Guild Wars 2

Monkey Fritz.9052:

MarkPhilips.5169:

Dunno, but i’ve a feeling, like sab on April First

I will be logging in either way. If its not there, we riot.

I think that might actually be the case. April 1st is such a significant date that enough people will be thinking about SAB for riots to come.

It isn’t just that people want SAB, it’s that the ICC will hit the year and a half mark without being refunded AND the OccupySAB movement was the thing that made ANet admit to bad communication and yet they still aren’t communicating on SAB.

I suspect that this will mean that April 1st, regardless of whether ANet hint at it being a SAB update or not, will be a breaking point for a lot of people if it doesn’t come.

Siphaed.9235:

I will say this:

They sell boosts in the Gem Store.

They sell Boon Fire bonfires in the Gem Store.

Both of these things cost gems and yet after a certain time frame are gone/done with.

SAB 2.0 was available for over 3 weeks (Sept 3rd through 30th, well actually that’s relatively 4 weeks).
The use of the 600 Gem coin was available that entire time, 24/7 (well, at least when servers were up, if they were down for the 4-6hr weekly period, then it was more 24/6 +18) That would be more than 522 hours available for SAB. Being reasonable let’s subtract 8hrs per each day for sleep and an additional 8hrs (x5) per each week for work time. So that’s 522-224-160= 138 hours accessable to the SAB with the Infinite Coin and a full time job.

That is still a large time. Far larger than you would get out of Boosts for the same amount of Gems. And the skins you got out of it? Shall we put a market gold value on them or the generic 800gem price that most Gem Store skins are? Either way definitely got the value out of it there too.

There is no reasonable expectation for a refund on this item. You got more than it’s value out of it when available and it will release at some point in the extended future (and no, future doesn’t just simply mean weeks or months from now, but years can be included in that term). There should be no sense of entitlement here -which is what requesting/demanding a refund is doing-, because delivery and fulfillment have been met. Future use is bonus icing on the cake.

While I see what you’re saying, they’re different types of product, marketed differently. It’s like comparing a sweet to a toy. You don’t expect a sweet to have use long term, because it’s a consumable. You do expect the toy to. Also, the ICC wasn’t just sold in the first hour of the first day of Back to School, it was sold throughout (If I remember correctly, for the entirety), you could buy it with five minutes left on that update.

Therodin.2970:

I dont know why someone can’t just tell us why W1 and W2 arent in the game currently. I’m sure they have a good reason. There is no way they just like seeing me cry ;(

Because when they were here last people raged like mad about them and thus it is likely that they would wait to release it again until they have done changes based on that feedback. Making changes takes manpower, manpower that is currently being spent better elsewhere, such as working on the expansion.

lordkrall.7241:

Because when they were here last people raged like mad about them and thus it is likely that they would wait to release it again until they have done changes based on that feedback. Making changes takes manpower, manpower that is currently being spent better elsewhere, such as working on the expansion.

People objected to the length and difficulty of world 2, which was largely though not entirely fixed. Even if that’s the reason, they could still turn on world 1 (though I don’t think even the most extreme “ragers” actually suggested that W2 was literally worse than nothing).

CrashTestAuto.9108:

lordkrall.7241:

Because when they were here last people raged like mad about them and thus it is likely that they would wait to release it again until they have done changes based on that feedback. Making changes takes manpower, manpower that is currently being spent better elsewhere, such as working on the expansion.

People objected to the length and difficulty of world 2, which was largely though not entirely fixed. Even if that’s the reason, they could still turn on world 1 (though I don’t think even the most extreme “ragers” actually suggested that W2 was literally worse than nothing).

extreme ragers have to continue to farm dungeons and dailyes , W2 was perfect and fun

The ICC issue is an absolute, unmitigated debacle. It should have been rectified. I like SAB, but I am not one of the die hard fans of it so I never bought a coin, but how it was and still is being handled is poor form.

It’s fairly obvious to me at this point that we aren’t getting actual game play content before the x-pac. Why don’t they just release Worlds 1 and 2 until the x-pac goes live? Why not bring back the Pavilion? The Marionette fight?

I appreciated the fact that they said they needed to make sure the upcoming update got a little more work on it so they could get it right. That’s good communication. I feel however that they should have done a better job getting content out to us in the interim as we wait for the x-pac to launch. Those things I mentioned earlier would be a good diversion until HoT arrives if nothing else.

pelle ossa.9705:

CrashTestAuto.9108:

lordkrall.7241:

Because when they were here last people raged like mad about them and thus it is likely that they would wait to release it again until they have done changes based on that feedback. Making changes takes manpower, manpower that is currently being spent better elsewhere, such as working on the expansion.

