Guild Wars 2

Some (or alot?) people might know the competitive mode from Guild Wars 1: Heroes Ascent (HA). It was a 8v8 competitive mode for guilds and organisized teams to get famous and honor.

After a team was able to survive all instances of HA, they joined into HoH (Hall of Heroes). HoH was the last arena and there were 3-ways fights: 8v8v8.

I wish that A-Net would add that gamemode into Gw2 aswell. For me is 5v5 pvp like “solo q” pvp…like Random Arena (RA)(4v4) of Guild Wars 1. I know it’s pretty odd to compare Gw1 with Gw2, but more (or better) competitive in PvP would be nice for everyone!

What do you think about?

Videos about HA/HoH:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPPQE91urwo (HA)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OJATFoC05X4 (HA)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CdnvT2by9II (HoH)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JB3kvbrwCE (HoH)

By far the best pvp arena they put out. Had a great observer mode camera, rewarded balanced builds, and had a title track and rewards that were grindable while still favoring the highly skilled teams.

I love Gw1. I put in hundreds of hours into that game. I think the reason why a lot of people consider the PvP in Gw1 better than Gw2, is because the game’s focus was always about PvP. The PvE (as you know) was basically a single player campaign, that you had the option to play through with other people, that you met in the lobbies/towns.

I remember years ago, people complaining about the PvE in Gw1, saying they wanted a living, breathing world, where they can see other players running around, instead of it being instanced.

The devs listened to the criticisms of the PvE side of the game, so with Gw2, focused on making it more MMORPG like. With the inclusion of WvW, this obviously means they’ve had to focus on doing lots of things with the game, rather than focusing on making a PvP based game, like the original game was.

It’s a shame, because I too liked the PvP in Gw1 more than in Gw2. Gw2 has an amazing combat system, but the PvP we have, just isn’t as fun as the different modes in Gw1. Also Ritualist is hands down my favourite class. It became my main in Gw1 when Factions came out. Also remember getting to choose secondary classes for your characters? That was great and allowed you to have such diverse builds.

I feel the developers have tried to do too much with Gw2, I mean we only recently got Guild Halls, which you’d expect to be in from launch, given that the game is called “Guild Wars”. It feels like the whole guild part of the game, was better done in Gw1 to me.

I’d love to get some more PvP love, and make it great. Gw2 PvP feels quite…… lackluster compared to the original game. Alliance Battles, Heroes Ascent…we need more PvP options like that. We’ve been stuck with Conquest for quite some time. Granted we had Deathmatch/Courtyard for a time.

Faux Play.6104:

By far the best pvp arena they put out. Had a great observer mode camera, rewarded balanced builds, and had a title track and rewards that were grindable while still favoring the highly skilled teams.

THIS

When they develop a new expansion, hopefully they’ll add something like HA. PvP needs fresh wind.
Alliance battles…yea, that was cool That could be added too, for leveling the guild level and for a fraction (Tyria vs. Zaitan … )

HA cant work because there is no such thing as a frontline, midline or backline in this game to have different game modes, everyone is just a hybrid running around. Unfortunately, I think only conquest works based on how they made the classes. (which is fine for pve, sucks for pvp)

My opinion how to fix the 5vs5 pvp ranked games, adding karma system just like in Counter Strike:GO ESEA
ofc u can abuse the system true but that just tells the community is toxic then.
after the season all karma resets

The Karma System is a method of community self-policing, and is primarily based on users ranking their experience with players in-game. Users start with a neutral (0) karma level, and that level is affected by the following actions.

Positive Karma:
If the majority of teammates rate their experience with you as positive, you receive +1 Karma for that pug.
Negative Karma:
If the majority of teammates rate their experience with you as negative, you receive -1 Karma for that pug.
Leaving a pug (-1, -2, -4, -8, increases with each pug leave)

Be a good teammate and you’ll earn your +Karma, be a troll and you’ll find yourself in Karma Cleanup faster than you’d think! Remember, every pug you play is a potential addition or subtraction to your Karma level, however if your teammates rank you neutrally, then you will receive neither positive or negative Karma for that pug.

Based on your Karma level, your interaction with the community both in-game and on the website will be affected in the following ways.

