Put it this way … if you don’t repeat periodic events, then they are exactly like hearts, so the idea that Events aren’t an option for someone that likes doing hearts or aren’t an option for the people that think hearts is better than events is not sensible.
sigh I never claimed that the dynamic events were “not an option” for people who prefer hearts…
I quite enjoyed the hearts
Put it this way … if you don’t repeat periodic events, then they are exactly like hearts, so the idea that Events aren’t an option for someone that likes doing hearts or aren’t an option for the people that think hearts is better than events is not sensible.
sigh I never claimed that the dynamic events were “not an option” for people who prefer hearts…
Then why was there ever a clear distinction between the two for this discussion in the first place? Preference or hearts or events … is quite irrelevant w.r.t. looking at if HoT is playable solo or not.
Put it this way … if you don’t repeat periodic events, then they are exactly like hearts, so the idea that Events aren’t an option for someone that likes doing hearts or aren’t an option for the people that think hearts is better than events is not sensible.
sigh I never claimed that the dynamic events were “not an option” for people who prefer hearts…
But what’s actually the difference between hearts and events. You say you enjoy hearts more than events.
So if theres’ a heart that says gather these apples and bring them in, or there’s an event that says gather these apples and bring them in, what really is the difference.
The difference is once you do the heart it’s done and you can’t do it again. But you an always replay the dynamic event.
It’s just a bizarre thing.
The only other difference is if you want zone completion you have to do hearts, but events are almost always optional (with a few excpetions).
Put it this way … if you don’t repeat periodic events, then they are exactly like hearts, so the idea that Events aren’t an option for someone that likes doing hearts or aren’t an option for the people that think hearts is better than events is not sensible.
sigh I never claimed that the dynamic events were “not an option” for people who prefer hearts…
But what’s actually the difference between hearts and events. You say you enjoy hearts more than events.
So if theres’ a heart that says gather these apples and bring them in, or there’s an event that says gather these apples and bring them in, what really is the difference.
The difference is once you do the heart it’s done and you can’t do it again. But you an always replay the dynamic event.
It’s just a bizarre thing.
The only other difference is if you want zone completion you have to do hearts, but events are almost always optional (with a few excpetions).
Actually, in this case it’s pretty obvious with the difference – With the heart, it’s “Help Farmer X tend to the orchard – gather apples, clear pests, etc.” It tells you what’s going on in this area of the world, and it rewards you for just playing around in the area. The heart gives the event context.
The ‘heart-replacing’ events are the meta events. “Help Take/Hold the temples of Orr”, “Defend and Run Supplies to Red Rock Bastion”… and the numerous outpost progressions in Verdant Brink.
I wouldn’t mind if they were to put hearts in those areas to encourage exploration and interaction with the zones.
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Getting back to the original post….
Solo players cannot advance in the new content, and any decent publisher would disclose such a fundamental change prior to taking your money.
Solo players can advance in the new content. Time to close the thread?
Put it this way … if you don’t repeat periodic events, then they are exactly like hearts, so the idea that Events aren’t an option for someone that likes doing hearts or aren’t an option for the people that think hearts is better than events is not sensible.
sigh I never claimed that the dynamic events were “not an option” for people who prefer hearts…
But what’s actually the difference between hearts and events. You say you enjoy hearts more than events.
So if theres’ a heart that says gather these apples and bring them in, or there’s an event that says gather these apples and bring them in, what really is the difference.
The difference is once you do the heart it’s done and you can’t do it again. But you an always replay the dynamic event.
It’s just a bizarre thing.
The only other difference is if you want zone completion you have to do hearts, but events are almost always optional (with a few excpetions).
Actually, in this case it’s pretty obvious with the difference – With the heart, it’s “Help Farmer X tend to the orchard – gather apples, clear pests, etc.” It tells you what’s going on in this area of the world, and it rewards you for just playing around in the area. The heart gives the event context.
The ‘heart-replacing’ events are the meta events. “Help Take/Hold the temples of Orr”, “Defend and Run Supplies to Red Rock Bastion”… and the numerous outpost progressions in Verdant Brink.
I wouldn’t mind if they were to put hearts in those areas to encourage exploration and interaction with the zones.
Dynamic events often give the zones more context than hearts, because they chain. There’s a tiny dynamic event chain that repeats quite often in the beginning of Caldeon. A sylvari woman sees the lights have gone out and to light them again she needs firefly essences.
Once those essences are collected and handed in, the lights come on but then an influx of mosquitos some in. That’s a simple example. The difference is dynamic event context can build, heart context never builds.
Escorting caravans through Kessex hills which are attacked by bandits and centaurs give context to how dangerous that world is and who are the law-abiding human’s main enemy in those maps.
Basically anything that a heart can give context with, a dynamic event can give deeper context.
After all, the entire Orr maps are our incursion against Zhaitan and they tell more of a story and provide more context than any heart on the game. Same with DryTop. Same with Silverwastes. Same with south sun.
The context is there, if people care to look.
And on topic most events can be soloed. Not all, but most.
MMORPG
noun: MMORPG; plural noun: MMORPGs
an online role-playing video game in which a very large number of people participate simultaneously.
Origin
1990s: from massively multiplayer online role-playing game .
Not so sure what you were expecting when you purchased an MMORPG.
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
Dynamic events often give the zones more context than hearts, because they chain There’s a tiny dynamic event chain that repeats quite often in the beginning of Caldeon. A sylvari woman sees the lights have gone out and to light them again she needs firefly essences.
Once those essences are collected and handed in, the lights come on but then an influx of mosquitos some in. That’s a simple example. The difference is dynamic event context can build, heart context never builds.
Escorting caravans through Kessex hills which are attacked by bandits and centaurs give context to how dangerous that world is and who are the law-abiding human’s main enemy in those maps.
Basically anything that a heart can give context with, a dynamic event can give deeper context.
After all, the entire Orr maps are our incursion against Zhaitan and they tell more of a story and provide more context than any heart on the game. Same with DryTop. Same with Silverwastes. Same with south sun.
The context is there, if people care to look.
And on topic most events can be soloed. Not all, but most.
The context isn’t there when the Events aren’t. Why are there threats on the roads through Kessex Hills? Since when have Mosquitos been a problem to that village in Caledon (Where did they come from?)
And the meta events give context… but the standard events tend to not give as much. Even then, scouts and the Heart Vendor give even more context on the ’what’s going on in this part of the world’ if you ask them. This is why I mentioned the Meta events replacing hearts, because they give the context for the world. In the newer zones, the maps are a lot more “In the Now” – Sure, they’re on a cycle gameplay-wise… but there’s not really the same sense of “This has been going on for a while/This will keep going on for a long time – Your contributions help, but won’t immediately change the situation” that hearts have going for them.
