The Shank Anchorage farm rewards failure

The Shank Anchorage farm rewards failure

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Posted by: Duke Blackrose.4981

Duke Blackrose.4981

It’s ironic that most of the nerfed farming spots (such as Pen/Shelt) were nerfed into oblivion for rewarding based on intended mechanics (completion), while this Shank Anchorage farm has been going on without the immediate hotfix that it needs and deserves. It is, in my opinion, the single most toxic example of farming that has occurred in Guild Wars 2 to date.

1. Shank Anchorage Champ Farm rewards failure.

Massive zergs of players intentionally fail the mission over and over again to earn a profit.

2. It brings out the absolute worst in the community.

Anyone who attempts to do the event as intended (by, you know, actually DOING the event) will be harassed for hurting the profit of the zerg. Somehow, I sincerely doubt that this was in Anet’s (or anyone else’s) vision for the game.

3. It is exploitation of one of the most important dynamic events in the game.

Arah is permanently locked because of exploitation of the Shank Anchorage event. The farmers’ response to this? They will tell you to guest to another server, as if that excused their actions.

4. It is unhealthy for the economy.

The potential for profits is obscene. With a full dps group, the resulting profit can (and probably will) make pre-nerf CoF1 look like a joke. Unfortunately, just like CoF1, a large percentage of profits gained from this farm involves the introduction of new gold into the economy, rather than profits earned by trading. If the farm continues to exist in its current state, there will be lasting damage to the ingame economy.

5. Even the game itself dislikes it.

It literally breaks the game in that spot. It highlights all of the worst aspects of the current game engine and mechanics by culling out mobs and spells (getting instagibbed by an invisible AoE from an invisible Champion is always fun) and requiring full teams of berserker-only high dps characters just to get any significant amount of loot at all.

Basically, this event needs a hotfix.

It’s okay to nerf the rewards of this event into oblivion (temporarily) to solve the issue as quickly as possible, but DON’T leave it like this and DON’T leave it nerfed. After nerfing it, take the time to think out a more healthy rewards rework for this event chain and any other problematic event chains.

The easy solution would probably be to back-end the rewards more, placing more champions at the final Arah event, Defeat the Risen High Wizard and Secure the Promenade of the Gods. With no failure state, the potential for outright exploitation is considerably lower, making this event an ideal place to shift the income. People will be able to freely complete the dynamic events and open Arah WITHOUT being flamed by a veritable mob of toxic players.

(edited by Duke Blackrose.4981)

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Posted by: Kronus.6048

Kronus.6048

The reason why you see this happening is pretty simple: Arenanet nerfs to the ground every farming area in the game that is seen as profitable so the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really, but rather the extreme nerf on the farming areas from anet that led to this behaviour. Before you had cof p1 to run, areas to farm and so on. Now, it’s all about the places where champs spawn the most to get as many chests as possible. When this gets nerfed, the zerg will move to the next most profitable thing and repeat the process.

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Posted by: tolunart.2095

tolunart.2095

…the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really…

It really is. Try actually playing the game as it is intended to be played instead of squeezing every copper out of it until Anet is forced to step in.

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Posted by: Duke Blackrose.4981

Duke Blackrose.4981

The reason why you see this happening is pretty simple: Arenanet nerfs to the ground every farming area in the game that is seen as profitable so the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really, but rather the extreme nerf on the farming areas from anet that led to this behaviour. Before you had cof p1 to run, areas to farm and so on. Now, it’s all about the places where champs spawn the most to get as many chests as possible. When this gets nerfed, the zerg will move to the next most profitable thing and repeat the process.

Let’s be realistic – even if more legitimate farming locations had NOT been nerfed and this exploit came to be, the exploit would still become the dominant way of earning gold.

Do you honestly believe that people would choose pre-nerf Pen/Shelt over the ludicrous profits generated by this?

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Posted by: Quarktastic.1027

Quarktastic.1027

The only solution to this is to out-zerg the zerg. Get enough people to complete the event, then complete it. Let the zerglings rage at their monitors all they want.

If all else fails, report it to anet.

