Guild Wars 2

It’s probably already been said. Though, I think adding a debuff to the trait would be the way to go (if not completely rework it). I was thinking along the lines of “Take X% more direct damage while health is above 90%”

Looks like Necro needs to adapt to Dec. 10 the most. When you think about the typical 30/20/0/0/20 its not investing in any defensive attributes whatsoever through traits, and depending on conditions to survive.

I’m not a Necro main, but that doesn’t look like the kind of build that should be viable in 1v1 situations. Blood Magic is there for sustain, and Vitality is actually a really good stat for Necro, the only one that can actually get something out of it.

Necro mains gotta get their thinking caps on.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Yeh dat skill from healing PASSIVELY whilst they cast their skills will be epic. And it isnt a case of “debunk easily” – it is a case of 100% kill rate 1 on 1 an in team fights. Literally the hardest possible counter. They might as well give eles a skill called “Kill a necro within 1200 range”. You cant even stop them stomping by fearing from downed state. lol absurd

But passive ele healing/condi removal has been nerfed to the ground.. They would be running ether renewal.

If a team fight has only condi dps it deserves to be hard countered.. In the same way a team fight not running any condi removal would be hard countered.

And this is overlooking the fact that the build you’re describing is UP vs everything else.

Phaeton.9582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Yeh dat skill from healing PASSIVELY whilst they cast their skills will be epic. And it isnt a case of “debunk easily” – it is a case of 100% kill rate 1 on 1 an in team fights. Literally the hardest possible counter. They might as well give eles a skill called “Kill a necro within 1200 range”. You cant even stop them stomping by fearing from downed state. lol absurd

But passive ele healing/condi removal has been nerfed to the ground.. They would be running ether renewal.

If a team fight has only condi dps it deserves to be hard countered.. In the same way a team fight not running any condi removal would be hard countered.

And this is overlooking the fact that the build you’re describing is UP vs everything else.

No. A condi dps class deserves to be COUNTERED by people having condition removal. That is the logical conclusion of your statement. And that is already the case. It doesnt deserve to be countered by condition immunity because that isnt fun or skill based

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Yeh dat skill from healing PASSIVELY whilst they cast their skills will be epic. And it isnt a case of “debunk easily” – it is a case of 100% kill rate 1 on 1 an in team fights. Literally the hardest possible counter. They might as well give eles a skill called “Kill a necro within 1200 range”. You cant even stop them stomping by fearing from downed state. lol absurd

But passive ele healing/condi removal has been nerfed to the ground.. They would be running ether renewal.

If a team fight has only condi dps it deserves to be hard countered.. In the same way a team fight not running any condi removal would be hard countered.

And this is overlooking the fact that the build you’re describing is UP vs everything else.

No. A condi dps class deserves to be COUNTERED by people having condition removal. That is the logical conclusion of your statement. And that is already the case. It doesnt deserve to be countered by condition immunity because that isnt fun or skill based

But in a team fight vs a balanced comp this immunity is almost non existent.. Which takes us back to whether or not a glass condi build with no direct damage deserves a hard counter 1v1.

Phaeton.9582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Yeh dat skill from healing PASSIVELY whilst they cast their skills will be epic. And it isnt a case of “debunk easily” – it is a case of 100% kill rate 1 on 1 an in team fights. Literally the hardest possible counter. They might as well give eles a skill called “Kill a necro within 1200 range”. You cant even stop them stomping by fearing from downed state. lol absurd

But passive ele healing/condi removal has been nerfed to the ground.. They would be running ether renewal.

If a team fight has only condi dps it deserves to be hard countered.. In the same way a team fight not running any condi removal would be hard countered.

And this is overlooking the fact that the build you’re describing is UP vs everything else.

No. A condi dps class deserves to be COUNTERED by people having condition removal. That is the logical conclusion of your statement. And that is already the case. It doesnt deserve to be countered by condition immunity because that isnt fun or skill based

But in a team fight vs a balanced comp this immunity is almost non existent.. Which takes us back to whether or not a glass condi class with no direct damage deserves a hard counter 1v1.

No – because in a team fight this trait is still exceptional. And lame and no skilled. A condi class with no direct damage is all a necro can build. The class is designed around conditions and the necro weapons (except dagger) do not scale well with power. You should learn the game

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Yeh dat skill from healing PASSIVELY whilst they cast their skills will be epic. And it isnt a case of “debunk easily” – it is a case of 100% kill rate 1 on 1 an in team fights. Literally the hardest possible counter. They might as well give eles a skill called “Kill a necro within 1200 range”. You cant even stop them stomping by fearing from downed state. lol absurd

But passive ele healing/condi removal has been nerfed to the ground.. They would be running ether renewal.

