Guild Wars 2

AS someone who can’t play first person view games for the same reasons, I understand the problem all too well. I didn’t have this problem myself in the demo, but I do understand the feeling for those who had the issues. I truly hope something can be done to help alleviate the issue for these players.

Hello, any news about the issue?

I was curious if they had news as well.
I’m holding off purchasing until i know i can play it without becoming ill.

I am surprised that we got no statement from Anet about what is – or not – going on related to that issue. Or maybe they have done so somewhere else than in this thread?

I also get sick at using raptor and I worry a bit that it will stay as is…

I just hope they don’t change the animations. Make an option for a camera which only loosely tracks the character/mount (as in, the animation does not move the camera at all), but make it optional and keep the animations exactly the same.

Because frankly if those change, that’s as kitten ing to the expansion as the removal of the amazing shield / well /overload artwork back with HoT was. Don’t ruin the gorgeous work of the animators with half-baked fixes, basically.

Zoria.1392:

Part of the problem is probably that the camera ZOOMS OUT when you mount and ZOOMS IN when you dismount. I don’t have motion sickness but I HATE the zooming in and out. I have to keep zooming back out after dismounting.

This. I tend to get motion sickness in games mostly in first person view and because of weird camera zooms like this one. I’m okay when I’m ON the mount but the mounting/dismounting zooms are annoying. Kinda like those random camera zooms during the Tequatl fight that make me dizzy (unless they fixed that, I haven’t killed Teq in ages because of this problem).

For me the Tail sweeping of the raptor, pulls my eyes always to the bottom 10 pixels of the screen. It just sweeps way to hard. Give me a disable tail sweep mode, and i MIGHt be able to live with mounts (hate em now, maybe it will evolve into accept, it will however never evolve into liking, never).

I know it’s cool for those who like it, but for me, tail sweep of raptor kills it for me, the playability of mounts. A wolf, we just runs forward, or bear i would much better like. But it seems raptor will be meta (most used mount) because it’s the only one who can even go faster then the already 200% speed, with the leap.

I find it inexcusable, that Arenanet chose the biggest cash flow item ever (mounts) from other mmo’s, but did not even think/implement ways for players who dislike them/get motion sick, to make it more bearable for them. The people i talked too from Arenanet, just lifted their shoulders (in a way of speaking), when talking about this issue. Not cool. So my estimate is, at PoF launch, there will be no checkbox to make mounts less motion sick causing.

You say you heard Arenanet will ignore the motion sickness issue with mounts? This is very disheartening, because that means that PoF is not playable. Mounts are the major element in it, and no mounts mean no PoF. This would also explain the lack of acknowledgement or response of Arenanet in this thread, because if there is something bad to tell, it’s better to remain silent from the dev side. They answer only if there is something good to tell.

Dante.1763:

Also, horses can be trained to “strafe”, ive seen it done, so its not that unnatural.

It is very unnatural and it takes years of focussed training to learn how to do this, and even then it’s a forward strafe not a pure sideways one.

magicweaver.2695:

I don’t understand your comments about “I get that you have a problem, but also do get that changing the mounts may affect gameplay and gameplay is important to everyone overall … the delayed response imo is part of the core feature on how mounts operate in GW2 and cannot be changed” for 2 big reasons.

Number 1: Since this is the first time mounts have been introduced, there is no “core feature” yet. If there is going to be a change, then now is the time to do it, not after (for example) 5 mounts have this “feature” and then the next 5 don’t.

Number 2: Considering making adjustments to mounts in the way they are being suggested would bring them in closer to the way mounts work in other games (which I haven’t seen in any of the games I play a thread about mount induced VRMS) it wouldn’t be game breaking and if (for example) (the collective) “you” hadn’t seen the animations in the demo and they changed it in the design/QoL stage before “you” experienced it, “you” wouldn’t know the difference.