Those armadillos would be a lot cooler if they looked more like real armadillos. mmm armadillos
-BnooMaGoo.5690

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Posted by: darkace.8925

darkace.8925

The reason why you see this happening is pretty simple: Arenanet nerfs to the ground every farming area in the game that is seen as profitable so the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really, but rather the extreme nerf on the farming areas from anet that led to this behaviour. Before you had cof p1 to run, areas to farm and so on. Now, it’s all about the places where champs spawn the most to get as many chests as possible. When this gets nerfed, the zerg will move to the next most profitable thing and repeat the process.

Blaming ArenaNet for the poor behavior displayed by some of the people playing this game is absurd.

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Posted by: Zyphent.2967

Zyphent.2967

…the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really…

It really is. Try actually playing the game as it is intended to be played instead of squeezing every copper out of it until Anet is forced to step in.

Its the MMO player mentality, sure its the farmer’s fault, but you can’t change people, they need to fix it before it does long term damage to the economy.

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Posted by: Shockwave.1230

Shockwave.1230

There’s no reason to blame people for getting rewards as quickly as possible. If they found content compelling enough and rewards adequate enough then they’d do it.

Sylvari Elementalist – Mystree Duskbloom (Lv 80)
Norn Guardian – Aurora Lustyr (Lv 80)
Mia A Shadows Glow – Human Thief (Lv 80)

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Posted by: Star Ace.5207

Star Ace.5207

What’s sad is that Champions should not be nerfed because of the way they are currently exploited, but it’s almost impossible to force people not to exploit-bad for those who would do and finish events and farm champions “normally.”

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Posted by: Peetee.9406

Peetee.9406

It’s not nearly as profitable as the Deadeye Delta 5 gambit runs in Queen’s Gauntlet. Zerk warriors are pulling about 21gp/hour and that’s raw gold unlike the champ farm which is primarily loot.

Kayku
[CDS] Caedas
Sanctum of Rall

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Posted by: chemiclord.3978

chemiclord.3978

Quite a simple solution, really. Once the event is failed, the champion vanishes. There goes your farm.

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Posted by: Dante.1508

Dante.1508

It is Anets fault, and its getting worse, each time Anet clamps down on the content, they look for other ways to make money, if the currency wasn’t important we wouldn’t be in this state now..

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Posted by: kokiman.2364

kokiman.2364

There’s no reason to blame people for getting rewards as quickly as possible. If they found content compelling enough and rewards adequate enough then they’d do it.

There is no reason to harras people who like to complete events as intended .

GuildWars 2

Currently playing Heart of Thorns.

(edited by kokiman.2364)

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Posted by: Duke Blackrose.4981

Duke Blackrose.4981

Quite a simple solution, really. Once the event is failed, the champion vanishes. There goes your farm.

That wouldn’t hurt anything. It would cost them like 1-2 champs per run.

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Posted by: Im Mudbone.1437

Im Mudbone.1437

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Blackgate Megaserver – [LaZy] Imperium of LaZy Nation
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Shockwave.1230

Shockwave.1230

There’s no reason to blame people for getting rewards as quickly as possible. If they found content compelling enough and rewards adequate enough then they’d do it.

There is no reason to harras people who like to complete events as intended .

No, there’s not. This is ANet’s issue to manage though. They missed seeing that this event would cause two conflicting playstyles to collide, rewards driven vs content driven. There’s nothing wrong with how people enjoy the game.

Sylvari Elementalist – Mystree Duskbloom (Lv 80)
Norn Guardian – Aurora Lustyr (Lv 80)
Mia A Shadows Glow – Human Thief (Lv 80)

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Posted by: Kronus.6048

Kronus.6048

The reason why you see this happening is pretty simple: Arenanet nerfs to the ground every farming area in the game that is seen as profitable so the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really, but rather the extreme nerf on the farming areas from anet that led to this behaviour. Before you had cof p1 to run, areas to farm and so on. Now, it’s all about the places where champs spawn the most to get as many chests as possible. When this gets nerfed, the zerg will move to the next most profitable thing and repeat the process.

Let’s be realistic – even if more legitimate farming locations had NOT been nerfed and this exploit came to be, the exploit would still become the dominant way of earning gold.