If a team fight has only condi dps it deserves to be hard countered.. In the same way a team fight not running any condi removal would be hard countered.

And this is overlooking the fact that the build you’re describing is UP vs everything else.

No. A condi dps class deserves to be COUNTERED by people having condition removal. That is the logical conclusion of your statement. And that is already the case. It doesnt deserve to be countered by condition immunity because that isnt fun or skill based

But in a team fight vs a balanced comp this immunity is almost non existent.. Which takes us back to whether or not a glass condi class with no direct damage deserves a hard counter 1v1.

No – because in a team fight this trait is still exceptional. And lame and no skilled. A condi class with no direct damage is all a necro can build. The class is designed around conditions and the necro weapons (except dagger) do not scale well with power. You should learn the game

This simply isn’t true. Any coordinated burst will take this build down. An ele will swap to (rock solid) earth attunement once it has received pressure from a direct damage roamer (eg my role). A necro can then strip this and freecast, with their attempts to cleanse with ether renewal easily interrupted. That’s your role.

I have to learn this game so I can explain it to players like you.

Lordrosicky.5813:

No – because in a team fight this trait is still exceptional. And lame and no skilled. A condi class with no direct damage is all a necro can build. The class is designed around conditions and the necro weapons (except dagger) do not scale well with power. You should learn the game

While I’m also suspicious of full-immunity traits, calling everything “no skilled” is not a good argument. Ele will still be more difficult than necro to play 95% of the time.

My point is, complaining that a one-dimensional cookie cutter build will have trouble facing a “no skill” ele is kind of ridiculous. It will be an uneven matchup, but “no skill” is the incorrect term to use. Also, exaggerating things like “A condi class with no direct damage is all a necro can build” is not helping your argument either.

I’m being completely sincere. You’d find a lot of people would agree with you if you would just rephrase your arguments.

clint.5681:

Shar.3402:

Sensotix.4106:

mini.6018:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

Wintel.4873:

Holy knee-jerk reaction…clueless about Ele traits/builds much?

Diamond Skin is a 30-point Earth trait. EARTH. The condition damage tree. If you see an Ele with Diamond skin, they have already put themselves at a huge disadvantage against almost every meta build.

Currently there are NO decent builds involving 30 Earth because “condi ele” is something that barely exists. Necro and Engineer have superior condi application in every way. So you will still see most Ele’s going 30 Arcana + Air/Fire (burst) or Water (defensive).

What is wrong with people lol…

That is exactly what i was telling people when they introduced damage on boons trait on warriors but everybody has this ideea of 30/30/30/30/30 builds for all classes and they scream op op op op kitten(funny the screamers were mostly eles), even if in fact picking these traits actually means nerfing yourself.Just lol.I do hope however that they will qq as much about eles as they did about warriors.AGAIN and they will , the ammount of bad in players these days is “trough the roof”.

What are you on about dude. Yeh I am so bad. I couldnt find you on the leaderboards for team q but solo q you are 514th with a 59% win % over around 100 games. So you dont team q and have 100 games at a low level of solo q. Honestly, if you are so inexperienced/bad then why even post in balance threads? You cant have any understanding of the game. I dont go on fractals threads and tell them that a fractal boss is op cos I dont have a clue about it.

I loled .With an extra rofl.Not sure if serious whining about “can’t do 1k damage Anet omg” or “i’m a pro cuz i levderbvoards and stuff and you don’t”.

mini maybe because necro cant really bring an elementalist below that health line where he is actually affected by conditions…elementalists constantly heal themselves with their skill when using the signet…this might be okay in teamfights but in duels on sidenodes? hm maybe you should really think before you talk

then don’t send a rabid necro to duel a diamond skin elementalist on side node?

Those tactics are too advanced for some people, its better to complain on the forums before the change even comes out.

or maybe you have a necro on far because he could kill their bunker whatsoever or because you pushed with mes and nekro..
there are many situations
the point is a complete counter to some class should not exist in this game..also if you think i suck at tournys, tactics etc you might have a look at the leaderboard

Lordrosicky.5813:

Phaeton.9582:

Diamond skin rewards an overly demanding health management system, and raises the skill cap significantly (which most buffs don’t do). Having a matchup that a min maxed glass necro can’t debunk easily will not break the game.

