Guild Wars 2

I spent about 4 hours on Tuesday night roaming Alpine BLs with 3 other guild mates. We had many fun fights against groups of 2-8, ran into a couple blobs but nothing too crazy that couldn’t be avoided if we didn’t want to fight that many.

Basically, I haven’t had this much fun since the HoT release.

Long Live Alpine!

I’m a bit late, but I also prefer the Desert Borderlands. Let’s see why:

What I like about the Alpine Borderlands:

• The Northern Camp, because:
  • It’s one of the most detailed areas on that map
  • Easy to reach
  • Fun to defend
  • Ideal to resupply

What I do not like about the Alpine Borderlands:

• The Northern Camp, just because the dolyaks have to travel way too far and the routes feel boring
• The deadly cliffs, that kill me more often than the cliffs on the Desert Borderlands, as the landscape is so width and empty and boring
• Chasing a mesmer inside bay

What I like about the Desert Borderlands:

• Towers have two entrances and Keeps have many routes to the inner. This makes it much harder to cut off the supply for attackers and prevent any defence.
• Cannons and Oil are build more strategical, making them valuable defences. For towers there are even two of them, instead of only one each
• Keeps need at least two series of catapults to be opened. Only exception I know is the north of the Rampart. A small advantage for the Home Team
• No “save” spots to build catapults or trebuchets, that are very hard to destroy, e.g. in keeps or towers or on unreachable cliffs
• Every keep, tower and monument is different, so some strategies work better for some objects than others
• Many possibilities to attack and defend, also some strategies are more common
• Larger structures with more room to fight
• Walls feel better for defenders
• The Oasis Event. I enjoyed some of the most exciting fights there
• The landscape is more exciting, so I don’t realize any longer ways, if there are any
• High flexibility. When you can’t take the fight for one object, there are always enough options nearby. So your attacks can become less predictable
• +40% movement speed from shrines
• The Citadel feels more compact but modern

What I don’t like about the Desert Borderlands:

• Getting killed by the Rampart defence, when 20 attackers entered and I was caught in a blind end. Also this only happened once
• Feels too empty, as many players still run long paths and don’t know for some nice shortcuts. Therefore the map obviously feels tedious
• Trying to find and kill a thief or mesmer hiding inside your keep

Shinon.4513:

What I like about the Desert Borderlands:

• Towers have two entrances and Keeps have many routes to the inner. This makes it much harder to cut off the supply for attackers and prevent any defence.

UC have only 1 path to go at inner, this make it very very difficult for defenders to come back.
And on ABL every keep have at least 2 entrance for inner.
But on ABL tower have only 1 entrance, that bad yes. But this is probably difficult to make for the 2 north tower.

Shinon.4513:

• Cannons and Oil are build more strategical, making them valuable defences. For towers there are even two of them, instead of only one each

Canon on DBL are death trap… And if you are fear you will just fall in the ennemy zerg…

Shinon.4513:

• Keeps need at least two series of catapults to be opened. Only exception I know is the north of the Rampart. A small advantage for the Home Team

Yes that a good thing, but it’s not some advantage to be able to do that at rampart

Shinon.4513:

• No “save” spots to build catapults or trebuchets, that are very hard to destroy, e.g. in keeps or towers or on unreachable cliffs

hum… In the stairs at south UC if ennemy place balista first.. In the south camp at UC with treb… North UC you can place a cata that you can’t counter…
I did not defend too much palace, but before the map change you have that issue with north outer wall and south inner wall…

Shinon.4513:

• Every keep, tower and monument is different, so some strategies work better for some objects than others
• Many possibilities to attack and defend, also some strategies are more common

different skin, but tower and keep are not copy / paste on ABL… Same texture yes, but not the same shape..

Shinon.4513:

• Larger structures with more room to fight

Bay is much bigger… But flat or water… And you can have some place to fight insde the outer wall at hills.

Shinon.4513:

• Walls feel better for defenders

Yes… Too high, you can’t hit proxy cata with ac, or you have to place ac in ennemy aoe… You can’t use siege disabler because you are too far from the ennemy siege.

