Guild Wars 2

Albadaran.1283:

Ok to summarize a lot of what’s been saying:
Dailies are done for the 10 achievement points. Not for fun. Even those who play the new dailies often admit that its not for the fun. Especially the PvE dailies are subject of criticisms. Mostly because of the lack of choice. Obvious solution:

Give us more choice!! Instead of 3 out of 4 make it 3 out of 10! Everyone happy!

It’s actually 3 out of 12.

Albadaran.1283:

Ok to summarize a lot of what’s been saying:
Dailies are done for the 10 achievement points. Not for fun. Even those who play the new dailies often admit that its not for the fun. Especially the PvE dailies are subject of criticisms. Mostly because of the lack of choice. Obvious solution:

Give us more choice!! Instead of 3 out of 4 make it 3 out of 10! Everyone happy!

I wouldn’t be happy with that. It’d mean I’d have to take more time out of my day to get the easy rewards.

I like the new daily system . I took me a few days to get use to it but hey why not.

So far, I have personally liked the new dailies. While I strictly do PVE, I have not gotten into Fractals. So, when the two options for Fractals showed up, I sneaked into WvW land. I had no problems completing the dailies for WvW and while there, realized that the stars were right and my server was controlling an area that I needed for Map Completion. And was also doing well in the Eternal Battlefield. So, I ended up getting my map completion done. I enjoyed running around with the Zerg and accomplishing things. (And got the snot beat out of me by real WvWs when they caught me alone ). I think I will try out some more WvW in the future.

Filaha.1678:

Albadaran.1283:

Ok to summarize a lot of what’s been saying:
Dailies are done for the 10 achievement points. Not for fun. Even those who play the new dailies often admit that its not for the fun. Especially the PvE dailies are subject of criticisms. Mostly because of the lack of choice. Obvious solution:

Give us more choice!! Instead of 3 out of 4 make it 3 out of 10! Everyone happy!

I wouldn’t be happy with that. It’d mean I’d have to take more time out of my day to get the easy rewards.

Why is that a problem? After all, according to an argument you have used in this thread many times already, they would be purely optional, and nobody would force you to get them.

Astralporing.1957:

Filaha.1678:

Albadaran.1283:

Ok to summarize a lot of what’s been saying:
Dailies are done for the 10 achievement points. Not for fun. Even those who play the new dailies often admit that its not for the fun. Especially the PvE dailies are subject of criticisms. Mostly because of the lack of choice. Obvious solution:

Give us more choice!! Instead of 3 out of 4 make it 3 out of 10! Everyone happy!

I wouldn’t be happy with that. It’d mean I’d have to take more time out of my day to get the easy rewards.

Why is that a problem? After all, according to an argument you have used in this thread many times already, they would be purely optional, and nobody would force you to get them.

I didn’t say anybody would force me to do them. I choose to do what I can for extra rewards.

Filaha.1678:

Astralporing.1957:

Filaha.1678:

Albadaran.1283:

Ok to summarize a lot of what’s been saying:
Dailies are done for the 10 achievement points. Not for fun. Even those who play the new dailies often admit that its not for the fun. Especially the PvE dailies are subject of criticisms. Mostly because of the lack of choice. Obvious solution:

Give us more choice!! Instead of 3 out of 4 make it 3 out of 10! Everyone happy!

I wouldn’t be happy with that. It’d mean I’d have to take more time out of my day to get the easy rewards.

Why is that a problem? After all, according to an argument you have used in this thread many times already, they would be purely optional, and nobody would force you to get them.

I didn’t say anybody would force me to do them. I choose to do what I can for extra rewards.

Then, again using your own argument, where the unhappiness would come from? You could always choose to not do them. They’d be optional, you wouldn’t need to do them at all.

Filaha.1678:

Djinn.9245:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Save up 20 fine essences of luck. Grab a character with Artificer at 0. Refine luck up to exotic. Receive 3 ectoplasm. Not hard, great pay-off.

The average player who either isn’t a crafter or who only crafts on one or two characters looks at “Exotic” as the level under “Ascended” and therefore a very high level of crafting. And if they aren’t a crafter or only craft on one character to make bags or whatever they aren’t likely to know that Artificers are the only profession that comes with Exotic crafting at level 0.

Well then, it’s a good thing for this new daily system, isn’kitten

Because now those people get to learn about crafting luck items through artificing into higher luck items to reduce numbers of clicks.

They now have to do less clicks in order to get through stacks of luck items!

I think it more likely that most of these same players will think that the “Craft an Exotic” daily is out of their reach and they won’t attempt it OR learn from it.

Sinifair.1026:

Djinn.9245:

Sinifair.1026:

Personally, I like the new dailies, they work very well for me.

Shouldn’t we be allowed to have fun in GW2 the way we always have? With access to the same Achievement rewards that everyone else gets?

It’s not that I don’t get your point. Getting rewarded for the content you enjoy doing? I’m all for it, however, I don’t think that the dailies should reward you for that content.

Your answer is kind of confusing. You are enjoying the new Dailies, therefore you are being rewarded for doing the content you enjoy. Yet you say that I should not get the daily reward for doing the content I enjoy…

Djinn.9245:

Sinifair.1026:

Djinn.9245:

Sinifair.1026:

Personally, I like the new dailies, they work very well for me.