People objected to the length and difficulty of world 2, which was largely though not entirely fixed. Even if that’s the reason, they could still turn on world 1 (though I don’t think even the most extreme “ragers” actually suggested that W2 was literally worse than nothing).

extreme ragers have to continue to farm dungeons and dailyes , W2 was perfect and fun

I wasn’t a fan of world 2 at all. I felt the insta die nature of the whole world was a shady attempt to get coins sold. Having said that, I loved W1 and hope SAB becomes permanent content.

Guhracie.3419:

Draknar.5748:

lordkrall.7241:

silly and immersion breaking weapons everywhere.

This can’t possibly be anyone’s opinion. Considering the silly, immersion breaking skins that exist outside of SAB…

I think a weapon skin that is being populated/generated via some Asuran computer technology is far less immersion breaking than a bow that shoots rainbow unicorns, a disco ball mace, or heck even a greatsword that allows you to see into some other dimension that also changes dimensions based on time of day (still not sure what the twilight/sunrise/eternity skins are referencing, is it heaven/hell does Tyrian lore even have heaven and hell?)

Uhh… twilight and sunrise are both times of day, and eternity is a concept of “forever” that has nothing to do with heaven or hell. The skins visually reflect morning and evening, as well as the night sky, in the case of eternity.

They certainly do not. I can see galaxies in my Twilight…. like nebulas and such. Take a look into the when you get a chance. It isn’t just a night scene.

(That 45 character title limit)Hello.

This is a recurrent topic pretty much since I started playing the game. Super Adventure Box was also the event that bid me welcome into Tyria. However, as a player, and moreso, as a human being, I recognise there are certian limitations that would prevent the scenario of returning Super Adventure Box to the game, and before starting the debate, I would like to point them out:

The problems:
-Arenanet’s resources are focus ed on development of Heart of Thorns.
-Super Adventure Box has not been worked on since its last release.

The claims:
-Halloween and Wintersday events were successfully recicled.
-Players who bought Infinite Continue coins to show their support to Super Adventure Box feel ripped.
-Players do not have an inherent need for new content to be released next time Super Adventure Box is released.

*There are more points that might have eluded my knowledge and perception, so please, feel free to add them up.

So here we have a problem that makes, albeit still legit, The claims to ge low priority. So the question here is, "How could Super Adventure Box be brought back without slowing progress on Heart of Thorns?"

Here is my suggestion: Allow us to buy our right to access Super Adventure Box. No need for a recicled meta achievement even. Just Access to the fun it provides and its rewards. Considering you can individually purchase Living Story Season 2 Chapters for 200 gems, allowing such such content to be avaliable for the same sum, or maybe even splitted for access for each world.

Or they could just not bring it back at all, ever. Please.

Lampshade.7569:

Or they could just not bring it back at all, ever. Please.

Or, you could just not play it if they do.

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

I mean they already spent all that money to pay people to make,debug, texture, advertise SAB Why not stop wasting the money and just give us access to W1 and W2? I would be fine with paying up to 1000 gems if i could buy like a SAB transport key that looked like one of the keys in SAB and using it teleported me to the world hub.

Lampshade.7569:

Or they could just not bring it back at all, ever. Please.

I will never understand this. I can understand and accept people not liking things that I love. I know this is a thing because other people love things that I don’t have an interest in nor enjoy, like PvP. But why would you seek to actively block other people from accessing a thing they love just because you personally don’t enjoy it?

What kind of person makes the mental connection that since they personally dislike something no one should be allowed to experience it?

Moldur.6275:

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

It only took 7 Devs to make world 1 in the first place.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Moldur.6275:

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

It only took 7 Devs to make world 1 in the first place.

Really? do you know how long it took them?

Therodin.2970:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Moldur.6275:

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

It only took 7 Devs to make world 1 in the first place.

Really? do you know how long it took them?

That I don’t recall. Josh told us all about it, but I forget.

I really enjoyed world 1 & 2 and would definetly put down monster hunter, minecraft and gta5 heists if i could grind out all those wonderfully colored skins

Therodin.2970:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Moldur.6275:

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

It only took 7 Devs to make world 1 in the first place.

Really? do you know how long it took them?

Quick history lesson.

World 1 was made for fun, by a handful of devs, in their spare time. At least 80% of the work was done without even being paid, as a side project. The side project was cool and fun, so it was thrown into the game as a fun april fools joke.

