Guild Wars 2

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Quotes aren’t working, so @turtledragon

So you’re just going to talk trash about the way I play, without knowing how I play, alright, sure, that’s fair, and then assume that you’re automatically correct and that I agree with you? You are a moron.

I use stealth, dodging, and shadowstep. I use stealth not as a crutch, but BECAUSE THERE’S AN ENTIRE TRAITLINE DEVOTED TO IT THAT GIVES BENEFITS FOR STEALTHING.

And your little point about how more weapon skills on other classes means that a thief’s core mechanic isn’t stealthing is just downright pathetic. Thieves have access to stealth on all but two weapon sets. We don’t need more skills to stealth, and thinking that other professions have more of a certain type of skill discounts a thief’s core mechanic being stealth is just downright idiotic.

I haven’t admitted anything. All you’ve done is make baseless assumptions on a player you don’t even know.

To add in to your last little remark, the “get good”, the only reason that this skill is being updated to reveal stealth is because other players couldn’t “get good”. They whined and complained until they got their way, while you go on to claim that I don’t want this because it makes stealth “uncounterable”, even though the most required to counter a thief using stealth is a basic thought process that many guild wars 2 players seem to lack.

Yourself included.

Thieves and stealthing has always been counterable. I’ve had plenty of times where I’ve died in stealth because other players knew what they were doing, or have even gotten lucky. It’s not hard, but people like you make it out to be by claiming that stealthing is “uncounterable”.

I think that the person who thinks their whole class will be useless if 1 skill with a 40 second cooldown from a Pet applies Revealed to them is the one who should get good. Thank you.

I never said useless, but feel free to make more baseless assumptions.

And whose to say that they won’t decrease the cooldown?
Whose to say they won’t add more, similar skills?

Not only are your points invalid and idiotic, but you also fail to look at the bigger picture.

edit

And no thieves get perma stealth. There’s always a point as to when they’re unstealthed, but the ones that constantly spam it in wub with dagger/pistol never accomplish anything.

But yes, sure, compare “not accomplishing anything” to being invincible, or brokenly overpowered. Yes. Sure.

“but the ones that constantly spam it in wub with dagger/pistol never accomplish anything”

I’m sure everyone is familiar with the scenario below:
The Thief attacks you. The Thief cant kill you. The Thief spams dagger/pistol combo to stealth and runs off. The Thief waits for all his skills to recharge. The Thief comes back and tries again, over and over. You on the other hand, cannot do anything about this stealth harasser, because he runs away invisible before you can finish him off. Wait, the Thief can see you and will make sure to run in a completely different direction that you are going to chase him.

So then after the Thief realizes he cannot kill you, he waits for someone to attack you, and then jumps in too. You kill the guy who attacked you, but the Thief realized his ally is dead, and stealths and runs away again, repeat over and over.

What did the Thief accomplish?
He did not get killed by using a broken mechanic.

What did the Thief not accomplish?
Killing You.

So compared with Guardians blocking all incoming attacks and not getting killed while dealing 0 damage themselves, and Necros fearing everyone who targets them, I see their level of survival they provide to be equal to that of Stealth, that is: OP and Broken.

And you’re telling me to get good.
Follow your own advice if you think that a situation like that in world versus world of all things is actual proof of stealth being overpowered.

What? Was the discussion about Stealth being OP anywhere else other than WvW?
Stealth is OP in WvW, Stealth is not OP in PvE, nor PvP because you cant cap while Stealthed.
You speak of counters to stealth in WvW?
Name them please?
Name on each profession please.
Show me them counters, I wanna see. Since I obviously cant see the thief so i wanna see the counter to the little thief in the scenario above.

Yeah, that’s kinda what the entire discussion has been about. Spvp and Wub.

The counter?

Getting good.

And that, proves that there are no counter to stealth, and someone who mentioned that they got killed while being under stealth is due to that someone’s own stupidity, not because counters exist to the mechanic. Thanks.

@turtledragon

And that proves that you rush to conclusions because you assume too much.
You wanna know the counter to stealth? Try swinging your sword. Try AoE. Try correct positioning, and correct timing of certain skills to stun, knockback, or pull the thief.

But nah, you’re just gonna wait until the update so you don’t have to think about anything.

“Pet HP split between PvE and PvP”

PvE/PvP splitting is a change I have wanted since I first played the beta of this game. But honestly what you guys are working on is not enough. I want a full true split.

