Guild Wars 2

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Diamond_Skin

Diamond Skin
“Conditions cannot be applied to you when your health is above the threshold.”
Health Threshold: 90%

currently we have the above.
what if,

Diamond Skin
“Conditions currently on you are ineffective when your health is above the threshold.”
Health Threshold: 90%

well, the health threshold value of 90% could be modified if 90% is too high. since now we can apply lots of conditions … we just need to chip away 11% health for those conditions to work ! at least necromancer traits that rely on applying conditions will still work to some extend.

discuss!

edit:
there should be a trait icon on the ele when it is active. just like the many other trait icons we have now.

diamond skin should have its own trait icon in the buff bar.

god….I come back from work and…do you guys even sleep? No matter the time I always find the same people ranting on the forums..I wish I had your time + my money xd

Supreme.3164:

god….I come back from work and…do you guys even sleep? No matter the time I always find the same people ranting on the forums..I wish I had your time + my money xd

what i wrote above is considered to be ranting? : \

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

well, i’m in gmt +8:00 time zone so its 4:25 pm over here.
late afternoon.

and i have more time to browse and post on these forums than actually play gw2 spvp so here i am!

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Honestly I’m amazed at such level of tenacity…like 50% of the threads for the last month were about diamond skin.

Whatever you guys are even hoping to achieve by constantly asking for nerfs?
Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Honestly I’m amazed at such level of tenacity…like 50% of the threads for the last month were about diamond skin.

Whatever you guys are even hoping to achieve by constantly asking for nerfs?
Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

so you are saying what i am proposing is a nerf?

So you’re saying, eles should have a permanent resistance buff until hp falls below 90%?

Everything is a matter of personal skill?
Lol

Play the game without HoT. That takes personal skill. Patience mostly.

lepewpwn.4726:

So you’re saying, eles should have a permanent resistance buff until hp falls below 90%?

ya ya.
what do you think?

alain.1659:

Everything is a matter of personal skill?
Lol

Play the game without HoT. That takes personal skill. Patience mostly.

yeah. its very hard to play core specs nowadays.
i try that on my warrior and get put down very quickly.

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Ah man, gave me a good laugh!
Saying everything is currently about skill.. In this meta..

You just lost your last credibility.

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Honestly I’m amazed at such level of tenacity…like 50% of the threads for the last month were about diamond skin.

Whatever you guys are even hoping to achieve by constantly asking for nerfs?
Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Since the sPvP community collectively got Chrono bunker nerfed, it’s only fair to nerf DS. THere’s plenty threads and replies to indicate why it’s OP, so I dont need to write the same info again.

i dun understand why some people are being defensive.

how is this a nerf?
i said rework.

Diamond Skin
“Conditions currently on you are ineffective when your health is above the threshold.”
Health Threshold: 90%

plus, the health threshold of 90% is open for discussion.
what if it is 85% ? or 80% ? or 75% ?

or 90% is just fine ?

what i am proposing is basically making diamond skin a permanent resistance as long as the elementalist have 90% health and above.

Often broken builds that work too well appear. Until they are addressed, there’s always people defending them saying that they ‘require skill’. Some people actually believe that, while others know how broken they are, yet they lie through their teeth about it, in futile hopes developers will fall for their blatant lies even though the game’s metrics clearly show the problem, and players who test those builds can see by themselves how broken they are.

We all know the current behavior of Diamond Skin is one of the key problems with the latest tempest builds. There isn’t some mystic mystery here. We all can try those builds and see how they work way too well.

We all know it’s going to be addressed. It’s only a matter of time. Search your feelings; you know it to be true!

So why don’t we focus on ways to fix the problem instead wasting your time in trying to convince people there’s no such problem?

Anyways, there’s already plenty of threads about it. For example:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Idea-for-Diamond-Skin-Rework

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/As-an-ele-main-Diamond-Skin-OP

My take on it is making it work the other way around. Right now it’s too much ‘all or nothing’. Without changing its behavior, just the numbers like increasing recharge or increasing the health threshold or reducing the immunity, it will either stay problematic or become useless. So it should be changed into something that works the more it is needed, balancing itself. For example:

• Reduce effects and duration of conditions on proportion to health lost.

