Guild Wars 2

Ashen.2907:

Zelulose.8695:

Ashen.2907:

Zelulose.8695:

It kind of Gets worst since Spending USD can get you to level 80 without even playing the game technically. You could just buy yourself to end game content currently.

One can instant level to 80 without spending a dime.

Only if they already have a level 80 unless HoT changed that and ruined pve further for new players.

Been able to insta level to 80 since well before HOT via tomes. No need for an 80, just a willingness to do one’s dailies.

People fast leveled to 80 with crafting right at launch. I’m not sure when the first level 80 was, but it was only a few days after the game launched. So fast leveling has existed from the very beginning.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Ashen.2907:

Zelulose.8695:

Ashen.2907:

Zelulose.8695:

It kind of Gets worst since Spending USD can get you to level 80 without even playing the game technically. You could just buy yourself to end game content currently.

One can instant level to 80 without spending a dime.

Only if they already have a level 80 unless HoT changed that and ruined pve further for new players.

Been able to insta level to 80 since well before HOT via tomes. No need for an 80, just a willingness to do one’s dailies.

People fast leveled to 80 with crafting right at launch. I’m not sure when the first level 80 was, but it was only a few days after the game launched. So fast leveling has existed from the very beginning.

I don’t craft and had forgotten about that. Wasn’t there a story about someone whose guild fed him the mats needed to fast level to 80 in something like a couple of days after launch?

Ashen.2907:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Ashen.2907:

Zelulose.8695:

Ashen.2907:

Zelulose.8695:

It kind of Gets worst since Spending USD can get you to level 80 without even playing the game technically. You could just buy yourself to end game content currently.

One can instant level to 80 without spending a dime.

Only if they already have a level 80 unless HoT changed that and ruined pve further for new players.

Been able to insta level to 80 since well before HOT via tomes. No need for an 80, just a willingness to do one’s dailies.

People fast leveled to 80 with crafting right at launch. I’m not sure when the first level 80 was, but it was only a few days after the game launched. So fast leveling has existed from the very beginning.

I don’t craft and had forgotten about that. Wasn’t there a story about someone whose guild fed him the mats needed to fast level to 80 in something like a couple of days after launch?

That’s correct. He had his guild send him all they got so he could use those mats to craft and get exp and be the first level 80 in the game.

Before there were tomes, crafting to level 80 was fairly common is you wanted to fast level.

^ According to the story he leveled to 60 in normal PvE fashion then his guild helped him craft level the last 20. Apparently it was done in 32 hours during headstart. I wonder if he still plays.

MO’s reddit post about it.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/yy07z/congratulations_and_apologies_to_surfeuze_and_war/

But yeah craft leveling was a thing before tomes. I leveled two alts that way.

Zelulose.8695:

It kind of Gets worst since Spending USD can get you to level 80 without even playing the game technically. You could just buy yourself to end game content currently which is why I feel bad for the people in pve and am satisfied with my cheap gear. All the players doing anything in pve aren’t unique players can spend USD to get everything they have with less time.

How? You mean as in actually buying the game?

Someone has more play money than me.

What will I ever do with life?

Unless someone gives me gold, the only gold I care about is my own.

I’m just calling out the strategy used in GW2 to make people buy gems. They make things ingame very hard to achieve and then offer a cash shop method of getting it. The games I played that were the most fun pve wise didn’t need the fanciest graphics. It was known that if you went in and fought a tough boss that it took an adventure/ maze to get too you walked away with a new epic weapon and became stronger somehow. There still were rare items the bosses would drop in addition to these epic boss drops that you would get not crafting or doing achievements but by defeating the boss you got the complete weapon. That was adventure. The earliest game I played that captivated players with great monster drops and a good story-line was Champions of Norrath (PS2) as the drops were useful!

Gw2 has a story line but it feels like the magic is gone when I do pve. I don’t pve to find much anymore. Everything epic is on the TP and can be bought with gems.

the time has come for a change. no longer will the top 1% be able to buy their way into politics, no longer will our great country continue to be degraded by large corporations who only look after their own self interest…..

wait wut.

The OP has some points and there are some things about the games economy, that I would like to see changed, even if that means that it will be negative for like 1% of the games community..

But if that 1% of the game is richer, than then 99% of the rest of the community together, then theres somethign really wrong in this game.
Clearly, it is more than understandable, that Anet wants us that we pay thignjs in the game with real money, because its more comfortable to get thast way the gold that you need for things in the game quickly.

However, this doesn’t mean, that there can’t and should exist mechanics in this game, that keep the economy so far in check, that the gap between poor players and rich players doesn’t grow so extremely into the unendlessness, because of there being absolutely no mechanics, which stop in general this bad movement of money flow, this disparity between both sides that couln’t be any bigger, where one side has far more Gold than a single person will ever need in this Game for years and where most others crab around at mostly always lesser than approx 200-1000 Gold, if not even far under this line, so basically people, which are unable to buy anythign from the TP, or if they do, are instantly after the buy bankrupt or nearly bankrupt in most cases and have to farm first again for a long time, before they become able to buy again something that they want, while the uber rich can let basically their money work for them self through the TP and if wanted just need only to wait on the right time, where they can find something in the market that they can buy in super cheap and sell then for liek double the price or higher, when they practically own the whole offer of an item and they are the only source to get that item, because the item has been either permanently or temporarly removed from the game.
This is called Monopoly!! And Monopolies are bad for the economy, there you can say what you want, thats fact!
Thats the reason why there exist for that in real life things like cartels, that make sure, that a monopoly doesn’t get created at all in a country, so that small portions of a market can’t rule over the a large market alone.

i’d like to see for the economy the following changes to this game:

1: The Game receives a new maximum Gold Limit you can own per Account by 1000 Gold (GW1 had also a Limit, that you could own maximum 1000 Platin for the Account Chest and 100 Platin on characters) GW2 will use now the same System. You can have now maximum 1000 Gold in the chest per Account and maximum 100 Gold on your Chartacters.
This will limit the maximum Gold one will be able to store and will discourage super rich people to get richer and richer, because it iwll become more of a hassle to organize all the Gold, instead of spending it and removing it out of the Game or being maybe a bit more generous and helping out every now and then some poor players out.

