Guild Wars 2

Stop blowing this out of proportions. You’ve had an official response. Enough!

Martin Kerstein.3071:

We just wanted to respond to the image that has been data-mined from the Edge of the Mists testing branch.

This is a testing branch. We conduct internal experiments for various territories on our testing branches. This particular experiment is not being tested for the West.

As always, keep in mind that we test a lot more than we ship, so data-mining is no guarantee of anything. If we have announcements to make about future content, we’ll make them through the usual official channels.

It’s for Chinese market. Ok.

So we will get for free in patches:
- Convenient Banking (2x click on item in inventory and it;s going to stuck with the same item in the bank). I like it.

- Teleport to Friend. Rly god option. (it should be available as guild option to unlock/upgrade for the guild, that guild members would be able to teleport each other – cost influance + mertis)

- Convenient Trading. No Tp just click on the player name and select trade. Nice one

- and much more!: (option to dule, pets fight, and more)

What?

Why would you assume we would get that?

There will be a rather big difference between the Chinese and NA/EU version of the game, including (rumors) a rather massive decrease of WPs around the world, which would make the Teleport to Friend very useful, while for us we can simply WP.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/is-it-fun-colin-johanson-on-how-arenanet-measures-success/

Now let me pose a second question: If the success of a subscription-based MMO is measured by the number of people paying a monthly fee, how does that impact game design decisions?

The answer can be found in the mechanics and choices made in subscription-based MMOs, which keep customers actively playing by chasing something in the game through processes that take as long as possible. In other words, they design content systems that take more time to keep people playing longer. If this is your business motivation and model so you keep getting paid, it makes sense and is an incredibly smart thing to do, and you need to support it.

When your game systems are derived and designed to fill this prime motivation of a subscription-based MMO, you potentially sacrifice quality to get as much content in as possible to fill that time. You get leveling systems that take insane amounts of grind to gain a level, loot drop systems that require doing a dungeon with a tiny chance the item you want can drop at the end, raid systems that need huge numbers of people online simultaneously to organize and play, thousands of wash/repeat item-collection or kill-mob quests or dailies with flavor text support, the best stat gear requiring crazy amounts of time to earn, etc.

https://twitter.com/PersistentWorld/status/418816619825999872

I can’t wait until you guys find out what’s in store this year. People are going to die with excitement/shock

I kid, I kid.
Or do I? :P

Elthurien.8356:

Devata.6589:

Elthurien.8356:

lol @ all the chicken littles in this thread.

I looked at the pictures on reddit and I just thought, “That really doesn’t seem worth it to me”

If this game was buy to play I would expect all content available at launch until the next expansion with the exception of transfers, storage, character slots, boosters, which would be available in the MTX store, then I would buy the next expansion for additional content.

If this game were Free to play, I would expect all base launch content available at launch with everything else to be purchased from the MTX store, including new skins, vanity items, transfers, boosters, character slots, storage etc etc.

If this game were subscription model It would include launch content and all future content available at subscription price, this would mean makeover kits, transmutation crystals, character slots, bag space, bank space, skins the whole darn lot would be available for your subscription price. If an expansion ensued, it would be at the cost of an expansion, not a full game. I would not pay a subscription for anything less personally.

This game seems to be trying to blend the top two models together in an attempt to get more out their business model, and then offer gimmicky VIP’s for additional money. Whoever is running the show is going down a very slippery slope if the OP is legit.

I totally agree on your 3 options.. Well maybe boosters should also not go into a B2P model but I can live with transfers / extra char slots and name changer but that’s really it.

I did go for and had much hope for GW2 thinking it would go the B2P way as you describe it and much like they did mainly in GW1.

Sadly it now indeed looks more like the second (F2P) one with the difference that you do need to buy the game first.

In comparison, I can play Neverwinter for free and still not feel forced into the MTX store as much as I do in GW2. I agree with the Nexon theories tbh

How? Lol. Never winter store has MUCH more pay to win than gw2. I purchased a $40 mount on never winter so I could keep up in PvP. Need that 150% speed bonus

for me, the simple fact they are even only thinking about this vip, is a clue that anet has taken the worst direction possible.
it s for asia only? not so sure about it.

Kevan.8912:

for me, the simple fact they are even only thinking about this vip, is a clue that anet has taken the worst direction possible.
it s for asia only? not so sure about it.

It is common practice in Asia, and have been for YEARS, they even had time-cards for GW1 over there. And I have yet to see anything like that in NA/EU version of GW1.

The are REQUIRED to have something like this in order to have the game on the Asian market. You also have to keep in mind that ArenaNet is not responsible for marketing the game in China.

Martin Kerstein.3071:

We just wanted to respond to the image that has been data-mined from the Edge of the Mists testing branch.

This is a testing branch. We conduct internal experiments for various territories on our testing branches. This particular experiment is not being tested for the West.

As always, keep in mind that we test a lot more than we ship, so data-mining is no guarantee of anything. If we have announcements to make about future content, we’ll make them through the usual official channels.