Shouldn’t we be allowed to have fun in GW2 the way we always have? With access to the same Achievement rewards that everyone else gets?

It’s not that I don’t get your point. Getting rewarded for the content you enjoy doing? I’m all for it, however, I don’t think that the dailies should reward you for that content.

Your answer is kind of confusing. You are enjoying the new Dailies, therefore you are being rewarded for doing the content you enjoy. Yet you say that I should not get the daily reward for doing the content I enjoy…

He’s saying you picked a plant, congratulations you were rewarded with a cabbage.

You should actually have to do something for the achievements.

Astralporing.1957:

DeWolfe.2174:

Running around Gendarran Fields for 30 minutes already trying to do events. Absolutely fabulous experience (sarcasm) running to events, only to have them already been nuked by the “comfortable” level of players in these Mega Server instances.

That… was interesting experience. Fortunately guardian staff farmer can tag anything, but still those events were unreal. Champ spider? Died in 7 seconds. Treasure Skritt that had the misfortune to spawn in the middle of a zerg? 4 seconds. People were often calling events when they were already ending.
At least some of the Toxic offshoot events take longer and couldn’t be speeded too much by zerg dps. That way at least the level-appropriate players had some chance. I really felt sorry for them, those that i saw/heard in chat looked completely lost and confused.

What I don’t understand is why Anet would introduce another “whole game in a beginner zone” mechanic. They nerfed champ farming because it was toxic to new players, made the Living Story into instances and in new level 80 areas. Making zone-specific dailies is a step backward. Is it a right-hand / left-hand issue?

Astralporing.1957:

Filaha.1678:

Astralporing.1957:

Filaha.1678:

Albadaran.1283:

Ok to summarize a lot of what’s been saying:
Dailies are done for the 10 achievement points. Not for fun. Even those who play the new dailies often admit that its not for the fun. Especially the PvE dailies are subject of criticisms. Mostly because of the lack of choice. Obvious solution:

Give us more choice!! Instead of 3 out of 4 make it 3 out of 10! Everyone happy!

I wouldn’t be happy with that. It’d mean I’d have to take more time out of my day to get the easy rewards.

Why is that a problem? After all, according to an argument you have used in this thread many times already, they would be purely optional, and nobody would force you to get them.

I didn’t say anybody would force me to do them. I choose to do what I can for extra rewards.

Then, again using your own argument, where the unhappiness would come from? You could always choose to not do them. They’d be optional, you wouldn’t need to do them at all.

I could choose to, but I wouldn’t wish to. But at least it’s my choice.

Djinn.9245:

Filaha.1678:

Djinn.9245:

Manasa Devi.7958:

Save up 20 fine essences of luck. Grab a character with Artificer at 0. Refine luck up to exotic. Receive 3 ectoplasm. Not hard, great pay-off.

The average player who either isn’t a crafter or who only crafts on one or two characters looks at “Exotic” as the level under “Ascended” and therefore a very high level of crafting. And if they aren’t a crafter or only craft on one character to make bags or whatever they aren’t likely to know that Artificers are the only profession that comes with Exotic crafting at level 0.

Well then, it’s a good thing for this new daily system, isn’kitten

Because now those people get to learn about crafting luck items through artificing into higher luck items to reduce numbers of clicks.

They now have to do less clicks in order to get through stacks of luck items!

I think it more likely that most of these same players will think that the “Craft an Exotic” daily is out of their reach and they won’t attempt it OR learn from it.

Then that’s all the more reason to have this. If people aren’t aware of luck compression, then they’re missing out on a huge click-saver. Clearly this new system is objectively useful as a method to spur people to learn how to enhance their play experience.

Manasa Devi.7958:

WvW and PvP players can pretty much finish their dailies while going their usual merry ways. The system obviously isn’t meant to get players to play outside their comfort zones, it’s specifically geared to only do that to PvE players. And not by making WvW/PvP more attractive. Perish the thought. It is accomplished by making the PvE dailies terribly unattractive.

Great summation.

After running tonight’s daily it was a total cluster. The events in Snowden Drifts were never announce. I spent 7 silver jumping around the map trying to join events. There were so many other players that I was not even hitting enemies because of total damage being done by other players, I did not get credit for them. Being a physically handicapped player the new daily and holiday events are not obtainable without waiting until the mobs leave the maps so I can do them. I know the game is meant for everybody to play but the daily and alot of the special events make me want to walk away from doing the daily and special events. Could we find a happy medium that will allow handicapped players like myself be able to once again enjoy the game I came to enjoy. Thank you for reading

The “do 4 events in” are a bad design – all it leads to are overcrowded maps and frustrated melee players who see enemies melt ebfore they have even spawned – add to this that in low level areas events to not scale properly – so you have still like 5 grawl in stage II of the ice shaman regardless of the 50+ players …

As a melee it is very hard to score a hit so that you get recognized for the event and for new players it is next to impossible to get recognized because a true level 5 does way less damage than a fully geared downscaled level 80.

So it would be better to have things spread out (like with the vista or the mining) and make it "do 4 events in the Shiverpeaks, Kryta, etc.) which would not lead to all that clustering.

