Guild Wars 2

phys.7689:

IndigoSundown.5419:

phys.7689:

Lemondish.3268:

Professions will decide base attribute points, traits lines and gear will do the rest. Every player will have 1000 base points on every stat, then profession will add some points, then each chosen specialization will add more, and finally equipment will do the same. This means that some professions may have higher power that others, a bit like Warrior has currently more health and armor that others.

ahhh didnt really understand that proffesion based stat thing till you said it.
That blows.
some proffessions will just be built kitten (toughness/vit stats)

I’m not sure that’s correct.

“We feel that separating build choices from stat decisions provides greater build flexibility, so you’ll no longer gain attribute points through a given line.

Each profession’s attributes will be updated to have half of their functionality be part of a specialization and half of their functionality will be a baseline for that profession. For example, elementalists now have a base attunement recharge of 10 seconds, which is reduced to 8.7 seconds when the arcane specialization is equipped."

It looks to me that the only attributes that will be profession-specific are the ones that are already profession-specific, like the example, attunement recharge.

Either that or the blog is contradicting itself, which I won’t rule out.

half will be part of the specialization, thats the ele base recast lowered with arcane trait line.
half will be proffession linked: “Each profession’s attributes will be updated…. half of their functionality will be a baseline for that profession.”

now, i could easily see this interpretation being incorrect, because it does seem to go against stats being mostly on armors, but thats what what they wrote says now that i look at it carefully.

My interpretation is that “baseline” refers to the profession-specific attribute. In other words, you’ll get some of the benefit of traiting Arcane (for instance) just for being an ele, and the rest by actually choosing that line. This w2ould level the playing field a bit because universal attributes look like they’ve been removed from traits altogether.

Giving professions more universal attributes like power and toughness seems like it would break too many things. Then again, I’ve made that argument in the past and been wrong, so, yeah, we’ll see.

IndigoSundown.5419:

phys.7689:

IndigoSundown.5419:

phys.7689:

Lemondish.3268:

Professions will decide base attribute points, traits lines and gear will do the rest. Every player will have 1000 base points on every stat, then profession will add some points, then each chosen specialization will add more, and finally equipment will do the same. This means that some professions may have higher power that others, a bit like Warrior has currently more health and armor that others.

ahhh didnt really understand that proffesion based stat thing till you said it.
That blows.
some proffessions will just be built kitten (toughness/vit stats)

I’m not sure that’s correct.

“We feel that separating build choices from stat decisions provides greater build flexibility, so you’ll no longer gain attribute points through a given line.

Each profession’s attributes will be updated to have half of their functionality be part of a specialization and half of their functionality will be a baseline for that profession. For example, elementalists now have a base attunement recharge of 10 seconds, which is reduced to 8.7 seconds when the arcane specialization is equipped."

It looks to me that the only attributes that will be profession-specific are the ones that are already profession-specific, like the example, attunement recharge.

Either that or the blog is contradicting itself, which I won’t rule out.

half will be part of the specialization, thats the ele base recast lowered with arcane trait line.
half will be proffession linked: “Each profession’s attributes will be updated…. half of their functionality will be a baseline for that profession.”

now, i could easily see this interpretation being incorrect, because it does seem to go against stats being mostly on armors, but thats what what they wrote says now that i look at it carefully.

My interpretation is that “baseline” refers to the profession-specific attribute. In other words, you’ll get some of the benefit of traiting Arcane (for instance) just for being an ele, and the rest by actually choosing that line. This w2ould level the playing field a bit because universal attributes look like they’ve been removed from traits altogether.

Giving professions more universal attributes like power and toughness seems like it would break too many things. Then again, I’ve made that argument in the past and been wrong, so, yeah, we’ll see.

HMMM ok….

well, lets hope they clear that up tommorow

Guhracie.3419:

…

• When in the leveling process can we start accessing traits?
  …

This was actually answered— and the answer is good! Jon Peters said, “We will have more choices available to players at earlier phases in the game. We’re aiming to unlock specializations around level 20.”