2: The Trading Post Taxes get changed to the point, that they proportionally become significantly bigger for players, that are super rich, to ensure that the economy of this game stays healthy and also to discourage people to get uber rich and to try to build up monopolies of so much Gold that they become able to buy out stocks of items just to resell them then greedily for double/tripple the price for what they bought the stuff in.

3: Relisting Items and Preordering Items gets changed, underbidding for a lousy single copper won’t be possible anymore. Relisting and Preordering will be now only possible, if the prices are at least 5% higher/lower than what is currently the highest/lowest price. This will benefit especially parts of the market, where people constantly underbit themself to ensure, that people buy from them, but if you can just underbit people with a freaking single coppe,r its no miracly, that players stay always so super high, that many people can’t buy the things from the TP, or first after having done some obcene and absurd money grinding or beign lucky with some loot drops that give them instantly some bigger gold income if they sell it, like a unneeded precursor, or like an already unlocked very valuable dye …

4: Waypoints will get changed to cost money based on your total money that you own on your account, instead of having a general small cost, they costs will grow now also if you get richer and richer, so that WPs stay a good money sink also over time.
So easiest way for getting lower WP costs is, spend some Gold instead of playing Dagobert Duck and hoarding gold like there is no tomorrow… Gold is there to spend it, not to hoard it forever, only when Gold is constantly in flow and also constantlyx removed from a game like GW, only then you have a healthy economy, where poorer players can also catch up slowly and where a game doesn’t get super inflatious prices for things in the tp, just to unlock some skins or to get an achievement done, because of the game offering only very poor designed options of obtaining said things in the game which makes it super rich players very easy to become even richer, because these people abuse the fact naturally on the cost of the poorer players, that the game offers for certain things only very limited ways of income for the offer, especially when making something self barely lets you save any money worth it, when its just quicker to preorder something, if you are willing to wait.

Best example for this is Pendant of Orr, from all items required to get a single lousy achievement done, this is by far the most costy item that rich people abuse to get richer, which the rich palyrs manipulate to keep at high cost at any time, because items like these are it with that rich players make quickly more money with due to buying in when its cheap and selling again, when they make some few Gold with it that is higher income than the trading post taxes they have to pay so that they make profit from the item. Simple market basics.

All othe items for that achievement are alot lesser valuable, because there exists a much steadier income of the offer, but due to the Pendant being not craftable somehow, and you can receive in rarely only as loot from very limited options naturally means, that rich people abuse this item to make quickly a few bucks with, while ruining for many people that aren’t that rich an achievement basically, because they ruin with their greed the absolut cost/benefit relationship of that item for the achievement, because the reward of the achievement is absolutely not worth all the money spend for the required items, but as long those greedy rich players can make moeny from such items, they naturally don’t care if their personal greed ruins the game for many other players. However, thats an other topic.

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

Simply said, there are things, that Guild Wars 1 has made significantly better and I wish they’d return in favor of this games economy.

Zelulose.8695:

I’m just calling out the strategy used in GW2 to make people buy gems. They make things ingame very hard to achieve and then offer a cash shop method of getting it. The games I played that were the most fun pve wise didn’t need the fanciest graphics. It was known that if you went in and fought a tough boss that it took an adventure/ maze to get too you walked away with a new epic weapon and became stronger somehow. There still were rare items the bosses would drop in addition to these epic boss drops that you would get not crafting or doing achievements but by defeating the boss you got the complete weapon. That was adventure. The earliest game I played that captivated players with great monster drops and a good story-line was Champions of Norrath (PS2) as the drops were useful!

Gw2 has a story line but it feels like the magic is gone when I do pve. I don’t pve to find much anymore. Everything epic is on the TP and can be bought with gems.

I don’t think you’re necessarily wrong, but I think you’re only looking at one side of it.

Yes it’s possible to convert gems to gold and use it to level by crafting or with boosters (or even buy enough black lion keys to get 80 tomes of knowledge although that could be stupidly expensive compared to other alternatives), and then you can buy or craft a full set of exotics or even ascended equipment.

But it doesn’t actually matter because it doesn’t give you an advantage over someone who levelled normally. They will almost certainly have enough karma (or a combination of karma, gold and other currencies) to also get a full set of exotics right away. Ascended will take longer but you specified PvE and ascended really doesn’t make much difference in PvE (outside of Fractals).

More importantly though the person who levelled normally will have more experience playing their character. Even if the person who paid to skip ahead copies a build off a website they won’t have the experience and understanding of the game to use it effectively (especially since it will most likely be a glass cannon build).

They’re also more likely to not know what there is to do or how to do it (like how to find dungeons and form parties to do them or how to understand a meta-event chain in level 80 maps), and they’ll have skipped a huge amount of the earlier content.

I’m not denying it happens, because I’ve actually played with people who paid real money to advance their characters. But they were without exception some of the worst players I’ve encountered. Nice people, willing to learn, but no good at the game. In other words it actually put them at a major disadvantage compared to people who didn’t spend that money.

(And on the other side as someone who has only ever spent money to buy novelty items and convenience things like extra bank tabs from the gem store I’ve never found anything in this game, especially PvE ‘very hard to achieve’ or felt like spending money would make it any easier.)

Anet seems deadly opposed to free market in my opinion.

Orpheal.8263:

The OP has some points and there are some things about the games economy, that I would like to see changed, even if that means that it will be negative for like 1% of the games community..

But if that 1% of the game is richer, than then 99% of the rest of the community together, then theres somethign really wrong in this game.
Clearly, it is more than understandable, that Anet wants us that we pay thignjs in the game with real money, because its more comfortable to get thast way the gold that you need for things in the game quickly.

