Guild Wars 2

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Define a lot of damage? Even full glass in sPvP it is almost impossible to see anything over 4-5k unless your fighting glass cannons, in which case that is their fault. Why in gods name is this even being discussed? yes lets nerf the only viable one hand weapon mesmer has since scepter is crap. Also, lol at being hit with blurred frenzy in the first place, ileap (instigator for BF) is so telegraphed and bugged it is sad.

I feel like nobody is able to read today… let me try it again.

“Well, you are already invulnerable and deal a lot of damage. What else do you want for a 10 second CD? The root sucks but it doesn’t hurt too much since the enemy can’t do anything to you (except for repositioning). And like I said before, the damage is not the problem. The 2 second Distortion on a 10 second CD is the problem.”

I don’t care about the damage. It could be twice as much damage and I still wouldn’t care. It. is. about. Distortion.

Lawl, no I can’t read past all the crying. The distortion is fine as it is, it makes up for the fact we are rooted and are a light class kitten If distortion is nerfed, evade on ranger should be nerfed, evade from thief should be nerfed and anything else that grants a certain type of “invul” should be nerfed as well. Flawed argument is flawed. sPvP forum is full of crybabies, no wonder I don’t come here.

Totally understand the “crybaby” argument there. Maybe I should have thought about that before. The off-topic talk makes that even more clear.

Honestly, if you expect a proper answer you should read and write properly as well.

Point proven. Whining for the sake of whining. Let’s nerf all things.

jportell.2197:

Wow no just no…. Mesmer has plenty long CDS on the majority of skills other classes get multiple evades in weapon sets and setting up a blurred frenzy combo takes timing and terrain awareness.

Mesmer Sword: 2 second evade on 10s CD, traitable to reduce CD to 8s (Adept Major). Best evade rate on weapon 25% (not including dodge rolls)
Ranger Sword: 1/2 second evade on an 8 second CD (6.5 traited), and 3/4 of a second evade on a 15s CD (12s traited). Trait is a Master Major giving the best evade rate as 14%.
If you add in dagger offhand and offhand training (20 pt major but shared in the same slow as sword training so its now a 30pt trait) you get an additional 1+1/4 dodge on an 8s CD (traited) which adds to just under 30%. But since taking dagger is rare at best, it should be viewed as untraited which is just over 26%.

Talking about sheer mathematical numbers these two would seem similar, however there are two major differences between them. Blurred frenzy does about more base tooltip damage (808 vs 638) than all of the rangers combined, however 2 of the ranger dodges come with poison (16s approx). The largest factor is that ranger’s evades is split up amongst 3 abilities which gives them greater ability to dodge on queue. Sources > Duration for more than just conditions.

There are things that are imbalanced on mesmer but I do not think blurred frenzy is one of them. Perhaps some form of weapon based stun break on a 10s CD that also allows porting up terrain. cough

jportell.2197:

And how many really high damage skills do mesmers have that don’t require a target? How many utility skills offer us invulnerability? How many movement skills do we have in our weapons? How about for escaping a fight? Even necros can out run us or catch us… What about evades on our weapons as far as weapon movement goes we have 2 that’s it

Not every class has high damage no target abilities, if you are talking about a thief in stealth randomly stabbing the air… I am not exactly sure how this factors into anything. You have invulnerabilities on your class abilities (F4), stealth in traits and utilities, and on an elite. Weapons have phase retreat (10s CD) swiftness on focus offhand, utility skill blink.

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Define a lot of damage? Even full glass in sPvP it is almost impossible to see anything over 4-5k unless your fighting glass cannons, in which case that is their fault. Why in gods name is this even being discussed? yes lets nerf the only viable one hand weapon mesmer has since scepter is crap. Also, lol at being hit with blurred frenzy in the first place, ileap (instigator for BF) is so telegraphed and bugged it is sad.

I feel like nobody is able to read today… let me try it again.

“Well, you are already invulnerable and deal a lot of damage. What else do you want for a 10 second CD? The root sucks but it doesn’t hurt too much since the enemy can’t do anything to you (except for repositioning). And like I said before, the damage is not the problem. The 2 second Distortion on a 10 second CD is the problem.”

I don’t care about the damage. It could be twice as much damage and I still wouldn’t care. It. is. about. Distortion.

Lawl, no I can’t read past all the crying. The distortion is fine as it is, it makes up for the fact we are rooted and are a light class kitten If distortion is nerfed, evade on ranger should be nerfed, evade from thief should be nerfed and anything else that grants a certain type of “invul” should be nerfed as well. Flawed argument is flawed. sPvP forum is full of crybabies, no wonder I don’t come here.

Totally understand the “crybaby” argument there. Maybe I should have thought about that before. The off-topic talk makes that even more clear.

Honestly, if you expect a proper answer you should read and write properly as well.

Point proven. Whining for the sake of whining. Let’s nerf all things.

Why are you still commenting? We are all crybabies and have no idea how a balanced skill should look like. That’s all you need to say to sum up your last few answers.

@OP
To sum it up:
Yes, the skill needs a slight nerf when it comes to Distortion or CD. Either reduce the Distortion uptime or increase the CD. I would prefer to reduce the uptime since the damage is ok. I have faith in Anet in this case.

