Guild Wars 2

Laraley.7695:

Toxsa.2701:

Laraley.7695:

Toxsa.2701:

Laraley.7695:

insanemaniac.2456:

Cynz.9437:

oh i wanna join too!

make engi kits go on CD if they are chilled D8

already happens. 1.66 secs instead of 1 is quite noticable when you play kit engi a lot.

…and imagine you’re an ele and get your attunements have 16 second cd instead of 10.
Yesterday I downed an engi and ended up with 18 seconds of chill, couldn’t cleanse it for more than half of the duration.That was fun.

Oh no!
I burn all my Cantraps!
I need to rely on signet of restoration to survive so I can’t bring Ether Renewel!
I switch out water right after Engi throws a freeze Grenade!
My Windborne Speed is on CD too!
I didn’t bring a focus for Magnetic Wave!
Because of all the mistakes I made, now I need to waste merely 16 seconds!

Cmon, give me a break. Ele has like 5 times more ways to deal with chills than most of the other classes.

Lol, first of all I was on fresh air, so no I don’t have million condi removals. Second of all, most condi removals are in attunements, if you cannot switch to the attunement, you’re not going to get the cleanse.

I use no cantrips.
Using ER over SoR is the stupidest idea I’ve ever heard. Even staff eles use SoR, because ER is that bad. If you face competenent players it will get interrupted every single time.
It wasn’t nades, it was from downstate. It was a lot of RNG, therefore I couldn’t have predicted it.
I wasn’t on staff.
I had focus, but it was on cooldown.
I didn’t do any mistakes, the only one that could be taken as a mistake was not considering I can end up with so much chill due to RNG. Using Magnetic Wave during a fight is hardly a mistake, then I’m left with one condition removal.

Then it’s YOUR problem then….
If you decide not to run any cleanse utility, not to run cleanse heal, not to bring a focus, not to play staff, not to learn to rotate your attunement more precisely, seriously you have no right to complain about the chill.

It’s like going full zerk 6 6 2 0 0 as ranger, with Troll Ungeant, quickness, signet of wild, and lightning reflex, you get good burst but you have absolutely no cleanse, so now weakness hard-counters you and make you completely useless. Do I see full zerk ranger complain about weakness being OP? I have yet to see any.

You seem to have reading issues. I said I had focus, but my Magnetic Wave was on cooldown. I actually do not have the choice to bring many condition removals if I wish to play dps ele. Once again, elementalist is the ONLY CLASS, which weapon swap gets affected by chill. Your comparsion to weakness is completely irrelevant, since weakness affects all classes the same.

The idea of not being punished by chill so much on ele is simply because maybe one day ele will have to stop traiting for survability and there will be other viable options aside d/d ele.

I have the right to complain about the chill if my class gets punished more than other classes, there.

And you’re just a Ele whiner who refuses to change and adapt your build, instead, come here to cry for a chill nerf despite there’re plenty of options lie there for you to pick.
You’re like those: “Wahhh, I want to run whatever I want and still work perfectly, chill is getting on my way! Please dad! Get rid of it for me!”

I already gave an argument of weakness hard-counter full zerk 0 cleanse class, and it is YOUR choice to pick that. I can also argue that no class get punished as much as ranger when it comes to projectile reflection. Also, chill punishes any no-cleanse classes as much as Ele suffers too, such as mesmer. Basically for mesmer, chill is also a death sentence if not dealt with it immediately.

ronpierce.2760:

And that’s true. I hate (not just thieves) many of the instant procs, and excessive access to certain defenses that scale too well for low-protection stats (Guardian for example). I even dislike how passive AI is and how little the on-use effects impact gameplay more than their sheer existence, and I main a MM necro…

Unfortunately, I can’t write a list of everything that needs to be dialed back and reconsidered a bit every time I make an argument, though. It just isn’t possible…

I agree with you here, there are a lot of procs that have problems. However, you can follow a line of thinking to understand why those things got that point. For instance, I will use an example I am familiar with: Fresh-air ele instant burst. Is it OP – absolutely. Is it necessary for fresh-air to even have any semblance of a chance – also yes. Why does it need to have instant-damage: this is the only way it can compete with bursts coming from a stealthed thief/mesmer. You have to have one OP mechanic to compete with another…

Now, if we add some greater counter-play options to stealth, for instance, so that other classes aren’t just “thief food” if they don’t tank-up, then we can tone down the OP stuff they have too (because they are no longer absolutely necessary). Doing this requires work, but the payoffs would be great.

Of course, thieves are going to reply to this claiming how stealth is UP and only the other OP stuff needs a nerf, but not the one they have.

BlackBeard.2873:

ronpierce.2760:

And that’s true. I hate (not just thieves) many of the instant procs, and excessive access to certain defenses that scale too well for low-protection stats (Guardian for example). I even dislike how passive AI is and how little the on-use effects impact gameplay more than their sheer existence, and I main a MM necro…

Unfortunately, I can’t write a list of everything that needs to be dialed back and reconsidered a bit every time I make an argument, though. It just isn’t possible…

I agree with you here, there are a lot of procs that have problems. However, you can follow a line of thinking to understand why those things got that point. For instance, I will use an example I am familiar with: Fresh-air ele instant burst. Is it OP – absolutely. Is it necessary for fresh-air to even have any semblance of a chance – also yes. Why does it need to have instant-damage: this is the only way it can compete with bursts coming from a stealthed thief/mesmer. You have to have one OP mechanic to compete with another…

Now, if we add some greater counter-play options to stealth, for instance, so that other classes aren’t just “thief food” if they don’t tank-up, then we can tone down the OP stuff they have too (because they are no longer absolutely necessary). Doing this requires work, but the payoffs would be great.