Shinon.4513:

• The Oasis Event. I enjoyed some of the most exciting fights there

Don’t bring that kitten back ! This event is a big piece of kitten ! PVE event should not give so much advantage to one team !
At least quaggan was not OP and was easy to counter… But the best thing is no pve event at all.

Shinon.4513:

• The landscape is more exciting, so I don’t realize any longer ways, if there are any

Yeah… desert desert and desert… Feel like hell…

Shinon.4513:

• High flexibility. When you can’t take the fight for one object, there are always enough options nearby. So your attacks can become less predictable

You have multiple spot to attack on ABL, but all scout know all those spot then they are prepared for that. And keep should give advantage to defender with clear LOS around the keep… Not be surrounded with cliff and object that block your view or defense (UC / Palace).

Shinon.4513:

• +40% movement speed from shrines

As ABL is smaller you don’t need that… Just don’t make a huge map for home border and you don’t need that…

Shinon.4513:

• The Citadel feels more compact but modern

Citadel on ABL is a city… On DBL the spawn is just some outpost..
Again ABL feel like home, as DBL is just some weird territory and no one know what you are doing here…

And look about the supply camp…. On ABL you have the nc who is a small town, the sawmill, the quarry, the fishing camp.. Just vale have no real purpose… Even south camp have a mill…
On DBL the supply camp are just place in the middle of the map… We don’t even know what they do here… No element to understand why there is some production here…

Sich.7103:

Shinon.4513:

• The Oasis Event. I enjoyed some of the most exciting fights there

Don’t bring that kitten back ! This event is a big piece of kitten ! PVE event should not give so much advantage to one team !
At least quaggan was not OP and was easy to counter… But the best thing is no pve event at all.

It wasn’t a PvE event, there is no such thing as a PvE event in a PvP game mode, what it is just like the “PvE” in nearly every PvP game, like the Lord in Foefire, is an objective designed to attract fights, which it did.

In a few weeks and after a couple of changes, sure, bring it back. But bring Alpine maps back a few weeks after that. Rotate the maps properly, don’t wait 3 months between.

Remove the cripple zones and revert the Desert Lords to the Alpine versions (I want to cap a tower, not chase a teleporting npc) and it’ll be much better in my opinion.

FINALLY! No more DayZ survival content while playing GW 2!

anet has finally listened to their players!

Already bored of the Alpine maps again.

displacedTitan.6897:

Already bored of the Alpine maps again.

Thank you for pointing this out, now I can point out to some of the trolls that I was right!

I said this, a few times: that subjectively (day, week, month) people would get bored of them because they are too old and plain and wide open and boring!

I was right :P

sparc.3649:

displacedTitan.6897:

Already bored of the Alpine maps again.

Thank you for pointing this out, now I can point out to some of the trolls that I was right!

I said this, a few times: that subjectively (day, week, month) people would get bored of them because they are too old and plain and wide open and boring!

I was right :P

You are so wrong. My guild mates and I are playing on our BL which we haven’t done in several months. We hate the simplistic and tedious desert BL and appreciate the superior Alpine BL.

Blockhead Magee.3092:

sparc.3649:

displacedTitan.6897:

Already bored of the Alpine maps again.

Thank you for pointing this out, now I can point out to some of the trolls that I was right!

I said this, a few times: that subjectively (day, week, month) people would get bored of them because they are too old and plain and wide open and boring!

I was right :P

You are so wrong. My guild mates and I are playing on our BL which we haven’t done in several months. We hate the simplistic and tedious desert BL and appreciate the superior Alpine BL.

