Guild Wars 2

Gaudrath.6725:

No, not at all. I have no problem with a “reluctant hero” – Aragorn (LOTR) is one, and is one of my favourite characters.

Aragorn is a different type of reluctant hero. Aragorn was born to be king, however he constantly refuses to take up the mantle until the story changes him and makes him both capable and willing to do so. It would have been rather strange to see Aragorn go straight from being Strider in Bree to demanding that Denethor make him king without all the pages of character development in between. Thus Aragorn taking up the mantle of the king in Return of the King is a natural and expected progression of the story which is why it works.

Trahearne however does go straight from being Strider to being made king and that is where the problem lies as he is clearly unfit for the position at the time when he is made leader and he is made leader at a time when there were people who were actually qualified and able to lead the Pact.

In my opinion, Doern Velazquez would have made a much better Marshall than Trahearne. Trahearne just seems to have absolutely no character and is pretty boring. i wish they would have made another Prince Rurik like character.

As I was sitting around in the final story instance, listening to that nice music, I had a bit of a think.

Trahearne’s like, this kitten that you don’t like at all, but you have to work with as a part of your job. Meanwhile you’re essentially batman, doing all the heavy lifting and not really giving a kitten about whether or not people know you did it. You care about getting the job done, whatever it takes. Right there at the end, Trahearne isn’t even there, he’s off being a kitten while it’s basically just you and an airship and a lot of cannons vs zhaitan, also I guess 4 other players and destiny’s edge, but no one cares about or notices them.

You win, you head back, you stop by Trahearne’s place, you tell him he’s a kitten and never to contact you again, then you head out and celebrate with the people, throw a few fireworks, and just enjoy your victory. “Fear Not This Night” is like your personal theme song, no matter how dark things get, you’ll be there to do the right thing and make the difference.

That’s how it happened in my head and I enjoyed it a lot more that way. It may be egotistical as hell, but screw you, what happened to ‘personal’ story.

I dont mind my hero being a sidekick or even just a small cog in the overall scheme of things , but Traherne has no charisma what so ever . Like someone else already said , he is a walking cabbage

I totally agree, after all of the trailers showing Destiny’s Edge, i thought that the game would revolve around them; instead they just seemed like a insignificant side story.
I was gutted when i learnt that the drawling Sylvari would be leader of the Pact. It should have been Destiny’s Edge, showing racial unity as well as the unity of the orders. I hope they kill off Trahearne in the next campaign to make room for a better Pact Marshal

Watching Pact characters, especially the top-ranked Order Liaisons, talk to Trahearne about “how good [he’s] doing” and “how much [he’s] grown as a leader” seemed insanely condescending. I was actually embarrassed for him. He made a couple of droning speeches, and took all his cues from a literal army of subordinates more qualified than him, and everyone started praising him in near the same tone of voice with which I congratulate my Dog for waiting until he’s outside to poop.

A big part of the problem is that I wobbled between feeling like I was secretly in command of the Pact, and feeling like I wasn’t even a member of it. Members of my own Order almost never knew who I was (not surprising given that I was also fast-tracked to a high rank without really earning it). Grunts and Gate Guards told me I didn’t have proper security clearance for various things until after I’d already slain Zhaitan. If I had been better integrated as a part of an actual command structure, maybe I’d feel something other than contempt for Trahearne as a leader. As is, I can only assume the Pact just sort of rumbled on with the inertia of its components, and any leadership from “the top” was accidental.

If my function had been as an Elite Troubleshooter, reporting to the top brass but outside the traditional command structure, everything would have made a lot more sense. As it was, I was a Commander who didn’t actually command anything, except my superior officer. I wound up being ordered around by the flunkies I was sent into the field to support almost as often as I picked the plan of action before handing it up to Trahearne. This was especially jarring on those missions where he decides to play the Captain On The Away Mission, despite there being no tactical reason why he’s needed, when some random Vigil dude would yell “OVER HERE! WE NEED TO GO THIS WAY!” and Trahearne and I would both immediately fall in line like raw cadets.

The whole thing was just sloppy. It feels like they didn’t take the time to read the individual script chunks in order to see if it was coherent before sending them off to the voice actors.