And an S/d ranger has what a total of 3/5 evasion skills? The shortest c/d on SB is 20s if that? And just FYI I think the ele RTL nerf in this patch was unnecessary. People are so p/od about mesmer invuln but I gaurantee you if ANet gave us the mobility of a D/d ele even post nerf with their boon uptime we wouldn’t care if b/f went bye bye. If our shatters hit for as much as warrior AA we wouldn’t care. But currently blurred is our only real option for defense in melee since we don’t have access to protection in melee range

Blurred frenzy is one of those skills that is currently maximum reward for 0 risk. With its cooldown and the fact it can be so easily executed out of illusionary leap means pretty much every mesmer runs the sword as a weapon set.

Those 2 second of evasion has so much going for it you can pretty much spam this whenever its off cooldown and never get punished for it if you can dodge,teleport,stealth away. As an offensive tool, its more or less the mesmer’s version of 100 blades with a built in immunity button – this is probably a skill a warrior should have had rather then a mesmer, who really doesn’t need it due to the fact they practically have everything going for them in their favor.

My suggestion is to tone it down as a defensive tool, to stop people mindlessly spamming it to avoid damage. It should receive a penalty for this and rewarded if it hits. So something like this

‘Blurred Frenzy’, 10 sec cooldown -
If it strikes a foe, 10 sec cooldown. If it does not strike a foe or if your not hit in melee range, cooldown is 50% longer (15 secs).

So a nerf similar to ride the lightning for ele’s is how I can see this skill being more balanced. Also the shatter skills should be locked out while this move is being done.

And I still believe, that putting Blurred Frenzy on Offhand-Sword would solve alot of problems.

Currently mainhand sword + focus or pistol allows for everything.
Invul, CC, a good phantasm, one of the longest immobilize uptimes on a weaponskill.

Putting it on offhand-sword basically gives you the choice, of:

1. Getting a pull
2. Getting a ranged stun
3. Getting melee invul

It isn’t like the block is bad. Hell, against bad players the actual burst can become even better. I blocked a Ele once for 6k damage.

Once again what other real defensive skills do mesmers have in their weapons? And if you increase the CD YOU screw over a shatter mes without any compensation. Its ridiculous how much this class has been nerfed to satisfy the kittening QQ. And to the person saying that mesmers are the only ones with instant cast abilities…. Gaurdian shouts… Cantrips/auras on eles…. etc etc all are instant cast… and that is just to name a few.

And no the blocks aren’t bad but they are offensive mainly because they only block one just ONE attack… Which in this button mashing game doesn’t count for much unless its killshot or churning earth.

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Define a lot of damage? Even full glass in sPvP it is almost impossible to see anything over 4-5k unless your fighting glass cannons, in which case that is their fault. Why in gods name is this even being discussed? yes lets nerf the only viable one hand weapon mesmer has since scepter is crap. Also, lol at being hit with blurred frenzy in the first place, ileap (instigator for BF) is so telegraphed and bugged it is sad.

I feel like nobody is able to read today… let me try it again.

“Well, you are already invulnerable and deal a lot of damage. What else do you want for a 10 second CD? The root sucks but it doesn’t hurt too much since the enemy can’t do anything to you (except for repositioning). And like I said before, the damage is not the problem. The 2 second Distortion on a 10 second CD is the problem.”

I don’t care about the damage. It could be twice as much damage and I still wouldn’t care. It. is. about. Distortion.

Lawl, no I can’t read past all the crying. The distortion is fine as it is, it makes up for the fact we are rooted and are a light class kitten If distortion is nerfed, evade on ranger should be nerfed, evade from thief should be nerfed and anything else that grants a certain type of “invul” should be nerfed as well. Flawed argument is flawed. sPvP forum is full of crybabies, no wonder I don’t come here.

Totally understand the “crybaby” argument there. Maybe I should have thought about that before. The off-topic talk makes that even more clear.

Honestly, if you expect a proper answer you should read and write properly as well.

Point proven. Whining for the sake of whining. Let’s nerf all things.

Why are you still commenting? We are all crybabies and have no idea how a balanced skill should look like. That’s all you need to say to sum up your last few answers.

@OP
To sum it up:
Yes, the skill needs a slight nerf when it comes to Distortion or CD. Either reduce the Distortion uptime or increase the CD. I would prefer to reduce the uptime since the damage is ok. I have faith in Anet in this case.

You really don’t get it do you? It does not need a nerf. Plain and simple. I really hope anet doesn’t buy into all this QQ.

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Blackhat.4016:

Archer.1658:

Define a lot of damage? Even full glass in sPvP it is almost impossible to see anything over 4-5k unless your fighting glass cannons, in which case that is their fault. Why in gods name is this even being discussed? yes lets nerf the only viable one hand weapon mesmer has since scepter is crap. Also, lol at being hit with blurred frenzy in the first place, ileap (instigator for BF) is so telegraphed and bugged it is sad.

I feel like nobody is able to read today… let me try it again.

“Well, you are already invulnerable and deal a lot of damage. What else do you want for a 10 second CD? The root sucks but it doesn’t hurt too much since the enemy can’t do anything to you (except for repositioning). And like I said before, the damage is not the problem. The 2 second Distortion on a 10 second CD is the problem.”

I don’t care about the damage. It could be twice as much damage and I still wouldn’t care. It. is. about. Distortion.

