Guild Wars 2

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ofc they are brokenly op. The damage is insane. And the time when they are not invuln, dodging, stealth or have a port available is very low. So their survivability is better than a bunker guardian right now.

The class is so strong that there is zero chance of it being bought back into line for at least 18 months with the speed anet balance at, and the fact they often try to do nerfs which actually turn out to be buffs.

It is the same with ele and has been the same with thief for 3 years now. Conceptually op classes which are just going to be op for 18 months (18 more months). Either get used to it or quit. Cos its happening

please tell me when thieves were able to chain stun someone while hitting for 13k at the same time and had invul, ever?

Cynz.9437:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ofc they are brokenly op. The damage is insane. And the time when they are not invuln, dodging, stealth or have a port available is very low. So their survivability is better than a bunker guardian right now.

The class is so strong that there is zero chance of it being bought back into line for at least 18 months with the speed anet balance at, and the fact they often try to do nerfs which actually turn out to be buffs.

It is the same with ele and has been the same with thief for 3 years now. Conceptually op classes which are just going to be op for 18 months (18 more months). Either get used to it or quit. Cos its happening

please tell me when thieves were able to chain stun someone while hitting for 13k at the same time and had invul, ever?

Thieves still have the best on demand dazes. It is still harder to heal vs a thief than any other class.

I dont know what to tell you. If you dont think thief has consistantly warped the entire game. You could still make a case that thief is more op than mesmer. It is still a more importamt part of any team comp. By that reasoning thief needs nerfs as much as mesmer

Lordrosicky.5813:

Cynz.9437:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Ofc they are brokenly op. The damage is insane. And the time when they are not invuln, dodging, stealth or have a port available is very low. So their survivability is better than a bunker guardian right now.

The class is so strong that there is zero chance of it being bought back into line for at least 18 months with the speed anet balance at, and the fact they often try to do nerfs which actually turn out to be buffs.

It is the same with ele and has been the same with thief for 3 years now. Conceptually op classes which are just going to be op for 18 months (18 more months). Either get used to it or quit. Cos its happening

please tell me when thieves were able to chain stun someone while hitting for 13k at the same time and had invul, ever?

Thieves still have the best on demand dazes. It is still harder to heal vs a thief than any other class.

I dont know what to tell you. If you dont think thief has consistantly warped the entire game. You could still make a case that thief is more op than mesmer. It is still a more importamt part of any team comp. By that reasoning thief needs nerfs as much as mesmer

Thieves dazes don’t last as long so they are hardly best, they have short range (compared to other classes) and thieves give up their entire dmg for those dazes, where mesmers don’t.

When was last time a war, ele, engi needed to use heal vs thief…. or rather couldn’t get it off? Rangers don’t have long cast heals either (depending on build), mesmers could heal while in stealth, guard heal is actually a block and can’t be interrupted at all, only class that would actually struggle to heal vs thief is necro and other thieves….. (oh wait you are a necro, i see where QQ comes from).

Thieves didn’t “warp” entire game; conquest mode did…. Thieves may have limited how many classes/builds could take roaming role (because they are good at it, they are niche class and should be good at least at something) but they had close no effect on main fights/point holders etc.
Try to prove me wrong, i watched meta changing for few years now and there were all possible builds viable in those metas. Given that thieves builds stayed about constant, the fact that builds from other classes changed over the course of years just proves that thieves have no effect on meta besides roaming builds otherwise other classes would still run same builds. Also, now that thieves are a joke and not as desired anymore, do you really see a difference? You still want to run few point holders and 2-3 dps.

Thief is really only good at vertical moblity. This is literary only reason why they are taken in teams. Take that away and they would be in worse state than eles in 2013. They can’t win 1v1, they can’t hold points, they can’t stay in team fights, their team support is extremely limited to stomp/rez interrupts, few sec team stealth and maybe some team boons on steal. They go in down state when enemies don’t even focus them.

Necros lost their spot in team pvp because of their lack of moblity and team support + absurd amount of cleanses in game frome eles/engis/shoutbow and co. If anything you should cry about those classes, they are the reason why you can’t find a team on necro.

