For Anet’s sake, I seriously recommend an analysis: How did such a terrible idea get all the way to the point of “we’re going to implement this” in the official forums?
I think I know the answer; there simply is no other reasonable or logical explanation!
I will make sure to stress the importance of spreading out among all the tiers when this comes around again. But, neither I nor John can force their decisions in a voluntary program.
I did, however, want to clear up the misconception that nobody was playing on the lower tiers during this past tournamnet, because I know for a fact that some were and brought back feedback that directly relates to the experiences on the lower end.
We understand and have seen the feedback regarding the proposed white swords change and the team is discussing that feedback.
WOW! Backpedal much? Did you have one, no maybe two devs on a low tier server? You understand? The reality is that WE are finally starting to UNDERSTAND, the “dev team” is pretty much clueless about WvW, which is rather obvious to those of us who actually do it. But hey, thanks for more of the same, with a little “dev participation” thrown in to spice things up.
The thing is that we have less guilds in lower tiers, so statistically people will end up more on higher tiers.
It wasn’t a random drawing of who goes where, so that’s irrelevant.
I was replying to Mark saying “your guilds in lower tier should have applied”
AFAIK only 1 guild from my world applied (Whiteside Ridge / EU). We also had the huge barrier of timezone, so no one was particularly encouraged to apply tbh.
If there are 20/30 guilds in a T1 server that apply and 2 in a T8, where people would end? Even if they have no idea of WvW (as few devs admitted, and people blamed on them, like everyone has to do everything) you still have more chance on picking an higher tier. Then you had up the standard preference for higher tiers that the average player has.
At any rate, this was a good brainstorming. Don’t pick the bad all time, sometimes you have to get trough a series of bad ideas to get to a good one, I don’t think this was a wasted last chance.
I sincerely hope there would be a new round of adopt a dev, maybe when a few of the tweaks will actually hit the game.
Emanuel Dawntree – Nord Guardian of [TasH] – 9×80 Whiteside Ridge
WOW! Backpedal much? Did you have one, no maybe two devs on a low tier server? You understand? The reality is that WE are finally starting to UNDERSTAND, the “dev team” is pretty much clueless about WvW, which is rather obvious to those of us who actually do it. But hey, thanks for more of the same, with a little “dev participation” thrown in to spice things up.
One developer did join Eredon Terrace, which was at the bottom of the rankings at the time, and did participate with the guild he joined. Another played on Darkhaven, which is also in Bronze. At least part of the problem is that the developers were adopted by guilds to go to guild stuff, which generally involves larger scale activity, even on low-tier servers, oriented toward attacking and not wandering the map alone or as part of a small group, refreshing siege, running upgrades, and so on.
I think there might be an even broader and impossible to solve issue here, which is that opinions about what’s good or bad and fun or awful in WvW varies considerably from person to person. Every developer could be paid to play on the bottom tier for a month, but they might never understand what a low-tier player finds appealing about playing on their server. If they think the goal of WvW is massive battles with so many people that it strains the playability of the game and that activity should be heavily guild oriented (which is what some of the recent events and megaservers suggest), then they might never understand what an independent roamer finds appealing about low tier play and low population map. At that point, they can either listen to what those players say and try not to ruin the game for them or they can decide that they can afford to lose those players and not worry about them and their concerns.
For Anet’s sake, I seriously recommend an analysis: How did such a terrible idea get all the way to the point of “we’re going to implement this” in the official forums?
For Anet’s sake, I seriously recommend an analysis: How did such a terrible idea get all the way to the point of “we’re going to implement this” in the official forums?
Probably because it’s an easy and quick thing to do.
And then the white knights can come along and claim Anet are bringing us updates, updates that “we” “asked” for!
I still want to know who “we” are!!!???
So far the only thing this “project” has done is yet again shine a light on the devs to show that they have no idea what they are doing with WvW, or rather what WvW is!
The WvW Forum Poster Formerly Known As Omaris Mortuus Est
The program was very positively received by our developers, so many of them are likely to participate again.
This shouldn’t be a choice for the wvw developers but rather mandatory. Seeing how things they implement affect wvw first hand on a regular basis seems like a pretty important thing.
So you want them to be paying these people to just sit there and play the game rather than work on the game? seems like a silly idea to me.
It’s not either or. It’s not a do this rather than that. It’s do both. Spend some time playing the game on a regular basis to know what is happening and how their work is being received by the people who are being subjected to it. See first hand how things they do impacts wvw instead of waiting for a blowup in the forums.
The Adopt-a-Dev program is a voluntary program. The developers who participate do so in their own free time and they choose from the guilds who apply to the program. If you want to see more developers participating in the lower tiers, then encourage more of the lower-tiered guilds to apply.