Do you honestly believe that people would choose pre-nerf Pen/Shelt over the ludicrous profits generated by this?

Probably not, but back then the economy was fine and everything was cheap. Those days arenet added a bunch of gold sinks even though the price for gems is much higher and everything is more expensive.

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Posted by: Duke Blackrose.4981

Duke Blackrose.4981

There’s no reason to blame people for getting rewards as quickly as possible. If they found content compelling enough and rewards adequate enough then they’d do it.

There is no reason to harras people who like to complete events as intended .

No, there’s not. This is ANet’s issue to manage though. They missed seeing that this event would cause two conflicting playstyles to collide, rewards driven vs content driven. There’s nothing wrong with how people enjoy the game.

It’s their issue, but not their fault. In a game with hundreds, if not thousands of events, predicting this outcome in any one of them is too much to expect. Now, the fixing of said problem should have been more prompt than it has been. It’s been going on for days now, if I’m not mistaken.

Then again, Anet rarely seems to be fast on the uptake of anything that doesn’t involve nerfing Elementalists or nerfing legitimate farm locations.

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Posted by: Shockwave.1230

Shockwave.1230

Then again, Anet rarely seems to be fast on the uptake of anything that doesn’t involve nerfing Elementalists or nerfing legitimate farm locations.

It’s almost like the Elementalist having widespread meta builds is the afflicted plague and ANet is the Ministry of Purity, but this is something completely separate. No further diverging necessary in this forum.

Sylvari Elementalist – Mystree Duskbloom (Lv 80)
Norn Guardian – Aurora Lustyr (Lv 80)
Mia A Shadows Glow – Human Thief (Lv 80)

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Posted by: Sanctus.8350

Sanctus.8350

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

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Posted by: Im Mudbone.1437

Im Mudbone.1437

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Blackgate Megaserver – [LaZy] Imperium of LaZy Nation
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

You know, if we can blame ANet for the people being complete c . . . contemptible excuses for human beings, does that mean I can go back to blaming WotC for making Magic: The Gathering too entertaining I spend too much on it from time to time?

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

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Posted by: Sanctus.8350

Sanctus.8350

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Exactly what “isn’t intended”? If events weren’t meant to fail, they wouldn’t have designed them so.

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Posted by: Im Mudbone.1437

Im Mudbone.1437

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Exactly what “isn’t intended”? If events weren’t meant to fail, they wouldn’t have designed them so.

The deliberate fails in order to do repeatedly, ad-nauseum, THAT is not an intended feture of the game. Next.

Blackgate Megaserver – [LaZy] Imperium of LaZy Nation
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Cletus Van Damme.2795

Cletus Van Damme.2795

Our guild completed this event while other players told us they’d hunt us down and murder us in real life if we killed a cauldron. Something must be done.

Magumer Ranger

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Posted by: Tobias Trueflight.8350

Tobias Trueflight.8350

Our guild completed this event while other players told us they’d hunt us down and murder us in real life if we killed a cauldron. Something must be done.

Report them. That may fly (somewhat) on League, but it should really be reported.

Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.

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Posted by: Lucius.2140

Lucius.2140

There’s no reason to blame people for getting rewards as quickly as possible. If they found content compelling enough and rewards adequate enough then they’d do it.

The problem here is the form they react against someone trying to do the event, not the fact they are farming.

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Posted by: Kronus.6048

Kronus.6048

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

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Posted by: Lisa.6102

Lisa.6102

Our guild completed this event while other players told us they’d hunt us down and murder us in real life if we killed a cauldron. Something must be done.

oh now thats a bit Like stealing Sheldons weapons in WoW

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Posted by: Duke Blackrose.4981

Duke Blackrose.4981

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Actually, that silver reward is random can go up to about 7s+ and they can be farmed at an extreme rate by deliberately failing this event. Hell, with a group that barely did any dps (in other words, missed the majority of champ kills), I made about 6g from the 3 runs I participated in with guildies. That’s roughly 2g per 10-15 minutes of actual playtime with a poor farming group. An optimal one could likely make 2-3 times that amount, and that’s NOT counting the potential to get lucky with the RNG chests and net an Entropy, Genesis, or other unique exotic.