Thank you very much for the clarification.

Edit: May I suggest closing this thread now? Because the amount of tinfoil that’s wasted on hats here sure isn’t good for the environment.

Martin Kerstein.3071:

We just wanted to respond to the image that has been data-mined from the Edge of the Mists testing branch.

This is a testing branch. We conduct internal experiments for various territories on our testing branches. This particular experiment is not being tested for the West.

As always, keep in mind that we test a lot more than we ship, so data-mining is no guarantee of anything. If we have announcements to make about future content, we’ll make them through the usual official channels.

Thank god..

Don’t feed the trolls, this is probably another april’s fools from Anet.

I don’t mind GW2 having a subscription model.Also I won’t mind those VIP benefits for two reason:

1.They all are mostly fluffs with the only exception being that Ressurection buff.
2.If there is a person who on a regular bases buys gems from the shop then a subscription model will fit him more.Will he pay for gems or a subscription which gives him the same benefits won’t matter.

All of these things essentially are already available via the gem store in the form of account services and consumables, and are simple conveniences.
Anet:‘Hey, we notice you buy gems a lot. Would you like to make this a regular thing? If so, you get extra boosters and minor conveniences.’
This is in no way going to be forced on anyone.As long as new content is still free, I’m OK with people being able to buy a monthly sub for fluff. Lots of F2P games have a monthly sub that gives you extra bullkitten.
I repeat Rez buff is the only power item, the rest is fluff.

Cush.4063:

Elthurien.8356:

Devata.6589:

Elthurien.8356:

lol @ all the chicken littles in this thread.

I looked at the pictures on reddit and I just thought, “That really doesn’t seem worth it to me”

If this game was buy to play I would expect all content available at launch until the next expansion with the exception of transfers, storage, character slots, boosters, which would be available in the MTX store, then I would buy the next expansion for additional content.

If this game were Free to play, I would expect all base launch content available at launch with everything else to be purchased from the MTX store, including new skins, vanity items, transfers, boosters, character slots, storage etc etc.

If this game were subscription model It would include launch content and all future content available at subscription price, this would mean makeover kits, transmutation crystals, character slots, bag space, bank space, skins the whole darn lot would be available for your subscription price. If an expansion ensued, it would be at the cost of an expansion, not a full game. I would not pay a subscription for anything less personally.

This game seems to be trying to blend the top two models together in an attempt to get more out their business model, and then offer gimmicky VIP’s for additional money. Whoever is running the show is going down a very slippery slope if the OP is legit.

I totally agree on your 3 options.. Well maybe boosters should also not go into a B2P model but I can live with transfers / extra char slots and name changer but that’s really it.

I did go for and had much hope for GW2 thinking it would go the B2P way as you describe it and much like they did mainly in GW1.

Sadly it now indeed looks more like the second (F2P) one with the difference that you do need to buy the game first.

In comparison, I can play Neverwinter for free and still not feel forced into the MTX store as much as I do in GW2. I agree with the Nexon theories tbh

How? Lol. Never winter store has MUCH more pay to win than gw2. I purchased a $40 mount on never winter so I could keep up in PvP. Need that 150% speed bonus

..and yet I’ve never spent a cent in Neverwinter since it launched. Then again, I don’t PvP in Neverwinter. I like GW2 WvW better.

In China, the government regulates gaming and requires all MMOs to have sub fees, thats all.

Good luck in China Anet, if the game succeeds, we all win.

Mods should close this thread already.

Outrage was created, you got a response that refuted it all, false outrage continues to ensue for nothing.

Vol.7601:

Mods should close this thread already.

Outrage was created, you got a response that refuted it all, false outrage continues to ensue for nothing.

I’m not for or against any kind of VIP membership, but…

1) The image was in English
2) The “sub”/“fee” models are typically more Western-market models
3) Blizzard said the same thing when their in-game store was mined.

Personally, I think I’d welcome a fee-based (subscription) if it would result in more consistent larger content patches that also worked toward bringing new types of features and systems to the game like raids, mounts, etc.

Zeldain.5710:

Vol.7601:

Mods should close this thread already.

Outrage was created, you got a response that refuted it all, false outrage continues to ensue for nothing.

I’m not for or against any kind of VIP membership, but…

1) The image was in English
2) The “sub”/“fee” models are typically more Western-market models
3) Blizzard said the same thing when their in-game store was mined.

Personally, I think I’d welcome a fee-based (subscription) if it would result in more consistent larger content patches that also worked toward bringing new types of features and systems to the game like raids, mounts, etc.

That’s because the devs speak english! When all the content is ready, it gets localized!

Why is that hard to understand?

Vol.7601:

Zeldain.5710:

Vol.7601:

Mods should close this thread already.

Outrage was created, you got a response that refuted it all, false outrage continues to ensue for nothing.

I’m not for or against any kind of VIP membership, but…

1) The image was in English
2) The “sub”/“fee” models are typically more Western-market models
3) Blizzard said the same thing when their in-game store was mined.

