Guild Wars 2

I already got my elite finished, and they’re catering to the whiners…yet again. it took me only 4 days….

If some one unlocked 200 HP in central tyria, it would probably take them 10 hours to do so. I think unlocking their elite fast is well deserved.

And the lesson is: tell people a little earlier than three days before launch what you expect them to do for something they paid money for.

250 is a good amount – not everything one can achieve because he or she obviously has absolutely nothing better to do with his time should be treated as something with more value than what it actually has.

arakkune.1429:

well i played for the 400 hero points and i had my fun unlocking the elite spec the challenging way so i really feel like ive done the right thing. If other people want less and they get it i dont see the problem. What’s important is we did it the right way and that in itself is self satisfactory

Didn’t really know there was a “right” way, but if that helps you sleep better at night then by all means. It is an accomplishment whether it is 250 or 400. I applaud you for getting the specialization the “correct” way.

And I disagree that the world is round, but it don’t make it any flatter now does it.

As for the topic, I could not be happier for myself or my 9 alts!!

steve.2945:

I already got my elite finished, and they’re catering to the whiners…yet again. it took me only 4 days….

I also finished two elite specs last 3 days but I am still one of those whiners.
Because I know there are so many people who don’t like spending hours on HP unlock or WvWing. You need to think for the majority instead of being pure selfish.

joric.1042:

arakkune.1429:

well i played for the 400 hero points and i had my fun unlocking the elite spec the challenging way so i really feel like ive done the right thing. If other people want less and they get it i dont see the problem. What’s important is we did it the right way and that in itself is self satisfactory

Didn’t really know there was a “right” way, but if that helps you sleep better at night then by all means. It is an accomplishment whether it is 250 or 400. I applaud you for getting the specialization the “correct” way.

well for one i got the elite spec the way anet intended it to be unlocked and that is by playing all the content so yeah i did it how it was designed to be done and not how whining made them change it ^^

Akath.2650:

I know that many people is excited for that, because they want their Revenant running around as Herald or even a new player/character wants their hands on the elite spec, but for those who completed Central Tyria Hero Points, 250 points means almost full elite specialization unlocked… Which means that for those who explored the Core Guild Wars 2, unlocking the elite specialization will no longer be a challenge or even feel like an accomplishment. Thanks all

It’s more about awarding your previous accomplishment (all those otherwise useless core hero points) by giving you a much larger head start.

It’s still totally about character accomplishment, it’s just much more about choosing how you prioritize that accomplishment now. More elite specs are coming, and the next spec will also serve as your reward for doing all those HoT hero challenges.

This means when specs are released they reward your previous effort, rather than putting you in a place where your previous efforts feel less rewarded. Now in stead of feeling like you have to do a bunch of hero points in HoT, and feeling like a gate for highly accomplished characters, it feels much more like a reward for previous accomplishments, meaning you feel like the remaining hero points you’re putting in to the bank for the next one feel like a journey rather than a race, as you know they’ll pay off well, but that the payoff will be far enough in the future you don’t feel incentivized to rush them. This makes them feel much more natural as things locked behind masteries, which are also much longer term and less rushed progression systems. Now in stead of being mad you have to grind nuoch mastery, you’re happy when you get a nice HP bonus a a result of getting the nuoch mastery because you wanted the line rather than needed it much faster than you actually wanted to level it.

For new characters or those who haven’t accomplished much, they still have a hefty amount of work in front of them to achieve that spec, but they have more options as far as what heriocs they want to undertake to reach it.

Yeah this blows, elite specs had a level of prestige to it, something to work towards, have mastered your character to get.

Now you can complete the old content and basically have it finished. Zzz.

ols.4263:

agree, elite unlock should not be done easily, game experience in the long run will suffer.

This is the new meme around here, and I want to squash it with some reality. You and others feel that, by making this faster/easier, it reduces overall playtime in the long run because you can get your spec sooo fast now. What you and others here fail to understand is that, Anet has already been down this road of making things difficult/time consuming to unlock and they realized (likely through actual data analysis) that prohibitive gating of content REDUCES longevity in this game, not increases it.

By reducing the barriers, especially for alt play, the game actually increases longevity in the long run. Hell, just look at the Mastery system: its account based! This is the reason Anet has ALREADY made changes in this direction over the past few years including: Making WvW Ranks account based, making Fractal personal levels account based and making Ascended gear account bound. Now, the point isn’t that things need to be account based, the point is that the barrier for play on other characters should be low as that is the easiest way to dramatically increase gameplay diversity. Once you understand this, you will understand why Anet has made this change.