It was immensely popular.

More time was allotted, and the devs were allowed to spend paid time working on w2. Unfortunately it had issues. There were bugs with latency they had not predicted, the levels were overtly long, making it very difficult for people to finish when it required 3+ hours of uninterrupted playtime to finish (6+ hours for many). And they released the biggest grind Tyria had ever seen with ascended weapons at the same time, keeping a large portion of the player base too busy to play content that didn’t help in any way to achieve those weapons.

W2 was not as popular as they hoped, and I am sure the suits decided it was a lost investment vs the expectations of a cash cow they wanted it to be.

W2 was promised to be reworked, to fix a lot of the issues. So they are not just taking the time to make w3, but to redesign all of w2. I expect the devs are not allotted time to work on it in their paid schedules, either.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Therodin.2970:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Moldur.6275:

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

It only took 7 Devs to make world 1 in the first place.

Really? do you know how long it took them?

Quick history lesson.

World 1 was made for fun, by a handful of devs, in their spare time. At least 80% of the work was done without even being paid, as a side project. The side project was cool and fun, so it was thrown into the game as a fun april fools joke.

It was immensely popular.

More time was allotted, and the devs were allowed to spend paid time working on w2. Unfortunately it had issues. There were bugs with latency they had not predicted, the levels were overtly long, making it very difficult for people to finish when it required 3+ hours of uninterrupted playtime to finish (6+ hours for many). And they released the biggest grind Tyria had ever seen with ascended weapons at the same time, keeping a large portion of the player base too busy to play content that didn’t help in any way to achieve those weapons.

W2 was not as popular as they hoped, and I am sure the suits decided it was a lost investment vs the expectations of a cash cow they wanted it to be.

W2 was promised to be reworked, to fix a lot of the issues. So they are not just taking the time to make w3, but to redesign all of w2. I expect the devs are not allotted time to work on it in their paid schedules, either.

But while they are working on W2, why can’t they also let us play the old w2? and the popular w1?

Therodin.2970:

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Therodin.2970:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Moldur.6275:

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

It only took 7 Devs to make world 1 in the first place.

Really? do you know how long it took them?

Quick history lesson.

World 1 was made for fun, by a handful of devs, in their spare time. At least 80% of the work was done without even being paid, as a side project. The side project was cool and fun, so it was thrown into the game as a fun april fools joke.

It was immensely popular.

More time was allotted, and the devs were allowed to spend paid time working on w2. Unfortunately it had issues. There were bugs with latency they had not predicted, the levels were overtly long, making it very difficult for people to finish when it required 3+ hours of uninterrupted playtime to finish (6+ hours for many). And they released the biggest grind Tyria had ever seen with ascended weapons at the same time, keeping a large portion of the player base too busy to play content that didn’t help in any way to achieve those weapons.

W2 was not as popular as they hoped, and I am sure the suits decided it was a lost investment vs the expectations of a cash cow they wanted it to be.

W2 was promised to be reworked, to fix a lot of the issues. So they are not just taking the time to make w3, but to redesign all of w2. I expect the devs are not allotted time to work on it in their paid schedules, either.

But while they are working on W2, why can’t they also let us play the old w2? and the popular w1?

I’m not saying I agree with this, but the reason is likely along these lines:
w2 is seen as a problem, they will not re-release the problem to cause more problems and risk bringing more dislike towards the content. It was a massive barrier to their primary customer base: casuals.

They can’t release w1, because no matter how much some of us may like it, releasing less content than they had before would cause a kittenstorm. They can’t release w2, for fear of causing the same kittenstorm as when it came out. As well, there WOULD be people complaining that they had released it without any new content. They can’t even release an updated w2, because people would only complain about things they liked being removed or shortened, and yet more would complain that there was no new content.

From a content/marketing perspective nothing they do would generate positive feedback, unless they release an updated w2, and a new w3. Even this being silent and not telling us anything is less damaging to the brand of gw2, and even the brand of super adventure box, than if they did any of the things we fans would like them to do in the mean time.

From Anet’s perspective they cannot bring SAB back to the focus without releasing new and improved content. So it is simply best for them to wait until they are ready to announce w3.

I don’t like that either, but it really is the best thing they can do.

That makes such very sad sense. And i know they don’t care about one customer but i have been noticing myself get online less and less lately. The last few weeks i really just got on for guild missions and maybe a fractal afterwards. If they released W2 the way it is but charged you money to go there while letting you know that it was exactly the same as it was before would that be better? Then nobody who hated W2 would have to go?

