Guild Wars 2

As far as i know,with expansion release in mmo,you get : New content,new dungeons,new raids,new items,new awesome looking zones.

In expansion HoT we got : Mastery system,which you need in order to complete 4 new zones.4 new zones,looking like SW and Brisband Wildlands mixed together.(Nothing new about them)And new specialization.Ok,that coust us 50 euros (or even 100)

No one said raids,new items and rest of the kitten,is going to be late for month after HoT release.

People are stupid and naive,if they thing they actually paid for all arena net said HoT is going to have.We paid for new specialization,mastery system and 4 new zones.

Rest of the things,they add in future is only patch,nothing else,and ArenaNet employers can say,your money bought you,this,and thins,and this,and every single update until next expansion,but that’s not true,we bought 4 maps,and 30 events,nothing else.

Please look at wow expansions.(comparing wow because that’s only mmo i played besides GW2) They get 7-8 new zones every expansion,2-3 raids,5 dungeons,tons of new armors,and all that at same time,with expansion release.

Werdx.2059:

As far as i know,with expansion release in mmo,you get : New content,new dungeons,new raids,new items,new awesome looking zones.

In expansion HoT we got : Mastery system,which you need in order to complete 4 new zones.4 new zones,looking like SW and Brisband Wildlands mixed together.(Nothing new about them)And new specialization.Ok,that coust us 50 euros (or even 100)

No one said raids,new items and rest of the kitten,is going to be late for month after HoT release.

People are stupid and naive,if they thing they actually paid for all arena net said HoT is going to have.We paid for new specialization,mastery system and 4 new zones.

Rest of the things,they add in future is only patch,nothing else,and ArenaNet employers can say,your money bought you,this,and thins,and this,and every single update until next expansion,but that’s not true,we bought 4 maps,and 30 events,nothing else.

Please look at wow expansions.(comparing wow because that’s only mmo i played besides GW2) They get 7-8 new zones every expansion,2-3 raids,5 dungeons,tons of new armors,and all that at same time,with expansion release.

please don´t call me stupid and naive. please go play wow.

Werdx.2059:

No one said raids,new items and rest of the kitten,is going to be late for month after HoT release.

I didn’t start playing GW2 again until after the HoT release and even I knew that the Raid part of HoT was coming after a month or so.

Werdx.2059:

Please look at wow expansions.(comparing wow because that’s only mmo i played besides GW2) They get 7-8 new zones every expansion,2-3 raids,5 dungeons,tons of new armors,and all that at same time,with expansion release.

If you’d like to pay for Guild Wars 2 the game, then have to pay for Guild Wars 2 every month in order to be able to play, then pay again for Guild Wars 2 Expansions every few months, then sure, you absolutely can get a WoW-like expansion for Guild Wars 2.

However, if you’re going to pay for GW2 once three years ago, then again three years later, you can’t expect the same amount of content for your $90 compared to the $630 a WoW player has paid during the same time.

Also, WoW had upwards of 10 million subscribers while GW2 has a few hundred thousand. You cannot compare the two games. GW2 is pretty amazing for the features and content you get for free.

Werdx.2059:

As far as i know,with expansion release in mmo,you get : New content,new dungeons,new raids,new items,new awesome looking zones.

In expansion HoT we got : Mastery system,which you need in order to complete 4 new zones.4 new zones,looking like SW and Brisband Wildlands mixed together.(Nothing new about them)And new specialization.Ok,that coust us 50 euros (or even 100)

No one said raids,new items and rest of the kitten,is going to be late for month after HoT release.

People are stupid and naive,if they thing they actually paid for all arena net said HoT is going to have.We paid for new specialization,mastery system and 4 new zones.

Rest of the things,they add in future is only patch,nothing else,and ArenaNet employers can say,your money bought you,this,and thins,and this,and every single update until next expansion,but that’s not true,we bought 4 maps,and 30 events,nothing else.

Please look at wow expansions.(comparing wow because that’s only mmo i played besides GW2) They get 7-8 new zones every expansion,2-3 raids,5 dungeons,tons of new armors,and all that at same time,with expansion release.

WoW added stuff between XPac’s it launched while I was there. At launch in WotLK, there was one mini-raid plus Naxx. Another mini raid was added later, then the Ulduar raid, then Icecrown Citadel. Did Wrath offer more than HoT. I’d say so, but I bought it and could no longer play it when I stopped paying monthly.

Try to access any incoming GW2 content updates that take place in the jungle without owning HoT. You won’t be able to, just like you cannot access ICC without owning Wrath.

Finally, look at other _buy-to-play MMO’s like Secret World or ESO. All content updates are paid for piecemeal. Compare what’s on offer in those and their cost to HoT.