Of course, thieves are going to reply to this claiming how stealth is UP and only the other OP stuff needs a nerf, but not the one they have.

+1

Toxsa.2701:

Laraley.7695:

Toxsa.2701:

Laraley.7695:

Toxsa.2701:

Laraley.7695:

insanemaniac.2456:

Cynz.9437:

oh i wanna join too!

make engi kits go on CD if they are chilled D8

already happens. 1.66 secs instead of 1 is quite noticable when you play kit engi a lot.

…and imagine you’re an ele and get your attunements have 16 second cd instead of 10.
Yesterday I downed an engi and ended up with 18 seconds of chill, couldn’t cleanse it for more than half of the duration.That was fun.

Oh no!
I burn all my Cantraps!
I need to rely on signet of restoration to survive so I can’t bring Ether Renewel!
I switch out water right after Engi throws a freeze Grenade!
My Windborne Speed is on CD too!
I didn’t bring a focus for Magnetic Wave!
Because of all the mistakes I made, now I need to waste merely 16 seconds!

Cmon, give me a break. Ele has like 5 times more ways to deal with chills than most of the other classes.

Lol, first of all I was on fresh air, so no I don’t have million condi removals. Second of all, most condi removals are in attunements, if you cannot switch to the attunement, you’re not going to get the cleanse.

I use no cantrips.
Using ER over SoR is the stupidest idea I’ve ever heard. Even staff eles use SoR, because ER is that bad. If you face competenent players it will get interrupted every single time.
It wasn’t nades, it was from downstate. It was a lot of RNG, therefore I couldn’t have predicted it.
I wasn’t on staff.
I had focus, but it was on cooldown.
I didn’t do any mistakes, the only one that could be taken as a mistake was not considering I can end up with so much chill due to RNG. Using Magnetic Wave during a fight is hardly a mistake, then I’m left with one condition removal.

Then it’s YOUR problem then….
If you decide not to run any cleanse utility, not to run cleanse heal, not to bring a focus, not to play staff, not to learn to rotate your attunement more precisely, seriously you have no right to complain about the chill.

It’s like going full zerk 6 6 2 0 0 as ranger, with Troll Ungeant, quickness, signet of wild, and lightning reflex, you get good burst but you have absolutely no cleanse, so now weakness hard-counters you and make you completely useless. Do I see full zerk ranger complain about weakness being OP? I have yet to see any.

You seem to have reading issues. I said I had focus, but my Magnetic Wave was on cooldown. I actually do not have the choice to bring many condition removals if I wish to play dps ele. Once again, elementalist is the ONLY CLASS, which weapon swap gets affected by chill. Your comparsion to weakness is completely irrelevant, since weakness affects all classes the same.

The idea of not being punished by chill so much on ele is simply because maybe one day ele will have to stop traiting for survability and there will be other viable options aside d/d ele.

I have the right to complain about the chill if my class gets punished more than other classes, there.

And you’re just a Ele whiner who refuses to change and adapt your build, instead, come here to cry for a chill nerf despite there’re plenty of options lie there for you to pick.
You’re like those: “Wahhh, I want to run whatever I want and still work perfectly, chill is getting on my way! Please dad! Get rid of it for me!”

I already gave an argument of weakness hard-counter full zerk 0 cleanse class, and it is YOUR choice to pick that. I can also argue that no class get punished as much as ranger when it comes to projectile reflection. Also, chill punishes any no-cleanse classes as much as Ele suffers too, such as mesmer. Basically for mesmer, chill is also a death sentence if not dealt with it immediately.

That would be true if ele wasn’t the only class that has its weapon swap affected by chill. But seeing as you really cannot understand written information and only cry about rangers not being in meta, there’s no point in talking to you. Btw, you should make take your advice to the heart and start playing something else, if picking something that isn’t meta is the problem in your eyes. All your arguments consists of insulting and never bring anything consructive, I’m getting tired of it.

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

ronpierce.2760:

And that’s true. I hate (not just thieves) many of the instant procs, and excessive access to certain defenses that scale too well for low-protection stats (Guardian for example). I even dislike how passive AI is and how little the on-use effects impact gameplay more than their sheer existence, and I main a MM necro…

Unfortunately, I can’t write a list of everything that needs to be dialed back and reconsidered a bit every time I make an argument, though. It just isn’t possible…

I agree with you here, there are a lot of procs that have problems. However, you can follow a line of thinking to understand why those things got that point. For instance, I will use an example I am familiar with: Fresh-air ele instant burst. Is it OP – absolutely. Is it necessary for fresh-air to even have any semblance of a chance – also yes. Why does it need to have instant-damage: this is the only way it can compete with bursts coming from a stealthed thief/mesmer. You have to have one OP mechanic to compete with another…

Now, if we add some greater counter-play options to stealth, for instance, so that other classes aren’t just “thief food” if they don’t tank-up, then we can tone down the OP stuff they have too (because they are no longer absolutely necessary). Doing this requires work, but the payoffs would be great.

Of course, thieves are going to reply to this claiming how stealth is UP and only the other OP stuff needs a nerf, but not the one they have.