Something else the hearts do is give a sense of “Why are these creatures here” or “What effect are the creatures in this area having on local settlements outside of immediate events?” Sure, they tend to be ‘telling’ more than ‘showing’ – but telling is a LOT easier on the budget, and also less likely to be missed or misunderstood.
Events, including the meta events, say ’What’s happening now" – but they don’t always convey the conditions that the events arise from. Some of the events in Orr really should have been Hearts instead, as well (Such as the priory’s “Answer questions about Orr’s History” and “Bring spectral hammers to be destroyed” near the Cathedral in Malachor’s Leap).
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
Dynamic events often give the zones more context than hearts, because they chain There’s a tiny dynamic event chain that repeats quite often in the beginning of Caldeon. A sylvari woman sees the lights have gone out and to light them again she needs firefly essences.
Once those essences are collected and handed in, the lights come on but then an influx of mosquitos some in. That’s a simple example. The difference is dynamic event context can build, heart context never builds.
Escorting caravans through Kessex hills which are attacked by bandits and centaurs give context to how dangerous that world is and who are the law-abiding human’s main enemy in those maps.
Basically anything that a heart can give context with, a dynamic event can give deeper context.
After all, the entire Orr maps are our incursion against Zhaitan and they tell more of a story and provide more context than any heart on the game. Same with DryTop. Same with Silverwastes. Same with south sun.
The context is there, if people care to look.
And on topic most events can be soloed. Not all, but most.
The context isn’t there when the Events aren’t. Why are there threats on the roads through Kessex Hills? Since when have Mosquitos been a problem to that village in Caledon (Where did they come from?)
And the meta events give context… but the standard events tend to not give as much. Even then, scouts and the Heart Vendor give even more context on the ’what’s going on in this part of the world’ if you ask them. This is why I mentioned the Meta events replacing hearts, because they give the context for the world. In the newer zones, the maps are a lot more “In the Now” – Sure, they’re on a cycle gameplay-wise… but there’s not really the same sense of “This has been going on for a while/This will keep going on for a long time – Your contributions help, but won’t immediately change the situation” that hearts have going for them.
Something else the hearts do is give a sense of “Why are these creatures here” or “What effect are the creatures in this area having on local settlements outside of immediate events?” Sure, they tend to be ‘telling’ more than ‘showing’ – but telling is a LOT easier on the budget, and also less likely to be missed or misunderstood.
Events, including the meta events, say ’What’s happening now" – but they don’t always convey the conditions that the events arise from. Some of the events in Orr really should have been Hearts instead, as well (Such as the priory’s “Answer questions about Orr’s History” and “Bring spectral hammers to be destroyed” near the Cathedral in Malachor’s Leap).
But most hearts don’t really give that much context. In fact, many hearts are just add on sort of things. Several hearts in Queensdale and Kessex are just kill bandits, which you get from scouts. It’s really not that much context.
In fact, I’d say there’s precious little context from a huge percentage of the hearts. There are exceptions. But many of them are just mini games, an excuse for context. They fit without the established world, but there’s no depth to them at all.
And all of this has nothing to do with whether events are or aren’t soloable anyway.
But hearts are static in every sense of the word. And you can only do them once and then they’re gone forever. Events keep coming back again and again. So once you do ever heart of a character, the world is only alive because of events. The hearts become insignificant.
And if you have a boatload of alts, as I do, they become an impediment. I’m not sure how much context I need about trading with the Jotuns on six or seven or ten characters. Or bringing rabbit food in.
They’re just time wasters.
But most hearts don’t really give that much context. In fact, many hearts are just add on sort of things. Several hearts in Queensdale and Kessex are just kill bandits, which you get from scouts. It’s really not that much context.
They give the context of who the bandits are, who’s fighting the bandits, and what’s at stake in the conflict with the bandits (Or do you not talk to the heart-NPC?).
In fact, I’d say there’s precious little context from a huge percentage of the hearts. There are exceptions. But many of them are just mini games, an excuse for context. They fit without the established world, but there’s no depth to them at all.
That’s like saying there’s no depth in a fetch quest (Which Hearts are the equivalent of). The purpose of hearts/fetch quests isn’t simply to mindlessly Do X to Receive Y. Instead, it’s an invitation to get involved in learning about and interacting with the world (Especially free of the time constraints of an Event), go places that would otherwise be out of the way, and see how things fit together (though you can always ignore that part).
And all of this has nothing to do with whether events are or aren’t soloable anyway.
Yes, we’re drifting off topic here.
But hearts are static in every sense of the word. And you can only do them once and then they’re gone forever. Events keep coming back again and again. So once you do ever heart of a character, the world is only alive because of events. The hearts become insignificant.
Hearts are constant. They are the “What this part of the world is about.”
And if you have a boatload of alts, as I do, they become an impediment. I’m not sure how much context I need about trading with the Jotuns on six or seven or ten characters. Or bringing rabbit food in.
The Jotun are always in need of trade, and rabbit food must be gathered, but not everyone needs to be always trading with the Jotun (And can trade at any time), nor are you expected to be a full-time rabbit food gatherer.
They’re just time wasters.
Only an impediment to World Completion on a character. But world completion is more than just about zooming around places tagging locations. The title is “Been there, done that”. Not simply “Been There”. The hearts are the part of the world you interact with to say the character not only has passed through the zone, but actively engaged with it.
(edited by Sartharina.3542)
I quite enjoyed the hearts
Me too.
Put it this way … if you don’t repeat periodic events, then they are exactly like hearts, so the idea that Events aren’t an option for someone that likes doing hearts or aren’t an option for the people that think hearts is better than events is not sensible.
sigh I never claimed that the dynamic events were “not an option” for people who prefer hearts…
So if theres’ a heart that says gather these apples and bring them in, or there’s an event that says gather these apples and bring them in, what really is the difference.
The difference is once you do the heart it’s done and you can’t do it again. But you an always replay the dynamic event.
It’s just a bizarre thing.
The only other difference is if you want zone completion you have to do hearts, but events are almost always optional (with a few excpetions).
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
(edited by Dante.1508)
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
(edited by Obtena.7952)
The thing that I don’t like as much about dynamic events is that, while many are memorable and important to the context of the map/region…they get very stale when repeated over and over. It doesn’t’ give you the sense that you made any change in that part of the world, whereas Hearts are done once – you’ve fixed the immediate issue plaguing that farmer or that community. Honestly, the only “events” in this game that I DO enjoy repeating on a single character are world bosses and dungeons. Dynamic events make no sense when done more than once.
Honestly, I’m not even arguing against dynamic events. We all get things in this game that we can choose to do based on our game style preferences. No need to be at each other’s throats just because we all prefer different things! Some people here are incredibly antagonistic and don’t like to accept other people’s opinions… -sigh-
That’s easily solved though as we already stated. you can do events at your leisure as well, just do them less often. I mean, if you do an Event once every few months, do they really get that stale? No more so than repeating a heart every few months if you roll a new character.