Please do compare value when making a purchase, but look more closely at all factors and possible points of comparison.

I would say that $50 is a little outrageous, if only for the fact that it’s the first expansion. Then again, given the fact that inflation has hit like crazy over just the past 10 years, it would probably equate to the price of WoW’s Burning Crusade expansion, which, if memory serves, was around $30. Looking at Warlords of Draenor for WoW at $50, which I DID buy, I’m not really all too against the price of Heart of Thorns for this game, but my problem is I’d like to just have it separate from the core game. If there was a way to do so, I’d be fine, but with an extra copy of the core game, it’s like… what do I do with this? Unless I find someone who wants to play it, there’d be no use for me to have an extra copy of the core game. $50 is a tad ridiculous for an expansion, but then again, this is coming from the guy who shelled out $50 for WoD, so what the hell am I talking about?

I’m probably just sounding confusing here, so I’ll just shut up right now. xD

Shiverwar.7608:

I would say that $50 is a little outrageous, if only for the fact that it’s the first expansion. Then again, given the fact that inflation has hit like crazy over just the past 10 years, it would probably equate to the price of WoW’s Burning Crusade expansion, which, if memory serves, was around $30. Looking at Warlords of Draenor for WoW at $50, which I DID buy, I’m not really all too against the price of Heart of Thorns for this game, but my problem is I’d like to just have it separate from the core game. If there was a way to do so, I’d be fine, but with an extra copy of the core game, it’s like… what do I do with this? Unless I find someone who wants to play it, there’d be no use for me to have an extra copy of the core game. $50 is a tad ridiculous for an expansion, but then again, this is coming from the guy who shelled out $50 for WoD, so what the hell am I talking about?

I’m probably just sounding confusing here, so I’ll just shut up right now. xD

The only way to get a vanilla game would be to register the HoT serial code with a new account. It’s not that the base game comes separate from HoT, it’s that the HoT serial code unlocks the base game if the base game is not already unlocked. If vanilla is already unlocked, you just get HoT.

The ArenaNet Response is very sloppy. The problem isn’t it being $50, obviously. The problem is why is there NO OPTIONS to buy the expansion on it’s own? If I purchase a car, I would understand that I will need to pay for oil change when I need to, but they wouldn’t make me BUY A NEW CAR every time I go oil change, so every time I go oil change I come home with one extra car which I don’t need; If I purchase a phone, I don’t expect to pay for the SAME PHONE again every time there’s a new case to fit on it, and I go home with one extra phone just to sit in the corner of my room, because “The phone comes with the new case! So basically your phone which you paid for is valued at $0 and the NEW CASE is valued at $800”.

And still the question remains, WHY CAN’T WE BUY THE HoT with just the expansion? NONE OF THE staff team can give me a straight answer, because basically old players are getting kitten. ArenaNet is ran by morons.

The pricing is way over the top. No expansion should cost the same as the core game.

Definition of an expansion from Dictionary.com:

“additional content for a video game, card game, board game, etc., that significantly expands or alters the way the game is played”

That being said, 45 EUR as standard price is too much. Should be reduced by 50% the least. End of story.

They still have no character slot for 49.99 version I will wait for the expansion to come down to 19.99 before I purchase it. I have put a 6 month game time on my long buried wow account until the price of the expansion comes down. Enjoying my shaman for the next 6 months if the price still hasn’t changed, I will purchase Legion and wait longer.

I already bought the core years ago! ANET should have had a stand-alone copy of HoT in stores as well! Very surprised at this and not amused in the least!

Waiting……………………………

i bought it for €32,- so……maybe you ppl need to think outside the box and NOT buy it directly from Anet.

IcoverU.9658:

The ArenaNet Response is very sloppy. The problem isn’t it being $50, obviously. The problem is why is there NO OPTIONS to buy the expansion on it’s own? If I purchase a car, I would understand that I will need to pay for oil change when I need to, but they wouldn’t make me BUY A NEW CAR every time I go oil change, so every time I go oil change I come home with one extra car which I don’t need; If I purchase a phone, I don’t expect to pay for the SAME PHONE again every time there’s a new case to fit on it, and I go home with one extra phone just to sit in the corner of my room, because “The phone comes with the new case! So basically your phone which you paid for is valued at $0 and the NEW CASE is valued at $800”.

And still the question remains, WHY CAN’T WE BUY THE HoT with just the expansion? NONE OF THE staff team can give me a straight answer, because basically old players are getting kitten. ArenaNet is ran by morons.

You are buying just the expansion. The core game is added for free when applied to a new account. This has been explained many times so I don’t see how it is sloppy.