With this, at 100% health you’ll take 100% condition duration, and they will have their full effect on you. At 50% HP, conditions will last 50% less and those already on you that can have degrees of effect (like damaging conditions, slow or snares) will have less effect. At 0% HP (after being downed) you become immune to condition effects as if you had Berserker Stance and Resistance, so enemies can’t use immobilize on you to prevent you from running away with vapor form.

This way it still has a Grandmaster grade effect, but it’ll work more the more in risk you are, instead being too much at the start but useless when they manage to take your health down a bit.

Supreme.3164:

Honestly I’m amazed at such level of tenacity…like 50% of the threads for the last month were about diamond skin.

Whatever you guys are even hoping to achieve by constantly asking for nerfs?
Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

…..I take it you play Ele?

Anyway Dragonhunters would like to say hi, they know how you feel with all these Ele nerf posts you are referring to.

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Ah man, gave me a good laugh!
Saying everything is currently about skill.. In this meta..

You just lost your last credibility.

Everything always comes down to personal level of skill, who lose now…will lose later

It’s a rather simple concept really, a nerf there and there won’t magically allow you to beat any player on the nerfed profession and that’s obvious I believe

The trait got clear weaknesses that requires some active thinking out of you, coming here to complain only shows that you( generally speaking) lack that ability to adapt to the situation.

The nerf to this trait, won’t make so that you will be able to beat those eles who murder you already without even using that trait in the first place.

In the end of the day meta auramancer is just a support build not a duellist build and that’s where lots of arguments fall flat against.

Nerfing that trait won’t stop the people who whine now to come once again on the forum asking for more nerfs because they lost yet another 1vs1 against an ele

But guess what, no matter how much you whine on the forum….no game will ever be balanced around you, so get out there…and learn to adapt

Many reapers and other players did that, you can follow them..or you can keep ranting frustration on the forum.

P.S = for “You” I mean generally speaking

Supreme.3164:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Ah man, gave me a good laugh!
Saying everything is currently about skill.. In this meta..

You just lost your last credibility.

Everything always comes down to personal level of skill, who lose now…will lose later

It’s a rather simple concept really, a nerf there and there won’t magically allow you to beat any player on the nerfed profession and that’s obvious I believe

The trait got clear weaknesses that requires some active thinking out of you, coming here to complain only shows that you( generally speaking) lack that ability to adapt to the situation.

The nerf to this trait, won’t make so that you will be able to beat those eles who murder you already without even using that trait in the first place.

In the end of the day meta auramancer is just a support build not a duellist build and that’s where lots of arguments fall flat against.

Nerfing that trait won’t stop the people who whine now to come once again on the forum asking for more nerfs because they lost yet another 1vs1 against an ele

But guess what, no matter how much you whine on the forum….no game will ever be balanced around you, so get out there…and learn to adapt

Many reapers and other players did that, you can follow them..or you can keep ranting frustration on the forum.

P.S = for “You” I mean generally speaking

Where were you before the nerf to Chronobunker? You could’ve post the same thing…

rchu.8945:

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Honestly I’m amazed at such level of tenacity…like 50% of the threads for the last month were about diamond skin.

Whatever you guys are even hoping to achieve by constantly asking for nerfs?
Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Since the sPvP community collectively got Chrono bunker nerfed, it’s only fair to nerf DS. THere’s plenty threads and replies to indicate why it’s OP, so I dont need to write the same info again.

Oh…I see…revenge nerfs then…impressive

Supreme.3164:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Ah man, gave me a good laugh!
Saying everything is currently about skill.. In this meta..

You just lost your last credibility.

Everything always comes down to personal level of skill, who lose now…will lose later

It’s a rather simple concept really, a nerf there and there won’t magically allow you to beat any player on the nerfed profession and that’s obvious I believe

The trait got clear weaknesses that requires some active thinking out of you, coming here to complain only shows that you( generally speaking) lack that ability to adapt to the situation.