It’s not that people aren’t accepting of opinions here. It’s the idea that somehow, the lack of hearts in HoT is a problem related to soloable/appealing content for people that prefer them even though the technical difference between hearts and events is so trivial, it’s hard to believe such a claim to be honest.
That’s easily solved though as we already stated. you can do events at your leisure as well, just do them less often. I mean, if you do an Event once every few months, do they really get that stale? No more so than repeating a heart every few months if you roll a new character.
It’s not that people aren’t accepting of opinions here. It’s the idea that somehow, the lack of hearts in HoT is a problem related to soloable/appealing content for people that prefer them even though the technical difference between hearts and events is so trivial, it’s hard to believe such a claim to be honest.
Oh, I wasn’t arguing anything about lack of Hearts in HoT; it’s just when a discussion began to crop up in here about Hearts vs Events, I thought I’d give my own thoughts about it, that’s all. HoT is no different from Orr in this regard, and Orr has been around much longer, so those of us who have gotten to level 70+ know the deal. I just don’t think that Hearts should be seen as “trivial”, as they are needed for map completion. Events are an optional way to get XP and loot and keep busy, so nothing wrong with that. I’m just not going to repeat them every single time they reset.
Live and let live.
That’s easily solved though as we already stated. you can do events at your leisure as well, just do them less often. I mean, if you do an Event once every few months, do they really get that stale? No more so than repeating a heart every few months if you roll a new character.
It’s not that people aren’t accepting of opinions here. It’s the idea that somehow, the lack of hearts in HoT is a problem related to soloable/appealing content for people that prefer them even though the technical difference between hearts and events is so trivial, it’s hard to believe such a claim to be honest.
technical? sure
but there is A HUGE difference in the way, that they play
hint: one of them lets me play on my own terms, the other one doesnt
if they really WERE the same, as you claim, why would you want anything else , but hearts?
The thing that I don’t like as much about dynamic events is that, while many are memorable and important to the context of the map/region…they get very stale when repeated over and over. It doesn’t’ give you the sense that you made any change in that part of the world, whereas Hearts are done once – you’ve fixed the immediate issue plaguing that farmer or that community. Honestly, the only “events” in this game that I DO enjoy repeating on a single character are world bosses and dungeons. Dynamic events make no sense when done more than once.
Honestly, I’m not even arguing against dynamic events. We all get things in this game that we can choose to do based on our game style preferences. No need to be at each other’s throats just because we all prefer different things! Some people here are incredibly antagonistic and don’t like to accept other people’s opinions… -sigh-
Not really the case. Let’s take fighting bandits or centaurs in a heart area. After you kill them they’re still ALL there. You fixed nothing. That’s why hearts are less immersive than events.
If I drive the centaurs away from a town in an event, sure they’ll eventually attack again but I’ve done something. If I kill seventeen centaurs and got my heart, the heart does disappear, but the centaurs don’t. If I’ve disarmed traps, they’re still there.
Nothing changes except that your heart disapppears. DEs affect the world in a persistent manner, hearts do not.
That’s easily solved though as we already stated. you can do events at your leisure as well, just do them less often. I mean, if you do an Event once every few months, do they really get that stale? No more so than repeating a heart every few months if you roll a new character.
It’s not that people aren’t accepting of opinions here. It’s the idea that somehow, the lack of hearts in HoT is a problem related to soloable/appealing content for people that prefer them even though the technical difference between hearts and events is so trivial, it’s hard to believe such a claim to be honest.
technical? sure
but there is A HUGE difference in the way, that they play
hint: one of them lets me play on my own terms, the other one doesnt
if they really WERE the same, as you claim, why would you want anything else , but hearts?
Not sure what you’re point is … that’s what I basically said already but to answer your question:
I would want something else than hearts because I realize it’s completely impractical for Anet to implement the quantity of hearts that would be needed to replace events. In addition to that .. if I LIKE one of the hearts and think it’s a cool content, it would suck to only be able to do it once, especially in HoT.
Having both gives different options, but I think the good reasons and practical necessity of events makes them preferable.
The thing that I don’t like as much about dynamic events is that, while many are memorable and important to the context of the map/region…they get very stale when repeated over and over. It doesn’t’ give you the sense that you made any change in that part of the world, whereas Hearts are done once – you’ve fixed the immediate issue plaguing that farmer or that community. Honestly, the only “events” in this game that I DO enjoy repeating on a single character are world bosses and dungeons. Dynamic events make no sense when done more than once.
Honestly, I’m not even arguing against dynamic events. We all get things in this game that we can choose to do based on our game style preferences. No need to be at each other’s throats just because we all prefer different things! Some people here are incredibly antagonistic and don’t like to accept other people’s opinions… -sigh-
Not really the case. Let’s take fighting bandits or centaurs in a heart area. After you kill them they’re still ALL there. You fixed nothing. That’s why hearts are less immersive than events.
If I drive the centaurs away from a town in an event, sure they’ll eventually attack again but I’ve done something. If I kill seventeen centaurs and got my heart, the heart does disappear, but the centaurs don’t. If I’ve disarmed traps, they’re still there.
Nothing changes except that your heart disapppears. DEs affect the world in a persistent manner, hearts do not.
But then you have to have an event made to drive the centaurs away from the town. And during that time, there can’t really be anything BUT driving the centaurs away from the town. I also disagree with the guy above you saying ‘completing the heart solves the problem’ – No, it doesn’t. But what the heart DOES do is give you a reward for helping out with persistent problems in the area that are generally beneath the notice of an event, and provide more texture for the world.
Solo players cannot advance in the new content, and any decent publisher would disclose such a fundamental change prior to taking your money.
I did the whole story alone, and I do just fine in all the maps except DS alone, and no I don’t have ascended armor, at all.
The thing that I don’t like as much about dynamic events is that, while many are memorable and important to the context of the map/region…they get very stale when repeated over and over. It doesn’t’ give you the sense that you made any change in that part of the world, whereas Hearts are done once – you’ve fixed the immediate issue plaguing that farmer or that community. Honestly, the only “events” in this game that I DO enjoy repeating on a single character are world bosses and dungeons. Dynamic events make no sense when done more than once.
Honestly, I’m not even arguing against dynamic events. We all get things in this game that we can choose to do based on our game style preferences. No need to be at each other’s throats just because we all prefer different things! Some people here are incredibly antagonistic and don’t like to accept other people’s opinions… -sigh-
Not really the case. Let’s take fighting bandits or centaurs in a heart area. After you kill them they’re still ALL there. You fixed nothing. That’s why hearts are less immersive than events.
