expected to simply accept whatever other product the seller decides to deem as equal to the previously undelivered product.
In fact, this is essentially what Anet has tried to do in this case. Their “compensation” was moving devs from legendary weapons to the live team to bring better living world content. This is the very “compensation” that people are angry about.
And their anger/frustration is expected. But enough time hasn’t passed to prove if the compensation is adequate. And, there will always be some people for whom it isn’t. I am glad that you do recognize the team being moved as a form of compensation (regardless if you approve of it or not)… many people in this thread don’t yet see it that way.
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
Some of them own at least 1 legendary weapon.
They simply don’t read the news.
As I said, they were disapointed – so it affected them.
They shouldn’t be … they have 20+ more Legendaries to craft. More content than they could possible handle if they have only managed one so far. I can see being disappointed if you have ALL the legendaries, but just one? That’s makes no sense. If I have just one, and there are 20 more to go, I’m not disappointed … I can’t even keep up with the old ones, let alone any new ones they make.
Why? And why should those affected by anet’s decision to not deliver what was paid for care about what you think is unreasonable, or even what anet may think is unreasonable?
Was anet taking people’s money for something not delivered a reasonable thing for them to do?
If a refund or other form of monetary compensation is not possible, then what about the actual delivery of the content advertised? Do you find this unreasonable as well?
Is letting anet (or any company) do this to their customers — and get away with it — the only reasonable thing to be done?
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
Some of them own at least 1 legendary weapon.
They simply don’t read the news.
As I said, they were disapointed – so it affected them.
They shouldn’t be … they have 20+ more Legendaries to craft. More content than they could possible handle if they have only managed one so far. I can see being disappointed if you have ALL the legendaries, but just one? That’s makes no sense. If I have just one, and there are 20 more to go, I’m not disappointed … I can’t even keep up with the old ones, let alone any new ones they make.
You usually craft the weapon you find suatable for you and don’t craft them just because you can.
It’s like saying “Hey, you have a lot of content in game. You can’t complain there’s a content drought, before finishing every unfinished achievement”
I see the circular arguments are still going strong in this thread with the same 5-6 people shouting down anyone who has a different opinion to them. ANet are not going to change there minds folks.
I don’t get why they went the collection route anyways. I’m currently doing the collections for bolt and nevermore out of curiosity to see why they are such a big issue.
So far, ALL they are are wp checklists of running to an npc to get an item or finishing an event. It’s certainly not the “epic journey” Johansen would have u believe and in fact it’s just a chore.
Honestly the old rng system was better than this boring grind.
So you would rather spend your day crafting weapons to flush down the Mystic Toilet? With almost ZERO chance of getting anything in return for your time and effort? That’s not only boring it’s frustrating and demoralizing. Just like playing the game for YEARS and never getting a precursor drop.
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
Some of them own at least 1 legendary weapon.
They simply don’t read the news.
As I said, they were disapointed – so it affected them.
They shouldn’t be … they have 20+ more Legendaries to craft. More content than they could possible handle if they have only managed one so far. I can see being disappointed if you have ALL the legendaries, but just one? That’s makes no sense. If I have just one, and there are 20 more to go, I’m not disappointed … I can’t even keep up with the old ones, let alone any new ones they make.
You usually craft the weapon you find suatable for you and don’t craft them just because you can.
It’s like saying “Hey, you have a lot of content in game. You can’t complain there’s a content drought, before finishing every unfinished achievement”
Yeah, exactly … so how can you complain about weapons that aren’t being delivered that might not be suitable to you? That doesn’t make sense. It’s also silly to say there is a content drought for legendaries if there is lots of legendaries to craft. It’s not a drought if the water is there and you aren’t willing to drink it.
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
You keep referring to it as low impact, which in addition to being somewhat vague, is something none of us have the data to determine. Only Anet has the information relevant to determine that, and we have no idea what was actually factored into their decision. For all we know, it could have absolutely nothing to do how much “impact” legendary weapons have.
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Seer Of The Divine | Sarina Starlight | Tireasa | Caedyra
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
Some of them own at least 1 legendary weapon.
They simply don’t read the news.