(Source: http://massivelyop.net/2015/04/23/exclusive-guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-interview-unwraps-specializations-and-traits/)

You know what, rather then wasting dev time dumbing down traits and making up new ways to grind our kitten off to regain traits we had before I wish that dev time had been used to give us the ability to save builds and 1 click between them.

That alone would increase build diversity.

Atm and ever since GW2 was released its quite a bit of hassle/time to switch builds, what with swapping out equipment, skills, traits, food etc…

A lot, of players after a while can’t be bothered and just stick with the same build all the time, cause its just too much hassle to keep changing.

Even PvP where its considerably easier than PvE or WvW, cause you don’t after spend gold, its still a chore.

Kumion.7580:

Guhracie.3419:

…

• When in the leveling process can we start accessing traits?
  …

This was actually answered— and the answer is good! Jon Peters said, “We will have more choices available to players at earlier phases in the game. We’re aiming to unlock specializations around level 20.”

(Source: http://massivelyop.net/2015/04/23/exclusive-guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-interview-unwraps-specializations-and-traits/)

Conveniently adjacent to the level 20 scrolls we’re holding onto for alts~

3 full trait lines – maybe good.
Smaller amounts of traits (and build variabilities) – bad.
Impossible to replace Grand Master trait with the Lesser One – bad.
Separating Traits and Stats – maybe good. Where can we find our 30% Condi/Boon duration? Will it be implemented on our gear or just lost?

A lot of the updates seem cool, but I’m not happy with how the trait system is put on rails too much. We should have the ability to build traits in a freeform way. What if I want to be kind of good in all 5 of my trait lines instead of really good in 3?

Hehe! I totally called this trait system (grouping by skills, spending hero points to increase your proficency, several distinct builds from just leveling), and it’s in line with the dumbing down process we’ve been getting so far.

I won’t mind it, though, but we need more interesting ways to get our heroskill points than killing a miniboss or pressing f to commune, somethig that challenges a player, gives us a good reason to group up. (fetch an item from a mini- jumping puzzle like that trait in lornar’s pass comes to mind, toned down a few degrees in lowbie areas) At least now there are people doing events like the High Priest of Balthazar, and together running that sunken ship where you can get Phalanx Strength for warriors. Like it or not, the current trait system makes these events/areas much more meaningful. If all we get from these are salvage trash with a chance of a rare, it won’t be the nearly as interesting to play them.

Well in all fairness to Anet (and believe me, these words coming from my fingertips is alot as of late), while they have shopped it to us on the premise of focusing only on the 3 lines, this system is still not in its final form so there are things that might change between now and live or even now and HoT. (Still hoping those are mutually exclusive Anet.)

Much like Guhracie, you’ve got my attention Anet. Now bring it home.

They’re removing Skill Points. What about all those MF recipes that need mats you can only get with skillpoints?

arkealia.2713:

They’re removing Skill Points. What about all those MF recipes that need mats you can only get with skillpoints?

You can never get those mats again, ever. They’re removing everything from the game that involved that resource. That includes legendaries, despite making a new system that technically will make it easier, or at least more reliable to get a legendary.

Or, more likely, they will change the process by which those mats are acquired.

Kal Spiro.9745:

arkealia.2713:

They’re removing Skill Points. What about all those MF recipes that need mats you can only get with skillpoints?

You can never get those mats again, ever. They’re removing everything from the game that involved that resource. That includes legendaries, despite making a new system that technically will make it easier, or at least more reliable to get a legendary.

Or, more likely, they will change the process by which those mats are acquired.

Kal, be nice. :P

One of the blogs mentioned that skill points (or whatever they’re converting to) will be awarded in level-80 play.

I’d look for MF mats in place of skill scrolls, which means champ bags and the like.

Ok, I’m a very concerned about this new traits/specialization rework that’s coming soon. I personally don’t always use an adept, master, and grand master trait in each of my trees. Will I still be able to use 1 adept and 2 masters if I want, or 2 adepts and a grandmaster?

On the other side, I’m really excited about the ability to modify my class by unlocking new roles for a class and a new weapon like Druid for a ranger. I think that is going to be really enjoyable, once I get that done.