If I drive the centaurs away from a town in an event, sure they’ll eventually attack again but I’ve done something. If I kill seventeen centaurs and got my heart, the heart does disappear, but the centaurs don’t. If I’ve disarmed traps, they’re still there.
Nothing changes except that your heart disapppears. DEs affect the world in a persistent manner, hearts do not.
But then you have to have an event made to drive the centaurs away from the town. And during that time, there can’t really be anything BUT driving the centaurs away from the town. I also disagree with the guy above you saying ‘completing the heart solves the problem’ – No, it doesn’t. But what the heart DOES do is give you a reward for helping out with persistent problems in the area that are generally beneath the notice of an event, and provide more texture for the world.
It’s only persistent until you do it the first time. Then it’s not persistent anymore. Things that are persistent persist. Hearts do not. They evaporate.
If you’re leveling a new character and you complete a zone and return to that zone, hearts have virtually no influence on that character, on the world, on the story. They are gone. They’re complete. If hearts were repeatable, then indeed they would be persistent.
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
That is mostly your opinion, i do not agree with it, hearts i can turn up do it and then leave with my rewards at will, with the other i must either wait around for others (assuming in a populated zone) and then do it or move on and miss it till later “if” i decide i want to come back..
I’ve avoided heaps of events in hot, i choose to because i hate giant zergs or as mentioned i’m in a dead server 24/7 due to my timezone..
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
That is mostly your opinion, i do not agree with it, hearts i can turn up do it and then leave with my rewards at will, with the other i must either wait around for others (assuming in a populated zone) and then do it or move on and miss it till later “if” i decide i want to come back..
I’ve avoided heaps of events in hot, i choose to because i hate giant zergs or as mentioned i’m in a dead server 24/7 due to my timezone..
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
You’re saying hearts are better than dynamic events because you could solo them at any time.
I might point out you can stand in Lion’s Arch solo at any time, but it’s not better than a dynamic event. As for the rewards you get from the hearts, you might as well be standing in Lion’s Arch anyway, because it’s ain’t that much.
Jumping puzzles are great content because I can solo them at any time. Minigames then would be great content because you can jump in any time and you don’t need a group.
In my opinion this is just bad criteria for what makes something good or not so good content. Involving or not so involving content.
I could put a flower you could pick over and over again in a city and that would be content you could solo any time, but it wouldn’t be engaging content.
By you’re own admission you’re not such a good player, so we couldn’t really use you as a standard around which content should be made to solo, otherwise, many people better than you would be bored. In other words, a lowest common denominator must be set somewhere, probably around the low median, where most people can do something. You can’t create content around the outliers. Well you can. You’d just have a game with only the outliers playing it. It’s a bad business decision.
Just because you can do something at any time, and you can solo it doesn’t make it engaging content. It does make it convenient, though.
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
Awesome. I to can solo many Hot Events and do them any time, since they are so frequent. Furthermore, I can do them repeatedly, so … maybe HoT events are far superior content too.
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
That is mostly your opinion, i do not agree with it, hearts i can turn up do it and then leave with my rewards at will, with the other i must either wait around for others (assuming in a populated zone) and then do it or move on and miss it till later “if” i decide i want to come back..
I’ve avoided heaps of events in hot, i choose to because i hate giant zergs or as mentioned i’m in a dead server 24/7 due to my timezone..
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
You’re welcome to your opinion, but I really don’t see what you’re seeing in HoT. The only map that seems to fit your description is DS, where the entire cycle consists of 3 large groups of players moving down the lanes toward the conclusion. I’m personally not a fan of the event cycle on that map either.
However, the other HoT maps aren’t like that at all. Most of the events can be comfortably completed alone or in a small (2-3 player) group. Even some of the boss events. For instance, the wyvern bosses in VB actually appear to scale better for small groups than large, resulting in dead easy breakbars and a much cleaner, quicker kill if you show up with just a handful of players rather than an army.
Further, you don’t actually need to find a group. Unless the map is completely dead, chances are good that somebody nearby is heading toward the same event you’re working on. Just get started clearing enemies and usually within a minute or two others will arrive and join in.
Of course you can’t expect to complete the entire map meta this way, but that’s simply an unreasonable expectation. Events like the chak gerent are supposed to be map-wide participation events. They can’t be done solo or by small groups. You need lots of people and they need to coordinate somewhat.
If that isn’t your cup of tea, I still don’t see what’s stopping you from being mostly a solo player? It’s mostly how I play in HoT! I just head to TD or VB usually, because they offer steady loot for solo players in the form of airship cargo/chak caches. If I come across an event that seems worthwhile, I jump in. And then, if the map is sufficiently organized, I can get in on the meta when that comes around.
Sometimes I’ll run into a group working on events or someone trying to complete an HP and I’ll jump in on that, too. It really doesn’t seem like that bad a place to be a solo player to me. I think your issue may be one of skill – you can’t solo because you haven’t figured out how to survive and kill things effectively in the jungle.
Fix that and I think you’ll enjoy HoT a lot better. And again, I’m willing to help you with that any time you want to have a go at it. I do my best open-world HoT work on my daredevil, which I believe you said was one of the classes you were having trouble with.
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
That is mostly your opinion, i do not agree with it, hearts i can turn up do it and then leave with my rewards at will, with the other i must either wait around for others (assuming in a populated zone) and then do it or move on and miss it till later “if” i decide i want to come back..
I’ve avoided heaps of events in hot, i choose to because i hate giant zergs or as mentioned i’m in a dead server 24/7 due to my timezone..
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
You’re saying hearts are better than dynamic events because you could solo them at any time.
I might point out you can stand in Lion’s Arch solo at any time, but it’s not better than a dynamic event. As for the rewards you get from the hearts, you might as well be standing in Lion’s Arch anyway, because it’s ain’t that much.
Jumping puzzles are great content because I can solo them at any time. Minigames then would be great content because you can jump in any time and you don’t need a group.
In my opinion this is just bad criteria for what makes something good or not so good content. Involving or not so involving content.
I could put a flower you could pick over and over again in a city and that would be content you could solo any time, but it wouldn’t be engaging content.
By you’re own admission you’re not such a good player, so we couldn’t really use you as a standard around which content should be made to solo, otherwise, many people better than you would be bored. In other words, a lowest common denominator must be set somewhere, probably around the low median, where most people can do something. You can’t create content around the outliers. Well you can. You’d just have a game with only the outliers playing it. It’s a bad business decision.
Just because you can do something at any time, and you can solo it doesn’t make it engaging content. It does make it convenient, though.
Actually i’m a pretty good player i’m just tired of grind, prefer the solo aspects of mmorpgs and can’t be bothered to minmax, that said if i apply myself i can do all GW2 content and not bat an eyelid..
I just don’t enjoy it, Raids, fractals, wvw, pvp are all content i hate, i can do it all and do it ok, i just don’t want too..