I have been playing GW2 since the early access pre-lauch for pre-purchase. Admittedly, that isn’t as long as some, but I don’t think that being a customer since before the launch is anything to sneer at, even if it was from only just before. With some of the changes that took place in the last 6 months or so, I found myself less interested, and therefore have played very little, but I still come back and play from time to time, and keep hoping that new changes will make up for what I haven’t liked.

Enter Heart of Thorns.

The expansion provides new zones, a new class, new events, new story. Just a lot of new content in general to try out, and most of it sounds pretty fantastic to me. So I’ve been contemplating picking up a copy.

Then I heard about the Play for Free Today concept. The way I first heard about it was “no matter how many expansions are released, you only have to pay for the game once”, and I thought, “that sounds great!”. But then I actually read up on the details of the system and how it actually works, and I found one huge problem: it only applies to new players! (At least, that is how I understand it. By all means, correct me if I’m wrong).

In other words, if you’ve paid for the game already, and been a loyal player for a while, and then a new expansion comes out (like Heart of Thorns), you have to buy the game again if you want to play the expansion. So while any new player only has to buy the game once in order to play both the original core and Heart of Thorns, anyone like me who already paid for the original core is forced to buy the expansion (pay for the game a second time) in order to enjoy that new content!

So instead of rewarding loyal players who have been around a while (something that tends to help keep customers loyal), or at least making it so that they aren’t punished for having been around a while, ArenaNet is now rewarding people for having never played or supported the game before while at the same time punishing those of us who have been around since the beginning!

But why?

Not only have those of us who have been around a while already paid for the game, but many of us have further supported the game through cash shop purchases (myself included)! And instead of being rewarded for that, we now have to pay even more if we want to access the new content. But someone who has never given any money whatsoever to GW2 before can now get the same game for what essentially equates to half the price!

And if a third expansion were to be released, that would mean that those of us who have been around since the beginning would have to pay for the game 3 times, while anyone new at that point would still only pay for it once.

I understand completely the desire to prevent expansions from getting so crazy that people have to buy the game 5+ times to keep up to date, and especially to start as a new player and still be able to play with friends who have been playing for a while. That makes sense, and I like the concept. Especially since, as more and more expansions come out, the cost to start as a new player with full access can get extremely and prohibitively high.

But the way the Play for Free Today system works (as I understand it) only solves this issue for the new players. It still leaves established players suffering from the expense of expansions. And by having established players suffer in such a way, while allowing new players to bypass the cost requirements, you’re creating a system where would-be players are rewarded, not for loyalty as a longstanding customer, but for deliberately waiting until the game is on its last legs and purchasing the game just once at a time where it seems additional expansions may be few and far between at best.

This is simply a bad policy.

If you want to ensure that players only have to pay for the game once, then you need to ensure that all players only have to pay for the game once. Which means you should give free expansion unlock codes (product keys) to the established players. And then make it so that anyone who purchases any copy of GW2, expansion or otherwise, automatically gets unlock codes for every installment. This would ensure that new players are not prohibited from game entry by vise of too many expansions to buy, but at the same time does not punish established players for having been here first.

(It would be entirely reasonable, IMO, to set up a limited time frame for free unlocks to be provided. For example, you could set up a set of events, such as part of the Living World story, that act as a precursor and introduction to the new events and story that are covered by the expansion. Then make rewards for participating in such events that can be turned in somehow in exchange for an expansion unlock code/product key. That would give the opportunity to get the expansion for free to loyal players who are still active players, but only for a limited time. Any players who have not been active and have renewed interest due to the expansion may still have to pay for the expansion because they may have missed the events).

My 2cp,
Drake

Old complain. Very old. If you have much time read thread on topic.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/HoT-Price-Feedback-Base-game-included-merged/

It’s entirely set up that way to entice new players.

However, they’ll pay for the next xpac. And at that point some more players will come along and get to ‘play for free’.

Then they original players will pay 3 times, the previous players 2 times, and the new players 1 time.

Etc, etc, etc, etc.

TD;LR A sucker gotta pay at some point yo

It’s to avoid a high paywall for new players.

Games must attract new players to replace vets who leave and it’s a heck of a lot easier to get new players to buy and try if they don’t have to pay for both the core and expansion, especially when you get to the second or third expansion. Once you’re in and you know if you want to continue with the game it’s not so much a leap of faith to continue to buy the expansions as they come out.

Qugi.2653:

Old complain. Very old. If you have much time read thread on topic.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/hot/HoT-Price-Feedback-Base-game-included-merged/

I missed that thread, because the titel talks about the price of HoT instead of mentioning specifically Play for Free. So thanks for pointing it out. I imagine my thread here will get merged over to there.

But old complaint or not, it is entirely valid.