Just give it time, maybe you’re one of the ones it will take a month for :P

I know by typing i am breaking my own rule BUT
please let this thread die
It burns my eyes to see this thread title in the non-alternate universe that i have become accustomed to. Please take the desert bl back to the strange dimension from where you were hatched…. where good becomes bad, red appears blue, and the word mom becomes wow.

so please, please, no typing below this line:
______________________________________________________

bu bu but the DBL was superior in every way =\

I wasn’t bored of playing these maps for almost 3 years prior to HoT release and I’m not bored of playing them now. In fact, I’m incredibly excited about their return because it has brought life back in to WvW for me and my guild.

sparc.3649:

bu bu but the DBL was superior in every way =\

omg
its like the twilight zone

Akkeros.1675:

sparc.3649:

bu bu but the DBL was superior in every way =\

omg
its like the twilight zone

Tower of terror, yea – fun ride

Having to remove content a development team spent years working on just because you can’t imagine a system that support 4 different maps… This seems like a abdication to me.

I’m certainly not going to reinstall the game now that the only new WvW content has been removed. I was expecting fixes and improvements, not a rollback to 3 years ago.

Xillllix.3485:

Having to remove content a development team spent years working on just because you can’t imagine a system that support 4 different maps… This seems like a abdication to me.

I’m certainly not going to reinstall the game now that the only new WvW content has been removed. I was expecting fixes and improvements, not a rollback to 3 years ago.

That is not the only new WvW content. All of the new tactivator things, guild claiming things, reward tracks, dolyak buffs, siege disablers and other stuff is still in place. A lot of “new content” is there, just not the garbage impractical new map.

I’d rather have no new content where the existing content is high quality than poorly-implemented new content.

DeceiverX.8361:

I’d rather have no new content where the existing content is high quality than poorly-implemented new content.

So entitled for someone who paid $50 for 3 years of entertainment.

Are you guys going to complain every time they switch the maps? Because there’s going to be a rotation, get over it and enjoy wvw for a change? Biggest complaint I see about alpine is “it’s boring” while dbl still gets complaints about the many problems about the map.

Sorry Shinon but I don’t agree with some of your points.

Shinon.4513:

What I do not like about the Alpine Borderlands:

• The Northern Camp, just because the dolyaks have to travel way too far and the routes feel boring

You do realize that the alpine north camp dolyaks only send one dolyak per side because it’s the same one that goes to the north towers and garrison, it makes them more precious to guard to get in to garrison. There’s nothing particularly fun about walking yaks on dbl from north camp either. The dbl is just more detailed, I guess maybe if they put something like a forest between north camp and the north towers it wouldn’t be as boring?

Shinon.4513:

• The deadly cliffs, that kill me more often than the cliffs on the Desert Borderlands,
  as the landscape is so width and empty and boring

Yeah let’s not exaggerate ok? alpine cliffs have “safe” areas for you to drop down from with mid cliffs in the well traveled areas between the towers and garrison, yes there’s even mid cliffs to the valley under hills. There are a hell of a lot more cliffs on the dbl and a lot less safe areas to drop, even dropping from a tower wall to the ground can kill you. In a lot of areas for dbl you are forced to stick to the pathways, that was the point of the map, to force you into the chokes.

Shinon.4513:

• Chasing a mesmer inside bay

This is where stealth traps need to be used. Also guild upgrade watchtower.

Shinon.4513:

What I like about the Desert Borderlands:

• Towers have two entrances and Keeps have many routes to the inner. This makes it much harder to cut off the supply for attackers and prevent any defence.

This is a good thing, but the only reason they had to include two entrances is because the towers are twice as big as the old ones. Plus they had barriers setup somewhere between the two entrances before so you had to give better access coming from either side, now the barriers are gone.

Shinon.4513:

• Cannons and Oil are build more strategical, making them valuable defences. For towers there are even two of them, instead of only one each

The cannons and oils are built on narrow walkways around the gates, it makes it just as dangerous for the defender to be there.

Shinon.4513:

• Keeps need at least two series of catapults to be opened. Only exception I know is the north of the Rampart. A small advantage for the Home Team

There’s good and bad in that.
In order to accomplish that they had to increase the keep size which a lot of players didn’t like, as it’s more difficult to scout and siege up, but I suppose that’s where the watchtower comes in useful again. There’s also a lot less walls for you to knock down on the dbl keeps, while on the abl keeps you can pretty much knock down every wall. The abl map puts more pressure on defenders to build and maintain siege in the vulnerable spots, on the dbl no one cared to.