Additionally, I don’t feel that the person you were responding to was being aggressive, but rather defensive. There have been more than a few comments on here telling people who are experiencing this problem to “get used to it” or saying to ANet that they don’t have the problem so don’t change anything. Statements such as “others can also voice their concerns about how possible solutions would affect them” while valid in sentiment doesn’t truly follow because the only way it would “affect” them is if mounts were removed or the expansion was canned (maybe because not enough people bought it because it made them ill). Those animations do not make the game playable for you. However, they do potentially make it unplayable for others and that is a dangerous precedence to begin setting. If a whole group (which is surprisingly quite large and potentially even larger because people may be deciding just not to buy the expansion because it makes them ill – such as I decide not to buy FPS games because they make me ill) is negated then ANet has just dwindled down a shrinking player base (they are losing profit gains according to the NCSoft quarterly reports) even further, and as that slippery slope continues eventually the whole game will die and then you really will be affected by the animations (and other causes in the future) affecting your game play (though less noticeable on your part).

Also, I would like to point out to those people shouting for “no changes” or that we should get used to it, etc – if you reduce your player base further and further, how do you expect to do meta events etc? Already in HoT there are not enough people to complete the Auric Basin meta event and others and that’s the current newest maps where you would expect the player base to be. My husband and I started on the EU servers and played across a wide range of hours (both in and outside of peak times) and have since transferred to NA servers, and both are suffering from the same ailment. If you negate even more players further, you are dwindling your player base and potentially making it harder for your enjoyment of the game and completion. Just a thought that maybe you need to consider the big picture, not just whether a mount turns with strafing (which is highly possible and happens – check out dressage for example) or whether the mount bobs about, etc.

Hopefully, they will be able to give me the options to fix it for me unique to my situation, and not affect anyone else, but if they can’t due to engine limitations for example – how is making the game playable for a larger group of people really a bad thing for anyone here? ANet and NCSoft make more money, you have a wider base to play with, and we get to enjoy all the parts of the game we want to play. Seems a Win-Win-Win in my opinion.

I’m sorry but if you really don’t understand that mount animations, one of the most celebrated features of the upcoming expansion, one that has one of the most highly upvoted reddit threads on the gw2 reddit that everyone is excited about, is important now that they have showed it off and people have experienced it and it’s been reported on, i’m not sure how you can even have a discussion. Phasing mounts back to something like other mmo’s when the devs have been praised for mounts being “not like other mmo’s” is asking them to shoot themselves in the foot. I get that people want options, and i hope you get them, but not at the cost of the actual game. You speak about having people to do meta-events but then you ask a game to suicide itself trough the destruction of the appeal of a highly praised upcoming feature.

Phoebe Ascension.8437:

… The people i talked too from Arenanet, just lifted their shoulders (in a way of speaking), when talking about this issue. Not cool. So my estimate is, at PoF launch, there will be no checkbox to make mounts less motion sick causing.

That is practically a slap in the face for ppl with this issue, if it was true Anet’s employee responded like that. However be positive and look at the bright side, those affected will have a good reason to ask for refund and move on. Those who haven’t spent can just turn away for good, I supposed. It’s not the end of the world.

Before everybody gets mad at Anet, perhaps they are looking at solutions and just don’t have something ready at this point. Anet will not make any statement unless they have an answer, one way or the other.

Personally, I LOVE the mounts as they are, and I was very against them before the demo. The camera seems to be a large part of the issue—perhaps a toggle to “Use standard camera when mounted” would work.

We can have an invisible mount skin on the Gem store for 8000 gems, problem solved for mocean seekness

i bet some people pass out just by watching this
https://youtu.be/ytOz1AbHZlg?t=6

that is my mount before i played GW2
too bad no mount combat…..

rdfaye.4368:

Before everybody gets mad at Anet, perhaps they are looking at solutions and just don’t have something ready at this point. Anet will not make any statement unless they have an answer, one way or the other.

Personally, I LOVE the mounts as they are, and I was very against them before the demo. The camera seems to be a large part of the issue—perhaps a toggle to “Use standard camera when mounted” would work.