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Therodin.2970:

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Therodin.2970:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Moldur.6275:

Between now and HoT launch there is yet a lot of time, and if preparing SAB means that HoT is delayed by a couple of weeks due to some of the devs preparing SAB, I think it is completely worth it. Lets face it, they haven’t announced the release date yet, and if they were to release HoT in late August vs early September, it wouldn’t matter which date they chose, as the difference from now until then is minimal between the two.

To get to my point, spending some resources on SAB would give the playerbase an incredible amount of content compared to the devs needed, as it could easily make months fly by as we wait for the expansion to launch.

Conclusion: A few devs working on SAB as a side project would barely affect HoT as a whole, but make the time until launch so much more enjoyable that I think it would greatly benefit HoT and the whole game in a bigger perspective.

April 1, two weeks away.

It only took 7 Devs to make world 1 in the first place.

Really? do you know how long it took them?

Quick history lesson.

World 1 was made for fun, by a handful of devs, in their spare time. At least 80% of the work was done without even being paid, as a side project. The side project was cool and fun, so it was thrown into the game as a fun april fools joke.

It was immensely popular.

More time was allotted, and the devs were allowed to spend paid time working on w2. Unfortunately it had issues. There were bugs with latency they had not predicted, the levels were overtly long, making it very difficult for people to finish when it required 3+ hours of uninterrupted playtime to finish (6+ hours for many). And they released the biggest grind Tyria had ever seen with ascended weapons at the same time, keeping a large portion of the player base too busy to play content that didn’t help in any way to achieve those weapons.

W2 was not as popular as they hoped, and I am sure the suits decided it was a lost investment vs the expectations of a cash cow they wanted it to be.

W2 was promised to be reworked, to fix a lot of the issues. So they are not just taking the time to make w3, but to redesign all of w2. I expect the devs are not allotted time to work on it in their paid schedules, either.

But while they are working on W2, why can’t they also let us play the old w2? and the popular w1?

I’m not saying I agree with this, but the reason is likely along these lines:
w2 is seen as a problem, they will not re-release the problem to cause more problems and risk bringing more dislike towards the content. It was a massive barrier to their primary customer base: casuals.

They can’t release w1, because no matter how much some of us may like it, releasing less content than they had before would cause a kittenstorm. They can’t release w2, for fear of causing the same kittenstorm as when it came out. As well, there WOULD be people complaining that they had released it without any new content. They can’t even release an updated w2, because people would only complain about things they liked being removed or shortened, and yet more would complain that there was no new content.

From a content/marketing perspective nothing they do would generate positive feedback, unless they release an updated w2, and a new w3. Even this being silent and not telling us anything is less damaging to the brand of gw2, and even the brand of super adventure box, than if they did any of the things we fans would like them to do in the mean time.

From Anet’s perspective they cannot bring SAB back to the focus without releasing new and improved content. So it is simply best for them to wait until they are ready to announce w3.

I don’t like that either, but it really is the best thing they can do.

I still don’t see how people spent 3+ hours on a map in World 2 unless they were doing the achievements. There’s nothing wrong with World 2 and it doesn’t need to be fixed.

Eh, I shall now contribute to the length of this lengthy thread in order to express my support for SAB. It’s brilliant content that I had far too little time to mess around with.

To SAB or bust!

Ayrilana.1396:

I still don’t see how people spent 3+ hours on a map in World 2 unless they were doing the achievements.

I’m not sure how anyone, no matter how exceptionally good they may have been, or claim to be, can NOT see how that is possible for a lot of other players. Players have been known to take longer on their first run of AC or fractals for not knowing the mechanics of the dungeons. But there were plenty of things to extend gameplay sessions for the average player.

1: The bugs. People with poor latency had major issues with a lot of the content. It just wasn’t forgiving even the slightest discrepancies between the client and server. It definately caused issues for me personally, and contributed to a lot of fails in specific locations. I could not even get past the rapids until the first patch removed that mechanic. There are videos of people trying to get past them with random knockbacks because of the latency issues.

2: It was actually difficult. Not everyone who plays video games is naturally good at them. Especially in this game, which is heavily marketed to a more casual crowd. Even more so in the mmo market as a whole, where platforming skills are not usually required.

3: It was long. No one can (or at least should) be arguing against the fact that the levels were incredibly long compared to any other instanced content in the game. There isn’t a single dungeon path as long as the second or third levels of w2. And when every ten feet there is another platforming challenge or tricky enemy to get past, it gets longer.