But even as excited as I am about that, I have a feeling that you’re about to break a lot of my characters. I currently have EVERY skill and trait/perk thing unlocked on my Ranger and my Thief. I just have this gut feeling that it’s all going to be erased and I’m going to have to do all of that work over again, with whatever new setup you’re going to have and all of the time and effort I put into working on that is going to be for nothing.

Frozen.7245:

Ok, I’m a very concerned about this new traits/specialization rework that’s coming soon. I personally don’t always use an adept, master, and grand master trait in each of my trees. Will I still be able to use 1 adept and 2 masters if I want, or 2 adepts and a grandmaster?

On the other side, I’m really excited about the ability to modify my class by unlocking new roles for a class and a new weapon like Druid for a ranger. I think that is going to be really enjoyable, once I get that done.

But even as excited as I am about that, I have a feeling that you’re about to break a lot of my characters. I currently have EVERY skill and trait/perk thing unlocked on my Ranger and my Thief. I just have this gut feeling that it’s all going to be erased and I’m going to have to do all of that work over again, with whatever new setup you’re going to have and all of the time and effort I put into working on that is going to be for nothing.

1. As it stands right now (which may, but probably won’t change), you get one Adept, one Master, and one Grandmaster. But, you also get three Grandmaster traits. Some of your builds may have to be retweaked, some may be blessed as some traits combine into one. Cross your fingers.
2. The best way to insure yourself against having setbacks later is to do some world completion now, and hit up those skill challenges. Not only are skill points getting converted to materials (or something), but the system will likely read your level and completed skill points when handing out Hero Points for rebuilding.

That’s based on what I’ve gleaned so far, and it’s obviously up for change. Best thing to do right now is keep calm and explore.

I think it’s also important to start spreading the word that trait changes WILL be occurring on live before HoT ships, and so people should immediately stop spending currency on the present system.

So i am going to arbitrarily lose utility skills and traits i already had, just to regrind old content another 7x to get them back?

Terrahero.9358:

So i am going to arbitrarily lose utility skills and traits i already had, just to regrind old content another 7x to get them back?

It looks like you’re going to get hero points based on your level (mostly) and then however many correspond to skill challenges you’ve completed around the world. It looks like being level 80 will allow for a majority of the unlocks. So it’s more like the new system will be implemented and you’ll get a refund of approximately however many points you should have. There’s no word on if these points will be in any way account bound.

Guhracie.3419:

Terrahero.9358:

So i am going to arbitrarily lose utility skills and traits i already had, just to regrind old content another 7x to get them back?

It looks like you’re going to get hero points based on your level (mostly) and then however many correspond to skill challenges you’ve completed around the world. It looks like being level 80 will allow for a majority of the unlocks. So it’s more like the new system will be implemented and you’ll get a refund of approximately however many points you should have. There’s no word on if these points will be in any way account bound.

So, yes. I am arbitrarily going to lose utility skills and traits and have to grind old content to get them back.

Well thanks for the response.

Terrahero.9358:

Guhracie.3419:

Terrahero.9358:

So i am going to arbitrarily lose utility skills and traits i already had, just to regrind old content another 7x to get them back?

It looks like you’re going to get hero points based on your level (mostly) and then however many correspond to skill challenges you’ve completed around the world. It looks like being level 80 will allow for a majority of the unlocks. So it’s more like the new system will be implemented and you’ll get a refund of approximately however many points you should have. There’s no word on if these points will be in any way account bound.

So, yes. I am arbitrarily going to lose utility skills and traits and have to grind old content to get them back.

Well thanks for the response.

Dude, I’m just a player. I don’t have a hand in this system. I’m just trying to clarify based on what they’ve said.

Guhracie.3419:

Terrahero.9358:

Guhracie.3419:

Terrahero.9358:

So i am going to arbitrarily lose utility skills and traits i already had, just to regrind old content another 7x to get them back?

It looks like you’re going to get hero points based on your level (mostly) and then however many correspond to skill challenges you’ve completed around the world. It looks like being level 80 will allow for a majority of the unlocks. So it’s more like the new system will be implemented and you’ll get a refund of approximately however many points you should have. There’s no word on if these points will be in any way account bound.

So, yes. I am arbitrarily going to lose utility skills and traits and have to grind old content to get them back.

Well thanks for the response.