XGhoul.7426:

HA cant work because there is no such thing as a frontline, midline or backline in this game to have different game modes, everyone is just a hybrid running around. Unfortunately, I think only conquest works based on how they made the classes. (which is fine for pve, sucks for pvp)

That’s actually a good point. The classes in Gw2 were designed to be able do everything, rather than given a certain role, whereas in Gw1, each of the classes had a role, like healer, tank, dps etc

Zynt.5769:

XGhoul.7426:

HA cant work because there is no such thing as a frontline, midline or backline in this game to have different game modes, everyone is just a hybrid running around. Unfortunately, I think only conquest works based on how they made the classes. (which is fine for pve, sucks for pvp)

That’s actually a good point. The classes in Gw2 were designed to be able do everything, rather than given a certain role, whereas in Gw1, each of the classes had a role, like healer, tank, dps etc

the difference would be the player Determins his role in the group by his set up rather than class that is all.

if a team comp is set up in a way there will be a frontline/mid/back line fighters but obviously 1 of the mid line fighters would have to be CC>interruptions to help defend the high damage back line .

the systems just not as clear as gw1 as those classes forced those roles upon you.

the Heroes Ascent system is still viable in gw2 because its 8v8 where you’d need a Balanced team comp to cope with 5vs8’s durning dead spawns or moving between locations which could enforce more Extreme roles determinded by the players/teams choices rather than the classes chosen.

I’d love to see a New heroes ascent brought to gw2 , it’ll blow the doors off anything and everything gw2 pvp is about.

courtyard was just too small , it could of done with a 3rd level walk way and a bridge over the top of the center courtyard so the fighting didn’t alway converge in the middle.

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

Zynt.5769:

XGhoul.7426:

HA cant work because there is no such thing as a frontline, midline or backline in this game to have different game modes, everyone is just a hybrid running around. Unfortunately, I think only conquest works based on how they made the classes. (which is fine for pve, sucks for pvp)

That’s actually a good point. The classes in Gw2 were designed to be able do everything, rather than given a certain role, whereas in Gw1, each of the classes had a role, like healer, tank, dps etc

the difference would be the player Determins his role in the group by his set up rather than class that is all.

if a team comp is set up in a way there will be a frontline/mid/back line fighters but obviously 1 of the mid line fighters would have to be CC>interruptions to help defend the high damage back line .

the systems just not as clear as gw1 as those classes forced those roles upon you.

the Heroes Ascent system is still viable in gw2 because its 8v8 where you’d need a Balanced team comp to cope with 5vs8’s durning dead spawns or moving between locations which could enforce more Extreme roles determinded by the players/teams choices rather than the classes chosen.

I’d love to see a New heroes ascent brought to gw2 , it’ll blow the doors off anything and everything gw2 pvp is about.

courtyard was just too small , it could of done with a 3rd level walk way and a bridge over the top of the center courtyard so the fighting didn’t alway converge in the middle.

It would be amazing if they did make a Heroes Ascent for Gw2. I was actually really surprised that there wasn’t anything like it in the game, when Gw2 launched.

Considering PvP was the big draw for Guild Wars, you’d think they’d have put more things into the PvP side.

XGhoul.7426:

HA cant work because there is no such thing as a frontline, midline or backline in this game to have different game modes, everyone is just a hybrid running around. Unfortunately, I think only conquest works based on how they made the classes. (which is fine for pve, sucks for pvp)

Ofc there are frontliner and backliner. The midliner would be like “focus party”. Go into WvW, follow a Zerg and you can see that roles
But who says that we need frontliner, backliner or something else in HA? Those roles became Meta in Gw1 because it was effective. People will make their own Meta in HA for Gw2, too.

SaXiar.2198:

XGhoul.7426:

HA cant work because there is no such thing as a frontline, midline or backline in this game to have different game modes, everyone is just a hybrid running around. Unfortunately, I think only conquest works based on how they made the classes. (which is fine for pve, sucks for pvp)

Ofc there are frontliner and backliner. The midliner would be like “focus party”. Go into WvW, follow a Zerg and you can see that roles
But who says that we need frontliner, backliner or something else in HA? Those roles became Meta in Gw1 because it was effective. People will make their own Meta in HA for Gw2, too.

That’s being optimistic, deathmatch wont work in this game, capture the flag won’t either, my biggest gripe playing this game is that they picked the most hated game mode in gw1 (capture points) and made it the main game mode for this game (conquest). To say there wasn’t a legitimate role system in guildwars 1 is being delusional, exceptional midline (interrupt mesmers) or backline (healers) became known based on their skill to shut down 8 other players, that doesn’t happen in this game.