As I said, they were disapointed – so it affected them.
They shouldn’t be … they have 20+ more Legendaries to craft. More content than they could possible handle if they have only managed one so far. I can see being disappointed if you have ALL the legendaries, but just one? That’s makes no sense. If I have just one, and there are 20 more to go, I’m not disappointed … I can’t even keep up with the old ones, let alone any new ones they make.
Or only just one or two legendaries to craft. How many people want Champawat, yet have no desire for The Dreamer? Or any non-shortbow?
I’m still working on my first legendary (Sunrise), but I was eager to see what the new sword and shield would look like.
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
Some of them own at least 1 legendary weapon.
They simply don’t read the news.
As I said, they were disapointed – so it affected them.
They shouldn’t be … they have 20+ more Legendaries to craft. More content than they could possible handle if they have only managed one so far. I can see being disappointed if you have ALL the legendaries, but just one? That’s makes no sense. If I have just one, and there are 20 more to go, I’m not disappointed … I can’t even keep up with the old ones, let alone any new ones they make.
Or only just one or two legendaries to craft. How many people want Champawat, yet have no desire for The Dreamer? Or any non-shortbow?
I’m still working on my first legendary (Sunrise), but I was eager to see what the new sword and shield would look like.
Again, if you are down to one or two Legendaries to craft, then that’s exactly the kind of customer that Anet can’t deliver content to with legendary development. Those people are the extreme cases and wouldn’t be able to be satisfied with Anet’s devliery schedule anyways, so it’s no matter to them. Also, Anet should NOT strive to appeal to every extreme type of player at the expense of the significant remainder.
You can be eager on other skins if that’s you interest … It’s not like Legendaries were the only new sword and shield skins that Anet ever released. In fact, skins that are legendaries are the most infrequent. Desiring Legendaries because of a skin doesn’t make sense.
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
You keep referring to it as low impact, which in addition to being somewhat vague, is something none of us have the data to determine. Only Anet has the information relevant to determine that, and we have no idea what was actually factored into their decision. For all we know, it could have absolutely nothing to do how much “impact” legendary weapons have.
You’re right … I’m making an educated guess on that. I’m assuming Anet isn’t stupid enough to cancel high impact content that has a low cost to implement that they can deliver vs. low impact content that is more costly that they can’t deliver. You know, business decision stuff based on ROI, etc … much better metrics than what any of us have access to.
let’s not get back into the premise that Anet is clueless about what they are doing, so we can assume anything they do is stupid and therefore, reinstate Legendary development. That goes nowhere.
Obtena, please, just stop. you have a really flawed logic and a way of not reading the whole message but just the part that suits you.
I was talking about general content drought. You can’t complain about the content drought until you have a single unfinished Achievement.
By following your own flawed logic, MO shouldn’t have disbanded the team, since there’s no content drought of ANY KIND.
And yes, Belial. We’re still here – same as your kind.
And it was proven to you or someone else defending ANET before, that they have changed their mind in the past already. And the only thing needed for a change was their customers complaining.
Your local store advertises buy one get one free cans of green beans, you go there and they’re out of green beans, they give you a substitute of corn (or a rain-check for a future visit, or whatever). Substitutes happen frequently enough.
And that rain check is the very monetary compensation I was talking about. The rain check is offered because the consumer cannot be expected to accept another product. In fact, advertising a product that you intend on substituting with another product is called “bait and switch”, and is usually illegal. Not that I’m claiming ’"bait and switch" applies to Anet in this case, though there are some similarities.
Footsteps Of War [FoW] | Yak’s Bend
Seer Of The Divine | Sarina Starlight | Tireasa | Caedyra
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I was talking about general content drought. You can’t complain about the content drought until you have a single unfinished Achievement.
That’s a matter of opinion. Again, it’s unreasonable for Anet to simply deliver ANY kind of content, no matter how costly it is just because of ‘content drought’.
As a matter of fact, I suspect those devs they took off Legendary development are being put onto content that will deal with whatever lack of it you think exists to get it to us faster.