Personally, I think I’d welcome a fee-based (subscription) if it would result in more consistent larger content patches that also worked toward bringing new types of features and systems to the game like raids, mounts, etc.

That’s because the devs speak english! When all the content is ready, it gets localized!

Why is that hard to understand?

It’s not hard to understand. But fear and sense of betrayal are two things which cloud judgement pretty completely, and lead people to conclusions not always within reason.

This is especially common if it’s something they’re passionate about.

Vol.7601:

Zeldain.5710:

Vol.7601:

Mods should close this thread already.

Outrage was created, you got a response that refuted it all, false outrage continues to ensue for nothing.

I’m not for or against any kind of VIP membership, but…

1) The image was in English
2) The “sub”/“fee” models are typically more Western-market models
3) Blizzard said the same thing when their in-game store was mined.

Personally, I think I’d welcome a fee-based (subscription) if it would result in more consistent larger content patches that also worked toward bringing new types of features and systems to the game like raids, mounts, etc.

That’s because the devs speak english! When all the content is ready, it gets localized!

Why is that hard to understand?

Also sub fees are typically more Asian market models. I believe it has something to do with their laws.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Vol.7601:

Zeldain.5710:

Vol.7601:

Mods should close this thread already.

Outrage was created, you got a response that refuted it all, false outrage continues to ensue for nothing.

I’m not for or against any kind of VIP membership, but…

1) The image was in English
2) The “sub”/“fee” models are typically more Western-market models
3) Blizzard said the same thing when their in-game store was mined.

Personally, I think I’d welcome a fee-based (subscription) if it would result in more consistent larger content patches that also worked toward bringing new types of features and systems to the game like raids, mounts, etc.

That’s because the devs speak english! When all the content is ready, it gets localized!

Why is that hard to understand?

It’s not hard to understand. But fear and sense of betrayal are two things which cloud judgement pretty completely, and lead people to conclusions not always within reason.

This is especially common if it’s something they’re passionate about.

So what would these people like Anet to do, since they obviously have concerns even though they have refuted the VIP membership. You want them to pinky promise? Or do you want them to admit that they are going to come through with this in the East?

You have to understand that some Asian localities pay for their internet by the minute. Adding a VIP to allow them to maximize their play time is good business sense in those areas.

I don’t think that the “company” is going to slit their own financial wrists by intoducing such a system in a locality that will not accept it.

I do think they will add some of those items to the gem store. They already have the Pavillion for a fee, so what harm would it do to add the rest of the things in the VIP pack? Besides…the potential is there to make much more from individual sales of items (in the “West”) than a one-time thing.

Think of it this way: Would you rather make 100g from the sale of one thing, or would you rather make 10g with the potential for infinite individual sales?

This is really good .

I will subscribe for sure.

chemiclord.3978:

If Nexon IS somehow pulling the strings with their 15% share in NCSoft (which is a shade of a stretch)… they’ve been keeping pretty well in line with cash shop items being largely cosmetic or of little consequence.

Maybe I’m just immune to the draw, but I can say there has been NOTHING in the Gem Store that I’ve felt forced or coerced into buying… or even look at the store at all.

Once again I for one never said it’s perse the items them-self so much. I also don’t feel so much of a ‘draw’ mainly because I play a game to have fun so I want to get the items buy playing, not by buying them. That not fun.

The problem however is how it effects the game. For example how I can not get items with some real playing (not farming gold), how gold is everything is this game.

What is fun about grinding away to get gold to buy mini’s? Imho it’s way more fun if a mini drops from a dungeon or a boss or a group of mobs so I can go directly for that mini in-game in stead of going for gold to then buy it. And all mini;s should be like that so you can collect all mini’s in such a way.

I almost always take the mini example but same can be said for many thinks. Dyes, crafts and so in.

It’s not so much the items itself it’s how the focus influence the game mechanic in a negative way.

Especially the PvE aspect of this game is extremely effected by game mechanics that have been influenced buy the company wanted to sell items.

chemiclord.3978:

Aedelric.1287:

You get bent out of shape more than I do, hence your many replies.

If I was upset, I’d just leave. This forum isn’t worth rage or anger.

I am genuinely curious why players (and it’s not just in this game, mind you) get so worked up about things that really don’t have to impact them in the slightest. If you don’t like the “VIP Status”… don’t buy it, and your game experience doesn’t change.

I’d understand the anger if it did (like if it took away something you previously had unless you paid in), but I don’t see how this, as its presented would. It’s much ado about what amounts to nothing.

And This ^^

Vol.7601:

That is totally unrelated to the topic at hand.

And from what they’ve said, the whole VIP concept as shown in the data mining is completely unrelated to the market I play the game in.

:)

Ashabhi.1365:

You have to understand that some Asian localities pay for their internet by the minute. Adding a VIP to allow them to maximize their play time is good business sense in those areas.

So, we’ve somehow switched around from a time where the west was sub-based and subscriptions were shunned in the east… to the point where now, the east prefers subs and the west will have none of it?