GW2 had 8v8 sPvP once. They removed it because reasons.

GW1 had healers, front mid & backline, not everyone could just run in and zergwtfpwnaoespaminstakill so it’s simply (and unfortunately) not possible to put the game modes that were in GW1 into GW2. This game is not as slow & tactical. It’s more of a braindead spammy light show xD

XGhoul.7426:

HA cant work because there is no such thing as a frontline, midline or backline in this game to have different game modes, everyone is just a hybrid running around. Unfortunately, I think only conquest works based on how they made the classes. (which is fine for pve, sucks for pvp)

It really depends on the number of players involved. I think deathmatch works fine in this game on the 2-3 player scale where every individual skill matters, as well as on a 10+ scale where roles become more dedicated. The 5-8 player region is where it breaks down to a chaotic, uninteresting mess.

A HA structure for 12-15s could be pretty god kitten incredible.

HA won’t come back, mainly because of how lopsided the balance is and hybrid classes. You can see it now with leagues where teams can go 50-0 without any issues. In GW1 one slip-up could cost you the HoH streak. In this game, 1 slip up is a slap on the wrist.

You could actually see ANET gearing toward more of a PVE direction with each expansion release in GW1.

GW2 PvP was an after thought and I doubt anyone at ANET will tell us why.
- There was and STILL is no Guild vs Guild
- Hybrid classes, so team comps were sub-par in comparison to gw1
- Rank emotions were given to everybody under the sun including pve players.
- No HoH, and although they did have tournament play, they removed it.

ANET missed its mark not once but twice. GW2 took forever to release, and when it did the pvp was a joke. At the same time esports was starting to truly rise. If they had taken the GW2 combat mechanics, and the same class system as well as game types from GW1. This game would be thriving on levels ANET could only dream of.

I dont see how many of the map mechanics from HA will ever work in gw2. IE; Antechamber.
Thieves will be absolutly crazy in this map.
Without actual healers (Im not counting cleric eles), the whole point of a Ghostly goes away aswell.
On maps like Fetid River where the “Balanced” setup (2 warriors, ranger, mes ele prot fuse and Rt/N) was so prominent on dp’ing out the enemy team in order to prevail, it just wont work unfortunatly. I do however would love to see some of the maps used as conquest. Such as the Burial Mounds.
I’d love to see an enhanced version of forgotten shrines to be a 5 point conquest map for unranked at some point.

Let’s say, the number XvX is debatable. It can be 5v5, 8v8 or 12v12 for example.
But a gamemode of PvP like that would bring in new fresh air at all – even with hybrid classes, or ?

In the end, HA/HoH wasn’t the arena when the best of best fight each other, but rather who can survive all instances. Ofc, if there are 1 super strong team and alot weaker teams, then the super strong team would win always HoH.
It was designed for organisized/GvG teams, not for randoms :P

This ^^ 10 thumbs up , if Anet want to reuse HoH or HA the maps will be vastly different to conquest or stronghold and things can be done or made so Classes Abilities can’t abuse a map or the maps don’t favour too many classes at one time.

i still beleive its possible for 8v8s or 12vs12’s to be useful , i know most of the Target skills are 5vs5 but if the map has enough focused locations like one area needs consistant defence you’d get 6 at most on that location leaving 2 other players on point scoring or capping ect you can say good bye to those two players trying to fight 1vs2 with where the 1 has 2-4 npcs also defending , it’ll ether be a drag or a long drawn out fight which needs mesmers/thiefs fast moving builds to quickly Move and bomb then back to defence , just like the role of LB ranger in gw1 to pew pew from a ranged location offering offense support between shrines maybe dumping a spirit on shrines between movements for added support for defenders while you support else where.

it’s totaly a gvg/team game mode .

also if anet expand the pvp system to include HA/HoH lets say if your team wins a tornament in conquest mode , your team gets the rights to enter into the HoH League/ swiss tournament at the end of the year after the conquest tournaments.

people will start with 5man teams then by winning a tournament they can have 5-8 on the bench they will never be short of players to fill the gaps in a 8vs8 HA/HoH , it also gives the teams the choice for conquest tournaments to sub out a player on the 5man team and bring in a benched player rather than Swapping classes.

it adds depth to the Pvp tournaments just like football/basketball or any sports event , could even hold back your best player or players as a trump card till the 2nd match ect.

push on the top ^^