+1

Before u +1 Supreme, u need to understand what he said. He said in order stealth to have more counter, everyone will need to sacrifice something. So its a thing vs a thing, which is good

Terrorsquad.4802:

Lordrosicky.5813:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Mrbig.8019:

More on topic, the real issue is that D/P is such a strong set that can’t be paired with strong sustain ( given by condi cleanse in stealth and vamp runes invuln+ leech) without losing huge part of its damage.

It does lose dps due the loss of Fury uptime.

Air/fire + leech procs give panic strike thief the damage it would lack by going into DA + SA instead of CS

That’s not Thief’s fault, thats sigils + rune balance problem.

The result is the most OP build this game has ever seen

Shoutbow and Slick Shoes? Anyone?

Stop complaining about a thief not being able to 1vs1 a cele proff ( something that is not even true if u think of a fight without time constrainsts), thief is not even meant to 1vs1 things.

Exactly, and thief is not meant to even fights either. Only to +1. So if you get killed by thief, its because you were outnumbered.

Thief is no more about skill, it’s just about camping stealth till u get things back on CD, and most of these things are procs ( leeches, panic strike, air/fire, steal, withdraw).

• Leech = Vamp Rune
• Panic Strike = Dedicated Traitline (6)
• Air/Fire = Sigil RnG procs
• Steal = Not a proc, is a skill we actually press and decide when to use
• Withdraw = Not a proc, is a skill we actually press and decide when to use

As we can see in the list above, gathered from your post, the problem lies in Sigils and Runes, not the Thief itself.

Signed

Ex-thief main from times when u weren’t even planned by your parents.

Right.. Your post clearly shows that.

The only class comparable to thief is shoutbow. Thief warps the game due to its stealth insta spikes with no counter play. It pushes out or makes it hard to play many squishy specs that people might otherwise play. Shoutbow has the same effect in that it forces out all condition builds from the meta.

But thief is more oppressive. Not sure which is easier to play. Both have been picked up and played well by the wider community which is when you know something is too easy. When people are able to reroll to d/p thief and shoutbow in a day or two and become 95% as good as thief mains of their level then there is an issue.

Ye, lets not even talk about the low skill curve of necro’s/engi/ele/guards.. Those are even easier to learn and pick up.
Necro: 11111111111111 DIES 11111111111111111112

You see, I can give subjective replies aswel.

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

ronpierce.2760:

And that’s true. I hate (not just thieves) many of the instant procs, and excessive access to certain defenses that scale too well for low-protection stats (Guardian for example). I even dislike how passive AI is and how little the on-use effects impact gameplay more than their sheer existence, and I main a MM necro…

Unfortunately, I can’t write a list of everything that needs to be dialed back and reconsidered a bit every time I make an argument, though. It just isn’t possible…

I agree with you here, there are a lot of procs that have problems. However, you can follow a line of thinking to understand why those things got that point. For instance, I will use an example I am familiar with: Fresh-air ele instant burst. Is it OP – absolutely. Is it necessary for fresh-air to even have any semblance of a chance – also yes. Why does it need to have instant-damage: this is the only way it can compete with bursts coming from a stealthed thief/mesmer. You have to have one OP mechanic to compete with another…

Now, if we add some greater counter-play options to stealth, for instance, so that other classes aren’t just “thief food” if they don’t tank-up, then we can tone down the OP stuff they have too (because they are no longer absolutely necessary). Doing this requires work, but the payoffs would be great.

Of course, thieves are going to reply to this claiming how stealth is UP and only the other OP stuff needs a nerf, but not the one they have.

+1

Before u +1 Supreme, u need to understand what he said. He said in order stealth to have more counter, everyone will need to sacrifice something. So its a thing vs a thing, which is good

Before all your posts in this thread you should have realized the reasoning behind people requests , that’s it :playing a viable zerker build, which is not possible atm because of thieves, something universally accepted…save few thieves ofc.

At the most basic level of understanding people made an ele with the intention of playing a ranged dps spec, after all the GW1 ele is all about ranged dps, a role which is neutralized by thieves because of stealth and the lack of counters; half the people who made an ele are GW1 ele..the other half wanted to play your typical high dps caster like other MMOs….guess how many made an ele to play a tanky glorified healbot sitting at mele range

Why don’t you ask @Phantaram what he always wanted to play and ask him why he couldn’t, ask @Zoose ( assuming you can find him), you don’t need to ask a “nobody” like me, just ask some well known ele and see if the version of the facts change.

If there would be a viable dps build, nobody would give a flying donkey if you nerf defenses, sustain whatever…you don’t need huge amounts of sustain if you have the viable dmg to end the fight quickly.

That’s why I +1 @Blackbeard, at 200% I understand what he says and I agree, if people would have access to better counterplay against the apex predator then there would be less need to tank your spec, ‘cause you know right now unless you tank up , you won’t last long against a creep who just stealthed few kms aways from you, approach unnoticed and then hit you for 60-70% of your HP bar in one hit.

And I am the one who don’t understand?

Cynz.9437:

T raw.4658:

Lots of nerf thief threads popping up lately.

After the last huge nerfs to S/D and D/P it was basically stated if you are complaining about thieves being OP its a sign you are bad.

Heck didn’t grouch even say that people complaining about thieves need to l2p in one of the last Ready Ups?

i think the guy who got banned for trolling thief forums got second accnt(s) thanks to sales thats is why all this threads~

and chill not affecting ini isn’t bug but intended, it did during beta and it was terrible so it was removed~

Still a problem, though.