Lawl, no I can’t read past all the crying. The distortion is fine as it is, it makes up for the fact we are rooted and are a light class kitten If distortion is nerfed, evade on ranger should be nerfed, evade from thief should be nerfed and anything else that grants a certain type of “invul” should be nerfed as well. Flawed argument is flawed. sPvP forum is full of crybabies, no wonder I don’t come here.

Totally understand the “crybaby” argument there. Maybe I should have thought about that before. The off-topic talk makes that even more clear.

Honestly, if you expect a proper answer you should read and write properly as well.

Point proven. Whining for the sake of whining. Let’s nerf all things.

Why are you still commenting? We are all crybabies and have no idea how a balanced skill should look like. That’s all you need to say to sum up your last few answers.

@OP
To sum it up:
Yes, the skill needs a slight nerf when it comes to Distortion or CD. Either reduce the Distortion uptime or increase the CD. I would prefer to reduce the uptime since the damage is ok. I have faith in Anet in this case.

You really don’t get it do you? It does not need a nerf. Plain and simple. I really hope anet doesn’t buy into all this QQ.

The reason no one will listen is because they just say “MESMER OP NERF NERF NERF!” I had hope for this community at one point 6-7 months ago…. But now if they lose its because something is OP and needs nerfed… Not because they messed something up in the fight or they weren’t built right.

The combination of root + teleport + blurred frenzy + shatter + phantasms needs to be nerfed.

Wreck.2634:

The combination of root + teleport + blurred frenzy + shatter + phantasms needs to be nerfed.

So just remove mesmers from the game because players aren’t good? yes lets do that makes perfect kittening sense.

The rotation is on too short of a cd to rinse and repeat. It leaves no counterplay.

@jportell you are sounding way to defensive through this thread for anyone to take you seriously I am a mesmer player myself so chill. It needs to happen.

Wreck.2634:

@jportell you are sounding way to defensive through this thread for anyone to take you seriously I am a mesmer player myself so chill. It needs to happen.

Because I am sick of kitten like this happening to a class that has seen way more than its fair share of nerfs… Unlike d/d eles (yes they can run the 0/10/0/30/30 build and be very damaging) Mesmer cannot have tons of healing plus good damage we get one or the other not both ever. We get absolutely NO other evades in a sword/x set up… and to the person that said “oh just switch it to OH” that pretty much forces Mesmer to run S/S if they want to use a MH sword because then the Mesmer is pretty much saying just kill me with iLeap and swap otherwise. I would LOVE for blurred frenzy to do 100B damage. Remove the freaking invuln for all I care after that… The fact is for a melee Mesmer to even have a prayer of holding up against this condition happy artards running around pvp lately blurred frenzy is necessary and if the cooldown was any longer (15s as people suggest here) the MH sword would be essentially useless for Mesmer because by the time they swap back to it its still on CD so the Mesmer can just run around in circles saying “im hereee come kill me” And I said before I do not use the sword right now. Not because I don’t like it but because it doesn’t work with the build I am running right now…

Wreck.2634:

The rotation is on too short of a cd to rinse and repeat. It leaves no counterplay.

It leaves plenty of counterplay lmao, I never get caught in blurred frenzy because I use a movement skill or a condi removal, simple as that. The whole point of a shatter build is being bursty with as much speed as possible. I don’t believe you know anything about mesmer.

Psychogene.6780:

Blurred frenzy is one of those skills that is currently maximum reward for 0 risk. With its cooldown and the fact it can be so easily executed out of illusionary leap means pretty much every mesmer runs the sword as a weapon set.

Those 2 second of evasion has so much going for it you can pretty much spam this whenever its off cooldown and never get punished for it if you can dodge,teleport,stealth away. As an offensive tool, its more or less the mesmer’s version of 100 blades with a built in immunity button – this is probably a skill a warrior should have had rather then a mesmer, who really doesn’t need it due to the fact they practically have everything going for them in their favor.

My suggestion is to tone it down as a defensive tool, to stop people mindlessly spamming it to avoid damage. It should receive a penalty for this and rewarded if it hits. So something like this

‘Blurred Frenzy’, 10 sec cooldown -
If it strikes a foe, 10 sec cooldown. If it does not strike a foe or if your not hit in melee range, cooldown is 50% longer (15 secs).

So a nerf similar to ride the lightning for ele’s is how I can see this skill being more balanced. Also the shatter skills should be locked out while this move is being done.

People run the sword because it’s the only mainhand weapon that is not garbage.

A lot of people would love to run a scepter or even maybe a primary staff setup, but both weapons fail horribly as offensive tools. The staff is used purely for the defense — it’s autoattack is one of the worst in the game and Chaos Storm is absolutely awful as an aoe.

Scepter just has nothing good.

The mesmer’s setup is quite limited — condition builds don’t work because of the random condition application, which causes very slow condition ramp up (and vulnerability application is useless for condition specs — the phantasm won’t even hit hard anyways on rabid gear).

So you’re left with either phantasms or shatter. Phantasms don’t work in teamfights because phantasms and illusions are pretty much 2-3 shot — casual aoe will wipe them out easily. So you have shatter as the only viable spec, and worst of all is the fact that their utilities are redundant and phantasm utilities and mimickry and thievery and mantras are just inferior versions of null field and feedback and decoy/blink/MI, and it’s not like you have the option of not running portal.