Also. I do not agree with your split. It should be PvP/WvW and PvE. Though a true split between the 3 would be the most optimal…..I can see that it would require too much effort. I think that the perspective for you developers need to change. Which means that you guys need to consider WvW as a pvp game mode. Otherwise WvW will stay as boring as it is now.

Engineer changes-

Im glad that you are getting rid of some of the rng from the abilities. But again, that’s not enough. Why even have rng in their abilities? It was never a pro and will never be a pro to the class design nor the players.

Also, I want to see even more changes to the Engineer. Make it that grenades aren’t the only optimal build for PvE…and I mean not for you guys to nerf grenades but to bring the other kits in line with grenades. While I see the FT as a useful tool for a bunker spec for pvp….you know how I mentioned above for a true split between pve and pve? well….the FT is completely useless in pve. Change it for pve to make it more useful. This means more dmg.

Lastly. The defiant boss mechanics need to change in order for “support” to be useful. I don’t want it to be completely gone but a simple tweak like defiant expiring after x amount of time would make “support” a lot more viable. The 25 stack condition dmg also needs addressing. Make it so that each classes " Cond stack" is counted as a different dmg source. Like if two players cast burning on a target. The target will have two different burning stacks.

raahk.2786:

@turtledragon

And that proves that you rush to conclusions because you assume too much.
You wanna know the counter to stealth? Try swinging your sword. Try AoE. Try correct positioning, and correct timing of certain skills to stun, knockback, or pull the thief.

But nah, you’re just gonna wait until the update so you don’t have to think about anything.

You cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, stop talking big please.

I’m not the one who is dying on my Thief when I have access to Stealth.
FYI my Thief has ran the scenario above multiple times, and I have yet to see anyone able to counter it and kill me. Am I just too good? Or is Stealth just broken?
Wait you ran this scenario too, but you died? You died because…Wait that’s obvious.

Spamming 1 to swing my sword that the Thief can clearly see and avoid.
Trying to AoE something I cant see.
Stunning my target, wait what target?
Use Pull? Pull have 40-60 recharge, Thieves have 5 skills of which some have no recharge to get back into Stealth.

With the update, I hope to see more skills that apply Revealed to Thieves.

JonathanSharp.7094:

Thief

We’re also looking at shaving the efficiency of Flanking Strike slightly, so that it now only removes 1 boon instead of 2.

If you do decide to make it remove 1 boon instead of two, at least reduce the initiative cost so it remains viable.

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

@turtledragon

And that proves that you rush to conclusions because you assume too much.
You wanna know the counter to stealth? Try swinging your sword. Try AoE. Try correct positioning, and correct timing of certain skills to stun, knockback, or pull the thief.

But nah, you’re just gonna wait until the update so you don’t have to think about anything.

You cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, stop talking big please.

I’m not the one who is dying on my Thief when I have access to Stealth.
FYI my Thief has ran the scenario above multiple times, and I have yet to see anyone able to counter it and kill me. Am I just too good? Or is Stealth just broken?
Wait you ran this scenario too, but you died? You died because…Wait that’s obvious.

Spamming 1 to swing my sword that the Thief can clearly see and avoid.
Trying to AoE something I cant see.
Stunning my target, wait what target?
Use Pull? Pull have 40-60 recharge, Thieves have 5 skills of which some have no recharge to get back into Stealth.

With the update, I hope to see more skills that apply Revealed to Thieves.

Did I ever say that I was utilizing the perma stealth build? No, I didn’t. Again, you assume too much.
Skills aren’t needed, player skill is, but you’ll await the update because you’re terrible.

I use perma stealth build and nevr die. you claim that I am terrible.
You use a build inferior to perma stealth build and die, and you claim to be good.

Logic much?

You cant even copy the perma stealth build correctly or use it correctly, and you are dying. I shouldnt even need to assume anything, this is obvious

I have a suggestion involving Warrior and Sword mainhand weapon.

I know mainhand sword is used a lot in PvP environments due to gap closer and inmobilize + tons of bleeds, but Flurry burst skill lacks in direct damage, where a warrior is more specialized at, and most builds for PvE are pure power builds.

Maybe Flurry skill could be split between PvP and PvE somehow or rework it, so instead of 90% bleed damage and 10% direct damage, it did something in between, or more direct damage oriented.

Remember I’m talking from a PvE perspective, I know that skill is great in PvP atm.