The nerf to this trait, won’t make so that you will be able to beat those eles who murder you already without even using that trait in the first place.

In the end of the day meta auramancer is just a support build not a duellist build and that’s where lots of arguments fall flat against.

Nerfing that trait won’t stop the people who whine now to come once again on the forum asking for more nerfs because they lost yet another 1vs1 against an ele

But guess what, no matter how much you whine on the forum….no game will ever be balanced around you, so get out there…and learn to adapt

Many reapers and other players did that, you can follow them..or you can keep ranting frustration on the forum.

P.S = for “You” I mean generally speaking

you still have not explained why what i proposed is a nerf.

i said rework.

now please explain.

Just make DS immune to damage and damage modifiers from conditions. Just apply the non damaging effects cc, chill, fear, immob, blind. Would that be balanced?

Diamond skin trait icon is fair. Also a possible rework would be to proc resistance on an incoming condition when above 90%.

How about changing diamond skin from a straight immunity to a passive 2 sec proc of resistance, with a reasonable cd?

rchu.8945:

Supreme.3164:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Ah man, gave me a good laugh!
Saying everything is currently about skill.. In this meta..

You just lost your last credibility.

Everything always comes down to personal level of skill, who lose now…will lose later

It’s a rather simple concept really, a nerf there and there won’t magically allow you to beat any player on the nerfed profession and that’s obvious I believe

The trait got clear weaknesses that requires some active thinking out of you, coming here to complain only shows that you( generally speaking) lack that ability to adapt to the situation.

The nerf to this trait, won’t make so that you will be able to beat those eles who murder you already without even using that trait in the first place.

In the end of the day meta auramancer is just a support build not a duellist build and that’s where lots of arguments fall flat against.

Nerfing that trait won’t stop the people who whine now to come once again on the forum asking for more nerfs because they lost yet another 1vs1 against an ele

But guess what, no matter how much you whine on the forum….no game will ever be balanced around you, so get out there…and learn to adapt

Many reapers and other players did that, you can follow them..or you can keep ranting frustration on the forum.

P.S = for “You” I mean generally speaking

Where were you before the nerf to Chronobunker? You could’ve post the same thing…

They nerfed it because it deserved to be nerfed, Diamond skin doesn’t, or have they nerfed it already?

kuritsutian.2987:

rchu.8945:

Supreme.3164:

Terrorsquad.4802:

Supreme.3164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Supreme.3164:

pfff..whatever ..like I care anyway

but you cared enough to post a reply here !

Everything is a matter of personal skill….who lose now…will lose later still

Ah man, gave me a good laugh!
Saying everything is currently about skill.. In this meta..

You just lost your last credibility.

Everything always comes down to personal level of skill, who lose now…will lose later

It’s a rather simple concept really, a nerf there and there won’t magically allow you to beat any player on the nerfed profession and that’s obvious I believe

The trait got clear weaknesses that requires some active thinking out of you, coming here to complain only shows that you( generally speaking) lack that ability to adapt to the situation.

The nerf to this trait, won’t make so that you will be able to beat those eles who murder you already without even using that trait in the first place.

In the end of the day meta auramancer is just a support build not a duellist build and that’s where lots of arguments fall flat against.

Nerfing that trait won’t stop the people who whine now to come once again on the forum asking for more nerfs because they lost yet another 1vs1 against an ele

But guess what, no matter how much you whine on the forum….no game will ever be balanced around you, so get out there…and learn to adapt

Many reapers and other players did that, you can follow them..or you can keep ranting frustration on the forum.

P.S = for “You” I mean generally speaking

Where were you before the nerf to Chronobunker? You could’ve post the same thing…

They nerfed it because it deserved to be nerfed, Diamond skin doesn’t, or have they nerfed it already?

They nerfed it because it was overused and overpowered in a tournament, just like what happened to DD ele. They didn’t give a darn before the tournament became a lauging stock.

I would not use the argument " if it was needed to be nerfed, it would be already" with anet. There are several pages of bugs, which are needed to bi fixed two years ago, but are still in the game.