CONSTRUCTIVE PORTION:

If I rewrote it, the Order Leaders would play a much more active role as the effective command staff. Trahearne would be a respected adviser and expert, one given pretty much any resources he requested to accomplish his Wild Hunt, which would still be second on the Pact’s goal list only to killing Zhaitan, but not actually in the chain of command. The Player Character would occupy a similar position, but where Trahearne gets respect as an academic expert on Orr, the PC would get respect as a seriously bad dude who can be sent into Hell itself and trusted to bring back the keys to the Devil’s car. This would require much greater build-up on the PC’s reputation, and I’d probably want to at least double the length of the Order story arcs to justify the buildup of that reputation and rise to high rank. And, again, the PC would be one of several such professional bad mofos, so you wouldn’t feel like the only one who’s doing anything, and so all the downtime between missions (if you do them at the earliest level they become available) wouldn’t feel so bizarre, like the Pact was just picking its nose.

I’m playing a new Sylvari Ranger right now, on the story path that introduces Trahearne earliest and uses him the heaviest. One of my goals is to do all story missions at the listed level and no later, but to also do all the Dungeon Story Modes at the earliest chance, to see if the reappearance of Destiny’s Edge feels a little less jarring if I’ve woven them into the story on the recommended schedule. I’ll return and report in a couple weeks.

Melchior.2135:

It feels like they didn’t take the time to read the individual script chunks in order to see if it was coherent before sending them off to the voice actors.

That . . . is what stuck out for me most, yes, and it was a persistent issue once I had actually gotten through the story and had time to look back.

I dislike Trahearne because he made me feel like he is dodging fights all the time. like okay, you go kill all the baddies while I stay here and study our next move.

He is also projected like an emo kid, after completing a personal story “section” he had to run away, make the players go look for him in the air ship, just so that section of the story could end. peekaboo...at the end when everyone was celebrating he had to hide .... and players have to go and beg him to come join in the celebration, what the heck was that

Also, if I was playing a Sylvari and Trahearne is introduced into the personal story line, i could maybe understand it, but in every personal story, there he is! I thought we were going to be involve more with Destiny’s Edge, not that they are any more interesting… or a separate/different “guide” for each race. He single-handedly made replying personal story dull. (beside the stingy rewards)

Tybalt was a very good character, make more like him.

Earlier during this college term, my creative writing instructor was mentioning something to the effect of “you don’t introduce a main character half way into a story.” My immediate thought was: Trahearne. Unless you’re Sylvari, he just randomly pops into “your” story halfway through leaving you wonder “Who the hell does this guy think he is?”

I think it would have been a better tie in to Destiny’s Edge if Caithe had taken charge. Zojja and Eir had their issues, as did Rytlock and Logan; which leaves Caithe. Wasn’t that part of what GW2 was supposed to be? The rise of Sylvari as a race? What better way than to have Caithe take charge where the members of the older races failed in Destiny’s Edge. I think this would have added better symbolism, which is greatly lacking in what was released.

I also had issue, at least as far as the Human story line goes, with the leap we had to make at level 20. We wrap up our circus story, or find the lost sister, then all of a sudden you have to leave to join one of the orders. I needed a better connection between what was happening in Kryta and the Risen.

I got this sense of:
“You did great hero! Now go join an order, bigger things you have no knowledge about are happening.” And my character just bought it. It made my character look mindless, taking orders without thought. No one wants to play that character.

The writers didn’t have enough of my trust yet to make the jump from finding my parents to going to fight elder dragons.

just adding my voice to the many, absolutely dispise Trahearne, his character is bland, and that is putting it lightly, introduced way too late.
I cant help myself but [skip] every single time he starts talking, after having it done once, he completely ruins the personal story for me.

I would love it if ANet could see how many times someone [skip]’s a chatline/voiceover, and see which ones are skipped i can only imagine the numbers Trahearne would pull.

Now when i played a Sylvari it seemed abit more “alright”, how he gets introduced, you have mett him afterall before, any other race however.. your more inclined to go “who is this wimp?”