Call me confused.

Nageth.5648:

Devata.6589:

Nageth.5648:

Devata.6589:

Nageth.5648:

~

~

You didn’t explain anything at all. How does an optional sub mean more money needed from the gem shop but optional expansions doesn’t mean more money needed from gem shop?

And your last statement saying my theoretical isn’t the case here. Prove it. How is that not a possibility. Point to evidence. You can’t, because we have no evidence what is going on. Lets not spread FUD when we have no idea what the specifics are.

Well then I guess I did not understand your question and to be honest I am still not sure if I get it.
What do you mean with an optional expansion?

When you focus on expansions you don’t need to focus on a cash-shop.
Pretty much you don’t need a cash-shop because you focus on expansion.

With an optional sub the focus is usually still on the cash-shop and the optional sub mainly gives you some thinks automatically that are in the cash-shop plus some other little thinks.

So then the question becomes. Why a focus on expansion in stead of a focus on a cash-shop and I did explain that in the link.

About the theoretical option.. No thats not the case.. GW2 does not have the option to buy expansions or a subscription.

Did you play GW1 at all? That is a good example of optional expansions. Several people have replied with explanations of optional expansions and how they split the player base. I think you might need to research a bit more if you are still having problems understanding what an optional expansion is.

And again, explain how focusing on optional expansions means you don’t need to focus on the cash shop. Explain the economics. How will the expansions be able to provide enough funds without the cash shop but a sub will not provide enough funds without the cash shop.

This is all theoretical, of course, because as is now proven, there won’t be a sub for the west. So all the instant doom and gloom is proven false. It still doesn’t make the lack of supporting evidence for the sub vs expansion argument you made acceptable in an argument. My position has always been we did not have enough information and requested more. I still would like that information.

GW1 did have expansions yes but the bit difference was that it where totally different campaigns meaning it where different games.
Obviously when I talk about expansion in an MMO it does not mean an expansion adds a ‘new game’ but that it adds new abilities, new items to drop and usually a new continent. So in that of of ‘splitting up the player-base’ it’s not comparable.

About me not understanding what an optional expansion is. I might not understand your definition of it. Expansions are pretty much always optional. You are not forces to buy an expansion to play on, it’s always something optional that can give you access new items in the game. Anyway, you are referring to the way GW1 did it so thats your definition for a ‘optional expansion’. Well GW2 is an MMO so an expansion would work here not like it did in GW1 where it indeed pretty much meant it was a separate game. In GW2 an expansion would mean it add something to the current game.

“And again, explain how focusing on optional expansions means you don’t need to focus on the cash shop. Explain the economics. How will the expansions be able to provide enough funds without the cash shop but a sub will not provide enough funds without the cash shop.”

I never said a sub will not provide enough funds. I even said focus on expansions would be similar to a focus on subs. I said that an optional sub (Like this VIP thing seems to be) would not bring in enough funds because such a option subs (VIP subs) are always being used in combination with cash-shop and usually they give stuff of the cash-shop automatically. It’s pretty much the same system as the cash-shop only with some automated part. SO I am pretty much saying it’s the same. Have you ever seen an MMO where you can buy a full subscription fee but can also play for free and where there is no real cash-shop or at least it has not a big role? I have never seen it because in those cases not enough people would buy the sub to be able to keep the game running.

“This is all theoretical, of course, because as is now proven, there won’t be a sub for the west. So all the instant doom and gloom is proven false. It still doesn’t make the lack of supporting evidence for the sub vs expansion argument you made acceptable in an argument. My position has always been we did not have enough information and requested more. I still would like that information.“
Once again you are suddenly talking about a sub. I was talking about a optional sub as in a VIP model. The ones you always see in combination with a cash-shop focus. Not a sub like in WoW.

LemnzestManatee.2157:

Devata.6589:

Behellagh.1468:

Judge Banks.9018:

Zlociutki.9165:

NEXON s…t.

Well at least someone knows who actually calls the shots on everything these days.

Honestly I’ll keep posting this image until that ridiculous rumors like that are dead and buried.

What rumors? That Nexon acquired a 15% interest in NCSoft?http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/Meleagar/112012/24237_NCSoft-Sold-Arenanet-and-GW2-Out-For-Nexon-Investment
According to that pretty reliable site thats a fact, not a rumor.

Taken from the article linked:
’The point is that shortly after Nexon and Crystin Cox arrived on the scene at Arenanet, that company threw 7 years of game philosophy (whether you agreed with it or not), trust, and credibility down the drain in order to, apparently, introduce a gear-treadmill monetization scheme that would require people to either endure a massive grindfest to keep up with top gear stats, or pay to keep up by buying gems in the cash shop, converting them to gold, and then buying Ascended gear and infusions off the trading post.

Essentially, the game has become a pay-to-win scheme."