And yes, there is a valid reason to report this situation (but not the players taking advantage of it, with the exception of flamers/verbal harassers). He’s not the toxic player – the ones throwing out insults, death threats, and reports at players who are trying to correctly do an event are the toxic players. Though you clearly haven’t the slightest bloody clue what does and doesn’t constitute bad player behavior.

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Posted by: Im Mudbone.1437

Im Mudbone.1437

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, the only thing I have reported are a handful of gold sellers and botters, I have never made zerg farming reports only observations, I myself am a solo open world farmer(never staying in one region for more than 2 hours max). Next.

Blackgate Megaserver – [LaZy] Imperium of LaZy Nation
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Kronus.6048

Kronus.6048

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, the only thing I have reported are a handful of gold sellers and botters, I have never made zerg farming reports only observations, I myself am a solo open world farmer(never staying in one region for more than 2 hours max). Next.

Well the way you answered in your first post you actually seemed like you wanted arenaet to ban people for failing those events. Personally I’ve never been there, but even then it wouldn’t be fair because you cannot judge who does what. Some there might be following a commander or just someone unflagged, so how do you ban and for what reason? It’s not exactly ’’fair’’ to ban a guy for following a zerg and farming champions UNLESS farming itself becomes bannable, but then again that would be stupid.

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Posted by: CMF.5461

CMF.5461

Actually, I think the simple solution would be that dynamic events scale to success and failure rates as well as surrounding players.

The more often the event is failed, the easier and easier the mobs should become till the point there are no champions.

The more often the success of the event happens, the harder it will be next time, causing incentive to spawn more difficult mobs and drawing in more possible rewards.

There will be a balancing point where players can’t push anymore and it will even out at a win/loss rate to stop spawning harder mobs and making it easier on the next try.

Hard core players could try to push the success rate higher and claim the accomplishment of hard challenges by winning “x” amount of successes on an event in a row, reaching a crazy high number of champions per an event.

Empty servers/zones with people not doing events could become soloable after a period of time that an event had no successes to it. This would allow more players to see more parts of the game…with less rewards of course because the event scaled down.

More can be done to make it different, and the more often you win an event it will not count towards DR because the event keeps changing and it isn’t a repetitive farm.

They could go so far as if you get multiple wins in a row, it will spawn a new event…but that’s for other talks to help improve the game.

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Posted by: Im Mudbone.1437

Im Mudbone.1437

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, the only thing I have reported are a handful of gold sellers and botters, I have never made zerg farming reports only observations, I myself am a solo open world farmer(never staying in one region for more than 2 hours max). Next.

Well the way you answered in your first post you actually seemed like you wanted arenaet to ban people for failing those events. Personally I’ve never been there, but even then it wouldn’t be fair because you cannot judge who does what. Some there might be following a commander or just someone unflagged, so how do you ban and for what reason? It’s not exactly ’’fair’’ to ban a guy for following a zerg and farming champions UNLESS farming itself becomes bannable, but then again that would be stupid.

I do want this, examples must be set and have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. Next.

Blackgate Megaserver – [LaZy] Imperium of LaZy Nation
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Kronus.6048

Kronus.6048

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, the only thing I have reported are a handful of gold sellers and botters, I have never made zerg farming reports only observations, I myself am a solo open world farmer(never staying in one region for more than 2 hours max). Next.

Well the way you answered in your first post you actually seemed like you wanted arenaet to ban people for failing those events. Personally I’ve never been there, but even then it wouldn’t be fair because you cannot judge who does what. Some there might be following a commander or just someone unflagged, so how do you ban and for what reason? It’s not exactly ’’fair’’ to ban a guy for following a zerg and farming champions UNLESS farming itself becomes bannable, but then again that would be stupid.

I do want this, examples must be set and have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. Next.

Then you are either ignorant or just naive if you think it’s easy. You are basically saying ‘’ban players even if they are innocent.’’ I asked once again, who do you blame for letting the events fail? the leader or the sheep? the leader might not be trying because he might be scared others will curse/insult him, while the sheep won’t do it for the same reason.

