Guild Wars 2

I’m sorry how exactly was this soooo hard to achieve prior. Most people did it on several characters. Masteries unlock across your account. Imagine if it wasn’t haha you guys would be raging even harder. Anyway when you bad decision guys sit on top of the fractal leader boards then I’ll maybe care what you say. Enjoy the slightly quicker elite unlock nerds.

Laraley.7695:

morrolan.9608:

Copestetic.5174:

Tommyknocker.6089:

According to the wiki in base Tyria:

“There are 214 points available if you have the Krait Obelisk Shard in your home instance”

This means you still have to do some of the jungle to unlock your specialization. Sorry but I see no problem with this AT ALL.

My Warrior and Guardian both had over 200 HP’s left prior to HoT ( World Completion ). It’s pathetic that to max out an ELITE specialization I have to do what? 5 Hero Challenges? lol

ArenaNet, you need to stop caving in.

No they don’t they need to remember that the vast majority of players are casual. 1%ers are called that for a reason.

Its not pathetic that you only have to do 5 hero challenges in HOT on toons that you’ve got world completion because you’ve done a lot of work to get that far and this is where you get rewarded for it. What about revenants though and other alts without world completion?

There were people able to get Herald at the time when it cost 400. How you ask? They didn’t whine on forums, they just went and got it.

And there were people playing revenants who made complaints, so what.

morrolan.9608:

Laraley.7695:

morrolan.9608:

Copestetic.5174:

Tommyknocker.6089:

According to the wiki in base Tyria:

“There are 214 points available if you have the Krait Obelisk Shard in your home instance”

This means you still have to do some of the jungle to unlock your specialization. Sorry but I see no problem with this AT ALL.

My Warrior and Guardian both had over 200 HP’s left prior to HoT ( World Completion ). It’s pathetic that to max out an ELITE specialization I have to do what? 5 Hero Challenges? lol

ArenaNet, you need to stop caving in.

No they don’t they need to remember that the vast majority of players are casual. 1%ers are called that for a reason.

Its not pathetic that you only have to do 5 hero challenges in HOT on toons that you’ve got world completion because you’ve done a lot of work to get that far and this is where you get rewarded for it. What about revenants though and other alts without world completion?

There were people able to get Herald at the time when it cost 400. How you ask? They didn’t whine on forums, they just went and got it.

And there were people playing revenants who made complaints, so what.

You know what’s funny? That half of the people who were complaining didn’t even try to get one Hero point. If people spent their time actually getting those instead of whining, they would have got it, too.

Ravion Hawk.4736:

Chrispy.5641:

There is nothing difficult or challenging about time consuming content. All it requires is your patience with repeating the same content over and over until you get something. I know being patient is difficult for some of you, and that somehow makes it challenging content, but for the vast majority of us, here is a message :::

Get a life

Umm…

We do have lives, that is why it got lowered so we can enjoy the game in our down time.

You might want to check and see if your life is missing something if you can sit and grind on a game for hours on end. Eventually your parents will kick the bucket and if they know you just play games all day, they are not leaving you the house. It will be the last life lesson they can teach you, Getting a life.

Wow, did this go over your head. Like, several miles over your head. This post was more directed towards people who said that getting 400 points was somehow challenging and should stay that way, you know, like what OP’s post says and 90% of those complaining about the change :::

I know that many people is excited for that, because they want their Revenant running around as Herald or even a new player/character wants their hands on the elite spec, but for those who completed Central Tyria Hero Points, 250 points means almost full elite specialization unlocked… Which means that for those who explored the Core Guild Wars 2, unlocking the elite specialization will no longer be a challenge or even feel like an accomplishment. Thanks all

But hey, you managed to get a zinger off….I think. Mostly you succeeded in proving your inability to contribute to this conversation, so…there’s that.