Diamond skin is the best, when I have it equipped it means I get 5,000 toughness that stops people being able to hit me for 1,700 damage. THEY DO HALF DAMAGE TO ME!!!!

What’s protection? Oh the Ele can’t spam protection you’re silly! No they don’t have a tonne of physical hit negation or get a buff to protection… It’s definetly Diamond skin thats OP for sure.

sephiroth.4217:

Diamond skin is the best, when I have it equipped it means I get 5,000 toughness that stops people being able to hit me for 1,700 damage. THEY DO HALF DAMAGE TO ME!!!!

What’s protection? Oh the Ele can’t spam protection you’re silly! No they don’t have a tonne of physical hit negation or get a buff to protection… It’s definetly Diamond skin thats OP for sure.

You don’t even know which one diamon skin is.

Stone Hart = you wont take critical damage
Diamond Skin= immune to conditions if you’re over 90% hp.

People need to understand that breaking the 10% barrier and dumping a full load of conditions is actually easy. If you can’t see the big letters in red that read “Immune” then you deserve to get pwned. Just do some damage and load the conditions after that. If anything, they should make it clear, with an icon or some sort of animation so people don’t need to read the red word immune.

If you see the icon of a heart, then you know you wont do much if you’re a power spec. Just let your condi teammates handle the ele or wait for the ele to leave earth.

Imo they have enough hard counters that its really not a problem. It’s a 10% health threshold. If you strip their boons they go down crazy quick.

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

They might as well.

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

Sounds pretty similar to me.

Iron Skin warrior 10% effective health versus condi’s = 2821 with Soldier amulet
DS auramancer 10% effective health versus power = 2586 with Cele amulet

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

Sounds pretty similar to me.

Iron Skin warrior 10% effective health versus condi’s = 2821 with Soldier amulet
DS auramancer 10% effective health versus power = 2586 with Cele amulet

10% of ele base health is 1165 vs 1921 for warrior. Cele amulet can add like 500ish to that which applys to both classes.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Health

Not to mention condition damage is over time and can be cleared. So I see some pretty glaring differences.

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. wow really. you said it, not me.

so thats ok for someone pure condi but if someone is pure power then its not ok….

and yes warrior has more hp making that 10% more but condi does such high damage and is not mitigated by toughness or protection. one burn tick and its gone so yea lets add this to warriors asap plz

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

Sounds pretty similar to me.

Iron Skin warrior 10% effective health versus condi’s = 2821 with Soldier amulet
DS auramancer 10% effective health versus power = 2586 with Cele amulet

10% of ele base health is 1165 vs 1921 for warrior. Cele amulet can add like 500ish to that which applys to both classes.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Health

Not to mention condition damage is over time and can be cleared. So I see some pretty glaring differences.

I even gave Ele an advantage in the effective health comparison by using Soldier’s amulet on the Warrior (900 vs 560 Vit).No one runs around without armor and amulets in Pvp, so tell my why base health means more than real effective health.

And as for condi’s being cleared, health can also renewed by auras, soothing mist, healing skills, etc. Ele’s have as many ways of healing as Warriors have healing and condi clear. Ele’s also ignore soft CC and CC conditions like Chill, Fear, and Immob. Warriors wouldn’t ignore power based knockback, just the power damage. Hahaha dang, I didn’t think this would look so even.

A tempest can easily burst down by two people. One breaks the 90% threshold and once a condi reaper or condi rev applies his condition burst, the tempest is dead.

So diamond skin really is only strong in 1v1. Could someone please explain to me why everyone thinks that he is supposed to be able to kill a bunker spec in a 1v1?

cursE.1794:

A tempest can easily burst down by two people. One breaks the 90% threshold and once a condi reaper or condi rev applies his condition burst, the tempest is dead.

So diamond skin really is only strong in 1v1. Could someone please explain to me why everyone thinks that he is supposed to be able to kill a bunker spec in a 1v1?