Cheers.

Just a side thought about thief LS: how about making it stealing one boon, but sharing it to allies? Would it be OP?

Advent Leader.1083:

Just a side thought about thief LS: how about making it stealing one boon, but sharing it to allies? Would it be OP?

Hard to say, it could be of course if it is a nice stack of might that is stolen. If it’s some short duration Retal, noone will care.

Since fast casting is on the table heres my 2 cents.
1. Allow use to see the target reticule at all times, (grenadier mostly will help)
2. Make reticule 3D. By this i mean give it some height effect so we can see it at max range just over the terrain. (again grenadier :P)

Second request:
Can we get the camera to zoom out further than normal max? Currently maxed range grenadier can be VERY difficult to place attacks due to limits of my camera’s view. If i pivot up the targets info bar is in the way, so it forces me to climb to higher ground just to see down at a long enough range to cast properly. PLus grenades are slow so i need to lead the target, kinda hard to do at the EDGES of my screen where all the maps, info, and HUD is.

@Xovian/raahk/Doomdesire, etc.
As someone who runs Mesmer and Thief mainly, I am going to say one thing. If we consider Stealth – due to # of Traits effecting its usage – to be a “core” mechanic of the Thief class … should we not also consider Confusion to be a “core” mechanic of Mesmers? And we all know how that business panned out.
With that in mind, the wholesale obliteration of Trait-based Confusion is on a wholly different order than the (potential as of now) existence of one move that can directly counter Stealth. Assuming the “Sic ’Em” change requires that the pet actually manages to hit a Stealth-user, then that – and the AI/overall mobility of Ranger Pets – balances the ability.
What, precisely, balanced things such as the Blinding Befuddlement debacle? As it is now: yes, a Mesmer can get good results from a Perplexity spec … but so can multiple other classes. Let alone that that little trick only works in PvE or WvW.
(And before anyone else brings it up: those cute little anti-Stealth traps in WvW? I guarantee ~90% of those are getting used to block Veil, not anything a Thief brings to the table.)

Now, with that out of the way, I do still think that the bit on Larcenous might be rather over the top, unless other Thief weapon-spreads are looked over, and kept workable. I wonder how hard it’d be to add a direct charge mechanic – for example, if I go for FS/LS “spam,” I remove a Boon less … but if I delay-trigger LS, it continues as current?

As a thief im fine with anti stealth going in wvw along with incentive to make our class play the game instead of trolling other people. I just hope they dont start implementing anti stealth in tpvp. In tpvp the mechanics are already rendering stealth useless but alot of thieves stil rely on stealth to escape , remove conditions and heal. Maybe wont make that much of a difference but it could still be fustrating in tpvp.

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

@turtledragon

And that proves that you rush to conclusions because you assume too much.
You wanna know the counter to stealth? Try swinging your sword. Try AoE. Try correct positioning, and correct timing of certain skills to stun, knockback, or pull the thief.

But nah, you’re just gonna wait until the update so you don’t have to think about anything.

You cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, stop talking big please.

I’m not the one who is dying on my Thief when I have access to Stealth.
FYI my Thief has ran the scenario above multiple times, and I have yet to see anyone able to counter it and kill me. Am I just too good? Or is Stealth just broken?
Wait you ran this scenario too, but you died? You died because…Wait that’s obvious.

Spamming 1 to swing my sword that the Thief can clearly see and avoid.
Trying to AoE something I cant see.
Stunning my target, wait what target?
Use Pull? Pull have 40-60 recharge, Thieves have 5 skills of which some have no recharge to get back into Stealth.

With the update, I hope to see more skills that apply Revealed to Thieves.

Did I ever say that I was utilizing the perma stealth build? No, I didn’t. Again, you assume too much.
Skills aren’t needed, player skill is, but you’ll await the update because you’re terrible.

I use perma stealth build and nevr die. you claim that I am terrible.
You use a build inferior to perma stealth build and die, and you claim to be good.

Logic much?

You cant even copy the perma stealth build correctly or use it correctly, and you are dying. I shouldnt even need to assume anything, this is obvious

I know the permastealth build, but I don’t use it. Why? because it’s world versus world. Sometimes I’ll run a normal stealth build, sometimes I’ll run pistol/pistol. I’ve been running around with spirit weapons on my guardians. World versus World is a place where you can mostly just screw around with whatever builds you use.