I love to play Edge of the Mists and in general WvW, as such, my map completion and along with it, hero points, tend not to be super high. I understand some people want a super large hero point map completion grind, but I don’t think it’s right to say all the WvW players have to spend endless hours grinding hero points in strict PvE when they like the more PvP aspects of the game. I like the decision by them to do this because even though I’ll have to go and grind out some hero points, in won’t be to the point of, “I will not be bothering with the new spec because I’d rather do WvW”.

benjinx.1957:

I’m sorry how exactly was this soooo hard to achieve prior. Most people did it on several characters. Masteries unlock across your account. Imagine if it wasn’t haha you guys would be raging even harder. Anyway when you bad decision guys sit on top of the fractal leader boards then I’ll maybe care what you say. Enjoy the slightly quicker elite unlock nerds.

You are absolutely right. It was not hard.

It was just mind numbingly boring, and completely against every single premise which guided the development of GW2.

There is a thread that has over 3k replies saying that 400 HP was a very bad decision. 250 is a very reasonable compromise. You have plenty more progression in the game to keep you busy. No need to lock new desperately needed specs behind needless unlock requirements.

You were having a lot of fun doing Hero Challenges, getting satisfaction from finding them and completing them. How is that gone? Could it be that the activity itself was not fun, just the reward?

Once upon a time, ANet posited a game where people would do stuff because the process of doing stuff would be fun in and of itself. Since you seem not to find the Hero Point exploring fun in and of itself, perhaps you could find some empathy for others who also didn’t like the process.

I would like to thank Arenanet for lowering it to 250. My faith in this game is back and I’m loving the grind for the rest of the stuff. Applause!!!!!!!!

If your only problem is with leftover points then you should be asking for a system to let you convert unused points instead of shafting everyone else.

The best solution would have been to have all leftover points before every expansion converted into spirit shards, so everyone starts at 0 and has to actually play the expansion to get points while no one has a huge advantage on everyone else. Some people literally had 200 hero points to other peoples’ 0 hero points and these people were all over the forums white knighting about how the elite specs weren’t hard to get…for them.

When I consider alts, I’m very glad for the change. I’d also like to have the spec sooner for playing with in the jungle. Besides, they’re not going to put it back the way it was.

As a pvper whose forcing myself to glide off cliffs and die from gliding latency to get my tempest shoulder skin, I polietely disagree.. some people don’t have the time to grind for masteries to get mastery gated hero points, nor the pve skills to solo champions.

I understand there are 40 hero challenges in the jungle, worth 400 points total, correct? So you could take your character into the jungle and earn the elite with all-new content instead of running around Central Tyria.

So with this change there are now 150 extra hero points in the jungle. Meaning that there will be a surplus of 364 hero points when the next elite specializations are added, instead of 214 as there were when HoT launched.

I recommend reducing jungle challenges to 6.25 hero points (call it 6), for 240 hero points total. Getting 10 hero points in Central Tyria shouldn’t be to onerous, especially with the addition of WvW heroics (that’s what, 10 of those things?). With that change, we’re down to a surplus of 204 hero points, which I think is probably a good number.

The next elite spec comes with content that adds 240 more hero points, so the surplus goes down to 194.

Of course, this can’t happen. You’ll revoke earned points for characters that have already spent them on the specialization. People will have to retrain their elite and end up with less than they had before (never mind that if they, like myself, had anywhere near half the thing before, this last change essentially gave it to them).

What’s going to happen instead is that there won’t be any hero points in any content that brings new elite specializations until the surplus is down to a reasonable number. Alternatively, the next ones could be 400 points too, with 240 points in the new content (to maintain that 200 point surplus); but given that Arenanet can’t last even a week in the face of excess saltiness, I can’t say they’ll find it in them to hold to that.

250 points to unlock the final grandmaster trait and have all of the utility skills. 400 points to unlock the skin and other cosmetics aspects of the elite specs.

That way, those who want to play with their elite spec quickly can do so, and those of us who like having something to work towards long term and have something to accomplish can have that too.

I understand the need to make the specs easier to obtain, but surely there can still be long-term character-based (as opposed to account-wide) progression for those of us who like that.

Well, personally, that’s what I would have wanted. But I don’t have a problem with it atm.