Yeh dat skill from healing PASSIVELY whilst they cast their skills will be epic. And it isnt a case of “debunk easily” – it is a case of 100% kill rate 1 on 1 an in team fights. Literally the hardest possible counter. They might as well give eles a skill called “Kill a necro within 1200 range”. You cant even stop them stomping by fearing from downed state. lol absurd

duke some people dont understand it because they have never put a foot in pvp which is okay for me as long as they dont discuss pvp issues

Sensotix.4106:

duke some people dont understand it because they have never put a foot in pvp which is okay for me as long as they dont discuss pvp issues

As I’m collectively well over rank 60 tpvp and also currently top 50 team q EU, although I don’t claim this to be significant for various reasons, to accuse me of never setting foot inside the mists is unfair.

And my only encounter in team q with you on NA in the last fortnight ended with my side winning, jus sayin.

But yeah my analysis of ele post patch is fairly astute, primarily because I replicate post patch builds on classes (as best I can) when notes leak. I only ask you don’t be too dismissive of my suggestions.

Phaeton.9582:

Sensotix.4106:

duke some people dont understand it because they have never put a foot in pvp which is okay for me as long as they dont discuss pvp issues

As I’m collectively well over rank 60 tpvp and also currently top 50 team q EU, although I don’t claim this to be significant for various reasons, to accuse me of never setting foot inside the mists is unfair.

And my only encounter in team q with you on NA in the last fortnight ended with my side winning, jus sayin.

But yeah my analysis of ele post patch is fairly astute, primarily because I replicate post patch builds on classes (as best I can) when notes leak. I only ask you don’t be too dismissive of my suggestions.

i see your point but i hope we can both agree that 100% immunity and a 100% counter to a class should not exist..
concerning the match on na i was playing with 3 sec lagg unfortunately and i have never played with that team before also we were playing without any bunker

No worries.

In terms of ele balance, immunity (including condition cc) can be lame, however it’s a very dynamic immunity being subject to a small health pool.

As for hard counters to classes I agree completely, however hard counters to builds I’m not so sure about.

Between two balanced builds, one should never hard counter the other.
Some may argue that any build incapable of dealing 1.4k direct damage to an ele is imbalanced, and could warrant a hard counter. However that makes the real question whether there is a viable necro build that can achieve this (if your goal is to 1v1).

Having seen various condi builds manage this through DS and/or minions I thought it might be possible, but I could well be wrong.

Anything that changes this stale meta is good news to me, but maybe I’ll regret it.

Bottom line is:

Balance should consist of toning down aspects of the game that are excessive (condi spam) instead of introducing more excessive measures (immunity and hard counters) to “balance” them.

As long as ANet doesn’t get this concept, there will be ridiculous power creep and rock-paper-scissors/whack-a-mole style balance with every patch and every player will be shoehorned into the cheesiest meta build for their class in order to be even the least bit competitive.

I’m bumping this because dec 10th is coming and this kind of trait should not exist.

Please, change Diamond Skin and Automated Response.

ExaFlare.1390:

I’m bumping this because dec 10th is coming and this kind of trait should not exist.

Please, change Diamond Skin and Automated Response.

Espicially when combined with instant, ranged aoe skills lolnet

jimmyimo.2089:

This trait will be quite nice. At least you will no longer get every condition in the game * 25 within a second; it might take 5 seconds now. It will also prevent people from facerolling and requires them to actually time their keyboard slide skill bar.

So instead of dodging the condi burst and actually play, you think that sitting there and taking it while drinking some coffee is a good option?

Funny you say instant ranged AoE like its not something a Necro does all the time every single PvP match they log in to….

There’s no distinguishing animation that tells you what Mark he’s casting and the mark itself just pops up on the screen underneath you if they’re casting it in a teamfight. Marks are the dumbest casts in the game, but, granted, without them Condi Necro would be terribad

You can’t let a necro freely destroying your team, like you can’t let any damage dealing class without pressure. Of course it’s going to hurt if you let him do what he wants.

jmatb.6307:

Funny you say instant ranged AoE like its not something a Necro does all the time every single PvP match they log in to….

What bro? Necro has 1s cast time on all marks.

lollasaurus.1457:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Marcos.3690:

Lordrosicky.5813:

mini.6018:

@op.Anet should definetly go with this and preferrably make it an adept trait.Necros stop qq i have a tip for you.Your pets do 5k damage in one autoattack.Diamond skin would be funny on warriors though.A 30 k hp war is still just 3k damage you need to do.What you need to hit an ele with the insane ammount of ………
1000 DAMAGE to get them at 90% ? Hard to do i know with eles insane inate armor and necros highly telegraphed and obvious weapon skills.

Just 1 q.If you can, t do 10% damage on an ele how exactly are you dealing with engineers?