4: Death had consequences. A single failure was quite the setback, for any average skilled player (not the people who always say thigs like “I can’t believe it would take anyone that long”) death happened frequently, set you back several dozen platforming challenges that had to be renegotiated, and an ever increasing potential of running out of continue coins and having to abandon the level completely.

5: Running out of time. even a single hour of dedicated instance time runs the risk of having real life interupt and prevent you from completing it.

6: Disconnects. Both as a result of people connections, certain bugs in the content, and a client that was not completely stable at the time, were common.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Ayrilana.1396:

I still don’t see how people spent 3+ hours on a map in World 2 unless they were doing the achievements.

I’m not sure how anyone, no matter how exceptionally good they may have been, or claim to be, can NOT see how that is possible for a lot of other players. Players have been known to take longer on their first run of AC or fractals for not knowing the mechanics of the dungeons. But there were plenty of things to extend gameplay sessions for the average player.

1: The bugs. People with poor latency had major issues with a lot of the content. It just wasn’t forgiving even the slightest discrepancies between the client and server. It definately caused issues for me personally, and contributed to a lot of fails in specific locations. I could not even get past the rapids until the first patch removed that mechanic. There are videos of people trying to get past them with random knockbacks because of the latency issues.

2: It was actually difficult. Not everyone who plays video games is naturally good at them. Especially in this game, which is heavily marketed to a more casual crowd. Even more so in the mmo market as a whole, where platforming skills are not usually required.

3: It was long. No one can (or at least should) be arguing against the fact that the levels were incredibly long compared to any other instanced content in the game. There isn’t a single dungeon path as long as the second or third levels of w2. And when every ten feet there is another platforming challenge or tricky enemy to get past, it gets longer.

4: Death had consequences. A single failure was quite the setback, for any average skilled player (not the people who always say thigs like “I can’t believe it would take anyone that long”) death happened frequently, set you back several dozen platforming challenges that had to be renegotiated, and an ever increasing potential of running out of continue coins and having to abandon the level completely.

5: Running out of time. even a single hour of dedicated instance time runs the risk of having real life interupt and prevent you from completing it.

6: Disconnects. Both as a result of people connections, certain bugs in the content, and a client that was not completely stable at the time, were common.

So i can’t argue against your other points that casual players and people bad at video games would have trouble here, but with the first one are you suggesting anet should try to design content with people with bad internet in mind?

Therodin.2970:

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Ayrilana.1396:

I still don’t see how people spent 3+ hours on a map in World 2 unless they were doing the achievements.

I’m not sure how anyone, no matter how exceptionally good they may have been, or claim to be, can NOT see how that is possible for a lot of other players. Players have been known to take longer on their first run of AC or fractals for not knowing the mechanics of the dungeons. But there were plenty of things to extend gameplay sessions for the average player.

1: The bugs. People with poor latency had major issues with a lot of the content. It just wasn’t forgiving even the slightest discrepancies between the client and server. It definately caused issues for me personally, and contributed to a lot of fails in specific locations. I could not even get past the rapids until the first patch removed that mechanic. There are videos of people trying to get past them with random knockbacks because of the latency issues.

2: It was actually difficult. Not everyone who plays video games is naturally good at them. Especially in this game, which is heavily marketed to a more casual crowd. Even more so in the mmo market as a whole, where platforming skills are not usually required.

3: It was long. No one can (or at least should) be arguing against the fact that the levels were incredibly long compared to any other instanced content in the game. There isn’t a single dungeon path as long as the second or third levels of w2. And when every ten feet there is another platforming challenge or tricky enemy to get past, it gets longer.

4: Death had consequences. A single failure was quite the setback, for any average skilled player (not the people who always say thigs like “I can’t believe it would take anyone that long”) death happened frequently, set you back several dozen platforming challenges that had to be renegotiated, and an ever increasing potential of running out of continue coins and having to abandon the level completely.

5: Running out of time. even a single hour of dedicated instance time runs the risk of having real life interupt and prevent you from completing it.

6: Disconnects. Both as a result of people connections, certain bugs in the content, and a client that was not completely stable at the time, were common.

So i can’t argue against your other points that casual players and people bad at video games would have trouble here, but with the first one are you suggesting anet should try to design content with people with bad internet in mind?

Nothing there was a suggestion. It was a list of reasons why the content took a large number of people more than 3 hours to complete, and a not insignificant amount of people spent as many as 6 before giving up. Although additionally, a lot of players do not attempt to power through content, making content last longer than those who do power through realize. One extra minute checking things out around each corner easily added up to an hour with the way the levels were designed.