I stopped reading that stupid article after that paragraph. You can’t buy ascended gear and infusions from the trading post. At the time that this article was written (Nov of 2012), you could either not get ascended items at all (I can’t remember when they came out exactly), or, if you could get them, they were from FotM or laurels (again, I can’t remember when they put out the laurel system). Both of these methods require you to actually play the game, not just purchase gems and convert to gold. This is a bullkitten article that was just trying to get views from a sensationalized headline.

Well only the “Essentially, the game has become a pay-to-win scheme” sentence is indeed not so true. Then again. The rest is.

So dismissing the whole article on that one sentence is a little strange.

Like you say yourself, the article was written before much was released meaning they still had to see how everything had to work out. Turn out the pay to win element was indeed not the case as they expected. That does not change the fact that the rest was.

Chrispy.5641:

Vanthian.9267:

Chrispy.5641:

….I still don’t see the problem with a bought VIP status ……

Then you are part of the “new player base” that have driven this game into a failing state that it is in and will continue to be. By failing I mean, not living up to what was sold/hyped (by Anet themselves).

With a bought status comes a bought power.

“But anet said they would never sell items that grant more power to the player than what can be earned!!”

They also said that the game wouldn’t be grindy and focus on looks rather than repetitive actions. The path you walk knows no bounds and will continue to drain pockets rather than aim to provide the best gaming experience possible.

I’ve actually been playing since Gw1 in 2005. And I’ve played other MMO’s with a ‘VIP’ status….

People suddenly getting a VIP status does not affect me in any way, plus, I’m not paying Anet extra money for whatever VIP gets them (which I assume is limited to GEM store discounts and such like that, not any actual combat advantages). It literally doesn’t affect me in any way since all new released content is free when through the Living story, and I will probably have to pay for an expansion, but so? So will the VIP’s! Also, that extra source of money will help Anet to develop bigger and better content in the future.

So I will say it again….

ME!!!!

“….I still don’t see the problem with a bought VIP status ……”

Biggest difference is that while you are a person who obviously does not care about how cash-shop effects a game, many people who did buy GW2 do. Thats why they did buy GW2 and did not just play any F2P game (like you say you did). You also say you support them but with buy gems imo you help to destroy the game. You see how people can have a different look at something. It all depends on what your expectations are from a game. GW2 did draw in certain people with there B2P model and those people do not like this. Do exactly the same in a F2P game and it would not be a problem. It’s something you can expect in such a game.. thats why I do not play them much.

That is the difference.

Cush.4063:

Elthurien.8356:

Devata.6589:

Elthurien.8356:

lol @ all the chicken littles in this thread.

I looked at the pictures on reddit and I just thought, “That really doesn’t seem worth it to me”

If this game was buy to play I would expect all content available at launch until the next expansion with the exception of transfers, storage, character slots, boosters, which would be available in the MTX store, then I would buy the next expansion for additional content.

If this game were Free to play, I would expect all base launch content available at launch with everything else to be purchased from the MTX store, including new skins, vanity items, transfers, boosters, character slots, storage etc etc.

If this game were subscription model It would include launch content and all future content available at subscription price, this would mean makeover kits, transmutation crystals, character slots, bag space, bank space, skins the whole darn lot would be available for your subscription price. If an expansion ensued, it would be at the cost of an expansion, not a full game. I would not pay a subscription for anything less personally.

This game seems to be trying to blend the top two models together in an attempt to get more out their business model, and then offer gimmicky VIP’s for additional money. Whoever is running the show is going down a very slippery slope if the OP is legit.

I totally agree on your 3 options.. Well maybe boosters should also not go into a B2P model but I can live with transfers / extra char slots and name changer but that’s really it.

I did go for and had much hope for GW2 thinking it would go the B2P way as you describe it and much like they did mainly in GW1.

Sadly it now indeed looks more like the second (F2P) one with the difference that you do need to buy the game first.

In comparison, I can play Neverwinter for free and still not feel forced into the MTX store as much as I do in GW2. I agree with the Nexon theories tbh

How? Lol. Never winter store has MUCH more pay to win than gw2. I purchased a $40 mount on never winter so I could keep up in PvP. Need that 150% speed bonus

I never played Neverwinter so I have no idea but I can understand how different aspects of the game gets effected. If your way of getting people to buy items is with a P2W mechanism it will effect the PvP element and if you mainly focus on horizontal progression or skins then it is more likely to effect the PvE element, and of course it’s also possible both gets effected.

In GW2 I think the way it effects WvW is mainly that they had to wait longer for updates but in the game mechanics WvW does not get much effected buy the cash-shop focus.

The PvE element on the other hand gets effected a lot.

Now in Neverwinter it might be just the other way around idk? But that might be the reason why one person feels the game gets effected by it and the other doesn’t.

I usually play all elements of the game (well for PvP only open PvP) so will always be effected in some way.

moiraine.2753:

I don’t mind GW2 having a subscription model.Also I won’t mind those VIP benefits for two reason:

1.They all are mostly fluffs with the only exception being that Ressurection buff.
2.If there is a person who on a regular bases buys gems from the shop then a subscription model will fit him more.Will he pay for gems or a subscription which gives him the same benefits won’t matter.