I quite liked feeling like I was working for something again. But now I’ll log in when I get home from work and will have gotten everything that I was working for with no real effort on my part. I feel like I was robbed of a sense of accomplishment – like I said in my OP, I understand letting people have their elite specs fully traited out sooner, but I still want to feel like I’m progressing. Like I have a tangible goal that will be rewarded. I have no problem with that goal and reward being cosmetic, but a significant part of the fun of the expansion has just been taken away from me and I don’t see it keeping my interest long-term any more.

Thanks for fixing this so fast, my enjoyment of HoT just went up significantly.

This is a good change and i’m glad to see it. I know i’ve chewed y’all out in the past (and will continue to do so) over crashes, bugs, and broken things, but y’all deserve a pat on the back for listening to the community. Thank you.

(Now seriously fix the kitten CTDs)

Casual game is casual.

why would they nerf it…? thats a horrible decision

Thank you. This is really a good decision! Now I can enjoy the xpac on 100%

Tommyknocker.6089:

According to the wiki in base Tyria:

“There are 214 points available if you have the Krait Obelisk Shard in your home instance”

This means you still have to do some of the jungle to unlock your specialization. Sorry but I see no problem with this AT ALL.

You would only have to do a wopping 4 challenges. That"s not progression, that’s practically being rewarded for walking into the map.

Soon.5240:

benjinx.1957:

I’m sorry how exactly was this soooo hard to achieve prior. Most people did it on several characters. Masteries unlock across your account. Imagine if it wasn’t haha you guys would be raging even harder. Anyway when you bad decision guys sit on top of the fractal leader boards then I’ll maybe care what you say. Enjoy the slightly quicker elite unlock nerds.

You are absolutely right. It was not hard.

It was just mind numbingly boring, and completely against every single premise which guided the development of GW2.

How was it boring?

AWACS.6537:

Behellagh.1468:

Define casual. I’m “casual” and 400 didn’t bother me. Probably because I play PvE and map complete every character so I needed only 190 to unlock the Elite fully. Hard core WvW and PvPers who can’t be bothered to play the core PvE game as well as Alt speed levelers, they are the ones who are screaming bloody murder. OMG they have to go and rub shoulders with PvEers and do … content.

Eeewww! Wash it off, wash it off.

So are you a hardcore casual PvE player?

No, I’m just a completionist where it comes to map rewards. And I measure casualness by hours played. I don’t play 6-8 hours a night. I’m lucky if I can play two. Sure I’m not a weekend only player or someone who can only get 1/2 an hour in at a time, but I’m casual.

Zabrios.6079:

No.

/15charsblabla

Thanks for your waste of space post. Don’t bother next time.

IndigoSundown.5419:

You were having a lot of fun doing Hero Challenges, getting satisfaction from finding them and completing them. How is that gone? Could it be that the activity itself was not fun, just the reward?

Yeah, they should just remove all rewards from everything, because rewards aren’t satisfying at all. Rewards/achievements aren’t satisfying at all. We should just start with everything unlocked. Would not ruin the game at all… I said the satisfaction of seeking them out was gone, not that the game-play wasn’t fun.

Celtic Lady.3729:

When I consider alts, I’m very glad for the change. I’d also like to have the spec sooner for playing with in the jungle. Besides, they’re not going to put it back the way it was.

There are better ways to cater to people with alts than to make everything faceroll easy and effortless. E.G. It’s easier for people who have played the game for a while to level alts due to Tomes of Knowledge, etc.

nearlight.3064:

As a pvper whose forcing myself to glide off cliffs and die from gliding latency to get my tempest shoulder skin, I polietely disagree.. some people don’t have the time to grind for masteries to get mastery gated hero points, nor the pve skills to solo champions.

I don’t have time to PvP, I should just get all PvP exclusive skins handed to me.

I already lvl’d my character and don’t care to spend the same amout of time to get one new trait line. I promise you it’s not the end of the world. In fact all those same hero points are still there for you to grind your heart out. Why inflict yourself on everyone else who’s sick of their old specs and ready for something new? Just let people do their thing and you do yours. The “compromise” in no way affects your ability to spend countless hours in game.

What about everyone who struggled to get 400 points?? What about progression?? what about challenge? What about expansion?? HEART OF THORNS IS RUINED.

Stop nerfing HoT and start making this expansion harder if anything.

Gilburt.9146:

Zabrios.6079:

No.