Although, yes, this is an mmo, the content does need to cater to poor internet connections, like every other mmo does. There is no reason to redesign mechanics, but rather how the server handles the interactions. Latency is always an issue, it always causes problems, but there are some things you just shouldn’t do if the backend doesn’t support fluctuating ping.

The issue between testing and the live implementation was that they used a means of artificially testing latency, which creates a static latency, rather than one which can fluctuate and spike at inopportune times. Thus mechanics like the geysers seemed like a good idea, but made the content impassible by a significant majority of the players. It was removed by the next day for that reason, but similar mechanics were still used in smaller doses, which caused a lot of issues, but were ultimately passable by “luck.”

Nothing major needed to be changed to “dumb down” the content, but a lot of small things needed tweaking to accommodate an issue they hadn’t actually noticed. Since they did test for latency problems, just not in a real world setting.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Ayrilana.1396:

I still don’t see how people spent 3+ hours on a map in World 2 unless they were doing the achievements.

I’m not sure how anyone, no matter how exceptionally good they may have been, or claim to be, can NOT see how that is possible for a lot of other players. Players have been known to take longer on their first run of AC or fractals for not knowing the mechanics of the dungeons. But there were plenty of things to extend gameplay sessions for the average player.

1: The bugs. People with poor latency had major issues with a lot of the content. It just wasn’t forgiving even the slightest discrepancies between the client and server. It definately caused issues for me personally, and contributed to a lot of fails in specific locations. I could not even get past the rapids until the first patch removed that mechanic. There are videos of people trying to get past them with random knockbacks because of the latency issues.

2: It was actually difficult. Not everyone who plays video games is naturally good at them. Especially in this game, which is heavily marketed to a more casual crowd. Even more so in the mmo market as a whole, where platforming skills are not usually required.

3: It was long. No one can (or at least should) be arguing against the fact that the levels were incredibly long compared to any other instanced content in the game. There isn’t a single dungeon path as long as the second or third levels of w2. And when every ten feet there is another platforming challenge or tricky enemy to get past, it gets longer.

4: Death had consequences. A single failure was quite the setback, for any average skilled player (not the people who always say thigs like “I can’t believe it would take anyone that long”) death happened frequently, set you back several dozen platforming challenges that had to be renegotiated, and an ever increasing potential of running out of continue coins and having to abandon the level completely.

5: Running out of time. even a single hour of dedicated instance time runs the risk of having real life interupt and prevent you from completing it.

6: Disconnects. Both as a result of people connections, certain bugs in the content, and a client that was not completely stable at the time, were common.

1) You can’t rate content based on people with poor internet connections or slow computers. The one issue people had with the Rapids was nerfed so that it took little effort to do.

2) It really was not that difficult but it was a step up from World 1 which you could do with almost no effort. That’s usually typical in older games. There was an infantile mode that allowed players to bypass the majority of the challenges and see exactly where they were supposed to go. They could then go back and beat the obstacles which were very linear.

3) Each zone was longer than in any of the ones in World 1 but not excessively so. Unlike other instanced content, there’s relatively no fighting in SAB. You can actually ignore most of the enemies although it’s wise to just kill them which only requires a few hits. For those that are unable to do the content, there are always guides within a few days of release that walk you through everything.

4) Older games had deaths that were punishing too. There’s no reason that this game can’t have the same since it was built with those type of games in mind. At least there were decent checkpoints and the enemies did not respawn. Many old school games used the lives/continues feature where you’d have to restart if you ran out. I remember farming lives for Donkey Kong Country when it came out and having to learn the maps when playing Contra (without using the cheat).

5) There will always be the unpredictable occurrences which were also present way back when playing older games. There were no save anytime you want like in Skyrim which does reduce a lot of the challenge in games nowadays.

6) I never once had a disconnect during any of the releases. Any issues were on the players’ end the majority of the time. Losing power in older games also caused you to lose progress as well.

EDIT: What I saw as being the biggest issue was the lack of rewards. Unlike the first release, the rewards for the second were not great which was made worse with the timegating when they made almost everything once per day per account rather than by character.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

I’m not saying I agree with this, but the reason is likely along these lines:
w2 is seen as a problem, they will not re-release the problem to cause more problems and risk bringing more dislike towards the content. It was a massive barrier to their primary customer base: casuals.