As voiced earlier in this thread, i would have been fine with Destiny’s Edge leading the pact, but not Trahearne.

By my point of view, the whole story is just a little too bright.

I mean… Humans were presented on the edge of extintion.
Charrs as a brutal, technocratic empire trying to rule the world.
Asura as a sort of a species of racist scientists that sees all other species as animals.

Those background are really dark. Cool, by my point of view.

Then what I saw was a story where everything was at peace, war was only against some odd races, some of theme looked more like parodies (like the grawls and the dredge). The idea of the Pact itself was the most predictable thing: everyone is uniting, why shouldn’t have the Orders done the same?

I fought some presence of grudge only among separatists. Someone actually against the system our characters are born in. You don’t even hear renegades or flame legions. From what I saw, they just look like the bad guys.

Even the part about the ghosts of Ascalon was a bit spoiled. As a charr, I felt all the grudge they had against me. It was cool. Then, when I stepped out of the citadel, I found out they were seen as a nuisance even by other humans: “Ah, yeah, those pesky ghosts”.

Personally, I would have preferred a darker story, going something like this:

The Orders don’t want to forge the Pact.

The players go up in the ranking with their own orders.

At some point, they are reached by some sort of mysterious entity. This entity persuade us of the fact the Orders must be united by any means. You need to weaken the lords to make the Orders bend to your will.

So you start a series of missions to put them one against each other. In the chaos that follows, you manage to eliminate all the commanders of each Order.
This could happen in various ways: you could kill the General of the Vigil in a fight, you could convince one race’s lord to execute the chief of the Orde of Whispers, and so on. And maybe you could manipulate everything n a way that you partners on each order may become the new commanders, while being dependant on you.

Then you convince Trahearne to follow your cause, and you somehow force him to become the Great Marshal of the new Pact. But he remains a puppet into your hands, and you should use every occasion to remind him.

That would be coherent with the fact every player would follow that story: you are just a part of a group of individuals who is working under the guide of this misterious entity, all working on their own to destroy the Order’s autonomy.

And that would satisfy more kind of characters: the hero would be doing that for a greater good. The mercenary would be doing that for his lust of power. Another player would be doing that just to create chaos.

And all would bring more personality to your character even in the cutscenes, instead of being some sort of boring boyscout.

The mysterious entity would have also been an interesting step for the story in another expansion.

Like many posts here have stated, I agree that we, the players, should have been the leader of the Pact, not Trahearne. First, we are the main focus of the entire story, not Trahearne. Second, we are the ones who put our efforts in rescuing our Orders from the Undead while Trahearne just stands there talking. Third, Trahearne is a scholar; it’s more likely that he stands with Durmand Priory, despite of the fact that he is not in any order. So, it does not make sense that the Orders want him instead of us, players. Moreover, we are the ones who unite the three Orders, not Trahearne. He basically just agrees and says like “Yes, yes, great idea, Hero, it’s great that we all fight together. Oh, who’s in charge? Me? Sure! And you be my second.” There goes my promotion! Trahearne, you thief!

And actually, being in an Order is not a valid reason at all because there are ways to make us the leader. For example, the three leaders of the Orders can test us to see whether we are qualified for being the marshal of the Pact. Almorra Soulkeeper may engage in combat with us to see if we have the courage of Vigil. Maybe, Riel can assign us a task, such as retrieving certain information from one of her hidden agents, to test if we have the cunning of Whispers. Lastly, Gixx probably can test us with riddles or puzzles to see if we have the wisdom of Priory. Through testing, it makes a lot more sense why they come to a conclusion why we are fitted to be a leader. And Trahearne? I don’t see what he did to earn himself a rank of Marshal other than whining all the time. Maybe the Pact believes that a whiner can save the world from the threat of the dragons? (lol)

Well, I think it would be a bit odd if all players became Grand Marshalls.

I think the players should control the Pact indirectly. i. e. Trahearne is in charge, but he gets orders from you.

This way you could say the Pact is guided by a mysterious group of fighters above everything, the true protectors of Tyria whose names will never be known.

redslion.9675:

Well, I think it would be a bit odd if all players became Grand Marshalls.