All of these things essentially are already available via the gem store in the form of account services and consumables, and are simple conveniences.
Anet:‘Hey, we notice you buy gems a lot. Would you like to make this a regular thing? If so, you get extra boosters and minor conveniences.’
This is in no way going to be forced on anyone.As long as new content is still free, I’m OK with people being able to buy a monthly sub for fluff. Lots of F2P games have a monthly sub that gives you extra bullkitten.
I repeat Rez buff is the only power item, the rest is fluff.

1 And the waypoint to a friend.
2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

Cush.4063:

How? Lol. Never winter store has MUCH more pay to win than gw2. I purchased a $40 mount on never winter so I could keep up in PvP. Need that 150% speed bonus

Yeah, I honestly don’t know what that person is smoking. NWN’s cash shop is far worse. I do think Anet has been very in your face with the cash shop. And I do wish they’d back off a bit. That much is true. There is constantly this or that new item being introduced. But none of it feels necessary. NWN on the other hand you feel pressure (like the mount issue you mentioned) because there are things that actually deeply affect you in that cash shop.

Devata.6589:

2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

. . . always negative? Really?

Devata.6589:

moiraine.2753:

I don’t mind GW2 having a subscription model.Also I won’t mind those VIP benefits for two reason:

1.They all are mostly fluffs with the only exception being that Ressurection buff.
2.If there is a person who on a regular bases buys gems from the shop then a subscription model will fit him more.Will he pay for gems or a subscription which gives him the same benefits won’t matter.

All of these things essentially are already available via the gem store in the form of account services and consumables, and are simple conveniences.
Anet:‘Hey, we notice you buy gems a lot. Would you like to make this a regular thing? If so, you get extra boosters and minor conveniences.’
This is in no way going to be forced on anyone.As long as new content is still free, I’m OK with people being able to buy a monthly sub for fluff. Lots of F2P games have a monthly sub that gives you extra bullkitten.
I repeat Rez buff is the only power item, the rest is fluff.

1 And the waypoint to a friend.
2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

Nah i don’t see how can a wp to friend affect by anyway the current game.We already have instantaneous teleporting anyway so i don’t see the big issue about port to a friend.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Devata.6589:

2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

. . . always negative? Really?

Well the focus on cash-shop seems to be always negative yes. Never seen a game where a focus on the cash-shop has no negative effect.

And by buying gems you are supporting that focus.

Devata.6589:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Devata.6589:

2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

. . . always negative? Really?

Well the focus on cash-shop seems to be always negative yes. Never seen a game where it has no negative effect.

And by buying gems you are supporting that focus.

It’s worth pointing this out:

- While there were no Gems in Guild Wars 1, there were things to purchase for a dollar amount. Hence, there was a cash shop. There are those who would say the game did not suffer from this.

- The notable difference is allowing Gems to be converted to or from Gold. This is pretty much the linchpin of all arguments about how Gems are bad, so really maybe it should be addressed how Gold functions in this game rather than how Gems are “ruining it”.

moiraine.2753:

Devata.6589:

moiraine.2753:

I don’t mind GW2 having a subscription model.Also I won’t mind those VIP benefits for two reason:

1.They all are mostly fluffs with the only exception being that Ressurection buff.
2.If there is a person who on a regular bases buys gems from the shop then a subscription model will fit him more.Will he pay for gems or a subscription which gives him the same benefits won’t matter.

All of these things essentially are already available via the gem store in the form of account services and consumables, and are simple conveniences.
Anet:‘Hey, we notice you buy gems a lot. Would you like to make this a regular thing? If so, you get extra boosters and minor conveniences.’
This is in no way going to be forced on anyone.As long as new content is still free, I’m OK with people being able to buy a monthly sub for fluff. Lots of F2P games have a monthly sub that gives you extra bullkitten.
I repeat Rez buff is the only power item, the rest is fluff.

1 And the waypoint to a friend.
2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

Nah i don’t see how can a wp to friend affect by anyway the current game.We already have instantaneous teleporting anyway so i don’t see the big issue about port to a friend.

I mean thats more then fluffs. You say the rest is fluff. I don’t say it’s an ‘issue’ but I do say it’s a huge profit to have that. I have had that option in a game once and since then I miss it. That shows how nice that option is.

You can only instantaneously teleport to waypoints you already have so if a friend is leveling somewhere and you want to go there with your alt to level but don’t have the waypoints yet then it can easily be a 15 min walk. This benefit would take away those 15 min. I think thats pretty huge.

In addition I do expect we will get mounts in the future and likely that means a reduction of waypoints at least on new maps. In that case the advantage even becomes bigger in an area where you do have all waypoints.

Devata.6589:

You can only instantaneously teleport to waypoints you already have so if a friend is leveling somewhere and you want to go there with your alt to level but don’t have the waypoints yet then it can easily be a 15 min walk. This benefit would take away those 15 min. I think thats pretty huge.