However, this doesn’t mean, that there can’t and should exist mechanics in this game, that keep the economy so far in check, that the gap between poor players and rich players doesn’t grow so extremely into the unendlessness, because of there being absolutely no mechanics, which stop in general this bad movement of money flow, this disparity between both sides that couln’t be any bigger, where one side has far more Gold than a single person will ever need in this Game for years and where most others crab around at mostly always lesser than approx 200-1000 Gold, if not even far under this line, so basically people, which are unable to buy anythign from the TP, or if they do, are instantly after the buy bankrupt or nearly bankrupt in most cases and have to farm first again for a long time, before they become able to buy again something that they want, while the uber rich can let basically their money work for them self through the TP and if wanted just need only to wait on the right time, where they can find something in the market that they can buy in super cheap and sell then for liek double the price or higher, when they practically own the whole offer of an item and they are the only source to get that item, because the item has been either permanently or temporarly removed from the game.
This is called Monopoly!! And Monopolies are bad for the economy, there you can say what you want, thats fact!
Thats the reason why there exist for that in real life things like cartels, that make sure, that a monopoly doesn’t get created at all in a country, so that small portions of a market can’t rule over the a large market alone.

i’d like to see for the economy the following changes to this game:

1: The Game receives a new maximum Gold Limit you can own per Account by 1000 Gold (GW1 had also a Limit, that you could own maximum 1000 Platin for the Account Chest and 100 Platin on characters) GW2 will use now the same System. You can have now maximum 1000 Gold in the chest per Account and maximum 100 Gold on your Chartacters.
This will limit the maximum Gold one will be able to store and will discourage super rich people to get richer and richer, because it iwll become more of a hassle to organize all the Gold, instead of spending it and removing it out of the Game or being maybe a bit more generous and helping out every now and then some poor players out.

2: The Trading Post Taxes get changed to the point, that they proportionally become significantly bigger for players, that are super rich, to ensure that the economy of this game stays healthy and also to discourage people to get uber rich and to try to build up monopolies of so much Gold that they become able to buy out stocks of items just to resell them then greedily for double/tripple the price for what they bought the stuff in.

3: Relisting Items and Preordering Items gets changed, underbidding for a lousy single copper won’t be possible anymore. Relisting and Preordering will be now only possible, if the prices are at least 5% higher/lower than what is currently the highest/lowest price. This will benefit especially parts of the market, where people constantly underbit themself to ensure, that people buy from them, but if you can just underbit people with a freaking single coppe,r its no miracly, that players stay always so super high, that many people can’t buy the things from the TP, or first after having done some obcene and absurd money grinding or beign lucky with some loot drops that give them instantly some bigger gold income if they sell it, like a unneeded precursor, or like an already unlocked very valuable dye …

4: Waypoints will get changed to cost money based on your total money that you own on your account, instead of having a general small cost, they costs will grow now also if you get richer and richer, so that WPs stay a good money sink also over time.
So easiest way for getting lower WP costs is, spend some Gold instead of playing Dagobert Duck and hoarding gold like there is no tomorrow… Gold is there to spend it, not to hoard it forever, only when Gold is constantly in flow and also constantlyx removed from a game like GW, only then you have a healthy economy, where poorer players can also catch up slowly and where a game doesn’t get super inflatious prices for things in the tp, just to unlock some skins or to get an achievement done, because of the game offering only very poor designed options of obtaining said things in the game which makes it super rich players very easy to become even richer, because these people abuse the fact naturally on the cost of the poorer players, that the game offers for certain things only very limited ways of income for the offer, especially when making something self barely lets you save any money worth it, when its just quicker to preorder something, if you are willing to wait.

Best example for this is Pendant of Orr, from all items required to get a single lousy achievement done, this is by far the most costy item that rich people abuse to get richer, which the rich palyrs manipulate to keep at high cost at any time, because items like these are it with that rich players make quickly more money with due to buying in when its cheap and selling again, when they make some few Gold with it that is higher income than the trading post taxes they have to pay so that they make profit from the item. Simple market basics.

All othe items for that achievement are alot lesser valuable, because there exists a much steadier income of the offer, but due to the Pendant being not craftable somehow, and you can receive in rarely only as loot from very limited options naturally means, that rich people abuse this item to make quickly a few bucks with, while ruining for many people that aren’t that rich an achievement basically, because they ruin with their greed the absolut cost/benefit relationship of that item for the achievement, because the reward of the achievement is absolutely not worth all the money spend for the required items, but as long those greedy rich players can make moeny from such items, they naturally don’t care if their personal greed ruins the game for many other players. However, thats an other topic.

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

Simply said, there are things, that Guild Wars 1 has made significantly better and I wish they’d return in favor of this games economy.

Man I seriously hope you just forgot the /s tag…

I am glad I got a permanent bank license. But quite honestly all it do is save you a few second when going to the bank.

I don’t think it is something you should get angry over.

infinitenoah.8296:

Anet seems deadly opposed to free market in my opinion.

Actually, the game has the ultimate free market.

Firefly.5982:

I am not lazy. I am actually working hard for my gold in GW2 (which is sad in itself). But with this stuff going on it will be forever impossible for me (and 99% of players) to ever catch up. I can never make enough gold because I can only do it slowly and by the time I get close to buying what I want it gets bought up and relisted at 2 or 3 times the price.

Catch up to what? If you can afford the things you need, then who cares that someone else has more than you?

What is it that you want to buy so badly? There’s no reason you need 100,000 gold. Nothing in this game requires that. Anyone who plays even 10hrs/week can easily amass 60-100g/week (depending on how driven you are—I use 10hrs/week because that’s about all I play and that’s how much I typically make these days).

That’s the problem with kids these days. They think "I work hard (which I’m sure “hard” is a complete exaggeration), I should be making as much as the richest guy, that’s not FAIR!" These are the same people that believe the government should give them everything.

The daily alone is a guaranteed 14g/week. Throw in ascended crafting every day, fractals dailies, dungeon running, heck even just HoT meta for the loot to salvage and sell, world boss farming, T6 mats from laurels, the list goes on and on.

At this point in the game there’s no reason not to be making enough gold each week to cover everything you want. You may have to save up for a bit to get some high priced item, but that’s normal.

This isn’t a competition. Focus on yourself and not on what a few have that you don’t.