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Posted by: knives.6345

knives.6345

…the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really…

It really is. Try actually playing the game as it is intended to be played instead of squeezing every copper out of it until Anet is forced to step in.

Is it stated somewhere that farming is illegal? I thought “it is not required” – means, we can farm “if we want”.

Vi Veri Veniversum Vivus Vici

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Posted by: Kronus.6048

Kronus.6048

…the farmers are rushing to get as many rewards as possible before the nerfhammer hits. It’s not the farmers fault really…

It really is. Try actually playing the game as it is intended to be played instead of squeezing every copper out of it until Anet is forced to step in.

Is it stated somewhere that farming is illegal? I thought “it is not required” – means, we can farm “if we want”.

OFC it is, the casuals have demanded ! It will become a banneable offense next patch -_-

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Posted by: Im Mudbone.1437

Im Mudbone.1437

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, the only thing I have reported are a handful of gold sellers and botters, I have never made zerg farming reports only observations, I myself am a solo open world farmer(never staying in one region for more than 2 hours max). Next.

Well the way you answered in your first post you actually seemed like you wanted arenaet to ban people for failing those events. Personally I’ve never been there, but even then it wouldn’t be fair because you cannot judge who does what. Some there might be following a commander or just someone unflagged, so how do you ban and for what reason? It’s not exactly ’’fair’’ to ban a guy for following a zerg and farming champions UNLESS farming itself becomes bannable, but then again that would be stupid.

I do want this, examples must be set and have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. Next.

Then you are either ignorant or just naive if you think it’s easy. You are basically saying ‘’ban players even if they are innocent.’’ I asked once again, who do you blame for letting the events fail? the leader or the sheep? the leader might not be trying because he might be scared others will curse/insult him, while the sheep won’t do it for the same reason.

I blame both, as I said before, have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. People should read and be expected to adhere to the rules no matter how trivial they may seem to you. Next.

Blackgate Megaserver – [LaZy] Imperium of LaZy Nation
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Lucius.2140

Lucius.2140

Then you are either ignorant or just naive if you think it’s easy. You are basically saying ‘’ban players even if they are innocent.’’ I asked once again, who do you blame for letting the events fail? the leader or the sheep? the leader might not be trying because he might be scared others will curse/insult him, while the sheep won’t do it for the same reason.

If both the sheep and the leader are capable of thinking, then they are both responsable. But isnt ilegal to farm, only insults and that kind of conduct.

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Posted by: Lucius.2140

Lucius.2140

I blame both, as I said before, have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. People should read and be expected to adhere to the rules no matter how trivial they may seem to you. Next.

Thats ok, but the problem isnt the farm but how some farmers react to normal people playing the game. So the act of farm isnt the problem but the behavior some of the farmers have when someone is playing their zerg chain. Next.

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Posted by: Duke Blackrose.4981

Duke Blackrose.4981

At any rate, the discussion has been derailed. It’s up to Anet to decide whether the farming itself is exploitative enough to warrant a temporary ban for those involved (I’m personally leaning towards it not being ban-worthy), but the important factor is the event itself (and others like it) that reward failure and create toxic behavior.

While I do consider the situation to be an exploit, it doesn’t share the same characteristics as the exploits that were deemed ban-worthy in the past. Whereas the karma exploit and the snowflake exploit created something of value from almost nothing, there is actual play and effort involved in the process of exploiting this particular champ farm – it’s just effort in an entirely and deliberately wrong direction.

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Posted by: Shockwave.1230

Shockwave.1230

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, the only thing I have reported are a handful of gold sellers and botters, I have never made zerg farming reports only observations, I myself am a solo open world farmer(never staying in one region for more than 2 hours max). Next.

Well the way you answered in your first post you actually seemed like you wanted arenaet to ban people for failing those events. Personally I’ve never been there, but even then it wouldn’t be fair because you cannot judge who does what. Some there might be following a commander or just someone unflagged, so how do you ban and for what reason? It’s not exactly ’’fair’’ to ban a guy for following a zerg and farming champions UNLESS farming itself becomes bannable, but then again that would be stupid.