Dude, I’m just a player. I don’t have a hand in this system. I’m just trying to clarify based on what they’ve said.

And i thank you for your time clarifying.

Or did you think i was blaming you personally for this?

That’s why they really need to grandfather us in. What ever is currently unlocked on a character should be unlocked after the update. Who the heck wants to grind to get something you already have.

Especially if you grinded it out in the current BS trait system.

………………………………………………

So HoT will essentially be NPE for everyone, including 80’s who currently have everything unlocked?

Let’s hope not. But hey, the fun starts ten levels lower.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

That’s why they really need to grandfather us in. What ever is currently unlocked on a character should be unlocked after the update. Who the heck wants to grind to get something you already have.

Especially if you grinded it out in the current BS trait system.

They can’t grandfather anyone in, because it’s not the same system at all, from what they’ve shown. There’s no direct correlation, which there was in the latest iteration. This is basically a clean slate, and it kind of looks like we’ll essentially have access to most of what we need. I’d say we should wait and see how it all pans out before panicking… and yes, I realize that some of you are wondering if I’ve been hacked, given my general stance on these things.

Lord Kuru.3685:

So HoT will essentially be NPE for everyone, including 80’s who currently have everything unlocked?

That’s not the impression I’m getting, but I’m not sure I’m clear on what you mean, here.

Guhracie.3419:

and yes, I realize that some of you are wondering if I’ve been hacked, given my general stance on these things.

That’s funny I really did do a double take on your name lol.

I get what you are saying but I see no reason they can’t give my level 80s that have all skill and traits currently unlocked the full skills and every specialization bar filled. Then again if they really don’t want me to come back and really want me to quit posting here for ever, then they can make me have to grind out what already have. That would seal the deal, yall would never hear from me again.

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

Guhracie.3419:

and yes, I realize that some of you are wondering if I’ve been hacked, given my general stance on these things.

That’s funny I really did do a double take on your name lol.

I get what you are saying but I see no reason they can’t give my level 80s that have all skill and traits currently unlocked the full skills and every specialization bar filled. Then again if they really don’t want me to come back and really want me to quit posting here for ever, then they can make me have to grind out what already have. That would seal the deal, yall would never hear from me again.

Because the new system will involve tracks, just like masteries. Each skill group, and each trait line will be their own track. Each track is then unlocked one piece at a time with hero points (read skill points.) For those that already have everything unlocked it probably won’t be difficult to just unlock everything in the new system since you’ll probably get enough hero points allocated to you based on level and completed skill challenges. But for those that haven’t it will be very problematic to unlock things at random. It could very well break their system. So rather than take that chance that some characters end up legitimately broken because they can no longer progress properly, they are not unlocking anything.

Also, there isn’t a one to one correlation between traits in the current system and the new system. Should you unlock traits that never existed before in any form simply because you unlocked four other traits that don’t even exist anymore?

Grandfathering is not a thing that will happen. It just isn’t. If that means you’re taking your ball and going home, then that’s just how it’s going to have to be. Before you leave, can I have your stuff?

Kal Spiro.9745:

Lobo Dela Noche.5127:

Guhracie.3419:

and yes, I realize that some of you are wondering if I’ve been hacked, given my general stance on these things.

That’s funny I really did do a double take on your name lol.

I get what you are saying but I see no reason they can’t give my level 80s that have all skill and traits currently unlocked the full skills and every specialization bar filled. Then again if they really don’t want me to come back and really want me to quit posting here for ever, then they can make me have to grind out what already have. That would seal the deal, yall would never hear from me again.

Because the new system will involve tracks, just like masteries. Each skill group, and each trait line will be their own track. Each track is then unlocked one piece at a time with hero points (read skill points.) For those that already have everything unlocked it probably won’t be difficult to just unlock everything in the new system since you’ll probably get enough hero points allocated to you based on level and completed skill challenges. But for those that haven’t it will be very problematic to unlock things at random. It could very well break their system. So rather than take that chance that some characters end up legitimately broken because they can no longer progress properly, they are not unlocking anything.

Also, there isn’t a one to one correlation between traits in the current system and the new system. Should you unlock traits that never existed before in any form simply because you unlocked four other traits that don’t even exist anymore?