BTW, there are two kinds of mystic conduits available on the trading post. One of them is account bound, (can’t be resold), I bought one of these for less than 70 gold, way less than it cost for the permanent account access slot to put it in. The other one can be resold but that one is closer to 250-300 gold.

Orpheal.8263:

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

That’s not a terrible idea if only 1 person per household plays the game. But it’s really not uncommon to encounter people who play together with their whole family, or with their housemates.

Do you really think it’s fair to say only the first 3 of them can have accounts and anyone else is out of luck (bear in mind it’s against the EULA to share an account, even with another person at the same IP address) because you’re concerned that someone else somewhere in the world may be using their 4th account to get an additional 2g from dailies?

Danikat.8537:

Orpheal.8263:

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

That’s not a terrible idea if only 1 person per household plays the game. But it’s really not uncommon to encounter people who play together with their whole family, or with their housemates.

Do you really think it’s fair to say only the first 3 of them can have accounts and anyone else is out of luck (bear in mind it’s against the EULA to share an account, even with another person at the same IP address) because you’re concerned that someone else somewhere in the world may be using their 4th account to get an additional 2g from dailies?

Pretty much what Danikat said. There is 4 in my household who play GW2. Each with their own account. There are several people in my guild who have at least 3 players per house hold. imo this limiting would hurt Anet in the long run. Considering how many people bought multiple accounts when they sold them for 10.00 per. That would be like Anet saying, thanks for the money but now those accounts are worthless. I disagree with this suggestion. And yes I bought my fair share of multiple accounts when they sold for 10 buck each. But I do not do the dailies on all of them. I simply don’t have time. But for those who do. That would be a slap in their face because when they bought the additional accounts that wasn’t part of the deal in purchasing them.

Danikat.8537:

Orpheal.8263:

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

That’s not a terrible idea if only 1 person per household plays the game. But it’s really not uncommon to encounter people who play together with their whole family, or with their housemates.

Do you really think it’s fair to say only the first 3 of them can have accounts and anyone else is out of luck (bear in mind it’s against the EULA to share an account, even with another person at the same IP address) because you’re concerned that someone else somewhere in the world may be using their 4th account to get an additional 2g from dailies?

Also, some people have dynamic IP’s.

Seera.5916:

Danikat.8537:

Orpheal.8263:

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

That’s not a terrible idea if only 1 person per household plays the game. But it’s really not uncommon to encounter people who play together with their whole family, or with their housemates.

Do you really think it’s fair to say only the first 3 of them can have accounts and anyone else is out of luck (bear in mind it’s against the EULA to share an account, even with another person at the same IP address) because you’re concerned that someone else somewhere in the world may be using their 4th account to get an additional 2g from dailies?

Also, some people have dynamic IP’s.

And gold sellers probably spoof their IPs in the first place (which makes blanket IP range bans sorta useless).

Orpheal.8263:

The OP has some points and there are some things about the games economy, that I would like to see changed, even if that means that it will be negative for like 1% of the games community..

But if that 1% of the game is richer, than then 99% of the rest of the community together, then theres somethign really wrong in this game.
Clearly, it is more than understandable, that Anet wants us that we pay thignjs in the game with real money, because its more comfortable to get thast way the gold that you need for things in the game quickly.

Not really. A disparity in wealth is only a problem if it creates undue suffering. In real life, it becomes a problem when the poor are no longer able to afford necessities (food, water, shelter, safety, etc). But if you aren’t without necessities, then there isn’t really an issue. If I make 40k a year and my neighbor makes 140k a year, and I am not being deprived of anything necessary to live, then why should I care that they make more? If anything I should be glad to know someone is more fortunate than I am.

And herein lies my problem with all of these claims that the GW2 economy is broken somehow: There are no necessities in GW2. There is nobody who is being deprived of something that is necessary for them to function in the game. Sure, there are many frivolous things that you aren’t able to buy (invisible shoes, for example),but there’s no starving children in the street because invisible shoes are 4k gold. Gold is produced from thin air, and it is quite easy to acquire it either directly, or indirectly via gathering various materials. Everything is balanced around exotics, which are easily obtained through multiple means.

Orpheal.8263:

However, this doesn’t mean, that there can’t and should exist mechanics in this game, that keep the economy so far in check,

I’m going to cut this one off a bit early, because this devolves into a paragraph long run on sentence. But here are mechanics that exist in the game to keep the economy under control. There’s the TP tax, account bound and soulbound items.

Orpheal.8263:

This is called Monopoly!! And Monopolies are bad for the economy, there you can say what you want, thats fact!
Thats the reason why there exist for that in real life things like cartels, that make sure, that a monopoly doesn’t get created at all in a country, so that small portions of a market can’t rule over the a large market alone.

Not really. A monopoly isn’t necessarily good for an economy, but it isn’t necessarily bad, either. In fact, the real world is full of monopolistic competition, wherein each individual good is manufactured by one company, and the goods themselves are competing for your wallet. I.E. only Apple is allowed to make Iphones, but that won’t stop Samsung from making a similar but alternate product for you to buy.

Anyway, the problem with monopoly claims are that everything in the game appears from thin air. To have a true monopoly, you would need to have control over both the production and distribution of an item. That doesn’t happen in this game.

Orpheal.8263:

1: The Game receives a new maximum Gold Limit you can own per Account by 1000 Gold (GW1 had also a Limit, that you could own maximum 1000 Platin for the Account Chest and 100 Platin on characters) GW2 will use now the same System. You can have now maximum 1000 Gold in the chest per Account and maximum 100 Gold on your Chartacters.
This will limit the maximum Gold one will be able to store and will discourage super rich people to get richer and richer, because it iwll become more of a hassle to organize all the Gold, instead of spending it and removing it out of the Game or being maybe a bit more generous and helping out every now and then some poor players out.

This is a horrible idea that will hurt everyone and won’t accomplish the goal you set out to accomplish. I’ve played games with cash limits before. Phantasy Star Universe and City of Heroes, in particular, actually had limits on the amount of currency you could hold at any one time. This didn’t somehow limit players from becoming rich, as much as it just inconvenienced the average player. Here’s how:

#1: Alternate currencies were developed. Instead of trading meseta or influence, they would trade collections of items that were deemed more valuable. If you were to put a gold cap, players would start using stacks of ectoplasm as a currency instead of gold. In GW1, platinum became worthless, and ecto’s became the default currency of that game, too. By continually shifting investment to more valuable items, wealth can continue to accumulate.