I do want this, examples must be set and have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. Next.

Then you are either ignorant or just naive if you think it’s easy. You are basically saying ‘’ban players even if they are innocent.’’ I asked once again, who do you blame for letting the events fail? the leader or the sheep? the leader might not be trying because he might be scared others will curse/insult him, while the sheep won’t do it for the same reason.

I blame both, as I said before, have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. People should read and be expected to adhere to the rules no matter how trivial they may seem to you. Next.

Ignorance is always an excuse, it doesnt mean it will always keep you from consequences.

This is ANet’s issue to solve, not the players. It’s ANet’s fault they missed this. Punishing people with a reward centric playstyle with bans for this is not acceptable. I bet there are people farming the area who have no idea it’s blocking anything, I didn’t even know about this farm until yesterday and didn’t know it was part of the arah chain until today.

You can’t punish people who are ignorant to this and also punish people who play the game for efficient rewards. Both set bad precedents.

Sylvari Elementalist – Mystree Duskbloom (Lv 80)
Norn Guardian – Aurora Lustyr (Lv 80)
Mia A Shadows Glow – Human Thief (Lv 80)

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Posted by: Im Mudbone.1437

Im Mudbone.1437

I blame both, as I said before, have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. People should read and be expected to adhere to the rules no matter how trivial they may seem to you. Next.

Thats ok, but the problem isnt the farm but how some farmers react to normal people playing the game. So the act of farm isnt the problem but the behavior some of the farmers have when someone is playing their zerg chain. Next.

Farming in and of itself isn’t illegal(I’m a farmer), It’s the method used(the zerg train causing purposely failed events in order to get not as intended gains). Here’s your sign.

Blackgate Megaserver – [LaZy] Imperium of LaZy Nation
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger

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Posted by: Duke Blackrose.4981

Duke Blackrose.4981

Isn’t it in the ANET/NCsoft ToS that anyone caught or reported for exploiting and confirmed by a dev grounds for an immediate ban whether it be temp. or perm.? If so, then, why has absolutely no-one been banned for this act of total disregard for legitimate players AND ANETs rules been totally ignored? IMHO ANET should just throw all the rules in the trash and allow everyone to do ANYTHING they want to any degree they want, it’s only fair. What’s good for the goose is good for the gander.

Because its not an exploit, granted, the rewards are a bit rediculous and nerf-worthy at the moment. Events were designed to scale to the amount of players involved in them. Events were designed to be failable. Events were designed to re-trigger after a certain amount of time after failing. Using intended ingame mechanics to your advantage isn’t exploiting (stop using this word to describe anything that might, has, or should get nerfed).

OK, fair enough, replace exploit with not as intended. Same difference.

Eh, they are not as bad as toxic players like you that report everything for no reason. Exploits are when you get insane unfair advantages aka karma weapon for 300 karma or snowflakes giving craploads of ecto. Champion provide 1 chest that is RNG with 4s in it.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but, the only thing I have reported are a handful of gold sellers and botters, I have never made zerg farming reports only observations, I myself am a solo open world farmer(never staying in one region for more than 2 hours max). Next.

Well the way you answered in your first post you actually seemed like you wanted arenaet to ban people for failing those events. Personally I’ve never been there, but even then it wouldn’t be fair because you cannot judge who does what. Some there might be following a commander or just someone unflagged, so how do you ban and for what reason? It’s not exactly ’’fair’’ to ban a guy for following a zerg and farming champions UNLESS farming itself becomes bannable, but then again that would be stupid.

I do want this, examples must be set and have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. Next.

Then you are either ignorant or just naive if you think it’s easy. You are basically saying ‘’ban players even if they are innocent.’’ I asked once again, who do you blame for letting the events fail? the leader or the sheep? the leader might not be trying because he might be scared others will curse/insult him, while the sheep won’t do it for the same reason.

I blame both, as I said before, have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. People should read and be expected to adhere to the rules no matter how trivial they may seem to you. Next.

Ignorance is always an excuse, it doesnt mean it will always keep you from consequences.