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

Daze Mantra + confounding suggestions = broken
Daze Mantra + chaotic Interruption = broken
Daze Mantra + power block = debatable

Yes, daze maze mantra is stupid.
The problem didn’t arise before the patch as you couldnt run ci+ip+pb+de at the same time.

Are people really kittening about the stun/daze effect? kitten bring stun breaker/stability/block/blinds/invul/etc. So basically when you’re stunned, you stand there and let someone burst you. You deal with it the same way you dealt with CC before. What changed? Did they introduced CC in this patch?

If the issue is the cooldown/precharge, I can kind of see the issue. If so, make it like the thief’s venom. You can precast it but it only last 30 secs then you have to cast it again. No ICD between charges and CD starts after cast just like venoms.

Gabriell.4856:

Are people really kittening about the stun/daze effect? kitten bring stun breaker/stability/block/blinds/invul/etc. So basically when you’re stunned, you stand there and let someone burst you. You deal with it the same way you dealt with CC before. What changed? Did they introduced CC in this patch?

If the issue is the cooldown/precharge, I can kind of see the issue. If so, make it like the thief’s venom. You can precast it but it only last 30 secs then you have to cast it again. No ICD between charges and CD starts after cast just like venoms.

Have you ever be burst by mesmer ? It happened like 0.5-1s and even in steath so you cant see it. You must have the prediction level of gods to use those skill you mention above to counter mesmer burst. Do you know how fast the burst is ? 0.5s for 5k-7k dam on target have 3k5 armor.

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Even if you use it most skills that grant stability, block, invul… have really long cooldowns and probably the mesmer will have bursted you another 6 times till then.

Slapinator.4196:

Even if you use it most skills that grant stability, block, invul… have really long cooldowns and probably the mesmer will have bursted you another 6 times till then.

So you just use block, invul, stability, etc and don’t follow up with anything else like…an attack?

I do and I get stunned…

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Shh, don’t think they can’t triple nerf things, look at what happened to Ride the Lightning.
Range was reduced twice from 1500 to 1200 to 900
CD was increased twice also, don’t give them idea now

Have all of you warriors have eny idea how classy mesm is? 1 full hundred blades downs us you will never land it but still arcing slice gets be on 50 % of health and if ur good warrior you can take mesmer 1 vs 1 only class hardcountered by mesmers is necro so buff necro.

Pepsi.8907:

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Shh, don’t think they can’t triple nerf things, look at what happened to Ride the Lightning.
Range was reduced twice from 1500 to 1200 to 900
CD was increased twice also, don’t give them idea now

Yeah except the 1500 range was a bug that they fixed. Blurred frenzy was just a double whammy.

Gabriell.4856:

Are people really kittening about the stun/daze effect? kitten bring stun breaker/stability/block/blinds/invul/etc. So basically when you’re stunned, you stand there and let someone burst you. You deal with it the same way you dealt with CC before. What changed? Did they introduced CC in this patch?

If the issue is the cooldown/precharge, I can kind of see the issue. If so, make it like the thief’s venom. You can precast it but it only last 30 secs then you have to cast it again. No ICD between charges and CD starts after cast just like venoms.

clearly every class has plentora of stab/stun breakers on low CD………

Cynz.9437:

Gabriell.4856:

Are people really kittening about the stun/daze effect? kitten bring stun breaker/stability/block/blinds/invul/etc. So basically when you’re stunned, you stand there and let someone burst you. You deal with it the same way you dealt with CC before. What changed? Did they introduced CC in this patch?

If the issue is the cooldown/precharge, I can kind of see the issue. If so, make it like the thief’s venom. You can precast it but it only last 30 secs then you have to cast it again. No ICD between charges and CD starts after cast just like venoms.

clearly every class has plentora of stab/stun breakers on low CD………

Just one stunbreaker is all you need because if you eat anymore past that guess what?