That’s my problem here, I understand people want this issue resolved, but if they in any way touch the animations, that’d be a reconsider-my-purchase thing for me. Those animations made me pre-order. They’re that slick and detailed.

Carighan.6758:

rdfaye.4368:

Before everybody gets mad at Anet, perhaps they are looking at solutions and just don’t have something ready at this point. Anet will not make any statement unless they have an answer, one way or the other.

Personally, I LOVE the mounts as they are, and I was very against them before the demo. The camera seems to be a large part of the issue—perhaps a toggle to “Use standard camera when mounted” would work.

That’s my problem here, I understand people want this issue resolved, but if they in any way touch the animations, that’d be a reconsider-my-purchase thing for me. Those animations made me pre-order. They’re that slick and detailed.

We (I think most people and me) are not asking for a change in basic animation. Do you think we do not know how enthousiast some people are for mounts and how ‘realistic they’ are. In every post of me you should see the word ‘checkbox’. Also a lot of work went into mounts, (i think) so i don’t see them dumbing down their long line of work. But this IS an Issue and even in minnority, people that get motion sick deserve to keep playing. Anet found a perfect solution for legendary sound effects. Legendary lovers happy (all effects in place), legendary haters too (all effects disabled), or a middle way for people that like that. Mounts should be same. Since it’s main feature of the pack. This checkbox imo, should already come with expansion and not later, since it’s a game changing, feature.

Far as I can tell all that’d be required is that optionally “Mounts use a fixed camera POV”, right?

Where the camera is locked against a specific point in the center of the ground circle of the mount’kittenbox? Which, as far as I can tell, doesn’t sway with its animations?

We can argue with other players until we’re blue in the face, and it doesn’t mean a thing.

It only matters if we can get through to the DEVS that
~Visually Induced Motion Sickness is a real thing, not just a preference, not just something you ‘get over’ or ‘learn to deal with’.
~It doesn’t just happen from VR rigs.
~Having mandatory content who’s visual aesthetics (not actual functional game mechanics), however pleasing, make a chunk of your player base violently ill is not good, and needs to be managed somehow.

In case, you don’t know what it means to experience game induced motion sickness.

Remember your worst hangover. Remember how you crawled out of bad and wished you were dead. Motion sickness feels worse.

Remember your last boozy session and 2 hours of sleep before getting up and back to work. The whole day is spoiled while you move like a zombie and feel your head will explode. Motion sickness is just like this. The rest of the day/evening is spoiled. You only want to go to bed. And it’s not that it vanishes after you cease playing. It lingers. It lingers for the rest of the day like a curse. It makes it impossible to enjoy anything for the rest of the day. And you cannot do anything about it! It just happens. You are totally helpless.

The lack of reaction from Anet makes me worry. Fact is that I love GW2 and will not stop playing the rest of it, but if nothing changes with the raptor, I can simply not use the new pack.
Therefore my question: Does anyone know if it is possible to cancel a pre-purchase? Is there a time limitation?

I have experienced it too, I didn’t know what bothered me until I unmounted and started running. Something about the camera while mounting (and also the mount and unmount animation) seems off. If something can be adjusted about the camera, would be appreciated.

Dear Anet,
you’ve been silent on the issue for more than two weeks.
Will you adjust/fix effects associated with PoF mounts for those who suffer from motion sickness/migraines and those who might experience other unpleasant conditions and health problems that can be potentially caused by the features discussed in this thread? Or won’t you?

All i need is a clear and simple answer to my questions.

Could you give me some information about your decision on the matter, please?

Thank you.

Now that we are on “Mount Week”, I’m hoping the devs will be able to comment on this in some way. I mean, I don’t expect things to be magically solved, but it would be nice it they at least mention they have heard the complaint.

Someone suggested what I thought was a brilliant suggestion for compromise on mount movement. Add a toggle to switch between “realistic” (RP) mount movement and movement that allows strafing and quick turns. I know there are many who like the RP aspect of mounts but for others, having movement that doesn’t flow with character presents problems.

Would allow those who want to role play their mounts to do so.