And you’re terrible because you can’t counter it, and even moreso for claiming that I’m the one relying on it when you have just stated that you’re the one doing so yourself. Hypocrite much?

And no, you shouldn’t assume anything, but you do so anyways.

I’m going to stop replying to this since you’re beyond logical thought and reason.

I cant counter it because there is no counter. You proved that yourself because you cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, which makes you believe there are skills out there that can counter stealth because you failed at using the perma stealth build.

It’s not that you dont use the perma stealth build. It is that you cant. Therefore, you have to resort to an inferior build. You are relying on stealth, but are not even able to use it at its broken potential. Then you say that stealth is not OP.

Everybody knows as much except for someone here. Even a dev admitted that he could not catch a thief in a livestream.

The transparency is appreciated. Thanks.

Hello anet! i love your changes. but thief needs better access to fury. due to thief being the class that should have highest fury.

Advent Leader.1083:

Just a side thought about thief LS: how about making it stealing one boon, but sharing it to allies? Would it be OP?

they will have to make it prioritize boon removal like bountiful theft which removes stability and aegis first than protection.

all other boon removal are sort of bad because it removes random boons.

I think one issue Anet should work on is boon removal/stealing/corrupting priority. Make it less random.

Keep buffing warriors developers! You’re definitely going in the right direction towards balancing the game!

As i already stated in my ranger forum. the ranger “stealth reveal” is only beneficial in large groups and zerges, other than that, it’s useless.

To all thieves, did you know we are 2 times vulnerable without our suicidal 1-3 kill pets?

> So what if our pets can reveal you
>They nerfed our Pet leach range
>They nerfed our Pet hp
>They nerfed our Pet damage output
>Our pets swapping have cooldowns
> You kill our pets
>We Rangers are 2x more likely to die without them
>You kill us with 1-4 14k+ back stabbs+heatseeker (as usual)
>You win (as always)

So again,

Where is the threat,

Thieves?

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

@turtledragon

And that proves that you rush to conclusions because you assume too much.
You wanna know the counter to stealth? Try swinging your sword. Try AoE. Try correct positioning, and correct timing of certain skills to stun, knockback, or pull the thief.

But nah, you’re just gonna wait until the update so you don’t have to think about anything.

You cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, stop talking big please.

I’m not the one who is dying on my Thief when I have access to Stealth.
FYI my Thief has ran the scenario above multiple times, and I have yet to see anyone able to counter it and kill me. Am I just too good? Or is Stealth just broken?
Wait you ran this scenario too, but you died? You died because…Wait that’s obvious.

Spamming 1 to swing my sword that the Thief can clearly see and avoid.
Trying to AoE something I cant see.
Stunning my target, wait what target?
Use Pull? Pull have 40-60 recharge, Thieves have 5 skills of which some have no recharge to get back into Stealth.

With the update, I hope to see more skills that apply Revealed to Thieves.

Did I ever say that I was utilizing the perma stealth build? No, I didn’t. Again, you assume too much.
Skills aren’t needed, player skill is, but you’ll await the update because you’re terrible.

I use perma stealth build and nevr die. you claim that I am terrible.
You use a build inferior to perma stealth build and die, and you claim to be good.

Logic much?

You cant even copy the perma stealth build correctly or use it correctly, and you are dying. I shouldnt even need to assume anything, this is obvious

I know the permastealth build, but I don’t use it. Why? because it’s world versus world. Sometimes I’ll run a normal stealth build, sometimes I’ll run pistol/pistol. I’ve been running around with spirit weapons on my guardians. World versus World is a place where you can mostly just screw around with whatever builds you use.

And you’re terrible because you can’t counter it, and even moreso for claiming that I’m the one relying on it when you have just stated that you’re the one doing so yourself. Hypocrite much?

And no, you shouldn’t assume anything, but you do so anyways.

I’m going to stop replying to this since you’re beyond logical thought and reason.

I cant counter it because there is no counter. You proved that yourself because you cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, which makes you believe there are skills out there that can counter stealth because you failed at using the perma stealth build.

It’s not that you dont use the perma stealth build. It is that you cant. Therefore, you have to resort to an inferior build. You are relying on stealth, but are not even able to use it at its broken potential. Then you say that stealth is not OP.

Everybody knows as much except for someone here. Even a dev admitted that he could not catch a thief in a livestream.