Later,
Drake

Once again self centered and envious/greedy people viewing other peoples gains as their own loss

You arnt being “punished” for buying the game at launch, you got to play the game for 3 years
The only thing happening is new players are getting a good deal, if you somehow see the good fortune of someone else that effects you in no way as a “punishment” to you, than you really need to look deep and sort some stuff out with your psyche

Are you being “punished” for buying food when somone gives a free sandwich to a homeless person?

Regina Buenaobra.6193:

To clarify: $50 is the price of the expansion. We included the core game as a free bonus to make it easier for new players to get into it.

The problem, as has been pointed out repeatedly in this thread, is that doing it this way basically requires established, loyal customers to pay for the game twice, while only requiring new players to pay for it once. Why should we, who have been here since the beginning, have to pay the rough equivalent of $100+ (not counting the money we’ve spent on the cash shop) while new players only have to pay $50?

For one thing, the content additions of the expansion do not justify the $50 price tag on its own. But more than that, it simply is unfair. You should be rewarding loyal customers, not punishing them. At the very minimum, you should be giving them the same deal, namely: you only have to pay for the game once.

If you’re going to require some players to pay for the game more than once, then you ought to require all players to do so. If you don’t want to require new players to have to pay for the core and the expansion(s), but only the latest expansion, then the only fair thing to do is to give the expansions free to those with established accounts. That way, everyone only has to pay for the game once.

Aside from the fact that the HoT DLC expansion is overpriced, the business model is simply unfair to established players. Why are we being punished for our loyalty? How long do you really think that loyalty will last now that you’re punishing us for it?

The policy is a big mistake. And while I’ve gotten used to ArenaNet and NCSoft refusing to acknowledge or correct their mistakes, this one is far too big for you guys to ignore. If you ignore it, you do so to your own detriment. The policy is self-destructive.

Later,
Drake

Drake Phoenix.6158:

Regina Buenaobra.6193:

To clarify: $50 is the price of the expansion. We included the core game as a free bonus to make it easier for new players to get into it.

The problem, as has been pointed out repeatedly in this thread, is that doing it this way basically requires established, loyal customers to pay for the game twice, while only requiring new players to pay for it once. Why should we, who have been here since the beginning, have to pay the rough equivalent of $100+ (not counting the money we’ve spent on the cash shop) while new players only have to pay $50?

For one thing, the content additions of the expansion do not justify the $50 price tag on its own. But more than that, it simply is unfair. You should be rewarding loyal customers, not punishing them. At the very minimum, you should be giving them the same deal, namely: you only have to pay for the game once.

If you’re going to require some players to pay for the game more than once, then you ought to require all players to do so. If you don’t want to require new players to have to pay for the core and the expansion(s), but only the latest expansion, then the only fair thing to do is to give the expansions free to those with established accounts. That way, everyone only has to pay for the game once.

Aside from the fact that the HoT DLC expansion is overpriced, the business model is simply unfair to established players. Why are we being punished for our loyalty? How long do you really think that loyalty will last now that you’re punishing us for it?

The policy is a big mistake. And while I’ve gotten used to ArenaNet and NCSoft refusing to acknowledge or correct their mistakes, this one is far too big for you guys to ignore. If you ignore it, you do so to your own detriment. The policy is self-destructive.

Later,
Drake

I bolded the part in the quote that you missed.

I wonder if you complain about other products like this?

Agreed F2P is a bad policy. Keep in mind a company needs to make money to survive, and that means income. Customers generate that income with their purchases. The problem with F2P is rooted here because game designed would be based around “encouraging” players to part with their money, even making the game or any hint of progress unplayable without spending real life money. In other games it’s much worse, you’d spend literally over $100 upgrading a sword, and that’s only factoring in guaranteed progress, other games you need to buy real life items just for the CHANCE to improve your weapon or even have a downgrading risk.

Here new accounts are just very limited compared to paid accounts.

F2P is not a bad policy. It’s amazing when done right, and I think ANet has done better than most. However, keep in mind that they are far from perfect. Also, you have to realize that the $50 for the expansion is how much the actual expansion costs. The free core game is just tacked on as an added bonus- it is in no way part of the price you payed. The issue that we have is that it was not communicated very well, so people started complaining about being charged for something they already had. Unfortunately, this probably means that anytime ANet tries to be nice to one group of people the other group will go berserk with complaints. I, for one, think that the expansion is a fine price for the thousands of hours I’d put in before that without paying any more than the original box price.

Your analogy is inaccurate. This isn’t anything like someone giving a sandwich free to a homeless person, where I had to pay for it. Because in that case, both sandwiches were paid for. So your analogy would be more like someone buying the game and then giving it away to someone who wants it but can’t afford it themselves. That’s not a problem.

The problem is when a company charges a loyal customer more for something than they charge a new customer for the exact same product.