Shinon.4513:

• No “save” spots to build catapults or trebuchets, that are very hard to destroy, e.g. in keeps or towers or on unreachable cliffs

Which took away any value to the towers on dbl, in the beginning the only value to the south towers was the waypoint and access to the middle area which was eventually changed. The north towers have no value other than ppt. On abl you have to be active and upgrade and siege your towers or risk losing it and then risk your keep getting hit from them. Even then 90% of the time you can counter long range siege in the towers while not even having to take the tower.

The one thing that’s great about the abl that most people don’t realize is the amount of places where you can place siege to hit some thing, and the counter siege you can use to get rid of it. There are obviously some bugged out areas that players eventually found out about, such as citadel siege on the east side to hit net, but I chalked that up to a home field advantage.

Shinon.4513:

• Every keep, tower and monument is different, so some strategies work better for some objects than others

Not really. You get lords with different set of skills, but it comes down to just zerging them anyways. There isn’t anything different to dropping a cata or ram depending on the weaker of the gate or wall. Taking the alters doesn’t affect how you take a keep, gives slight advantage to movement for the defender, run over lava use the portals, don’t take dmg from falling etc. People don’t even bother with golems on that map.

Shinon.4513:

• Many possibilities to attack and defend, also some strategies are more common

Again the keeps have a lot less walls to break because they designed the map for chokes. Players don’t use golems because it’s a pain to move them now, there’s a lot less attack strategies to use. They also don’t bother to siege up because structures are so big no one is going to bother refreshing siege in there, siege only goes down when you know exactly where the enemy is coming from.

Shinon.4513:

• Larger structures with more room to fight

Air keep is filled with narrow hallways, stairs, there’s barely anywhere to have open fights, fire keep has the mid courtyard and the lords for a large area to fight, larger structures didn’t mean more room to fight, the towers are about the only things with a large space to fight.

Shinon.4513:

• Walls feel better for defenders

That they do, until you accidentally fall off one….

Shinon.4513:

• The Oasis Event. I enjoyed some of the most exciting fights there

A lagged out area where people didn’t bother fighting each other over dinos? Still doesn’t compare to an old school keep lord room fight.

Shinon.4513:

• The landscape is more exciting, so I don’t realize any longer ways, if there are any

It certainly does look more updated than alpine map, like comparing HoT maps to the old school maps, there’s just so much more detail. That fog area around garrison certainly didn’t feel more exciting to me though.

Shinon.4513:

• High flexibility. When you can’t take the fight for one object, there are always enough options nearby. So your attacks can become less predictable

Not sure what you mean by that, if you can’t take a tower go take the nearest shrine and your enemies become confused by your tactics?

Shinon.4513:

What I don’t like about the Desert Borderlands:

• Feels too empty, as many players still run long paths and don’t know for some nice shortcuts. Therefore the map obviously feels tedious

It was empty because a lot less players were there, it felt like a bigger map, it felt like a lot more traveling was involved when it probably wasn’t, that’s what happens when you confine players to travel the safe routes. It wasn’t great for roaming either when sentries could mark you unless you take the really long way around, while on abl you have open space to avoid it.

Both maps have their advantages and disadvantages, both maps will be around and rotated every once in a while, people need to get over it and enjoy the revived wvw population.

Because it is rather poor implementation to “rotate” them. All maps should just be active at once, so nobody has to be “benched” while they wait for their favorite map to come back into rotation…

sparc.3649:

Because it is rather poor implementation to “rotate” them. All maps should just be active at once, so nobody has to be “benched” while they wait for their favorite map to come back into rotation…

Yeah well many also took a break and benched themselves from wvw when desert came in, and waited 6 months before the rotation finally happened.

They don’t have the systems in place to auto rotate them, and it sounds like it’s a lot of work to even do them manually, so if anything it might come down to rotations every quarterly update along with the server links.

If you want the maps to exist at the same time then there needs to be a third borderland which they do not have. It takes them a year or more to create a brand new wvw map, if they ever bother to make another one.