No, if you run a condition build you cant do 1k direct damage. It simply wont be possible. I cant kill an AR engi sitting there on 100 health an regen. Regen alone > my direct damage. And hybrid necro is horribly bad because scepter doesnt scale at all well with power stats outsies of scepter 3 which only does really when they have condis on them – which they wont.

So ye, you cant deal 10% damage. Rabid engis will be the same tbh.

And AR is not nearly as bad as this trait. At least with ar engis every build in the game has some chance of killing them but condi bombing them at 30% health. There will literally be no way a rabid build can even interract with such an ele. And tbh, same even for a carrion build on necro. They still wont be able to hurt the ele.

Like I said, the evidence is in this thread. A while back there was a thread about anet listening to the wrong players. It is time to see if that is truely still the case. You have experienced players lining up and saying this is a very very bad change to the game. And you have inexperienced players defending it for illogical reasons. This is such a simple thing for anet to see. I hope they dont kitten it up with this trait, which only effects pvp and not pve.

Sorry but a build that can’t deal 1k damage without condis is pure mindless spam and shouldn’t be playable in a serious game. Stop this nonsense thread.

Why is that the definition of mindless spam? That literally makes no sense whatsoever.

Im not saying that necro shouldnt be nerfed. It should be nerfed along with everything else. In fact atm it is probably 5th most powerful class in the game, as whilst it puts out big damage (in the right hands espicially) – it also actually dies and is really weak to the most powerful builds in the game.

5th most powerful class ahahaha

try 3th…just because warrior (Our number 1) counters necro…if not it would be second just because spirit ranger is more easy to play than necro..

ExaFlare.1390:

You can’t let a necro freely destroying your team, like you can’t let any damage dealing class without pressure. Of course it’s going to hurt if you let him do what he wants.

“bleurgh bleurgh bleurgh” sound reminding you the necro is around, and now you’re standing on kitten that’s all over the freakin point…always go for the necro first..kill him before he could spam all his stuff all over the place..pretty old rule..if you let them keep spamming you’re dead…same rule for nades engis..

That’s not how you said it.
But anyway, you can’t have automatic immunity to something in a game like this.

ExaFlare.1390:

That’s not how you said it.
But anyway, you can’t have automatic immunity to something in a game like this.

And automatic conditions on autoattacks are fine?
kitten please.

Kids want to hit the trigger freely whenever they want, when really Diamond Skin and the Warrior’s new heal will encourage players to be patient and wait on firing the gun.

“Thief, take off that Diamond Skin so I can explode the Ele with my condition barrage.”

“Done.”

As for the Warrior’s new heal, think stealth but visible. Any class with stealth currently has the same effect as this new heal; when players stealth, they cannot be targeted, they avoid damage for a moment, and they have full control of the situation (they can run, they can stay and fight, they can wait on cooldowns, etc). This is like stealth for Warriors, except you can see the Warrior, you can continue targeting the Warrior, and you can plan accordingly.

Lordrosicky.5813:

jmatb.6307:

Funny you say instant ranged AoE like its not something a Necro does all the time every single PvP match they log in to….

What bro? Necro has 1s cast time on all marks.

Do you really need to lie to make your points seem more valid all the time?

Marks have a 3/4 second cast time.

And he was talking about instant AoE ranged as in Marks have 0 travel time, they just appear and instantly go off under your feet.
+ No clear animations from ranged for which is being cast.

zone.1073:

Kids want to hit the trigger freely whenever they want, when really Diamond Skin and the Warrior’s new heal will encourage players to be patient and wait on firing the gun.

“Thief, take off that Diamond Skin so I can explode the Ele with my condition barrage.”

“Done.”

This…

zone.1073:

As for the Warrior’s new heal, think stealth but visible. Any class with stealth currently has the same effect as this new heal; when players stealth, they cannot be targeted, they avoid damage for a moment, and they have full control of the situation (they can run, they can stay and fight, they can wait on cooldowns, etc). This is like stealth for Warriors, except you can see the Warrior, you can continue targeting the Warrior, and you can plan accordingly.

IMO it will reward you for enemy class knowledge, which is something I’ve always thought lacking with the warrior play style (limited blinds; semi ‘spammable’ dodge etc),

It also makes stance traits AND frenzy more viable, which is greaat for warrior mains..

Ezrael.6859:

Lordrosicky.5813:

jmatb.6307:

Funny you say instant ranged AoE like its not something a Necro does all the time every single PvP match they log in to….

What bro? Necro has 1s cast time on all marks.

Do you really need to lie to make your points seem more valid all the time?

Marks have a 3/4 second cast time.

And he was talking about instant AoE ranged as in Marks have 0 travel time, they just appear and instantly go off under your feet.
+ No clear animations from ranged for which is being cast.