We all know that the devs arent really good players so saying they cant catch one doesnt mean much. catching a thief is very similar to catching a warrior or the new mesmer meta scepter torch staff. All very strong all very hard to kill.

As a thief, i feel we should not be able to chain stealth like what current thieves are doing with d/p or d/d and smoke screen. The only skill that should grant long duration stealth is Shadow refuge which has high risk and high reward due to the fact you can pull/push them out and it has a long CD.

If they simply nerf how chain stealthing works we wouldnt need stealth trap or skills that reveal players.

PS why are we discussing perma stealth thieves here? why not move those talk to another section and concentrate on the upcoming changes

Vi Au.8341:

Advent Leader.1083:

Just a side thought about thief LS: how about making it stealing one boon, but sharing it to allies? Would it be OP?

they will have to make it prioritize boon removal like bountiful theft which removes stability and aegis first than protection.

all other boon removal are sort of bad because it removes random boons.

I think one issue Anet should work on is boon removal/stealing/corrupting priority. Make it less random.

They should probably either make boon removal either go on specific boon priority when removing stealing, or make it so that it either goes by stack based boon removal (last applied gets removed) or queue removal (first applied gets removed).

I was super hoping for the perma store ranger pet option. This just isn’t going to happen is it lol.

Other than that all looks good, warriors have amazing dps, and now will be buffed up to amazing support, wondering why I should log on to anything else =D

Advent Leader.1083:

Vi Au.8341:

Advent Leader.1083:

Just a side thought about thief LS: how about making it stealing one boon, but sharing it to allies? Would it be OP?

they will have to make it prioritize boon removal like bountiful theft which removes stability and aegis first than protection.

all other boon removal are sort of bad because it removes random boons.

I think one issue Anet should work on is boon removal/stealing/corrupting priority. Make it less random.

They should probably either make boon removal either go on specific boon priority when removing stealing, or make it so that it either goes by stack based boon removal (last applied gets removed) or queue removal (first applied gets removed).

Point is random boon removal is a terrible mechanic.

Fletch.3572:

I was super hoping for the perma store ranger pet option. This just isn’t going to happen is it lol.

Other than that all looks good, warriors have amazing dps, and now will be buffed up to amazing support, wondering why I should log on to anything else =D

I was hoping the same for our suicidal pet mechanics.

Those balance fixes look very cool !

Can I propose an idea for support sigils ?
Right now there are not many support sigils available for elementalist ( we cant’ switch weapons in combat), I like to run helear/buffer and the only viable sigil to improve his effectiveness is the [superior sigil of life].

Some ideas :

. + 5% healing power.
. + 5% stack duration.
. 30% on dodge, give protection to all nearby allies.
. 30% on skill, cure a condition to all nearby allies.

Sick ‘Em will now apply ‘Revealed” to enemies they target.
Ok people want some counter to stealth i can get that but why…

We’re also looking at shaving the efficiency of Flanking Strike slightly, so that it now only removes 1 boon instead of 2.

Why are you guys nerfing the only really decent option of a non-stealth thief too?
Nailing hard both stealth thieves and non-stealth thieves this while other classes get only improvements… we got venomus auroa yey… and some pistol main hand that prob wont even be worth as always

Vi Au.8341:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

Turtle Dragon.9241:

raahk.2786:

@turtledragon

And that proves that you rush to conclusions because you assume too much.
You wanna know the counter to stealth? Try swinging your sword. Try AoE. Try correct positioning, and correct timing of certain skills to stun, knockback, or pull the thief.

But nah, you’re just gonna wait until the update so you don’t have to think about anything.

You cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, stop talking big please.

I’m not the one who is dying on my Thief when I have access to Stealth.
FYI my Thief has ran the scenario above multiple times, and I have yet to see anyone able to counter it and kill me. Am I just too good? Or is Stealth just broken?
Wait you ran this scenario too, but you died? You died because…Wait that’s obvious.

Spamming 1 to swing my sword that the Thief can clearly see and avoid.
Trying to AoE something I cant see.
Stunning my target, wait what target?
Use Pull? Pull have 40-60 recharge, Thieves have 5 skills of which some have no recharge to get back into Stealth.

With the update, I hope to see more skills that apply Revealed to Thieves.

Did I ever say that I was utilizing the perma stealth build? No, I didn’t. Again, you assume too much.
Skills aren’t needed, player skill is, but you’ll await the update because you’re terrible.