#ubadbro.

baylock.1703:

Have all of you warriors have eny idea how classy mesm is? 1 full hundred blades downs us you will never land it but still arcing slice gets be on 50 % of health and if ur good warrior you can take mesmer 1 vs 1 only class hardcountered by mesmers is necro so buff necro.

This made me laugh. I’m waiting for a possible patch I’m staying low for the moment.

Mesmers are broken. The ones denying it, should really take a look in HoTM around them, see the increase of Mesmers, think its even most played class now in PvP. I wonder why..

Prolly because it takes so much skill..

Terrorsquad.4802:

Mesmers are broken. The ones denying it, should really take a look in HoTM around them, see the increase of Mesmers, think its even most played class now in PvP. I wonder why..

Prolly because it takes so much skill..

Same could of been said for ranger when they buffed longbow. All those pew pew rangers! So OP, all top teams were running with 5 LB rangers.

jportell.2197:

Cynz.9437:

Gabriell.4856:

Are people really kittening about the stun/daze effect? kitten bring stun breaker/stability/block/blinds/invul/etc. So basically when you’re stunned, you stand there and let someone burst you. You deal with it the same way you dealt with CC before. What changed? Did they introduced CC in this patch?

If the issue is the cooldown/precharge, I can kind of see the issue. If so, make it like the thief’s venom. You can precast it but it only last 30 secs then you have to cast it again. No ICD between charges and CD starts after cast just like venoms.

clearly every class has plentora of stab/stun breakers on low CD………

Just one stunbreaker is all you need because if you eat anymore past that guess what?

#ubadbro.

um, idk what build you play but i can get at least 3 dazes off on my mes, that besides knockback from GS and immob from s/t; oh and don’t forget that opponent also has to dodge shatters

Terrorsquad.4802:

Mesmers are broken. The ones denying it, should really take a look in HoTM around them, see the increase of Mesmers, think its even most played class now in PvP. I wonder why..

Prolly because it takes so much skill..

Or because mesmer was so spat on for so long that noone dared try it. Now that it’s on even footing for once people are giving it a go.

That said my only suggestions to properly shave mesmer is

1. Increase ICD of CS to 10s per target. As it is now it is 5s across the board.
2. PU remove the might from the boons but then decrease the duration of stealth to 3s extra max.

Because they can do 20k+ burst from stealth in less than a second, daze you and interrupt you constantly, stack insane torment and confusion, avoid damage easily and are super hard just to target doesn’t mean they are OP. It just mean everyone should play mesmer.

jportell.2197:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Mesmers are broken. The ones denying it, should really take a look in HoTM around them, see the increase of Mesmers, think its even most played class now in PvP. I wonder why..

Prolly because it takes so much skill..

Or because mesmer was so spat on for so long that noone dared try it. Now that it’s on even footing for once people are giving it a go.

That said my only suggestions to properly shave mesmer is

1. Increase ICD of CS to 10s per target. As it is now it is 5s across the board.
2. PU remove the might from the boons but then decrease the duration of stealth to 3s extra max.

1. mesmers were good in good hands, they simply required some skill before and weren’t faceroll like shoutbow, there were few mesmers on high tier pvp teams

2. they are not on even footing; go roll a thief or a ranger and try to pull same thing you pull on mes atm; i promise you it won’t work

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Can you tell me how evade and invulnerability are not effectively the same thing in pvp? You do not take damage from any skills, no new conditions can be applied on you and you also cannot be cced. The only thing that’s different is the fact Blurred frenzy won’t save you from taking damage from retaliation, which is only an issue if you fight guardians/engis and do not know how to position yourself.

Also look at all other skills that provide evade, the time frame of the evade is usually 1/2 to 1 sec, for some reason Blurred frenzy provide 2 and 1/2 sec of evade on 12 second cooldown. On top of that mesmers have distortion by default, I think every profession would love that, having an invulnerability for free.

Mesmers are clearly over the top, not all nerf suggestions are justified, but stop acting like they killed the class with this change.