I think the players should control the Pact indirectly. i. e. Trahearne is in charge, but he gets orders from you.

This way you could say the Pact is guided by a mysterious group of fighters above everything, the true protectors of Tyria whose names will never be known.

That’s basically what I got from most of the cinematics.

“Trahearne we have this neat bibblededoo to stop the Risen!”
“Or we can simply use this Ermbibble to do the same thing.”
(Trahearne): “Hmmm we do need to stop the Hamena Hamena, so what do you think is best Commander?”
(The Player): “I choose the bibblededoo.”

While I really dislike Trahearne, I thought Logan was a lot worse. I just helped a random team finish their storyline, and that whole final scene with Logan staying behind is so stupid. Its just bad writing. We already dislike Logan for being a goody-two-shoes with no character what so ever, and then they introduce this contrived plot device where for some reason no one can just cut the bloody airship loose. So he must stay behind. This whole “noble” sacrifice could have meant something, if Logan didn’t pop up moments later on a brand new much bigger airship that he just pulled right out of his pants. Terrible writing.

Both Logan and Trahearne suffer from the Mary-Sue syndrome where they feel like you are watching someone’s favorite DnD character. This is the sort of thing that can ruin any story. A character is introduced that the writers love, and is pushed to the fore front, but without giving the players a good reason to love him as well. And since the writers make him the focus point of the plot, it turns all the players against that character. He steals their spotlight, when he doesn’t deserve it.

I’ve been feeling compelled to finish the personal story recently, and (cheesy/cliche as the whole thing is) I’ve found the writing for Trahearne to be pretty decent – the way he seems to exceed his own (often pessimistic) expectations.

But the one thing I absolutely cannot stand is the VO – it is so unbelievably bland and lifeless, breaking what little immersion there is as well as the context of the dialogue. I’m sorry to have to say that, but if it were an option he should have a completely fresh voice over.

I can see why Trahearne is a necromancer – he certainly sounds like one of the dead. :p

Edit: I should say, I like that Trahearne is the leader of the Pact, rather than our own characters always being put on a pedestal as in most game stories.

I’m just gonna leave this here…

Trahearne = Palawa Joko. Nuff said.

The thing that kills me about Trahearne is that he overshadows/takes credit for nearly everything I’ve done in the game.

My first playthrough with him on my Thief annoyed me to no end.

Instead of feeling like a Marshall with command and power over my story, I happened to be a lackey advisory to Trahearne.

This wouldn’t have even bothered me if he had brought some compelling awesome moments to the story, but no. He doesn’t do that. He’s about as bland as celery (Insert Sylvari/Celery Comparison joke here). He doesn’t nothing exceptional; As a matter of fact, he does quite the opposite.

He literally fumbles throughout the storyline looking to you for guidance at every single turn, and what does he do? Gets all the credit as the main hero simply because he just so happened to have been given a Leek of Risen Repelling from some Ancient Radish in the grove. It’s bull crap.

And where does that leave me in the Glory? I feel more or less as a second command look-over. Sure, I have my moments where, “Oh, they acknowledge me. Nice” but it’s literally nothing compared to the ego sucking that Trahearne gets on the regular.

I’m not narcissistic saying that it ALL has to be about me, but for fudge’s sake, at least make the protagonist I’m following not a fumbling clueless who just so happens to snatch the headline while I probably get a slight honorable mention in the history book for doing practically everything.

He’s literally a vegetable the entire storyline. (Pun City in this post.)

You’d think that Arenanet would have figured out that players absolutely dislike “special” NPC characters who do mostly nothing and swoop in for the glory after all the hate that Kormir had from the players in Guild Wars: Nightfall.

What’s especially aggravating is that they had some really interesting characters who could have taken Trahearne’s place. I wouldn’t have minded if he was replaced with a kitten such as Warmaster Forgal Kernsson or one of the other Faction leaders. But nope, they killed them off quickly and gave us the boring plant-version of Kormir in Guild Wars 2…

I don’t get what everyone is so uptight about. I like trahearne, and that’s my opinion of course. I believe I never heard an NPC say, “Good job Trahearne you did it.” I must be crazy, because it feels to me, that we’re helping him with his wyld hunt, as he helps us get closer to defeating Zhaitan. It’s sort of a symbiosis kind of thing.