So either chillax and get use to a rotation, enjoy the current map, or don’t, that’s up to you.

sparc.3649:

Because it is rather poor implementation to “rotate” them. All maps should just be active at once, so nobody has to be “benched” while they wait for their favorite map to come back into rotation…

First thing you’ve said that I almost agree with, but I’ll still be benched if I am queued out of whatever the Alpine map is that week and still forced in to playing maps I don’t want to play on.

If they decide to rotate maps, my guild will be taking however many weeks off WvW when they rotate DBL back in. I think a lot of guilds will go on a WvW strike if they rotate it back in. The majority is happy with Alpine, I’ve said it several times – the numbers speak for themselves. If you are too dense to notice, there is no hope for you.

There wouldn’t be a queue problem if ANet also got off their duff and fixed it so that we the players physically could NOT “stack servers”…

sparc.3649:

There wouldn’t be a queue problem if ANet also got off their duff and fixed it so that we the players physically could NOT “stack servers”…

I think it is a little too late for that. They do need to unlink the T1 and T2 NA servers from having a partner server though – none of them need help at all and all those extra people are doing is contributing to the queues.

It’s never too late really, although they never address it. Instead they keep giving us BANDAIDS. EoTM was a bandaid to this problem. The current “mashup” (I refuse to call it a “merge” since it’s not permanent), is a bandaid to the problem.

If they’d stop tossing us bandaids and actually FIX it already then they could focus on things that are actually more trivial. Like what map(s) are or aren’t on or how any such “rotation” works or anything like that…

But server stacking is one of the CORE issues with WvW. They need to address the CORE issue(s) first! Because like you said, you wouldn’t mind all maps being active, but you’re concerned about a queue. Okay, this makes sense – but queues would not be an issue if anet would just get off their duff and start with fixing CORE issues.

The rest is really trivial as long as we have fundamental core issues… =\

sparc.3649:

It’s never too late really, although they never address it. Instead they keep giving us BANDAIDS. EoTM was a bandaid to this problem. The current “mashup” (I refuse to call it a “merge” since it’s not permanent), is a bandaid to the problem.

If they’d stop tossing us bandaids and actually FIX it already then they could focus on things that are actually more trivial. Like what map(s) are or aren’t on or how any such “rotation” works or anything like that…

But server stacking is one of the CORE issues with WvW. They need to address the CORE issue(s) first! Because like you said, you wouldn’t mind all maps being active, but you’re concerned about a queue. Okay, this makes sense – but queues would not be an issue if anet would just get off their duff and start with fixing CORE issues.

The rest is really trivial as long as we have fundamental core issues… =\

…..sigh
Think about what the server linkings are doing. T1 servers are full and locked to transfers. T8 servers are still open and cheap to transfer to. Anyone that wants to “stack” a server will be joining the T8 servers and increasing their player base. If that server’s population grows large enough they will be linked with another server instead of the blobby T1 server.
This “band-aid” is slowly balancing out the population.

LOL if you say so, then if they “unlink” them people will be like OMG AR sucks, and just leave again.

You’re the one who’s clueless here pal

@puck – we don’t know how they linked them or would re-link them. I don’t think pop came into play first pass – wasn’t it simply 1+24 2+23 based on Glicko? If Glicko is no longer being tracked for the guests, I guess they could potentially be tracking players or players*hours. It’s hard to say they accomplished anything with the linking at this poiNt IMHO….

It is not a fix it is a bandaid, nothing more nothing less.

ANet wants people to think they’re doing something or that this will work or to “have fun” again. They want people to be like “OMGZ I’m having fun again” so they get their friends to come back too.

And apparently it is working, FOR THE TIME BEING – because a bandaid is just that, TEMPORARY…

AGAIN, they need NEED NEED – to address CORE issue(s) before moving onto bigger fish.

Otherwise it’s putting the cart before the horse!