#2: This meant that there were a large set of items that weren’t publicly traded. Due to the fact that, even if you try to arbitrarily cap wealth, work hours and rarity still exist, there will inevitably be an item that the community values more than the gold cap. There will be a lot of items, actually. And these items will never be listed for trade, precisely because they cannot accurately be valued under a limited gold system. To get the top of the line stuff, you had to be in the know, and you also had to deal with the possibility that you’d be scammed due to the complexity of the trade. Players would have to swap accounts several times to facilitate the entirety of the gold transfer before the items would be exchanged, making it dangerous to trade.

To recap, the poor people pay, and the rich still get obscenely rich. Nothing is solved.

Orpheal.8263:

2: The Trading Post Taxes get changed to the point, that they proportionally become significantly bigger for players, that are super rich, to ensure that the economy of this game stays healthy and also to discourage people to get uber rich and to try to build up monopolies of so much Gold that they become able to buy out stocks of items just to resell them then greedily for double/tripple the price for what they bought the stuff in.

Again, this wouldn’t work. It doesn’t work that well in real life either. You may have heard the term “swiss bank account”. You see, the “swiss bank account” is infamous because it is highly confidential, so rich people will dump their money into an overseas account to hide their assets and avoid taxes. The same thing would happen here. If you have disproportionate taxes for wealthy players, then the player is just going to dump their money into another account or invest into items in order to hide their wealth, so they can trade at a level that everyone else would.

You also run the problem of punishing players unfairly if you go by total assets instead of just liquid gold. Then, players who don’t have a dime end up being punished because they bought a legendary weapon at some point, and now have a permanent tax because of a cosmetic choice.

Third, if you charge a higher tax in order to discourage wealthier players, this will just hurt the poor players again. Wealthier players will respond to this shifting tax by increasing the price of their goods to compensate. Everything becomes more expensive for poor players, because now the barrier to entry on trade is that much more difficult.

Orpheal.8263:

3: Relisting Items and Preordering Items gets changed, underbidding for a lousy single copper won’t be possible anymore. Relisting and Preordering will be now only possible, if the prices are at least 5% higher/lower than what is currently the highest/lowest price. This will benefit especially parts of the market, where people constantly underbit themself to ensure, that people buy from them, but if you can just underbit people with a freaking single coppe,r its no miracly, that players stay always so super high, that many people can’t buy the things from the TP, or first after having done some obcene and absurd money grinding or beign lucky with some loot drops that give them instantly some bigger gold income if they sell it, like a unneeded precursor, or like an already unlocked very valuable dye …

This just hurts competition and stagnates the market. Underbidding people isn’t a problem because you have to eat the 5% listing price. Players in competition for selling a high value good, this can actually consume a whole lot of wealth. Likewise, relisting items and bidding differences of 1 copper aren’t actually a problem. At all. The whole point of a buy offer is to be patient and wait for players who are willing to sell the item to you. If you have a problem with someone always out bidding you, you yourself can raise the top bid by a significant amount. There’s nothing stopping you yourself from raising the price by 5%.

Relisting increases availability, and the free bidding system allows the buy and sell prices to more closely match each other. This system does not need to be fixed, at all.

Orpheal.8263:

4: Waypoints will get changed to cost money based on your total money that you own on your account, instead of having a general small cost, they costs will grow now also if you get richer and richer, so that WPs stay a good money sink also over time.

There’s a big problem with this; the people who pay the most for waypoints are the people who are the worst at playing the game. Players who are constantly dying have to pay more money. So, by having a scaled cost per gold, the players who are undergeared or aren’t good at the game have to pay more, which makes them unable to afford better gear, which makes them lose more, etc. This change will cause elitism to skyrocket, because now horrible players don’t just cost you time, they cost you dozens of gold with each loss. Elitism means ascended only requirements and painful gear checks for the most valuable items (which themselves will raise in price, due to elitist demands), making the barrier to entry that much harder and making everything more expensive for poor players.

Think of what this does for content, too. The dungeon running community will take a massive hit, because instead of warping from dungeon to dungeon, they’ll be stuck running between them. Now, if you want to run a dungeon, the chances of getting a group together is reduced to nigh impossible, because nobody wants to pay a lot of money just to play with you. Same thing with world bosses, group events, and map wide meta events. Playing the game gets more painful for everyone.

Orpheal.8263:

So easiest way for getting lower WP costs is, spend some Gold instead of playing Dagobert Duck and hoarding gold like there is no tomorrow… Gold is there to spend it, not to hoard it forever, only when Gold is constantly in flow and also constantlyx removed from a game like GW, only then you have a healthy economy, where poorer players can also catch up slowly and where a game doesn’t get super inflatious prices for things in the tp, just to unlock some skins or to get an achievement done, because of the game offering only very poor designed options of obtaining said things in the game which makes it super rich players very easy to become even richer, because these people abuse the fact naturally on the cost of the poorer players, that the game offers for certain things only very limited ways of income for the offer, especially when making something self barely lets you save any money worth it, when its just quicker to preorder something, if you are willing to wait.

You know very little about how money works. The richest players in the game don’t just sit on top of a massive pile of gold. Their money is constantly shifting through various investments and materials. Their total gold “worth” is flowing through the economy constantly, buying things from players at prices they are willing to sell, and taking gambles on what players are willing to pay for an item later. This gives money to new players, and keeps the economy flowing so “poor players” are never left sitting on materials that no one is willing to buy.

The fact is, there is no “catching up”. You talk as if there is some inherent disadvantage to not having thousands of gold in this game. There really isn’t. At most, you can buy the rare cosmetic items and convenience items. “Oh wow, that person has a permanent hairstyle kit! Now I can’t beat his server in WvW?”. You’re talking about cosmetics as if they actually matter in this game. They don’t.