And from a roleplay stance, I would never make my character take credit for jack, especially if there are people helping me… yet always in almost every story it’s "good job hero, you did this, by yourself, with no help at all NPCS who helped me huffing in a corner.

That’s honestly all I have to say. and saying we know nothing about trahearne… we knew nothing about Sieran’s past, Forgal’s, and the OoW ( I haven’t gone that route yet). We just met them, said “Hi, gonna work together”, and went off and an adventure. We knew nothing about about the Charr duo, cept that they may secretly be in love with eachother. All I’m saying is REALLY look at stuff before you make your judgement.

Trahearne is the Jar Jar Binks of the guild wars universe.

He is just obscenely boring. I already know how he is (not) gonna react to everything. This character is so lame it makes other characters much more boring than what they may be.

I made a Charr character. A brutal, technocratic engineer. Something like a steampunk barbarian.

When I saw the first cinematic, I thought “Man, my character is gonna be a kitten. Exactly how I wanted him to be.”
The first missions didn’t disappoint me much. Even if I hoped with a bit more cooperetion with the character’s father (in the creation I chose he was from the Flame Legion).

But when I joined the Vigil, I felt my proud, aggressive explosives-loving engineer became some sort of boy scout. Some sort of tired comrade irony from Forgal. That’s all. Nothing else. But my character was almost ok.

Now I’m with Trahearne. And my character feels almost as boring as him. As if neither he gave a crap about Zhaitan or the Pact.

Aeonblade.8709:

Trahearne is the Jar Jar Binks of the guild wars universe.

Best answer yet!

Trahearne was a valueable asset to the pact. yes he may be a bit lacking right now but i believe that this character may be able to develop over future content. there are still 4 more elder dragons out there. but i can see Trahearne’s usefulness comming to an end because we was only an expert on Orr and Zhaitan. so mabey something tragic may happen to him or a different character may take charge of the pact. who knows. but i still believe his character can develop throughout the series. i also think that destiny’s edge should have more involvcement with the personal story instead of just showing up in dungeons. they got the band back together now lets see them in action in our personal stories.

Frankly I just couldn’t get over the fact that some pathetic talking plant is this thing im supposed to follow. Should of been destiny’s edge. I would of been happier having the skritt lead us through the campaign

Mepheles.2087:

And from a roleplay stance, I would never make my character take credit for jack, especially if there are people helping me… yet always in almost every story it’s "good job hero, you did this, by yourself, with no help at all NPCS who helped me huffing in a corner.

The problem is, this time Trahearne is the one hoarding the spotlight while you do the dirty work.

At least he has the decency to sleep through most missions (read: killed off by mobs)

Look at him:

he is short.

He has an enormous head compared to the rest of the body. Some enormous arms, too.

And runs around with that kittened expression on his face.

This guy must have been taken from some show for 4 years old kids.

Or, outshined by “My little pony”, he decided to start a new career as a MMORPG NPC.XD

I Think Trahearne is the least of our problem in terms of Personal Story.

Egon Vidar.9125:

Arcalithe.6057:

snip

I still like Trahearne and I think people are overreacting to him.

snip

You can think what you like, and you are free to like him, but it does not change the fact that he is a horrendously written character no matter how you cut it, at least to people who have at least vague familiarity with creative writing, proper character development, etc.

Similarly, Twilight has fans, but the series also has some of the most abysmal writing I’ve ever seen in a published piece of fiction.

Lori from The Walking Dead is actually a pretty good comparison, since you brought it up. She is a blatant, negative stereotype of women and exists solely to create cheap conflict in the plot, she has no depth beyond that. Trahearne is an equally cheap cardboard cut out of a character, he is a Gary Stu deus ex machina, sucking out anything remotely resembling depth in the plot every time he shows up.

The difference between them is that while they’re both utterly one dimensional, Lori seems to exist just to create easy strife and drama, making things feel like a soap opera every time she shows up. Trahearne on the other hand really does fit that deus ex machina label I gave him up there. No matter the problem, Trahearne will solve it, whether because he just magically has the right information, or because of that overpowered sword he lugs around.