There shouldn’t ever be a case when profession gains partial immunity to one effect just by design, without any choice or sacrafice and doesn’t get any other effect instead.

If Chill affecting Initiative system in regular way hits Thief way too much, compared to other professions, that’s indeed not right.

But instead of just nullying main aspect of one condition on Thief weapon skills, replace it with other, more fair effect for that specific profession.

And don’t even start with “Thieves are squishy”. If we want a balanced game, no profession should be immune to aspect of it just because.

Spamming AOEs is not legitimate counterplay to thiefs stealth just stop with this. Oh a thief dropped shadow refuge, spam AoE into it. This is literally one scenario that happens to terrible players. You should not use refuge in a manner that is obvious or gets you caught. If you are using the skill directly in the middle of a fight you better be using it to res a teammate and then yes that’s counter play to SHADOW REFUGE and not the entire stealth mechanic.

Another scenario that some people think is a viable active counter play to stealth, interrupts or all forms of cc. This is not true to a thief that already exists in long stealth. For gods sake a thief can stealth himself (completely out of enemy teams line of sight) for 5s switch SB, then still get a decap and then whoever the back point is will not be in range by the time the thief stealths again. If the thief wants to open on them there is no counterplay to that thief opening on them and getting burst and winning a 1v1 against whatever it was.

StickerHappy.8052:

Cynz.9437:

“stealth has no counter”
meanwhile stealth doesn’t make invulnerable to dmg nor CCs
comon skills that give stealth are interruptable and can’t be used while CCd (besides LR)
refuge is big bull eye for aoe spam
revealed debuff actually exists

yeah sure, no counter….

how many counters are there to block, invuls passive traits? oh wait, none~

@ron: same things can be said about a lot of things in this game not just thieves….

What? Mesmer’s have a 1 hit block, we block one BS and then what? Eat all the remaining attacks?

oh wait~ where is our counterplay to that? oh wait, none~

mesmers don’t have invul? since when?

Rym.1469:

Cynz.9437:

T raw.4658:

Lots of nerf thief threads popping up lately.

After the last huge nerfs to S/D and D/P it was basically stated if you are complaining about thieves being OP its a sign you are bad.

Heck didn’t grouch even say that people complaining about thieves need to l2p in one of the last Ready Ups?

i think the guy who got banned for trolling thief forums got second accnt(s) thanks to sales thats is why all this threads~

and chill not affecting ini isn’t bug but intended, it did during beta and it was terrible so it was removed~

Still a problem, though.

There shouldn’t ever be a case when profession gains partial immunity to one effect just by design, without any choice or sacrafice and doesn’t get any other effect instead.

If Chill affecting Initiative system in regular way hits Thief way too much, compared to other professions, that’s indeed not right.

But instead of just nullying main aspect of one condition on Thief weapon skills, replace it with other, more fair effect for that specific profession.

And don’t even start with “Thieves are squishy”. If we want a balanced game, no profession should be immune to aspect of it just because.

chill does have effect on thieves though, pretty big at it….. read posts above or just make one and try to kill ele or necro while being perma chilled

Lets just make chill freeze people in place so they are eternally immobile and while were at it add some sick mortal combat sub zero finishers. All hail your new balance warlord <-

Grimreaper.5370:

Lets just make chill freeze people in place so they are eternally immobile and while were at it add some sick mortal combat sub zero finishers. All hail your new balance warlord <-

that’s called ice bow 5…<_<

The initiative defense for chill immunity is absurd. Thieves act like getting chilled prevents them from using additional skills. No. If a thief has 15 initiative and gets chilled, he doesn’t suddenly have 10 initiative. He can use the exact same number of skills.

What chill does, is increase the cost of skills already used. Just like every other profession. It makes literally no difference if your skills draw from the same resource pool or from separate ones.

cyyrix.6105:

The initiative defense for chill immunity is absurd. Thieves act like getting chilled prevents them from using additional skills. No. If a thief has 15 initiative and gets chilled, he doesn’t suddenly have 10 initiative. He can use the exact same number of skills.

What chill does, is increase the cost of skills already used. Just like every other profession. It makes literally no difference if your skills draw from the same resource pool or from separate ones.

That’s not completely true. As a thief you share intiative for both weapons, if you get chilled your options will be very limited, other classes have access to more skills while being affected by chill. (cept ele, devs thought it would be fun if it just died to chill)

Cynz.9437:

StickerHappy.8052:

Cynz.9437:

“stealth has no counter”
meanwhile stealth doesn’t make invulnerable to dmg nor CCs
comon skills that give stealth are interruptable and can’t be used while CCd (besides LR)
refuge is big bull eye for aoe spam
revealed debuff actually exists

yeah sure, no counter….

how many counters are there to block, invuls passive traits? oh wait, none~

@ron: same things can be said about a lot of things in this game not just thieves….

What? Mesmer’s have a 1 hit block, we block one BS and then what? Eat all the remaining attacks?

oh wait~ where is our counterplay to that? oh wait, none~

mesmers don’t have invul? since when?

Did I say that mesmers don’t have invuln?

That is why I only mentioned the block part.

Cmon, thieves be flopping again.