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
That is mostly your opinion, i do not agree with it, hearts i can turn up do it and then leave with my rewards at will, with the other i must either wait around for others (assuming in a populated zone) and then do it or move on and miss it till later “if” i decide i want to come back..
I’ve avoided heaps of events in hot, i choose to because i hate giant zergs or as mentioned i’m in a dead server 24/7 due to my timezone..
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
You’re welcome to your opinion, but I really don’t see what you’re seeing in HoT. The only map that seems to fit your description is DS, where the entire cycle consists of 3 large groups of players moving down the lanes toward the conclusion. I’m personally not a fan of the event cycle on that map either.
However, the other HoT maps aren’t like that at all. Most of the events can be comfortably completed alone or in a small (2-3 player) group. Even some of the boss events. For instance, the wyvern bosses in VB actually appear to scale better for small groups than large, resulting in dead easy breakbars and a much cleaner, quicker kill if you show up with just a handful of players rather than an army.
Further, you don’t actually need to find a group. Unless the map is completely dead, chances are good that somebody nearby is heading toward the same event you’re working on. Just get started clearing enemies and usually within a minute or two others will arrive and join in.
Of course you can’t expect to complete the entire map meta this way, but that’s simply an unreasonable expectation. Events like the chak gerent are supposed to be map-wide participation events. They can’t be done solo or by small groups. You need lots of people and they need to coordinate somewhat.
If that isn’t your cup of tea, I still don’t see what’s stopping you from being mostly a solo player? It’s mostly how I play in HoT! I just head to TD or VB usually, because they offer steady loot for solo players in the form of airship cargo/chak caches. If I come across an event that seems worthwhile, I jump in. And then, if the map is sufficiently organized, I can get in on the meta when that comes around.
Sometimes I’ll run into a group working on events or someone trying to complete an HP and I’ll jump in on that, too. It really doesn’t seem like that bad a place to be a solo player to me. I think your issue may be one of skill – you can’t solo because you haven’t figured out how to survive and kill things effectively in the jungle.
Fix that and I think you’ll enjoy HoT a lot better. And again, I’m willing to help you with that any time you want to have a go at it. I do my best open-world HoT work on my daredevil, which I believe you said was one of the classes you were having trouble with.
Hot for me is full of cheap kitten designed to screw you at every turn, its not challenge its annoyance, the creatures have annoying skills designed to kill you for playing solo.. the mushrooms, frogs, raptors all of hot doesn’t let you enjoy yourself there, its all designed to kill you in cheap ways.
Thats not fun, its not worth playing imo.
(edited by Dante.1508)
Hot for me is full of cheap kitten designed to screw you at every turn, its not challenge its annoyance, the creatures have annoying skills designed to kill you for playing solo.. the mushrooms, frogs, raptors all of hot doesn’t let you enjoy yourself there, its all designed to kill you in cheap ways.
Thats not fun, its not worth playing imo.
We’ve been through this. You just need to learn how to fight these things. If you ignore their abilities and don’t employ strategy, you’re going to have a tough time.
You aren’t the first player to enter HoT and fall flat on his face. I did. Admittedly, HoT is my first experience with GW2, so when I reached the jungle it was also my first character to 80. But in my opinion, even veteran players were probably surprised by HoT. The core game doesn’t prepare you very well for it.
Initially, I felt lost and my character felt weak. If I could even find the next waypoint, I’d die several times trying to reach it. But I quickly began to recognize why I was dying and adapted my strategy to compensate. These enemies are not impossible, but they require that you understand the mechanics and adapt your strategies to them.
Finally decided to stop raiding wow and try HoT out in gw2. As a long time GW fan I am finding the content soloable in a sense of progressing my story. Events and a few points mastery points on the map are unsoloable for my skill. Im not really into trying to solo champions. But i have made it through 7ish missions without doing much more then killing jungle mobs for exp.
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
That is mostly your opinion, i do not agree with it, hearts i can turn up do it and then leave with my rewards at will, with the other i must either wait around for others (assuming in a populated zone) and then do it or move on and miss it till later “if” i decide i want to come back..
I’ve avoided heaps of events in hot, i choose to because i hate giant zergs or as mentioned i’m in a dead server 24/7 due to my timezone..
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
You’re saying hearts are better than dynamic events because you could solo them at any time.
I might point out you can stand in Lion’s Arch solo at any time, but it’s not better than a dynamic event. As for the rewards you get from the hearts, you might as well be standing in Lion’s Arch anyway, because it’s ain’t that much.
Jumping puzzles are great content because I can solo them at any time. Minigames then would be great content because you can jump in any time and you don’t need a group.
In my opinion this is just bad criteria for what makes something good or not so good content. Involving or not so involving content.
I could put a flower you could pick over and over again in a city and that would be content you could solo any time, but it wouldn’t be engaging content.
By you’re own admission you’re not such a good player, so we couldn’t really use you as a standard around which content should be made to solo, otherwise, many people better than you would be bored. In other words, a lowest common denominator must be set somewhere, probably around the low median, where most people can do something. You can’t create content around the outliers. Well you can. You’d just have a game with only the outliers playing it. It’s a bad business decision.
Just because you can do something at any time, and you can solo it doesn’t make it engaging content. It does make it convenient, though.
Actually i’m a pretty good player i’m just tired of grind, prefer the solo aspects of mmorpgs and can’t be bothered to minmax, that said if i apply myself i can do all GW2 content and not bat an eyelid..
I just don’t enjoy it, Raids, fractals, wvw, pvp are all content i hate, i can do it all and do it ok, i just don’t want too..
That is a VERY trivial difference, if a difference at all. The meta events are ALSO telling you what’s going on in that area of the world and also rewards you for just being around in the area at the time the event occurs. How the heart manages to give something context, but the event does not isn’t clear from your explanation. If anything, if the heart gives context, it’s fleeting at best … you complete the heart and then you’re like “OK, next”. It’s very unlikely there is some memorable heart because of content. The most memorable ones are the ones that are frustrating to do, not because they have unique, challenging or interesting activities linked to them.
Actually, there are a few memorable hearts I can think of: Smacking Oozes with signs in Metrica Province and catching booze in Snowden Drifts come to mind instantly. Oh yeah – and the main Ebonhawke quest heart (Arguing with Separatists, tearing down propaganda, and invading homes looking for terrorists). I also have all the Plains of Ashford hearts memorized, and most of the Diessa Plateau ones. But that’s because I have 10 Charr characters that have 100% completion of those zones.
A whole few? Wow … out of hundreds. The point is moot anyways … Events are as if not more memorable because of how often they are done and how they tie into the game story, unlike feeding rabbits, picking apples or trivial crap like that. If your point is that more memorable = more meaningful, Events got hearts over a barrel.