I use perma stealth build and nevr die. you claim that I am terrible.
You use a build inferior to perma stealth build and die, and you claim to be good.

Logic much?

You cant even copy the perma stealth build correctly or use it correctly, and you are dying. I shouldnt even need to assume anything, this is obvious

I know the permastealth build, but I don’t use it. Why? because it’s world versus world. Sometimes I’ll run a normal stealth build, sometimes I’ll run pistol/pistol. I’ve been running around with spirit weapons on my guardians. World versus World is a place where you can mostly just screw around with whatever builds you use.

And you’re terrible because you can’t counter it, and even moreso for claiming that I’m the one relying on it when you have just stated that you’re the one doing so yourself. Hypocrite much?

And no, you shouldn’t assume anything, but you do so anyways.

I’m going to stop replying to this since you’re beyond logical thought and reason.

I cant counter it because there is no counter. You proved that yourself because you cant even name a single skill that can counter stealth, which makes you believe there are skills out there that can counter stealth because you failed at using the perma stealth build.

It’s not that you dont use the perma stealth build. It is that you cant. Therefore, you have to resort to an inferior build. You are relying on stealth, but are not even able to use it at its broken potential. Then you say that stealth is not OP.

Everybody knows as much except for someone here. Even a dev admitted that he could not catch a thief in a livestream.

We all know that the devs arent really good players so saying they cant catch one doesnt mean much. catching a thief is very similar to catching a warrior or the new mesmer meta scepter torch staff. All very strong all very hard to kill.

As a thief, i feel we should not be able to chain stealth like what current thieves are doing with d/p or d/d and smoke screen. The only skill that should grant long duration stealth is Shadow refuge which has high risk and high reward due to the fact you can pull/push them out and it has a long CD.

If they simply nerf how chain stealthing works we wouldnt need stealth trap or skills that reveal players.

PS why are we discussing perma stealth thieves here? why not move those talk to another section and concentrate on the upcoming changes

The dev may not be a good player, but they are the ones that are balancing the game. But what you are saying there, i totally agree with. Stealth is not even a boon, it should not be stackable. Shadow’s Refuge could be changed, instead of pulsing 3s Stealth for 4 seconds, it should give 12s Stealth immediately but if you step out before the AoE ends, you are Revealed. Rest of Stealth skills should just provide their Stealth duration and if another stealth skill is used, take the highest between current remaining stealth and duration of new stealth.

This is a similar situation from back from GW1, Shadow Form and Permasins.
Except that the latter was used for PvE farming rather than PvP/WvW purposes.
Perma anything is bad balancing, using the skills when it is needed makes the game interesting.

Engineers welcome changes to make turrets increasingly viable for pve & wvw. However turrets need a few seconds of invulnerability to even survive their setup animation and fire once. Turrets need to fire their over charge instantly not with several seconds delay. Turrets need to apply and benefit from runes traits and sigils properly. The 30+ major bugs with turrets need fixing, including massively increased hitboxes broken fire rates broken over charges broken deployment range.

Please for once do work on turrets without failing to think about deployable versions and supply drop versions.

Ability to use grenades and flamethrower without 10 times more deadly retaliation damage incoming than damage you cause.

Elixir gun doing some damage and more support.

Better pistol pistol and rifle builds.

Delete bomb radius increase trait, make base radius of all bombs 350. Add a new rifle and pistol trait instead.

Add more engineer weapon choices.

Big Tower.5423:

Hello anet! i love your changes. but thief needs better access to fury. due to thief being the class that should have highest fury.

dat argumentation

Regarding the explosives on engineer will there be anything done to improve where mines land for both the mine toolbelt skill and the trait that sprays mines all over the place as well as the shrapnel racial mine?

These things still have a problem going off while mobs especially big mobs are dancing all over the place on top of them.

Also, is anything being done about condition damage stacking? This is especially important for classes which are heavy condition classes no matter their build!