Supreme.3164:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

ronpierce.2760:

And that’s true. I hate (not just thieves) many of the instant procs, and excessive access to certain defenses that scale too well for low-protection stats (Guardian for example). I even dislike how passive AI is and how little the on-use effects impact gameplay more than their sheer existence, and I main a MM necro…

Unfortunately, I can’t write a list of everything that needs to be dialed back and reconsidered a bit every time I make an argument, though. It just isn’t possible…

I agree with you here, there are a lot of procs that have problems. However, you can follow a line of thinking to understand why those things got that point. For instance, I will use an example I am familiar with: Fresh-air ele instant burst. Is it OP – absolutely. Is it necessary for fresh-air to even have any semblance of a chance – also yes. Why does it need to have instant-damage: this is the only way it can compete with bursts coming from a stealthed thief/mesmer. You have to have one OP mechanic to compete with another…

Now, if we add some greater counter-play options to stealth, for instance, so that other classes aren’t just “thief food” if they don’t tank-up, then we can tone down the OP stuff they have too (because they are no longer absolutely necessary). Doing this requires work, but the payoffs would be great.

Of course, thieves are going to reply to this claiming how stealth is UP and only the other OP stuff needs a nerf, but not the one they have.

+1

Before u +1 Supreme, u need to understand what he said. He said in order stealth to have more counter, everyone will need to sacrifice something. So its a thing vs a thing, which is good

Before all your posts in this thread you should have realized the reasoning behind people requests , that’s it :playing a viable zerker build, which is not possible atm because of thieves, something universally accepted…save few thieves ofc.

At the most basic level of understanding people made an ele with the intention of playing a ranged dps spec, after all the GW1 ele is all about ranged dps, a role which is neutralized by thieves because of stealth and the lack of counters; half the people who made an ele are GW1 ele..the other half wanted to play your typical high dps caster like other MMOs….guess how many made an ele to play a tanky glorified healbot sitting at mele range

Why don’t you ask @Phantaram what he always wanted to play and ask him why he couldn’t, ask @Zoose ( assuming you can find him), you don’t need to ask a “nobody” like me, just ask some well known ele and see if the version of the facts change.

If there would be a viable dps build, nobody would give a flying donkey if you nerf defenses, sustain whatever…you don’t need huge amounts of sustain if you have the viable dmg to end the fight quickly.

That’s why I +1 @Blackbeard, at 200% I understand what he says and I agree, if people would have access to better counterplay against the apex predator then there would be less need to tank your spec, ‘cause you know right now unless you tank up , you won’t last long against a creep who just stealthed few kms aways from you, approach unnoticed and then hit you for 60-70% of your HP bar in one hit.

And I am the one who don’t understand?

+1

Thieves are so deluded that they have it worse than other classes. Goodluck in finding someone who will have a constructive argument here.

I will tell you now. Reaper would suck big time.

A profession which whose design is centered around chill has its design functioning only 50% against certain classes.

What a joke.

Thread fix.

/15 chars

StickerHappy.8052:

I will tell you now. Reaper would suck big time.

A profession which whose design is centered around chill has its design functioning only 50% against certain classes.

What a joke.

Thief is the only profession that gets affectes by chill less than others.

Necro as a profession is not centered around chill, only the elite specialization is. You can still have access to old weapons and have two more trait lines if you wish to play this.

StickerHappy.8052:

Supreme.3164:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

BlackBeard.2873:

ronpierce.2760:

And that’s true. I hate (not just thieves) many of the instant procs, and excessive access to certain defenses that scale too well for low-protection stats (Guardian for example). I even dislike how passive AI is and how little the on-use effects impact gameplay more than their sheer existence, and I main a MM necro…

Unfortunately, I can’t write a list of everything that needs to be dialed back and reconsidered a bit every time I make an argument, though. It just isn’t possible…

I agree with you here, there are a lot of procs that have problems. However, you can follow a line of thinking to understand why those things got that point. For instance, I will use an example I am familiar with: Fresh-air ele instant burst. Is it OP – absolutely. Is it necessary for fresh-air to even have any semblance of a chance – also yes. Why does it need to have instant-damage: this is the only way it can compete with bursts coming from a stealthed thief/mesmer. You have to have one OP mechanic to compete with another…

Now, if we add some greater counter-play options to stealth, for instance, so that other classes aren’t just “thief food” if they don’t tank-up, then we can tone down the OP stuff they have too (because they are no longer absolutely necessary). Doing this requires work, but the payoffs would be great.

Of course, thieves are going to reply to this claiming how stealth is UP and only the other OP stuff needs a nerf, but not the one they have.

+1

Before u +1 Supreme, u need to understand what he said. He said in order stealth to have more counter, everyone will need to sacrifice something. So its a thing vs a thing, which is good

Before all your posts in this thread you should have realized the reasoning behind people requests , that’s it :playing a viable zerker build, which is not possible atm because of thieves, something universally accepted…save few thieves ofc.

At the most basic level of understanding people made an ele with the intention of playing a ranged dps spec, after all the GW1 ele is all about ranged dps, a role which is neutralized by thieves because of stealth and the lack of counters; half the people who made an ele are GW1 ele..the other half wanted to play your typical high dps caster like other MMOs….guess how many made an ele to play a tanky glorified healbot sitting at mele range

Why don’t you ask @Phantaram what he always wanted to play and ask him why he couldn’t, ask @Zoose ( assuming you can find him), you don’t need to ask a “nobody” like me, just ask some well known ele and see if the version of the facts change.

If there would be a viable dps build, nobody would give a flying donkey if you nerf defenses, sustain whatever…you don’t need huge amounts of sustain if you have the viable dmg to end the fight quickly.