/15charsblabla

Thanks for your waste of space post. Don’t bother next time.

IndigoSundown.5419:

You were having a lot of fun doing Hero Challenges, getting satisfaction from finding them and completing them. How is that gone? Could it be that the activity itself was not fun, just the reward?

Yeah, they should just remove all rewards from everything, because rewards aren’t satisfying at all. Rewards/achievements aren’t satisfying at all. We should just start with everything unlocked. Would not ruin the game at all… I said the satisfaction of seeking them out was gone, not that the game-play wasn’t fun.

Celtic Lady.3729:

When I consider alts, I’m very glad for the change. I’d also like to have the spec sooner for playing with in the jungle. Besides, they’re not going to put it back the way it was.

There are better ways to cater to people with alts than to make everything faceroll easy and effortless. E.G. It’s easier for people who have played the game for a while to level alts due to Tomes of Knowledge, etc.

nearlight.3064:

As a pvper whose forcing myself to glide off cliffs and die from gliding latency to get my tempest shoulder skin, I polietely disagree.. some people don’t have the time to grind for masteries to get mastery gated hero points, nor the pve skills to solo champions.

I don’t have time to PvP, I should just get all PvP exclusive skins handed to me.

Skins dont affect how your character feels or plays, specs do.

Gilburt.9146:

I don’t have time to PvP, I should just get all PvP exclusive skins handed to me.

There’s nothing wrong with gating aesthetics behind accomplishments, but there’s a problem when core mechanics of the game which I paid for are gated behind a grind that I didn’t pay for.

Like it’s been repeated ad infinitum, the way the beta weekends were structured made the specializations out like they were going to be accessible immediately, which is what appealed to a lot of payers who were then reassured to pay for the content.

There was a lot of miscommunication up on that front and that rightfully upset a lot of players when the game they paid for didn’t meet their expectations. This is what the main issue is, and Anet directly addressed that in their update announcement. It has nothing to do with whiners or getting rewards handed out for free.

In any case, I fail to see how it affects you whether or not specializations are easily accessible. It has no impact on your game play apart from some misplaced sense of elitism. A large number of players derive no sense of satisfaction from searching for and completing hero points and are more happy exploring said hero points with the new specializations.

If you feel cheated out of the effort you put into getting the 400 HP, it sounds like a better solution would be to get Anet to make a new achievement for it, rather than asking for a revert and screwing over a large number of players.

Tommyknocker.6089:

Tommyknocker.6089:

Can we just stop calling them "elite specs " FKS (for kittens sake)!

They are alternate play style, they are no more elite than any other extra trait line with a new weapon. Continuing to refer to them as elite is a misnomer and propagating the fact is just getting asinine at this point. Unlocking them should be an accomplishment yes, but no more so than unlocking your other trait lines/weapons/utilities IMO.

Had to quote myself here.. if you want to call them elites so be it, but honestly they are just an alternate way to play the class otherwise you get power creep and PvP becomes VERY unbalanced.

Thank you sane person for the sound comment.

Zoid.2568:

What about everyone who struggled to get 400 points?? What about progression?? what about challenge? What about expansion?? HEART OF THORNS IS RUINED.

Stop nerfing HoT and start making this expansion harder if anything.

I thought time was it’s own reward for grinder’s? I thought the challenge of 20-40 hrs made the game? There was no problem telling everyone that didn’t agree with that position that they were whiners, cry babies, and casuals; before the compromise. Now what are we to say when you take your doomsday complaint here now afterwards?

steve.2945:

I already got my elite finished, and they’re catering to the whiners…yet again. it took me only 4 days….

Most players..are hard working individuals with family that maybe can spare yes or not couple hours every 4 days, the game is for casuals not for hardcore gamers college kids with loads of time at their hands

Give us something to do with excess HP. Maybe give some sort of passive utility buff for every point of HP you have after elite is maxed. Idk but that would probably make most people happier rather than having people who wasted time getting 400 extra HP that will have no use for years.

I’m not sure where this supposed hardcore presence came from, when has this game even been touted as hardcore. Yes it has challenging elements to it you may partake in if you wish, however none of those are a requirement to complete any main story or living story aspect of the game Infact you don’t even have to do those if you don’t want to.