Another option is to make stealth similar to ele aura. you can reapply as much as you want but it only last 3sec.

as for shadow refuge, just make it a different type of stealth like mesmer stealth.

stealth as it is is not a huge issue, what most ppl have complaints with perma stealth

Can I get confirmation on the way the tab targeting changes will work? Will players have a higher priority than Ranger spirits, necro minions and mesmer clones? If so I won’t be playing any more WvW or sPvP ever as all three classes rely very heavily on enemies having to target the player purposefully – it would be a HUGE nerf for any PvP content to have tab targeting prioritize players over clones, minions and spirits…

Elementalist:

- Signet build is still not viable.
- Glyphs still absolutely suck.
- Fire still has many useless traits and is horrible for non-fire users
- ARCANA IS STILL REQUIRED DUE TO STUPID ATTUNEMENT RECHARGE MECHANICS AND BLASTING STAFF.
- Lowest hp and armour means go water or go home for large scale pvp.
- Toughness is still a horrible stat.
- Massive reliance on survivability skills.
- No viable Condition build outside of solo content such as Liadri.

Your changes do nothing to address the core problems of the elementalist.

For my mesm i want two things:

1) Bounce skills priorities. It is stupid when they kill grey neutral animals instead of doing something useful. And even aggro more mobs through them.

2) Clones created from “dodge” (thx to trait) MUST NOT AGGRO NEUTRAL MONSTERS around me!

Fix these two things and will be happy enough.

Meh! The ele changes are underwhelming to me so i wont be coming back anytime soon.

In the great Ranger vs Thief: Who has been nerfed more debate I will just post these facts here

Ranger Shortbow auto attack speed was nerfed because Anet didn’t like the animation and no damage increase was given to keep dps the same.

Ranger SB range was decreased to bring it in line with thief Shrotbow while nothing has been done about Warrior Rifle, Mesmer Greatsword, Guardian Spear, Necro Axe, Elementalist dagger all having bigger ranges then other classes versions of those weapons.

All Ranger specs across all game modes got massive damage nerf when they nerfed pets to weaken the least sturdiest pvp bunker build.

Firefly.5982:

Can I get confirmation on the way the tab targeting changes will work? Will players have a higher priority than Ranger spirits, necro minions and mesmer clones? If so I won’t be playing any more WvW or sPvP ever as all three classes rely very heavily on enemies having to target the player purposefully – it would be a HUGE nerf for any PvP content to have tab targeting prioritize players over clones, minions and spirits…

Your question seems to be adequately addressed by the original post. Nothing in there suggests that a player would have higher priority than a clone… they are considered in this context as equal and the same.

JonathanSharp.7094:

Tab Targeting Improvements

• Now prioritizes Champs/Legendary, then players/clones, then everything else

Given clones have the same priority as players…how about spirits and minions? Am I the only one seeing this as the possible biggest nerf ever to rangers and necros in wvw and sPvP? O_o

Firefly.5982:

Given clones have the same priority as players…how about spirits and minions? Am I the only one seeing this as the possible biggest nerf ever to rangers and necros in wvw and sPvP? O_o

Not really. As an MM necro, unless your opposition’s a 100% rushdown build, they need to kill your minions to reduce your healing enough to deal serious damage.

While I welcome the changes, I have to say that I would have rather seen an across-the-board shave/reduction in damage output by everything. Frankly, it’s the damage that kills people.

Tweaking things is nice, and giving people alternate ways of removing conditions is cute, but in many cases people have already maximised their ability to do this and still get killed by condi spam. Giving them another method to clean conditions doesn’t help them, it just gives them an alternative way to postpone the inevitable.

LoreChief.8391:

…
sry but was too long to quote

About Sick’Em:

I don’t think it will be as bad as you think, you will always be able to dodge or counter “Sick’em”, it will give the ranger a real possibility to counter stalth, which wasn’t possible.
It should have ben like this from the beginning, finally anet is adressing this problem.

The ranger, from the official site :
"
Rangers rely on a keen eye, a steady hand, and the power of nature itself. Unparalleled archers, rangers are capable of bringing down foes from a distance with their bows. With traps, nature spirits, and a stable of loyal pets at their command, rangers can adapt to ANY situation."

The only thing I fear for the upcoming changes is the increase of the pet hp, not that changes anything in small groups fight ( who kills pets ? ), its just to OP for camp flipping, with that boost even a fully upgrade camp is easy business.

Awesome changes all around, since you’re looking a guardian meditations, my request would be to make merciful intervention ground targetable to make it viable.

PSX.9250:

Meh! The ele changes are underwhelming to me so i wont be coming back anytime soon.

Pretty much. Not sure if I should bother…

Ranger
I want to put away my pet permamently. Because it´s annoying in jumping puzzles and a hintrance.

Ok. I’ve gone away and thought about it. As for engies, I still think the turret idea stinks.