They can’t release w1, because no matter how much some of us may like it, releasing less content than they had before would cause a kittenstorm. They can’t release w2, for fear of causing the same kittenstorm as when it came out. As well, there WOULD be people complaining that they had released it without any new content. They can’t even release an updated w2, because people would only complain about things they liked being removed or shortened, and yet more would complain that there was no new content.

From a content/marketing perspective nothing they do would generate positive feedback, unless they release an updated w2, and a new w3. Even this being silent and not telling us anything is less damaging to the brand of gw2, and even the brand of super adventure box, than if they did any of the things we fans would like them to do in the mean time.

From Anet’s perspective they cannot bring SAB back to the focus without releasing new and improved content. So it is simply best for them to wait until they are ready to announce w3.

I don’t like that either, but it really is the best thing they can do.

I respect you took the time to argue this, even though you dislike it, but I just don’t think its true. ANet’s biggest issue in terms of image is its communication, and at this stage the approach they’re taking is really damaging.

Moreover, we’ve had SAB riots once, and I suspect they may well return on April 1st, if not next summer (right around HoT launch hype time).

Finally, there has to be a point where the fact they took the cash for the ICC and ran away starts creeping into reporting on things like #OccupySAB. Remember Oblivion horse armour? That was at least usable.

Ayrilana.1396:

1) You can’t rate content based on people with poor internet connections or slow computers. The one issue people had with the Rapids was nerfed so that it took little effort to do.

2) It really was not that difficult but it was a step up from World 1 which you could do with almost no effort. That’s usually typical in older games. There was an infantile mode that allowed players to bypass the majority of the challenges and see exactly where they were supposed to go. They could then go back and beat the obstacles which were very linear.

3) Each zone was longer than in any of the ones in World 1 but not excessively so. Unlike other instanced content, there’s relatively no fighting in SAB. You can actually ignore most of the enemies although it’s wise to just kill them which only requires a few hits. For those that are unable to do the content, there are always guides within a few days of release that walk you through everything.

4) Older games had deaths that were punishing too. There’s no reason that this game can’t have the same since it was built with those type of games in mind. At least there were decent checkpoints and the enemies did not respawn. Many old school games used the lives/continues feature where you’d have to restart if you ran out. I remember farming lives for Donkey Kong Country when it came out and having to learn the maps when playing Contra (without using the cheat).

5) There will always be the unpredictable occurrences which were also present way back when playing older games. There were no save anytime you want like in Skyrim which does reduce a lot of the challenge in games nowadays.

6) I never once had a disconnect during any of the releases. Any issues were on the players’ end the majority of the time. Losing power in older games also caused you to lose progress as well.

1. Um, yes, you can. MMOs are typically designed around it. Yes, the rapids were nerfed, but what else should they have done? Alienated a large chunk of the players because the content worked fine for you and you liked it better? Ideally they will fix the rapids, rather than just disabling a mechanic that failed to work as intended. You are taking this all too far and almost seems personally because I am simply saying the things need to be designed to “Work” and you are complaining about me saying the content should be nerfed and made easier? I haven’t said any such thing. There were a lot of things they wanted to “Fix,” not remove. The rapids were removed as a hotfix because the did not have time to rework the mechanic once the patch was live.

2. I fail to understand why you are arguing about difficulty? Okay, maybe you are so amazing at video games you can’t possibly understand why content might be hard for others. I don’t think many other fans of SAB have that problem, and we all know full well that platforming and precision jumping, avoiding traps is difficult. Comparing it to older games as a way of saying it “isn’t” difficult is laughable.

3. you are still talking about the difficulty of enemies? You do understand it was a jumping puzzle and the difficulty is in the platforming, not the mobs, Right?

4. Again, how can you honestly compare the difficulty to “older games like contra” and not understand that the content was challenging for a lot of players? “Other games are harder, so it was easy” is not an argument. Though I still don’t understand why you are arguing in the first place. you stated you didn’t understand and I gave you a list of reasons and you are arguing about why you personally don’t think it was hard.

5. Um… yes. Duh. The content was long and could not be done in short play sessions. Thus the reason a lot of people found it too hard/frustraiting.

6. Lucky you. The first year of the game was particularly bad about random disconects. I rarely ran a dungeon without someone dc’ng. Those letters alone were extremely common in chat because it was such a frequent occurrence.

I made a dream of SAB yesterday…
In this dream i saw “the super adventure box is back at 2 april 2015”
Bring us these funny events please !!

We have the camera improvements …. Now SAB just wait us no..? It’s the perfect time to put this in my opinion!