It’s not only strong 1v1, it’s only impossible to kill 1v1. Do you not understand that auramancer is designed as a teamfight spec and that the only place it can be killed is also the place where it is most useful? An auramancer getting burst down in a 2v1 is the result of the auramancer being out of position.

It’s not only strong 1v1, it’s only impossible to kill 1v1. Do you not understand that auramancer is designed as a teamfight spec

And in a teamfight, diamond skin is broken easily. So if the purpose of the ele is to pick teamfights, what is your point again? It really is “I want to be able to beat a bunker 1v1”, isn’kitten

Edit: Nice, isn’t#it is being censored.

cursE.1794:

It’s not only strong 1v1, it’s only impossible to kill 1v1. Do you not understand that auramancer is designed as a teamfight spec

And in a teamfight, diamond skin is broken easily. So if the purpose of the ele is to pick teamfights, what is your point again? It really is “I want to be able to beat a bunker 1v1”, isn’kitten

Edit: Nice, isn’t#it is being censored.

No, my point is right there. The only time Ele’s can be killed is in the situations they are most useful in. Is that “I want to be able to 1v1 bunkers” your fallback so you can ignore criticism?

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

Sounds pretty similar to me.

Iron Skin warrior 10% effective health versus condi’s = 2821 with Soldier amulet
DS auramancer 10% effective health versus power = 2586 with Cele amulet

10% of ele base health is 1165 vs 1921 for warrior. Cele amulet can add like 500ish to that which applys to both classes.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Health

Not to mention condition damage is over time and can be cleared. So I see some pretty glaring differences.

I even gave Ele an advantage in the effective health comparison by using Soldier’s amulet on the Warrior (900 vs 560 Vit).No one runs around without armor and amulets in Pvp, so tell my why base health means more than real effective health.

And as for condi’s being cleared, health can also renewed by auras, soothing mist, healing skills, etc. Ele’s have as many ways of healing as Warriors have healing and condi clear. Ele’s also ignore soft CC and CC conditions like Chill, Fear, and Immob. Warriors wouldn’t ignore power based knockback, just the power damage. Hahaha dang, I didn’t think this would look so even.

So I’m saying that your math appears to be off for the ele. If you’re looking at just base health plus cele ammy that’s not 2500. Base health matters because they can both use any ammy or rune. And if you don’t address the fact that everyone has base power damage but no base condition damage then I still don’t get how you expect a zerker to break that threshold 1v1. They are completely different.

meow one twenty.4376:

cursE.1794:

It’s not only strong 1v1, it’s only impossible to kill 1v1. Do you not understand that auramancer is designed as a teamfight spec

And in a teamfight, diamond skin is broken easily. So if the purpose of the ele is to pick teamfights, what is your point again? It really is “I want to be able to beat a bunker 1v1”, isn’kitten

Edit: Nice, isn’t#it is being censored.

No, my point is right there. The only time Ele’s can be killed is in the situations they are most useful in. Is that “I want to be able to 1v1 bunkers” your fallback so you can ignore criticism?

I can totally kill a tempest on a rev with boon strip 1v1. It’s quite fun. It helps having played a lot of tempest and knowing when to cc but it’s not crazy hard.

meow one twenty.4376:

No, my point is right there. The only time Ele’s can be killed is in the situations they are most useful in. Is that “I want to be able to 1v1 bunkers” your fallback so you can ignore criticism?

Funny that you mentioned it twice. So I guess this is the way it’s supposed to be according to your logic: “The only time Ele’s can be killed is in the situations they are the least useful.” Right? If the situation where you can kill an ele is the situation he is also most useful in, then that is exactly how you should balance stuff.

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

Sounds pretty similar to me.

Iron Skin warrior 10% effective health versus condi’s = 2821 with Soldier amulet
DS auramancer 10% effective health versus power = 2586 with Cele amulet

10% of ele base health is 1165 vs 1921 for warrior. Cele amulet can add like 500ish to that which applys to both classes.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Health

Not to mention condition damage is over time and can be cleared. So I see some pretty glaring differences.