Additionally, the analogy of giving to someone homeless implies that the homeless person has a need. Specifically, they need to eat, and can’t afford food, so someone gives them food for free. In other words, it is a needs-based gift.

But the HoT issue is not needs-based. Anyone who buys the HoT expansion as a new player gets both the core and the expansion for only the price of the expansion, even if they could easily afford to pay for both. While someone who has the core game already, but perhaps can’t afford the expansion because they’ve been laid off and have to feed their kids (just as one possible reason), still has to pay for both the core and the expansion separately (or do without the expansion) only because they already paid for the core before the expansion came out.

In other words, we are being required to pay for the game twice, while others are only required to pay for it once, and the determination of who pays what has nothing to do with need or affordability, but is purely a difference between new player vs. established player.

As a loyal and long-standing customer I should not have to pay more for the exact same product than someone who is buying it for the first time. It has nothing to do with being self-centered, envious, or greedy. It has to do with a sense of fairness and justice.

Later,
Drake

Ayrilana.1396:

Drake Phoenix.6158:

Regina Buenaobra.6193:

To clarify: $50 is the price of the expansion. We included the core game as a free bonus to make it easier for new players to get into it.

The problem, as has been pointed out repeatedly in this thread, is that doing it this way basically requires established, loyal customers to pay for the game twice, while only requiring new players to pay for it once. Why should we, who have been here since the beginning, have to pay the rough equivalent of $100+ (not counting the money we’ve spent on the cash shop) while new players only have to pay $50?

For one thing, the content additions of the expansion do not justify the $50 price tag on its own. But more than that, it simply is unfair. You should be rewarding loyal customers, not punishing them. At the very minimum, you should be giving them the same deal, namely: you only have to pay for the game once.

If you’re going to require some players to pay for the game more than once, then you ought to require all players to do so. If you don’t want to require new players to have to pay for the core and the expansion(s), but only the latest expansion, then the only fair thing to do is to give the expansions free to those with established accounts. That way, everyone only has to pay for the game once.

Aside from the fact that the HoT DLC expansion is overpriced, the business model is simply unfair to established players. Why are we being punished for our loyalty? How long do you really think that loyalty will last now that you’re punishing us for it?

The policy is a big mistake. And while I’ve gotten used to ArenaNet and NCSoft refusing to acknowledge or correct their mistakes, this one is far too big for you guys to ignore. If you ignore it, you do so to your own detriment. The policy is self-destructive.

Later,
Drake

I bolded the part in the quote that you missed.

I didn’t miss anything. The point is, we established players have had to pay for something that new players are being given for free. It doesn’t matter if the expansion is free for them or if the core is free for them. The point is that for us established players, neither the core nor the expansion are free. And therefore, we are paying twice the price for the exact same (combined) product, whereas new players are only paying once.

Later,
Drake

This is a very short-sighted critique.

Forcing new players to pay a massive up-front cost means far fewer new players will enter the game, which means the game will begin to contract and die. Lowering those barriers means new players won’t feel like they’ve been left behind, which means they’ll be more likely to hop in and the game will thrive as a result for years to come.

I’ve been playing GW2 since the very first day of release and I don’t have the slightest problem with the new business model. I got almost 2000 hours of play out of that $50 I spent when the game first came out and I don’t regret it. As Doc Brown would say, you’re not thinking 4th-dimensionally! It isn’t just about how much you pay but about when you payed it. You’re essentially saying that all the time you’ve played so far is totally worthless to you, which causes me to wonder why you’re continuing to play.

My primary problem with Anets decision on HoT bundling and pricing is that I believe it actually makes it -harder- for new players to get into the game. F2P helps sure but there are a boatload of restrictions along with it (and most/all of them justifiably so to prevent abuse).

Having the option to pay $5 to buy the Core GW2 game and remove these restrictions could have been a stepping stone to ease players in. Instead they are stuck with massive restrictions or the $50 price tag. It would have gone over better with existing players, too if they hadn’t acted like bundling the two together was doing us some kind of favour.

Keep in mind the living story isn’t free. Assuming 2-3 seasons per expansion, new players (next expansion) are going to be paying roughly the same price as HoT itself if they want to buy the full package. In the end, both new and active players are paying the same. Those that buy and quit however will end up paying twice.

Their new single box model is to simply make it easier to start. Like the core game, past expansions will also likely be given away to free accounts, simply to keep the old game active.

Glacial.9516:

Having the option to pay $5 to buy the Core GW2 game and remove these restrictions could have been a stepping stone to ease players in.

They’ll never do that again. The $10 accounts were the best deal ever offered. Why buy 800 gems for $10 when you could buy an account which, at the time, generated ~400 gems a month just through selling the login rewards?

“This is simply a bad policy.”

Welcome to Arena Net. Get used to it, if you plan to play this game at length.