That’s why I +1 @Blackbeard, at 200% I understand what he says and I agree, if people would have access to better counterplay against the apex predator then there would be less need to tank your spec, ‘cause you know right now unless you tank up , you won’t last long against a creep who just stealthed few kms aways from you, approach unnoticed and then hit you for 60-70% of your HP bar in one hit.

And I am the one who don’t understand?

+1

Thieves are so deluded that they have it worse than other classes. Goodluck in finding someone who will have a constructive argument here.

Which is funny seeing as you stated you only played s/d thief for a bit. Maybe actually listen to people who main other classes, but also happens to play thief. Or do it yourself, actually go play d/p thief and see how you do.

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

The thief can move and dodge your attacks too? Not that hard really.

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

So you dont move fast enough? What? So other classes have an innate +10% movspeed?

LOL stealth has nothing do with squishy (NOT NOW) I would take stealth any day rather than toughness. Stealth can let you disengage (avoid CCs, get to safety, misdirect foes) does toughness do that?

So with the upcoming changes to traits (that-50%) so where’s your argument?

@Shadow

Yes I am calling you out.

http://www.twitch.tv/tarcisanastasis/c/3038277

00:35 second mark, do you notice Caed does not stay put inside SR? so Where’s your argument tha:t

A.) You don’t move fast enough?
B.) AOE counters stealth

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

http://www.twitch.tv/tarcisanastasis/c/3038277
00:35 second mark, do you notice Caed does not stay put inside SR? so Where’s your argument tha:t
A.) You don’t move fast enough?
B.) AOE counters stealth

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

Alright because this is going over your head I will try to break this down. Playing a guessing game with thiefs or the stealth mechanic in general is not fun and it does not make someone a better a player, neither does it promote skillful gameplay.

Good players do not make mistakes (to often) like take a face full of auto attacks or not dodging in their refuge when they know AOEs are coming. This has been pretty much common knowledge as a thief to dodge in your refuge and to bait out dodges/cooldowns before you open/burst.

There is no counterplay to stop a thief from doing whatever they want to their target they can call out a target and spike them from 1800 range whenever they want. Whether it is from stealth or just completely out of line of sight.

I think it says something that someone from the highest seeded team (Helseth) even agrees something needs to be done about stealth. Will Anet do anything? Very doubtful.

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

http://www.twitch.tv/tarcisanastasis/c/3038277
00:35 second mark, do you notice Caed does not stay put inside SR? so Where’s your argument tha:t
A.) You don’t move fast enough?
B.) AOE counters stealth

Yeah, nobody said you had to stay put in SR to eat the damage. He moved out of the way of the attack. You can do that with or without stealth since the attack was a basically a channeled animation attack instead of one of those big AoE circle attacks.

Also, the thief goes on to lose that duel so that doesn’t really help with the thieves are invincible because of stealth argument.

Are you saying you want a definite never fails counter to stealth that any lame brain can just drool on the keyboard to do?

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

Alright because this is going over your head I will try to break this down. Playing a guessing game with thiefs or the stealth mechanic in general is not fun and it does not make someone a better a player, neither does it promote skillful gameplay.

Good players do not make mistakes (to often) like take a face full of auto attacks or not dodging in their refuge when they know AOEs are coming. This has been pretty much common knowledge as a thief to dodge in your refuge and to bait out dodges/cooldowns before you open/burst.

There is no counterplay to stop a thief from doing whatever they want to their target they can call out a target and spike them from 1800 range whenever they want. Whether it is from stealth or just completely out of line of sight.

From 1800 range? How?

Also there are things about probably every profession someone can say is not fun to play against or doesn’t promote skillful play.

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

http://www.twitch.tv/tarcisanastasis/c/3038277
00:35 second mark, do you notice Caed does not stay put inside SR? so Where’s your argument tha:t
A.) You don’t move fast enough?
B.) AOE counters stealth

Yeah, nobody said you had to stay put in SR to eat the damage. He moved out of the way of the attack. You can do that with or without stealth since the attack was a basically a channeled animation attack instead of one of those big AoE circle attacks.

Also, the thief goes on to lose that duel so that doesn’t really help with the thieves are invincible because of stealth argument.

Are you saying you want a definite never fails counter to stealth that any lame brain can just drool on the keyboard to do?

Yeah, nobody said you had to stay put in SR to eat the damage. He moved out of the way of the attack

-Argument 1, contradicted yourself

• I quote "Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. "

• I quote again “I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…”

Definite counter, that sounds familiar.

- Blinds on mesmer to make phantasm casting fail

Also, the thief goes on to lose that duel so that doesn’t really help with the thieves are invincible because of stealth argument.

Noone is saying that stealth makes you invincible, where did you get that? Invincible means = 0 damage taken when you attack them (This is different from dodging okay). Cmon flop some more.

Revenant and Energy is probably gonna fall into the same category.

making chill affect this type of mechanic could be a welcomed change, specially since the new upcoming class has such limited counter play as it stands.

Laraley.7695:

StickerHappy.8052:

I will tell you now. Reaper would suck big time.

A profession which whose design is centered around chill has its design functioning only 50% against certain classes.

What a joke.

Thief is the only profession that gets affectes by chill less than others.

Necro as a profession is not centered around chill, only the elite specialization is. You can still have access to old weapons and have two more trait lines if you wish to play this.

Yeap, thats why I said Reaper. So are you saying that specialization mechanic/design (CHILL) is 50% less effective vs thieves?