What you mention has always been there and yet mesmers were never op. Now they are, but the guilty is not distortion but the fact that you can be lockdown + shatter + stealthy.

Laraley.7695:

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Can you tell me how evade and invulnerability are not effectively the same thing in pvp? You do not take damage from any skills, no new conditions can be applied on you and you also cannot be cced. The only thing that’s different is the fact Blurred frenzy won’t save you from taking damage from retaliation, which is only an issue if you fight guardians/engis and do not know how to position yourself.

Also look at all other skills that provide evade, they time frame of the evade is usually 1/2 to 1 sec, for some reason Blurred frenzy provide 2 and 1/2 sec of evade on 12 second cooldown. On top of that mesmer have distortion by default, I think every profession would love that, having an invulnerability for free.

Mesmers are clearly over the top, not all nerf suggestions are justified, but stop acting like they killed the class with this change.

Here is the biggest one you didnt mention.

Distortion on the mesmer enables him to the Something else ON TOP of Being Invuln.

Evade and Other Invuln (like Renewed F.) Prevents other classes doing something else.

StickerHappy.8052:

Laraley.7695:

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Can you tell me how evade and invulnerability are not effectively the same thing in pvp? You do not take damage from any skills, no new conditions can be applied on you and you also cannot be cced. The only thing that’s different is the fact Blurred frenzy won’t save you from taking damage from retaliation, which is only an issue if you fight guardians/engis and do not know how to position yourself.

Also look at all other skills that provide evade, they time frame of the evade is usually 1/2 to 1 sec, for some reason Blurred frenzy provide 2 and 1/2 sec of evade on 12 second cooldown. On top of that mesmer have distortion by default, I think every profession would love that, having an invulnerability for free.

Mesmers are clearly over the top, not all nerf suggestions are justified, but stop acting like they killed the class with this change.

Here is the biggest one you didnt mention.

Distortion on the mesmer enables him to the Something else ON TOP of Being Invuln.

Evade and Other Invuln (like Renewed F.) Prevents other classes doing something else.

This is what Mesmer “mains” refuse to acknowledge. Evading/invuln while attacking is not skill based. All it does is make the way you attack have NO RISK. At least Rampage can get hit by a Moa morph by Engi or Mesmer because you can’t attack while you spam 1. You run out of evades on Mesmer and you missed a shatter? Is k just stealth, teleport on ledge, and portal out and wait for your cool downs to come back.

Mesmer was never a hard class, it is THE privileged class of the game in design.

TL;DR Mesmer never took skill.

hey, I wonder if a team with a mesmer will win the 2v2 tournament

So hmm evade on sword is 2 strong you say? I wanted to say something but every 1 has made up their mind so I don’t bother go and play zerker. Mesmer for month and than come back and talk of ur experience

If you are an ele, pop Shock Aura and you’ll see the difference between invul and evading.

Comparing mesmers to rangers is some of the most ridiculous kitten I’ve ever seen, but yea man mesmers are kind of insane atm, you can still kill them of course but wow they’ve really lowered the skill necessity on that class by ALOT. Used to have to be good to get rewarded on that class, now it’s just simple. So crazy how different shatter is prepatch vs postpatch. They really dumbed the class down hardcore.

Iavra.8510:

If you are an ele, pop Shock Aura and you’ll see the difference between invul and evading.

Except it doesn’t hit you when you evade, there is a small time window when you can interrupt Blurred frenzy before the evade time frame starts. Just like Burning speed.

blitzkrieg.2451:

Comparing mesmers to rangers is some of the most ridiculous kitten I’ve ever seen, but yea man mesmers are kind of insane atm, you can still kill them of course but wow they’ve really lowered the skill necessity on that class by ALOT. Used to have to be good to get rewarded on that class, now it’s just simple. So crazy how different shatter is prepatch vs postpatch. They really dumbed the class down hardcore.

Absolutely. The barrier to entry playing an effective Mesmer used to be very high. I read a thread some time ago referring to mesmers as the cerebral class. Margin for errors were so slim. Now I see Mesmers fearlessly free cast like tanks with little consideration to terrain, positioning and timing…while still being effective.