This is ANet’s issue to solve, not the players. It’s ANet’s fault they missed this. Punishing people with a reward centric playstyle with bans for this is not acceptable. I bet there are people farming the area who have no idea it’s blocking anything, I didn’t even know about this farm until yesterday and didn’t know it was part of the arah chain until today.

You can’t punish people who are ignorant to this and also punish people who play the game for efficient rewards. Both set bad precedents.

Even if it didn’t set bad precedents, a mass ban would probably be a bad move on Anet’s part from a business and PR standpoint. It would only hurt the reputation with both the in-game community and onlookers. Bad PR just isn’t worth making a statement to your playerbase that won’t stick and won’t solve anything – 5 minutes later, they’ll find something else to exploit and nothing good will come of it all.

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Posted by: Ashen.2907

Ashen.2907

I do want this, examples must be set and have you not heard the saying “ignorance of the law(or in this case, the ToS) is not an excuse”. Next.

Your quote is inapplicable. Someone who wanders over to the location of a commander tag on the map and joins a fight is not guilty of breaking any law (or TOS).

Real world example:

A man hurries out of a store, dropping a package on the way. Another man entering the store, trying to be helpful, picks up the package and hands it to the man who dropped it. The good Samaritan learns after the fact the the package was stolen merchandise from the store and that the man who had dropped it was a thief. The good Samaritan is not a criminal for helping the thief get away because he was not knowingly aiding in the commission of a crime.

Your quote is also not applicable because the action in question has not been declared to be a crime (or violation of the TOS). Ignorance of the law IS in fact a defense if the law in question is not unambiguously stated.

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Posted by: Vayne.8563

Vayne.8563

I don’t think players should be banned for farming, but they should definitely be receive at least temporary bans if they abuse people playing the game as intended. And like it or not, finishing DEs is what Anet intended when they made the game.

So if I go to finish an event, whether I realize people are farming or not, because I want to finish an event, and people curse at me, you’re kitten straight I’ll report them.

That said, I passed that event today on my way to a personal story, and ended up killing some champs. Man they go down fast. It was ridiculous.

The event spawning champions the way it does, one after another, is clearly broken and needs to be fixed.

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Posted by: Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

Herr der Friedhoefe.2490

Given the lack of response from Anet so far, this is probably working as intended, and I was one of the first to predict an incoming nerf on this farming. It’s quite likely that we’re going to need an awful lot of mats for Crafting from 400 to 500, so they’re pre-loading it for us.

The fact that we can pick up a fair bit of gold along the way isn’t all that bad either. Not all of us are trading post sharpshooters.

The lack of civility between players however, is not justified. Play nice kiddies, and maybe we’ll get to keep playing Farm Wars 2.

My posts are facts as I know them, or my own opinion, and do not represent any guild.

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Posted by: Algreg.3629

Algreg.3629

/signed every of your points except the economy part. Economies rarely “break”, they just shift and adapt, with winners and losers.

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Posted by: data.4093

data.4093

Every time I read these threads I feel compelled to jump in for 1 reason alone: the whiners always have a “they shouldn’t have that! I should have that!” mentality. They(the farmers) get rewards that complainers feel are “undeserved” and they vent on the forums trying to get Anet to show up as the shining angel of banhammerville. It’s so weird because all of you complaining should be farming too, that’s how games work! Intelligent farming and time spent yield greater rewards than casual running around.

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Posted by: darkace.8925

darkace.8925

Given the lack of response from Anet so far, this is probably working as intended, and I was one of the first to predict an incoming nerf on this farming. It’s quite likely that we’re going to need an awful lot of mats for Crafting from 400 to 500, so they’re pre-loading it for us.

The fact that we can pick up a fair bit of gold along the way isn’t all that bad either. Not all of us are trading post sharpshooters.

The lack of civility between players however, is not justified. Play nice kiddies, and maybe we’ll get to keep playing Farm Wars 2.

I think their lack of response is because they know they’ve created an insatiable monster. To let the monster run amuck isn’t good for the good citizens of Tyria, but any attempts to check the monster will result in a display of wrath terrible to behold.