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

Alright because this is going over your head I will try to break this down. Playing a guessing game with thiefs or the stealth mechanic in general is not fun and it does not make someone a better a player, neither does it promote skillful gameplay.

Good players do not make mistakes (to often) like take a face full of auto attacks or not dodging in their refuge when they know AOEs are coming. This has been pretty much common knowledge as a thief to dodge in your refuge and to bait out dodges/cooldowns before you open/burst.

There is no counterplay to stop a thief from doing whatever they want to their target they can call out a target and spike them from 1800 range whenever they want. Whether it is from stealth or just completely out of line of sight.

From 1800 range? How?

Also there are things about probably every profession someone can say is not fun to play against or doesn’t promote skillful play.

1800 range

SS+Steal or SS+IS or Steal+IS or SS +Sword#2 or Sword blah blah blah blah blah…

StickerHappy.8052:

-snip

I never said that hitting a stealthed thief was guaranteed, just said it can be done but if you want to call that contradicting myself then whatever. I was in dramatic fashion stating with just using your head you can counter stealth with the most simple attack in the game on a class I have very little experience playing.

Noone is saying that stealth makes you invincible, where did you get that? Invincible means = 0 damage taken. Cmon flop some more.

Some things said in this thread…

“2)You can’t interact with the thief once he’s stealthed, that’s basically invulnerability”

“a period of time where thief cannot be harmed, that’s invulnerability in practice.”

And that’s just 2 instances of people likening it to invulnerability in a quick skim.

But in the end instead of QQing on the forums when I lose to something I just look at it as a challenge to overcome instead of crying over it.

Gabriell.4856:

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

EoNxBoNx.9213:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

I was just in a match and saw I was paired with two other thieves. I didn’t want to be in a Ranked match with 3 thieves so I switched to warrior. My second match as a warrior and being a thief win day there was 2 thieves on the opposing team. Early in I was defending a point and the thief went into stealth. My toon’s life flashed before my eyes, I thought for sure he was dead with this invincible mechanic being used against me. I spammed my AA in a dread panic and in 2 seconds it was all over…

…there was a downed thief that lost his nigh invulnerable and un-uncounterable stealth.

I breathed a sigh of relief and AAed the poor thief to death.

L2P.

Uhmm how do you AA something you can’t see? So…The thief decided to eat all your AA then? what?

So…. are you parading the fact that the thief decided to stay in place while in stealth to eat all your AA? What a joke.

Any half decent thief will move away from where the are he is being attacked to avoid damage.

#Flopsomemore

No, it’s called moving and thinking. I just moved around, swung my sword starting from where I knew he went into stealth at and moved in the direction I guessed he would move to get a backstab off on me. Not that hard really.

#L2PNoob

So the thief can move too? Not that hard really.

Yes, the thief can move too and as someone who mains a thief I know that despite being able to move sometimes we just don’t move fast enough or in the wrong direction and eat that damage. The point people are missing is that stealth doesn’t make a thief any less squishy.

The point most are missing is a good thief won’t make these mistakes and won’t leave such a weak counter play option available, which is why AOE or AA spam is not viable or even valuable counter play.

So what you’re saying is good players should be punished for being good at what they do?

Alright because this is going over your head I will try to break this down. Playing a guessing game with thiefs or the stealth mechanic in general is not fun and it does not make someone a better a player, neither does it promote skillful gameplay.

Good players do not make mistakes (to often) like take a face full of auto attacks or not dodging in their refuge when they know AOEs are coming. This has been pretty much common knowledge as a thief to dodge in your refuge and to bait out dodges/cooldowns before you open/burst.

There is no counterplay to stop a thief from doing whatever they want to their target they can call out a target and spike them from 1800 range whenever they want. Whether it is from stealth or just completely out of line of sight.

From 1800 range? How?

Also there are things about probably every profession someone can say is not fun to play against or doesn’t promote skillful play.

1800 range

SS+Steal or SS+IS or Steal+IS or SS +Sword#2 or Sword blah blah blah blah blah…

Oh sorry I meant from 1800 whenever they want not when all those skills are off cooldown and you don’t mind blowing at least one stunbreaker without a sword.

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

-snip

I never said that hitting a stealthed thief was guaranteed, just said it can be done but if you want to call that contradicting myself then whatever. I was in dramatic fashion stating with just using your head you can counter stealth with the most simple attack in the game on a class I have very little experience playing.

Noone is saying that stealth makes you invincible, where did you get that? Invincible means = 0 damage taken. Cmon flop some more.

Some things said in this thread…

“2)You can’t interact with the thief once he’s stealthed, that’s basically invulnerability”

“a period of time where thief cannot be harmed, that’s invulnerability in practice.”

And that’s just 2 instances of people likening it to invulnerability in a quick skim.

But in the end instead of QQing on the forums when I lose to something I just look at it as a challenge to overcome instead of crying over it.

That is not invulnerability. Really? So You can’t AoE bomb him for a period of time? Again you are contradicting yourself. So go ahead and tell your fellow thieves that AoE is not a way to deal with stealth, since you are invulnerable for a period of time right?

I’ll quote you again,

You can’t interact with the thief once he’s stealthed, that’s basically invulnerability
“a period of time where thief cannot be harmed, that’s invulnerability in practice.”

Jut give more profs “reveal utility skills” than just ranger’s sic’em. In that way they have to sacrifice something to counter stealth.

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

-snip

I never said that hitting a stealthed thief was guaranteed, just said it can be done but if you want to call that contradicting myself then whatever. I was in dramatic fashion stating with just using your head you can counter stealth with the most simple attack in the game on a class I have very little experience playing.