And then he snatches away your credit. I think the writer might have unwittingly done something clever there, at least – with Trahearne stealing your credit, he looks very insecure, like he’s compensating for his own shortcomings. It fits well with his supposed reluctance.
If the writer was actually trying to write a completely unpleasant weasel of a character that almost everyone would hate, they succeeded with flying colors. I know it’s not intentional, though.

Anyway, telling a few hundred (or more..) people in the community who dislike him that they’re overreacting is laughable. I don’t think the problem lies with these people, as the word “overreacting” implies. I think it’s that all of these people are all spotting the same thing – that the writing and voice acting for this character are glaringly terrible.

…Really sorry to rag on the writing so much, but as someone who works in a creative field, too, I suspect Trahearne’s writer can probably take some honesty and critique.

Oh man your review made me cry of laugh xD

Wow, I have just discovered this thread and I am surprised that so many people have an issue with Trahearne.

I enjoyed the story and I enjoyed being a “junior partner” to Trahearne who is essentially a leader getting on-the-job-training.

In general, I am quite impressed with some attempts to make a stereotypical save-the-world story less stereotypical in some places. (The voices of Ogres and Hylek, the design of the charr females.)

There may be issues with his writing BUT real persons don’t always adhere to the rules of creative writing. This actually makes Trahearne more real to me. That is why I am always suspicious of people citing rules for creative writing and character development. Real characters don’t always follow these rules!!

The moment I realized something was up with Trahearne was when he wondered what to call the fort and I said, “There are three orders, how about Fort Trinity?” Then he turned to the group and said, “I have named it Fort Trinity.” Something was up. I decided to watch him closely.

Then someone hypnotised me and had me kill a bunch of soldiers. And then they tried to kill me directly. Trahearne said, “You’ve been the target all along, but it’s clear I’m really the target.” And gave no explanation for that. This made it obvious: he wanted to be me.

I said, “Of course, you’re right!”, now knowing full well he was a perfect figurehead, staying at the fort and being seen so I could leisurely defeat Zaitan instead of feeling all this pressure to do it right away. I mean I’d hate to really be leader. This way I got to save the world in my own time, spending a good few weeks in Lion’s Arch and hanging out at the beach between battles. Trahearne had to stick around pretending to be making decisions while really waiting for me to come make the choices (should we attack this or that? etc) so the missions moved forward.

The others were in on it. This was made obvious when Trahearne made a speech and everyone went crazy, telling him how he’d really come into his own and was such a great leader, all speaking in that “Oooh well done puppy” voice you save for people you like but don’t respect.

If I’m wrong, and Trahearne really was meant to be the hero, it wasn’t well done at all because my scenario makes so much more sense and is ultimately more satisfying.

Edited to say: Ok, I wrote the above when I’d done all but “Victory or Death.” Now I’ve finished that I suspect I’m not totally far off, though of course I exaggerated. I’ll write a new comment for specifics.

I agree with this. Arena Net could learn a thing or two from the deep personal stories in the New Star Wars Universe MMO, even thought its a dying one. The personal story is truly amazingly deep they even have romance and other crazy stuff.

Anyway to return to the point, this should be taken to account, you just CANT TAKE THE GLORY OF PLAYERS CHARACTERS LIKE THAT!!! Its not nice…or even cool.

First Strike out was Kormir, Second Strike out was Trahearne, will the third strike be Oogooth quaggan? lol

Tybaldt was awesome. He stood out because he was a very likeable character and in a way unpredictable. Trahearne’s character is just flat out boring and that emotionless voice? Come on Anet.

Just a few from WoW:
Sylvannas Windrunner – Battle of the Undercity where she literally jumped everywhere and rained death upon her enemies who dared invade her home with arrows. Holy respect!
Saurfang/Broxigar – Battle prowess, honor, glory and so much rage. So awesome.

Trahearne – Leader of the Pact. Flat voice, armed with a greatsword that hits like a noodle. Many hold him in high regard. What? Really!?

GET RID OF TRAHEARNE!!!!!!!!!!!

…

At least he didnt become a god.