Using the greatsword on the mesmer pretty much makes you a train target.

Mesmer signets are likely the worst signets in the game. Domination’s condition damage stat is absolutely horrendous (and condi spec for mesmer is terrible anyways), Inspiration’s passive is just really bad and only good with someone else around, and Signet of Illusions makes little difference in illusion survival — with the extra phantasm HP trait from inspiration and signet of illusions, my Illusionary Warden was still dying in 2 hits to a normal Frostgorge alpine wolf’s autoattacks.

Zenith.7301:

Mesmer signets are likely the worst signets in the game. Domination’s condition damage stat is absolutely horrendous (and condi spec for mesmer is terrible anyways), Inspiration’s passive is just really bad and only good with someone else around, and Signet of Illusions makes little difference in illusion survival — with the extra phantasm HP trait from inspiration and signet of illusions, my Illusionary Warden was still dying in 2 hits to a normal Frostgorge alpine wolf’s autoattacks.

I will disagree about signet. A traited Mesmer signet build is viable in spvp.

Due to problems with mesmer mobility and the recent distortion nerf. I can never dream of my joke build to be viable in tpvp

The skill is fine. Certain players have difficulty with the mesmer and look for excuses as to why they can’t win. I can’t count the times I’ve hit blurred frenzy too early only to have an opponent walk into it. :facepalm: These are the players who want skills nerfed.

The fact is that a sword mesmer can’t survive long in melee without it. Melee classes have too many gap closers, immobilizations, and stuns. Plus, they can put out too much damage in melee range. Without blurred frenzy, the mesmer’s mainhand sword would become useless because it would never want to be in melee range. First, it wouldn’t have any defense to survive there. Second, it wouldn’t deal any damage to make risking melee worthwhile. If blurred frenzy is nerfed, then every classes melee attacks should be at the same level of the mesmer’s autoattack. Any other argument would be incredulous.

Finally, other classes are not defenseless against it. While comparing blurred frenzy to 100B is a bit ridiculous because blurred frenzy does no where near as much damage, the same counters exist. The initial casting of iLeap is an obvious tell. If you miss that, then you have a second chance to avoid it by keeping your distance from the clone for 5 seconds (or kill it in one hit and then dodge roll away or vice versa). Finally, if you are immobilized, you can you whatever skills you use to get out of every other class’ immobilization. This is all assuming that the skill even worked, which about 50% of the time it doesn’t. So it is not fair to say that the mesmer’s iLeap+blurred frenzy is uncounterable. You have at least three options to avoid it. And if you can’t, it is not as devastating as 100B or getting insta-gibbed by an invisible thief.

People saying Swap is easy to detect are underestimating how disorienting it can be to deal with multiple illusions. The Swap flash in particular is very similar to shatter. Good players will still generally see it because of the initial Illusionary Leap cast, but calling it as obvious as Bull’s Charge is far-fetched.

DaShi.1368:

The skill is fine. Certain players have difficulty with the mesmer and look for excuses as to why they can’t win. I can’t count the times I’ve hit blurred frenzy too early only to have an opponent walk into it. :facepalm: These are the players who want skills nerfed.

The fact is that a sword mesmer can’t survive long in melee without it. Melee classes have too many gap closers, immobilizations, and stuns. Plus, they can put out too much damage in melee range. Without blurred frenzy, the mesmer’s mainhand sword would become useless because it would never want to be in melee range. First, it wouldn’t have any defense to survive there. Second, it wouldn’t deal any damage to make risking melee worthwhile. If blurred frenzy is nerfed, then every classes melee attacks should be at the same level of the mesmer’s autoattack. Any other argument would be incredulous.

Finally, other classes are not defenseless against it. While comparing blurred frenzy to 100B is a bit ridiculous because blurred frenzy does no where near as much damage, the same counters exist. The initial casting of iLeap is an obvious tell. If you miss that, then you have a second chance to avoid it by keeping your distance from the clone for 5 seconds (or kill it in one hit and then dodge roll away or vice versa). Finally, if you are immobilized, you can you whatever skills you use to get out of every other class’ immobilization. This is all assuming that the skill even worked, which about 50% of the time it doesn’t. So it is not fair to say that the mesmer’s iLeap+blurred frenzy is uncounterable. You have at least three options to avoid it. And if you can’t, it is not as devastating as 100B or getting insta-gibbed by an invisible thief.

This pretty much hits the nail on the head. While blurred frenzy is powerful, it’s also one of the only melee skills mesmers have that’s worthwhile (and also ridiculously easy to avoid/counter — look for a leap, dodge; or if you see “Invulnerable!” while you’re attacking that’s usually a big clue). Moreover, Illusionary Leap is quite possibly one of the buggiest gap closers in the game given that even the slightest alteration in terrain from point A to point B will prevent the leap from reaching its target.

It does not need a nerf. If anything, people should learn how to predict it and counter it (dodge, wait two seconds and continue attacking).

Lopez.7369:

People saying Swap is easy to detect are underestimating how disorienting it can be to deal with multiple illusions. The Swap flash in particular is very similar to shatter. Good players will still generally see it, but calling it as obvious as Bull’s Charge is far-fetched.

It may not be as obvious, but that hardly warrants a nerf (not implying you meant that, but just in general).