Also, while having a lot of wealth means that you can get capital and economic gains easier, it also means you can suffer from capital and economic losses more easily, too. If you’ve ever actually played the TP for money, you would’ve learned that not only is it not this grand magnificent money making device that only the rich get to use, but also that it is very likely you’ll encounter a downturn in an items value, causing you to have lost money overall. Unless you can make an immediate profit greater than 15% trading an item, you have to take a financial hit on the risk that the item you’ve bought will eventually be more valuable. Or, another bad case, if gold over-inflates so that the item you’re selling is now worth relatively less than what you bought it for.

Orpheal.8263:

Best example for this is Pendant of Orr, from all items required to get a single lousy achievement done, this is by far the most costy item that rich people abuse to get richer, which the rich palyrs manipulate to keep at high cost at any time, because items like these are it with that rich players make quickly more money with due to buying in when its cheap and selling again, when they make some few Gold with it that is higher income than the trading post taxes they have to pay so that they make profit from the item. Simple market basics.

I demand proof that this item is being abused. Because last I checked, it is an extremely rare drop from an event nobody does, and because of this it is so rare that the pendant is actually that valuable. Show me the palyrs that make this item too costy, because otherwise I’m just going to chalk this up to supply and demand. “Oh, this item is being abused because people buy it whenever there’s a cheap sell”. Seriously? You’re attributing to conspiracy something that is common sense.

Orpheal.8263:

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

Other people have already elaborated on horrible an idea this is. Punishes players for very little reason, extremely easy to bypass, and to cope with this problem you are encouraging the real world trading of accounts. Again, this does nothing to solve the problem you are proposing.

I suppose that is the best way to sum up every one of your suggestions. Make a series of drastic changes to solve a problem, when there is absolutely no evidence that this is a problem, the series of changes would do nothing to solve the problem if it were one, and this would just harm most of the gaming community to spite the richer players. And why, exactly? I would assume that, since the game rewards you with gold and valuable goods for accomplishing various feats, then a player who earns a lot of gold is one who is playing the game well. And as such, I see no reason to punish people who play the game well.

I farm the TP for items that I salvage and sell for profit. I do it so I can play the game how I want and not focus only doing the content with the most gold per hour. Now I can “waste” time doing map completion or story or all those less lucrative aspects of the game where I don’t see anybody playing.

Making 100k gold is easy if you never spend anything on unlocks (dyes, minis, skins)

Firefly.5982:

This is both a list of questions as well as a request. The questions first:

Does Anet monitor the amount of gold people have and make?
Does Anet think it’s fine if someone has 100k gold, buys up all perma items on the TP and puts them back up one by one for 2-3 times as much as they were before?
Will there ever be a top limit of gold one can own per account?

And the request:

Something needs to be done about this. It’s so unbelievably sad that the economy in this game is just the same as in real life. The poor will always stay poor and the rich will forever get richer. Why is this allowed to happen? Why is there no system in place to keep things fairly priced?

I am not lazy. I am actually working hard for my gold in GW2 (which is sad in itself). But with this stuff going on it will be forever impossible for me (and 99% of players) to ever catch up. I can never make enough gold because I can only do it slowly and by the time I get close to buying what I want it gets bought up and relisted at 2 or 3 times the price.

“the poor will always stay poor” – you mean those people who play the game a few hours a week.
“the rich get richer” – you mean those people who play the game for a few hours every day.

You see the problem there? Some people play the game * a little* and receive little reward for it.
Some people play the game a lot and are greatly rewarded for it.
Where exactly is the problem?
Do you expect to put 200-300 hours into this game and have the same possibilities as someone who has spent 200-3000 hours?

Anet has promised a game where statistical differences won’t be night and day – and they’ve delivered.

Exotic is easy to get – and it provides almost the same things as ascended and legendary do stat-wise.
Even ascended is easy to get if you put in the effort ( or at least the daily log-ins).

What’s not easy to get is vanity skins – items you have to play a lot for – either by doing things or items that costa a lot – why? Because that’s how it should be.

What would this game’s long-term goals be if someone who doesn’t play a lot – or plays a lot but poorly can just straight up get everything.

Zelulose.8695:

Many players own multiple accounts to get rich like an investment. It is much more effective than paying for gold over time once you own a few accounts. What’s more is that players sell their accounts cheaply often online when they quit GW2.

I have long argued against the free market of the TP and they way the limit player to player based trade. It takes the economic fun out of the game and some players with multiple accounts further ruin that fun for people. This is why I boycotted pve because it banned every creative way of making money to standardize it.

People like games where they can do something unique to move forward. GW2 overbalancing certain things creates a bland game where everyone has to use the same rout. It is closed minded. In fact I don’t mind them balancing get rich quick schemes I just wish they would only mix them up rather than ban them so players don’t feel they are being more limited every-time they play smart.

If players own multiple accounts they have earned the right to get the daily rewards and other associated benefits because they bought the game again.

eithinan.9841:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

#6: Working the TP to get money isn’t lazy, either. To be successful requires research, plenty of math, a lot of patience, and plenty of luck, too.

This is actually false. I have amassed a sizable fortune without a single spread sheet or calculation, simply intuition. I also make the majority of my gold on the tp, while playing aspects of the game I enjoy. The rich want people to think its hard work and lots of math, which everyone hates, but it isnt. Just need to pay attention to a few things here and there, especially patch notes and seasonal market shifts. Farm zone shifts based on the zone level are also a thing to watch. When HOT came out and the population shifted to mostly lvl 80 maps all mid mat prices adjusted for this lack of supply and other factors. Farmers who know the rich nodes are very happy about this.

There should be another shift in a few months.

Same here – just like you – the fact however is that both you and Blood are right and wrong.
Intuition ( as you call it ) is a personal thing – you may have it but others do not. Just because you have an innate talent at doing something doesn’t mean Blood was wrong. The majority of people are unable to do what you did.

I do make a profit – a good one off the TP – but I do realize that if I bothered to do hard numbers and actually apply math and spreasheets and whatnot to my TP method I’d easily make 40-60% more. I simply choose not to because I can’t be bothered – I already make enough gold to satisfy my needs and honestly there’s not really that many things I like to spend it on.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

eithinan.9841:

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

#6: Working the TP to get money isn’t lazy, either. To be successful requires research, plenty of math, a lot of patience, and plenty of luck, too.