HtFde.3856:

The “do 4 events in” are a bad design – all it leads to are overcrowded maps and frustrated melee players who see enemies melt ebfore they have even spawned – add to this that in low level areas events to not scale properly – so you have still like 5 grawl in stage II of the ice shaman regardless of the 50+ players …

As a melee it is very hard to score a hit so that you get recognized for the event and for new players it is next to impossible to get recognized because a true level 5 does way less damage than a fully geared downscaled level 80.

So it would be better to have things spread out (like with the vista or the mining) and make it "do 4 events in the Shiverpeaks, Kryta, etc.) which would not lead to all that clustering.

I don’t suppose you could not melee for the span of four events? I don’t. Even on melee characters. I use a staff on my guardian and a bow on my warrior. My thieves use a bow or a pistol with ricchochet. It works fine.

So, on the assumption I can talk about pvp dailies too…man, there bad. 1) You can get a daily to play a class you don’t actually have 2) they make matchmaking much worse than it should be by class stacking to the point of 3 of a class on one team. “Play x class” dailies should be removed

In the match I got 3 thiefs on my team, and the other team had 2 thiefs and 3 warriors. lol

Subdue.5479:

Elden Arnaas.4870:

So zone is map, and region is region. Then that’s 9 needlessly specific choices. Which is one of our major arguments – too much specificity. And why can’t all game modes have more choices?(than 4)

One of the goals of the revamp is to encourage players to try different game modes and activities. If all the game modes have a bunch of easy stuff to complete, people just default to the easy stuff. In the current setup, there’s 2 easy, 2 time consuming dailies in each mode, which means you can stick to your own game mode if you like and complete the dailies but take longer, or you can explore a different game mode and finish faster. Choice.

Not choice; cattle chute. Learn when you are being herded/controlled, please.

Spook.5847:

Subdue.5479:

Elden Arnaas.4870:

So zone is map, and region is region. Then that’s 9 needlessly specific choices. Which is one of our major arguments – too much specificity. And why can’t all game modes have more choices?(than 4)

One of the goals of the revamp is to encourage players to try different game modes and activities. If all the game modes have a bunch of easy stuff to complete, people just default to the easy stuff. In the current setup, there’s 2 easy, 2 time consuming dailies in each mode, which means you can stick to your own game mode if you like and complete the dailies but take longer, or you can explore a different game mode and finish faster. Choice.

Not choice; cattle chute. Learn when you are being herded/controlled, please.

You can call it what you like. It’s yet to take me more than 10 minutes to complete the daily and get 10 AP since the patch, a feat which took much longer previously. If all it takes is a quick visit to WvW to make that happen, why the heck not?

Astralporing.1957:

Djinn.9245:

I believe you that there was a blog post, but do you really think the openworld PvE dailies are enticing players to do things they haven’t done?

Even the defenders of the system do not seem to truly believe it, as they apparently think that the default behaviour should be to do them in the least time possible, using all loopholes and shortcuts you can find. And laugh at posters that actually went at the dailies the normal way.

I believe the default behavior is, indeed, “get this done as quickly as possible” because that seems to be a focus of the majority of the people on the forums. Therefore, it’s entirely logical the majority of the players agree with the concept of them doing everything quickly and with the least effort.

Given this is also related to the arguments for how change needs to be done because the forums exploded on a topic, I dare someone to try to dismiss that as “vocal minority” . . . who isn’t Vayne . . . and not come off as hypocritical.

Regardless, I will continue to do them quickly because they’re easily done quickly and with a minor amount of fuss most times. (And when they’re not, I’ll turn the page to the WvW ones and see if there’s one there which will be simple.) I’ll also continue to offer up advice on how easily to do some of the tasks for those who want to complain about them being hard or time-consuming.

. . . no, I have no way around World Bosses, or dual-Fractals.

Subdue.5479:

You can call it what you like. It’s yet to take me more than 10 minutes to complete the daily and get 10 AP since the patch, a feat which took much longer previously. If all it takes is a quick visit to WvW to make that happen, why the heck not?

Some people don’t want to go to WvW. Given how the behavior is there sometimes, it’s understandable. (Some commanders do not like rogue agents doing stuff on a map which was not explicitly approved of.)

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Subdue.5479:

You can call it what you like. It’s yet to take me more than 10 minutes to complete the daily and get 10 AP since the patch, a feat which took much longer previously. If all it takes is a quick visit to WvW to make that happen, why the heck not?

Some people don’t want to go to WvW. Given how the behavior is there sometimes, it’s understandable. (Some commanders do not like rogue agents doing stuff on a map which was not explicitly approved of.)

This made me laugh. I’d love to see a commander try to tell me that it’s his map and I can’t do something on it.

CMM.6712:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Subdue.5479:

You can call it what you like. It’s yet to take me more than 10 minutes to complete the daily and get 10 AP since the patch, a feat which took much longer previously. If all it takes is a quick visit to WvW to make that happen, why the heck not?

Some people don’t want to go to WvW. Given how the behavior is there sometimes, it’s understandable. (Some commanders do not like rogue agents doing stuff on a map which was not explicitly approved of.)