Grandfathering is not a thing that will happen. It just isn’t. If that means you’re taking your ball and going home, then that’s just how it’s going to have to be. Before you leave, can I have your stuff?

I mostly agree with this.

If a character is level 80, then you’ll have enough Hero Points to unlock most of the core stuff (normal 5 trait lines and skills). If you’ve done enough of the skill points on the map, then you’ll have enough points to finish buying everything when this goes live.

If you want to make sure your character is ready for this change, just go around and hit any skill points you’ve missed. Even if you have to skip the occasional one, it sounds like a level 80 will have little problem having enough Hero Points built up when this hits.

From what I’m reading, I kinda like the new system, but I admit I haven’t seen it in action. There’s room for them screwing up, but if it turns out well, it’s a good attempt to fix the trait system…because it’s STILL better than what we got now, gentlemen and ladies.

I don’t mind the new system so far. It seems interesting enough. However, they REALLY need to grandfather all current 80s who have everything unlocked already. It’s just not acceptable for us to lose abilities we already earned and have to grind all over for them. I don’t have world completion on most of my alts so many of them do not have all those random skill point challenges done. The last thing I want is to have to run around on a ton of alts doing silly hero point challenges for unlocking stuff I already earned before.

Kumion.7580:

Guhracie.3419:

…

• When in the leveling process can we start accessing traits?
  …

This was actually answered— and the answer is good! Jon Peters said, “We will have more choices available to players at earlier phases in the game. We’re aiming to unlock specializations around level 20.”

(Source: http://massivelyop.net/2015/04/23/exclusive-guild-wars-2-heart-of-thorns-interview-unwraps-specializations-and-traits/)

I don’t think I ever thanked you for this post! That was well-spotted, and does sound like very good news.

xarallei.4279:

I don’t mind the new system so far. It seems interesting enough. However, they REALLY need to grandfather all current 80s who have everything unlocked already. It’s just not acceptable for us to lose abilities we already earned and have to grind all over for them. I don’t have world completion on most of my alts so many of them do not have all those random skill point challenges done. The last thing I want is to have to run around on a ton of alts doing silly hero point challenges for unlocking stuff I already earned before.

you will be doing it for elite spec anyhow.
they said 60 challenges will get you enough to unlock everything. that means youll probably need like 140-180 to unlock the new spec.

phys.7689:

xarallei.4279:

I don’t mind the new system so far. It seems interesting enough. However, they REALLY need to grandfather all current 80s who have everything unlocked already. It’s just not acceptable for us to lose abilities we already earned and have to grind all over for them. I don’t have world completion on most of my alts so many of them do not have all those random skill point challenges done. The last thing I want is to have to run around on a ton of alts doing silly hero point challenges for unlocking stuff I already earned before.

you will be doing it for elite spec anyhow.
they said 60 challenges will get you enough to unlock everything. that means youll probably need like 140-180 to unlock the new spec.

They need to at least make it so that if you have one character with world completion then all your alts get the hero points needed to unlock all the core things.

phys.7689:

xarallei.4279:

I don’t mind the new system so far. It seems interesting enough. However, they REALLY need to grandfather all current 80s who have everything unlocked already. It’s just not acceptable for us to lose abilities we already earned and have to grind all over for them. I don’t have world completion on most of my alts so many of them do not have all those random skill point challenges done. The last thing I want is to have to run around on a ton of alts doing silly hero point challenges for unlocking stuff I already earned before.

you will be doing it for elite spec anyhow.
they said 60 challenges will get you enough to unlock everything. that means youll probably need like 140-180 to unlock the new spec.

But now we have to do a lot more.

I have 1 character with world completion, all my other characters i did not level through pve. So i have to do 60 extra hero challenges 7 more times, thats 420 extra hero challenges total, just to get back the stuff that was arbitrarily taken away.

And why can i suddenly not control what skills i unlock? I have to go through the list and take whatever the game says i get.