The ONLY thing that’s going to fix population AKA “server stacking” issues is having HARD CAP LIMITS in place in one way or another. So that it becomes PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE to stack any given single server…

Unless they make it PHYSICALLY IMPOSSIBLE to do, people are going to do it till the end of time!

or reduce the number of server to 3 factions, and start makign more maps :|
Use the phisical servers to hold more maps, more team more player s to call help form bl to bl etc.
then add more feature/tool that arent gimmick based for guilds and tools for players create temporary groups havoack squads, where they can be rewarded for disrupting. theres a gazilion of ideas to be added.

sparc.3649:

LOL if you say so, then if they “unlink” them people will be like OMG AR sucks, and just leave again.

You’re the one who’s clueless here pal

Well if you continue to be an asocial karma trainer who avoids people and caps empty structures then….. yeah, they’ll probably leave.
If instead someone decides to get organized and recruits the new players to their guild they’ll probably stick with their new friends no matter what server you all end up linked with next.
Remember, no matter what the next link is you won’t be going back to the deserted wasteland of T8. As long as you are low pop they will likely link you with a full server. But what do you care, you are leaving……. eventually….. hopefully.

The irony of reading ppl telling you to adapt then complain about the change back to ABL… They sure seem like they are adapting well to that change themselves…

They should have just merged the servers honestly. Completely kill 12 servers then basically say to those people “If you don’t like where your server was merged in to, here is a free transfer to anywhere else you want to go that is not full.”

Sure people would complain, you people complain about everything. But it would have been effective.

I have no problem with anet bringing back DBL as long as it is in some sort of rotation. It would be even cooler if anet adds more and more maps to said rotation. As long as maps are in a rotation, anet can spend the week fixing/improving whatever map is not being used.

Yes DLB got better after the patch but they still have a long way to go to be really playable and after everyone was asking for alpines to come back i cannot fathom that this thread even exists.

They are aware of the server population imbalance and that some of the merges are not perfect yet. Thats why its a beta and things will change. They have done more for wvw in the past two weeks than we have seen in years. And most of these are good changes so don’t bite off their hand now.

Pride.1734:

Yes DLB got better after the patch but they still have a long way to go to be really playable and after everyone was asking for alpines to come back i cannot fathom that this thread even exists.

They are aware of the server population imbalance and that some of the merges are not perfect yet. Thats why its a beta and things will change. They have done more for wvw in the past two weeks than we have seen in years. And most of these are good changes so don’t bite off their hand now.

Indeed I think this merits some patience.

This is a far cry from HoT release when we had nothing concrete and we simply didn’t know how long we’d spend with that version of DBL. There didn’t seem to be any kind of plan or sound reasoning.

While the current direction still leaves much to be desired, we can at least see it’s going somewhere beyond some kind of logical backing that was clearly derived from feedback given out.

It’s perfectly reasonable to be impatient and show disdain with what appears to be the former approach, but when the later one actually shows some real effects, I think it deserves more than a week or two before people threatening to quit.

Not to mention this lays the foundation for any implementation of any new map down the line, since hopefully history won’t repeat itself.

To all those saying Alpine is all about those blobs. I tell you. Alpine is much, much more welcoming to roamers and small group play than Deserted BL since the terrain is simply way more open (unless back caping a tower and night caping a tower without giving the enemy server a chance to react since he had to run a marathon was your thing).

Anyway. I’ll take a group of roamers over a blob any time of the day. Enjoy the watch!

Bring DBL back ! Was way more entertaining than ABL! Like way better, loved it and after the linking of worlds it was actually pretty popular, with ques on all the BLs. Starting to see the ABL to be empty already as the nostalgia goggles have inevitably cracked , and people are camping EBG once more

Some more candy for the eyes of our fellow roamers <3

sparc.3649:

Blockhead Magee.3092:

sparc.3649:

displacedTitan.6897:

Already bored of the Alpine maps again.

Thank you for pointing this out, now I can point out to some of the trolls that I was right!

I said this, a few times: that subjectively (day, week, month) people would get bored of them because they are too old and plain and wide open and boring!

I was right :P

You are so wrong. My guild mates and I are playing on our BL which we haven’t done in several months. We hate the simplistic and tedious desert BL and appreciate the superior Alpine BL.