How much would you guys be willing to pay in gems to “unlock” W1 or W2?

Therodin.2970:

How much would you guys be willing to pay in gems to “unlock” W1 or W2?

I’d pay 6000 max.. Can’t afford much more with my wages :P

I think 1000 gems each would be a lot but i would still be willing to pay it

I’d pay what it costs to unlock living story episodes- 200 gems per world, and I’d be bitter about it.

No gems for sab, i’ve already bought the infinite coin and it’s more than 1 year i can’t use it.

World 1 + 2 + 3 and Make it a permanent content.

Thx

Well im sure we would all prefer if sab were completely free and there was another world but i dont think its totally realistic to expect that

Therodin.2970:

Well im sure we would all prefer if sab were completely free and there was another world but i dont think its totally realistic to expect that

It should be. It absolutely should be realistic to expect that.

I would be willing to pay gems to have a functional SAB entrance added to my personal instance. I would not be willing to pay gems to simply be able to use SAB again.

What if the options were pay gems for sab or not have it come back again?

Been trying to find either a download or a list of SAB sounds in the dat file for quite a while. Not the music, know it’s on soundcloud. Failed to find anything other than references to the critter rampage game and shop keeper sounds.

Would anyone know of a source of any of this, or at the very least a general idea where to look when digging in the dat file? Thanks. ( guessing I’ll just have to export all the sounds and sort through it :/ )

Therodin.2970:

What if the options were pay gems for sab or not have it come back again?

I already paid gems for SAB when I bought the ICC. So that’s not an argument I’m ok with.

I would’ve paid gems for SAB in a heartbeat…. but they already ran away with my money once (continue coin) by tricking me into thinking there were gonna be more worlds and I will NOT let myself get hyped/fooled again.
Anyway, keep pushin’ for it.

Kal, I pay a few gems so you can get SAB, now shush and kindly agree.

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Mea.5491:

Noob question: Why do people like / want SAB so much??

Because it was incredibly fun and challenging and had a great reward system, both internally and in skins. There hasn’t been a single content release to match it since launch, with the possible exception of fractals.

Your entire post is 100% subjective and 100% your opinion. I guess that is a valid answer, but I’m just making sure the person asking the question KNOWS not every player thinks SAB is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I personally think the SAB skins are an eyesore and a blight to my eyes in the normal game…..

Valento.9852:

Kal, I pay a few gems so you can get SAB, now shush and kindly agree.

I 100% agree to you paying gems for me to get SAB. I have absolutely no issue with that scenario.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Monkey Fritz.9052:

Mea.5491:

Noob question: Why do people like / want SAB so much??

Because it was incredibly fun and challenging and had a great reward system, both internally and in skins. There hasn’t been a single content release to match it since launch, with the possible exception of fractals.

Your entire post is 100% subjective and 100% your opinion. I guess that is a valid answer, but I’m just making sure the person asking the question KNOWS not every player thinks SAB is the greatest thing since sliced bread. I personally think the SAB skins are an eyesore and a blight to my eyes in the normal game…..

It is subjective, but I don’t know if I would say 100%. Technically he didn’t say the skins were good, just that the reward system was good. I don’t have such hate for the skins that you do, but I only find them appropriate on an Asura. I actually realized, recently, that all of my Asura have at least one of the weapons, and they looks completely appropriate.

Would you argue the reward system for acquiring the skins was good or bad? Mainly, if the skins were different, would you be satisfied with that system of reward being pushed through to other parts of the game?

There are two aspects to this. Random drops in the game to acquire a non-soulbound skin, but also acquiring currency to purchase a soul bound skin. Gaining special items through a series of paths that can be combined with a skin in the forge to get a different skin.

I would love to see that implemented in dungeons. Run all three paths and get three items that when combined with a dungeon skin, of the same dungeon, give you a new unique skin.

My answer to the original question is: It introduced all the best aspects of last century platformers, and a unique whimsy not otherwise present in the game, while simultaneously maintaining the feel and functionality of Guild Wars 2. Also I love jumping puzzles and it was a huge jumping puzzle, especially tribulation mode.

I would be able to buy an SAB world 500 gems if it’s needed.

10 days left …. I hope … I just cross my fingers.

So they said in an interview with AngryJoe that once again they are looking for the right time to fit sab in. What could be a more right time than now, when we have nothing going on but a pvp ladder test season?

I don’t even like SAB, yet I think it should be a permanent addition. It’s just ridiculous it’s not there all the time.