Drake Phoenix.6158:

Ayrilana.1396:

Drake Phoenix.6158:

Regina Buenaobra.6193:

To clarify: $50 is the price of the expansion. We included the core game as a free bonus to make it easier for new players to get into it.

The problem, as has been pointed out repeatedly in this thread, is that doing it this way basically requires established, loyal customers to pay for the game twice, while only requiring new players to pay for it once. Why should we, who have been here since the beginning, have to pay the rough equivalent of $100+ (not counting the money we’ve spent on the cash shop) while new players only have to pay $50?

For one thing, the content additions of the expansion do not justify the $50 price tag on its own. But more than that, it simply is unfair. You should be rewarding loyal customers, not punishing them. At the very minimum, you should be giving them the same deal, namely: you only have to pay for the game once.

If you’re going to require some players to pay for the game more than once, then you ought to require all players to do so. If you don’t want to require new players to have to pay for the core and the expansion(s), but only the latest expansion, then the only fair thing to do is to give the expansions free to those with established accounts. That way, everyone only has to pay for the game once.

Aside from the fact that the HoT DLC expansion is overpriced, the business model is simply unfair to established players. Why are we being punished for our loyalty? How long do you really think that loyalty will last now that you’re punishing us for it?

The policy is a big mistake. And while I’ve gotten used to ArenaNet and NCSoft refusing to acknowledge or correct their mistakes, this one is far too big for you guys to ignore. If you ignore it, you do so to your own detriment. The policy is self-destructive.

Later,
Drake

I bolded the part in the quote that you missed.

I didn’t miss anything. The point is, we established players have had to pay for something that new players are being given for free. It doesn’t matter if the expansion is free for them or if the core is free for them. The point is that for us established players, neither the core nor the expansion are free. And therefore, we are paying twice the price for the exact same (combined) product, whereas new players are only paying once.

Later,
Drake

So if I buy a GOTY edition of a game that contains the original game and all expansions, the developers are ripping off previous players by not giving them that same deal? How about when a core game get’s marked down as what happens over time? The issue here is not with what Anet has done but with some players not understanding how things work with expansions.

If you want the same deal, apply the expansion that you bought to a new account. You’ll then get exactly what new players are getting. Companies have always offered discounts or value packages to specific segments of their customers or potential customers. What Anet is doing is nothing new and should not come as a surprise.

My analogy is not inaccurate, your just doing mental gymnastics to make it seem like your paying for the game twice just because other people who didnt play the game for the last 3 years are now able to get it free.

Your seeing people get something 3 years old with added restrictions for free, and now all of a sudden you want a free handout too even tho you have 3 years worth of playtime and in game rewards/ resources that those players will NEVER have

What do you think the price of HOT will be in 3 years time ?
The price of a MMO falls from the day its released, so the original game may have cost $50 for example 3 years ago, but the original game today is worth close to nothing.
HOT now includes the original game because the original game is worth close to nothing.
If Arenanet does make another expansion , it will include HOT and the original game in the expansion price.

It’s not that simple. In the OP, you suggest giving the x-pac out for free to all active players, perhaps as a reward for Living World type events. Do you realize how much that would cost? The amount of lost revenue would be massive. Making an x-pac, even one as small in scope as HoT, takes a lot of time and money, and dong so would remove a lot of the latter. I agree, it’s not a great system, but at least it keeps the game growing.

Additionally, Kayberz has a very good point. You paid and got the game to play for 3 years; isn’t that worth something?

DeShadowWolf.6854:

It’s not that simple. In the OP, you suggest giving the x-pac out for free to all active players, perhaps as a reward for Living World type events. Do you realize how much that would cost? The amount of lost revenue would be massive. Making an x-pac, even one as small in scope as HoT, takes a lot of time and money, and dong so would remove a lot of the latter. I agree, it’s not a great system, but at least it keeps the game growing.

Additionally, Kayberz has a very good point. You paid and got the game to play for 3 years; isn’t that worth something?

no. frankly, that is the model that attracted us to the game in the first place.
we should not be penalized for actually purchasing the game 3yrs ago. GW1 offered expansions, but GW2: tough luck, they will never offer one according to the email I received. So, that makes it official. They simply do not care about existing customers. The only way I can receive any value for purchasing it (again) is to create a new email address and make an entirely new account. That is unacceptable, so, since they don’t care to offer loyal customers anything reasonable (such kitten additional character slots as though it was a new account), then that purchase will NEVER happen for me till they get their heads out of their collective rear ends.

therealcyrano.1927:

no. frankly, that is the model that attracted us to the game in the first place.

“Us?” Is there a bird in your pocket?

therealcyrano.1927:

we should not be penalized for actually purchasing the game 3yrs ago.