Of course. I think the Illusionary Leap and Blurred Frenzy combo is fine. The fact it’s different from the Bull’s Charge and Hundred Blades combo is good for the game. It’s what having different classes is all about. It’s cool warriors are easier to predict but do more damage, while mesmers are harder to predict but do less damage.

I think people just need more experience and patience with the ability to learn how to counter it.

Lopez.7369:

People saying Swap is easy to detect are underestimating how disorienting it can be to deal with multiple illusions. The Swap flash in particular is very similar to shatter. Good players will still generally see it because of the initial Illusionary Leap cast, but calling it as obvious as Bull’s Charge is far-fetched.

But you know that a Mesmer gerts a sign such as a boon when hr uses illu leap? So just wait for a purple kitten in his boon-bar and dodge… Seems like forum is full ppl w/o clue.
Mesmer is a light armor class that has access to almost no boon. Best is probably 5s prot all 15s… The heals and condi clear trait are ridiculous cuz to make them usefull you need deceptive evasion which is an offense trait. So we’re forced for offense atm. Now take the only deff. skill in the whole build from a light armor class in melee. byebye mesmerz

I’m a guardian since beta, never play a mesmer , but always PVP with my GF as a mesmer since beta (she never plays a Guardian either). We haven’t out winning each other yet, its a draw match.

I learned from my mistake. Mesmer skills are not OP at all. She taught me how to counter. Once you learned the cue, Mesmer will be downed in merely 5 secs if she is careless.

She learned from her mistake too, I taught her Guardian’s weakness. After that, I will be downed in 10 secs if im careless. In this case, Mesmer is not OP at all.

Conclusion? No, BF dont need a nerf. Its all about L2 kitten ue here.

GankSinatra.2653:

Nah its good that it makes the player choose between offense or defense, more skills should work like that. Also the cooldown seems fine.

But thats sort of the point isn’t it?

You don’t have to choose between defense and offence when you burst in complete immunity. Every handful fo seconds.

It doesn’t need a nerf. Swap is quite easy to escape/run away from using stun breaks or by simply dodge rolling away right when you see a clone leaping at you. Against really good players, I feel lucky to even land the full attack chain of Blurred Frenzy.

To OP, they should firstly remove its ability to block or evade trebuchet shots.

But given how mesmers already have a strong defensive skill on a low CD on the staff, and an overall easy access to invulnerability, you could easily tone this one down a bit, also because goes against the idea of putting oneself to danger when spiking. In that regard, it is rather similar to thieves being able to get a large chunk of their spike off while (still) in stealth.
At all those saying ‘it roots the mes/you can move away’… you know very well the mes will only use it offensively after a root or a stun, or another form of CC that renders the target unable to kite away.

Invulnerability should only work on Regular damage, Critical Hits should still land.

Psychogene.6780:

Blurred frenzy is one of those skills that is currently maximum reward for 0 risk. With its cooldown and the fact it can be so easily executed out of illusionary leap means pretty much every mesmer runs the sword as a weapon set.

Those 2 second of evasion has so much going for it you can pretty much spam this whenever its off cooldown and never get punished for it if you can dodge,teleport,stealth away. As an offensive tool, its more or less the mesmer’s version of 100 blades with a built in immunity button – this is probably a skill a warrior should have had rather then a mesmer, who really doesn’t need it due to the fact they practically have everything going for them in their favor.

My suggestion is to tone it down as a defensive tool, to stop people mindlessly spamming it to avoid damage. It should receive a penalty for this and rewarded if it hits. So something like this

‘Blurred Frenzy’, 10 sec cooldown -
If it strikes a foe, 10 sec cooldown. If it does not strike a foe or if your not hit in melee range, cooldown is 50% longer (15 secs).

So a nerf similar to ride the lightning for ele’s is how I can see this skill being more balanced. Also the shatter skills should be locked out while this move is being done.

I can guarantee you there are players in this game good enough to punish you extremely hard for spamming anything just because it’s off cooldown. They’ll dodge iLeap or MB and wait for the channel to end before smashing you in the face. And bar the fact that they’re both rooted channels 100b and BF have absolutely nothing in common. You can’t trait Blurred to proc Might on crit and the overall damage scaling between the two is worlds apart.

Personally I hope the RtL nerf gets reverted, it was a complete mistake and kitten a class hard for the sake of a few poorly-designed sPvP maps.

And ladies and gents, you don’t have to qualify everything you say with, “I play a Mesmer…” or “I’m a Mesmer player too, so […]”. If your opinions are sound and backed up by truth and knowledge, they’ll stand on their own.

Lopez.7369:

People saying Swap is easy to detect are underestimating how disorienting it can be to deal with multiple illusions. The Swap flash in particular is very similar to shatter. Good players will still generally see it because of the initial Illusionary Leap cast, but calling it as obvious as Bull’s Charge is far-fetched.

One of the best ways to spot iLeap is to watch the actual Mesmer. He’ll stick his arm out in a very pointed manner (illusions will never do this), it’s quite the distinctive animation.

The problem is not Blurred Frenzy. It is the broken piece of crap that is Illusionary Leap. It’s nearly impossible to telegraph, and most of the time doesn’t leap, but just appears right in your face. UNAVOIDABLE. Shimmerless there is nothing distinctive about the animation, especially on Asura, which most Mesmers seem to run. How can Warrior leaps be so slow and obvious, but Illusionary Leap is a super speed run/leap that pops up next to you and says HI IMMOBILIZESHATTERRRRRRR.

jportell.2197:

So just remove mesmers from the game because players aren’t good? yes lets do that makes perfect kittening sense.