Would allow those who want their mount to feel like a natural extension of the character in movement and who couldn’t care less about “realism”, to have their way as well.

Everyone goes home happy.

If they can’t give us an option to tone down the wobbliness I will play the new maps on foot. I hope that will be possible.

I am not even sure to buy the expansion, because there is no PvP content and I can’t say that I love mounts (everything will be around mounts).

Carighan.6758:

rdfaye.4368:

Personally, I LOVE the mounts as they are, and I was very against them before the demo. The camera seems to be a large part of the issue—perhaps a toggle to “Use standard camera when mounted” would work.

That’s my problem here, I understand people want this issue resolved, but if they in any way touch the animations, that’d be a reconsider-my-purchase thing for me. Those animations made me pre-order. They’re that slick and detailed.

And my problem here is that the animations make me violently ill, so if they remain a mandatory part of gameplay, without any way for me to mitigate the effects, I won’t be purchasing the expansion, even after playing the game since beta. Those animations keep me from pre-ordering, they are that debilitating.

kellenburger.9245:

If they can’t give us an option to tone down the wobbliness I will play the new maps on foot. I hope that will be possible.

The mounts are mandatory for certain areas of the game, they have stated that. They aren’t just a fun add-on you can choose to have or not. That makes this doubly frustrating, because it means those of us having the issue are all or nothing, either we get sick, or we don’t get the expansion.

They’re not going to comment, and likely will not fix it. Have you tried gliding off a cliff with a large group? Or, fought ANY boss in this game? It’s just a giant blinding light show that is seizure inducing for a lot of people. The mounts will be the same way. Unless a dev’s kid or family member is directly affected, nothing will happen.

Could be you are very much right when I see the latest message: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/developer-diary-joy-of-movement-on-mounts/

It is like telling to all of us who have troubles that we are ignored.

Yep, they just don’t take care of suggetions and feeling of players.. Indeed, Anet don’t answer every forum’s topic: Only those who are viewed and replied over a specific limit… We speak here of an dangerous important issue…. but they just don’t care…
I Have experienced a kind of motion sickness, and it’s surely due to the camera or the “Realistic” movement that they talk about: For me it make mount like slimes, giggling in every directions… After less than 15min on it, I feel forced to dismount…

I have aldready purchased the extension but if not fixed, I will ask for a refund.

Dreamy Lu.3865:

Could be you are very much right when I see the latest message: https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/developer-diary-joy-of-movement-on-mounts/

It is like telling to all of us who have troubles that we are ignored.

Not actually surprised, this is pretty much the standard for the devs and has been from the start. A new “feature” will be introduced, jumping puzzles, gliding, (and now mounts) etc and the team responsible for that “feature” will assume their feature should be required to play instead of optional. Every new map after that “feature” is added will require it in some form or another. Mark my words, every map and/or expansion from this point forward will at some point require the use of mounts and if you have an issue with motion sickness, well you will be SOOL.

Eleri Tezhme.3048:

Carighan.6758:

rdfaye.4368:

Personally, I LOVE the mounts as they are, and I was very against them before the demo. The camera seems to be a large part of the issue—perhaps a toggle to “Use standard camera when mounted” would work.

That’s my problem here, I understand people want this issue resolved, but if they in any way touch the animations, that’d be a reconsider-my-purchase thing for me. Those animations made me pre-order. They’re that slick and detailed.

And my problem here is that the animations make me violently ill, so if they remain a mandatory part of gameplay, without any way for me to mitigate the effects, I won’t be purchasing the expansion, even after playing the game since beta. Those animations keep me from pre-ordering, they are that debilitating.

kellenburger.9245:

If they can’t give us an option to tone down the wobbliness I will play the new maps on foot. I hope that will be possible.

The mounts are mandatory for certain areas of the game, they have stated that. They aren’t just a fun add-on you can choose to have or not. That makes this doubly frustrating, because it means those of us having the issue are all or nothing, either we get sick, or we don’t get the expansion.