So what happens if I spent 240 hero points already and am 1/2 way through the elite. Will I now be almost complete or still only 1/2 way?

Hawken if you think the people complaining about the insane requirement to fully unlock the elite spec are in the minority than you really haven’t been paying attention.

People were indifferent about the insane 400 HP requirements at best, and infuriated about it at worst. I’ve actually not seen a single person who actually truly enjoyed grinding 400 HPs for each and every single character they play. You are in fact the first and only person I’ve seen who states that he likes the grind.

Besides, the biggest problem wasn’t even the fact that we had to grind 400 HP. The biggest problem was the fact that it was impossible to explore HoT with the new elite spec (unless you already had 100% map completion in central Tyria, in that case you can explore 50% of HoT with your new elite spec). Most people who complained about the elite spec implementation complained about that, the fact that they wouldn’t be able to enjoy the new elite spec while exploring HoT.

Exciton.8942:

steve.2945:

I already got my elite finished, and they’re catering to the whiners…yet again. it took me only 4 days….

I also finished two elite specs last 3 days but I am still one of those whiners.
Because I know there are so many people who don’t like spending hours on HP unlock or WvWing. You need to think for the majority instead of being pure selfish.

pure selfish? not really, I was grinding my Masteries, and picking up Hero points on the side, did 5 wvw rank ups on free time, and ran around tyria since alot of people don’t do HP trains, im a college student too, i made schedule on what i wanted to do, and when i could do it. Complaining wasn’t in there.

Ewer.1850:

So what happens if I spent 240 hero points already and am 1/2 way through the elite. Will I now be almost complete or still only 1/2 way?

You should be nigh fully unlocked then according to this so, yay.

For those people who want some prestigious feeling, go PvP or later Raid and fractal leaderboard.

Those are places you can stand out. The elite unlocking is not.

THIS IS OUTRAGEOS

Exciton.8942:

For those people who want some prestigious feeling, go PvP or later Raid and fractal leaderboard.

Those are places you can stand out. The elite unlocking is not.

For now.

Raid’s will most likely get nerfed as well. Just make sure you kids hit up the forums to complain and, on gaming websites to give bad reviews about them when they go live.

SuinegTsol.1729:

I wanted to play revenant with hot, but without hearld it just sucks, so i “farmed” those hero points about 24h to finally play the class like i want and in a way i think its competitve for group content.
400 Points for a class, that “don’t work” without them is rly tough, so i understand the step to make it easy to access.

But you should at least reward those, who did it the hard way. (title/mini/…)

A bit hyperbolic as, while I want to play herald, I’ve had a lot of fun and great success (in PvE mind you) running dwarf/Shiro hammer/sword/axe. Axe 4 is actually alot of fun right after sword 3.

Akath.2650:

but for those who completed Central Tyria Hero Points, 250 points means almost full elite specialization unlocked… Which means that for those who explored the Core Guild Wars 2, unlocking the elite specialization will no longer be a challenge or even feel like an accomplishment. Thanks all

btw you can do your own challenge.
(comparison to gw2 vanilla hardcore e.g the woodenpotatoes rules for hc mode with no dodge and so on)

here ist the rule for HoT:
dont unlock your elite completly until you have earned all hero points
—> challenge accepted

“hardcores” can play the game with their"personally 400 Hp is the only real way anet expected to play" while others enjoy the jungle with new traits and new feeling of playing their alts.

all win.

Laetitia.9576:

They said they wanted to do content for more hardcore players, and now, 5 days after release they already nerf everything worth caring about. WHY :: We hat nothing to do for a year, now we have work for 5 days and you take it away anet ..

They did not nerf everything worth caring about. HoT is still difficult. Your hyperbole is not helping your cause. If you hate the change so much, I recommend you go to Metacritic and write a review and give this game as low a score as possible.

I agree with this change.

I’m watching with interest in the upcoming changes. I’m still waiting to see how everything shakes out, and for some professional reviews, but the level of communication this week, and the speed of the responses to the feedback has been positive, in my opinion. Good on you, ANET. I may end up in the jungle, yet.

how is it a bad decision I can finally think of playing different classes now with their elite specs instead of speady at least 24 hours total per a character which i have 9 more who needed their elite spec 2 of which are 100% map so not much worry for those two.

Akath.2650:

will no longer be a challenge

My 50 characters say’s “wut?” Also, it never felt like an accomplishment to level up and hit 80. These gates always feel like the same thing, that we can finally start playing!