There is a clear animations and sound. Really I find it funny that noobs actually think staff is good. It is a utility weapon. The whole necro condition build revolves around scepter auto attack

Even if the diamon skin will be a complete counter to the condition necro, it’s fine. This game uses rock paper scissor balancing (just like most mmos out there) and so such counters are indeed valid.

Really, stop crying that Build Wars happent in Guild Wars, and learn to deal with it.

I sense that the complaints from the rabid (amulet?) necromancers will cause Anet to nerf ele healing to the ground, instead of revising Diamond Skin.

Malcastus.6240:

I sense that the complaints from the rabid (amulet?) necromancers will cause Anet to nerf ele healing to the ground, instead of revising Diamond Skin.

I suspect they will. That would suck though

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ezrael.6859:

Lordrosicky.5813:

jmatb.6307:

Funny you say instant ranged AoE like its not something a Necro does all the time every single PvP match they log in to….

What bro? Necro has 1s cast time on all marks.

Do you really need to lie to make your points seem more valid all the time?

Marks have a 3/4 second cast time.

And he was talking about instant AoE ranged as in Marks have 0 travel time, they just appear and instantly go off under your feet.
+ No clear animations from ranged for which is being cast.

There is a clear animations and sound. Really I find it funny that noobs actually think staff is good. It is a utility weapon. The whole necro condition build revolves around scepter auto attack

Sounds like braindead spirit ranger to me…just scepter instead of sbow

Lordrosicky.5813:

It introduces a ridiculously hard counter WITH literally 0 counter play for a condition class.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Imagine in dota2 if you have some guy who is the best player around, and people watch him get schooled by some guy with 20 games ever just because a hero the new guy picked is immune to everything that the best player in the world can do.

You have no idea what are you talking about, newbie. Also, dota 2 is full of hard counters. Such a bad comparsion. You are able to win 1×1 against someone based on:
1)Your hero.
2)Much less – your skill.

Lordrosicky.5813:

SKILL should matter. Not build wars and spam.

If you build condi-sh$t it is only your problem.

And I dont even care if this change makes ele op or not.

This change signifies that anet dont listen to anyone good at pvp.

And of course, you’re good, and anyone who disagrees with you isn’t.

Lordrosicky.5813:

It is totally passive and skilless. The way the best player in the world will use this trait is identical to a rank 5 noob. It is completely ridiculous and skillless.

Said skillful condition necromancer. OP is a noob, scared of 30/30/30/30/30 ele’s with +1000 to all stats which can both do damage and sustain. Thread should be closed.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ezrael.6859:

Lordrosicky.5813:

jmatb.6307:

Funny you say instant ranged AoE like its not something a Necro does all the time every single PvP match they log in to….

What bro? Necro has 1s cast time on all marks.

Do you really need to lie to make your points seem more valid all the time?

Marks have a 3/4 second cast time.

And he was talking about instant AoE ranged as in Marks have 0 travel time, they just appear and instantly go off under your feet.
+ No clear animations from ranged for which is being cast.

There is a clear animations and sound. Really I find it funny that noobs actually think staff is good. It is a utility weapon. The whole necro condition build revolves around scepter auto attack

The entire build revolves around giving up any semblance of attention span in favor of facerolling every button but condi passes on weapons when there’s red on the screen.

The more I try to think from a condi necro’s perspective the more it just puzzles me that they have anything worthwhile to add to a conversation about balance. They whine about their speed when they don’t use Spectral Walk. They whine about lack of sustain without putting points into Blood. They whine about Diamond Skin when they don’t put anything but 300 power into their build. They whine about getting wrecked 1v1 when they’re relying on Rabid ammy with no Death or Blood traits, prot runes..

It’s getting harder to respect them feel free to correct me and prove your playstyle isn’t a sign of the kittenocalypse

I agree with all the arguments listed here against introducing more passive play into the game.

jmatb.6307:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ezrael.6859:

Lordrosicky.5813:

jmatb.6307:

Funny you say instant ranged AoE like its not something a Necro does all the time every single PvP match they log in to….

What bro? Necro has 1s cast time on all marks.

Do you really need to lie to make your points seem more valid all the time?

Marks have a 3/4 second cast time.

And he was talking about instant AoE ranged as in Marks have 0 travel time, they just appear and instantly go off under your feet.
+ No clear animations from ranged for which is being cast.

There is a clear animations and sound. Really I find it funny that noobs actually think staff is good. It is a utility weapon. The whole necro condition build revolves around scepter auto attack

The entire build revolves around giving up any semblance of attention span in favor of facerolling every button but condi passes on weapons when there’s red on the screen.