Just saying, this is happening every couple of months since launch.

Player cry at something of the mes (regardless if actually OP, or only good/balanced) -> nerfed across the whole game due to spvp whiners.

Rinse and repeat.
TW portal phntasm CDs confusion shattered strenght….

Copenhagen.7015:

The problem is not Blurred Frenzy. It is the broken piece of crap that is Illusionary Leap. It’s nearly impossible to telegraph, and most of the time doesn’t leap, but just appears right in your face. UNAVOIDABLE. Shimmerless there is nothing distinctive about the animation, especially on Asura, which most Mesmers seem to run. How can Warrior leaps be so slow and obvious, but Illusionary Leap is a super speed run/leap that pops up next to you and says HI IMMOBILIZESHATTERRRRRRR.

Ha, well, I think a lot of Mesmers might agree with you that iLeap’s broken, but probably not in the same sense you’re implying…

I can’t say I’ve ever experienced the instant iLeap you’re describing, but I suppose it’s possible. The thing with Asura I take as more an issue with Asura in PvP generally.

Yes the skill is broken.
Remember that a lot of people trait this skill and reduce the cooldown to 8 seconds. This means that mesmers have access to a 2 second invulerability every 8 seconds, which means that you only have a window of 6 seconds to deal dmg. This gap can easily be closed by going invis, using distortion or blinking.

This skill is incredibly good, and i cannot think of any other weapon-skill with similar usefulness. The cooldown should be increased to 15 seconds and 12 when traited.

When that is fixed, Phase Retreat needs to either have an increased CD as well, or prererably not be a semi-breakstun.
The way Phase Retreat works now, is that it has a 5 sec cooldown traited and can be used while stunned and immobilized. Though you still remain stunned and immobilized, you will be moved which is good enough to avoid a burst.

If this does not scream broken to you, i am afraid that you might play a mesmer yourself. No other class has a break-stun on their weapon if I recall correctly.

Edit:
Actually guardians have a semi-breakstun as their 2nd ability on sword, which is very nice. But it has a 15 sec CD to 5, is NOT a leap-finisher and requires a target which makes it useless in 1v1s.

AndrewSX.3794:

jportell.2197:

So just remove mesmers from the game because players aren’t good? yes lets do that makes perfect kittening sense.

Just saying, this is happening every couple of months since launch.

Player cry at something of the mes (regardless if actually OP, or only good/balanced) -> nerfed across the whole game due to spvp whiners.

Rinse and repeat.
TW portal phntasm CDs confusion shattered strenght….

I know it is. I have seen it happen and go down hill since the shattered strength nerf… if the kittening devs want build diversity then they need to stop screwing over our viable builds… We have so many traits that deal with confusion. yet confusion damage isn’t that great… If they want confusion to be a spike damage condition then remove the barriers for damage that exist in sPvP and WvW. If they want it to be DOT then increase the base duration for all Mesmer skills and traits that apply confusion… Why not do this for engi you ask? Oh because they have blind/cripple/chill/bleed/burn/poison and so on… Mesmer have confusion and random good streaks with winds of chaos.

jportell.2197:

AndrewSX.3794:

jportell.2197:

So just remove mesmers from the game because players aren’t good? yes lets do that makes perfect kittening sense.

Just saying, this is happening every couple of months since launch.

Player cry at something of the mes (regardless if actually OP, or only good/balanced) -> nerfed across the whole game due to spvp whiners.

Rinse and repeat.
TW portal phntasm CDs confusion shattered strenght….

I know it is. I have seen it happen and go down hill since the shattered strength nerf… if the kittening devs want build diversity then they need to stop screwing over our viable builds… We have so many traits that deal with confusion. yet confusion damage isn’t that great… If they want confusion to be a spike damage condition then remove the barriers for damage that exist in sPvP and WvW. If they want it to be DOT then increase the base duration for all Mesmer skills and traits that apply confusion… Why not do this for engi you ask? Oh because they have blind/cripple/chill/bleed/burn/poison and so on… Mesmer have confusion and random good streaks with winds of chaos.

actually, engineers have been pig holed to a hgh condition build

they essential remove 100 nades from the from the game

beta events had a lot of nerfs to mesmers

portal, phastasm cd, choas storm, shatter strength, mind wreak, and tw

Ever occurred to you mesmers were simply too good to start with…? Especially when compared to certian other classes in regards to the skill/reward ratio.

This thread is basically a sum of completely random suggestions from people who know nothing about the mesmer and care even less about how balancing might ruin their play or not.

If you increase its cooldown, what will you expect sword’s mesmers to do? Auto-attack for most of the time? Move it out of sword, and you’re ruining what makes the mesmer’s mh sword so fun and unique for so many people.

Blurred Frenzy is perfect as it is, and the mesmer’s problems -which they exist- come from other sources. Blurred Frenzy is a skill designed for a squishy class to fight at melee range. The mesmers need it, and they need the low cooldown to be able to defend with it as well. It deals cool (rooted) damage for some immunity, but it is far from the most damaging skill there is, which makes it perfectly fair. For mesmers to deal serious burst damage, they’ll need a specific skill sequence and the aid of phantasms, mind wrack and traits.