A better solution would have been to have the training unlock utility skills first, then traits. That would have fixed Herald’s issue as well.

captaincrash.6528:

Yeah this blows, elite specs had a level of prestige to it, something to work towards, have mastered your character to get.

Now you can complete the old content and basically have it finished. Zzz.

You are equivocating on the word prestige with desire/demand. No really… elite specs in less than 2 months time will NOT have ANY level of prestige to them. They will just be what they already are, another way to play your class. Prestige in GW2 is not a class mechanic, it is high level sPvP success, Tier 1 WvW, high level fractals, Legendaries and soon to be raiding. Those things will always be prestige in this game, a new playstyle, although desired, is not a badge to wear as prestige… Wielding Eternity is.

well it only changed my “I need 3 hero challenges more” to “crap when this thing hits the grid? I wanna mah elite skill and armor piece NAO!”

arakkune.1429:

joric.1042:

arakkune.1429:

well i played for the 400 hero points and i had my fun unlocking the elite spec the challenging way so i really feel like ive done the right thing. If other people want less and they get it i dont see the problem. What’s important is we did it the right way and that in itself is self satisfactory

Didn’t really know there was a “right” way, but if that helps you sleep better at night then by all means. It is an accomplishment whether it is 250 or 400. I applaud you for getting the specialization the “correct” way.

well for one i got the elite spec the way anet intended it to be unlocked and that is by playing all the content so yeah i did it how it was designed to be done and not how whining made them change it ^^

amen, i was skeptical at first, but it was really fun, to roam around with an aim in mind.

I think you have a different understanding of what the Elite spec is for. It only allows new weapon, healing skill, elite skill and a set of utility skills in addition to its own set of traits, it’s not some super power boost. To do so would unbalance the game. All the specs are on a horizontal plain, not a vertical one. So it would not be odd that the new spec be the same price as the other, or even a little higher. But for it to be 400 HP is insane. I don’t even begin to use specs until I have unlock everything for it. So it’s something I really would not have had an interest in if it was still going to be 400. Why would I go from a well tuned ranged fighter to a melee one with less perks? This change allows someone like me to unlock all of it in one go and gives me the willingness to try it out without lacking all of the customization that comes with it.

BeardRex.6739:

A better solution would have been to have the training unlock utility skills first, then traits. That would have fixed Herald’s issue as well.

It would have been extremely uneven for some specs (like daredevil) that lean way harder on their traits than their utilities.

There’s no way, given the diversity of the specs, to make it fair aside from adjusting the point costs.

I was okay with the 400 point cost (as a daredevil that couldn’t really use my build without getting the GM traits) but I think the 250 is a nice compromise. it awards and requires effort, but is more respectful of previous accomplishments without completely becoming a trivial task on a per character basis.

It’s absolutely still not an instant gratification system. It just rewards existing accomplishments better and shifts future ones in to a “bank” for future rewards so they feel less gated and better paced to do on your own time.

captaincrash.6528:

Yeah this blows, elite specs had a level of prestige to it, something to work towards, have mastered your character to get.

Now you can complete the old content and basically have it finished. Zzz.

Prestige? Yeah right. Grinding and waiting for other players to group up with to steamroll the hero challenge champions is not prestige.

With the elite specs costing 250 HP, you’re still gonna need to do at least 4 hero challenges in HoT to get the elite spec done.

But for many people it’s gonna take a lot more than that. Not everyone has 100% completion on every single character. I dare say most people don’t have 100% map completion on every single character.

Having to do 100% map completion in central Tyria (plus 4 hero challenges in HoT) or having to do 50% map completion in HoT is a perfectly reasonable requirement for the elite specializations.

Being forced to go 100% map completion + 50% HoT completion, or 100% HoT completion on every single character to be able to use the elite specs was just too much.

As has been said multiple times, don’t call it elite. It is not “elite”. Elite is a title given to an alpha class, as in…if you are a reaper you will slaughter every single individual in PvP that isn’t also an elite of some kind without even trying. THAT is elite. This is nothing more than another option, that frankly shouldn’t cost a single HP more than any other spec line.

Hawken son of Z.1367

I actually understand your point but you have to look at this change from bigger perspective.

You were getting that difficulty and challenge by cost of A LOT of other players that dont want to play through harder content which is new HoT maps. These maps are not as casual as others. You cant just rush them with any gear, any stats, any build and get everything just by smashing auto attack key to be more than happy. Hard content should be always separated from normal content. It always should be something that you CAN do but DONT HAVE to. An additional game mode not required mode.

In this situation it was REQUIRED to play through content that some players may actually dont like. This is always bad to force players to play something instead of giving then a chance to play if they want.