This is actually false. I have amassed a sizable fortune without a single spread sheet or calculation, simply intuition. I also make the majority of my gold on the tp, while playing aspects of the game I enjoy. The rich want people to think its hard work and lots of math, which everyone hates, but it isnt. Just need to pay attention to a few things here and there, especially patch notes and seasonal market shifts. Farm zone shifts based on the zone level are also a thing to watch. When HOT came out and the population shifted to mostly lvl 80 maps all mid mat prices adjusted for this lack of supply and other factors. Farmers who know the rich nodes are very happy about this.

There should be another shift in a few months.

says it’s easy and not hard work….

2 paragraphs about tracking multiple things, reading from various sources and following trends…

People like the OP would consider that significant effort and very hard work

It isn’t just that information. It’s having the ability to acquire that information, and also having the wit to realize that other investors are doing the same thing, so you have to be ahead of them. Reading markets requires a certain amount of skill and awareness that most people plainly do not have.

True – because most people didn’t bother to develop themselves through education and simply breezed through most things and ended up average.

It’s not even that. It’s simply for whatever reason treating the TP like an NPC vendor rather than spending to couple of seconds to put items up for bid. Beyond that is understanding the intrinsic value, whether it’s salvage value, collection value or contents value (ie bags and their ilk).

Orpheal.8263:

lots off stuff

Let me explain to you why your ideas are bad.

1.Once the limit is in place trading will take place via gold and another currency – since nobody can have more than 1000 gold you’ll stock up your gold in OTHER materials – so I can have 8k gold on my account – just 1k solid and 7k in ectos – or whatever else is stable.

Also – 1k gold per account – but I can have multiple accounts – and have multiple guild banks – and so on and so forth.

2.Welcome to the world of multiple accounts – I’ll keep my money on my main and do all my trading from my second account – that has literally no gold on it – so my fees will be low.

4. Like I said – I’ll keep my money in something other than gold – perhaps GEMS – or something else. That way I can have all the perks of being “poor” in your system while not actually being poor.

Also – give up the notion of “players have to catch up” – sure – they can catch up but up to a point.
Don’t you find it absurd for someone who’s been playing 3 months to suddenly catch up to someone who’s been playing 3 years?

Anet has done a lot to help players catch up – the new HoT – instant 80 boost + exotics is exactly a system put in place to help new players catch up.
What – did you want them to give them an extra legendary too? Maybe a full ascended set? Don’t make me laugh.

A 30 hour player should be miles behind a 300 hour player – and he should be miles behind a 3000 hours player.

5. Account limit per IP? Don’t make me laugh.
Some people don’t even have a static IP – others can change IP’s on a whim. And even if that were so – take my case for example – I can easily play this game on 3-4 machines.
It’s just another form of “the rich get richer” only in this situation it won’t be the TP masterrace who gets most benefits – it’ll be the real life rich that have more than one computer to play off.

Also – you fail to realize that the further “behind” new players are the better the chances they’ll bust out their cards to try and catch up a bit. I’ve seen it happen time and time again in this game with people I know.
This is something Anet want because it earns them money.

There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

Reading this – your tone and overall wording point out that you are actually mad because others have more than you do.

Stay mad friendo.

I just have to say this… you can easily make substantial quantities of gold from ‘very’ low value items on the trading post, without having much to invest to start with. Many commonly dropped salvagable items (such as low-level loot armor) often have hundreds listed for sale for prices less than what the minimum number of materials they return are worth…. even a half-silver profit each adds up quickly when you melt a few hundred, and doing so might take 5 minutes.

Also, using external sites like gw2bltc that give price graphs makes a big difference… most highly-traded items have a ‘ceiling’ that they repeatedly climb to over the course of a day, where the very large sell orders are sitting, and it’s often more than 20-25% over the spot price… if you are undercutting the low sell with your jute scraps so they will sell in 30 seconds instead of 15 minutes, you’re paying for it.

When you deal with the very expensive items, you are not ‘investing’ on the TP, you are ‘speculating’, and you are accepting the risk of competing with everyone else that likes to gamble. If you just want to make money on the TP, deal with the items that trade in large amounts, make a little profit from each, and do it repeatedly.

Vyrulisse.1246:

All you need is that one in-demand skin to drop and you’re rich like that in this game.

waits from emma watson’s skin to fall off so I can sell it

Just like in real life, people who blow all their money on expensive pointless stuff end up with no money and the people who save and invest get richer. Anet can’t change common sense.

I just have to applaud Blood Red’s long (but good) response

I’ve tried teaching guildies various methods of making cash with minimal effort, via investments. Some have caught on, but most are too afraid to put in the initial investment (perhaps they don’t trust me enough). However those willing to take the risk, have profited (as far as I know).

I’ve found that those who use gem conversions tend to be those who aren’t as “skilled” at making money ingame, so they turn to other options.
Others still, use various other ways to make gold, like converting karma into linen (or similar schemes), and while they work, they’re pennies compared to what they could be doing with that time.

As far as investments, it does take some intuition, some experience, but in this case, if a rich guildie or friend tells you there’s something you should invest in, take a leap of faith.

danielrjones.8759:

Danikat.8537:

Orpheal.8263:

5: Account Limit per IP. Every IP should be able to own maximum 3 accounts, this is also a very important aspect against Gold Sellers that should have been done right from the begin on!! Yes, that might be a very frustratign change for all people, which might have already more than 3 accounts, but peopl can (and will) sell them anyways in that case, but for the safely of this games economy and in protection against Gold Selling, this change is long overdue and neccessary.
Even the most hardcore altoholic players should have with 3 Accounts more than enough space for possible characters.
Limiting the maximum number of accoutns, limits extremely also the maximum gold a hoarder can accumulate together in regard of farmed materials/general gold to be able to try to monopolize the game’s economy.
There needs to be borders for such people, a point, where they simply can’t get more anymore. Stop until here and no further, thats the principle that is missing in this game to protect the game’s economy from dagobert duck syndrome players, which don’t know anymore, when it is enough.