This made me laugh. I’d love to see a commander try to tell me that it’s his map and I can’t do something on it.

It’s not necessarily the commanders which are a problem, in those cases. No, the real problem are their followers who don’t like how someone is not throwing themselves at Hills but is capping camps/sentries or gone dolyak killing.

It’s also not common but it does happen.

I like the new system. I like that I only have to do 3 achievements of my choice for a full 10 AP. I like that the cap for dailies and monthlies have been combined and I can still potentially get as many AP from the new system as from the old. I like that I only do more achievements because I want to, for the nice rewards, not because I need to in order to not fall behind with the AP. It makes it feel much less of a chore. I like that I get rewards for simply logging in, because I’ll probably keep on doing that no matter how busy I get.

Scale specific fractal dailies need to GTFO, like today. You’ve ruined the experience for EVERYONE. It’s not an elitism thing, new players should not be jumping in every single scale 19 group in green gear 0 AR asking how to do every fight. There’s scale 1-10 for people who need to learn it without proper gear. Making the daily for the end chest was an excellent change but making it scale specific is the worst cancer I’ve ever seen in a game. So now every single 11-20 group on days with 11-20 daily is a revolving door of no AR new fractallers who die 15 times and rage quit. Bad experience for newcomers, bad experience for veterans, equals garbage coding that had zero thought put into it. Just had to leave an hour into a scale 19 on dredge because no one knew the place, having to stop and explain every fight, revive everyone 20 times during each fight, replace someone every 3-5 minutes who broke their armor dying. I literally had 25 people in my scale 19 and didn’t even finish it. I think at least 12 of them were sub 1k AP rangers. I don’t mind playing with new people, but we should be going to scale 1 for that which is why the system exists to begin with.

bring the old pve dailies the new one are kitten and forcing me to go to lvl 80 zones do things i dont wanna do etc etc and new players cant understand them at all

Djinn.9245:

What I don’t understand is why Anet would introduce another “whole game in a beginner zone” mechanic. They nerfed champ farming because it was toxic to new players, made the Living Story into instances and in new level 80 areas. Making zone-specific dailies is a step backward. Is it a right-hand / left-hand issue?

ANet nerfed the Queensdale Champ trains because players were fighting in chat because someone killed a Champion out of rotation. While the arguments and name-calling did not give new players a good impression, Anet has also nerfed other farms in high-level areas where similar arguments occurred. This tells me that ANet does not want players fighting in chat, whether new players are there or not.

That said, events in a low level area that happens to be the daily “target zone” are not likely to be fun for new players. They haven’t yet learned to run to the mob spawn point and attack empty space until the mobs appear (only to die before they can take a step or launch an attack). Even if they learn, they will still have trouble because an on-level cannot generate damage to compete with 40+ down-levels.

Poor event and mob scaling and “enticing” hordes of 80’s into the same low to mid-level zones makes for some ludicrous game-play. I wonder what a new player thinks of this type of game-play.

“Hey, there’s an event! Wow, that’s a lot of people? Why can they all move faster than me? Where did the mobs go? It’s over? Why didn’t I get credit?” How’s that for a New Player Experience?

HtFde.3856:

The “do 4 events in” are a bad design – all it leads to are overcrowded maps and frustrated melee players who see enemies melt ebfore they have even spawned – add to this that in low level areas events to not scale properly – so you have still like 5 grawl in stage II of the ice shaman regardless of the 50+ players …

As a melee it is very hard to score a hit so that you get recognized for the event and for new players it is next to impossible to get recognized because a true level 5 does way less damage than a fully geared downscaled level 80.

So it would be better to have things spread out (like with the vista or the mining) and make it "do 4 events in the Shiverpeaks, Kryta, etc.) which would not lead to all that clustering.

Forgive me if I’m seeming rude, I’m really unclear on this point, don’t most people carry both a ranged and a melee weapon? I understand melee being your primary play style for serious events, but for tagfests like these, wouldn’t you want to have a ranged weapon? You listed Guard in your signature, so you have access to the Lootstick, no?

One more try on improving the daily tasks, PvE only:

• Daily Nice View
  • View a vista in {map},
  • complete a jumping puzzle in {region},
  • or kill 50 monsters across the world.

• Daily Resource Manager
  • Gather 4 {resource type} in {map},
  • gather 15 resources across the world,
  • or salvage 50 items.

• Daily Heroic Deeds
  • Complete 4 events in {map},
  • complete 10 events across the world,
  • or complete a dungeon in explorable mode.

• Daily Proficient Fighter
  • Apply 20 conditions to enemies,
  • cleanse 20 conditions from yourself,
  • or dodge 20 attacks.

• Daily Mad Quaggan’s Pick
  • Kill a specific world boss / complete a specific tier of Fractals.

At the moment I think that something like that could please everyone: those who need a daily goal and play just a bit, those who play a lot but prefer specific content, those who hunt for APs, and those who level their 1st characters.

HELLO!!!! I used to do all daily everyday!!!! yahooooooo I don’t have to do it all now. I am happy customer! in my opinion THERE IS NO CHANGES REQUIRED. it is perfect as it is! GOOD JOB ANET for making these changes. hallelujah god bless.. happy new year!
btw.. thumbs up for josh foreman… looking forward for more SAB soon!