This whole system is just a step backwards, and reminds me very much of what WoW already did a few years ago. Go down a talent tree, every once in a while you get to pick between 3 talents. And skills unlock in arbitrary order, preset by the game. Ow, we get to pick the category we want to progress in? Yah, now it’s completely different…

I don’t give a kitten about “but there were only like, 0-1 viable builds”. Viable changes all the time, and not all the time do people want to play the viable build. Sometimes they want to have fun. In a game? heresy i know. But this new system has far less choice.
Infact that is the running theme with these overhauls. Less choice, more on rails. Before long we’ll just have complete build templates with everything preset.

This is awful for the people who choose to level through WvWvW or PvP.

Map completionists have a much better time under this system, but WvWvW has an extremely limited number of skill challenges available to them, and actually going to do them means that you’re taking up a slot for your world without contributing anything.

PvP might as well just not give tomes of knowledge anymore, because the characters leveled through it will be crippled by the lack of traits.

It seems as though this is even more of a step back. Under system 1 I could still play my release date mesmer and thief. Now it sounds as though I’m restricted to just my world completion mesmer. Wonderful.

Eponet.4829:

This is awful for the people who choose to level through WvWvW or PvP.

Map completionists have a much better time under this system, but WvWvW has an extremely limited number of skill challenges available to them, and actually going to do them means that you’re taking up a slot for your world without contributing anything.

PvP might as well just not give tomes of knowledge anymore, because the characters leveled through it will be crippled by the lack of traits.

It seems as though this is even more of a step back. Under system 1 I could still play my release date mesmer and thief. Now it sounds as though I’m restricted to just my world completion mesmer. Wonderful.

1. There’s no need to go through the unlocking process in PvP. Everything will be unlocked automatically.
2. When you level via tomes, you will still get the overwhelming majority of the hero points you need. Most of the points will be obtained by simply leveling- skill challenges are just supplemental, and really won’t be necessary until Heart of Thorns.
3. There’s no telling how they’re going to tweak the system so that it has better synergy with those game modes.

One thing I learned from WoW: Wait until something is in the game and I can see how it functions before I assume anything about it. Some things I was sure would be game-breaking never made it in. Some things I assumed would be game-breaking had to be balanced. And some things made absolutely no difference at all, or were a distinct improvement.

This system is a work in progress. That’s a good thing. It was awesome to hear them theorycrafting during the livestream. It means we can still give feedback. I know people are discouraged, but let’s prove to them that we can handle getting news about a work in progress. It’s… it’s actually time to put on those constructive feedback caps again. Imma have to go looking for mine…

We have a chance to effect change, here. There’ll be plenty of time for doom and gloom (if the last year is any indication) once the system is in the game. But right now, let’s all try to focus on the positives. I’m not saying you don’t have a right to feel however you feel. I’m just saying that now that they’ve given us the information we’ve been begging for, let’s show them how good feedback actually works.

400 points from 80 levels. 65 skill challenges for full trait and skill unlock.

That means you will have had to do 1/3rd of the skill (hero) challenges in the game if you want to remain full unlocked.

Sorry WvWers.

This system just doesn’t feel alt friendly at all. Which is very surprising considering the direction that HoT has been taking with making things alt friendly (such as the way masteries will work). Anet, PLEASE take alts into consideration when you think about how you want this system to work. I do not want to be running around on every single character doing hero challenges over and over again for skills I already unlocked.

I like how they are making elites and heals skill types. Couple other good things, namely how they combined a number of traits.

Still a bit worried about

1. Only picking three lines.

2. That it may not be account bound, and every character that I level will feel like its sole mission is to run around getting points.

3. Some traits concern me. I love that warriors shield skills were put together, but I wonder if they know that when you reflect, blocking no longer procs things like runes or the even the other part of the same trait (might on block) since you are no longer proccing a block, but a reflect!

Still though, I am much more excited about this and HoT with this reveal! I’m glad they shared.

xarallei.4279:

This system just doesn’t feel alt friendly at all. Which is very surprising considering the direction that HoT has been taking with making things alt friendly (such as the way masteries will work). Anet, PLEASE take alts into consideration when you think about how you want this system to work. I do not want to be running around on every single character doing hero challenges over and over again for skills I already unlocked.