Do mesmers have cheap – and I mean unfairly cheap, tricks? Yes, they do. But BF is not one of them. If you want to look for cheap stuff, look at their traits. Look at their illusionary persona grandmaster trait, that no matter how fun and creative of a trait it is for a mesmer’s player, it dumbs down the entire profession by allowing you to use distortion and diversion without an intelligent usage of clones. That very same trait that, in addition to making the class drastically easier to play, in addition to making some of their key skills easily available at no cost, it still allows them to burst higher with Mind Wrack. The mesmers don’t even have to choose between more options and stronger options: they get both in a single trait. Or, look at their clone generation per dodge trait, where mesmers can spam clones out of their kitten for no effort, and trivialize too the difficulty of playing with a mesmer.

Currently, the mesmer has two traits that are, pretty much, the equivalent of the thief’s heartseeker: they prepare the food for you, cook for you, and put it on the table for you. Mesmers might have no slots for condition removal, which creates against them a strong although niche counter. But once more balance changes come out and illusion of life stops becoming necessary, and once portal’s effect is spread towards other classes (which the devs have said they would do), and once stun breakers are spread through other utilities (which the devs have said they would do next), and mesmers get their opportunity to use a condition removal skill and become a truly unbeatable anti-profession duelist, the devs will have to look at those traits that dumb it down, and nerf, move them to higher tiers (the dodge one), or even divide them into two (illusionary persona).

And then, when that happens, people will realize that Blurred Frenzy is perfectly fine as it is for a squishy caster that has to play at melee range.

jportell.2197:

AndrewSX.3794:

jportell.2197:

So just remove mesmers from the game because players aren’t good? yes lets do that makes perfect kittening sense.

Just saying, this is happening every couple of months since launch.

Player cry at something of the mes (regardless if actually OP, or only good/balanced) -> nerfed across the whole game due to spvp whiners.

Rinse and repeat.
TW portal phntasm CDs confusion shattered strenght….

I know it is. I have seen it happen and go down hill since the shattered strength nerf… if the kittening devs want build diversity then they need to stop screwing over our viable builds… We have so many traits that deal with confusion. yet confusion damage isn’t that great… If they want confusion to be a spike damage condition then remove the barriers for damage that exist in sPvP and WvW. If they want it to be DOT then increase the base duration for all Mesmer skills and traits that apply confusion… Why not do this for engi you ask? Oh because they have blind/cripple/chill/bleed/burn/poison and so on… Mesmer have confusion and random good streaks with winds of chaos.

Soo… you are whining because they nerfed the nuclear holocaust shatter?

But you where happy when they erased 100 nades, right? And glass engies have no survivability, differently from mesmer glass cannons.

And is required much more skill to play against a mesmer in 1v1 than the skill required to actually play one.

But the problem stands: mesmers are an unbalanced class. I don’t mean Op. I mean that hey excel at doing specific tasks.

In team fights they aren’t more dangerous than other classes.

In 1v1, you’d have more chance defeating the main enemy in Slender.XD

redslion.9675:

jportell.2197:

AndrewSX.3794:

jportell.2197:

So just remove mesmers from the game because players aren’t good? yes lets do that makes perfect kittening sense.

Just saying, this is happening every couple of months since launch.

Player cry at something of the mes (regardless if actually OP, or only good/balanced) -> nerfed across the whole game due to spvp whiners.

Rinse and repeat.
TW portal phntasm CDs confusion shattered strenght….

I know it is. I have seen it happen and go down hill since the shattered strength nerf… if the kittening devs want build diversity then they need to stop screwing over our viable builds… We have so many traits that deal with confusion. yet confusion damage isn’t that great… If they want confusion to be a spike damage condition then remove the barriers for damage that exist in sPvP and WvW. If they want it to be DOT then increase the base duration for all Mesmer skills and traits that apply confusion… Why not do this for engi you ask? Oh because they have blind/cripple/chill/bleed/burn/poison and so on… Mesmer have confusion and random good streaks with winds of chaos.

Soo… you are whining because they nerfed the nuclear holocaust shatter?

Oh snaps! You can’t one-shot kill a bunker by rolling your finger on the keyboard anymore! How sad!

But you where happy when they erased 100 nades, right? And glass engies have no survivability, differently from mesmer glass cannons.

And is required much more skill to play against a mesmer in 1v1 than the skill required to actually play one.

But the problem stands: mesmers are an unbalanced class.

In team fights they aren’t more dangerous than other classes.

In 1v1, you’d have more chance defeating the main enemy in Slender.

Oh you mean the HGH build that has 20+ stacks of might most of the fight while having high toughness and vitality plus perma fury and retal? That build? Because as it stands yes that build is OP as all hell… And as far as 100 nades… I wasn’t terribly upset that it went bye bye but it was less of a pain in the kitten then HGH hands down… When mesmers could stack might that high it was wrecked… and as for the person that says everything else about the Mesmer is too good like DE and IP… Ipersona is essentially the only trait we have that is worth going 30 deep into…. if that wasn’t there mesmers would likely be one a lot less survivable and two run a 20/20/20/10 what ever build… our other grand master traits are just a sad…

Blurred frenzy is going to be here to stay as it is… if it was gonna be nerfed it would have gotten it long ago… and engies are still powerful as all hell even without HGH there are some nice tank builds out there… The only class that is really hurting is warrior but do I think they need helped by wrecking other classes specs? No… They need buffed. Plain and simple… And this whining and moaning about blurred frenzy… Since everyone and their mom here is going from personal experience I will say it… I GET HIT WITH BLURRED FRENZY MAYBE 2/10 TIMES…. illusionary leap is obvious and if a Mesmer throws out blurred frenzy before iLeap and swap then laugh and dodge… Seriously. I hate saying it but when it comes to this LEARN TO PLAY. Be aware… target the real Mesmer.. so on and so forth… Stop whining.