Right on. This game was all about choices. I enjoyed the game bc of the choices that I made not what people want me to do. Hell if I want to stay in Kryta and slaughter gazillion bandits daily then that’s the way it should be. Why? Maybe bc I love Kryta n love killing bandits.

The dailies are far too specific they need to be generalised, take the pvp dailies.

Win a match? That’s fine that’s the goal of PVP after all.
Defend a point? Part of playing.
Capture a point? Part of playing.
Win as specific profession? Not great.

Why isn’t it great? Because usually two of the four PVP dailies are win as X class, which means unless you intend to play one of those two classes you can’t do your daily through SPVP and have to venture into one of the other catagories.

If they are going to insist on having two of the dailies be profession based, makes them either more generalised.

Win as heavy armour class.
Win as light armour class.
Win as medium armour class.

Or change them to be kill/kill as Profession so that either slaying or slaying as one of those professions counts.

Making people abandon their main PVP class just to get the daily done is lame and makes matches unfun.

Likewise in PVE less of the ‘Do events in this Zone’ crap, switch it to ‘Do events in this Region’ and less ‘Do this specific world boss’ change it to ‘Do a world boss’.

More emphasis on ‘Play how you want’ and less Anet telling us what to play each day.

Bottom line is Anet forgets everyone plays the game differently. We all play the same game but in different styles. They just need to leave those alone and add more flavor into the game for the needs of others. Can’t force all to play the same.

Just wanted to give my feedback on the new dailies. Hopefully A-net is still taking notes from this thread.

Firstly, I don’t mind removal of monthlies and am OK with the daily login rewards. Secondly, I only PVE and WvW – I do not PVP so no feedback on those.

WvW Dailies
I’ll start with the simple one.

Overall, I am liking them very much and hope they’re kept as is. I like the reduction in requirements and in particular, the change of Daily Invasion Defender (kill 10 players in WvW) from appearing daily to occasional and only 3 players.

As the WWF saying goes “When the achievements stops, the killing can too”. :P

I am loving the opportunity to earn a Tome of Knowledge when capturing a Keep. One feedback is I hope taking SMC will count towards Keep Capturer (it is not currently).

PVE Dailies
This one is a mixed bag. Some I like, some I really don’t care for. None are too troublesome but that could be because I am a veteran player with sufficient understanding of the game and resources.

As with WvW Dailies, I am liking the opportunities to earn a Tome of Knowledge but in PVE, I can also earn extra Pristine Fractal Relics for Fractal runs and Ectoplasm just for making Exotic Essence of Luck.

Also happy that I don’t have to look for “Mentored Events” anymore i.e. no AP opportunity cost to skip.

IMO, I think the PVE achievement items would be a lot better if they were made “region/zone-free” or taught gameplay mechanics (e.g. Daily Interruptor/Dodger). The new gathering ones are way too specific (zone + type all specified). Fractals too (drop the level specification).

Overall
As someone mentioned earlier in this thread, I too believe that Dailies should be covered naturally as you play the game. This was largely true of the “PVE” achievements of the past. As I run Ascalonian Catacombs P1 to P3 everyday, I would find that the “PVE” achievements were largely accomplished by the time I finished; typically only sans Daily Gatherer.

This is no longer the case. In fact, running AC P1 to P3 does nothing for dailies nowadays. I need to make special trips to places to finish them (I ignore the “Metrica Province events” or “Daily Frost Maw” types; going mainly for the “Shiverpeaks Gatherers” or “Ascalonian Vista” types). Does this bother me a lot? Not at all! I have 16 fully exotic-equipped level 80s stationed around Tyria and have good understanding of how to accomplish these efficiently. But it’s still a deviation from the earlier philosophy of earning dailies as you play.

Do folks on new accounts see the same things we do? I can only imagine someone with a fresh GW2 account and first character (say its a human, for example) encountering Ascalonian Vistas or Dredgehaunt Cliffs Events Completer. What the heck is that? And its so far away. If they decided to tough it out without asking they could be attempting to cross high level zones which is frustrating and also tedious if they don’t know about the Asura portal system through Lions Arch etc. Point is, not going to be a pleasant early game experience.

In summary (and IMO), the changes to the WvW dailies were very much in the right direction while PVE dailies mostly went to wrong way.

I like the new dailies just as they are. Easier to get at the rewards that i want and most the objectives are fairly easy to do. It allows me to focus more on what i want to do, rather than trying to get ALL the dailies done. This was a very nice change.

Vayne.8563:

HtFde.3856:

The “do 4 events in” are a bad design – all it leads to are overcrowded maps and frustrated melee players who see enemies melt ebfore they have even spawned – add to this that in low level areas events to not scale properly – so you have still like 5 grawl in stage II of the ice shaman regardless of the 50+ players …

As a melee it is very hard to score a hit so that you get recognized for the event and for new players it is next to impossible to get recognized because a true level 5 does way less damage than a fully geared downscaled level 80.

So it would be better to have things spread out (like with the vista or the mining) and make it "do 4 events in the Shiverpeaks, Kryta, etc.) which would not lead to all that clustering.