/dodgerolls away from rotten vegetables/

Trahearne was pretty poorly VOed, but other than that he is a sound character. He doesn’t steal spotlight nor do anything stupid, though I guess his AI was a bit Kormir-like when you were fighting Risen around him.

Problem is personal story is linked with Trahearne. Trahearne is boring to say the least. I don’t feel moved to respect him. He is just a nuisance, and I feel bad for helping him.

And well, seeing how the whole Southsun affair went, I fear the whole game tends to avoid moral dilemmas. There is always the obvious “right thing” to do, and no reason not to do it. Seriously, I’m starting to fear going out of the Mists. My character’s story feels so lame I’m sad when my toon wins a battle.

I think you should take DC Universe as an example: adding some internal conflict, giving the chance to fight some important character (like the ones from Destiny’s Edge), having a lot of grey areas (at least if you play as a villain: Lex Luthor is definetely an ambiguous character). This way you can feel like going through a living world, who feels you are in there, by reacting to your presence and sometimes rejecting it.

I’ve just finished the Arah dungeon, story mode. I noticed that Destiny’s Edge and Trahearne are so disconnected, it really seems like DE were planned, with the novels and dungeons, and Trahearne was added later to actually give the player an excuse to not always do the next personal quest right away, and also tie things together and introduce more about the new race (Sylvari). It would explain why he was introduced so late, why we’re told about his greatness rather than shown, why he’s barely part of the victory celebration, never mentioned by DE, etc.

I’d love to hear a GW2 writer’s view on all this, but I’d understand if we never did, considering how bad the response has been to Trahearne.

redslion.9675:

And well, seeing how the whole Southsun affair went, I fear the whole game tends to avoid moral dilemmas. There is always the obvious “right thing” to do, and no reason not to do it. Seriously, I’m starting to fear going out of the Mists. My character’s story feels so lame I’m sad when my toon wins a battle.

You are spot on! Its not just that Trahearne is boring, but that everything in the storyline takes no risks what so ever. There hardly is any conflict, and characters fall into the stereotypical good and bad categories, but without motivation. The player’s main character is the most bland and boring character of all, and when Trahearne shows up this only further emphasizes how dull the player himself is. Its two boring characters talking to each other, without them ever showing any real emotion. They never really get angry, or really get sad. The story takes no risks.

Once Trahearne starts asking the player for advise, it becomes painfully obvious how unnecessary Trahearne is to the plot. There is no reason why they couldn’t have let the player give out the orders directly. You could remove Trahearne from the plot entirely, and nothing would have changed, except the player being the military leader now.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Trahearne: You’ve been the primary focus of these attacks so far, but it’s clear that I am the real target.
<Player Name>: That fits. If you can’t trust me, or I’m dead, you lose your second-in-command. It makes you and the Pact more vulnerable.

. . . sorry, that’d be my conclusion as well. Get rid of the Player Character and the Pact can’t survive. After all, we’re the thing that makes it actually work

No, this text says the Pact is more ‘vulnerable’ if our character is removed not “The Pact can’t possibly hold together” if our character is removed. We’re given no evidence at this point in the PS that Trahearne will have any problems finding another flunky if our characters completely vanished.

This said, I will say that I just finished the Arah dungeon and saw the finale of the PS. I became a bit more accepting of Trahearne when he steps out of the way and lets our character and Destiny’s Edge take on Zhaitan (Being forced to do it with four other player is another issue for another thread)

Still I agree with other people that Destiny’s Edge would have been better in the role of leading the story. I especially agree with ammayhem.5962’s comments that introducing a main character halfway in a story is not an effective thing to do.

redslion.9675:

And well, seeing how the whole Southsun affair went, I fear the whole game tends to avoid moral dilemmas. There is always the obvious “right thing” to do, and no reason not to do it. Seriously, I’m starting to fear going out of the Mists. My character’s story feels so lame I’m sad when my toon wins a battle.

I think the real problem is the lack of a good VILLAIN in the stories so far. The Elder Dragons and their mindless minions are about as interesting as an animal/force of nature. We’re only told they’re evil ‘just because’. They might as well just wear black hats like silent movie bad guys for all the motivation we know of them.