The more I try to think from a condi necro’s perspective the more it just puzzles me that they have anything worthwhile to add to a conversation about balance. They whine about their speed when they don’t use Spectral Walk. They whine about lack of sustain without putting points into Blood. They whine about Diamond Skin when they don’t put anything but 300 power into their build. They whine about getting wrecked 1v1 when they’re relying on Rabid ammy with no Death or Blood traits, prot runes..

It’s getting harder to respect them feel free to correct me and prove your playstyle isn’t a sign of the kittenocalypse

wtf lol. There is no way to respond to such rubbish sorry

jimmyimo.2089:

ExaFlare.1390:

That’s not how you said it.
But anyway, you can’t have automatic immunity to something in a game like this.

It is the same as zerker stance but worse as it requires only one hit to get rid of it. 2k most.

Berserker stance is a manual skill, last 10sec with 60cd. Once it’s used the warrior is vulnerable.
Diamond Skin and Automated response are automatic, no CD. Last as long as you stay in the HP requierement.
How can you say it’s the same?
You need to use your berserker stance are the right time. But you don’t even need to pay attention to activate Diamond Skin or Automated Response.

Oh and btw, I main guardian. I hate Necros, but I still find those abominations should not exist.

ExaFlare.1390:

jimmyimo.2089:

ExaFlare.1390:

That’s not how you said it.
But anyway, you can’t have automatic immunity to something in a game like this.

It is the same as zerker stance but worse as it requires only one hit to get rid of it. 2k most.

Berserker stance is a manual skill, last 10sec with 60cd. Once it’s used the warrior is vulnerable.
Diamond Skin and Automated response are automatic, no CD. Last as long as you stay in the HP requierement.
How can you say it’s the same?
You need to use your berserker stance are the right time. But you don’t even need to pay attention to activate Diamond Skin or Automated Response.

Oh and btw, I main guardian. I hate Necros, but I still find those abominations should not exist.

You’re missing one key difference between Diamond Skin and Automated Response. Diamond Skin requires the Ele to be extra aware of their HP. One good power hit is all it takes to rid them of their immunity. True Eles can heal very well, but it still puts pressure on the Ele player, it’s still something they have to give a portion of their attention to. I think a good analog of it would be the Shield system in Halo. When a player’s shield in Halo goes down, the player has to immediately respond to the situation. When a DS Ele’s immunity goes down the Ele will have to react to that, when the Ele takes noticeable damage, they will have to react.
In short, Diamond Skin requires the Ele to pay attention to it.

Inversely, Automated Response becoming active at the bottom of the Engi’s health bar, acts as a safety net. It’s not something the Engi has to devote attention to, when it activates the Engi just has to use the reprieve from the condi damage to heal up and get back in the fight. They don’t need to do anything else because they know their AR safety net will be there when they get low again.

I do admit that Diamond Skin < Automated Response

Mobas are ful of counters..Most of the self procclaimed “pros” of this game seem to not have played any other competitive game apart from gw2.
In lol a support would likely lose 1vs1 at full build against an adc unless its build tanky regardless of player skills. Not only that but every time you engage in a 1vs1 u check the enemys build and you judge wheather you can win or not..Its a matter of avoiding the lost encounter and making up for it in the teamfight by covering your weakness with your teammates .
Personally i hate any condi that uses rabid.Some classes with it put way too much presure for the extra toughness they get from it.I also loathe the standard necro build and i find it weird that op thinks it revolves any skill apart from that of survivng a warrior(welcome to the club)
Eles are used for months now, to avoid every or almost all 1vs1.And now 1 build of 1 class is gonna have a hard time to retaliate against 1 ele build..Id say get some power or dont 1vs1 the ele.Getting that trait means ele is getting weaker a lot against physical damage since u cant have water 15 or evasive arcana or even elem attunement if its a burst build.That is counterable if you realise for once that this is a teams game and that is fine to lose a fight if you can still mantain a role in the team.

Dual.8953:

ExaFlare.1390:

jimmyimo.2089:

ExaFlare.1390:

That’s not how you said it.
But anyway, you can’t have automatic immunity to something in a game like this.

It is the same as zerker stance but worse as it requires only one hit to get rid of it. 2k most.

Berserker stance is a manual skill, last 10sec with 60cd. Once it’s used the warrior is vulnerable.
Diamond Skin and Automated response are automatic, no CD. Last as long as you stay in the HP requierement.
How can you say it’s the same?
You need to use your berserker stance are the right time. But you don’t even need to pay attention to activate Diamond Skin or Automated Response.

