Remove Stronghold from Ranked
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What does anyone care if someone else has Legendary from Stronghold instead of Conquest? If you play exclusively Conquest, does it matter at all?
Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
Haven’t you heard? Rushing NPCS means you are skilled PvP player.
Still takes more skill than afking and self sustaining on point.
The real question is : Why Conquest is in Ranked?
Conquest you fight players, stronghold the only thing I do is roll Ele with a friend Ele and we push for lord in under 3 mins, mowing down NPC’s to get ready for the next 8 minute que….
Not gonna disagree about skill on conquest in current bunker META though.
I mostly play for the new Free-For-All arena in PvP lobby.
….. And Elementalist.
….. And Elementalist.
You really think it’s enough 2 ele to win in stronghold? Yes in tier 1 and 2… You would be amazed how much stronghold changed.. “You know nothing X Snow”
You really think it’s enough 2 ele to win in stronghold? Yes in tier 1 and 2… You would be amazed how much stronghold changed.. “You know nothing X Snow”
Yes i do, from experience, but I’m just a casual low ranked player who plays with other scrubs.. but that’s all we do, 2 ele lord rush, win.
Or we Rev/Ele mid point in conquest. We been playing together for 3 years now under the same 7-12 man guild that focuses purely on WvW/PvP.
We also use TS which makes life easier against people who don’t, we also try to encourage the randoms in our games to join us on TS for better co-ordination.
I mostly play for the new Free-For-All arena in PvP lobby.
….. And Elementalist.
….. And Elementalist.
(edited by sephiroth.4217)
but I’m just a casual low ranked player who plays with other scrubs..
If only Conquest were evaluated at the same level of excellence.
Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
Why on Earth would you want to remove the OPTION to do ranked Stronghold games?
If you’re solo queuing just uncheck the box for Stronghold. Suddenly the premades can’t “cheese” the game for easy wins anymore.
Because the two game modes share the same league system. Why should someone who cheeses stronghold be considered legendary?
LOOOOOL all them Meta bunker abusers hating on Stronghold this is rich
what your build not works that good there ? you people cant just camp points with your Broken bunker builds while spamming everything ? cry more people. im enjoying this.
not sure if serious… if it is serious i’m more than sad…
At least one person tried to explain what the cheese was in Stronghold. Apparently once PvPers get a whiff of “cheese”, they refuse to try anything that might stop it. I get that adaptation is hard, but if you’re going to call yourself a competitive PvPer, you shouldn’t quit at the drop of a hat.
There isn’t an actual counter to 2 Tempest/1 Chrono/1 Scrapper rushing with DBs, well apart from running the same comp yourself and doing it better than the other team. If you commit the entire team, offensively specced, to defense with the singular goal of killing the DBs they won’t die until after breaking the 1st gate regardless of how much damage you throw on the DBs. This also means you leave the 5th enemy which is usually a Reaper, Rev or DH free to damage your team. This 5th guy is usually also the one that denies treb usage at the start, so no treb. So someone is likely to die as well if you go hard on the DBs. Now you might think “Why not just kill the pesky Tempests and Chronos so they can’t heal the DBs?” and I’m just going to point out that it takes maybe 40~ seconds for DBs to reach the 1st gate if you stall them with CC hard and soft both between whacking away at the Temps and Chronos who will definitely not die in under 40s.
Now when the DBs break through 1st gate most of the defensive stuff used to keep the DBs alive will be on cooldown so there’s a window to kill them here if you have enough damage. If you manage to do so you have a very slight chance of winning with the odds very much stacked against you by staying hard on defense, denying supplies and winning by score gain from hero channels and the odd kill. If they break the 2nd gate it is over. The amount of effort required to pull this sort of defense off compared to the amount of effort it takes to rush with that comp is immense.
(edited by Aktium.9506)
IIRC, trebs kill all of the DBs in 1 hit. Why not send multiple people to defend the treb, then snipe out the NPCs?
I can almost guarantee you no one is trying to beat that comp. It may be the easiest to try for a win against lack of coordination/effort, but that doesn’t mean it is unbeatable. Competition evolves by finding the easiest way to win, then finding out how to beat it. If you quit once someone finds the easiest way to win, then you’re selling competition short.
Maybe Stronghold isn’t a really good competitive mode, but at this point I really don’t see how anyone can tell without putting in the effort.
Alduin Nightsong, 80 Human Necro
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
“He’s like a man with a fork in a world of soup.”
IIRC, trebs kill all of the DBs in 1 hit. Why not send multiple people to defend the treb, then snipe out the NPCs?