Canach isn’t much better. He’s yet another Secondborn sylari with a chip on his shoulder. We’ve seen this before and it worked with the Nightmare Court but a sylvari trying to prove himself to the Pale Tree by becoming a capitalist is pretty weird. And not really something most people will feel any real empathy toward especially given how badly Canach always seems to screw up.

Because empathy is CRITICAL for a villain. You need to understand their motivations and goals even if you don’t agree with their means. You need to understand their fears and hopes and even see how you might have ended up in their shoes if things were different. I don’t think most people could image doing anything that Canach has done and that’s a problem with understanding him as a villain.

You brought up Lex Luthor in your post. Now there is a villain. We understand Lex’s xenophobic fear of an all-powerful alien and we’re not proud of that part of ourselves, but we know we share that with him. And we even have to admire how a mere human would dare to take on someone like Superman. We don’t agree with his actions, but there is something in Lex Luthor for people to understand and empathize. We need to see some of that in GW2’s villains in the Living and Personal Story.

Trahearne is by far the worst idea that went into GW2. We start building up the epic story for our characters and BAM sidelined and turned into a sidekick for a nobody in a moment.

Whose idea was it? It seems like a rookie mistake to make the player a sidekick in their own PERSONAL Story.

Honestly you should set up a world ending scenario and kill him off in the middle of it Red Wedding Style and let the Player take his place as the hero snatching victory from the jaws of defeat.

Oh, and another thing:

My main is a charr

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Charr_hide_armor

Just look at it.

Now look at the interactions I, as a charr player have with humans.

Now think that these humans USED TO MAKE CLOTHES OUT OF MY ANCESTORS LESS THAN TWO CENTURIES AGO.

(GW2 is set 200 years after GW1, okay, but we don’t know when this habit stopped.)

Now… How is the fact that I’m acting nice to them justifiable?

I may not be contrary on the “let’s not exterminate ALL humans” part. But it’d be more like “you should be grateful your skin is too fragile to make an armor and your flesh is not tasty enough to make a decent meal, human”.

the PS was great initially but like others said revolved around being an exploration of the psyche of a plant, and basically soothing his ego, as if the potentialend of the world wasnt enough of a pain.

if i was the mother tree i woulda wooped his kitten and told him to stop being such a dandelion

And still… to make sure we understand the dramatic situation, each holiday all major cities of Tyria get full of obscene decoration.

Not saying they are ugly, but just that they are really much more extreme than any city on Earth, I guess (at least in my country i have never seen a whole city being decorated for the occasion).

Where did they even find his voice actor?

The guy sounds bored out of his mind, like he doesn’t give two ****s about what’s going on. There’s nothing as Jarring as hearing him say ‘To Arrah, and victory!…….’ in the most apathetic voice one can imagine.

i honestly think that if his voice was redone….and a few introduction missions for the other races that have no idea who the hell he is…i wouldn’t mind him so much

Well, somehow I like Trahaerne. Perhaps just because he is a calm thinker and not an overemotional clown.

Even his voice is ok for me. Maybe the voice actor could have done better, but I’m really fine with it.

No trolling, no sarcasm, no irony. I really mean it, lol.

I agree with the lack of introduction of him though. Luckily, I started as Sylvari, so I got him introduced properly and somehow liked how the story developed. As I played other races, it got a little wonky. He suddenly poped up like: “here I am, deal with it.”, and there you are, having this midget salad head, ordering you arround like Isaac in Dead Space.

On the other hand, it would have been difficult to be marshal by myself, because the story would have forced decisions onto me, I perhaps wouldn’t make myself.

So with Trahearne, there is a leading force, giving the direction of the story. I find this being neccessary.

Painking.4703:

Honestly I think it’s entirely for continuity reasons, same with Kormir jacking your spotlight in GW. They need to be able to say “Zhaitan was slain by Firstborn Sylvari Trahearne”. Not, “Zhaitain was slain by the commander of the pact but we know absolutely nothing about him.”

Zhaitan was slain by the pact and Destiny’s edge.

Zhaitan was slain with the firepower of an airship.