Noone is saying that stealth makes you invincible, where did you get that? Invincible means = 0 damage taken. Cmon flop some more.

Some things said in this thread…

“2)You can’t interact with the thief once he’s stealthed, that’s basically invulnerability”

“a period of time where thief cannot be harmed, that’s invulnerability in practice.”

And that’s just 2 instances of people likening it to invulnerability in a quick skim.

But in the end instead of QQing on the forums when I lose to something I just look at it as a challenge to overcome instead of crying over it.

That is not invulnerability. Really? So You can’t AoE bomb him for a period of time? Again you are contradicting yourself. So go ahead and tell your fellow thieves that AoE is not a way to deal with stealth, since you are invulnerable for a period of time right?

No, that’s quotes from other people on this thread likening it to invulnerability. I am stating quite the opposite.

You said nobody was calling it invulnerability and I found two quick quotes from people on this thread that said it.

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

-snip

I never said that hitting a stealthed thief was guaranteed, just said it can be done but if you want to call that contradicting myself then whatever. I was in dramatic fashion stating with just using your head you can counter stealth with the most simple attack in the game on a class I have very little experience playing.

Noone is saying that stealth makes you invincible, where did you get that? Invincible means = 0 damage taken. Cmon flop some more.

Some things said in this thread…

“2)You can’t interact with the thief once he’s stealthed, that’s basically invulnerability”

“a period of time where thief cannot be harmed, that’s invulnerability in practice.”

And that’s just 2 instances of people likening it to invulnerability in a quick skim.

But in the end instead of QQing on the forums when I lose to something I just look at it as a challenge to overcome instead of crying over it.

That is not invulnerability. Really? So You can’t AoE bomb him for a period of time? Again you are contradicting yourself. So go ahead and tell your fellow thieves that AoE is not a way to deal with stealth, since you are invulnerable for a period of time right?

No, that’s quotes from other people on this thread likening it to invulnerability. Iam stating quite the opposite.

That is why I told you, stop listening to those posts, but provide constructive feedback on non exaggerated posts. I am really sorry but infuriates me for you thieves to always express you have it worse than other classes.

Essence Snow.3194:

Jut give more profs “reveal utility skills” than just ranger’s sic’em. In that way they have to sacrifice something to counter stealth.

ah? So building around to counter stealth? sounds legit.

Yep 1 utility skill out of 3…sounds like a full build…you know legitimately speaking….lol

Essence Snow.3194:

Yep 1 utility skill out of 3…sounds like a full build…you know legitimately speaking….lol

You know sic em, isnt that all effective right? If it was, You would’ve saw a lot of rangers running Sic em, in high tier pvp to cull the thief players.

So sadly I think 1 is not enough.

We shall see with revenant’s reveal skill if it makes a difference..Things can always be re-balanced….skills are not set in stone

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

Shadow.1345:

StickerHappy.8052:

-snip

I never said that hitting a stealthed thief was guaranteed, just said it can be done but if you want to call that contradicting myself then whatever. I was in dramatic fashion stating with just using your head you can counter stealth with the most simple attack in the game on a class I have very little experience playing.

Noone is saying that stealth makes you invincible, where did you get that? Invincible means = 0 damage taken. Cmon flop some more.

Some things said in this thread…

“2)You can’t interact with the thief once he’s stealthed, that’s basically invulnerability”

“a period of time where thief cannot be harmed, that’s invulnerability in practice.”

And that’s just 2 instances of people likening it to invulnerability in a quick skim.

But in the end instead of QQing on the forums when I lose to something I just look at it as a challenge to overcome instead of crying over it.

That is not invulnerability. Really? So You can’t AoE bomb him for a period of time? Again you are contradicting yourself. So go ahead and tell your fellow thieves that AoE is not a way to deal with stealth, since you are invulnerable for a period of time right?

No, that’s quotes from other people on this thread likening it to invulnerability. Iam stating quite the opposite.

That is why I told you, stop listening to those posts, but provide constructive feedback on non exaggerated posts. I am really sorry but infuriates me for you thieves to always express you have it worse than other classes.

I don’t think thieves have it worse than other classes. They are however hamstringed into one role. You can’t run Support on them. Controller is pretty much a joke. Condis? Pfft, Necro and Ranger are just two classes out of the 4 total classes I have even played on this game that easily beat Thief in conditions. The bleed stacking on pistols is crap compared to a Ranger flanking with SB.

Personally I wouldn’t mind seeing more skills like Sic ‘Em for countering stealth but I’d want to see the Thief have more viability in other roles in exchange.

Sure people who main thieves get defensive when other people kitten and complain about the two defenses they have, stealth and evade. And even for a lot of evasion you have to run S/D and sacrifice some of that spike damage. Other than that thieves have next to no damage mitigation and garbage HP so escape is all a thief really has for survivability. Elementalists have the same problem sure but they also have tons of defense in the right attunement.

Also thief is not a “takes no skill” class. If a thief gets the drop on you then yes they maul your face off. If not then they can get spanked pretty hard.

Sure my post was a tongue in cheek way of calling out crybabies on here that act like there is absolutely nothing that can be done once a thief goes into stealth but there can be. Nobody ever told anyone you have to just stand around and wait for that backstab. Be proactive against it and sometimes you get that laugh when you see the poor little thief laying on the ground trying to heal his meager HP to get back up before getting facemelted.