Very pleased with this change. 250 HP is a great compromise. People will still need to work hard for them, but they can still enjoy battling the hordes of Mordremoth in a new play style and build.

Hawken son of Z.1367:

I must say.. it felt nice to have something that felt some what difficult and time consuming to work for.. and tbh.. it only took me about 15 hours of game play to reach that goal. (full reaper spec)

I never felt like Anet treated me badly by making the Elite spec fairly difficult and time consuming to get. I was happy to put the time in.. I guess maybe this is one of the differences between my generation of gamers.. and the new generation of gamers who are used to playing games where everything is handed to them.

I guess theres no much else to say or explain. I’m disappointed Anet felt the need to cater to what I felt like where a few people per a thousand who whined about not getting their ELITE spec on day one. I disagree with your decision to change it, and I think you should be a little, not a lot, but a little ashamed of yourselfs for holding these players hands.

Does the concept that you got there before most people, using the old system, mean anything to you? That’s bragging rights right there bro.

I just finished my Daredevil build today, having had 200 HP before drop. I really didn’t mind and it felt legitimately like I accomplished something rather than just got something to play with.

This is a acceptable compromise, though. I only say that because they didn’t explain the thought process, that we weren’t supposed to just be it. We were intended to be developing our new elites alongside Rytlock who doesn’t fully understand how to be a Revenant, let alone a Herald.

By putting it at 250 map completion still isn’t enough to fully unlock it, and for those that don’t want to turn away from working for the build they still have the option. It also means that our Heralds, who had no options have an easier time.

Akath.2650:

I know that many people is excited for that, because they want their Revenant running around as Herald or even a new player/character wants their hands on the elite spec, but for those who completed Central Tyria Hero Points, 250 points means almost full elite specialization unlocked… Which means that for those who explored the Core Guild Wars 2, unlocking the elite specialization will no longer be a challenge or even feel like an accomplishment. Thanks all

Kitten off. Most characters don’t have core map competition. I small percentage of the total player base has it and most of those have it on one character. Truthfully they should have introduced a new type of hero point for HoT and not made a link to the two at all. Made it so you could exchange your unspent GW1 core game hero points for Spirit Shards, but they didn’t. The new 250 price is a fair compromise. It means by the middle of the first HoT map players who invested all that time in map competition can have the full elite spec unlocked. Players who did not will have it by the end of the second map and still get to enjoy about 50% of the game with the Elite Specialization. It’s a fair compromise.

Copestetic.5174:

Tommyknocker.6089:

According to the wiki in base Tyria:

“There are 214 points available if you have the Krait Obelisk Shard in your home instance”

This means you still have to do some of the jungle to unlock your specialization. Sorry but I see no problem with this AT ALL.

My Warrior and Guardian both had over 200 HP’s left prior to HoT ( World Completion ). It’s pathetic that to max out an ELITE specialization I have to do what? 5 Hero Challenges? lol

ArenaNet, you need to stop caving in.

That’s really great for people like you that actually like doing Map completion (Or stomached through it on 2 chars) but for people that don’t like map completion this whole HP things was a waste of time. I have map completion on my main from 3 years ago, not on any my toons that I actually use now, so I’m sorry I wanted reasonable access to new skills without have to run around in circles to get old skill points (Or even better the WvW way which is great, pretty much “Keep doing what you’ve been doing with absolutely no change to anything and after like a month we’ll give you new stuff”)

Runiir.6425:

As has been said multiple times, don’t call it elite. It is not “elite”. Elite is a title given to an alpha class, as in…if you are a reaper you will slaughter every single individual in PvP that isn’t also an elite of some kind without even trying. THAT is elite. This is nothing more than another option, that frankly shouldn’t cost a single HP more than any other spec line.

It’s not elite because it makes you OP. It’s elite because of the level of what it grants you compared to core specs. It’s elite because you would be OP if you could take two of them at the same time.

It’s an “elite specialization” not a “specialization that makes you elite”

I was one of the people who wanted it to change, I like it. Mobs stay hard, masteries stay time consuming, raids will be hard but now I get to do them with my spec the way I wanted it. Also it’s not like they made the remaining hero points easier to get so you still have the challenge of obtaining them.

PopeUrban.2578:

Runiir.6425:

As has been said multiple times, don’t call it elite. It is not “elite”. Elite is a title given to an alpha class, as in…if you are a reaper you will slaughter every single individual in PvP that isn’t also an elite of some kind without even trying. THAT is elite. This is nothing more than another option, that frankly shouldn’t cost a single HP more than any other spec line.