If I waypoint to a friend at a new location as you mention, how does this harm your game play in any way, shape or form? Shoot, would you even know I did it?

Devata.6589:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Devata.6589:

2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

. . . always negative? Really?

Well the focus on cash-shop seems to be always negative yes. Never seen a game where a focus on the cash-shop has no negative effect.

And by buying gems you are supporting that focus.

By buying gems you are supporting the game. Anet needs to make a profit to keep the game up.

Most of what’s in the cash shop are vanity items and toys, so you can mark those off from being a negative effect. The rest are boosters and convenience items which can be obtained through playing the game without buying gems.

The gem store is fine, unless you want GW2 to be a subscription game.

The gem store in GW2 isn’t a problem. The lack of new armor sets outside the gem store is the problem.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Devata.6589:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Devata.6589:

2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

. . . always negative? Really?

Well the focus on cash-shop seems to be always negative yes. Never seen a game where it has no negative effect.

And by buying gems you are supporting that focus.

It’s worth pointing this out:

- While there were no Gems in Guild Wars 1, there were things to purchase for a dollar amount. Hence, there was a cash shop. There are those who would say the game did not suffer from this.

- The notable difference is allowing Gems to be converted to or from Gold. This is pretty much the linchpin of all arguments about how Gems are bad, so really maybe it should be addressed how Gold functions in this game rather than how Gems are “ruining it”.

- GW1 focused on the selling expansions (most of it’s life.). So yes GW1 was a game that did not have those negatives but it also did not have a focus on the cash-shop, it had a focus on expansions. Thats why I use GW1 as an example of expansion focus.

- Not completely because mini’s are in the gem-store not in the world. So it would even effect the game without the gold (in the way that most mini’s are not in the open world).

And about the gold. Yes the problem is the way gold works but why do you think it works like that? Why do you think gold is everything in GW2? The reason for that might not be because people are then more likely to buy gems to convert to gold? That exactly one of those game mechanics I am talking about if I say if effects game mechanics and it not only about if an item in the store itself it nice or not. You want people to buy gems, you allow gems to be converted to gold.. How would you then try to increase sales.. maybe, just maybe by making sure gold is very useful in your game and many elements of the game can only be collected with gold not buy farming for the items.
Why do you think everything people find a way to farm an specific item it gets patched out. And I am not talking about exploits so people get extremely big amounts of such an item.. No just the ability to farm it much like you can in many mmo’s.
Because they want you to need to buy the items with gold so gold is worth much and so people are more likely to buy gems.

You say “maybe we should address how gold works”, thats what I do when I talk about how the gems effect the game mechanics. It are not 2 separate things.

Shut up and take my money. I want VIP right now.

VOLKON.1290:

Devata.6589:

You can only instantaneously teleport to waypoints you already have so if a friend is leveling somewhere and you want to go there with your alt to level but don’t have the waypoints yet then it can easily be a 15 min walk. This benefit would take away those 15 min. I think thats pretty huge.

If I waypoint to a friend at a new location as you mention, how does this harm your game play in any way, shape or form? Shoot, would you even know I did it?

I said that it gives a big benefit and so not just being fluff, I never said it did harm me directly in any way. It doesn’t. If they would implement a few new maps that are only allowed for VIP it will also not harm me directly. Does not mean it’s a good idea.

Although we should all take this type of thing as being put in the game with a grain of salt (as in its likely they wont do it), we should still give our constructive criticism on the topic in case anet does start considering it for the west.

So anet, I personally would be disappointed in something like this unless it was obtainable via ingame some how. No I have no idea what is in the gift bag and the “much much more”, but the convenient trading, resurrection buff, and teleport to a friend are three things I am not happy about. If you do decide to do something like this with the same features in the west, I sincerely hope that the base game is in a good position. I know a huge portion of the fans with this game play it because theres no subscription. It is also a major point when players are arguing about other games and playmodels. Installing something like this will reduce this argument and perhaps cause a loss of customers to other games.

Zone.1275:

Devata.6589:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Devata.6589:

2 For that person it would indeed not matter. Problem is that the fact that people buy gems always effects the game in a negative way.

. . . always negative? Really?

Well the focus on cash-shop seems to be always negative yes. Never seen a game where a focus on the cash-shop has no negative effect.

And by buying gems you are supporting that focus.

By buying gems you are supporting the game. Anet needs to make a profit to keep the game up.

Most of what’s in the cash shop are vanity items and toys, so you can mark those off from being a negative effect. The rest are boosters and convenience items which can be obtained through playing the game without buying gems.

The gem store is fine, unless you want GW2 to be a subscription game.

With buying gems you are not supporting the game you are helping to destroy it. And I will not explain why again. Just read here https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/A-focus-on-micro-transactions/first#post3324571 how the cash-shop focus (what you help to create when buying gems) effects the game in a negative way.

And even in this thread I said many times it’s not about specific items! It’s about the focus!