I even gave Ele an advantage in the effective health comparison by using Soldier’s amulet on the Warrior (900 vs 560 Vit).No one runs around without armor and amulets in Pvp, so tell my why base health means more than real effective health.

And as for condi’s being cleared, health can also renewed by auras, soothing mist, healing skills, etc. Ele’s have as many ways of healing as Warriors have healing and condi clear. Ele’s also ignore soft CC and CC conditions like Chill, Fear, and Immob. Warriors wouldn’t ignore power based knockback, just the power damage. Hahaha dang, I didn’t think this would look so even.

So I’m saying that your math appears to be off for the ele. If you’re looking at just base health plus cele ammy that’s not 2500. Base health matters because they can both use any ammy or rune. And if you don’t address the fact that everyone has base power damage but no base condition damage then I still don’t get how you expect a zerker to break that threshold 1v1. They are completely different.

Armor is being ignored on the Warrior, since conditions (the only thing that could take out this hypothetical 10% health) don’t observe it. It is, however, being factored into the Ele.

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

Sounds pretty similar to me.

Iron Skin warrior 10% effective health versus condi’s = 2821 with Soldier amulet
DS auramancer 10% effective health versus power = 2586 with Cele amulet

10% of ele base health is 1165 vs 1921 for warrior. Cele amulet can add like 500ish to that which applys to both classes.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Health

Not to mention condition damage is over time and can be cleared. So I see some pretty glaring differences.

I even gave Ele an advantage in the effective health comparison by using Soldier’s amulet on the Warrior (900 vs 560 Vit).No one runs around without armor and amulets in Pvp, so tell my why base health means more than real effective health.

And as for condi’s being cleared, health can also renewed by auras, soothing mist, healing skills, etc. Ele’s have as many ways of healing as Warriors have healing and condi clear. Ele’s also ignore soft CC and CC conditions like Chill, Fear, and Immob. Warriors wouldn’t ignore power based knockback, just the power damage. Hahaha dang, I didn’t think this would look so even.

So I’m saying that your math appears to be off for the ele. If you’re looking at just base health plus cele ammy that’s not 2500. Base health matters because they can both use any ammy or rune. And if you don’t address the fact that everyone has base power damage but no base condition damage then I still don’t get how you expect a zerker to break that threshold 1v1. They are completely different.

Effective health is the amount of damage they can take after damage reduction modifiers are accounted for. If you have Protection your effective health against power damage increases. Conditions only have damage mitigation from gear and stats in the form of Runes, which I didnt account for either class because only the most effective/common builds matter and I’m not going to guess what the most effective/common combinations would be if Iron Skin was a thing. This is the same for amulets. I gave the ele an amulet with lower vitality and it had near the same amount of effective health as the Warrior, meaning I even gave you and advantage PLUS I also didn’t account for your toughness.

I don’t expect a zerker to break through the threshold, just like I dont expect a condi class to break through DS. That’s the point, silly.

cursE.1794:

meow one twenty.4376:

No, my point is right there. The only time Ele’s can be killed is in the situations they are most useful in. Is that “I want to be able to 1v1 bunkers” your fallback so you can ignore criticism?

Funny that you mentioned it twice. So I guess this is the way it’s supposed to be according to your logic: “The only time Ele’s can be killed is in the situations they are the least useful.” Right? If the situation where you can kill an ele is the situation he is also most useful in, then that is exactly how you should balance stuff.

I didnt say it is bad, I was just clarifying what I was saying. Remember, I’m supposedly on the side that believes Iron Skin should be added to Warrior and that it is balanced because it is like DS on Ele.

Someday.3650:

sephiroth.4217:

Diamond skin is the best, when I have it equipped it means I get 5,000 toughness that stops people being able to hit me for 1,700 damage. THEY DO HALF DAMAGE TO ME!!!!

What’s protection? Oh the Ele can’t spam protection you’re silly! No they don’t have a tonne of physical hit negation or get a buff to protection… It’s definetly Diamond skin thats OP for sure.

You don’t even know which one diamon skin is.