Mesmers are indeed broke/ overpowered.

Dustin.2793:

Mesmers are indeed broke/ overpowered.

Yeah they are. And don’t steal my girlfriend.

Dustin.2793:

Mesmers are indeed broke/ overpowered.

That brought so much to the whole ordeal, thank you for that very constructive and useful input, we are adding your pertinent arguments to the list.
Feel free to add more

The worst thing is, as a new pvp’er, is that they are just plain confusing. I had trouble with glasscannon thieves in the beginning too but it’s so much easier to come up with something to deal with them.
Mesmers? I have no kittening idea because i have no idea what’s going on thanks to the very nature of the class. This is how the average fight with a mesmer goes for me:
A wild mesmer appears. “Stuff” happens. I’m dead in 2 seconds.

And it’s not just one build that messes me up, the confusion spamming ones just destroy me aswell and i have even less of an idea what the hell it’s going on.
It makes losing to them all the more frustrating because i have no idea what to do.

Rampage and Lichform kicks my butt aswell but atleast those are elites and i know where it’s coming from!

Petrol.9086:

The worst thing is, as a new pvp’er, is that they are just plain confusing. I had trouble with glasscannon thieves in the beginning too but it’s so much easier to come up with something to deal with them.
Mesmers? I have no kittening idea because i have no idea what’s going on thanks to the very nature of the class. This is how the average fight with a mesmer goes for me:
A wild mesmer appears. “Stuff” happens. I’m dead in 2 seconds.

And it’s not just one build that messes me up, the confusion spamming ones just destroy me aswell and i have even less of an idea what the hell it’s going on.
It makes losing to them all the more frustrating because i have no idea what to do.

Rampage and Lichform kicks my butt aswell but atleast those are elites and i know where it’s coming from!

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Laraley.7695:

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Can you tell me how evade and invulnerability are not effectively the same thing in pvp? You do not take damage from any skills, no new conditions can be applied on you and you also cannot be cced. The only thing that’s different is the fact Blurred frenzy won’t save you from taking damage from retaliation, which is only an issue if you fight guardians/engis and do not know how to position yourself.

Also look at all other skills that provide evade, the time frame of the evade is usually 1/2 to 1 sec, for some reason Blurred frenzy provide 2 and 1/2 sec of evade on 12 second cooldown. On top of that mesmers have distortion by default, I think every profession would love that, having an invulnerability for free.

Mesmers are clearly over the top, not all nerf suggestions are justified, but stop acting like they killed the class with this change.

Exactly ! They get 2 and 1/2 second of invuln/ evade every 12 seconds for pressing number 2. Not even Distortion gives that every time,if they don’t have all clones up. So with Blurred Frenzy they can save Distortion and other important stuff,they can use Daze Mantra’s as offensive thing,giving them even more dps. Note,how jportell didn’t reply to my post,when I said, BF can have 5s cd, increase it’s dmg ,just take away distortion effect it gives.
And to jportell…mesmers came back,because of Helseth. People started using sword main hand,because he started using it. Basically anything he does and uses with memser, wannabes and copycasts will use that.

I play mainly ele and I don’t kitten about Ride The Lightning and nerfs it got. 40 seconds seems reasonable cd,it’s cut in half,if you hit enemy. If you use it for escape,then chances are,you are not gonna go back in fight right after you used it. On top of it,you’ll go to other attuments,etc. so by the time RTL comes off of cd,you should be fine.

Gabriell.4856:

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Mesmers have so many ways to provide deception through clones, stealth, battlefield cluttering, that you just can’t see everything happening clearly.

Empty Sky.6354:

Laraley.7695:

jportell.2197:

Vanthian.9267:

jportell.2197:

Wow so clearly there are people here that are new or relatively new.

Blurred frenzy was nerfed hard in 2013 May:
Blurred Frenzy CD increased by 20%
This skill now is an evade instead of an invulnerability.