I don’t suppose you could not melee for the span of four events? I don’t. Even on melee characters. I use a staff on my guardian and a bow on my warrior. My thieves use a bow or a pistol with ricchochet. It works fine.

I could – is it, however, the purpose to alter your build for dailies? And the problem for downleveled players persist – thanks to the new NPE weapon swap comes rather late in the game, so they can’t swap as easily as higher leveled players.

And – I didn’t want to name my least facourite classes – but on those event loot stick swinging guardians are a pest, indeed.

felessan.9587:

HtFde.3856:

The “do 4 events in” are a bad design – all it leads to are overcrowded maps and frustrated melee players who see enemies melt ebfore they have even spawned – add to this that in low level areas events to not scale properly – so you have still like 5 grawl in stage II of the ice shaman regardless of the 50+ players …

As a melee it is very hard to score a hit so that you get recognized for the event and for new players it is next to impossible to get recognized because a true level 5 does way less damage than a fully geared downscaled level 80.

So it would be better to have things spread out (like with the vista or the mining) and make it "do 4 events in the Shiverpeaks, Kryta, etc.) which would not lead to all that clustering.

Forgive me if I’m seeming rude, I’m really unclear on this point, don’t most people carry both a ranged and a melee weapon? I understand melee being your primary play style for serious events, but for tagfests like these, wouldn’t you want to have a ranged weapon? You listed Guard in your signature, so you have access to the Lootstick, no?

I should update my signature – there’s an 80 of all classes and – no – ranged is not really a good option for some classes. From what I expect (could be my fault) the dailies should be do-able by any profession and you should not be forced to re-trait or reskill just because of them, right?

Also keep in mind please, that many events take place in starter zones and that weapon swap comes a tad late in the game (level 15) now with the new NPE.

The problem is mainly that there are many people and that -especially so in the low level zones – events do not scale properly. It’s ok-ish for Orr – you have many people you get many enemies and elites and champs which “last a while” – in most zones, however, the number of enemies and their level is not adjusted wether there be 5 or 60 players so stuff just insta-melts in one hits.

Now think of new players … will they enjoy being in an event they have no chance to get credited for? I don’t think so.

When I first heard about the new dailies I was pretty skeptical. After the trait system mess and the almost-but-not-quite NPE changes I wasn’t confident in more system changes.

But the new dailies work quite well, actually.

The big difference between the new trait system and the new daily system is that one removes player options and one provides more options. Yes, I said it – the new dailies give us more options. We don’t have to do the dailies at all to get laurels and Mystic Coins anymore.

Before, I had to do the dailies to get access to some parts of the game (Laurels and MC mainly). Now, if I don’t have time to go do something out of my way, I don’t need to. I get the important progression currencies anyway. BUT if I do want to explore, the dailies can be a guide to what content lots of people will be doing. So I have more freedom, and a suggestion list of where I can go to play with other people.

The daily changes seem like a thoughtful attempt to revamp a system to be more player-friendly. I just hope the trait system gets a similar makeover so that the traits are a natural part of leveling again.

Spook.5847:

Not choice; cattle chute. Learn when you are being herded/controlled, please.

Thank you! Not everyone wears blindfolds after all!

Anyandrell.6238:

Spook.5847:

Not choice; cattle chute. Learn when you are being herded/controlled, please.

Thank you! Not everyone wears blindfolds after all!

Somehow, the distinct lack of cattle prods and electric fences makes me question your opinion.

Seriously – we now don’t have to do dailies at all to get laurels and MC. And we need to do fewer dailies to get AP. And each daily gives a single reward.

To me, ANet clearly uncoupled the currencies from the dailies so that people wouldn’t feel pressure to do them. You’re not missing out on anything by not doing dailies, unlike with the old system.

The only way to really complete events when they’re in low level maps is to sit at one camp site now until the event respawns and just do it 4x’s. People have been running all over snowden drifts this morning trying to catch up and tag the event before it’s over literally 5 seconds later. I’ve been bouncing back and forth as soon as the waypoint’s listed and the other 20 people kill the vet first.

Either randomize it every 100 people or work on scaling, since obviously they’re going to keep showing up in lower level maps to not alienate new people.

Vayne.8563:

HtFde.3856:

The “do 4 events in” are a bad design – all it leads to are overcrowded maps and frustrated melee players who see enemies melt ebfore they have even spawned – add to this that in low level areas events to not scale properly – so you have still like 5 grawl in stage II of the ice shaman regardless of the 50+ players …

As a melee it is very hard to score a hit so that you get recognized for the event and for new players it is next to impossible to get recognized because a true level 5 does way less damage than a fully geared downscaled level 80.

So it would be better to have things spread out (like with the vista or the mining) and make it "do 4 events in the Shiverpeaks, Kryta, etc.) which would not lead to all that clustering.

I don’t suppose you could not melee for the span of four events? I don’t. Even on melee characters. I use a staff on my guardian and a bow on my warrior. My thieves use a bow or a pistol with ricchochet. It works fine.

First: so play a different way than you want, huh? That’s the answer? Figures.

However, some people can’t even get to an event that pops up right in their map area before geared vets with speed get there first and kill everything. The problem is the events being limited to a single zone, not what weapons people are using.