What I would like to see, as someone that runs not one, but 2 engies (yes, I love the class), is:

1. weapon swap. Not like we have a lot of weapons, but I’d love to swap pistols for rifle sometimes.
2. make turrets tougher, or make them ignore aoe skills. They draw aggro like crazy, but are one-shot by ordinary monsters. Too weak to do any good.
3. make healing turret NOT targetable. No other class has their aoe heals draw aggro and be destroyed.
4. make turrets target whatever the player has targeted when they drop them. Then if the player changes targets, the turrets do not, until the target is dead. then it is closest target/player target.
5. fix the flamethrower animation. The skill does not reach as far as the flames do.
6. give us the option to make skills like the grenades be throwable at a target, not ground targeting. Many of us are just too slow for ground targeting, or lose our mouse cursor too easily. In fights, I run 8-10 fps usually, ground targeting just doesn’t work, unless I can stand still and use it.

Any plan on making venom worth using (outside of baskilisk and devourer) without spending 30 points for a trait which is responsible for them being terrible on their own to begin with?

Puru.4217:

Any plan on making venom worth using (outside of baskilisk and devourer) without spending 30 points for a trait which is responsible for them being terrible on their own to begin with?

I agree as a PVE thief all of the venoms and poisons are useless

tigirius.9014:

Puru.4217:

Any plan on making venom worth using (outside of baskilisk and devourer) without spending 30 points for a trait which is responsible for them being terrible on their own to begin with?

I agree as a PVE thief all of the venoms and poisons are useless

And dont forget the traps or the fights underwater should you play a condition build

So, rangers get a way to entirely negate a whole trait line. This in itself wouldn’t be horrible, if thieves had decent alternatives.

Traps – garbage, with maybe the exception of Shadow Trap. CD is far too long on all traps, making them nearly useless.

Venoms – Unless heavily traited, borderline crap. CDs on use are again, too high. Other classes can land debuffs rapidly, over and over again. Traits that buff venoms are lackluster overall.

Weapon Sets:

P/P is a set that doesn’t know what it’s supposed to do, and has no innate access to stealth. Is it a condition set? Is it a direct damage set? It has elements of both, and doesn’t do either well.

P/D – relies heavily upon stealth to do any sort of damage. Most that use this set spec heavily into shadow arts, which will be made useless by Sic’ Em. Unless you can come up with something viable for main-hand pistol (which I find unlikely, given Anet’s track record regarding thieves), this will possibly becomes another less-used set.

Then there are a ton of abilities/utilites/traits that either don’t work right, are buggy, or are detrimental to a thief.

Some examples:

Last Refuge – This one trait is more detrimental to a thief than a ranger getting a reveal ability on Sic’ Em. Frankly, I’d rather just lose the 5 point trait entirely, than be forced to have it.

Improvisation – No one runs this. At all. Total crap shoot using it.

Back Fighting – Worthless, no one would use this over another trait.

Corrosive traps – Never used, no one uses traps enough to warrant it, as traps are a waste of a utility.

Venomous Aura – Would be a good grandmaster trait, if venoms were more useful.

Power Shots – 5% damage increase to shortbows and harpoons? Really?

Hard to catch – Decent, although the teleport more often than not puts you in a worse location, or quite often, stuck in geometry if near a wall or something.

Master Trapper – Again, not used because traps aren’t worth using.

Then there is Scorpion Wire. at least 70% of the time, all it does is cause an interrupt (if we’re lucky) and doesn’t pull the target more than a foot or so, due to poor programming.

The bottom line is, until Anet can fix the broken things a thief has, and make nearly 50% of a thief’s abilities worth using (except in very niche circumstances), we’re pigeon-holed into HAVING to rely on stealth, with the exception of S/D, and even that is getting a nerf.

How about you tell US what you expect the thief to do, instead of us trying to make things work?

Those that whine about stealth, typically don’t want to be bothered to learn how to counter it.

Yes! Thank you! Please come again!

Condi – Can we get individual stacks/affect objects. It’s still going to be pointless in group PvE otherwise. (Unless ya’s come up with some other thing like making it do direct dam on object/stack cap, so people actually get credit on group events/stop stealing others dam in dungys)

Necro – Huge worry is necro in dungy being behind on Dodge/Block/Invul now the DS rework. Reanimator trait is good to change to Vigor on Crit if you wanted to do something non-creative.

Shout heal warriors new dungeon meta.