What I mean by mandatory is that those devs who work on wvw should be required to play wvw on a regular basis. Not as game testers but simply to know what the community at large thinks of how things are going. I don’t mean that it should be mandatory that they participate in an adopt-a-dev thing and get into guilds.
It is difficult for me imagine a worse change to WvW than the removal of white swords. Prior to reading that they were considering this, I thought the developers knew what they were doing and that the forum QQ was just QQ. Now I have doubts.
Yep to be honest thats what saddens me the most about these CDI. It lets us know that even though these things have been outline as issues or requested features for 2 years, devs are still only at the ‘lets talk about whats wrong’ stage…not 6 months into testing a developed solution. WvW will bleed out and be cold on the floor before they get round to doing anything.
I didn’t run with a dev, however, the only way for them to learn our side of WvW is to participate with us. I really respect and applaud the “AaD” initiative. They immersed themselves into the fray of how some of us play. Some play for PPT, some play for roaming, some play for karma, and even some just play for social interaction.
What better way to see our side of WvW then to become one of us? Hopefully, they will be able to get feedback that was also experienced by a dev. They will have a better understanding now on how adjustments and WvW traits effect other parts and play styles of the game. If the devs don’t enjoy “our” created ways to enjoy WvW then the game will never be what we want and should look elsewhere for fun. However, by experiencing “our” ways of WvW they may just like how we have fun and have never really understood it till now.
Thank you Anet for doing the initiative as it’s the best thing you have done since beta for the game of WvW.
Commander Togochubb aka Chubby
Perfect Dark [PD] – Yaks Bend
I think this is how the meeting played out, expect there was no 3rd guy :/
To be honest, I think a new map wouldn’t solve anything. At least not now. What they need to do first is fix what is broken. Population inbalance, Zergs being too effective, PPT, unreasonable achievements , reward reworks , commander usability etc.
Worse that a wasted chance: because all the devs adopted themselves to T1, we’re now going to have white swords removed. We would have been better off without the adopt-a-dev.
The bolded section is blatantly false. We had developers spread across all of the leagues. Don’t mistake your guild not getting a developer to mean there were no developers on your tier. If you want a developer in your guild, just apply again next time. The program was very positively received by our developers, so many of them are likely to participate again.
As example…
Some dev’s or Anet employees are on low WvW pop servers, true story.
1st April joke, when gw2 receives a “balance” update.
Dude, we all lost faith in you. No matter the ton of discussion going around. We gave you the chance. We wait for months. What you gave us? A freaking “Colored commander tag” and “Siege golem mastery”?
Come on Anet, stop trolling. If you want us to stay, get some manpower going on to WvW not a lol PvE. I’m sure the game will die if you keep adding those stupid pve one-time-map every two months.
WvWvW havent get a single great update ever. Nothing had been done to make it work. Orb hack? It was removed and completely forgot until today! Simply amazing how you people “IGNORED” WvW.
Dude, we all lost faith in you. No matter the ton of discussion going around. We gave you the chance. We wait for months. What you gave us? A freaking “Colored commander tag” and “Siege golem mastery”?
Come on Anet, stop trolling. If you want us to stay, get some manpower going on to WvW not a lol PvE. I’m sure the game will die if you keep adding those stupid pve one-time-map every two months.
WvWvW havent get a single great update ever. Nothing had been done to make it work. Orb hack? It was removed and completely forgot until today! Simply amazing how you people “IGNORED” WvW.
Well they did destroy the wvw match up discussions. So to say they’ve totally ignored wvw isn’t entirely true.
Removal of white swords isn’t an issue for any Tier. Even in the lower tiers if you see that something is contested, how often is anyone actually able to make it to the node before it flips? The color still changes so you know it isn’t under your control and that you need to reclaim it. That’s the important part. If the colors were removed and no one had a clue which team owned what then we might have a small problem.
Just remember to be open to new ideas. Regardless of your feelings towards them. I admit i was completely against removal of white swords when i first heard the rumors. Now that i have had time to think about it, I like the idea even if for no other reason than its something new to possibly change things up.
SoS – Ele – Burn Me, Freeze Me, Blind Me, Pound Me — Wait…What?
Warrior – The New Burninator! Strongbad would be so proud!
Guardian – Burn for you, heal for me, block for me and uh…sorry Im all out of gifts.
Wait they are removing any indication of battle so the only way to figure out where people are is by randomly running into them and following the blob swords?
Is this the real life? is this just fantasy?
54 infractions and counting because a moderator doesn’t understand a joke when he/she sees it.
E.A.D.
Wait they are removing any indication of battle so the only way to figure out where people are is by randomly running into them and following the blob swords?
Is this the real life? is this just fantasy?
To be fair if we should compare it to the real life time there would actually be no way to contact the rest of your forces during a surprise attack, unless you have very sneaky birds that managed to fly away before they got killed.