Just give it time, maybe you’re one of the ones it will take a month for :P

lol you realize, so many people played the old alpine borderlands indefinitely and the only reason they quit is because of the desert borderlands… hence how dead the bloody servers were post HoT… It went backwards completely in population for wvw..

My entire guild still hasn’t returned from DBBL. We all quit cause the new borderlands were way too big, no fights no nothing… Except most have already found other games and some are slowly returning..

The first time in ages that there wasn’t a queue for EB in prime time on Piken.
That wasn’t a thing since HoT and shows how alpine is welcomed.

Phantom.5389:

Some more candy for the eyes of our fellow roamers <3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8Evhd4A70A

y are u spamming with old as kitten vids… We are talkin bout today son.

DeceiverX.8361:

I’d rather have no new content where the existing content is high quality than poorly-implemented new content.

I couldn’t have said it better!!!

Gaile Gray.6029:

I think it’d be good to read the update notes for today’s build.

A lot has been adjusted and amended, as you can see:

• The Alpine borderlands map has been rotated back into play.
• Updated map content to be consistent with existing WvW maps.
  • Sentries now detect and mark enemy players on the map.
  • Original resource nodes have been removed. Resource synthesizer nodes now exist inside objectives.
  • Objectives now have capture-point decals.
  • Objective lords now have health scaling.
  • Objectives now upgrade based on dolyak caravan deliveries.
  • Objectives now support the updated guild-claiming and guild-objective upgrades systems.
  • Disabled Commander Siegerazer’s breakout events.
  • Cultural armor vendors have been added at the team citadel areas.
  • Dolyak caravans now jog rather than walk.
  • Dolyak caravans now gain the Protected Caravan effect when allied players are nearby.
  • Players can no longer rally by killing basic creatures.
  • Halved the number of ambient creatures (deer, drakes, wolves, etc.).

Frankly just the idea of jogging dolyaks makes it all worthwhile to me.

But seriously, give it a try before making a judgment, ok? The WvW Team is actively reading your feedback, but that feedback is always best when based on solid experience with the current map.

Thanks.

While I appreciate the WvW Team working on this, I think that rotating the old Alpine maps back into play isn’t the best thing. Why?
1. They are now too small, especially with the server mergers
2. Server mergers were just completed and the DBL was finally becoming populated.
3. New reward system brought players into the DBL. More time should have been given for those players to adjust to the new maps.
4. Fire Keep was awesome and is now a missed element on the old Alpine maps.

I wasn’t a fan of WvW before, but with the release of the DBL I found myself playing more WvW then I had in the past. Yes, the map is huge. (Which serves more populated servers well.) After playing the DBL’s for months now, the Alpine BL seems boring, small and crowded. If you won’t bring back the DBL, at least introduce elements like the Fire Keep & Air Keeps into a better Alpine map.

Q_Q

I miss my fire keep!

That’s mature…

Could we maybe refrain from throwing insults and calling people “whiny children” because they disagree with you?

Some people genuinely prefer each map for whatever reason, insulting either party because of that gets us nowhere.

Map rotation is in the works and is the best compromise (though 3 months is too large of a delay currently, even if they have a good reason for it) and making threads like this and causing arguments for no good reason is one of the reasons why the devs abandoned posting in the forums to begin with, no-one wins if nobody compromises.

sparc.3649:

That’s mature…

I know it ain’t, man, but is your crying any different? WTF you want? You want to get WvW score for PvE-ing. There are single-player games when you need this kind of fulfillment. You think just because you prefer a large and complex map over a small and simple one, that makes you smart? If you really are smart, do you honestly believe your opinion here is more important than mine? Do you think ANet care about how smart you and I are (baboon)? They care about getting easy money from weak-minded or good-natured people… that buy HoT. If you bought HoT, then they have nothing else to gain from you at this time.
I didn’t buy HoT, however, and the Desert map for WvW was just one of the reasons. So they are after my wallet right now. And I say, don’t bring back the Desert Borderland (not as WvW anyway). Ever.