Guild Wars 2

Support canning elite specs and going back to the pre expansion meta, a meta in which EVERY profession had at LEAST one viable build?

Or are the new shinys too tempting, are new abilities and missing counterplay your cup of tea?

This meta blows kitten

No, I won’t even though I main warrior. Doing the same thing over and over gets boring after a while.

TheLargeUnit.2793:

Support canning elite specs and going back to the pre expansion meta, a meta in which EVERY profession had at LEAST one viable build?

Or are the new shinys too tempting, are new abilities and missing counterplay your cup of tea?

This meta blows kitten

i’d pay for a server running with pre juny patch…

I would pay to be able to play pre-June 2015 PvP again with a decent population. I probably wouldn’t pay for pre-HoT with core specs, but it might get me to play again, at least. In my opinion elite specs + rev should have been restricted from ranked play when it became clear they were far stronger than core builds, at most 2 weeks into the pro league, and an attempt at balancing should have been made a priority then. If ANet wants PvP in this game to be taken seriously, they need to make balance a top priority.

no.

they need to introduce more viable builds.

more power creep please.

I would rather have more options with more problems then the other way around. Problems can usually be fixed quicker then new content can be created.
Wait.
/wrists

MadVisions.4529:

TheLargeUnit.2793:

Support canning elite specs and going back to the pre expansion meta, a meta in which EVERY profession had at LEAST one viable build?

Or are the new shinys too tempting, are new abilities and missing counterplay your cup of tea?

This meta blows kitten

i’d pay for a server running with pre juny patch…

This made me smile. I said the exact same thing to a friend yesterday evening. I’d pay to get the game back how it was before the “streamlining”.

TheLargeUnit.2793:

Support canning elite specs and going back to the pre expansion meta, a meta in which EVERY profession had at LEAST one viable build?

Or are the new shinys too tempting, are new abilities and missing counterplay your cup of tea?

This meta blows kitten

Hell no. I like playing against all the new specs.

I used to read the forums before HoT and before the June patch even though I was on a long hiatus and there was the exact same amount of whinging and crying posts then, so at least the forums have t changed.

no, honestly, we needed new ways of combat, there was simply too much power added. If A-net is not going to do anything about the power-creep, then i atleast hope that this is as powerfull as we can get. I’d rather have warrior and mesmer on the same level as the rest then have another unnuanced nerf that does more harm then good. We just need to have warrior sustain improved, and mesmer and elementalist reworked so that they can now they take an more offensive role. and then stop right there. No more power-ups. If A net wants to keep the elite specs>core class. then make sure that future elite specs stay at the same level.

Unfair question, there never was a meta were each profession had at least 1 viable build.

That said i’d like the old trait system back before june, so i could be more creative with creating build instead of being forced into the whole trait line.

Im not sure if would go back, but i’d love to go forward. Right now we have one elite spec for each profession, most of them meaning a straight upgrade to the original class.
This+ typical post patch balancing issues and some stuff gone plain wrong.
But again, i would love to see what the elite specs can offer for future content. If we have maybe 3 or 4 for each class, all more or less equal choices.
Think of what options we would have in terms of build diversity, we would basically have 9 (or more) classes, about 20-30 subclasses, each of them with at least one viable build.

So yeah, past or future, present has issues.

you kids dont know kitten, there’s always been bullkitten professions and bullkitten builds that would kitten all over the fun for everyone

actually having only 1 scrapper build and 1 rev build ruining the fun for everyone is one of the best results Anet could ever achieve as opposed to a crapton of dumb and annoying builds we’ve used to have before

More people looking at the past with rose tinted glasses

There was NEVER a meta where all 8(at the time) classes had a “meta-viable” build. There was always a rediculously overpowered class and 2-3 outliers that hardly got played at high level.
Only difference now is all of you armchair game developers have the scapegoat of the expansion and elite specs to complain about. This forum was always filled with these same threads complaining about “terrible balance” and “no build diversity”.
Nothings changed, the forum was destined to complain

I beg to differ. It is known that the meta immediately before HoT dropped had at least 1 meta build for every profession. The potency of each was well equalized, as none significantly outclassed another at doing the same role.
-Signet Necro
-Power Pu Mes
-D/F ele
-D/D ele
-Staff ele
-Shadow arts thief
-Pistol cele engi
-Soldiers rifle engi
-LB Power ranger (taken by 2 top esl teams)
-Burn ranger (a less known build that was extremely effective)
-Bunker guard
-Burn guard
-Dps war
-Shoutbow (only eu meta)

There you go all 8 profs having at least 1 viable build. If you dont believe me that all were used in competetive play i will happlily find you esl footage

No I really love Tempest althought Fresh Air – Air Overload spam is a bit facerolly.