One i do solo in my own time, the other is a group thing i’ll miss if i don’t do it immediately..
See, that’s a pretty disingenuous statement to me. Events are not so infrequent that you miss them if you blink. I recognize that hearts you do on your terms, but to imply that Events are something that is illusive to you because you didn’t jump on them ‘immediately’ is ridiculous, ESPECIALLY the ones in HoT, which last for numerous minutes, in fact, more minutes than any casual person wanting to do them would need to go to get there and get them done.
The only real factor there that differentiates those events from hearts is awareness, which is a function of the player, not the game. Therefore, the real problem here is that if for whatever reason, you are picky about the exact kind of events you are willing to do, then YES, you have a problem with Events compared to hearts.
It’s pretty obvious to me why Anet didn’t include hearts in HoT … because they don’t need filler content. Events are non-stop in most of the zones and lots of them are chains, so even if you don’t get the first one, you can get the second, thrid , etc… hearts would have been a waste in HoT where you literally can almost not avoid encountering events.
That is mostly your opinion, i do not agree with it, hearts i can turn up do it and then leave with my rewards at will, with the other i must either wait around for others (assuming in a populated zone) and then do it or move on and miss it till later “if” i decide i want to come back..
I’ve avoided heaps of events in hot, i choose to because i hate giant zergs or as mentioned i’m in a dead server 24/7 due to my timezone..
Honestly hearts were far superior content because i can solo them, i can do them at anytime, and i can play the game on my terms not some other persons terms..
You’re welcome to your opinion, but I really don’t see what you’re seeing in HoT. The only map that seems to fit your description is DS, where the entire cycle consists of 3 large groups of players moving down the lanes toward the conclusion. I’m personally not a fan of the event cycle on that map either.
However, the other HoT maps aren’t like that at all. Most of the events can be comfortably completed alone or in a small (2-3 player) group. Even some of the boss events. For instance, the wyvern bosses in VB actually appear to scale better for small groups than large, resulting in dead easy breakbars and a much cleaner, quicker kill if you show up with just a handful of players rather than an army.
Further, you don’t actually need to find a group. Unless the map is completely dead, chances are good that somebody nearby is heading toward the same event you’re working on. Just get started clearing enemies and usually within a minute or two others will arrive and join in.
Of course you can’t expect to complete the entire map meta this way, but that’s simply an unreasonable expectation. Events like the chak gerent are supposed to be map-wide participation events. They can’t be done solo or by small groups. You need lots of people and they need to coordinate somewhat.
If that isn’t your cup of tea, I still don’t see what’s stopping you from being mostly a solo player? It’s mostly how I play in HoT! I just head to TD or VB usually, because they offer steady loot for solo players in the form of airship cargo/chak caches. If I come across an event that seems worthwhile, I jump in. And then, if the map is sufficiently organized, I can get in on the meta when that comes around.
Sometimes I’ll run into a group working on events or someone trying to complete an HP and I’ll jump in on that, too. It really doesn’t seem like that bad a place to be a solo player to me. I think your issue may be one of skill – you can’t solo because you haven’t figured out how to survive and kill things effectively in the jungle.
Fix that and I think you’ll enjoy HoT a lot better. And again, I’m willing to help you with that any time you want to have a go at it. I do my best open-world HoT work on my daredevil, which I believe you said was one of the classes you were having trouble with.
Hot for me is full of cheap kitten designed to screw you at every turn, its not challenge its annoyance, the creatures have annoying skills designed to kill you for playing solo.. the mushrooms, frogs, raptors all of hot doesn’t let you enjoy yourself there, its all designed to kill you in cheap ways.
Thats not fun, its not worth playing imo.
You’ve had offers from several players to show you around the jungle and from what I can tell, you’ve refused. You’ve had advice from plenty of players on how to stay alive and it appears you’ve ignored that too. At some point, if you’re intellectually honest, you have to admit that you’re more interested in complaining than actually improving.
The good news is, it’s never too late to change. Try the builds/utils people recommend, study the techniques of the jungle critters, let Vayne or whoever play with you and watch what they do. If you do all that and still don’t enjoy it, at least you’ll know you gave it your best shot.
If you click his name and look at his last few posts, he has been leaving/left for the first couple of pages and seems to only come on here to complain about a game he isn’t playing any more. Any post that says HoT ruined the game, is too hard, can’t be soloed.. all over them. Offers of help.. not interested.
Thank you very much for the offer its very kind, but i haven’t logged in since honestly, i moved on to less tedious games.
On hearts — I find them annoying when playing with people, can’t help, often can’t even see their progress. Was doing one with someone the other day, I have world complete, he has to throw grenades at bees.. would just be nice when partied to see the other persons quest/progress/map imho.
On what this topic is all about.. took my ele round TD. Mostly solo. Map complete in an hour or so. Had mmorpg-life map and dulfy open on a second monitor. Removes the frustration factor and puts the fun back into running around.
If you click his name and look at his last few posts, he has been leaving/left for the first couple of pages and seems to only come on here to complain about a game he isn’t playing any more. Any post that says HoT ruined the game, is too hard, can’t be soloed.. all over them. Offers of help.. not interested.
Thank you very much for the offer its very kind, but i haven’t logged in since honestly, i moved on to less tedious games.
On hearts — I find them annoying when playing with people, can’t help, often can’t even see their progress. Was doing one with someone the other day, I have world complete, he has to throw grenades at bees.. would just be nice when partied to see the other persons quest/progress/map imho.
On what this topic is all about.. took my ele round TD. Mostly solo. Map complete in an hour or so. Had mmorpg-life map and dulfy open on a second monitor. Removes the frustration factor and puts the fun back into running around.
If you’re partied with someone you can always see their heart progress. Just mouse over the heart on their portrait in the party window. It tells exactly what percent of the heart they have done.
No I know that, as long as you are stood in really close proximity you see it. I wandered off to get the iron that was dotted around. A few feet away and I had no idea if the heart was being progressed or not as I couldn’t see their heart.
Maybe I’m mis-remembering, I’d need to check when I got home. My impression was that it was limited by proximity.
It would also be nice to see the other players map completion. If we were instanced I’d expect to see the other players story/world/etc, I’ve always felt partying up with people could tap into that, even if you were in the open world.
No I know that, as long as you are stood in really close proximity you see it. I wandered off to get the iron that was dotted around. A few feet away and I had no idea if the heart was being progressed or not as I couldn’t see their heart.
Maybe I’m mis-remembering, I’d need to check when I got home. My impression was that it was limited by proximity.
It would also be nice to see the other players map completion. If we were instanced I’d expect to see the other players story/world/etc, I’ve always felt partying up with people could tap into that, even if you were in the open world.
Oh yeah you’re probably right about that. If you’re out of the area, you wouldn’t see their heart.