Djinn.9245:

Vayne.8563:

HtFde.3856:

The “do 4 events in” are a bad design – all it leads to are overcrowded maps and frustrated melee players who see enemies melt ebfore they have even spawned – add to this that in low level areas events to not scale properly – so you have still like 5 grawl in stage II of the ice shaman regardless of the 50+ players …

As a melee it is very hard to score a hit so that you get recognized for the event and for new players it is next to impossible to get recognized because a true level 5 does way less damage than a fully geared downscaled level 80.

So it would be better to have things spread out (like with the vista or the mining) and make it "do 4 events in the Shiverpeaks, Kryta, etc.) which would not lead to all that clustering.

I don’t suppose you could not melee for the span of four events? I don’t. Even on melee characters. I use a staff on my guardian and a bow on my warrior. My thieves use a bow or a pistol with ricchochet. It works fine.

First: so play a different way than you want, huh? That’s the answer? Figures.

However, some people can’t even get to an event that pops up right in their map area before geared vets with speed get there first and kill everything. The problem is the events being limited to a single zone, not what weapons people are using.

Actually the problem is poor event scaling. And we’ve already seen that it is possible to have events that scale properly (Silver Wastes, Drytop), so it’s just a matter of applying adjustments that they should already have a grasp on.

This isn’t a problem with the daily, but rather, a problem that the daily has shed light on.

Asgaeroth.6427:

Scale specific fractal dailies need to GTFO, like today. You’ve ruined the experience for EVERYONE. It’s not an elitism thing, new players should not be jumping in every single scale 19 group in green gear 0 AR asking how to do every fight. There’s scale 1-10 for people who need to learn it without proper gear. Making the daily for the end chest was an excellent change but making it scale specific is the worst cancer I’ve ever seen in a game. So now every single 11-20 group on days with 11-20 daily is a revolving door of no AR new fractallers who die 15 times and rage quit. Bad experience for newcomers, bad experience for veterans, equals garbage coding that had zero thought put into it. Just had to leave an hour into a scale 19 on dredge because no one knew the place, having to stop and explain every fight, revive everyone 20 times during each fight, replace someone every 3-5 minutes who broke their armor dying. I literally had 25 people in my scale 19 and didn’t even finish it. I think at least 12 of them were sub 1k AP rangers. I don’t mind playing with new people, but we should be going to scale 1 for that which is why the system exists to begin with.

I don’t do Fractals currently since I would rather learn them first and don’t have a guild to do that with. But thank you for this very good summation of the problem with encouraging everyone to do something – whether they know what they’re doing or not.

As I said in another thread, if Anet wanted to introduce people to different types of content there should be instructions during leveling and a once-per-account nice reward for trying that content. Then people will probably try it and if they never return that should be their choice. Instead of this stupid railroading at every turn.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Djinn.9245:

What I don’t understand is why Anet would introduce another “whole game in a beginner zone” mechanic. They nerfed champ farming because it was toxic to new players, made the Living Story into instances and in new level 80 areas. Making zone-specific dailies is a step backward. Is it a right-hand / left-hand issue?

ANet nerfed the Queensdale Champ trains because players were fighting in chat because someone killed a Champion out of rotation. While the arguments and name-calling did not give new players a good impression, Anet has also nerfed other farms in high-level areas where similar arguments occurred. This tells me that ANet does not want players fighting in chat, whether new players are there or not.

That said, events in a low level area that happens to be the daily “target zone” are not likely to be fun for new players. They haven’t yet learned to run to the mob spawn point and attack empty space until the mobs appear (only to die before they can take a step or launch an attack). Even if they learn, they will still have trouble because an on-level cannot generate damage to compete with 40+ down-levels.

Poor event and mob scaling and “enticing” hordes of 80’s into the same low to mid-level zones makes for some ludicrous game-play. I wonder what a new player thinks of this type of game-play.

“Hey, there’s an event! Wow, that’s a lot of people? Why can they all move faster than me? Where did the mobs go? It’s over? Why didn’t I get credit?” How’s that for a New Player Experience?

Exactly. In the brief time I was farming events last night I saw several very confused players and one player rage quit because he couldn’t get to an event fast enough several times in a row.

Tumavotinh.6325:

Bottom line is Anet forgets everyone plays the game differently. We all play the same game but in different styles. They just need to leave those alone and add more flavor into the game for the needs of others. Can’t force all to play the same.

Sorry, but they didn’t forget – they don’t want people to play differently. They want everyone to play the way Anet wants them to play.

Posted some feedback a little wise back and have continued to gather insight from others that I play the game with but do not post here.

The change to the reward system versus AP system still seems to be well received. People like that you are rewarded with items that tie into the activity you are doing.

The AP hunters seem to be neutral about it so far, the hardcore ones feel that people have it easier, which I concur with.

The biggest issue seems to be number of choices. There are two camps here. One that likes to go out of their way to hit dailies and those that want to cover dailies in what they are doing so that they can focus on what the want to be doing versus what the game is leading them to. Been trying to find middle ground there.

It seems if there were more options and options that could be combined to count towards your daily then both camps would be happier. Note the examples below would be combined with others of the same style in a category, just given examples that build on a concept.