TheLargeUnit.2793:

Support canning elite specs and going back to the pre expansion meta, a meta in which EVERY profession had at LEAST one viable build?

Or are the new shinys too tempting, are new abilities and missing counterplay your cup of tea?

This meta blows kitten

I’d pay to go back when Mesmer was actually buffed correctly, which is right after the Robert Gee trait revamp patch.

TheLargeUnit.2793:

I beg to differ. It is known that the meta immediately before HoT dropped had at least 1 meta build for every profession. The potency of each was well equalized, as none significantly outclassed another at doing the same role.
-Signet Necro
-Power Pu Mes
-D/F ele
-D/D ele
-Staff ele
-Shadow arts thief
-Pistol cele engi
-Soldiers rifle engi
-LB Power ranger (taken by 2 top esl teams)
-Burn ranger (a less known build that was extremely effective)
-Bunker guard
-Burn guard
-Dps war
-Shoutbow (only eu meta)

There you go all 8 profs having at least 1 viable build. If you dont believe me that all were used in competetive play i will happlily find you esl footage

You can list just as many build right now that are comparably competitive as your list,
Half those build werent considered “meta” and were not actually used widely, they were “good” builds,

Only difference now is that the league system encourages people to play the “best” builds more than the game did befor that, build diversity didnt change, the incentive to play " best" builds increased.
,
People are sheep and will gravitate towards what meta battle tells them

Kayberz.5346:

TheLargeUnit.2793:

I beg to differ. It is known that the meta immediately before HoT dropped had at least 1 meta build for every profession. The potency of each was well equalized, as none significantly outclassed another at doing the same role.
-Signet Necro
-Power Pu Mes
-D/F ele
-D/D ele
-Staff ele
-Shadow arts thief
-Pistol cele engi
-Soldiers rifle engi
-LB Power ranger (taken by 2 top esl teams)
-Burn ranger (a less known build that was extremely effective)
-Bunker guard
-Burn guard
-Dps war
-Shoutbow (only eu meta)

There you go all 8 profs having at least 1 viable build. If you dont believe me that all were used in competetive play i will happlily find you esl footage

You can list just as many build right now that are comparably competitive as your list,
Half those build werent considered “meta” and were not actually used widely, they were “good” builds,

Only difference now is that the league system encourages people to play the “best” builds more than the game did befor that, build diversity didnt change, the incentive to play " best" builds increased.
,
People are sheep and will gravitate towards what meta battle tells them

Which ones wernt meta? Please like I said give me specifics and I will find footage proving you wrong. The number pales in comparison to the fact that every profession had a place. Being a tournamnet player I saw every single one of these builds used consistntly.

People see many past metas through rose colored glasses. Just the other day someone made a thread saying the days of d/d cele ele was the perfect meta… ya ok buddy.

Can’t wait for the thread saying 5 rev teams are ideal because we’re all on equal footing like an FPS.

No, but I want a meta where all classes got 3 viable build for each role (DPs roamer, sustain bruisers and bunker/support).

I want more option (not less).

So, let me use the trait line, like I want. Let me customize my attributes like in PVE and WvW. Then balanced the things with pvp mind set for diminishing returns, stats caps and soft caps.

Dal

Fluffball.8307:

People see many past metas through rose colored glasses. Just the other day someone made a thread saying the days of d/d cele ele was the perfect meta… ya ok buddy.

Can’t wait for the thread saying 5 rev teams are ideal because we’re all on equal footing like an FPS.

I think I know the post you are referring to, and that player was saying that the post-Sept. 29 cele d/d ele meta was the best (not the post June 23rd). And he’s right…between Sept. 29 and Oct. 23rd the game balance was really fantastic.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-September-29-2015/first#post5580330

TheLargeUnit.2793:

-Dps war

wot mate

lighter.2708:

TheLargeUnit.2793:

-Dps war

wot mate

Rampage gs axe shield cwysis warrior sound familiar?