Oh and btw, I main guardian. I hate Necros, but I still find those abominations should not exist.

You’re missing one key difference between Diamond Skin and Automated Response. Diamond Skin requires the Ele to be extra aware of their HP. One good power hit is all it takes to rid them of their immunity. True Eles can heal very well, but it still puts pressure on the Ele player, it’s still something they have to give a portion of their attention to. I think a good analog of it would be the Shield system in Halo. When a player’s shield in Halo goes down, the player has to immediately respond to the situation. When a DS Ele’s immunity goes down the Ele will have to react to that, when the Ele takes noticeable damage, they will have to react.
In short, Diamond Skin requires the Ele to pay attention to it.

Inversely, Automated Response becoming active at the bottom of the Engi’s health bar, acts as a safety net. It’s not something the Engi has to devote attention to, when it activates the Engi just has to use the reprieve from the condi damage to heal up and get back in the fight. They don’t need to do anything else because they know their AR safety net will be there when they get low again.

NO – in a 1v1 vs a necro the ele wont have to pay attention to anything. He will win with 100% health

Avead.5760:

Mobas are ful of counters..Most of the self procclaimed “pros” of this game seem to not have played any other competitive game apart from gw2.
In lol a support would likely lose 1vs1 at full build against an adc unless its build tanky regardless of player skills. Not only that but every time you engage in a 1vs1 u check the enemys build and you judge wheather you can win or not..Its a matter of avoiding the lost encounter and making up for it in the teamfight by covering your weakness with your teammates .
Personally i hate any condi that uses rabid.Some classes with it put way too much presure for the extra toughness they get from it.I also loathe the standard necro build and i find it weird that op thinks it revolves any skill apart from that of survivng a warrior(welcome to the club)
Eles are used for months now, to avoid every or almost all 1vs1.And now 1 build of 1 class is gonna have a hard time to retaliate against 1 ele build..Id say get some power or dont 1vs1 the ele.Getting that trait means ele is getting weaker a lot against physical damage since u cant have water 15 or evasive arcana or even elem attunement if its a burst build.That is counterable if you realise for once that this is a teams game and that is fine to lose a fight if you can still mantain a role in the team.

You seem pretty desperate to get this trait. The eles who are actually good at the game generally just want a level playing field where their skill can shine

I dont even play this game anymore.If i do play it after the patch im gonna play my standard 0 30 10 0 30 burst build.You know why?? Because this trait makes you defenceless against physical damage(assuming you dont go full def stats) which is warr/thief/mesm/guard etc and with focus offhand i could already outplay the standard noob spam to win necro.
So i let the other eles drop you out of meta and i enjoy playing what i like..Its a win regardless
I just find it funny how attached to your build you are and how you cant see the bigger picture.Plus it was kind of weird how you think other very popular games dont have counters at this “extreme” level.
And you seem pretty ignorant and absolute to any different opinion throwing the "im pro card you are clueless "card everywhere

Avead.5760:

I dont even play this game anymore.If i do play it after the patch im gonna play my standard 0 30 10 0 30 burst build.You know why?? Because this trait makes you defenceless against physical damage which is warr/thief/mesm/guard etc and with focus offhand i could already outplay the standard noob spam to win necro.
So i let the other eles drop you out of meta and i enjoy playing what i like..Its a win regardless
I just find it funny how attached to your build you are and how you cant see the bigger picture.Plus it was kind of weird how you think other very popular games dont have counters at this “extreme” level.
And you seem pretty ignorant and absolute to any different opinion throwing the "im pro card you are clueless "card everywhere

You dont play this game…well then there we go. Case closed.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Avead.5760:

I dont even play this game anymore.If i do play it after the patch im gonna play my standard 0 30 10 0 30 burst build.You know why?? Because this trait makes you defenceless against physical damage which is warr/thief/mesm/guard etc and with focus offhand i could already outplay the standard noob spam to win necro.
So i let the other eles drop you out of meta and i enjoy playing what i like..Its a win regardless
I just find it funny how attached to your build you are and how you cant see the bigger picture.Plus it was kind of weird how you think other very popular games dont have counters at this “extreme” level.
And you seem pretty ignorant and absolute to any different opinion throwing the "im pro card you are clueless "card everywhere

You dont play this game…well then there we go. Case closed.

The case was closed the moment you posted the thread.You cant have a conversation unless people are already in agreement with you.If you wanted to send a message to Anet you could email them or something. But yeah people can post here so expect them to do so..And sometime realise that not everyobdy thinks the same and its worth it to listen to every side. I dont think you are that close to the true solution for this game to be so arrogant and absolute about it.Maybe you are a kid..dont know

Lordrosicky.5813:

You dont play this game…well then there we go. Case closed.