Not sure how it’s not alt friendly. Assuming you’re leveling your alts to 80 (and if you’re not going into higher level zones not sure why you need traits anyway), you’ll get most of the hero points you need just from that. You can fill in what you want by doing skill point challenges, now call hero point challenges.

Are you saying going and getting some skill points is a big deal.

And if you’re only PvPing it’s all unlocked anyway so in theory the only people for whom it wouldn’t be alt friendly are WvWer’s who don’t PvE at all.

xarallei.4279:

This system just doesn’t feel alt friendly at all. Which is very surprising considering the direction that HoT has been taking with making things alt friendly (such as the way masteries will work). Anet, PLEASE take alts into consideration when you think about how you want this system to work. I do not want to be running around on every single character doing hero challenges over and over again for skills I already unlocked.

THIS

I had around 18 characters last time they reset traits. I was seriously not impressed by that as it took forever to set back the traits as I remembered. Now We will get a reset yet again and at 28 characters now I am frankly annoyed at this point. even worse the trait lines will be completely changed so I will have to slowly re-learn everything to “Maybe” get my old build back.

What the hell

Vayne.8563:

xarallei.4279:

This system just doesn’t feel alt friendly at all. Which is very surprising considering the direction that HoT has been taking with making things alt friendly (such as the way masteries will work). Anet, PLEASE take alts into consideration when you think about how you want this system to work. I do not want to be running around on every single character doing hero challenges over and over again for skills I already unlocked.

Not sure how it’s not alt friendly. Assuming you’re leveling your alts to 80 (and if you’re not going into higher level zones not sure why you need traits anyway), you’ll get most of the hero points you need just from that. You can fill in what you want by doing skill point challenges, now call hero point challenges.

Are you saying going and getting some skill points is a big deal.

And if you’re only PvPing it’s all unlocked anyway so in theory the only people for whom it wouldn’t be alt friendly are WvWer’s who don’t PvE at all.

a lot of people didnt level their chrs by map complete.
wvw
scrolls
eotm
crafting

while one skill challenge is easy, 65 is not so much.

Will previous successfully challenged challenges apply to the 65?

Gibson.4036:

400 points from 80 levels. 65 skill challenges for full trait and skill unlock.

That means you will have had to do 1/3rd of the skill (hero) challenges in the game if you want to remain full unlocked.

Sorry WvWers.

Wouldn’t be that hard to pull off, IMO. I say this simply because if you abuse the starter zones and go after their skill challenges, that’s exactly 36 out of the 65 you need, half of them right there. After that, it’s simply of going to the next lowest level zones. Here’s the math, starting with all the starter zones, with their total number in there, followed by the total point number you’ll have afterwards.

Queensdale (7; 7)
Caledon Forest (7; 14)
Metrica Province (8; 22)
Wayfarer Foothills (8; 30)
Plains of Ashford (6; 36)
Diessa Plateau (8; 44)
Snowden Drifts (6; 50)
Kessex Hills (5; 55)
Brisbain Wildlands (8; 63)

From there you only need 2 skill challenges from wherever, and you’re done. That’s if I’m getting the amount you need total correct, that is. It’s not really a hard undertaking, just a bit of normal PvE leveling first. It’s actually the route I take when leveling new characters (in terms of starter, then higher level zones).

Tachenon.5270:

Will previous successfully challenged challenges apply to the 65?

Given that the mastery system will be applying retroactively, I don’t see how they could exclude challenges you’ve already done. If you’ve done all the challenges already, that seems like a pretty major disadvantage, if not, anyway. So I would certainly find it to be mystifying if they didn’t. I do wonder if hero points will be account-wide, given that map complete will leave you with an excess of points.

Also, I could’ve sworn that the 65 points above and beyond leveling would be used in the HoT elite specialization trees, not the base system. I’ll go do some research and update with what I find. It’s 465 for the base system. But they did say that the numbers are not set in stone.

Vayne.8563:

xarallei.4279:

This system just doesn’t feel alt friendly at all. Which is very surprising considering the direction that HoT has been taking with making things alt friendly (such as the way masteries will work). Anet, PLEASE take alts into consideration when you think about how you want this system to work. I do not want to be running around on every single character doing hero challenges over and over again for skills I already unlocked.