So in a time when mesmers were hardly considered for teams ever, and halting strike did jack all for damage mesmer blurred frenzy was double nerfed.

Oh also! This was a time when Anet was considering putting an internal cooldown on deceptive evasion.

So maybe we should look at past nerfs before crying for more? Just maybe. If blurred frenzy is touched again mesmers will have no decent mainhand.

So full of it. Nerfed blurred frenzy? They changed it from a invulnerability to a evade which in this game are the same dam thing. You can’t be controlled or damaged, unless you already have condition on you, with both a evade and invulnerability.

The only thing that slightly affected you is the 20% increase on cool down and even that wasn’t much. It is still just as spamable just like the block for engineers which needs to be toned town.

Mesmer has always been strong 1v1 just like Thief have fine defenses without stealth even if all you people do is kitten the opposite. Most of this community that is left is just to bad to see it. That is why all the actual pvpers abandon ship a long time.

No they aren’t the same kitten thing. Before blurred frenzy was the only reason that sword was taken. Because illusionary leap missed its path to the target half the time. It also made it so mesmers could actually be in a team fight with out eating a face full of retal from guardians. It was a double whammy and right after that happened is when mesmers disappeared from the meta for quite a long time. The only reason sword was taken more recently is because we need a somewhat decent mainhand and illusionary leap after almost 3 years was finally fixed!

So no evade and invuln weren’t the same thing. And now people want to nerf the once nerfed blurred frenzy some more? What do you want it to be nerfed into now? 20s cooldown who’s activation time is so slow that there is no way it could count as an evade?

O wait. The devs would prolly do that.

Can you tell me how evade and invulnerability are not effectively the same thing in pvp? You do not take damage from any skills, no new conditions can be applied on you and you also cannot be cced. The only thing that’s different is the fact Blurred frenzy won’t save you from taking damage from retaliation, which is only an issue if you fight guardians/engis and do not know how to position yourself.

Also look at all other skills that provide evade, the time frame of the evade is usually 1/2 to 1 sec, for some reason Blurred frenzy provide 2 and 1/2 sec of evade on 12 second cooldown. On top of that mesmers have distortion by default, I think every profession would love that, having an invulnerability for free.

Mesmers are clearly over the top, not all nerf suggestions are justified, but stop acting like they killed the class with this change.

Exactly ! They get 2 and 1/2 second of invuln/ evade every 12 seconds for pressing number 2. Not even Distortion gives that every time,if they don’t have all clones up. So with Blurred Frenzy they can save Distortion and other important stuff,they can use Daze Mantra’s as offensive thing,giving them even more dps. Note,how jportell didn’t reply to my post,when I said, BF can have 5s cd, increase it’s dmg ,just take away distortion effect it gives.
And to jportell…mesmers came back,because of Helseth. People started using sword main hand,because he started using it. Basically anything he does and uses with memser, wannabes and copycasts will use that.

I play mainly ele and I don’t kitten about Ride The Lightning and nerfs it got. 40 seconds seems reasonable cd,it’s cut in half,if you hit enemy. If you use it for escape,then chances are,you are not gonna go back in fight right after you used it. On top of it,you’ll go to other attuments,etc. so by the time RTL comes off of cd,you should be fine.

I’m not jportell but I agree.

Lower the CD to 5seconds, remove the distortion, and increase the damage by 4 times.

Done deal.

20K BF…yummy.

Ryld.1340:

Gabriell.4856:

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Mesmers have so many ways to provide deception through clones, stealth, battlefield cluttering, that you just can’t see everything happening clearly.

In terms of keeping track of the mesmer, I usually don’t have a problem unless they chain MI with another stealth. Other than that, I play against them long enough to know which one is the real one. Experience helps and it seems like new players are quick to jump on the QQ bangwagon.

I don’t mind QQ but please provide backup and not “I don’t like playing against them because I’m too lazy to figure out what the class does.”

Gabriell.4856:

Ryld.1340:

Gabriell.4856:

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Mesmers have so many ways to provide deception through clones, stealth, battlefield cluttering, that you just can’t see everything happening clearly.