I totally get why people are upset over the 400 HP needed for the Elite spec and placing weird barriers around them but those barriers you needed to get anyway to complete the story so does it really matter that it’s now 250 you still have to do the masteries regardless which is more grindy then killing a few champions most of which are easy as hell and people are asking for them all day and night that I’ve noticed.

The people that are whinging about it being reduced and somehow feeling like they are super important because they did it when it was “harder” you are the problem with the game. Yah you did 15 more HP’s then others… whoopdie dooooooo.

Mallis.4295:

Give us something to do with excess HP. Maybe give some sort of passive utility buff for every point of HP you have after elite is maxed. Idk but that would probably make most people happier rather than having people who wasted time getting 400 extra HP that will have no use for years.

Why not keep them, so there is less QQ about having to “grind” them for the next specialisation?

Heimskarl Ashfiend.9582:

Mallis.4295:

Give us something to do with excess HP. Maybe give some sort of passive utility buff for every point of HP you have after elite is maxed. Idk but that would probably make most people happier rather than having people who wasted time getting 400 extra HP that will have no use for years.

Why not keep them, so there is less QQ about having to “grind” them for the next specialisation?

I’m not saying something to permanently spend them on. Just something to do with them for the next 2 years or however long until another elite spec so they aren’t a completely useless waste of time.

benjinx.1957:

I’m not sure where this supposed hardcore presence came from, when has this game even been touted as hardcore. Yes it has challenging elements to it you may partake in if you wish, however none of those are a requirement to complete any main story or living story aspect of the game Infact you don’t even have to do those if you don’t want to.

I totally get why people are upset over the 400 HP needed for the Elite spec and placing weird barriers around them but those barriers you needed to get anyway to complete the story so does it really matter that it’s now 250 you still have to do the masteries regardless which is more grindy then killing a few champions most of which are easy as hell and people are asking for them all day and night that I’ve noticed.

The people that are whinging about it being reduced and somehow feeling like they are super important because they did it when it was “harder” you are the problem with the game. Yah you did 15 more HP’s then others… whoopdie dooooooo.

Have you ever played a game before. Ever played Zelda, ever played any of those old RPGs or even new ones? It’s supposed to be challenging. There is supposed to be progression. If you jsut get what you want as fast as you can then there is little or no progression. Do you want a game without progression, do you want everything handed to you like a spoiled kid?

No.

I’m really disappointed by this decision. I didn’t want just have elite spec, i want to achieve it. It must be more challenging. 250 HP is worst decision.

I’m really disappointed by this decision. I didn’t want just have elite spec, i want to achieve it. It must be more challenging. 250 HP is worst decision.

Yes! It’s too easy.

I am also disappointed by this decision. If they give in to the pressure people will once again finish everything extremely quick then complain there is no content and leave the game.

It’s going to take some time for people to transition from the “icebow 4 kill all” mindset into this proper content, but ArenaNet has to wait it out… otherwise this game has no future.

Zoid.2568:

benjinx.1957:

I’m not sure where this supposed hardcore presence came from, when has this game even been touted as hardcore. Yes it has challenging elements to it you may partake in if you wish, however none of those are a requirement to complete any main story or living story aspect of the game Infact you don’t even have to do those if you don’t want to.

I totally get why people are upset over the 400 HP needed for the Elite spec and placing weird barriers around them but those barriers you needed to get anyway to complete the story so does it really matter that it’s now 250 you still have to do the masteries regardless which is more grindy then killing a few champions most of which are easy as hell and people are asking for them all day and night that I’ve noticed.

The people that are whinging about it being reduced and somehow feeling like they are super important because they did it when it was “harder” you are the problem with the game. Yah you did 15 more HP’s then others… whoopdie dooooooo.

Have you ever played a game before. Ever played Zelda, ever played any of those old RPGs or even new ones? It’s supposed to be challenging. There is supposed to be progression. If you jsut get what you want as fast as you can then there is little or no progression. Do you want a game without progression, do you want everything handed to you like a spoiled kid?