It’s useless trying to have a conversation with the mount supporters. All I have been reading on these forums is basically “I got what I want, screw the rest of you”. They do not care if you can play the game or not as long as they get the “pretty” graphics.
Really says a lot about the community and the state of the game, sad.

Colorblind people have been asking for a colorblind mode since launch. Now you know how they feel.

Get used to it. Anet doesn’t care.

That dev blog post clearly points out to devs thinking that the new motion and camera modes for each mount are the best thing since the invention of the wheel, and that obviously everyone should be enamored with those. And not even a slightest mention of motion sickness in this post.
They obviously either don’t care, or realized it too late and think that any changes would require too much effort to bother (so better pretend they don’t see anything).

First of all I want to say that this is obviously a serious issue that i 100% think, should be worked upon. There should prob be a way to pan the camera or sth so it feels less wobbly for those who have issues with it.

However, I really feel like people are reading too much into the blogpost. They’re just going over what they think is good and enticing about the mounts. I don’t think you can really say that they are certainly ignoring the issue. You just dont know. Low communication has always been their way, which maybe is not a good thing. But it does mean that people shouldn’t make too many assumptions. 1 small blog post about the positives off mounts, doesnt mean they’re not looking into the issues.

Secondly, although i 100% support your claim, i really love how the new mount feels. Feels amazing to actually ride an animal and not just run faster and have a visual model under you. I was like “meh do we really need mounts” for the longest time and now i’m superhyped. I don’t think it’s wrong that players who dont have this issue, respond to this thread and ask that Anet keep the mounts awesome for those without problems. The only good solution is a check box which many here advocate and i totally agree. But dont be mad when someone says “i want the animations to stay, they feel great”. Because they should stay, optionally that is.

I actually found the blogpost a bit encouraging for those of us dealing with this issue. Roy says that they created custom cameras to create the sense of motion they desired for each mount. I agree that the majority of players who do not suffer from motion sickness ought to be able to enjoy the full scope of what the developers have labored to create. For those of us who experience this problem, I have hope that a simple option to disable those aforementioned custom cameras will be like disabling camera shake and the drunken waver.

I don’t think that a publicity platform like how ANET uses their front page blog is the best or even appropriate place to bring up motion sickness and we shouldn’t read into their silence on that platform regarding this issue as intent to ignore it. Right here on the forums are really the place for the developers respond to our concerns, or perhaps on a guild chat interview if they have one on mounts.

As it happens, they will have a Guild Chat on mounts tomorrow per the Mounts Week schedule.

August 31: Mounts on Guild Chat

That should be over before the stress test begins. And in the stress test, motion sickness sufferers may be able to play with camera settings some more to see if they can find a bearable camera.

Well, according to the dev livestream:

For motion sickness, we do have options to turn off some camera options such as camera roll etc.

This is good to know, but it needs a LOT of clarification (and doesn’t really suggest that the devs know that this is an actual issue, not just a ‘oh, I feel a little woozy’)
How will changing the camera setting for mounts impact the camera the rest of the time? Will we be having to flip settings back and forth to get on and off a mount, or will it be a simple “don’t use this” button like turning off drunkeness effects? Importantly, will we get to test this before launch, so we can give the devs actual feedback on if it has the effect they think is does?

The other thing that was mentioned, but needs clarification, is that mounts are needed to get into “some” areas- the implication was that those were extra explorable areas like jumping puzzles.

The question is, will any of those areas be needed for map completion, or event (world and guild)participation, or story progression? Will they slip mount use into story instances?

They said the same sort of thing for the Zephyrite skills, and those ended up being mandatory to finish story, or participate in certain events and reach certain WPs so you could progress through the map. It is amazingly frustrating to be told something is ‘optional’, and then have a story instance that requires you to use that skill or tool.

Before we shell out $ for the expansion, we need to know if using a mount will become mandatory at any point for game progression; as in you can not Do The Thing unless you are using a mount. And it’s not just about not wanting to spend the money, it’s about having to miss out on a massive part of something we love, because is makes us sick.