Examples:
PVE

• Visit 5 vistas in the world (more general – less reward)
• Visit 2 vistas in Kytra (more specific – more reward)
• Visit Buloh Crossing Vista (highest reward)
• Participate in 10 Events (more general – less reward)
• Participate in 5 Events in Northern Shiverpeaks (more specific – more reward)
• Defeat The Gaint Imp in Spearhead Bane (highest reward)
• Complete 1 Path in the Honor of the Wave Dungeon (highest reward)
• Harvest 100 Units of Lumber (more general – less reward)
• Harvest 50 Units of Lumber from Timberlane Falls (more specific – more reward)
• Craft 50 Items (more general – less reward)
• Craft 5 Exotics (more specific – more reward)

PVP

• Play 10 Matches (more general – less reward)
• Play 6 Matches as a Warrior (more specific – more reward)
• Win 3 matches as a Warrior (highest reward)
• Play 5 Unranked Matches (more general – less reward)
• Win 3 Unranked Matches (more specific – more reward)
• Win 1 Unranked Match as a Mesmer (highest reward)
• Win 3 Ranked Matches (more specific – more reward)
• Win 1 Ranked Match as an Elementalist (highest reward)

WvW

• Capture 10 Objectives (sentries/camps/towers/keeps – more general – less reward)
• Capture 5 Towers (more specific – more reward)
• Capture 1 Keep (even more specific more reward)
• Defeat 50 Veteran Guards (more general – less reward)
• Defeat 20 Players (more specific – more reward)
• Finish 5 Thieves (highest reward)
• Gain 5 levels in WvW (more general – less reward)
• Kill 25 Dolyaks (more specific – more reward)
• Capture Stonemist 3 Times (more specific – more reward)

So key in the examples are general goals people might do as they do their normal game play and some that might encourage them to do other activities. Some build upon others so people could mix and match difficulty levels. There are additional more challenging ones for people targeting harder items.

Now there is an additional group here that this would not favor and that is the group that would want to do them all. Since AP is no longer tied to doing all the events that should reduce stress that this group felt was being applied to them, but at the same reward those that are doing it for the challenge if they are so inclined.

Hope that helps. Good hunting!

You know, this whole mess is because ANet does not communicate. If they had made a thread while this was in the planning stages and asked us about potential problems we could have pointed things out. It seems ANet isn’t good at putting themselves into the player’s shoes and seeing things from their point of view (traits, the commander tag issue, NPE and non new players, and now this)

They couldn’t foresee that putting EVERYONE in one map is too many people in one map and the events can’t handle it? They couldn’t foresee that putting everyone in a starter map screws it up for the new players? (They don’t have the speed boosts or wps to get to events, are maybe still melee due to no weapon swap and who are underpowered compared to level 80s). They couldn’t foresee that people would pour into non starter level fractals when they are not ready for that level? They couldn’t foresee that people don’t like being herded from one spot to the next instead of getting rewarded for playing? (and maybe for playing intelligently: dodges, condition applying and cleanses, interrupts).

Really ANet. Make a thread first before you do something liked this and ASK us if we see potential problems.

Listenbird, I really like your ideas in: One more try on improving the daily tasks, PvE only. But there are a few things that I disagree with, all issues of over-specificity. It seems like you’ve tried to work within Anet’s framework as much as possible, and that may be why those were included the way they were.

Map specific daily events – Yes, this is one item in a category, but it could still send hordes of high level players into a starter area. Probably less than when it was the only choice. But if a starter area comes up in the rotation, that may be widely chosen as it’s (perceived as) the path of least resistance. The events daily needs to not be map specific.

Specific Fractal – Someone has previously posted that this will send totally, or relatively inexperienced players into fractals of a higher difficulty than they should be attempting, instead of easing them into the lower level fractals where it would be more appropriate for them to ask questions, and actually be taught how to properly do fractals. So I can’t get behind this choice, either. Make this any fractal, and this option would be much better. People can choose whatever fractal they want, and everyone is happier.

Specific World Boss – I think that I know why Anet did this. They may want to use this as a gauge to see which World Bosses need to be reworked, because they just aren’t popular. But then why has it been Frozen Maw (one of the most over-populated WB events) so often? And you still have to factor in low level players that need an alternate choice when the WB that comes up is in a higher level area. So I have to disagree with this choice as well. If Anet wants to research what WB’s need to be improved, why are they spending so much time looking at popular ones, not sending people to the more complained about ones?(like the Shatterer, for instance)
An overly specific World Boss choice can also lead to scheduling conflicts. I just can’t get behind an overly-specific choice for World Boss.

Overall though, I like your latest rework. I like the the way you have them nicely grouped in categories, though Anet might find that level of hierarchy more difficult that what they would like to implement.

Thank you for putting in the time and effort(once again) to offer up a clear, logical solution. It’s obvious you care about GW2, and it is admirable of you work up clear, well organized posts which offer viable alternatives.

I think that Anet may be deliberately over crowding maps and events to research ways to make event scaling work better. This makes it more legitimate,(if that’s really what they’re doing) but what it does to starter areas is still very negative. Especially to new players. I think that the only players getting starter areas assigned for their Daily Events “Quota”, should be people who are level-appropriate for stater areas.