It’s not elite because it makes you OP. It’s elite because of the level of what it grants you compared to core specs. It’s elite because you would be OP if you could take two of them at the same time.

It’s an “elite specialization” not a “specialization that makes you elite”

Again, this doesn’t make any sense since, well… we have no idea what future specializations will look like, nor do we know if, when they do come, we will be able to take the new spec and a spec from HoT. I ask you, what does the new spec grant you compared to the core specs BESIDES just another way to play your class?

I signed in to personally say Thank you Anet. I have quite a few alts that I would like to get specialized in their elite. 400 is huge when you’re trying to do that.

Thank you Anet, I was almost quitting, seriously. Now it is more reasonable.

Sincerely,
WvW and GvG casual player

PopeUrban.2578:

Runiir.6425:

As has been said multiple times, don’t call it elite. It is not “elite”. Elite is a title given to an alpha class, as in…if you are a reaper you will slaughter every single individual in PvP that isn’t also an elite of some kind without even trying. THAT is elite. This is nothing more than another option, that frankly shouldn’t cost a single HP more than any other spec line.

It’s not elite because it makes you OP. It’s elite because of the level of what it grants you compared to core specs. It’s elite because you would be OP if you could take two of them at the same time.

It’s an “elite specialization” not a “specialization that makes you elite”

Now all you need to do is tell all the others this gem. I have been trying all day to tell players that it is not intended to make you a god of the <insert X class here> but it seems many still call it an elite thinking it is so.

I still think another term would have been better though. I just call it your specialization now.

Edit: also what Bhima said.

This is great news, now we can do the rest of the grind actually using the espec and hey it’s optional. If you want to make it more “challenging” you can just ignore it and not unlock the spec till you want.

At the end of the day they had to do something before all the media reviews came out. This could have lead to some low scores and subsequently low sales which is bad for the whole player base.

Sorry about it.

Tommyknocker.6089:

PopeUrban.2578:

Runiir.6425:

As has been said multiple times, don’t call it elite. It is not “elite”. Elite is a title given to an alpha class, as in…if you are a reaper you will slaughter every single individual in PvP that isn’t also an elite of some kind without even trying. THAT is elite. This is nothing more than another option, that frankly shouldn’t cost a single HP more than any other spec line.

It’s not elite because it makes you OP. It’s elite because of the level of what it grants you compared to core specs. It’s elite because you would be OP if you could take two of them at the same time.

It’s an “elite specialization” not a “specialization that makes you elite”

Now all you need to do is tell all the others this gem. I have been trying all day to tell players that it is not intended to make you a god of the <insert X class here> but it seems many still call it an elite thinking it is so.

I still think another term would have been better though. I just call it your specialization now.

“Elite Specialization” is a fancy Marketing term to add a little extra buzz to offering new specs in the expansion. Hey, Marketing works on everyone… it just works even more on some rather than others.

Mind you, I’m more excited for the map population fix. The maps are often too sparsely populated and you end up waiting around a lot for some of the group content like the Creeping Crevasse hero point.

Kaykero.7251:

Yeah, stop “caving in” to people who bought your game twice, put up with your weird decisions from time to time and does not even adress the fact that HoT offers 4 new maps, some elite specs, one new class and a short story, while GW1 got a new continent, two classes, a ton of new skills, new PvP modes and an epic, full-fleshed story for the same price.

The change was nessecary. Deal with it. Maybe ask them to give players who had the elite specs already fully unlocked ( = with no life) a fancy skin that tells other people that they have no life.

Those who play online games in any capacity shouldn’t throw stones… sure you could devote your free time to bettering yourself intellectually or physically, but instead you choose to play an elaborate game of pretend and melt your brain cells. >.>

In an ideal world, I would have preferred 200 HP, but 250 is also reasonably fair :-D thanks for listening to us players Anet :-) now perhaps my characters will be able to unlock their specs!

Also, for all those extra hero points that have no use now, you guys (Anet) could always fill in the slots with more specialisation skins? :-P LOVING the chronomancer shoulder skin. I’m still working on getting it, but I have an outfit already in mind for my elementalist. He’ll be ‘Exalted’ themed (see picture below).

I wish we could have enchanted armor skins with the glowy bits and the long flowy transparent tendrils though – that would just be amazing. Though I think because it would be animated it would have to be legendary armor skins. I know I’d work for it.

I totally agree. THEY SHOULD LEAVE IT AS IT IS. just because a few people kick up a stink they change it? what about all the people that were just happily playing the game. grow some balls Aent. You’ll lose my respect doing this change.