In terms of keeping track of the mesmer, I usually don’t have a problem unless they chain MI with another stealth. Other than that, I play against them long enough to know which one is the real one. Experience helps and it seems like new players are quick to jump on the QQ bangwagon.

I can assure you that people do not complain about mesmer because they can’t recognize which one is the real one. That might be a part of the complains, but mostly people actually adress the issues specifically.

Gabriell.4856:

Ryld.1340:

Gabriell.4856:

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Mesmers have so many ways to provide deception through clones, stealth, battlefield cluttering, that you just can’t see everything happening clearly.

In terms of keeping track of the mesmer, I usually don’t have a problem unless they chain MI with another stealth. Other than that, I play against them long enough to know which one is the real one. Experience helps and it seems like new players are quick to jump on the QQ bangwagon.

I don’t mind QQ but please provide backup and not “I don’t like playing against them because I’m too lazy to figure out what the class does.”

I know which one is the real mesmer.

I can’t tell what he’s DOING because of all the clutter and stealth.

Laraley.7695:

Gabriell.4856:

Ryld.1340:

Gabriell.4856:

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Mesmers have so many ways to provide deception through clones, stealth, battlefield cluttering, that you just can’t see everything happening clearly.

In terms of keeping track of the mesmer, I usually don’t have a problem unless they chain MI with another stealth. Other than that, I play against them long enough to know which one is the real one. Experience helps and it seems like new players are quick to jump on the QQ bangwagon.

I can assure you that people do not complain about mesmer because they can’t recognize which one is the real one. That might be a part of the complains, but mostly people actually adress the issues specifically.

Like the guy a few posts above?

“Mesmers? I have no kittening idea because i have no idea what’s going on thanks to the very nature of the class. This is how the average fight with a mesmer goes for me:
A wild mesmer appears. “Stuff” happens. I’m dead in 2 seconds.”

Gabriell.4856:

Laraley.7695:

Gabriell.4856:

Ryld.1340:

Gabriell.4856:

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Mesmers have so many ways to provide deception through clones, stealth, battlefield cluttering, that you just can’t see everything happening clearly.

In terms of keeping track of the mesmer, I usually don’t have a problem unless they chain MI with another stealth. Other than that, I play against them long enough to know which one is the real one. Experience helps and it seems like new players are quick to jump on the QQ bangwagon.

I can assure you that people do not complain about mesmer because they can’t recognize which one is the real one. That might be a part of the complains, but mostly people actually adress the issues specifically.

Like the guy a few posts above?

“Mesmers? I have no kittening idea because i have no idea what’s going on thanks to the very nature of the class. This is how the average fight with a mesmer goes for me:
A wild mesmer appears. “Stuff” happens. I’m dead in 2 seconds.”

Yeah, one guy in the whole thread. Read the mesmer complains again and actually realize many people have some valid points.

Laraley.7695:

Gabriell.4856:

Laraley.7695:

Gabriell.4856:

Ryld.1340:

Gabriell.4856:

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

Mesmers have so many ways to provide deception through clones, stealth, battlefield cluttering, that you just can’t see everything happening clearly.

In terms of keeping track of the mesmer, I usually don’t have a problem unless they chain MI with another stealth. Other than that, I play against them long enough to know which one is the real one. Experience helps and it seems like new players are quick to jump on the QQ bangwagon.

I can assure you that people do not complain about mesmer because they can’t recognize which one is the real one. That might be a part of the complains, but mostly people actually adress the issues specifically.

Like the guy a few posts above?

“Mesmers? I have no kittening idea because i have no idea what’s going on thanks to the very nature of the class. This is how the average fight with a mesmer goes for me:
A wild mesmer appears. “Stuff” happens. I’m dead in 2 seconds.”

Yeah, one guy in the whole thread. Read the mesmer complains again and actually realize many people have some valid points.

Oh you mean from the guy that doesn’t know the difference between evade and invul? Got it, I’ll go back and re-read the thread for good laughs.