Stone Hart = you wont take critical damage
Diamond Skin= immune to conditions if you’re over 90% hp.

People need to understand that breaking the 10% barrier and dumping a full load of conditions is actually easy. If you can’t see the big letters in red that read “Immune” then you deserve to get pwned. Just do some damage and load the conditions after that. If anything, they should make it clear, with an icon or some sort of animation so people don’t need to read the red word immune.

If you see the icon of a heart, then you know you wont do much if you’re a power spec. Just let your condi teammates handle the ele or wait for the ele to leave earth.

I thought the sarcasm stood out enough lol… Guess not.

any class that doesnt put all its eggs in 1 basket can deal with the 10% damage required to drop the DS , stop playing the equally OP condi spamfest zomg 9 condis in 4 seconds but I cant do 1800 damage . Competent players can dismantle a DS tempest the same as any other class

Defiling Treekiller.1632:

any class that doesnt put all its eggs in 1 basket can deal with the 10% damage required to drop the DS , stop playing the equally OP condi spamfest zomg 9 condis in 4 seconds but I cant do 1800 damage . Competent players can dismantle a DS tempest the same as any other class

except the fact that auramancer can constantly outheal that 1800 damage..

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

meow one twenty.4376:

HipposWild.7185:

Milan.9035:

leave it as is.

give warrior iron skin, immune to power damage if health above 90%.

That’s not really the same…. warrior already has highest base toughness and health. Regular damage is way higher than condi and innate. If you don’t have might or condi dmg a zerker would literally never get through that. There are hard counters but that would be pretty insane.

Sounds pretty similar to me.

Iron Skin warrior 10% effective health versus condi’s = 2821 with Soldier amulet
DS auramancer 10% effective health versus power = 2586 with Cele amulet

10% of ele base health is 1165 vs 1921 for warrior. Cele amulet can add like 500ish to that which applys to both classes.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Health

Not to mention condition damage is over time and can be cleared. So I see some pretty glaring differences.

I even gave Ele an advantage in the effective health comparison by using Soldier’s amulet on the Warrior (900 vs 560 Vit).No one runs around without armor and amulets in Pvp, so tell my why base health means more than real effective health.

And as for condi’s being cleared, health can also renewed by auras, soothing mist, healing skills, etc. Ele’s have as many ways of healing as Warriors have healing and condi clear. Ele’s also ignore soft CC and CC conditions like Chill, Fear, and Immob. Warriors wouldn’t ignore power based knockback, just the power damage. Hahaha dang, I didn’t think this would look so even.

So I’m saying that your math appears to be off for the ele. If you’re looking at just base health plus cele ammy that’s not 2500. Base health matters because they can both use any ammy or rune. And if you don’t address the fact that everyone has base power damage but no base condition damage then I still don’t get how you expect a zerker to break that threshold 1v1. They are completely different.

Effective health is the amount of damage they can take after damage reduction modifiers are accounted for. If you have Protection your effective health against power damage increases. Conditions only have damage mitigation from gear and stats in the form of Runes, which I didnt account for either class because only the most effective/common builds matter and I’m not going to guess what the most effective/common combinations would be if Iron Skin was a thing. This is the same for amulets. I gave the ele an amulet with lower vitality and it had near the same amount of effective health as the Warrior, meaning I even gave you and advantage PLUS I also didn’t account for your toughness.

I don’t expect a zerker to break through the threshold, just like I dont expect a condi class to break through DS. That’s the point, silly.

So first off all protection is completely removable which is how you kill an ele fast. It is available to warrior a well and not a valid adjustment.

As you said it doesn’t even account for the difference between light and heavy armor. Base light armor is 920 vs heavy being 1211 which means base line warrior takes 30% less physical damage. That gets diluted by runes but it’s very misleading to claim effective health of ele needs to be increased because they have good access to protection which decreases damage similar to the toughness factors.

If they didn’t split the classes health and armor it would be way easier to balance but they don’t.

Second as I said before you have base power damage. It’s not necessarily going to be amazing on condi specs but on zerker specs you have virtually no condi damage. That is a massive difference.