That’s not a terrible idea if only 1 person per household plays the game. But it’s really not uncommon to encounter people who play together with their whole family, or with their housemates.

Do you really think it’s fair to say only the first 3 of them can have accounts and anyone else is out of luck (bear in mind it’s against the EULA to share an account, even with another person at the same IP address) because you’re concerned that someone else somewhere in the world may be using their 4th account to get an additional 2g from dailies?

Pretty much what Danikat said. There is 4 in my household who play GW2. Each with their own account. There are several people in my guild who have at least 3 players per house hold. imo this limiting would hurt Anet in the long run. Considering how many people bought multiple accounts when they sold them for 10.00 per. That would be like Anet saying, thanks for the money but now those accounts are worthless. I disagree with this suggestion. And yes I bought my fair share of multiple accounts when they sold for 10 buck each. But I do not do the dailies on all of them. I simply don’t have time. But for those who do. That would be a slap in their face because when they bought the additional accounts that wasn’t part of the deal in purchasing them.

I was with you until you said “It would be a slap in the face.”

I really don’t see the issue, as someone who regularly drops to 1-2g I find it very easy to earn a few hundred gold in a matter of days just by playing the game, doing dungeons, selling mats etc. If I actually saved more instead of buying random things I would have a lot more money.

Wage inequality is not an issue in a world where the cost of living is literally zero.

there are no wages in gw2, just value and profits. nobody hires work for pay around here.. well except the gold sellers.

Steelo.4597:

there are no wages in gw2, just value and profits. nobody hires work for pay around here.. well except the gold sellers.

I hire people do to work for me, every time I buy things like Silver Doubloons (biggest supplier: people who forge), a precursor (also from forgers), a variety of intermediate crafting materials (folks who don’t mind spending time at the crafting stations), certain named exotics (people who like farming certain content more than I), and so on.

Of course, I have no idea who I’ve hired. I just know that I’m paying others so I don’t have go out and grind out the item(s) myself.

That’s one of the great thing about the TP: no one is forced to find their own commodities or luxuries. I can play the content I prefer, sell the stuff I don’t need, and use the funds to buy the stuff I want.

yeah and i fire my old milk into the garbage bin. huehue semantics such fun, unfortunately you didn’t make an argument so i’ll just troll you back some if thats k for you.

Steelo.4597:

there are no wages in gw2, just value and profits. nobody hires work for pay around here.. well except the gold sellers.

I’ve hired Mesmers to do a jumping puzzle and then a portal for a fee. And I know there are people who have paid for someone else to do the final bosses in dungeons and get access to the chest at the end.

As long as they came by their gold through legal in game means I don’t care how much others have. Sure, I’d love to have 100k gold. Most I’ve ever had was around 3k, but it didn’t last long since I was in the process of making a legendaries. But I hoard other stuff in the game, like materials and such, so I don’t have tons of gold – I have commodities. If I need to make a little gold I sell some of them, otherwise I hold on to them.

So be jealous, but don’t try to take from others. You too can be a 100kaire.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Steelo.4597:

there are no wages in gw2, just value and profits. nobody hires work for pay around here.. well except the gold sellers.

I’ve hired Mesmers to do a jumping puzzle and then a portal for a fee. And I know there are people who have paid for someone else to do the final bosses in dungeons and get access to the chest at the end.

you are right sir o7

There is a lot that is misguided on this thread. Rather than calling them out directly, I’ll just make some points.

• In the reddit AMA during the spring patch release party, Anet said that the 2 gold for doing dailies was done because most of the wealth was going to very few people, and that 2 gold for dailies was a way of making sure it went to everyone (who plays enough to do their dailies).

• Part of the reason that much of the wealth is going to few people is because few people actually care about the market. Most don’t want to bother. Flipping would stop being profitable if more people put in buy and sell listings rather than going for the instantaneous gratification. (Other methods, such as speculation would still exist, though).

• Looking at the previous point another way, flippers are providing a service. They allow people to buy and sell things instantly, instead of waiting until someone else wants/has the thing they want to sell/buy. Since placing your own orders is cheaper, that means people are choosing of their own free will to pay gold for this service in order to avoid waiting/being undercut/etc.

• In specific, flippers increase buy order prices and lower sell offer prices, bringing the two closer together. That lowers the cost of buying and selling instantly.

• However, there can be problems when an investor or a group of investors tries to corner the market. This can work or it can be undermined by others, so it is risky. However, that doesn’t mean that people don’t try to do this, since many of us have seen it happen.

• In part, the problem can be the power of extreme wealth, but I’d argue that part of the problem is that there isn’t enough flow of the good in that market. The most extreme example is when a good is no longer possible to obtain but someone stored away many stacks of it back when it was plentiful. I personally think the best fix for this is for Anet to re-release old items and make them attainable again. (Note that some items are now possible to get via the forge since the spring update that were previously impossible to get. I strongly approve of this.)

That’s an important point that people forget ekarat, where the flippers and traders are the ones helping give cheap items value, and pricy items are staying within a moderate range, more or less.

Far more things we get would have to be sold to merchants rather than on the TP if players didn’t play the market.

I mean, really, who is it that’s buying all the starter weapons??? lol

Ven Zehn.6573:

That’s an important point that people forget ekarat, where the flippers and traders are the ones helping give cheap items value, and pricy items are staying within a moderate range, more or less.

Far more things we get would have to be sold to merchants rather than on the TP if players didn’t play the market.

I mean, really, who is it that’s buying all the starter weapons??? lol

Players looking to salvage items for luck.

You don’t get luck from white items (iirc)

I mean the weap your character has upon creation btw, lvl 0, lowest stats:)

Ven Zehn.6573:

You don’t get luck from white items (iirc)

I mean the weap your character has upon creation btw, lvl 0, lowest stats:)

The ones that can’t be sold?

He means Basic rarity gear (whites)

The very first weap your character gets, the one that’s already equipped, is sellable, it’s pretty much the only thing that is, and there are almost always buy orders for em.