Anyways, here a hint:

Line of Warding, Ring of Warding, Unsteady Ground, Static Field, Temporal Curtain’s cripple, Guardian pulls, Retaliation, Auras, conditions, non conditions damage

This thread is so full of half-truths, disinformation and misinformation on what mes can and can’t do damage wise. I hope that the Devs ignore it and are only looking at live PvP combat and kitten their full combat logs for all classes to reveal what is out of balance. People talking about 20K insta death mesmers are generally referring to that dumb youtube video posted where a Guard is deliberately standing still and the Mes attempts many times to pull off a difficult hard hitting combo that downed the guard.

Youtube are strewn with different class combos which can quickly down a heavy practice golem after patch (this is effectively what those guys were doing). Ironically a Guard can also perform insta kill combos which I’ve experienced a few times first hand. I think some of the thread is based on genuine concern, but a lot of it reads like I don’t like fighting Mes so nerf them into the ground.

Hopefully the devs have enough intelligence to base any rebalancing around facts they determine from in-game, rather than some person who was half afk or didn’t realise he/she had a whole bunch of vuln stacks on them before getting insta downed. I play a lot of PvP and I have only been insta downed from full health (21.5K) in one match repeatedly since patch, and that was by a Guard, not a Mes.

Gabriell.4856:

Petrol.9086:

The worst thing is, as a new pvp’er, is that they are just plain confusing. I had trouble with glasscannon thieves in the beginning too but it’s so much easier to come up with something to deal with them.
Mesmers? I have no kittening idea because i have no idea what’s going on thanks to the very nature of the class. This is how the average fight with a mesmer goes for me:
A wild mesmer appears. “Stuff” happens. I’m dead in 2 seconds.

And it’s not just one build that messes me up, the confusion spamming ones just destroy me aswell and i have even less of an idea what the hell it’s going on.
It makes losing to them all the more frustrating because i have no idea what to do.

Rampage and Lichform kicks my butt aswell but atleast those are elites and i know where it’s coming from!

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

lmao, “wasting time”. People like you just make me laugh. Spending what little free time i have playing a class i have no interest in playing only so i can “git gud” at a kittening video game, now THAT would be a colossal waste of time.
Besides, all the other classes don’t require you to roll them only to figure them out.
I also have no interest in joining the fotm Mesmer zerg that is the hotjoin atm which speaks volumes of the state of the class atm.

No, i’m giving some feedback from a newbie perspective while checking my e-mail, that’s it.
Why are you wasting time getting salty at random strangers, whining about whining over a class that’s obviously over-tuned atm?

Petrol.9086:

Gabriell.4856:

Petrol.9086:

The worst thing is, as a new pvp’er, is that they are just plain confusing. I had trouble with glasscannon thieves in the beginning too but it’s so much easier to come up with something to deal with them.
Mesmers? I have no kittening idea because i have no idea what’s going on thanks to the very nature of the class. This is how the average fight with a mesmer goes for me:
A wild mesmer appears. “Stuff” happens. I’m dead in 2 seconds.

And it’s not just one build that messes me up, the confusion spamming ones just destroy me aswell and i have even less of an idea what the hell it’s going on.
It makes losing to them all the more frustrating because i have no idea what to do.

Rampage and Lichform kicks my butt aswell but atleast those are elites and i know where it’s coming from!

Why are you here wasting time QQing instead of making a mesmer to learn the class and ultimately learn how to counter it?

lmao, “wasting time”. People like you just make me laugh. Spending what little free time i have playing a class i have no interest in playing only so i can “git gud” at a kittening video game, now THAT would be a colossal waste of time.
Besides, all the other classes don’t require you to roll them only to figure them out.
I also have no interest in joining the fotm Mesmer zerg that is the hotjoin atm which speaks volumes of the state of the class atm.

No, i’m giving some feedback from a newbie perspective while checking my e-mail, that’s it.
Why are you wasting time getting salty at random strangers, whining about whining over a class that’s obviously over-tuned atm?

To troll people like you. lol why else?