“We?” You and that bird again? In any case you are not being penalized for buying the game three years ago.

therealcyrano.1927:

GW1 offered expansions, but GW2: tough luck, they will never offer one according to the email I received.

Evidence?

To date I have not seen any comment from Anet stating definitively that they would not produce an expansion for GW2. There is pretty solid evidence that they intend to do so….as it already exists.

therealcyrano.1927:

So, that makes it official. They simply do not care about existing customers. The only way I can receive any value for purchasing it (again) is to create a new email address and make an entirely new account. That is unacceptable, so, since they don’t care to offer loyal customers anything reasonable (such kitten additional character slots as though it was a new account), then that purchase will NEVER happen for me till they get their heads out of their collective rear ends.

So you paid for something. You got that something. You got more than was originally included in the purchase agreement, and yet Anet does not care?

They gave you more than you paid for and yet they are remiss?

Ashen.2907:

therealcyrano.1927:

GW1 offered expansions, but GW2: tough luck, they will never offer one according to the email I received.

Evidence?

To date I have not seen any comment from Anet stating definitively that they would not produce an expansion for GW2. There is pretty solid evidence that they intend to do so….as it already exists.

There certainly was some kind of message claiming that GW2 was unlikely to have an expansion, but it’s cool by me that there was one. Wish it hadn’t been quite as pricey, but I’m okay with supporting the team. Just gotta cross fingers and beg for more maps, more maps, more maps!

I’ve had GW2 since (I asked my wife to buy it for me for) the Christmas after its launch and I’ve played it off and on. I’ve always said it’s a beautiful game, but hard to “get into”. Not that it’s a hard game, just that there is something inherently boring about it, such that despite really quite enjoying its mechanics and design, my GW2 game sessions seem to always be considerably shorter than other games I have played (EQ/EQ2, SWG, WoW, PS2, Aion, etc…). Coming back after several months to find entire systems changed or removed certainly didn’t help that any btw – some of the things that compelled me to purchase the game no longer exist and that’s… annoying.

Anyhow, i finally leveled a character to 80 earlier in 2015 and I’ve considered purchasing the new expansion. I appreciate that it’s an actual expansion of the game rather than a wholesale replacement of the game, unlike so many other MMOs. However, there are some factors about Heart of Thorns that are keeping me from purchasing it:

1. I am Canadian. The retail box is $70 on store shelves here. The CAD to USD exchange rate makes the $50USD online purchase roughly $68.

Look, Canada is not some third world nation with a GDP worth a box of donuts. Despite the ridiculous geo-political garbage that has driven our dollar to historic lows in the last year, the reality is that Canadians earn roughly the same wages as Americans and our time is every bit as valuable as anyone else’s. Time IS money; Asking us to pay $20 more for your expansion is inappropriate.

2. $50 USD is about $10 USD more than I am willing to pay for an EXPANSION PACK. $39.99 is the top end of what I feel is reasonable. Honestly, as a person who never played the original Guild Wars, I would get more new content and thus, “value for the dollar”, by spending $20 on the original game.

3. I don’t like what I am reading about how the open world makes soloing a bunch of boring drudgery and frustrating tedium. Jumping puzzles? Yeah, fine, if they are optional and I happen to feel in the mood to do one. Mobs so tightly packed and on such a fast respawn that getting places is tedious? Tedium is the opposite of fun folks – Opposite of fun. Dungeons, raids, and PvP? Don’t care, do what you want with them. However, the open world should be there for everyone to enjoy.

4. I’m actually quite kittened off about the changes to the Skill Point system, which magically means that I get exactly NOTHING for leveling up beyond 80 now, unless I buy your expansion! What the actual… really? That was, point blank, a deceptive and kittenty thing to do people like me who bought the original game (collector’s ed no less…). I couldn’t care less that you “went free to play” – I bought the kitten ed game – stop taking away parts of what I paid for!

In fact, that last point there is such a stinger that as a matter of principle, I’m really not inclined to spend any money with NCSoft again. If that’s the kind of treatment I get for my money, well… I’d rather give my “disposable income” to someone else, tbh. Certainly no shortage of places to spend money…

As it stands, GW2 is a very nice game with much to like about it, but I doubt I will purchase the Heart of Thorns expansion. Sadly, from what I have already seen, I can’t help but worry that even more of the “base game” will be knee-capped, removed, or left broken, in the interest of pushing the sale of the expansion. An expansion that, from what I can tell, was made for a niche market rather than whole player base no less. Hopefully I will have time to finish the “base game” before it’s entirely paywalled, despite the fact that I did indeed pay for it already.

/first post

(After 3 years I finally felt strongly enough to come here and post something. Take that into consideration.)