He don’t play this game but he knows this game better than you. What a pity.

Avead.5760:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Avead.5760:

I dont even play this game anymore.If i do play it after the patch im gonna play my standard 0 30 10 0 30 burst build.You know why?? Because this trait makes you defenceless against physical damage which is warr/thief/mesm/guard etc and with focus offhand i could already outplay the standard noob spam to win necro.
So i let the other eles drop you out of meta and i enjoy playing what i like..Its a win regardless
I just find it funny how attached to your build you are and how you cant see the bigger picture.Plus it was kind of weird how you think other very popular games dont have counters at this “extreme” level.
And you seem pretty ignorant and absolute to any different opinion throwing the "im pro card you are clueless "card everywhere

You dont play this game…well then there we go. Case closed.

The case was closed the moment you posted the thread.You cant have a conversation unless people are already in agreement with you.If you wanted to send a message to Anet you could email them or something. But yeah people can post here so expect them to do so..And sometime realise that not everyobdy thinks the same and its worth it to listen to every side. I dont think you are that close to the true solution for this game to be so arrogant and absolute about it.Maybe you are a kid..dont know

Not really. I never said I know it all. You are right forums are for opinions and that is why I posted here. You dont play the game….so you said. So it is kind of irrelevant what you say. I could go to 50 forums of games I dont play and I wouldnt expect to be taken seriously.

Lordrosicky.5813:

Dual.8953:

ExaFlare.1390:

jimmyimo.2089:

ExaFlare.1390:

That’s not how you said it.
But anyway, you can’t have automatic immunity to something in a game like this.

It is the same as zerker stance but worse as it requires only one hit to get rid of it. 2k most.

Berserker stance is a manual skill, last 10sec with 60cd. Once it’s used the warrior is vulnerable.
Diamond Skin and Automated response are automatic, no CD. Last as long as you stay in the HP requierement.
How can you say it’s the same?
You need to use your berserker stance are the right time. But you don’t even need to pay attention to activate Diamond Skin or Automated Response.

Oh and btw, I main guardian. I hate Necros, but I still find those abominations should not exist.

You’re missing one key difference between Diamond Skin and Automated Response. Diamond Skin requires the Ele to be extra aware of their HP. One good power hit is all it takes to rid them of their immunity. True Eles can heal very well, but it still puts pressure on the Ele player, it’s still something they have to give a portion of their attention to. I think a good analog of it would be the Shield system in Halo. When a player’s shield in Halo goes down, the player has to immediately respond to the situation. When a DS Ele’s immunity goes down the Ele will have to react to that, when the Ele takes noticeable damage, they will have to react.
In short, Diamond Skin requires the Ele to pay attention to it.

Inversely, Automated Response becoming active at the bottom of the Engi’s health bar, acts as a safety net. It’s not something the Engi has to devote attention to, when it activates the Engi just has to use the reprieve from the condi damage to heal up and get back in the fight. They don’t need to do anything else because they know their AR safety net will be there when they get low again.

NO – in a 1v1 vs a necro the ele wont have to pay attention to anything. He will win with 100% health

What’s stopping the Necro from keeping a power option on standby? Just need to have a enough power to get past the immunity, like a power weapon on swap, then you can switch back. Also in a team fight, Necro’s would likely never even notice the immunity.

Dual.8953:

What’s stopping the Necro from keeping a power option on standby? Just need to have a enough power to get past the immunity, like a power weapon on swap, then you can switch back. Also in a team fight, Necro’s would likely never even notice the immunity.

It would be better if you focus on this part:

in a 1v1

OP isn’t going to pay attention to any sort of arguments and, well, now you should understand how bad he is actually.

I wonder how the devs think this trait has been after such a long peroid?

100% win rate vs 2 builds (rabid engi and rabid necro)
0 help vs anything else.

Do these people have ANY idea what fun is?? Seriously. I would love to see them stream and play a condi necro and attack a diamond skin ele and just see how epically fun it is.

Same with automated response. Is it fun to fight people immune to your damage?

In most game such situations are usually only present in hacks. And people hate hackers because they ruin the fun that is present in game. Anet actually introduce hack-like features (complete and unconditional immunity from a spec) in their game. This just boggles my mind.

And if you hunt this thread you can see many top players (at the time) saying to not make this change. You did it anyway for some reason. Any chance of this change getting reverted in the next balance patch? Or are you still ignoring the overwhelming community feedback which states that immunities with no cooldowns (like AR and DS) are not fun.