So the content drought argument for keeping Legendary development … is nonsense. The legendary development cancellation is to address content drought, it doesn’t cause it. You haven’t seen a new legendary since release until now, and it’s just one …. THAT’S content drought. Legendary development CAUSES content drought; having handfuls of devs making content you see a small fraction of every 6 months. That’s just ridiculous and Anet made the right decision to stop it.
Yeah, exactly … so how can you complain about weapons that aren’t being delivered that might not be suitable to you? That doesn’t make sense. It’s also silly to say there is a content drought for legendaries if there is lots of legendaries to craft. It’s not a drought if the water is there and you aren’t willing to drink it.
So when Anet announces that they will halt all PVE development and focus solely on PVP, you are fine with that, because there’s still endless amount of PVP matches to play?
]
I was talking about general content drought. You can’t complain about the content drought until you have a single unfinished Achievement.
That’s a matter of opinion. Again, it’s unreasonable for Anet to simply deliver ANY kind of content, no matter how costly it is just because of ‘content drought’.
As a matter of fact, I suspect those devs they took off Legendary development are being put onto content that will deal with whatever lack of it you think exists to get it to us faster.
So the content drought argument for keeping Legendary development … is nonsense.
lol okay, I get it – you’re a hypocrite.
You’re telling us: “You can’t demand more content if you didn’t complete everything yet”
While saying: “That’s a matter of opinion” when I used your own logic against your argument.
Also, I guess you’re the one who came up with the theory that ANET canceled the legendary team because it’s targeted by a small group of players and because it’s taking too many resources.
I stated a few facts on the previous page which counter this theory. Facts, not opinions and theories.
Because it’s such low impact content for most people that it doesn’t affect them.
You keep referring to it as low impact, which in addition to being somewhat vague, is something none of us have the data to determine. Only Anet has the information relevant to determine that, and we have no idea what was actually factored into their decision. For all we know, it could have absolutely nothing to do how much “impact” legendary weapons have.
You’re right … I’m making an educated guess on that. I’m assuming Anet isn’t stupid enough to cancel high impact content that has a low cost to implement that they can deliver vs. low impact content that is more costly that they can’t deliver. You know, business decision stuff based on ROI, etc … much better metrics than what any of us have access to.
let’s not get back into the premise that Anet is clueless about what they are doing, so we can assume anything they do is stupid and therefore, reinstate Legendary development. That goes nowhere.
So why are they still working on legendary armor?
It seems unlikely that legendary armor would have more impact than legendary weapons. It’s acquisition is even put behind content designed to be a challenge for more hardcore players. It also has a collection workload on-par with a full set of weapons, in addition to skins that are much more work to create to due to requiring different models and textures based on race and gender.
And I also think it’s fairly reasonable to question the decision making of a company that comes to the conclusion that a decision that they know will anger a lot of their customers, turns their own promotion/marketing into false information, and will negatively impact consumer trust/confidence, effecting the sales of their future products is somehow good for business.
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Your local store advertises buy one get one free cans of green beans, you go there and they’re out of green beans, they give you a substitute of corn (or a rain-check for a future visit, or whatever). Substitutes happen frequently enough.
And that rain check is the very monetary compensation I was talking about. The rain check is offered because the consumer cannot be expected to accept another product. In fact, advertising a product that you intend on substituting with another product is called “bait and switch”, and is usually illegal. Not that I’m claiming ’"bait and switch" applies to Anet in this case, though there are some similarities.
And the store determines what that compensation is… if they choose to make it a rain check, then so be it… but they don’t always. Heck, in this example the rain check can be equated to “indefinitely suspended.” You can get the green beans when they’re back in the store, but no eta on when that is.
There might be some similarities, but it’s not bait-and-switch if the company intended to make good from the outset… as I’ve said earlier, they can prove they made that effort (to me it’s evident). Intent plays a role in this, and their intent was to provide that content; not dupe their customer base. Kitten just sometimes happens, even to those with the best of plans and intentions.
Villainizing ANet for this decision may help some people to justify their rage/anger/hatred over the decision… but it also keeps those same people from seeing other parts of the picture and come to a reasoned decision about what they wish to do in response. Us vs Them anger helps no one.
Unfortunately that still takes time.