I don’t know, maybe we don’t want our progression to be about the character, but about player skill.

When I played NG+ onward in Dark Souls, I never leveled past 120, and my equipment remained exactly the same, yet I felt like I was progressing as I made less and less mistakes and got past each challenge.

Stat progression isn’t the only way to do progression, it just caters to the people who would rather grind than engage their minds and learn.

There’s nothing satisfying in grinding through content that can be easily trivialised if enough other people happen to waunder by.

It’s far more satisfying to be given the full set of mechanics to play with and learn to use as quickly as they can comprehend, then give them challenges that warrent using the full scope and require an understanding of those mechanics in order to overcome. The progression comes as you try and try again and begin to fully comprehend the entire scope of them, which ones are most useful in which circumstances, and more importantly, why that is.

It’s kind of disappointing that the typical person pushing the idea of progression focuses so much on the “Play longer, automatically get tangible bonuses over others who didn’t”. What happened to the communities who push for parity such that mechanical skill and proper preparation (i.e. picking the right set of skills based on your own knowledge and understanding of the situation and the character, not going out and doing chores in order to access them) are the important factors, not purely the amount of time you’re willing to sink into it.

So much Elite now. it feels like a piece of cake and no elite-specialisation.
at least 350 or 325 would’ve been okey, but 250? thats lame.

Zoid.2568:

benjinx.1957:

I’m not sure where this supposed hardcore presence came from, when has this game even been touted as hardcore. Yes it has challenging elements to it you may partake in if you wish, however none of those are a requirement to complete any main story or living story aspect of the game Infact you don’t even have to do those if you don’t want to.

I totally get why people are upset over the 400 HP needed for the Elite spec and placing weird barriers around them but those barriers you needed to get anyway to complete the story so does it really matter that it’s now 250 you still have to do the masteries regardless which is more grindy then killing a few champions most of which are easy as hell and people are asking for them all day and night that I’ve noticed.

The people that are whinging about it being reduced and somehow feeling like they are super important because they did it when it was “harder” you are the problem with the game. Yah you did 15 more HP’s then others… whoopdie dooooooo.

Have you ever played a game before. Ever played Zelda, ever played any of those old RPGs or even new ones? It’s supposed to be challenging. There is supposed to be progression. If you jsut get what you want as fast as you can then there is little or no progression. Do you want a game without progression, do you want everything handed to you like a spoiled kid?

Spoiled Kid gets thrown around a lot these days, you were one of those once I’m sure.

I personally don’t care either way I’m just sick of the elitism crap that this game is infested with far far more then any other game I’ve ever played.

And if you had of actually correctly read what I was saying I was agreeing on both fronts, the challenge is good but it was already there with the masteries not that they were challenging personally and if you seriously think that those extra 15 HP you did were challenging then you clearly haven’t played any challenging game ever. I said I understood why people didn’t like the 400HP It’s way more then was ever needed to unlock a trait tier. I don’t agree that getting the 400HP was hard at all it was easy as but it is what it is.

But what I don’t agree with is when people say things like “I did it the correct way.” No no you didn’t you did it the way it was before the change thats all.

The change from 400 hero points to 250 is something that I, with 14 lv80 characters am welcoming. 400 was just crazy. I can actually unlock elite traits for all my alts and not be bored to tears.

Gilburt.9146:

250 Hero Points is way too easy.

Unlocking the elite specialization is not supposed to be hard. You should be able to play the new content (or any content you wish for that matter) with your elite spcialization, not with just fragments of an unfinished traitline. The elite specialization is not the end-goal of the game, it’s what you use to play the game. Someone made an excellent comparison about restaurants in the other thread but I can’t find it now, the basic principle is that you shouldn’t have to unlock a spoon to eat a bowl of soup.

I am sorry that other people not being forced to play a certain way diminishes your sense of accomplishment but for me these news are a massive relief.

Thank you Anet. The grind for Hero Points was no fun for me. 250 HP is a good compromise.

Edit: I am not a casual player and I know many WvWers who didn’t like grinding 400 HP aswell.

put it to 214HP

This one change made my night so much easier to do what I need to do in order to make this fun again. Thank you Anet.