I will say this as a general statement and exit. I have anxiety panic disorder so not having friends or family in real life to turn too is Fact, and not having friends or a guild to turn too in game, or the ability to just join a random group was avoidable. By not keeping the world content difficulty level the same for people who mentally cannot be in groups, was a pretty big slap in the face. The difficulty level being raised in the Fracts, raids and dungeons would have been/should have been enough for the elites who needed the bar raised.
Your condition sounds extreme, but the reality is that no game caters to specific individuals. That content that appeals to you is still present in the game. Anet can’t expect to continue to appeal the lowest common denominator, thinking that since anyone can do it, it will have the widest market appeal. That’s not how things work.
I will say this as a general statement and exit. I have anxiety panic disorder so not having friends or family in real life to turn too is Fact, and not having friends or a guild to turn too in game, or the ability to just join a random group was avoidable. By not keeping the world content difficulty level the same for people who mentally cannot be in groups, was a pretty big slap in the face. The difficulty level being raised in the Fracts, raids and dungeons would have been/should have been enough for the elites who needed the bar raised.
You’re right. The general world content in HoT should have been the same as it always was for GW2. The maps we have in HoT now should have been optional raid content – they’re great for that, but they’re terrible “expansion” content for original GW2, as they are nothing like original GW2.
Sadly, the niche of folks who like WoW raid level content are also the same kind of people who enjoy being “Forum Warriors” (people who delight in telling everyone who doesn’t feel the same as they do how wrong they are). Normal players don’t often come to forums at all, so forums disproportionately represent niche players and when game companies don’t comprehend this, expansions like HoT are made.
For the record, I bought HoT for everything other than the new maps, because the new maps aren’t the type of content I play this game for. And, I only bought it when it went on sale, because the price was far too high for the content that was delivered.
I will say this as a general statement and exit. I have anxiety panic disorder so not having friends or family in real life to turn too is Fact, and not having friends or a guild to turn too in game, or the ability to just join a random group was avoidable. By not keeping the world content difficulty level the same for people who mentally cannot be in groups, was a pretty big slap in the face. The difficulty level being raised in the Fracts, raids and dungeons would have been/should have been enough for the elites who needed the bar raised.
You’re right. The general world content in HoT should have been the same as it always was for GW2. The maps we have in HoT now should have been optional raid content – they’re great for that, but they’re terrible “expansion” content for original GW2, as they are nothing like original GW2.
Sadly, the niche of folks who like WoW raid level content are also the same kind of people who enjoy being “Forum Warriors” (people who delight in telling everyone who doesn’t feel the same as they do how wrong they are). Normal players don’t often come to forums at all, so forums disproportionately represent niche players and when game companies don’t comprehend this, expansions like HoT are made.
For the record, I bought HoT for everything other than the new maps, because the new maps aren’t the type of content I play this game for. And, I only bought it when it went on sale, because the price was far too high for the content that was delivered.
This borders on hyperbole. I don’t like raids. I haven’t beaten a raid. I don’t enjoy raids, but I love the HoT maps.
Comparing HoT maps to raid difficulty is just way off base in my opinion.
It’s like saying this is too hard for me and raids are too hard for me therefore they’re l;ike raids.
Which is like saying My dad is taller than me, and my house is taller than me, so my dad is as tall as a house.
Raids require coordination and practice on a level far beyond HoT. HoT is not as hard as some people are making it out to be.
DS is empty because everyone is on one or two maps and to get on those you have to join their squads a while before the meta. DS is just one big meta event.
I will say this as a general statement and exit. I have anxiety panic disorder so not having friends or family in real life to turn too is Fact, and not having friends or a guild to turn too in game, or the ability to just join a random group was avoidable. By not keeping the world content difficulty level the same for people who mentally cannot be in groups, was a pretty big slap in the face. The difficulty level being raised in the Fracts, raids and dungeons would have been/should have been enough for the elites who needed the bar raised.
You’re right. The general world content in HoT should have been the same as it always was for GW2. The maps we have in HoT now should have been optional raid content – they’re great for that, but they’re terrible “expansion” content for original GW2, as they are nothing like original GW2.
Sadly, the niche of folks who like WoW raid level content are also the same kind of people who enjoy being “Forum Warriors” (people who delight in telling everyone who doesn’t feel the same as they do how wrong they are). Normal players don’t often come to forums at all, so forums disproportionately represent niche players and when game companies don’t comprehend this, expansions like HoT are made.
For the record, I bought HoT for everything other than the new maps, because the new maps aren’t the type of content I play this game for. And, I only bought it when it went on sale, because the price was far too high for the content that was delivered.
This borders on hyperbole. I don’t like raids. I haven’t beaten a raid. I don’t enjoy raids, but I love the HoT maps.
Comparing HoT maps to raid difficulty is just way off base in my opinion.
It’s like saying this is too hard for me and raids are too hard for me therefore they’re l;ike raids.
Which is like saying My dad is taller than me, and my house is taller than me, so my dad is as tall as a house.
Raids require coordination and practice on a level far beyond HoT. HoT is not as hard as some people are making it out to be.
yup 100% agree here too. Historically i have enjoyed very hard demanding raids that require weeks if not months of 60 + attempts per week on a single boss, now I cannot be bothered with that gamestyle. I have dabbled with raids in HOT and they are similar to any other mmo’s typical difficult raids, and far far more difficult that HOT zone content. I also get that players still enjoy this style of raiding, and they should get content too as long as its not to expensive to make.
HOT zones however I do enjoy BECAUSE it is more difficult to solo, I still farm the place and can destroy everything i come across easily, but at the same time i will die if i make mistakes, whereas in a low level zone there’s just no risk at all, you can face roll naked if you want to. Sometimes I want the latter, sometimes i want HOT – choice is good.
Here is something to consider for those that think that HOT zones are too difficult:
1. A mmorpg cannot balance a zone to be the perfect skill level to all people at the same time, that is impossible. If 2 people are fighting a monster the monster cannot have 2 skills and sets of stats at the same time. You cannot preemptively evaluate a players skill level prior to combat, and even if you could the first point still applies.
2. The most effective approach is to balance to match the average skill level.
3. The evidence to prove point 2 is that the majority of the player base should be able to complete the given content and skill level eventually.
it is absolutely clear that HOT is not ‘too difficult’
(edited by vesica tempestas.1563)
1. A mmorpg cannot balance a zone to be the perfect skill level to all people at the same time, that is impossible. If 2 people are fighting a monster the monster cannot have 2 skills and sets of stats at the same time. You cannot preemptively evaluate a players skill level prior to combat, and even if you could the first point still applies.
2. The most effective approach is to balance to match the average skill level.
3. The evidence to prove point 2 is that the majority of the player base should be able to complete the given content and skill level eventually.