Did you try purchasing a key from any official online retailer? They goes on sale often and if they’re on ANet’s whitelist, there’s nothing to hesitate.
But I understand if you don’t ever wish to purchase it. I bought it for $35 and if it wasn’t for the core game, I would have demanded for a refund.

Tatwi.3562:

2. $50 USD is about $10 USD more than I am willing to pay for an EXPANSION PACK. $39.99 is the top end of what I feel is reasonable

http://www.dlgamer.us/download-guild_wars_2_heart_of_thorns-pc_games-p-29808.html

$37.99 USD (official retailer)

As a Canadian is the U.S., I’m shocked at the state of the Canadian dollar. It’s terrible right now. It’s mind boggling low. It basically crashed 20 cents in a year or two. Ridiculous. I don’t blame Anet for wanting their pound of flesh, but I do think it’s priced too high. You’ll have to wait for a sale, that’s silly expensive, but I feel 50 bucks is already way too expensive, even the sale price I bought it for was a bit high. I wouldn’t pay 70 bucks Canadian for a full game, but you don’t really have an option. You either pay it, or you don’t play it. Specializations are fun, but they aren’t worth 70 bucks.

Go pay 15 bucks a month then.

Don’t buy HoT, you going to have buyers remorse like most of us.

I don’t know what you think Anet should do. Lower the price of the game just for Canadians. I actually feel your pain, since I’m in Australia. and everything is more expansive here/too expensive here. But the value of the Canadian or the Australian dollar isn’t Anet’s fault and has nothing to do with Anet.

As for the $50 being too high for an expansion, I’m not 100% sure I agree. I mean games with subs might well charge $40 bucks for an expansion but you’re still paying $15 a month. And games that are pay to win can give away expansions for free, because people have to keep spending money to play them.

I paid a whole lot of money to play DDO and Lotro and Perfect world, even though they were free. Far more than kitten expansion. And that’s the problem. In a buy to play game, you have to buy it to play. But you don’t get the you must buy this to survive, you must engage in an optional sub to be competitive, or have to pay a sub.

A lot more goes into MMOs than most games. So they have to charge for that.

On the other than, it’s already on sale for less than $40 in some places and it’ll probably go down again soon.

Shen Slayer.3058:

Don’t buy HoT, you going to have buyers remorse like most of us.

Not for everyone I know personally that plays. We are all having loads of fun with it.

Healix.5819:

Tatwi.3562:

2. $50 USD is about $10 USD more than I am willing to pay for an EXPANSION PACK. $39.99 is the top end of what I feel is reasonable

http://www.dlgamer.us/download-guild_wars_2_heart_of_thorns-pc_games-p-29808.html

$37.99 USD (official retailer)

That’s a good find and in line with what I would pay. Thanks for taking the time for posting it!

However, with Canadian dollar being so low, today 37.99 USD = 50.63 CAD. That’s $12.64 (more than my hourly wage, sadly) just thrown into the meaningless black hole that is currency exchange. I’m really not inclined to buy anything in USD these days…

In Canada they have priced it at the same level as the US ($50) and the UK (£35) and I assume it’s the same for all the other countries they sell to. You can blame ANet for many things but currency exchange rates is not one of them.

Besides, the OP does not sound like he wants to buy the expansion at any price. /shrug

DoctorDing.5890:

In Canada they have priced it at the same level as the US ($50) and the UK (£35) and I assume it’s the same for all the other countries they sell to. You can blame ANet for many things but currency exchange rates is not one of them.

Besides, the OP does not sound like he wants to buy the expansion at any price. /shrug

I’d be happy to buy it for $37.99 USD, if I lived in the USA.

I’ve bought the game back in 2012 and now I have the HoT included… is this normal? I’ve returned to the game with some friends and none of them have it. I do have a GW 1 account on the same Mail and they dont, does this change anything? thanks

Marketing ploy: Core is now ‘free’ so pay the same price as you did for the full game for the small 4-zone expansion.

I don’t understand why people get hung up on this? You’ve payed the game for 3 years and payed only 60$ (or something like that) in order to do so. For this money you’ve recieved free updates with content being added (and developed) without the need to pay for any of it.

Now 3 years later, they release an expansion, and with this expansion they make the game Free to Play. UNLESS you want to play the expansion! If you want to play the expansion (granted it was kind of a small expansion for a full game price) you need to purchase it.

How is this in any way wrong? Nobody’s forcing you to buy the expansion, but c’mon mate – you’ve gotten 3 years of update for free. You obviously like the game – why not give the devs some extra cash and insentive so keep making the game good?

New players will be able to see now if they like the core game, they can buy the expansion e.g. the game grows.

I’ve just about had it with these posts. It was a poorly thought through thing to mark out and complain about 3 months ago, and still is.

Sorry for rant.