Not sure how it’s not alt friendly. Assuming you’re leveling your alts to 80 (and if you’re not going into higher level zones not sure why you need traits anyway), you’ll get most of the hero points you need just from that. You can fill in what you want by doing skill point challenges, now call hero point challenges.

Are you saying going and getting some skill points is a big deal.

And if you’re only PvPing it’s all unlocked anyway so in theory the only people for whom it wouldn’t be alt friendly are WvWer’s who don’t PvE at all.

I have lots of alts, MOST of which I leveled in WvW. Unless you are saying WvW folks don’t matter at all. This IS a problem.

xarallei.4279:

Vayne.8563:

xarallei.4279:

This system just doesn’t feel alt friendly at all. Which is very surprising considering the direction that HoT has been taking with making things alt friendly (such as the way masteries will work). Anet, PLEASE take alts into consideration when you think about how you want this system to work. I do not want to be running around on every single character doing hero challenges over and over again for skills I already unlocked.

Not sure how it’s not alt friendly. Assuming you’re leveling your alts to 80 (and if you’re not going into higher level zones not sure why you need traits anyway), you’ll get most of the hero points you need just from that. You can fill in what you want by doing skill point challenges, now call hero point challenges.

Are you saying going and getting some skill points is a big deal.

And if you’re only PvPing it’s all unlocked anyway so in theory the only people for whom it wouldn’t be alt friendly are WvWer’s who don’t PvE at all.

I have lots of alts, MOST of which I leveled in WvW. Unless you are saying WvW folks don’t matter at all. This IS a problem.

Not necessarily. If you have 400 points right there, you can grab everything you need, then bumrush several maps in PvE, rush straight for the skill points, grab them, and get out. By the way, did they say whether or not skill books and tomes will be useable after the change?

RyuDragnier.9476:

xarallei.4279:

Vayne.8563:

xarallei.4279:

This system just doesn’t feel alt friendly at all. Which is very surprising considering the direction that HoT has been taking with making things alt friendly (such as the way masteries will work). Anet, PLEASE take alts into consideration when you think about how you want this system to work. I do not want to be running around on every single character doing hero challenges over and over again for skills I already unlocked.

Not sure how it’s not alt friendly. Assuming you’re leveling your alts to 80 (and if you’re not going into higher level zones not sure why you need traits anyway), you’ll get most of the hero points you need just from that. You can fill in what you want by doing skill point challenges, now call hero point challenges.

Are you saying going and getting some skill points is a big deal.

And if you’re only PvPing it’s all unlocked anyway so in theory the only people for whom it wouldn’t be alt friendly are WvWer’s who don’t PvE at all.

I have lots of alts, MOST of which I leveled in WvW. Unless you are saying WvW folks don’t matter at all. This IS a problem.

Not necessarily. If you have 400 points right there, you can grab everything you need, then bumrush several maps in PvE, rush straight for the skill points, grab them, and get out. By the way, did they say whether or not skill books and tomes will be useable after the change?

See if this was just one alt, I wouldn’t really care as much. But this is a lot of alts. And I know I’m not the only one with lots of alts. That adds up. Dragging them all around each map for hero challenges is going to be a tedious pain in the kitten .

Plus quite frankly the whole idea of taking away skills and things we’ve already earned in game is very repulsive to me in general. I should not have to re-earn these skills. Period.

Guhracie.3419:

Tachenon.5270:

Will previous successfully challenged challenges apply to the 65?

Given that the mastery system will be applying retroactively, I don’t see how they could exclude challenges you’ve already done. If you’ve done all the challenges already, that seems like a pretty major disadvantage, if not, anyway. So I would certainly find it to be mystifying if they didn’t. I do wonder if hero points will be account-wide, given that map complete will leave you with an excess of points.

Also, I could’ve sworn that the 65 points above and beyond leveling would be used in the HoT elite specialization trees, not the base system. I’ll go do some research and update with what I find. It’s 465 for the base system. But they did say that the numbers are not set in stone.

Hmm. Well, if for some reason the already completed challenges don’t count, and the 12 of my 14 level 80s who haven’t done world completion wind up needing 65 points each to get back to where they were before… that would be 780 hero challenges.