“The gem store is fine, unless you want GW2 to be a subscription game.” Yeah indeed or inless I want GW2 to be a game that generates it money with expansions in stead of with micro-transactions. Like a proper B2P game should do imho. Guess that. Thats indeed what I want.

Xia.3485:

The gem store in GW2 isn’t a problem. The lack of new armor sets outside the gem store is the problem.

Don’t you think the two might be related?

Thats what I am talking about here all the time. How an item in the cash-shop might not be a problem but how the focus on cash-items will still effect the game itself.

But for some people this is a very hard concept to understand.

A pay to win scheme for the Asian continent. Games used to need skill to be won. If throwing cash at a game makes me win I don’t see the fun in it. This pay to win mentality needs to stop for everyone.

Guild Wars 2 is the type of game anyone can jump into even if it is for only 30 minutes at a time. Players just don’t realize they are not racing against anyone and that is why they feel rushed.

Shogun.7401:

This is really good .

I will subscribe for sure.

Luckily anet already refuted it. So it is not going to happen, at least not for the western version of Gw2

What’s hard about it? What’s to even understand? Someone can teleport to a friend in an area they haven’t been to yet… and then they’ve been there and can waypoint with ease. OK, they saved a little time running. How is this a huge benefit? A little time saved by someone means what… they start gathering mats in an area ten minutes faster? Maybe they port to an event that’s happening and really shake things up by having fun. I’m seeing a lot of complaining about a whole lot of not much.

Xia.3485:

The gem store in GW2 isn’t a problem. The lack of new armor sets outside the gem store is the problem.

That’s the same as saying “the gem store is a problem”. Why do you think there’s a lack of new armor oustide the gem store? Why would ANet create a situation where the new armor sets are in the gem store?

• light bulb moment *

Devata.6589:

- GW1 focused on the selling expansions (most of it’s life.). So yes GW1 was a game that did not have those negatives but it also did not have a focus on the cash-shop, it had a focus on expansions. Thats why I use GW1 as an example of expansion focus.

Except it wasn’t sustainable as a business model. Eye of the North was nice, but it was starting to really show cracks in how far they could push GW1 as a whole before things got into less simple territory. They’d pretty much said at the time they started looking at developing GW2 instead of GW1: Utopia because it would let them get away from some underlying issues with GW1.

One of which was cited as the huge complexity in the skill system making it hard to balance anything new getting thrown into the mix.

But for a while there were things like “Buy extra storage tabs” and “we made these neat costumes for our content”, not to mention the “skill unlock pack”. Why the last one isn’t looked at as “Pay To Win” by people decrying Gems right now that way I dunno. I really don’t.

- Not completely because mini’s are in the gem-store not in the world. So it would even effect the game without the gold (in the way that most mini’s are not in the open world).

Not gonna lie here, I don’t like that. Of course, there’s no achievements or monuments for me to show off my minis in like there was before, so I’m a little more forgiving of it. But yeah, if the minis were stuff which dropped in the world off mobs (like Ultima Online had “creature statues” which could drop for house decoration) then would you consider that a good step? Worth posting in one of the CDI threads if it ever comes up.

And about the gold. Yes the problem is the way gold works but why do you think it works like that? Why do you think gold is everything in GW2?

Because gold is something which any player can earn through play and has many more methods of acquisition than Karma, or other currencies. Because it is, completely, the only currency which can be traded and thus can actually form an economy inside the game.

That’s why gold “runs everything”. It’s also very deeply ingrained in RPGs to have the basic necessities bought through gold (or a stand-in for it like “Zenny” or “gil”, or “pokedollars”) rather than through other means. Designers haven’t gotten away from it too far except for a few games I can think of, but MMOs almost always default to some form of coin currency as their basic building block.

The reason for that might not be because people are then more likely to buy gems to convert to gold? That exactly one of those game mechanics I am talking about if I say if effects game mechanics and it not only about if an item in the store itself it nice or not.

Mmm, no, I think the reasons I listed above are adequate. I agree the conversion of RM to Gems to Gold is an issue in so far as people can just plunk down cash to accelerate things. If there were no Gems to Gold conversions, any bets on whether certain high-ticket items in the Trading Post wouldn’t be quite so insanely high in gold cost?

Why do you think everything people find a way to farm an specific item it gets patched out.

Because they’d been doing it in GW1 too? They patched the heck out of the Underworld. It was almost a game to watch, “how are they gonna screw UW runs this next balance patch?” and put bets. I actually won a small pot once over the Shadow Form nerf . . .

And I am not talking about exploits so people get extremely big amounts of such an item.. No just the ability to farm it much like you can in many mmo’s.

They did it in Guild Wars 1, almost constantly.

I’ll start by pointing out there was a farm well known in the Crystal Desert which was lucrative and got beat with the nerf stick pretty fast. Before Factions, in fact.

You say “maybe we should address how gold works”, thats what I do when I talk about how the gems effect the game mechanics. It are not 2 separate things.

It’s part of what’s going on in the CDI, how do we use “skill” as a sort of currency to allow people to earn their stuff rather than time/grind or gold/cash.