Terrormancer. Wheeee.

i think that blurred frenzy need nerf yes. if u put on ur weapon that energy sigil or whatever called, that gives u +50 % endurance when u change weapon every 10 sec. + f4 + 2 + dodge dodge dodge dodge + friggin illusion kitten or decoy or w/e and decent burst i certainly think It needs a nerf. and it was 8 sec if i remember right if it was traited?

KrisHQ.4719:

Yes the skill is broken.
Remember that a lot of people trait this skill and reduce the cooldown to 8 seconds. This means that mesmers have access to a 2 second invulerability every 8 seconds, which means that you only have a window of 6 seconds to deal dmg. This gap can easily be closed by going invis, using distortion or blinking..

And once we have used our invulnerability, what is left on this weapon? A week auto attack that requires melee range.
Since that auto attack is all we do have, what do we do? We swap weapons.
Once we do that we have a 10 sec cooldown before we can swap back again, so 2 seconds invulnerability every 8 seconds would only be true if the mesmer ran in circles doing nothing but auto attack until blurred frenzy came off cooldown again.
I don’t know of anyone that would claim, that was the best way to go about it.

To say that you won’t deal damage if we use decoy is faulty as well. Just because we pop into stealth doesn’t mean you can’t hit us.

Besides: If the cooldown was increased, there would be no point for us to weapon swap before the cooldown had reset, because what would be we weapon swapping to? A week auto attack only? A clone we can swap place with to hit you with said auto attack?

Blurred Frenzy too strong? I don’t know. I am still learning and I make many mistakes so I really cannot say. But to increase the cooldown would be an absolutely horrible solution for the reasons stated above.

I think I heard somewhere, that the developers are considering making it an evade instead of invulnerability though.

KrisHQ.4719:

When that is fixed, Phase Retreat needs to either have an increased CD as well, or prererably not be a semi-breakstun.
The way Phase Retreat works now, is that it has a 5 sec cooldown traited and can be used while stunned and immobilized. Though you still remain stunned and immobilized, you will be moved which is good enough to avoid a burst.

So you want a class that wear light armor to stand in melee range and take the full burst?
How would you expect a mesmer to survive that? Should a mesmer not have a counter for those situations?
Or is the point exactly, that even if a mesmer blows every single cd such as distortion and decoy and phase retreat within the first few seconds of the fight, then you think you should be able to kill him within those few seconds still?

From what I gather, you play a guardian, so obviously it is annoying for you in particular to come up against a class that will move away from you. That being said: If a mesmer don’t move out but stay in melee range, he will fall over very fast.

I play Necromancer.

Wish I had invulnerability on a 8 second CD.

I play Warrior.

Wish I had a pet. Nerf pets.

I play Elementalist.

Wish I had Warrior’s HP. Nerf Warrior’s HP.

I play Guardian.

Wish I had Thief’s burst. Nerf Thief’s burst.

Actually, I’m not really interested in nerfing Blurred Frenzy all that much, it’s not hard to deal with although it is annoying. I want to nerf Phantasms.

Mesmers dont react to the enemy, the enemy has to react to them.

I dont care that they’re strong 1v1. I’ve played one myself for a long time, and i know how simple it is, using the same combo on each kitten class, and hiding or using ridiculous utility/elite skills in the meantime. So i know what to avoid but its still a total stupid kitten class and to me it embodies the very failure of the pvp in this game. It all the dumb crap in this game rolled into one.

Erm, its a 2 second distort every 10 seconds with a class who can blink, stealth various ways and can dodge just like everyone else and use 2x sigils of energy, with clones that confuse you to knowing who the right target is. The toolkit they have is what makes it further OP. Itself, on say just about any other class it wouldn’t be so OP. Its the whole kit that makes it that way.

Blurred Frenzy should not auto-turn in the direction of your target.
eg you are dodging through the mesmer using bf and he just turns 180 WHILE still in his bf animation —> NO other skill does that.
Probably already said but this needs to be FIXED (fixed(!) not nerfed cause it’s not working as intended) asap.

I always thought it was weird that it was an invuln and not an evade, but that’s just me.

tarcheg.4872:

Blurred Frenzy should not auto-turn in the direction of your target.
eg you are dodging through the mesmer using bf and he just turns 180 WHILE still in his bf animation —> NO other skill does that.
Probably already said but this needs to be FIXED (fixed(!) not nerfed cause it’s not working as intended) asap.

Well you could just take a step backwards or dodge away from the mesmer? The result for the mesmer would be: miss, miss, miss. Since you know how it works, surely it is not hard to counter?
I have no idea if it is working as intented or not, but it sounds fairly easy to deal with once you know how it works?