Which is why most MMOs balance their solo content for the most casual players, essentially at a Queensdale difficulty level, and in the end, there’s always vertical progression to further trivialize it. Without vertical progression, those who can’t handle it will eventually leave, and that wall will only get higher over time. ArenaNet has always wanted to be the more challenging niche however, as they’re for the gamers, not the majority, so only time will tell which direction they end up taking.
HoT will likely get nerfed however, not because it’s too challenging, but simply because zerg maps are not sustainable, though they could delay it by going F2P. For comparison, the Silverwastes was nerfed.
whereas in a low level zone there’s just no risk at all, you can face roll naked if you want to.
The trick with sub-80 areas is that downscaling is like playing the game on easy mode, as you’ll deal more damage and take less. You should always be at least 1 level below your target, preferably 5 in general. If you want to see a risk early on, try the Ancient Elemental Fire Energy hero challenge while solo and at the intended level, though I always get around to it level 9~11. Unless you’re expecting it, you’ll likely get facerolled by it.
GW has never used vertical progression, instead it gives you a large set of [horizontal] tools and rightly assumes over time people will learn ways of beating any content using those tools – which we have seen with all GW content to date (excluding Raids ofc – different design goal) agree with sub 80 zones, its the trivial content part of the map, Hot and others scale from there.
I will say this as a general statement and exit. I have anxiety panic disorder so not having friends or family in real life to turn too is Fact, and not having friends or a guild to turn too in game, or the ability to just join a random group was avoidable. By not keeping the world content difficulty level the same for people who mentally cannot be in groups, was a pretty big slap in the face. The difficulty level being raised in the Fracts, raids and dungeons would have been/should have been enough for the elites who needed the bar raised.
I’m glad you’re here to tell me what should have been enough for me, but I don’t spend much time in raids and dungeons. I do enjoy fractals, but I’ve spent the vast majority of my time in open world and absolutely love the HoT maps. Didn’t really like core Tyria. Too easy. So there’s that.
I will say this as a general statement and exit. I have anxiety panic disorder so not having friends or family in real life to turn too is Fact, and not having friends or a guild to turn too in game, or the ability to just join a random group was avoidable. By not keeping the world content difficulty level the same for people who mentally cannot be in groups, was a pretty big slap in the face. The difficulty level being raised in the Fracts, raids and dungeons would have been/should have been enough for the elites who needed the bar raised.
And for people with anxiety panic disorders maybe a mmo game aint the best fit.
May I suggest a single player game like for example dragon age?
Just like to say again, open maps should be open and explorable not gated.
Stick as many jump puzzles and (insert whatever here) behind gates as much as you want if it doesn’t affect MAP COMPLETION or gaining a Ranger/ Druid whatever pet..
Can I complete so and so jump puzzle?
Probably not as I don’t like them and don’t have the patience or time to spend hours on them for a chest full of crap.
I already have to jump through hoops ( literally in some cases) for even the basic achievements in the game.
(Don’t get me started on the Lions Arch Karka shooting)
Yeah, wait for night time for a door to open then do a jump puzzle and it’s in the bag…
Of course you have six hours to waste on the one thing..
Isn’t this supposed to be fun?
Explorable should be just that. I had no time limits or needed a massive amount of players to get around Queensdale or any of the other core maps.
Why now?
Just like to say again, open maps should be open and explorable not gated.
Stick as many jump puzzles and (insert whatever here) behind gates as much as you want if it doesn’t affect MAP COMPLETION or gaining a Ranger/ Druid whatever pet..
Can I complete so and so jump puzzle?
Probably not as I don’t like them and don’t have the patience or time to spend hours on them for a chest full of crap.
I already have to jump through hoops ( literally in some cases) for even the basic achievements in the game.
(Don’t get me started on the Lions Arch Karka shooting)
Yeah, wait for night time for a door to open then do a jump puzzle and it’s in the bag…
Of course you have six hours to waste on the one thing..
Isn’t this supposed to be fun?
Explorable should be just that. I had no time limits or needed a massive amount of players to get around Queensdale or any of the other core maps.
Why now?
I was in Orr today with a new guildie, who was trying to complete Cursed Shore. The temple of Grenth was under risen control and one of the hero points he couldn’t commune with because it was surrounded by poison. Tried laying down a healing spring for him, but he still couldn’t commune.
Until the temple was taken, he couldn’t commune with that point no matter what we did and the temple event wasn’t up.
We had to wait for the temple event to get up. I popped a tag, I got people there, and we finally took back the temple. Then he was able to get that hero point (not the one in the temple of grenth but the one on the north side of the same island).
This game has always had stuff gated by events. It’s just been so long most people don’t remember.
Just like to say again, open maps should be open and explorable not gated.
Stick as many jump puzzles and (insert whatever here) behind gates as much as you want if it doesn’t affect MAP COMPLETION or gaining a Ranger/ Druid whatever pet..
Can I complete so and so jump puzzle?
Probably not as I don’t like them and don’t have the patience or time to spend hours on them for a chest full of crap.
I already have to jump through hoops ( literally in some cases) for even the basic achievements in the game.
(Don’t get me started on the Lions Arch Karka shooting)
Yeah, wait for night time for a door to open then do a jump puzzle and it’s in the bag…
Of course you have six hours to waste on the one thing..
Isn’t this supposed to be fun?
Explorable should be just that. I had no time limits or needed a massive amount of players to get around Queensdale or any of the other core maps.
Why now?I was in Orr today with a new guildie, who was trying to complete Cursed Shore. The temple of Grenth was under risen control and one of the hero points he couldn’t commune with because it was surrounded by poison. Tried laying down a healing spring for him, but he still couldn’t commune.
Until the temple was taken, he couldn’t commune with that point no matter what we did and the temple event wasn’t up.
We had to wait for the temple event to get up. I popped a tag, I got people there, and we finally took back the temple. Then he was able to get that hero point (not the one in the temple of grenth but the one on the north side of the same island).
This game has always had stuff gated by events. It’s just been so long most people don’t remember.
If this comes up again, you can commune at that HC even if the poison field is up if you move all the way up against the back wall. That puts you just out of the poison field. You’d have to wait for the poison to run its course because the damage ticks are what breaks the commune. Haven’t tried it in a while, but it worked last summer, so unless ANet increased the size of the effect … At least it would be worth a shot.
If you want an example of a core HC that cannot be gotten if a temple is in the Risen’s hands, you’d be better to use the Melandru HC on the plain just north of the Grenth Temple. If that briar effect is up … well, I haven’t found a way around it, anyway.
If you want an example of a core HC that cannot be gotten if a temple is in the Risen’s hands, you’d be better to use the Melandru HC on the plain just north of the Grenth Temple. If that briar effect is up … well, I haven’t found a way around it, anyway.
You get that one using Stealth.
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