TheLargeUnit.2793:

lighter.2708:

TheLargeUnit.2793:

-Dps war

wot mate

Rampage gs axe shield cwysis warrior sound familiar?

Ya it does sound familiar, it was one of those “good” builds, not a meta must have build,

Like i said, there are just as many “good” builds for each class currently, but they arnt being played by every ESL team because its not the “best” but you wil see them around, your list consists of solo queue viable builds, similar to dragon hunter, its viable, but its not top tier “meta”.

This same meta that your refering to was also when teams stacked d/d eles as much as possible because it was so OP

4 d/d eles + 1 thief ring a bell?

Actually lile salamander already pointed out, the meta im refering to was after the nerf to dd eles. As to your definiton of meta as must have, meta simply refers to builds that are viable and frequently used at the highest level of competetive play. Something can be meta without being required on every team.

With that being said, you wont see any guardians or warriors or even thieves on any of the top tier teams right now. Druid only gets taken for SnR and mes is carried by an aids condi build. Right not the meta revovles around 3 or 4 builds not the surplus of “good” builds we used to see

Kayberz.5346:

Only difference now is that the league system encourages people to play the “best” builds more than the game did befor that, build diversity didnt change, the incentive to play " best" builds increased.
,
People are sheep and will gravitate towards what meta battle tells them

This.

No competitive game has more than 1 high-end viable class per role. There will always be 1 class that is better than it’s peers at a given role.

TheLargeUnit.2793:

Actually lile salamander already pointed out, the meta im refering to was after the nerf to dd eles. As to your definiton of meta as must have, meta simply refers to builds that are viable and frequently used at the highest level of competetive play. Something can be meta without being required on every team.

With that being said, you wont see any guardians or warriors or even thieves on any of the top tier teams right now. Druid only gets taken for SnR and mes is carried by an aids condi build. Right not the meta revovles around 3 or 4 builds not the surplus of “good” builds we used to see

My point still stands
Your mis-remembering the diversity of the meta back then, 1 or 2 random teams in the lesser tourneys running “viable” builds that get eliminated early or mid way through doesnt make the builds meta (by gw2 pvp communities definition and standards)

Even after the nerf the “top” teams were all still pretty much running double d/d ele.

Its literally the same situation now, there are many good builds on classes that can be considered “meta” but they arnt being run by the top teams because you only can fill 5 slots and they are choosing the most efficient TEAM comp, while also considering whats popular right now.
,
As an example mesmer could be considered “meta viable” back in the day if you played well (Helseth) but MOST teams didnt run it because thief filled a similar role while ALSO being a hard counter to mesmer. Overall thief was more popular and considered “meta” while mesmer was not, even though they were both arguably equally viable mesmer was not considered a “meta” class simply because the presence of thiefs pushed mesmer out

Kayberz.5346:

TheLargeUnit.2793:

Actually lile salamander already pointed out, the meta im refering to was after the nerf to dd eles. As to your definiton of meta as must have, meta simply refers to builds that are viable and frequently used at the highest level of competetive play. Something can be meta without being required on every team.

With that being said, you wont see any guardians or warriors or even thieves on any of the top tier teams right now. Druid only gets taken for SnR and mes is carried by an aids condi build. Right not the meta revovles around 3 or 4 builds not the surplus of “good” builds we used to see

My point still stands
Your mis-remembering the diversity of the meta back then, 1 or 2 random teams in the lesser tourneys running “viable” builds that get eliminated early or mid way through doesnt make the builds meta (by gw2 pvp communities definition and standards)

Even after the nerf the “top” teams were all still pretty much running double d/d ele.

Its literally the same situation now, there are many good builds on classes that can be considered “meta” but they arnt being run by the top teams because you only can fill 5 slots and they are choosing the most efficient TEAM comp, while also considering whats popular right now.
,
As an example mesmer could be considered “meta viable” back in the day if you played well (Helseth) but MOST teams didnt run it because thief filled a similar role while ALSO being a hard counter to mesmer. Overall thief was more popular and considered “meta” while mesmer was not, even though they were both arguably equally viable mesmer was not considered a “meta” class simply because the presence of thiefs pushed mesmer out

Im done posting here but obviously you are the one misremembering, as like I said all of these builds could be found in ESL tournaments, tournaments that dictate the meta.