They can survive a treb shot with protection from Tempests. It’s also quite hard to hit them due to superspeed and stealth since you will miss if they are far enough away that you have to charge the treb even slightly. Once they’re close enough that you can use uncharged treb shots at them near the gate the Chrono will be chaining invulns on them until they break the gate.
but that doesn’t mean it is unbeatable.
I literally said it wasn’t.
Maybe Stronghold isn’t a really good competitive mode, but at this point I really don’t see how anyone can tell without putting in the effort.
Well, as I’ve said before. Stronghold is a decent enough mode but Tempests and Chronos break it. The repercussions of changing Well of Precog from giving Blur to Distortion definitely wasn’t made with Stronghold in mind.
The foundational philosophy of a winner consists of:
1.Opportunism
2.Optimalism.
Does a chess champion’s opponents accuse him of being “unfair” when he sacrifices material for a winning attack or endgame? Of course not! They learn from the experience (also a key component). The champ would start strong and look for the best move using his understanding of the mechanics of chess, since it is a system with its own laws. Likewise, people make mistakes and if you see a winning opportunity you grab it. This of course assumes legal means, pick Akuma in some Street Fighter tournaments and you’ll get disqualified.
This brings me to stronghold. Yes, it could be much improved upon but people are doing what they can to win within the context of stronghold’s system. Is it exploiting? The other side has access to the same tactics and could form the optimal comp themselves so what’s stopping them? So players shouldn’t be given exploiter punishment (they weren’t violating rules by healing doorbreakers and since they can be healed it’s obviously intended for them to be) but rather have their MMR adjusted to accommodate for how many stronghold games they played or even creating a separate MMR for stronghold.
Does a chess champion’s opponents accuse him of being “unfair” when he sacrifices material for a winning attack or endgame? Of course not!
Dude! Are You comparing Chess, the most balance game in the world to Gw2 spvp?
Yes, there are broken specs in conquest. Hopefully ANET is addressing that.
Stronghold though can be won with minimal player fights and is mostly about the NPCs. It doesn’t belong in a competitive PvP match. Again, people who want to play it can play it in unranked. It shouldn’t be part of a PvP season though.
The other side has access to the same tactics and could form the optimal comp themselves so what’s stopping them?
The fact that when two teams using this comp I’m complaining about meet they never so much as see each other because it boils down to who can rush straight into the lord room first and stomp him? At that point it stops being PvP and it’s about as fun as it sounds.
Does a chess champion’s opponents accuse him of being “unfair” when he sacrifices material for a winning attack or endgame? Of course not!
Dude! Are You comparing Chess, the most balance game in the world to Gw2 spvp?
Guild Wars 2 PvP (whether stronghold, conquest, or WvW) and Chess have their own systems. Guild Wars 2 PvP isn’t balanced as far as classes go but if everyone takes two revs, two mesmers, and an elementalist isn’t that balanced? Lots of things need balancing in this game and people are doing what’s best, and what’s best is determined by the game’s internal systems. A damage or cooldown adjustment may even radically alter what’s considered optimal.
“The fact that when two teams using this comp I’m complaining about meet they never so much as see each other because it boils down to who can rush straight into the lord room first and stomp him? At that point it stops being PvP and it’s about as fun as it sounds.”
I have a problem with how the map’s mechanics allow that kind of play (and be optimal too) but people use those comps because it maximizes winning chances.
(edited by Agemnon.4608)
Does a chess champion’s opponents accuse him of being “unfair” when he sacrifices material for a winning attack or endgame? Of course not!
Dude! Are You comparing Chess, the most balance game in the world to Gw2 spvp?
Guild Wars 2 PvP (whether stronghold, conquest, or WvW) and Chess have their own systems. Guild Wars 2 PvP isn’t balanced as far as classes go but if everyone takes two revs, two mesmers, and an elementalist isn’t that balanced? Lots of things need balancing in this game and people are doing what’s best, and what’s best is determined by the game’s internal systems. A damage or cooldown adjustment may even radically alter what’s considered optimal.
“The fact that when two teams using this comp I’m complaining about meet they never so much as see each other because it boils down to who can rush straight into the lord room first and stomp him? At that point it stops being PvP and it’s about as fun as it sounds.”
I have a problem with how the map’s mechanics allow that kind of play (and be optimal too) but people use those comps because it maximizes winning chances.
and that’s why both mesmer and revs need a nerf bat next balance update. Likewise, stronghold as a map needs to either be removed from ranked queue or it needs a serious revamp. A gamemode that allows you to win with minimal player fighting does not belong in PvP.
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