Removal of white swords isn’t an issue for any Tier. Even in the lower tiers if you see that something is contested, how often is anyone actually able to make it to the node before it flips? The color still changes so you know it isn’t under your control and that you need to reclaim it. That’s the important part. If the colors were removed and no one had a clue which team owned what then we might have a small problem.
The only objectives I’m not able to reach in time after I see white swords are the southern towers of home borderland (if there is no WP) and camps (which sometimes flip without swords)… And by reach it in time, I mean have enough time to toss a disabler and use the siege inside the tower to protect it.
Of course, if it isn’t a sieged objective I’m sure not going to run like crazy to go try defend it. Without white swords, I might just not try defend anything at all…
Removal of white swords isn’t an issue for any Tier. Even in the lower tiers if you see that something is contested, how often is anyone actually able to make it to the node before it flips? The color still changes so you know it isn’t under your control and that you need to reclaim it. That’s the important part. If the colors were removed and no one had a clue which team owned what then we might have a small problem.
The only objectives I’m not able to reach in time after I see white swords are the southern towers of home borderland (if there is no WP) and camps (which sometimes flip without swords)… And by reach it in time, I mean have enough time to toss a disabler and use the siege inside the tower to protect it.
I play on the same server and agree. We arrive in time to save objectives from white sword all the time because our opponents are normally not a zerg of 30+ dropping 5 rams or catapults so there is often time to get in and defend, especially when it’s a keep but also often the towers if they are close enough to an open waypoint. It’s easy to jump in and save a tower from a small party or a camp from being soloed after seeing white swords and, on the flip side, I’ve gotten jumped plenty of times while soloing camps if I don’t get it done quickly enough. If there is a 30+ zerg on the map, we can usually tell that because of the Outnumbered buff. And even if we choose to ignore the white swords at a camp or tower we know isn’t upgraded or sieged up, it gives us more time to get to the next logical objective and make sure there are siege weapons waiting, which you won’t get if your first sign of trouble is the tower changing color, when your opponent may already be starting to move toward the next objective.
This is a change oriented toward offensive play, hobbling defense, and making it easier to capture objectives without resistance, as if the game needed any more of that.
Darkhaven got a dev to come to our server near the top of bronze.. He joined one of our small havoc guilds.. He was really chill.. actually joined us on our server teamspeak and hungout with DH every now and then…Talked to us about upcoming changes or ideas of what the WvW team was planning.. It was really cool
Wait they are removing any indication of battle so the only way to figure out where people are is by randomly running into them and following the blob swords?
Is this the real life? is this just fantasy?
To be fair if we should compare it to the real life time there would actually be no way to contact the rest of your forces during a surprise attack, unless you have very sneaky birds that managed to fly away before they got killed.
And if it was real life, any large force moving around in such a small area would be tracked all the time, so should appear on the map….your point was?
WvW player. Doing another world completion for my next Legendary. Hater of mini-games.
Open your eyes look up to the skies and seeeeee..
This idea is awefull, it doesn’t deserve sympathy..
Because they want PvE, PvE
eSport here, eSport there
Any WvW post will be infracted by mods, by mods.
Didn’t get Karma, but I just killed a man,
Casted Corrupt Boon on his head,
proc-ed my passive and now he’s dead.
Anet, Roaming was really fun.
But now you’ve gone and threw it all away…
Aneeet Ooooowhooooowh..
Did really wanted to buy gems
But now i feel i’ll never buy them at all..
So carry on, Carry on..
Those patches don’t really matter..
54 infractions and counting because a moderator doesn’t understand a joke when he/she sees it.
E.A.D.
Open your eyes look up to the skies and seeeeee..
This idea is awefull, it doesn’t deserve sympathy..
Because they want PvE, PvE
eSport here, eSport there
Any WvW post will be infracted by mods, by mods.
Didn’t get Karma, but I just killed a man,
Casted Corrupt Boon on his head,
proc-ed my passive and now he’s dead.
Anet, Roaming was really fun.
But now you’ve gone and threw it all away…
Aneeet Ooooowhooooowh..
Did really wanted to buy gems
But now i feel i’ll never buy them at all..
So carry on, Carry on..
Those patches don’t really matter..
Too late, your time has come,
Sent infractions down my way,
Forum bans all the time
Goodbye, everybody, I’ve got to go
Gotta leave you all behind and face the truth
Anet, Ooooowhooooowh.. (we can nott talk about it),
I can no longer wait
I sometimes wish you never made this game at all!
The WvW Forum Poster Formerly Known As Omaris Mortuus Est
Considering that there is already an active thread discussing the same topic and that this one has run its course and is veering off topic, I’m going to close this one and request you post on this topic in the other one (linked above).
